>Italy lasts three years receiving the brunt of the combined British and American assault against EuropeNow let's compare it to weaker allied powers>Czechoslovakia folds in one day>Poland lasts five weeks>Denmark folds in one day>Norway lasts two months>Netherlands folds in four days>Belgium lasts eighteen days>France lasts six weeksThere's nothing to suggest Italy's performance was uniquely bad compared to other Western European nations besides Germany
>>18733012>Italy lasts three years receiving the brunt of the combined British and American assault against EuropeIt didnt last they literally surrendered li 5 days after the allies landed on the mainland.
>>18733012It's not>spend years upgrading infrastructure in Albania and Libya(insufficient)>declare war before your military and country is actually ready>completely lose the Horn of Africa to the UK>get pushed back in North Africa by the UK and Hitler has to send help>completely fumble against Greece and Hitler has to send help yet again>get humiliated in the Mediterranean by the Royal Navy despite having a good navyI heard there is debating that Hitler is at fault because he pushed Italy into the war 3 years before their military was ready, because it's not like their soldiers were cowards or bad at all
>>18733043> before their military was ready
>>18733012Italians fought heroically in defense of Europe but sadly were outgunned by Anglo-American orcs
>>18733049Mussolini basically believed they're about to see negotiated peace between Britain and Germany and him joining the war would both make it guaranteed and also get him to grab some goodies on the peace table. Mussolini was the great compromiser and the great opportunist after all.In reality Italy needed to stockpile more fuels, was in the middle of rifle/machinegun ammunition switch, was just getting ready to build tanks they wanted to build rather than stop-gaps etc.
>>18733012They lost to fucking GREECE.
>>18733012The hypocracy of your argument is that all of those were smaller states that were overwhelmed by the full force of the German military.The only exception being France, but then again most people shit on France as well for their ww2 performance because on paper France was more powerful than Germany.With Italy it's a bit different. Italy was the major power in every conflict that it lost. It attacked Greece which (on paper) was considerably weaker than Italy.And in Egypt, a small British garrison routed the entire Italian army during Operation Compass. Even the British couldnt believe what was happening since Operation Compass was originally merely a skirmish operation.Italian government and people were reluctant to join the war but ultimately Mussolini had the final word, but after the loss in Libya and Greece even Mussolini wanted to throw in the towel but couldnt. From then on Italy became a German satelite and the Italian army was essentually merged into the Wehrmacht under German officer command.
>>18733012Italy actually lasted five years, since the Americans kept firebombing Italian cities and slaughtering civilians, resulting in resistance against the Anglophone occupiers
>>18733057>because on paper France was more powerful than Germany1939 there's 40 million French and 75 million Germans.Where do they write these papers
>>18733055Fun fact: Mussolini also delcared war before Italy could recall its merchant fleet, so nearly 90% of the countrys entire merchant fleet was lost the day Italy declared war since they couldnt re-enter the Mediteranian (UK controlled the only two entry-points Gibraltar and Suez). It was a major reason why supplying the divisions in North Africa was so tedious.
>>18733056Italy with assistance from our ally Germany defeated Greece.
>>18733062>why supplying the divisions in North Africa was so tedious.That's not why the major reason was british air and naval raids on convoys and the fact they had to be transported hundreds of km onland to the frontlines because the boats couldnt dock at the ports close the frontline as it was too dangerous.
>>18733062Yes, also there were some basic things "serious" entry into the war would involve. For one - Malta. If the war was more than opportunism then some form of invasion force would've went to the sea 2 hours prior to the declaration while the British would've complained for 2 months prior about Italian recon planes violating its airspace.Mussolini gambled and unlike his other gambles this one didn't work out.
>>18733060French military was considerably more powerful than the Wehrmacht in 1939-1940.They had far stronger armament and tanks and greater number of them. They had more fuel, more ammunition, more resources for production (in fact French aircraft production was on the verge of outproducing Germany already in 1940). They had stronger fortifications.Also, in regardless to population, the French had tens of millions more than Germany since they could mobilize their entire empire (and they were in the process of doing so). They also had a powerful surface fleet while the German surface fleet consisted of roughly only 3 battleships and a handful of cruisers.Not to mention, their ally was the second most powerful force on the planet, while Germany virtually had no ally in 1939- mid1940.So yes, by all accounts, Germany was fucked on paper. It was the reason for the "phoney war", France merely needed time.to mobilize its entire empire as well as its military production. This was the reason Germany HAD to strike first with Case Yellow, and as soon as possible because the longer Germany waits, the more they lose their early advantage from the rapid rearmament program and plunder from Czechia.
>>18733065The REAL reason why Cunninghams relatively small RN taskforce could contest the Mediteranian was because Italy had no fuel to power its navy. The Italian navy was the 4th largest surface navy of the world and would have overwhelmed Cunningham if it had been used to its full extent.Instead it was paralyzed and confined to port for most of the war, which also enabled Cunningham to cripple it further with the attack on Taranto since it was virtually sitting ducks.And the reason why Italy never had the fuel to power its navy was because Germany had strongarmed Romania to contract all its oil exports to Germany and leave Italy with nothing but scraps.
>>18733067So let's go through all of this one by one.Starting from tank fleet:French tanks prior to the start of WW2 can be divided into 3 groups. Limited mission range "accompaniment tanks" like R35. They were developed to be 1:1 replacement of Renault FT's, most even had their main guns directly lifted from said FT's as those were being decomissioned. They could have some usefulness in French doctrine but were pushed outside of what they could've done.Second group were stopgaps. ACM35 and D2 are good examples of that. Essentially they weren't tanks the French wanted ultimately but they didn't want to throw them away.Then you have compromised designs thay were scheduled to be both upgraded and replaced in the longer run. Those were S35 and B1bis, the upgrades were respectively S40 abd B1ter. Their replacements was most likely G1(in development). So they I think had more tanks on papers, but most of them were far from what they wanted them to be. Germans had a lot of outdated stuff too, but never as deficient as the accompaniment tanks.Second is airforce, the French have outproduced German fighter production in the first 6 months of 1940, but that's only a result of massive restructuring effort in 1938(which was part restructuring and part union busting exercise), meaning that the Germans had about 4-5 years on actually amassing modern fighter planes(until 1939 the French had to build MS40X which was both worse, slower to build and more expensive than BF-109. This is the entire reason why the French were in delay as much as possible mode, they knew they will eventually win the sky, but they also knew it would take time.As far as colonial population goes getting them actually into uniform isn't as easy as you'd think, because the administrative structure to do so didn't exist. That's why the French had to plan for the fact they had to mobilise 50 years olds and directed them to staff the Maginot to even barely match the number of troops Germany mobilised.
>>18733063lolhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W12BO9zJboY
>>18733082The parts the French were well prepared for was in artillery and logistics and the German experience at Gembloux proves this was about enough to stop the initial attack. That everything that could've gone the German way did go the German way is another thing(just for starters, the French captured German war plans and Gamelin correctly predicted the German staff will want to stick to them, there was even multiple-month long tug of war between them and Hitler who wanted it changed, had they not known there would be 3 French motorised infantry divisions at Sedan on the 2nd day of the battle).
>>18733012Not propaganda as much as it was a general impression seasoned with propaganda; they fought well controlling for their rather abysmal logistical position, but you can't expect the war analysts at the pub to consider that; the bumbling Italian is also partially post-war propaganda from the Italians themselves: Italy wanted to exonerate itself of the whole thing as quickly as possible, so they leaned into the already extant conception to pin all the blame on Germany. And I'm sure Bulgaria, Romania, and Hungary would have done the same had they avoided communism.>>Italy lasts three years receiving the brunt of the combined British and American assault against EuropeThe kingdom of Italy folded immediately and replaced by a puppet state though.>>18733056Their offensive was actually going well before they ran out of supplies.
>>18733093I can just imagine Antonescu writing a white-washed hyper-sanitized memoir about how he didn't know about any Holocaust, and protected all the true Romanian Jews.
>>18733012>>Italy lasts three years receiving the brunt of the combined British and American assault against EuropeSo? The Italian, Balkan and African fronts were still a massive net loss for Germany as they needed their men and equipment far more than the Allies needed theirs.
>>18733107tunisia=stalingrad
>>18733049Silly Duce!
>>18733107The Italian front was not a loss for Germany- In fact it was arguably Germanys most successful frontline 1943-1945 since a much smaller German force tied down a far larger American force and inflicted far heavier men/material losses.The Italian front is usually regarded as the allies 'worst' frontline during ww2 since it ultimately had questionable strategic value despite being very costly.
>>18733347The men Germany sent to Italy would have been far more useful in Normandy, the men the US sent to Italy would have been idle until a large enough bridgehead had been secured.
>>18733358>the men the US sent to Italy would have been idle until a large enough bridgehead had been secured.What the fuck are you even talking about you autistic freak?They would have walked right through Italy, and a fully intact Italy would have been able to effectively join the allies.>The men Germany sent to Italy would have been far more useful in Normandy,No they wouldnt lolIn the narrow mountainous Italian peninsula the German divisions were able to tie down an American force that was far larger than them with far stronger equiptment.Meaning if you remove this army and sends it to Normandy, not only will the Americans capture the most defensive geographical area around Mid-southern Italy without a fight, they will also be able to commit more to Normandy.The Italian front never saw anything remotely similar to the Falaise Pocket like what happened in Normandy. It was definetly the 'better' front for Germany 1943 and onwards.
>>18733093>Italy wanted to exonerate itself of the whole thing as quickly as possible, so they leaned into the already extant conception to pin all the blame on Germany. While this is true, it was very easy for them to look like the lesser of two evils next to the Nazis. The Italian equivalent to "Clean Wehrmacht" gets its phrase from an Italo-Soviet co-production in which their soldiers are portrayed favorably to the Germans.
>>18733364>They would have walked right through ItalyIf Italy wasn't in the war they wouldn't have gone through Italy, retard.>In the narrow mountainous Italian peninsula the German divisions were able to tie down an American force that was far larger than them with far stronger equiptment.But if they had been sent to France Overlord would have faced more men, more planes, more tanks, more bunkers, more everything, which easily could have led to an Allied defeat.
>>18733093>they were doing well before they made an absolutely basic error a random housewife could have told them to avoid
>>18733012Imagine being a dumb nigger.
