Would historic pagans align more with modern SJW Pagans or modern Nazi pagans, given those are the only two kidns of modern pagans?
nazi tranny pagans
>>18550213The third group you're ignoring; reconstructionists. They're the only ones that don't look at ancient cultural attitudes and say "No no, that can't be right. They must have believed and behaved like me."
You tell me.
>>18550213I guess it depends on the pagans but the romans would side with the trannies any day, they might not love them but they would consider them devotees. There were multiple roman cults that were state sponsored and protected where devotees were expected to cut their dicks off
>>18550213Well for one, there's no such religion as "pagan", so your question as posed is made incoherent by its ambiguity
they seemed pretty inhuman in a way we don't really understandthey'd probably see both groups are objects more than people
>>18550213SJW/new agey pagans interpose christian expectations of what a deity is to pagan gods which is their undoing. Odin is a great example of that. He was supposed give you strength and had certain admirable traits but his ultimate goal was to lead great men at their peak to die in battle so they can join him during Ragnarok. He didn't bend to give anything to you, a mortal worm, he would help you because he finds you useful to his ultimate goal. He's not really any kind of protector but rather certain superhuman force that may be bargained with but ultimately does what it wants. The new agey pagans draw Christ, give him winged helmet and an eyepatch and declare that Odin wants to help you acquire wisdom and he's just a friendly traveller, Odin loves you!The neonazi camp either thinks of the gods as ethnic patrons, which they were closer to ever being than this kind of individualsed Christs in costumes or is more reconstruction focused and there's far more insincerity in this, because where the new age types are loony enough to believe this, they are more like atheists+, they probably don't believe any of it but they are nationalists so they'll worship their own deities or they are scholarly and want to recreate it as an intellectual thing - which is the exact opposite of what a pagan would be. You read Herodotus and while he just says that this and that is what XYZ tell when inquired about an event, does introduce all sorts of stories which follow the same exact pattern:>Oracle says something>People purposefully or not do something else>Great calamity happens>People decide to turn around and do what the oracle has said>Things changeThe reconstructionist is too intellectualised to assume Herodotus really believed there's a causal link there.Ultimately I think they'd see the neonazi/right wing pagans as more understandable(not every one of them was very sincerely religious), but would probably admire the faith the SJW/lefty/new age pagans have.
>>18550213They would draw arrows to decide who to side with.
>>18550213>Would historic pagans align more with modern SJW Pagans or modern Nazi pagans, given those are the only two kidns of modern pagans?I think they'd be their own completely unrecognizable third option; possessing qualities from both that, from an outside perspective, would seem in conflict with one another, but under scrutiny integrate into something functional. This Anon's post gets it the idea: >>18550348I think they'd relate to the more unusual sexual proclivities, ideas about gender, and environmentalist positions, of the modern SJWs, but find their positions on race and views on cultural subjectivity to be worthless. They'd probably be more in line modern Nazi's interest in ethnic nationalism, however, I think they'd find their 'atheism' and industrialist/technocrat side to be repulsive and contemptable. Probably the biggest aspect they'd conflict with every contemporary group is the material and ritualistic demands: animal sacrifice, iconography, scarification, the general pageantry and actual resource component of historic paganism. Modern people 'generally' (in my head I suppose I'm mostly thinking of modern strip-mall spiritualists and the obsession with online discourse) where convenience and currency-based transactions take priority even in spirituality and a part of me would believe a 'true' historic pagan group would find that cunty.
>>18550213I have no doubts whatsoever that they would disdain both groups and consider their paganism to be a poor mockery of what they actually believe in.
>>18550213Neither. They would continue doing whatever they wanted and write down in a book some place "The anons on 4chan worship Zeus in a most curious way. They consider him a guardian of the paleness of their skin, but refuse to pay him libations in this function, and as such Zeus does nothing for them." and go about their business.
>>18550213Specify which pagans. There are plenty of places with uninterrupted, practicing pagans that you could observe if you insist on lumping all pagans together. Perhaps examine Hindu Indians or West Africans?
Neither of one of them makes proper offerings to the gods, nor do they have properly ordained priests, they don't consult oracles, they don't observe holy days.
>>18550420>but refuse to pay him libations in this functionI literally poured a libation to him earlier, what do you make of that?
>>18550258Cultural attitudes evolve in polytheism just look at the difference between the Hesiod and Prometheus Unbound. Nazi pagans would find the most allies in the Roman Empire since fascism is just aping the imperial system.>>18550261There were no gays if you ignore all of the gay queer shit lmao. Are you really going to tell me all the male gods male lovers were straight? By the time of Alexander it was well known many historical figures and myths were queer just look at how they though about Achilles and Patroclus>>18550263Yeah the Emperor Julian loved the Magna Mater Cybele and her trans cult to the point he had to write extensively about them after stopping in Bythnia >>18550348Historically inaccurate, during the high points of European polytheism you had a very modern looking landscape with deists/Epicurous, old school believers that believed in fundie Homer and Hesiods versions of the Gods and a mix of other beliefs. By the 4th century and beyond they had moved onto monism largely. The idea that polytheists have to believe and worship like Bronze age people is ridiculous, not even fundie abrahamics act like its the first century>>18550432>They dont observe holy daysAnon I've seen a lot of shitflinging towards polytheists but I've never seen anyone accuse them of ignoring holy days. The celebration of seasonal cycles and holy days is kind of the backbone of modern polytheist movements
>>18550462Stopping in Phyrgia* It was the cults center before the Romans started moving it to Rome during the Punic wars
>>18550462>I've never seen anyone accuse them of ignoring holy days. The celebration of seasonal cycles and holy days is kind of the backbone of modern polytheist movementsNew age claptrap completely devoid of actual sacraments and rites. Nothing but feelgood circlejerks and binge drinking. Even the more organized modern day Hellenists hem and haw over the "ethics" of animal sacrifice despite it being of the utmost importance to virtually all antique religions. Without sacrifice prayer is just words.
>>18550505Lmao once again with the bronze age shitBy the 4th century Roman polytheists had basically moved on to sacrificing food, incense and libations. Besides animal sacrific isnt even what you think it is. Killing a calf or cow and then burning a thigh bone from it wrapped in animal fat is an offering (thanks Prometheus)
>>18550505Animal sacrifice by the 4th century was already unpopular to pagans in the Mediterranean and had declined massively even in the century before. They were considered too “messy” and most people had begun to prefer solely bloodless sacrifices that didn’t involve killing animals.Also, most sacrifices don’t take the form of animals anyways. There are different degrees and levels of offerings and sacrifices. Incense and votive offerings were commonly used throughout pagan Europe. Germanic archeological sites are usually littered with golden figurines buried as sacrifices. Germans made sacrifices of everything really including swords and flags looted from enemies. The Romans often made offerings of oatcakes with butter along with frankincense to Jupiter.
Its always so bizarre coming into these threads. It's always a mix of dudes raised on YouTube debates and a mishmash of information they gleaned from their local tent pastors or pop culture telling you how you should believe in something
>>18550359>They'd probably be more in line modern Nazi's interest in ethnic nationalismI don't see it. Historic pagans weren't concerned with ethnicity so much as they were concerned with a shared heritage. Pagans happily married and bred with people from other cultures/ethnicities so long as they could raise the children after their own ways. Nazism is based on genetic purity/corruption and the idea that a half-Black could be Germanic on account of a Germanic father is nonsense to them.
>>18550213It's one type. It's all SJW Nazis.
>>18550462>Historically inaccurate...That's just part of the society. As these people existed you've also had mystery cults garnering great popularity. The Roman writers at the end of the republic and begining of the empire were also rather agnostic but it didn't stop other elites from funding grand temples or sending expensive gifts to existing ones.If someone said that let's say Dewey was the reflection of American political beliefs in the 1950's you wouldn't treat it seriously(we have surveys etc. showing he wasn't), but Epicureans yeah that's just dudes presenting mainstream views for sure. Even late in the empire you've had Christian mocking some pagan senator for saying that the defeats they've suffered started when they removed the statue of Fortuna from the senate.I've actually used this example when it came to homosexuality once - Xenophon was quite popular, yet when he describes the traitor forgot his name he ends the litany of his faults with something like "but people who knew him back home could've said he's not like this but here's what everyone knows -..." and he mentions him being at both ends of pederastic relationship. The context is clear and he's obviously appealing to popular sentiment here. It doesn't stop him from describing things like his comrades arguing about the order in which they'll rape some unfortunate Anatolian boy etc. but that's part of the story, the former was a moral indignation of a character.Likewise ever popular Herodotus and his very obvious religiosity is a better barometer of public belief than some intellectual sceptic.This is just the Mediterranean situation as well. Polabian slavs would decide whether they board a ship for a pirate raid by observing whether the sacred horse walks through some spears laid on the ground in 11th century, here it's not even questionable they were quite deeply religious.
>>18550213They would take an immediate liking to Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy due to the fact they are organic continuations of Late Roman Popular Religion.They have their own pantheons where you can pick favorite divinities, I mean "saints."An ancient Roman Pagan would be quite familiar with the modes of worship they engage in. House icon corners, for example, would be familiar to them. Even the Orthodox panel paintings for icons would be nearly identical to what the ancient Roman had of his gods.Modern "paganism", of course, is just a LARP for atheists. Or covert Hindoos.
>>18550213What do you think? No seriously, what do you think, retard? SJW woke Pagans are the weird foreign Cults, which the Pagans back then fought against. The foundational myth of any Pagan religion is snake/dragon killing. When Aryans conquered a land, they would first have to kill all snake cultists to make that land safe for settling. The myth is universal in all Aryan religions. Germans have them, Romans had them, Greeks had them, etc. But the closest thing to a Pagan today would be a secular Atheist right-winger, who doesn't believe in any stupid superstitions, but instead is content with his culture and history as a religion. He would invoke the names of famous Great men of history to make a point, not the Gods, although he would have no left-wing Atheist reservations about just using them as metaphors or even more than just a metaphor. Nietzscheans are Pagans in mindset. And that is what counts. Not rituals. How Pagans thought, that is important.Woke Pagans are basically just left-wing Christians with a quirky different religion, where they subversively cosplay as the oppressed minority. Their misgivings with Christianity is that they aren't nice enough.
