The book of Genesis copied Sumerian creation myths. Adam and Eve never existed, the tree of knowledge, the serpent and the fall from Eden never existed.
>>18532662>the book of genesis wasnt preserving old knowledge, it was 10 guys in a tent making things upWhy are boomers like this?
>>18532768Sumerian civilisation is far older than the ancient Israelites. Considering that the Sumerians were polytheists, that raises problems for any monotheists still believing in the book of genesis.
>>18532662It’s also derived from an older Canaanite myth down to the usage of the name Adam.
>>18532967Can you elaborate on this?
>>18532772you can handwave this by saying the Sumerians were describing the Genesis creation account but ascribed it to their pagan gods because they were corrupt
>>18532971The old testament wasn't even written down for centuries, it was passed down orally, with concomitant errors and alterations that brings. The Sumerian civilisation is far older than the Israelites, they were worshipping their gods long before ant Israelite even uttered the word "yahweh" or "elohim", why would they have copied from the oral myths of a bunch of savage Israelites?
>>18532971Judaism and by-extension Christianity and Islam are complete nonsense. There is no evidence of a complete Torah existing prior to the 5th century AUC (after of the founding of the city [of Rome]).The Exodus myth was written as a polemic against Manetho, not the other way around (again, no complete Torah prior to the 5th century AUC).Manetho was citing earlier sources and he has been proven correct by history. He was writing about the Shasu and his ONLY mistake was confusing them with the Hyksos. The Shasu were a group of nomads from the southern Levant who worshipped Yahweh and would later contribute to the ethnogenesis of the Jews. They were considered a nuance due to their tendency to raid the Egyptian borders and at some point in the late Bronze Age, they nearly succeeded in plundering Egypt but got their asses kicked and expelled. Manetho wrote this in his Aegyptiaca and the Jews, being mad that people remember this, wrote the myth of Exodus in response.Only those with a mental illness and leprosy would deny any of this. Also, Egypt didn’t even have the type of chattel slavery depicted in Exodus.
>>18532973You know that even the Israelites didn't know Yahweh's name in the Bible until the Exodus and that Abraham is literally from Ur, rightthe biblical narrative has everyone worshipping idols and no one aware of the true God and the true creation story until Moses goes up Mount Sinai and comes back with the first five books of the Bible
>>18532993Exodus as the Bible depicts it never happened and the Torah is a later forgery >>18532979
>>18532993>Moses goes up Mount Sinai and comes back with the first five books of the BibleUnlike since the Torah describes things that occur after this point like Moses’ own death.
>>18532662Your claim falls flat on the fact that their stories are literally the depiction of Cain. Cain was who got mad and decided to kill the enemy with an act of murder / violence because he felt like he was the real hero, annd had decided to act, and went to start the first cities of humanity. Which is a direct reference to Babylon, Babel, and satan’s kingdom on earth.The first cities would have made stories about their selves, and worshiped pagan deities which God spoke about drowned in the flood.If you read Genesis correctly, then Adam lived 6000 years ago, today, falling in 4000 BC. Making Jesus Christ about to come soon, and making God just about to experience 6 whole days (1000 days = 1 day). Rather, the 6 whole days from Christ Jesus’ crucifixion is about to occur. Which will then begin the birthing pains from serious persecution when people looking for his coming, especially Satan, and his children, begin to hate and kill Christians. That’s what I expect from soulless evil people who will never inherit the kingdom of God. If you belong to darkness, then you can never be in the light.Sumeria is home to Babylonia. Hence your problem.Eden was an actual garden, not walled off. The configuration is therefore built into the earth itself, and Creation was perfect. Six rivers into one, and God’s Throne itself fed it the water of life.Immortality in those myths always comes from a satanic serpent. Whereas immortality was already Man’s before the fall. It just came at the price of having a Spirit without sin, perfect in the garden of Eden that God set Man in.So to create a walled off garden like Cain did and to boast mighty man works because of it is essentially Marvel super hero comics and DC Universe. That the goat is superior to the lamb.But the Bible says man that is born of a woman is gone in but a few days.Samson was a nararite and if you remember the laws of a Nazarite, if you see death you must cut your hair. Donkey skull.
>>18533010>their stories are literally the depiction of CainOther way around, Cain is a depiction of their stories. King Arthur is not a depiction of Artoria Pendragon from the Fate series, Artoria Pendragon from the Fate series is a depiction of the older King Arthur. The rest of your post is young Earth creationist nonsense, which can be easily refuted by carbon dating pieces of ancient trees.
Donkey Skull was used by Samson as the only thing he could grab off the ground as a weapon to wage a war to kill philistines that were basically wild predatory killers that looked for violence. He lusted after Delilah and then his story is written in the vein of a mighty man using strength to get the woman. Hence as a Nazarite Samson is breaking all sorts of God’s laws, and the final one was he told her how to remove his strength (Old Testament Nazarite thing, doesn’t pertain to New Testament Christianity today).Showing that being carnal and fighting like a mighty man doesn’t actually get you your woman’s spirit and soul, she has to give it to the Lord first with her own consent. Sex and children isn’t spiritual. But they want you to believe that being mighty like a goat, and not like a lamb, is the actual determining factor for getting you your wife, like Cain felt which is why he murdered his brother Abel. (The reason for this)The flood happened prior to the Sumerians and Babylonians rewrote the same pagan deities through the flood again. Just like those underwater pyramids in China you can find online.Another reason is that Babylonia itself (Sumerian) is literally writing stories as enemies of God. Showing why would you ever just base it off of who can prove this myth was written first? You’d have to realize that is done intentionally, and you look like a serpent yourself toting paganism blasphemy, literally the same sin as Cain, just to whine that” no it was God who stole it from me first, I wrote marvel first.”Noah and Abraham and Moses and on and on received their wife by believing God only. And that righteous gift / Gift of God (your wife) being given even if you didn’t deserve it is called Grace. Even if you didn’t win the UFC championship today and get married after you won the fight. Does everyone have to get their bride that way just because Mauricio Ruffy did? No. If you like that, then great, but works doesnt make you better.
>>18533022No, you are mocking God, God is not mocking you.Furthermore, fuck you in the name of Jesus Christ. Your works of the flesh will not inherit the kingdom of God.
>>18533030Yahweh and Elohim were gods from a pantheon of gods worshipped by the ancient Israelites, another god they worshipped was Yahweh's wife Asherah. Elohim is derived from the Canaanite thunder god El, the Israelites copied one of their gods from their enemies.
>>18533022God is everlasting to everlasting. He is also Beginning and Ending.Those that are darkness and are not light, shall depart into everlasting darkness. Never to approach the light again.And a witch shall not suffer to live.Burn in hell.>>18533033Yahweh means the self existing one.Fuck you Satan. Burn in hell.
>>18533031>>18533039I don't see an argument in your posts
>>18533043You didn’t have an argument in yours either. Wishful thinking of a Satanist.
Everything that I said will come to pass upon my enemies. Meanwhile you will wish you had never been born.
>>18533044You can google everything I've said itt, what I'm saying is backed by archaeological evidence. Pic related is Yahweh, Asherah, and Baal(who the Israelites also worshiped at one point). The ancient Israelities were polytheists who became monolatrists(believed in the existence of multiple gods but worshipped only 1 of them).
>>18532971Abrahamic religions are by definition corruption from the original myths it borrows from.You make a posteriori explanations for a thing you posit as true in the first place, just because you were born into a retarded myth and suffer from sunk cost fallacy
>>18533051To add to this, some days ago a dude from the korean sect of god the mother showed me that in the original hebrew texts gods was in plural, talked using words like we, us etc...He made it to mean some retarded shut like actually theres also a god the mother but I concluded that it really was written as a polytheistic cult
>>18533064The Israelites believed in a high-god which presided over other gods, they also literally believed that the other gods, which other nations worshipped, could grant those nations victory against the Israelites. All of those gods, including yahweh and elohim, were eventually amalgamated into one god, which later Israelites used 'yahweh' and 'elohim' to refer to. This is akim to ancient Greeks whittling down their pantheon to just one god who they refer to by the names to as 'Zeus' or 'Hades' or 'Poseidon'.
>>18533079>yahweh' and 'elohim' to refer to. This is akim to ancient Greeks whittling down their pantheon to just one god who they refer to by the names to as 'Zeus'who themselves are all derivatives of the Sky Father of my Aryan ancestors. The Hebrew bible makes no mention of the culture and race that brought the neolithic enlightenment wth the wheel and axle and horses to the wok and gave it monotheism. The children of the Hebrew bible and all abrahamic faiths are the real heretics.
tbf couldn't both be derived from the same tradition?
>>18533109There is a larger gap in years between when the first Sumerian creation myths were created, and when the Israelities copied them, than between when the Israelites copied the Sumerian creation myths and the present. It's obvious that the Israelities just copied the Sumerians, though I suppose it could be possible that the Sumerians were influenced by earlier tribal myths. In any case, Adam and Eve never existed, the book of Genesis is a myth.
>>18532772Abraham literally came from the Ur of the Chaldees though.
>>18533168Abraham never existed and besides, Ur existed before the time period he is alleged to have lived in
>>18533097don't use the word aryan like that if you want to be taken seriously
>>18533172>Abraham never existed???He obviously existed according to a sound reading of history. You can argue the things surrounding him are different but to say Ur had zero men is just silly.Did Pythagoras also not exist?Does Plato actually say Socrates is a literary device?Is every king of Sparta too a fabrication?
>>18533221>erm you can’t do thatFuck offThat is the correct usage of an ethnonym.
>>18533120Are you like not aware genesis was recorded from the perspective of a Sumerian expat?
>>18532772Sumerian civilization being old is totally irrelevant when the Israelites are obviously recording the same events and same stories.The Israelites themselves tracked their ancestry back to Sumer itself.
>>18533452>Israelites are obviously recording the same events and same stories.Because they're copying them from the Sumerians. Is Christopher Nolan and Homer "recording" the same event, the Trojan war, or did Nolan write a screenplay based on Homer's account?>>18533450elaborate on your claim
>>18533452>The Israelites themselves tracked their ancestry back to Sumer itself.And Black American nationalists "tracked" their ancestry back to the ancient Egyptians. Some Scotsman 400 years ago also claimed thwt the Scots were a long los tribe of Israel.
>>18532662Absolutely, it does. Historically this was well known and plays a role in Conserative Judaism, Orthodox Judaism, Eastern Orthodox, Catholicism and Oriental Orthodox Christianity. THey generally held that these acted as types that prefigure each of their respective soteriological pictures of the world. The idea of literaralism really only made sense at the later parts of the reformation and not at all in the context of Judaism. I
Technically these myths exist in all sorts of cycles like the Ugaritc baal cycle and a few others. The Aratahasis comes to mind. The earliest version with Adam and Eve and going up to the flood stuff is Eridu genesis.The Greek Work and Days has such stories. In each it is likely highly understood in terms of local rituals.A lot of the details can differ or have different variants. For example, Islam takes a bit more from the Enki and Ninhursag myth with depictions of paradise, most likely presrved indirectly the interactions with secular Syraic works. Some details are picked up via Zoroastraian stories such as the tree from paradise and the hymens reconstructing. New version of the pic related are worth getting to see some of the interesting similarities. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8Q9uyFASF0
. In Mesopotamian flood stories such as the Epic of Gilgamesh and the older Atrahasis, the gods send a flood because humanity has become too numerous and noisy, disturbing the divine realm. The one found in Genesis actually more closely resembles ancient Greek accounts. The flood in Book of Genesis is primarily a moral judgment against human wickedness. The Greek flood of Deucalion and Pyrrha is similiar in that issue and emphasizes divine punishment, but the repopulation of humanity occurs through the symbolic casting of stones rather than through a preserved family line unlike some of the others.. In the Utnapishtim narrative, the survivor is granted immortality, whereas Noah remains mortal and becomes part of a renewed covenantal relationship with God. However, that figure maybe is a precusor to figures like Enoch.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5m1sittbWA
Creation accounts differ too. In Genesis, Adam and Eve are the first humans created by a single God and fall through disobedience after eating from the Tree of Knowledge. In Mesopotamian traditions, there is no exact Adam and Eve equivalent, as a pair, the pair creation might be actually an import from Greece where the idea that things had to be created in pairs was a common folk story. This presocraticism much like eveyrhting coming from water in Thales for example are stated to be in dicated by God in the Koran. Other accounts instead have a single figure described. Adapa for example, who loses immortality. Adapa refuses the food of life and thereby misses the opportunity for eternal life, reversing the Genesis pattern in which eating leads to mortality. In Greek mythology, the closest Pandora, whose curiosity releases suffering into the world. Unlike Eve, Pandora is intentionally created as a divine instrument to bring hardship upon humanity.
>>18532662I sometimes wonder if Sumerian myths were even originally human made or were inherited from or implanted by humanity creators.
>>18532979>Also, Egypt didn’t even have the type of chattel slavery depicted in Exodus.Consider following
>>18532772How?The Bible is filled with cases of people beginning with the right beliefs and lapsing into the worship of evil Gods.
>>18533446I'm 50/50 on all of that.My experience as a just a dude taught me that people love to make shit up, and back then, since they didn't have a good epistemological tool to clean the bs, its probable that most retelling of stories are feedback loops of errors adding upon themselves, not unlike how dna corrupts in a lifetime
>>18533494Except they don’t????The Hebrews have a completely behave catalog of ancestors going from Sumer to Canaan and within the lives of those ancestors they describe real events and real places.
>>18533490Is an English translation of the Iliad a complete and total fiction because it’s not the original manuscript?Is the historical narrative taught about the Indian wars in family stories untrue because it differs from the official narrative in historical academia?What’s there to elaborate on?Abram in the story is from Sumer, he leaves, he goes back, his family is from Sumer, in his life there are descriptions of people and places that can be corroborated.
>>18533051>Pic related is Yahweh, Asherah, and Baal(who the Israelites also worshiped at one point)Many of the stories in the bible originate from Baal. Yahweh took them over as other gods were excluded.
>>18533120>the book of Genesis is a myth.I disagree. I think it's an attempt at epistemology. "I think therefore I am".
>>18534114>>18534111>in his life there are descriptions of people and places that can be corroborated.Abraham was a Israelite fictional character, any real events described in the old testament are merely Israelites restating events the Sumerians have already documented.>>18534025How do you know that the worship of Yahweh instead of the Sumerian gods is an instance of the Israelites worshiping a false god?
>>18532662I always found it interesting that Jews and Christians attribute the ability to blacksmith or more precisely forge weapons of war as something satanicIn the Book of Enoch Azazel is said to have taught the Art of blacksmithing to mankind, and Tubal-Cain is supposed to have been the first blacksmith as well
>>18534620This is a second temple era motif. In the ancient near east, the ability to smelt metal and manufacture swords was connected to humanity's capacity for warfare. It is targeting that but also guilds who trained only their own members, getting at inequality. It also is some type of typology at Tubal-Cain but also foreign empires, like the Persians, Babylonians and others. The idea being Tubal-Cain developed further the work of Cain
>>18533447An ethnonym used mostly by Iranians and Indians?
