>Something bad happensGod willed it.>Something good happensGod willed it
Reminder that every event is directly caused by Allah, quantum mechanics proved this.
Correct. Every faith that has deities that can influence the world believes this.
>All is as willed by heaven. My failures are because of heaven. My victories are because of heaven. When I shit myself, heaven did it. When I shit in the loo, it is because heaven didnt make me shit myself.Life is just that fucking easy. No worries at all.>die to yellow river flood
>>18580744Everything is for your own good. You can grow with every situation if you learn to see it correctly, so you could extract the benefit from it.
>>18581094In Islam there actually isn't a "you" in any meaningful sense. "You" exist as a fully causally inert homunculus that watches a braindance produced by Allah.
>>18581117No. What you said is an overstatement that misrepresents mainstream Islamic theology. Islam teaches that Allāh has complete knowledge and power, and many schools affirm divine decree (qadar), but that does not mean humans are "causally inert homunculi" or mere spectators of a movie. Classical Islamic theology, whether Sunni or Shia, holds that people genuinely choose, intend, and are morally responsible for their actions, even though God is ultimately sovereign over creation. Different schools explain the relationship between divine causation and human agency differently; for example, the Ash'ari doctrine of kasb or 'acquisition,' and the Maturidi emphasis on meaningful human choice, but none reduce the human person to a passive observer with no real agency. What you said is therefore a philosophical caricature, not an accurate description of Islamic belief.
>>18581130>pic relLol SheikhGPT is back I see. >holds that people genuinely choose, intend, and are morally responsible for their actionsCompletely false per many many hadith. According to the hadith, Allah MAKES people do evil so that he can send them to Hell:"Then Allah sends an angel who is ordered to write four things. He is ordered to write down his (i.e. the new creature's) deeds, his livelihood, his (date of) death, and whether he will be blessed or wretched (in religion). Then the soul is breathed into him. So, a man amongst you may do good deeds till there is only a cubit between him and Paradise and then what has been written for him decides his behavior and he starts doing evil deeds characteristic of the people of the Hell Fire." - https://sunnah.com/bukhari:3208"and then what has been written for him decides his behavior". Allah makes you do evil, what he has written decides your behavior."When He creates a slave for the Fire, He makes him use the behaviour of the people of the Fire, so that he dies on one of the actions of the people of the Fire, and by it, He brings him into the Fire". (https://sunnah.com/malik/46)According to Islam the prophet Adam affirmed this explicitly in https://sunnah.com/bukhari:6614 ''O Moses! Allah favored you with His talk (talked to you directly) and He wrote (the Torah) for you with His Own Hand. Do you blame me for action which Allah had written in my fate forty years before my creation?'".In https://sunnah.com/muslim:2650 the question of the justness of Allah punishing people for things Allah himself is decreed comes up, and Muhammad doubles down in it: "Thereupon, he said: Of course, it happens as it is decreed by Destiny and preordained for them, and this view is confirmed by this verse of the Book of Allah, the Exalted and Glorious:'Consider the soul and Him Who made it perfect, then breathed into it its sin and its piety' (xci. 8)."Bukhari>ChatGPT.
>>18581136>completely falseOpinion discarded. You're utterly clueless about Islam.
>>18581139Al-Ghazali's insinuations still make you a homunculus because your choices are predetermined by Allah, and choice is an event - only determinable by Allah. Al-Ghazali didn't even try to justify anything else.
>>18581139I can cite hadith after hadith that agrees with me wholeheartedly. You have to get a milquetoast ChatGPT summary, as proven by a basic scan.There's survivorship bias that yields Muslims being generally poorer at telling what Islam teaches than non-Muslims are, since anyone reasonable who learns how disgusting its ideas are like Allah _WANTING_ and _MAKING_ people do evil to that he has an excuse to subject them to gory tortures will likely cease to be a Muslim.
>>18580744Deus vult
xddd
>Islam's determinism is... le bad!>Reformed Christianity's determinism is... le good!
>>18581320Reformed christianity paints a God so evil that it might as well be islam for white people
>>18581334>God isn't sovereignlmao you posit an impotent deity
>>18581320Other Christians can't stand that aspect of Calvinism and it's constantly criticized. Every sane person hates the model of the world where God is a lunatic torturing his puppets in a twisted sort of sadistic masturbation.
>>18581363I think they're just ennamored with the thought that they in particular are one of the chosen and that God is willingly sending a bunch of other people to hell just to exalt them and Himself. That and they have a severe form of autism where they cannot reconcile God's omnipotence with human free will.
>he believes this is Islam
>>18581149>likely cease to be a MuslimNot really. You caught him off gaurd, and tried to shove your wet cross down his throat. Islam is the only religion, that appeals to man's faculties of reason and rationality. That is to say, you can rationalize islam intellectually, but it's impossible to rationalize Christianity. This is why you're constantly getting humiliated by the atheists, you can't present a case to them, it's doctrines are infact insulting to the senses, once you read into it's scholastic tradition. This has been my problem as well, it seems to operate on good feelings. You were castrated in my thread last night, like Origen of Alexandria, and are trying to pick on this guy? Trying to act tough?
>>18581136And this again coming from your compounded ignorance, that has been clarified already. You're unable to rationalize robust systems of theolgical compatabilism, because you can't think about them on a deeper philosophical level. This is not a pressure point of Islam, our orthodoxy rejected your libertrarian nonsense, that was the mutazilite's position. You on the other hand, made this nonsense your orthodoxy, that relies on insulting scriptural gymnastics to substantiate. Because like I said before, Bible is inherently deterministic, this is why st. Augustine was deterministic, this is the problem John Calvin couldn't rationlise and lie himself over anymore. God isn't whatever you want him to be, because you're a special little boy in the butthole of the milky way.
>>18581130who gives a shit what islam says about anything. you're inbred rapey third world scum. the most retarded religion for the most backwards retarded cunts to ever walk the earth.
>>18581819>That is to say, you can rationalize islam intellectually,ahh yes the religion that tells us an illiterate goat fucker flew a magic unicorn to the moon and cut it in half before raping his child bride. All the mildly intellectual aspects are just plagiarised from the Bible. Fucking dickhead.
>>18581831>>18581835Whatever you say babygirl, but keep your dogs on a leash. I'm respectful only as long as there's mutual understanding.
>>18581838i accept your concession. Mohammed was a paedophile who raped little girls and islam is a death cult that promotes rape of non believers. Everyone else in the world hates you and your shithouse prophet.
>>18581853Your God commanded rape of little virgin girls on an industrial scale.>Everyone else in the world hates youI don't care princess, tone the drama down, don't flutter about me like a ponce.The clear difference between you and me is that, you're an incel that masturbates to summa theolgica while embodying a character the diametric opposite of what my prophet Jesus preached.You should not even be a Christian boy, it is as He said, like throwing peals before swines. Look into some eastern mystical religions, like buddhism. You won't be close to the creator, but atleast you'll get laid.
>>18581857Why does your prophet say it's fine to rape and murder people?
>>18581862Following biblical law of yehwah/jesus (your pauline understanding of "jesus", not our noble jesus (pbuh)). Now, come here, I'll shave your head myself. I've already paid 50 shekels to your daddy.
>>18581868Answer the question. Why does the Moslem God say it is ok to rape and murder people ? Jesus said love thy enemy. Mohammed said its your duty according to God to rape and kill infidels. Why ?
>>18581895jesus (your jesus) also commanded you to kill little babies, to stab them with the sharp-and-pointy edge of the sword. This visceral image was placed in my mind by a God that tells you not to spare even the animals; the innocent donkeys grazing on grass. Are you familiar with the patristic literature, or what a theophany is?These genocidal tendencies, of course, manifest themselves in your chosen people (I say your, because you give off the vibes of a dispensationalist dumb uneducated american) when they commit inhuman and barbaric acts, and justify them via the Bible.You don't seem well-versed in christianity, to even argue anything with me. You have never questioned your beliefs, or the foundations they stand upon. I can't blame the atheists for constantly humiliating you people on this board, and calling you parasites. "Christians" are good people, but you are an embarrassment to your religion and all theists. Making us appear retarded.
>>18581933>jesus (your jesus) also commanded you to kill little babies, to stab them with the sharp-and-pointy edge of the sword.no he didn't you lying paki bastard. that's all you cunts do. Lie and rape and subvert civilisation. >These genocidal tendencies, of course, manifest themselves in your chosen people (I say your, because you give off the vibes of a dispensationalist dumb uneducated american) when they commit inhuman and barbaric acts, and justify them via the Bible. The New Testament does no such thing and the NT supercedes the OT.
>>18581947I know it's hard on the mushrikeen, when you're confronted with the truth. Go ahead and pose this question to your preacher, when you're on your knees, doll. Make him squirm like you.God infact says,>The truth has come, falsehood has disappeared. By its nature, falsehood is bound to disappear (quran 17:81)>supercedesOh lawd, that's irrelevant. You can't even conceive of the fact that your God could command it. This, i present to the thread is the indoctrination of the Christian man.If his God is by nature good, as it is articulated in his literature. Within his paradigm, the act itself is good at some point in time. So as a christian boy, murdering babies is good, if my 'heart is hardened'. Is that what you'll say? How pathetic and infantile.Go away now, I'm done with you. Keep your self-righteous bible thumping to yourself. And stop making theists look as uneducated and idiotic as yourself, infront of these beautiful and intelligent atheists.
the religion that appeals the most to smelly, brown inbred rapist pakis who can never honestly defend what they own paedo prophet actually represented. Christians follow the teachings of Jesus Christ. Muslims follow the teachings of a murderer and bandit who robbed and enslaved and murdered people and bragged about it and married a 9 year old. You're fucking scum and i spit on your prophet you paki cunt. Hope you and your inbred family die in a fire today or of one of your many congenital defects. Fuck Mohammed!
And like Saint Mcdonalds says, I'm loving it. The seethe.This kind of hateful rhetoric is beneath me, it corrupts my soul, distances me from the light of God. So I'll make the apology instead, I don't mean to insult any christians or hurt their sentiments. Yet they act as confrontational bad-faith actors, that consider disagreement in belief as inherently demonic. and as the gospel of Matthew says, "by their fruits you shall know them".
>>18581970kys paki. you're inbred and stink and the rest of the world hates you
>>18581973If I call you pretty, will you be happier? No honey, that dress doesn't make you look fat. I'm not the namefag btw.
>>18581976go suck your mother who is also your cousin you sick fuck
>>18581981And now that you're primed, moist and ready to go. I'll say something mean to you. As literacy and education spreads, the old bonds of despondancy will no longer compel belief. The son of Adam will have a bitter epiphany; the roots of hatred, the source of division and suffering, is the all-loving the God himself. As luke succinctly says in his gospel,>He has come to divide, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against motherThe God who fashiones himself as Love, produces this fruit. Religion is the temporary refuge for us, as we squibble over it with misguided passions. The dustbin is what it truly awaits.The mere mention of the incredulity of the bible, made you hold onto it tighter than a nun's snatch. Yet you cannot hold this mirror to your pimple-filled, chin-less face.Remember this, when you go tomorrow to preach to your friends, (you) will not be to justify that they immerse themselves in this pool of hatred. Your words will say Love, but your heart will betray hatred.For the secular man towers above us both in ethic and love. This fact may not mean anything to you, but this is what humiliates me.
>>18581828>coming from your compounded ignoranceAll I did was quote hadith mate. One intimately familiar with the sunnah is, by definition, not ignorant on the subject of Islam.Notice your entire reply offers no counterargument. Because there is none to be made. The hadith are crystal clear on this point. You use whataboutism (as Muslims always, always, always do) and insults, but there is no attempt to refute what I said, because it is irrefutable, because it is simply quotes from the hadith.
>>18581819>Islam is the only religion, that appeals to man's faculties of reason and rationalityAnon it teaches to invoke Allah's protection against sprites called Jinn that haunt bathrooms before you enter them with your right foot. It's a pile of silly superstitions.>You were castrated in my thread last night, like Origen of Alexandria, and are trying to pick on this guy? Trying to act tough?I think you have somebody else in mind, this doesn't sound like any conversation I had last night
>>18581149>Hadith booksInto the trash they go. Islam is about the Quran (the Word of God), not about suppositions.>>18581147Oh, another so called "scholar", I see...
>>18582253I already gave you a comprehensive response in my thread. Something you didn't read nor had the capacity to understand. You kept being a pain in my ass about word counts, as if I would bow to the rules of this website.You seem to think the world owes you your share of attention; a self-fashioned Madonna, brandishing a mickey-mouse emblem on his big-boy knickers. don't act like a philosopher, while fumbling over basic concepts. "It's a divine mystery" is the catch-all phrase of your tradition, remember? I don't care if compatibalism, doesn't tickle you right. It's the only way a rational being can reconcile God, who's not merely an excercise in pointless pontifications and metaphysical masturbations.
>>18582269Any conversation does indeed radically change if you're Koran-only instead of a Sunni. Are you Koran-only, or do you reject these because you're a Shi'ite perhaps?>>18582295>Something you didn't read Oh you're that guy. Correct, I will not read five full replies to a single one of my own. Two at absolute maximum in special circumstances. Otherwise the conversation balloons past any practical point, it will take seven replies to deal with five. It's best to stay within the character limit since that requires you to be disciplined and briefly state your core points with their most direct supporting information. That is how a conversation can be truly productive.>"It's a divine mystery" is the catch-all phrase of your tradition, remember?I think you're mixing me up with somebody else because I never said something like this>It's the only way a rational being can reconcile GodDoes Allah want people to do evil, and then makes them do it?
>>18580744Nothing ever happens though
>>18580744Technically God actively wills every single thing to happen so this means God actively willed his own message to be corrupted and every other bad thing in Islam. >>18581117This is not quite true in Islam. In every aqidah, you are a soul and God causes your soul to do things by making your spirit do things. God also wrote in the tablet (al-Lawhu 'l-Mahfuz), the heavenly preserved record of all that has happened and will happen,technically contains qadar as in his will. One philsoophical problem is that the Koran is eternal as his will, which technically philosophically posed a lot of problems. Agency in Islam is not agency in analytic philosophy or even Christianity or Judaism, it is being capable of being blamed. This is the whole story of the point of Khidr.
>>18580744I agree with thist. Calvinist
>>18583095Technically the Calvinist holds that God wills everything all at once as a type of singlular plan. Qadar in the context of Islam holds God wills things individually. Whatever a person may have with Calvinism, those problems become much worse with Qadar. One implication of it is that cause and effect are not real because they don't actually capture the will of God.>>18582324Allah technically causes you do the acitons that he punishes you for.Whomsoever Allah guides, he is the one who follows the right way; and whomsoever He causes to err, these are the losers.Quran 7:178My counsel will not profit you if I were minded to advise you, if Allah’s will is to keep you astray. He is your Lord and unto Him ye will be brought back.Quran 11:34nd when We desire to destroy a city, We command its men who live at ease, and they commit ungodliness therein, then the Word is realized against it, and We destroy it utterly.Quran 17:16Whoever God guides, then he will be guided, while whoever He misguides, then he will never find helpers other than Him. And We shall gather them on the Day of Judgment upon their faces, blind, dumb, and deaf. Their abode will be Jahannam. Every time it abates, We shall increase the fierceness of the Fire.”Quran 17:97
>>18583090It is technically of being blamed by God. This means that since Allah can do anything, you are free. Freedom is the ability to do what is determiend by Qadar and Allah's will. Technically you are not supposed to reason about what that is possible and it is consdiered a type of devil's whisper to question it. It is unseen (ghayb).
>>18583106The Calvinist holds that God exists outside of time and does not experience time
