Can we have a Mesoamerica thread? Favorite culture? Favorite city? Favorite person? Any news from Valeriana? Apparently they discovered that much of the hill the Tonina Acropolis is on was actually manmade, putting it in the running for largest manmade structures
Does the same guy make all of these threads?
>>18627932I've been reading about the Mixtecs and Zapotecs lately, and their politics because that seems to be the aspect of theirs that we have the most information on for whatever reason, and it just makes me think it's a shame that shit like Apocalypto made the average person assume that mesoamerican societies took the shape of a handful of isolated city-state islands floating in a sea of innocent primitive tribesmen or something to that effect when in reality it was one relatively big, solid block of interconnected urban civilization.
>>18627932>Favorite culture?Mayans, they were the peak of mesoamerican culture for me>Favorite city?Palenque has the best architecture>Favorite person?They recently found the name of a Mayan astronomer, and I like scientists more than politicians and military men:>Archaeologists exploring the Maya ruins of Xultun in Guatemala have, for the first time, deciphered the name of an ancient Maya astronomer-mathematician: Sak Tahn Waax, or “White-chested Fox.”>The researchers found the name along with equations about the planetary movements of Venus and Mars that appear to be attributed to him, making it the first and only known example of a Maya astronomer-mathematician credited for their work.
Most if not all mesoanons are brown indios or mestizos from latin america.How do i know?I was one.I used to be a mesoanon.I became one after i realized that if i propagated the idea that indios werent that bad and primitive, then i wouldnt be considered inferior to whites ( bc of my 50% indio ancestry).Then i discovered indios hate on mestizos on twitter and stop being pro indio.
>>18628266>Then i discovered indios hate on mestizos on twitter and stop being pro indio.Good, fuck spicst. mestizo
>>18628266I have to say though, that there is people that are interested in mesoamerican/amerindian history not because (or atleast not only) they have amerindian ancestry and they want to prove themselves to others, but for the knowledge per se, as aristotle said.
>>18627932Question for Mezoamericanfags: What did the big cities look like in their prime? Aztec and Maya ruins mostly consist of the huge temples and pyramids that still exist. But I'm assuming the ordinary people didn't live in the pyramids and temples. What were the rest of the cities look like? What did the ordinary houses, shops, streets, etc look like. Also why are they gone? Were they made of wood so they rotted away while only the large stone structures remain?
>>18628266False, I'm interested in them and I don't have a drop of Latin American blood. Firstly, it's interesting to learn about these advanced cultures which are completely alien to our own. In the cases of Ancient Greece, Rome, China, etc their knowledge, teachings and philosophy has been passed down, through the generations. Italy, Greece and China still exist. But the great Pre Columbian American civilizations, despite being advanced peoples who built great cities and empires, were completely destroyed. I'm interested in what they were like. Also the aesthetic is just pure fucking kino. The image of gigantic pyramids and cities rising out of the dense jungle is fucking awesome. Aztec warriors wearing the skin of Jaguars and wielding gigantic obsidian chainsaws that could behead a horse are fucking awesome.
>>18628357It varied of course, but generally you'd have at least one big ceremonial center where the pyramids and ballcourts and sometimes elite residences were and then outside that you'd have the houses where people lived. Sometimes the cities were dense agglomerations, sometimes they were more spread out. Some were visibly very planned and organized along rigid grids, others were more organic in organization. Some had walls, most apparently didn't. They would, as is often the case with pre-modern places, be brightly painted and decorated.And yeah, most houses were made of perishable material and didn't survive the test of time, in most cases only nobility would live in higher quality stone houses, with one big exception on Teotihuacan, where most of the population lived in stone apartment complexes. As far as i know they didn't really have shops at all, as marketplaces were just out in the open in public plazas. That being said, there are plenty of surviving stone structures that aren't pyramids, they just get overshadowed.
>>18628266>blah blah I hate myselfNobody cares hispanchito.
>>18628266I am not mentally ill like you, I can be interested in a culture without being directly connected to it. I have absolutely zero Mexican ancestry.>>18628357You have to remember that Mesoamerican archeology is STUPIDLY underfunded and understaffed. it's usually just the central plaza and the biggest buildings that get excavated and the rest is still buried under dirt and jungle, hidden in plain sight. Most sites are only 5-10% excavated. Generally there's a LOT of small stone houses around, and on the outskirts more degradable wattle and daub houses. Most reconstructions forget about all of the housing and just show the big buildings that got excavated.
>>18628382Since you mentioned Teotihuacan I'll post this amazing reconstruction. The sheer scale is insane.
>>18628412You really only get how big it is once you've been there and tried to walk from the Sun pyramid to the Serpent's pyramid on a tight schedule.
>>18628412I prefer this one
>>18628382>>18628393Interesting. I was aware of the fact that there are many ruins that are partially buried or hidden beneath the jungle canopy. For example the picture I posted is of Caana, the main pyramid in the Mayan city of Caracol, Belize. Caracol itself is a massive complex of ruins that covers 25,000 acres, but all anyone focuses on is the central plaza where the impressive structures are.>You have to remember that Mesoamerican archeology is STUPIDLY underfunded and understaffed.It's crazy. In recent years, scientists have used advanced mapping to discover the remains of hidden cities under the Amazon that belonged to civilizations that are completely unknown to historians. However as far as I know there hasn't been much follow up investigation to them and they're still largely a mystery.
>>18628393>>18628412>>18628457
>>18628473(Forgot text)It's absolutely breathtaking to imagine what the great cities of pre Columbian American looked like in their prime. Take Tenochtitlan for example, basically an Aztec version of Venice with a population of between 200,000-400,000, built on a lake.
>>18627932Mesoamerica is too small of a label, what about the Incas and other based and kino pre Columbian American civilizations that aren't classified as part of Mesoamerica?
I like El Tajin because it's got cool pyramids and they were particularly big fans of the ballgameI guess the reason people don't talk about it much in spite of its size is because the guys that built it are just called "Classic Veracruz Culture". Doesn't roll off the tongue like Mixtec or Olmec or Teotihuacan do
>>18628471Somehow the general public is still under the impression that native americans were all just mudhut dwelling hunter gatherers so archeology is considered an extremely low priority
>>18628477Dont forget it was all master planned, had neighborhood level politicians normal people could talk to, a small army of government funded sanitation workers, and an efficient police force, so it was incredibly clean and safe>>18628481OP here, sure talk about them if you like. Non Inca Andeans are super underrated.
>>18628037Yes he is a mexican obsessed with this board for some reason.>>18627932>>18628069You are mexican>>18628266mestizos ARE THE BAD GUYS. The sons of Spain ruined Latin America ever since our independences, those who have at least a bit of white blood have always been feudal lords here abusing the rest of the populace, raping, paying off militias to randomly genocide towns so they could grab more land and be richer and mror powerful. Mestizos ARE scum, they are the problem. And worse of all mestizos hold no loyalty to their nation, they unironically think they are semi european or semi white north american. Mestizos call themselves white. They are scum.t. Racially conscious and not traitorous mestizo, my place is with the natives, not with traitor scum with delirium of whiteness
>>18629222Kill yourself. Normal people should be allowed to discuss history in peace without dealing with Mexican self hating schizophrenic bullshit. I don't give a fuck about modern mexicans or your politics or your racial insecurity this is a HISTORY board.
>>18629236>Posting his pale hand from lack of sunlight thinking that makes him white Way to prove my point resident autistMe and all my nerd Mexican friends are pale as fuck from lack of sunlight. You are not white. white is having blue eyes (which you don't)
Mitla o algo
>>18629257The Nahuatl Feathered Snake they have in the Vatican Museum of anthropology, I think its epic o algo.
>>18629266More Mitla o Algo.
>>18629270Reminds me of the monster mouth temple o algo. Since most of these kinds of decals were done using stucco that erodes overtime, it makes you wonder how many buildings had facades like this that were destroyed so we never knew about them.
>>18628363Akshually, Aztec Warriors did not actually wear jaguar skin at all, they wore suits made of cotton and decorated with iridescent feathers patterned to look like jaguar skin + wooden helmets shaped and painted like jaguar heads
>>18629222This does not at all match the idea of mestisaje, which says that Mestizos are the heirs of both the Spanish and the Mexica.
Calakmul is cool
>>18629236It’s good to know there are others who simply want to learn history for history’s sake, free from any political, racial, or economic contamination As for me, fuck mexicans and their stupid complexes
>>18629929Wish we knew more about why Calakmul and Tikal hated each other so much.
>>18630497Yeah too bad some assholes burned all the writings in the name of some magic sky man
>>18630497My headcannon is it started out as a Hatfield and Mccoys type petty feud that kept escalating.
>>18630524>When Pakalamalka'ixnibcha'kalma borrows your obsidian and never gives it back, then says he never took it in the first place, so you have to give him a taste of the atlatl
>>18629270I forgot what this was o algo
>>18630594I think this one is Mayan, o algo.
>>18630597You won't guess where this one's from o algo.
>>18630497>>18630524my guess is it was about Teotihuacan ancestry, some Mayans were proud of it some despised it
>>18631587Has it been proven that the Teotihuacan culture had ancestors of the Mayans? As far as I know we don't have any written records from there, but the Mayans were literate during the time period it was inhabited. I might be wrong though
>>18630497I think it was simply because of both being competing regional powers>>18631609There is a lot of evidence that Teotihuacan meddled in Maya politics, most notably in Tikal and Copan, where they seemingly overthrew local dynasties and replaced them with friendlier rulers or supported local factions in their bid for power.
>>18631675Can you show me a source on that? I'd be interested in reading it
>>18630444>free from any political, racial, or economic contaminationWhat the fuck are you even learning if you don't care about politics?
