Is there any solid evidence that Ashkenazi are actually descended from Levantine jews?
>>18585049Ashkenaz was the first descendant of Japheth and the progenitor of white people according to Biblical tradition. In practice, it wasn't entirely unheard of for people in Eastern Europe who are not in any way genetically tied to Levantine Jews to convert to Judaism on their own but for the most part they converted by marriage so it really just depends.
>>18585053That early? I assumed the Jewish diaspora as we knew it was the result of their failures to acquire independence from the Roman Empire before and in 70 AD?
>>18585049Yeah, the genetics has settled that question, more or less. If it even was a question, at any point.
>>18585049>descendedsure, but that doesn't mean much of anything
>>18585049They have some canaanite ancestry (40-50%), but it's impossible to say if that comes from levantine people why migrated or if it's from e.g. punic colonies who converted to yahwism.Before the fall of the Temple in 70CE, the diaspora jewish population is already way bigger than the one in the Levant, so we need some theory how that happened. It makes sense that it was through rapid conversion of canaanites and locals in various communities around the Mediterranean. Paul e.g. was born into a jewish family in antioch, in Turkey, around year 0. So what we do know is that they're not the result of some big expulsion in 70CE, that was always a Christian myth.
>>18585282This image is bullshit. Ashkenazi are around 50-70% Jewish. Sephardi and Mizrahi are even higher. Jews have always been endogamous
>>18585053>the progenitor of white peopleSo at what point did Ashkenazi become white? The Levantine and Mediterranean features are still there in terms of skull shape and all, but what about the skin tone? I always assumed it was from intermarriage in Eastern Europe at some period where marriage laws were flexible, and they were allowed to live outside of ghettos.
>>18585053Ashkenazi Jews are named as such because they were those among the diaspora to settle in the 'lands of Ashkenaz'.It doesn't mean those Jews descend from Ashkenaz.
>>18585478There was an initial period of mixing when the first Jews migrated north/east Europe. These Jews were overwhelmingly men so took European wives. But following this early period and as Jewish communities became established the mixing largely ceased.
>>18585397>>18585274>They have some canaanite ancestry (40-50%)Ashkenazis have nowhere near 50% canaanite ancestry. They’re basically Germans/Poles larping as a biblical race.
>>18585459yeah that’s why they have pale white skin and Central European features right?
>>18585459>Jews have always been endogamousI have never met a Jewish woman in my life who either wasn't a coal burner, feminist (lesbian) or porn star.
>>18585459>Jews have always been endogamousYou realize Ashekenazis are descendants of Europeans who converted to Judaism right?
>>18585053>>18585274>>18585397>>18585459Ashkenazim are descended from Khazars who converted to Judaism 1200-1400 years ago. This fact makes them seethe to this very day.
>>18585811There's no evidence Ashkenazim have Asiatic ancestry. Khazars were LARPing Mongols. They were largely isolated from the rest of the global Jewish community.
>>18585811They have Southern Italian blood. Specifically matrilinearly. Don't think Khazars were in the habit of marrying Southern Italians.
>>18585049If jewz iz all just local converts becuz Ashkenazi Jewz look white, why don't Karaites look like Tartars?
>>18585800>>18585811This bullshit was popularized by a literal communist Zionist Jew who made up this theory so he could claim the Jews are Europeans who didn't kill Jesus to combat Antisemitism. You idiots really are cattle.>A quote that shows the clear ethnic Jewish motivation of the popularization of the “Khazar theory” by Arthur Koestler. Koestler, the Jewish one time Communist and radical Zionist (Jabotinsky party member), is most famous for writing the book “The Thirteenth Tribe” which is one of the most quoted “proofs” of the “Khazar theory.”>His official biography, written by Michael Scammell, specifically quotes him on why he wrote “The Thirteenth Tribe.” His argument was that if he could persuade people that a non-Jewish “Khazar” heritage formed the basis of modern Jews, then this would be a weapon against European racially based anti-Semitism. “Should this theory be confirmed, the term ‘anti-Semitism’ would become void of meaning,” he said. According to Scammell, Koestler told French biologist Pierre Debray-Ritzen he “was convinced that if he could prove that the bulk of Eastern European Jews were descended from the Khazars, the racial basis for anti-Semitism would be removed and anti-Semitism itself could disappear.”>(Source: Scammell, Michael. Koestler: The Literary and Political Odyssey of a Twentieth-Century Skeptic, Random House, 2009, ISBN 978-0-394-57630-5, p. 546.)>The theory has sometimes been used by Jewish authors such as Arthur Koestler as part of an argument against traditional forms of antisemitism (for example the claim that "the Jews killed Christ")
>>18586144Kek
>>18586144>most people calling themselves jews now are Europeanshe wasn't wrong, they're jews who are not jews, or as the Bible labels them, the synagogue of Satan.
>>18585868>>18586102>>18586144>REEEES we wuz canaanites ‘n shieet!!!do you have any sources that corroborate your claim that don’t come from chabad.com?
>>18586127If anything this meme just demonstrates that judaism is a made up race to begin with
>>18586278Where did the whiteness of the Karaites come from?
>>18585811>This fact makes them seethe to this very day.But why though?
bump
>>18586439Irrelevant since judaism is a religion and not a race. Anyone can convert to judaism and claiming that jews all share a common ancestry is absurd.
>>18586526because that means they’re not actually native to “israel” and have no legitimate claim to levantine land
>>18586760And why does that make you angry? Are you a Palestinian or someone with Palestinian friends or family? There is a lot of injustice in the world, and focusing all your time and energy on a pin prick on the map feels odd.
>>18586172>or as the Bible labels themNo it doesn't. Revelations 3:9 reproaches the Churches of Smyrna and Philadelphia. https://biblehub.com/commentaries/revelation/3-9.htm>Of the synagogue of Satan.—We have here a re-appearance of the same troubles which afflicted the Church of Smyrna: the fixed and contemptuous exclusiveness of the Judaising party was their trial.>The church in Philadelphia is commended; yet with a gentle reproof. Although Christ accepts a little strength, yet believers must not rest satisfied in a little, but strive to grow in grace, to be strong in faith, giving glory to God.>Ignatius corroborates the malign activity of Jews at Philadelphia, who were in the habit of molesting the church (ad Philad. 6); he also refers them to the malicious cunning of Satan. Apparently Judaizing tendencies were rife among Christians of Gentile birth at Philadelphia. As in writing to Smyrna, the prophet thereforeclaimed the ancestral title “Jew” for the Christian church. Faith in Christ, not mere nationality, constituted true Judaism; the succession had passed to Christianity.Please learn your own religion.
>>18586834>And why does that make you angry?Where did I come across as angry?>There is a lot of injustice in the worldIf your argument is that no one should care about injustice because there’s so much of it, why would you demand sympathy and reconciliation from other people over the holocaust or any other misfortune that befalls jews?
>>18587352>Where did I come across as angry?>"This fact makes them seethe to this very day.">If your argument is that no one should care about injustice because there’s so much of itNot my argument. I'm asking why Israel? It seems like a point of fixation. If you have a personal connection to the region, then I get it. If you don't want your tax dollars being sent to the IDF to buy missiles, then I sort of get that too - though I'd want to know if you supported tax-funded aid in general or if you judge things on a case-by-case basis. But if this is a human rights issue for you, then I wonder about the fixation. There are larger issues that involve more people.>why would you demand sympathy and reconciliation from other people over the holocaust or any other misfortune that befalls jews?Me personally? I don't demand sympathy, monetary reconciliation, memorials, or anything else. I want the same standards applied to everyone, and if we demanded equal representation for all aggrieved parties in the world, then we'd never stop apologizing. It's best to enter things into the historical record and move on with our lives.
>>18585049No, they are basically Ukrainians.
>>18586747Who is this "anyone" in Crimea that converted to Judaism, the Tartars? They don't look white.
>>18585282>Depicting the admixture as "Brown"Literal opposite happened to the Ashkenazi, those motherfuckers are Polish/German/Belarusian
>>18588198Are Crimean Karaites "Polish/German/Belarusian"?
>>18586102Yeah I don't know why people continue to peddle bs in the age of archaeogenetic sequencing. Ashkenazi are mostly paternally Levantine and maternally southern italian. Only a small minority of them ever mixed with Slavs or Germanics. It's funny too because they came to America at about the same time as the wops and there was a ton of overlap between the two groups here when it came to things like revolutionary politics and organized crime. Plus they even look alike lol.
>>18585780Well that really gets into the question of what makes a "people" now doesn't it? While majority European, they still have a substantial amount of Palestinian DNA, enough to make them a distinct group within the larger European clade that is easily observable in a genetic test, No other European group has that mass of Palestinian DNA, but likewise that European DNA is substantial enough that they are easily and discernibly a different clade from the "pure" Palestinians who never left (and converted to christianity and islam). So are they one, both, or neither? Then what about culture? Despite the interbreeding with European Northern and Central European populations they remained a culturally and socially distinct group. But again, they became culturally and socially distinct from other groups like the Mizrahi as well. For example there was a severe culture class when Israel was being setup between things like the Ashkenazi settlers being Christian style monogamists, and the Mizrahi settlers being Muslim style polygamists.
>>18586834>And why does that make you angry? Are you a Palestinian or someone with Palestinian friends or family? There is a lot of injustice in the world, and focusing all your time and energy on a pin prick on the map feels odd.i find it most peculiar that oppression of Muslims in Burma and China is never ever mentioned and they focus 100% on Israel-Palestine conflict
>>18586144It may be bullshit, but Muslims pretty much all believe it.
>>18585049The fact that the stereotypical '''Jewish features''' just happen to fall in line with typical Levantine features doesn't mean anything to you?
>>18588209It's the other way around: Italians have a large Levantine maternal genetic heritage, hence the overlap with the Jews. The Romans killed hundreds of thousand of Jewish and Samaritan males, while their women were enslaved and sold around for the price of a donkey.>Y-chromosome admixture proportions to the current SSI genetic pool indeed confirm an high paternal contribution from the South-Eastern Mediterranean populations, and particularly from the Balkan Peninsula (∼60%), whereas about 25% of SSI Y-chromosomes can be traced back to North-Western European group. Analogously, although the present-day SSI mtDNA genetic pool is largely shared with the other South-Eastern European populations of the Mediterranean Basin (respectively Balkan and Italian Peninsulas), a remarkable proportion of maternal ancestry (especially if compared with its paternal counterpart) derives from the Levant.>In fact, whereas the different continental and within continental contributions to the current SSI genetic pool appeared to be more equally distributed on the maternal side (despite a noteworthy contribution of Levantine females), the paternal counterpart appeared to be clearly affected by South-Eastern Mediterranean, mainly Balkan, males.
>>18588908They don't get American pitybux to use for PR.
