“Yeah it didn’t happen because of inaccurate numbers but it also maybe did happen but it was all of those pesky mud hut dwelling cannibals that did all of it and the Europeans couldn’t do a thing and all they wanted to Do was give them jobs and health care why didn’t they just uproot their entire practices and way of life for them”
>>18551659Using an image like that immediately invalidated his argument anyway.
>>18551659>Yeah it didn’t happen because of inaccurate numbersHe didn't say that. He first proved it's a myth fabricated by Anglo merchants, who wanted Congo to give them unrestricted trade rights. First he established the motive for the lie and the he explained why the lie is a lie and a lie will always remain a lie.>but it also maybe did happen but it was all of those pesky mud hut dwelling cannibals that did all of it and the Europeans couldn’t do a thing and all they wanted to Do was give them jobs and health care why didn’t they just uproot their entire practices and way of life for themNo, he actually didn't say that. The myth of King Leopold's Congo Massacres is not something that "might have happened on a small scale", he already established it was completely fabricated. What did happen was something else.Never accept atrocity propaganda from the Anglos as normal history without revision!>>18551660It doesn't.
>>18551659>colonialism was evilit was the opposite of evil, you're just bitter and ungrateful
As usual pointing fingers to the past is useful for nothing but to hide crimes of the present.
>>18551659>>18551660Weren't most of the hand-chopping incidents carried out independently by natives who were allied with Belgium? There wasn't some Belgian officer sitting in an office saying "Go cut off X amount of hands today." It was just a local tradition.
>>18551665>He didn't say that. He first proved it's a myth fabricated by Anglo merchants, who wanted Congo to give them unrestricted trade rights.First he disputes the numbers and methodology of how the common figures are overblown(understandable) then tries to, in his words, cast doubt on the first hand accounts of atrocities because of “bias” or things being “illogical” the last thing he brings up is the British propaganda and economic interests which doesn't automatically equate to everyone was lying just means economic interests of the powerful aligned with the outrage of a humanitarian crisis same with the civil war and slavery > No, he actually didn't say that. The myth of King Leopold's Congo Massacres is not something that "might have happened on a small scale", he already established it was completely fabricated. What did happen was something else.If he did he didn’t articulate it well or concisely. at the end of the part dispute the atrocities specifically states that it’s “considerations of possible bias” with the sources
>>18551679Disputing*
>>18551674They did but the Pièces Justificatives is its own thing, Pièces Justificatives was the practice of the exchange of severed hands for ammo in the force publique with the intent of conserving ammo from being wasted hunting as economic reasoning but also to try and control the stockpiling of ammo for revolts and mutinies which he doesn’t bring up
>>18551659>>18551674The practice of amputation was brought to the Congo by Arab slave traders. Ending the East African slave trade was actually one of the reasons Leopold II cited as to why he should control the Congo, as a humanitarian mission to end the Arab slave trade, which he did.The problem was that the Congo was too vast to be administered by a handful of Europeans, so they designated to natives. This was a huge mistake, considering the Congolese themselves were already African savages, but not only that they'd been taught that amputation was the standard punishment by the Muslims for the last few centuries.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHTsrraXYGc
>>18551669Yes Israel needs to be wiped off the face of the earth what else is new
>>18551659>Dindu NuffinDas rite. It's the same thing with the Holohoax persecution and hatred of the Nazi. Why does the whole world hate their Great Satan crakka saviors?
>>18551659biggest dindu nuffin i've ever seen
>>18551659OP can you tell us what exactly you believe about this event? Were there 10 million dead or not? Did hand chopping exist there before Leopold or not? Was it ordered by European colonial overseers or not?
>>18551667If it wasn't evil, why would they be bitter?>smartest /pol/tranny
Discussion around Leopold and the Congo Free State on the right wing internet is always funny as hell since they try to act like the whole thing is just ridiculous modern revisionist hysteria on par with buck breaking or whatever, but then you look at political cartoons and newspapers from the time and learn that in reality, Leopold was literally always widely mocked and derided as an unnecessarily cruel tyrant even when he was still alive
>>18551704>which he did.He pretty much enslaved the locals AND hired Arab mercs into his forces as well as allowing them in private concession forces lmao.>This was a huge mistake, considering the Congolese themselves were already African savages, but not only that they'd been taught that amputation was the standard punishment by the Muslims for the last few centuries.False bullshit.
>>18551660You can't explain why, redditor
>>18551869>but then you look at political cartoons and newspapers from the time and learn that in reality, Leopold was literally always widely mocked and derided as an unnecessarily cruel tyrant even when he was still aliveSo what? I guess that means Trump is a swole bodybuilder because that's how his supporters depict him in political cartoons.Like this is seriously the dumbest argument I've seen here yet
>>18551665>He first proved it's a myth fabricated by Anglo merchantsNot really.>who wanted Congo to give them unrestricted trade rightsLeopold promised MULTIPLE EMPIRES that if he got Congo he's give them concessions as thanks for the support. Then he broke all those promises which pissed off everyone.>Never accept atrocity propaganda from the Anglos as normal history without revision!There's countless evidence and proofs.>>18551660James Talas can't even get a consistent posting schedule going and all he posts are jpgs and a shitty Australian (NZ) voiceover.
>>1855186990% of the slander you read about some historical figure was actually written by their contemporaries who disliked them but braindead /pol/niggers on the internet still think every single cultural critique was written by leftists in 1960.
>>18551873It means it'a one of many sources of the public opinion of him. He wasn't well liked in Belgium either since he basically took on thr Congo Free State without any real debate or consultation with the Belgian state.
>>18551877/his/ be like>/pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/ /pol/
>>18551879Obviously he wasn't well liked, the James Atlas video notes many times that he was utterly despised by his contemporaries. So what exactly are you arguing against here again?
>>18551674No, they were soldiers working for Belgium. Imposing ridiculously high quotas which forced them to terrorize the population so they wouldn’t be punished doesn’t absolve Europeans of their guilt because some soldiers were congolese.
>>18551889>doesn’t absolve Europeans of their guiltWhy are anticolonial libs so adamant on guilt tripping Europeans? Note how whenever chuds point to Arabic slavers they don't intend to do weird mind games on Arabs
>>18551892>whataboutismNot an argument.
>>18551896It's a perfectly valid argument. Why do you only care about slavery when Europeans do it?
>>18551898>justifying european atrocities by comparing them to atrocities of people i consider inferiorDoesn’t this conflict with your worldview? Europeans aren’t supposed to be brutal savages like brown people
>>18551903I don't care about the inferior/superior thing, I just find it cringy and reddity how only Euros get guilt-tripped over these things. The only difference between Euro and Arab empires is that the former were more powerful and wide-reaching because technology allowed them to be.
>>18551898>why is historical discussion relevant to the region it occurred inYou think people in MENA don't bitch about Arabization and Islamic conquests?
>>18551911I've never seen them do it online. It's only brought up by chuds to silence libtards who are obsessed with fagging out around European colonialism
>>18551659>>18551867>Were there 10 million dead or not?Population numbers are unreliable due to no census data during most of the free state period so there’s no certainty on any firgure but there was definitely a drastic population decline under the free state period accompanied by the atrocities that occurred >Did hand chopping exist there before Leopold or not?yes the Africans practiced mutilation before the CFS but the CFS used the Africans with their preexisting practices and cruelty against other Africans to secure Leopold’s financial interests to turn the Congo into a giant rubber plantation with the ivory trade on the side despite claims of wanting to “civilize” the area>Was it ordered by European colonial overseers or not?His only sources that directly dispute the claim is the inquiry commissioned by Leopold himself and a book on the history of the Congo that was quoting the same commission so everyone else was lying ig Idk why he’s even defending Leopold he’s honestly just bad at colonizing lol>>18551679>>18551701>>18551706were me as well forgot to tag the first post on them
>>18551659>>18551898Obviously it’s abhorrent for either but in this case the CFS under Leopold was supposed to end slavery and establish open trade with other European powers but then enacts royal decrees that essentially turned the natives into serfs and still didn’t just open up trade lolWhat really grinds my gears the way he essentially infantilizes Leopold and the Europeans of the CFS saying “they were trying there best out of a bad situation” Like they were taking a math test they forgot to study forHe also forgets to mention the burningof government archives in Belgium to attempt to cover up what Leo had done in the video
>>18551868>>/pol/trannyGo back to Bunkerchan, tourist.
>>18552007You're literally a transvestite though.
>>18552009>Me when I take things out of context:
>>18551659>Yeah it didn’t happenHe says in the video it did happen though? Just that the details are embellished
>>18551659>>18552198>but it also maybe did happen but it was all of those pesky mud hut dwelling cannibals
>>18552543>Those who eat my flesh and drink my blood have eternal life, and I will bring them back to life on the last day.Yummy yummy yummy I got love for your body and I feel like eating you.
>>18552604I bet you believe that Nazis made lampshades and soap out of jews.
>>18552604>hungHanged.
>>18551873Whether he actually did those things or not is irrelevant, I'm not trying to argue in favor of the veracity of those claims, i am simply pointing out the objectively false nature of an assumption common in certain corners of the internet.
>>18552633You're one of types who say he "pleaded" guilty instead of "pled", huh.
>>18551660Sure, give into the spectacle, puppet
>>18552878Pleaded and pled are both acceptable.I personally prefer strong verbs, but that's fine.
>>18552908No, they aren't.Sorry.I see journalists doing this dumb shit all the time. It's because they're effective ESLs who just take what dictionaries say for granted. These same dictionaries treat "envy" and "jealousy" as synonyms, when they are definitely not. Maybe the unread masses don't know there's a difference, but that doesn't mean they aren't very different anyways.It's part of the slow and deliberate corrosion of language.The proper use for "pleaded" belongs to the same use for begging. "He pleaded for her to say yes." or "She pleaded with him to stay."Not "He pleaded innocent."It is the more active form, but it is actually improper when applied to that particular context.Being sentenced to "be hanged until dead" reflects this active form. Once that happens, it is right to say "he has been hanged".
>>18552973*hung* God damn it. You know what I mean.
>>18552973What's the difference between envy and jealousy and a good way to remember it?I google this once a year and then promptly forget it for 12 months.
>>18552973You don't know what you're talking about, sorry.Strong verbs have been on the way out for a while.Americans keep maintaining them. Scots, too.English, not so much.
>>18552977Envy is desiring something someone else has.Think your "coveting".Being jealous is being possessive and defensive of something or someone you already have which another person might take away or otherwise affect.The God of the bible isn't a jealous God because Israel naturally belongs to another god and he desires them, but because Israel repeatedly goes after idols and strange gods.A man is usually jealous of his wife.Whereas an adulterer might be envious of that man for his wife.That doesn't mean the husband feels like his wife is superior to him in some respect. He's defensive of her position regarding him.
>>18552994But no one actually uses jealous in that way. You wouldn't say you're jealous of your money.Do archaic dictionary definitions matter when that's not how they're used? English isn't a prescriptive language like French.
>>18551871I dont have to, I dont respect anyone who posts images like that.
>>18551659You know you are right, Leopold was in the wrong in hiring backwater 70IQ chimps and expected nothing to go wrong.
>>18551906Bringing up the atrocities of Arab empires and their slave trade in this context is usually not a good faith attempt to address that subject, its usually a whataboutist tactic by white nationalists who get uncomfortable when European colonial atrocities are brought up and want to derail the discussion. Now as to why the atrocities and harmful impact of European colonialism is more discussed than that of Arab empires, part of it is ironically a pervasive sense Eurocentrism in scholarship, even in writing critical of Europe's impacts. But we do also have to grapple with the reality that in the last few centuries, European colonialism reshaped the entire world in ways no other civilization ever did, and continues to do so. White nationalists are more than happy to gloat about that as evidence of their race's innate superiority, but when people bring up the harmful impacts that this had (and continues to have) on peoples all over the globe, they retreat back into a position of moral relativism and supposed parity between Europe and other civilizations.
>>18553043Leopold gave the OK to concessions and the Force Publique in using violence. Like he was directly aware and directly backed them. It's been stated multple times over many sources.
>>18553055And all these policies of the Congo Free State focused on extracting as much resources as possible. So the idea thay Leopld had no idea or that he was innthe dark is a total meme. Everyone in the private holding knew what was going on. The trade of hands is a direct response to making sure that no FP solider spared any person or village of their quota punishment and people needing a way to avoid getting chopped/killed due to the constant quota jumps.
>>18553001Yeah, dictionary definitions matter especially more when illiterate colloquialisms become predominant in the vernacular.A good dictionary isn't supposed to confuse the meanings of words just because random plebs have confused them.That results in eventual semantic collapse.
>>18553080>>18553001Arguments about each other’s vocabulary is crazy lol
>>18552858>assumption common in certain corners of the internet.I've never seen anyone assume Leopold was beloved by other Europeans at the time. Even then Euros were bleeding heart lib activists
It wasn't anything unusual. Only thing anybody even knows leopold exist is becsuse of some black facebook conspiracy meme about how he was literally hitler.
>>18551659based Kang Leo cut the crime rate in half. You could almost say he chopped off half the crime
>>18553052>Bringing up the atrocities of Arab empires and their slave trade in this context is usually not a good faith attempt to address that subject, its usually a whataboutist tactic by white nationalists who get uncomfortable when European colonial atrocities are brought up and want to derail the discussion.Whataboutism is a perfectly valid strategy though. In the Euro vs. Arab colonialism case there is the obvious discrepancy in how they are treated in mainstream discourse. Euro colonialism is treated with heavy moralizing and this weird almost religious-sounding impulse to make Europeans "atone" for their "colonial guilt" like in this thread. It's perfectly legitimate to ask why this discrepancy exists. Obviously some of these people just want Europeans to hate themselves so they can move into white countries, but I can't help but feel that antiracists subconsciously don't see non-white people as fully human, ironically enough. Why else don't they treat them as moral agents? Why is it an outrage when Euros enslave and multilate Africans, but a complete non-issue when Arabs and Africans do the same? Need I remind you that slavery and hand-chopping existed in the Congo before Leopold and nobody cares.Maybe a more charitable interpretation is that the previous abuses lack a "face" which you can single out and perceive as a comic book villain, so on an emotional level people are less engrossed.>White nationalists are more than happy to gloat about that as evidence of their race's innate superiority, but when people bring up the harmful impacts that this had (and continues to have) on peoples all over the globe, they retreat back into a position of moral relativism and supposed parity between Europe and other civilizations.Yeah they switch tactics to win an argument like every other group that argues from an ethnocentric position.
>>18553168>black facebook conspiracy memeA jew wrote a popular book about it, "King Leopold's Ghost". The real truth was he did nothing wrong and the Congolese should reverse him for slashing the crime rate by 50%
lol
>>18553173No attonment just dont lie and say the Europeans of the CFS regime were helpless bystanders in the Congo, at least in this thread
>>18553227Citation needed.
>>18553227>>18553347The only source for Permentier's existence seems to be (((Adam Horschild)))'s own book he wrote in 1998.
>>18551868>why would they be bitter?because accepting that you lost is hard
>>18553032Your respect is worth less than shit, so carry on
>>18551868Colonizers actually believed you could elevate other races, it turns out we wasted our time trying to teach a dog to speak when we should have been genociding them and building over their pathetic civilisations
>>18551659It is impossible to have an honest intellectual discussion with chuds. Accept it and move on.
>>18553349Yeah, I was just laughing at how brazen the lie is. Sounds exactly like Holocaust stuff.
>>18553227So he literally wrote down Schindler's list?
>>18553032This is why you lost the culture war.
>>18551868They’re bitter because they’re seething incels compared to White BVLLs
>>18553032What do you think about the King Leopold II Basedboy Cobson Whoahjack?
>>18554187>say the line Leopoldjak
>>18551869Look at the 'toons bro!
>>18554904Libtard niggas will mock 1950s fans for fawning over advertisements and then point to political cartoons as proof of genocide
