Historically speaking, why were Jews always the ones blamed for Usury and not the borrowers who accepted loans they knew they could never pay back? Why can't gentiles hold themselves accountable for their own actions?
>>18581607Because they were a convenient scapegoat due to being an insular minority.
>>18581609>schlomo dindu buffin he was on his way to synagogue getting his life back on track
Jews were basically forced into giving out loans because they were barred from pretty much every non-finance position in Medieval Europe
>>18581607>>18581609Historically speaking, why were Jews never smart enough to anticipate that King John HateHeebs and the Templar Order Deus Vultus Knights and the horde of Jorge Matajudeos peasants might just skip out on their loan instead of repaying it?
>>18581615Jews were simply too trusting and naive
>>18581615Because they usually did pay them back and because they didn't exactly have much choice in the matter.
>>18581614>the invisible hand of the free market FOrCED us to be extortionate schylocks!
>>18581614completely false, read Chaim Potok's Wanderings. For their first two hundred years in Medieval Europe, Jews worked in fields and vineyards or itinerant merchants, lived as regular townsfolk, entered the homes of Christians regularly. The reason the Church needed to regularly send out insistent, plaintive reminders not to intermarry with Jews was because it was happening so much.The Jews entered usury because they wanted to, because it was a pathway to becoming the richest men in Europe. Oh no, the Norman king forced Aaron of Lincoln to become the wealthiest man in Norman England purely through savvy business dealings. The horror! Do you really buy a tale like that?
>>18581619And if you juggle hand grenades you'll usually keep your hands.
>>18581619>didn't exactly have much choice in the matter.look at a map of the migrations of the early Ashkenazim at the time of the Carolingians. Are you insane? Do you know how hard that would have been for them as Jews?They were traversing forests of Gaul and Germany chock full of slavering hordes of barbarians, fuck off with this nonsense. They did it to get rich, they had full autonomy in the matter.Maybe there was a handful of court Jews who were gang-pressed into being accountants, but as a rule the Jews made herculean treks to attain their positions as moneylenders.
Jews will risk life and limb traversing some Medieval trade route that takes them through three different German fortifications full of warriors ready to rip their heads off for not hailing the Donar oak, then sail the English channel nearly capsizing twice, trudge through the English estuary mud to finally get to Westminster to have an audience with the King and beseech him that they know about some special trade route for spices and silks from Asia Minor that their cousin can hook him up with.And 500 years later their descendants will log on to 4channel and be like "yeah he was forced to make those loans lol"
>>18581624>>18581640Almost all Jewish money-lenders were working for rich Christian nobility tho, they were providing them with the money they could lend in the first place
>>18581632Jews were largely prohibited across Europe from owning land or joining guilds. Great shocker that they tended to work in the one field they were actually encouraged to work in by Europeans, as there was a widespread need for non-Catholic moneylenders, with Catholics themselves being discouraged from working in the field. They were even brought to England after the Norman conquest with protection guarantees from the king as he strongly desired to have them work for him in the country. Antisemites seriously have less accountability than radical feminists.
>>18581642That doesn't relate to my post, I'm saying the notion that Jews were forced into money lending is utterly absurd considering they went on Oregon Trail tier voyages to get to the places where they lent money, because they wanted to do it! They were good at it! They liked it! No one was forced to do anything.On any given day, they could have woken up, gone to the church, converted to Christianity, and worked any profession they pleased. We know that because a lot of them did it.And to your point, in at least three instances I can think of without googling - Aaron of Lincoln, the Rothschilds, and Chaym Solomon - they became far, far richer than the Christian nobility they "worked for"
>>18581662they made herculean odysseys to reach the places where they lent money and they could have quit and converted and worked any other profession whenever they pleased and no one would have stopped them. No one, not even you, believes they lent money because they "had to"
>>18581662How many people in the world today do you think would look at this map, knowing what they know about how difficult travel was at the time, and seriously believe they were FORCED to travel to these places in search of trade and opportunities to lend money? One? Two?
>>18581667BTW this map doesn't even include the original Ashkenazi migrations from Italy and Spain into Northern Germany, you can't find those maps on the internet, they don't exist, no one wants to acknowledge that the Ashkenazim CHOSE to enter Germany.
>>18581664Yeah, just convert. As if Jews genuinely did not believe in their own faith. Stop being such a clown, it's embarassing. And herculean odyssey is very overdramatic. Jews were in Europe since the Romans and most generations barely moved. They migrated gradually across centuries within the same continent, with said migrations often being due to expulsions. I would say that the European barbarian migrations from the 4th to 6th centuries were far more extreme and dramatic than any migrations made by the Jews.
>>18581672They repeatedly risked life and limb to lend money and be Jewish, knowing their ancestors had repeatedly been gruesomely massacred and impaled and lynched and expelled for doing so, and they continued to do it because THEY WANTED TO.>the European barbarian migrations from the 4th to 6th centuries were far more extreme and dramatic than any migrations made by the Jews.They were the SAME MIGRATION PATHS in reverse you fucking moron, THAT'S MY POINT! You don't even know your own history.The Germanic barbarians migrated from Scandinavia across the Rhine into Italy and Spain. The first Ashkenazim migrated in the 8th, 9th, and 10th centuries from Italy and Spain into Carolingian Gaul and Germany. It's the same thing, except it was a far, far riskier journey for the Jews, far more likely to be fatal, but they nevertheless undertook it because they knew the trade routes and money lending opportunities that awaited them could make them rich.Yes, migrating from Toledo to the Rhineland as a Jew in Carolingian Europe was Herculean. Think about what it would entail!
You try to adopt this tone of victimization because you are uncomfortable with the notion of usury, you hate your own history, you want to disown it. But you're also intensely proud of your Judaism. So the conversation starts out as one of utility and victimization. They had to moneylend, it was the only way to make a living, they were pressured into it. Then when the "c" word is mentioned, the conversation is transformed into one of philosophical intention and agency and autonomy. The Jews made a philosophical choice as a nation to preserve their tradition and mythology and worldview. How clownish it would be to convert. What happened to being victims?
>>18581675The only one playing victim here is you, along with being completely hysterical like a theater kid lol Nobody is disowning that Jews worked in moneylending. It is simply being explained as to why, which is because Europeans wanted them to due to their own prohibitions on the trade despite their continuous need for it. And that Jewish migration was not some overnight and dramatic odyssey but a millennia long gradual process that was largely due to necessity. They did migrate thoughout the Mediterranean before the destruction of the temple and the beginning of formal expulsions, but that's hardly unusual considering Romans, Greeks, and Phoenicians all did the same. With many migrations such as to England and Poland being due to formal invitation and migrations away from countries like Spain or even their native Judea being due to expulsions.So quit being such a dramatic whiny theater kid, it is once again very embarrassing.
>>18581684easy. the Church didn't want Christians engaging in usury, but they were ok with Jews doing it since they didn't care if they went to Hell when they died.
>>18581663Some of the smartest achived success on their own, most were just middlemans for the noblity
>>18581607>Victim blaming
