Why did fascists idolize Greece and Rome when they were massive degenerates who enjoyed nutting inside puer delicati (femboys)?
>>18766413Same reason why e-Christians claim Plato was a monotheist despite him being a proto-Gnostic whose philosophy was far too entrenched in paganism to be truly reconciled with Christianity
Regular reminder there is no evidence that the Warren cup is Roman. It just appears in the 19th century with zero provenance.
>>18766413Mussolini never criminalized homosexuality though he did extra-judicially imprison gays.
>>18766470I feel like Mussolini personally wouldn't have a prejudice against gays it was probably just low IQ reactionaries that he had to put up with who wanted that. Even Hitler wasn't homophobic until Himmler and Heydrich framed Roehm
>>18766413This board is really gay so I don't think they care
>>18766413>Fascists hated fagsKek
>>18766413>enjoyed nutting inside puer delicati (femboys)?Was that common? I thought anal was rare and they mostly just fucked the gap in their soft thighs
>>18766413All the nations that worship the false gods, who are demons, are overcome with degenerate desires and impulses because those nasty and dirty spirits go inside them and take over their minds and hearts.
>>18766592This is literally what the dancing boy Islamists say about prophet Muhammad raping 6 years old Aicha. The Indian-Euro/Semitic Abrahamic Aryan fags rewrite their pedofaggotry into Divine Love while they call other people degenerate savages.
>>18766592some are translated as "thighs" others as penetration, before soap I would assume the former was more desirable but it seems both were options>. . . While one loves boys among the lovely flowers of youth,>Desiring their thighs and sweet mouths.— Solon, fragment 25 West>[537a] By Delphinius Apollo, here Crimon penetrated the son of Bathycles, brother of . . .>[538b] Here Crimon penetrated Amotion.— Graffiti from Thera = Inscriptiones Graecae>[8] (early fifth century) Hegestratus had intercourse with me.>[23] (second quarter of fifth century) Sydromachus of the gaping anus submitted.— Inscriptions on Athenian Vases = Athenian Agora>If a beautiful boy doesn’t give his ass to be fucked, may he not get a fuck when he falls in love with a beautiful girl.— Greek graffito from Stabiae>Herakleitos was fair, when there was a Herakleitos, but now that his prime is past, a screen of hide[2] declares war on those who are behind-mounters. But, son of Polyxenos, seeing this, be not insolently haughty. Even on the buttocks too there is a Nemesis growing.— Meleagros 33, Greek Anthology>The Hours and Graces shed sweet oil on you, buttocks, and you do not let even old men sleep. Tell me, whose are you, blessed one, and which of the boys do you adorn? The buttocks answered: “Menekrates’.— Rhianos 38, Greek Anthology>Once a trainer, opportunely instructing a smooth lad,>Getting him to his knees, worked over his middle,>Touching the boy’s nuts with his hand. But by chance>The master came, seeking the boy.>Quickly the trainer, bracing him with his feet, turned the boy>On his back and with his hand grasped the boy’s throat.>However, the master, not unskilled in wrestling, said to him:>“Stop. You are,” said he, “gagging the kid.”— Strato, AP
>>18766491Didn't he have Röhm killed? Maybe they were ambivalent at first them turned on the gays later.
>>18766672Rohm was killed because he didn't want to cuck out to the elites
>>18766672Hitler reportedly didn't have a problem with Rohm's sexuality
>>18766688Clearly he did as he would later go through the trouble of putting homosexuals in camps. He was probably biding his time, every so often someone turns out to be a homosexual and it wasn't worth kicking up dust over it in the critical years during his rise to power.
>>18766761You underestimate the amount of leeway Hitler gave his subordinates to do random shit. Himmler was the main architect of the Homocaust. Himmler was absolutely obsessed by the question of homosexuality from before he even joined the Nazi Party (his juvenile diary entries show this). I doubt Hitler even came up with the idea of the Jewish Final Solution either. Hitler was probably ambivalent to the fates of homosexuals and soured on them after the Night of the Long Knives, but I seriously doubt he ever had plans to eliminate them from the beginning. Notably other Nazis like Bormann and Goering were more tolerant of homos too
>>18766669I love these. Roman Graffiti and Bronze Age correspondences are my favorite primary sources.
>>18766771Why didn't Hitler notice Himmler had gone full autism?
>>18766937He was acting like a normal German.
>>18766413Cause they're gay
>>18767451Why were so many gay? Aren't only 5% of the population gay? Why wasn't homosexuality suppressed as it was after Christianity took root? Does paganism have homosexual tendencies?
>>18766428>plato >proto-gnosticYeah and Julius Caesar was proto National-Socialist by your logic
>>18768234Christianity only suppresses certain homosexual acts. Sodomy refers to someone of lower social status taking a dominant role in a same-sex relationship specifically, because sexual roles were partially tied to social status in the ancient world (women were always at the bottom of the social food chain, that's why the Bible never explicitly forbids lesbian sex, just women having sex with animal). It wasn't until later on that the term "sodomy" became a blanket term for same sex relationships in general
>>18768238Just read Plato, he literally goes on and on about how the material world is an imperfect and inferior copy of the spiritual one and that the god who created this world (the demiurge) is not the first cause of everything or even omnipotent
>>18766669>Sydromachus of the gaping anus
>>18766937Hitler clearly wanted an autism-in-chief, and Himmler was the man for the job.
>>18768239>Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor malakoi (GAY BOTTOMS), nor arsenokoitai (GAY TOPS)Paul literally says fags are going to Hell and you're twisting the Word to what you want it to say.
>>18766669I understand this is about thighs vs anal, but when people use such things as evidence that gay sex was everywhere and unremarkable in ancient Greece--don't people usually write vulgar confessions on graffiti, not what's normal? These just read like ancient smut.
>>18768234It's more that the scriptures of a certain bunch of provincial homosexuality hating weirdos got coopted in to a universalist religion.
>>18768333malakoi = femininearsenokoitai = masculineYou are the one misinterpreting Paul. He's saying that no sinner is spared Hell regardless of your background, he's not saying that these are in and of themselves sinful
>>18766428In dialogues like The Republic (Book II), Plato posits a singular, ultimate source of goodness and truth—the Form of the Good—and speaks of "the god" in the singular. He argues that God is strictly good, unchanging, and incapable of evil.The Form of the Good is an impersonal, transcendent absolute—the ultimate "Form" from which all other ideals (like truth, beauty, and justice) derive their meaning and reality. It acts like the sun in the Republic, which illuminates the visible world so we can see it. Plato treats it as divine in status, calling it the supreme principleLater Christian thinkers merged Platonic and biblical ideas. They identified Plato's Form of the Good with God—specifically the idea that God is the Supreme Good, where goodness is not an abstract rule above God, but flows directly from God's own essential nature.Ultimately, Augustine argued that Platonism was the closest any human philosophy came to Christian truth through natural reason alone—yet it remained inherently fractured by its pagan, polytheistic compromises and lack of Christ's direct revelation.In other dialogues like Timaeus, Plato introduces the Demiurge (a craftsman deity who shapes the material universe based on the Forms) alongside cosmic, celestial gods and intermediary entities (daimons).Plato's sharp division between the perfect, eternal Realm of Forms and the flawed, shifting material world laid the direct groundwork for Gnosticism.Gnostics took this Platonic duality to an extreme, equating the material world with literal evil or ignorance and viewing the Demiurge as a flawed or malicious lesser god. This structural alignment is so deep that a fragment of Plato’s Republic was famously found buried in the ancient Gnostic text cache at Nag Hammadi.
>>18766669>>If a beautiful boy doesn’t give his ass to be fucked, may he not get a fuck when he falls in love with a beautiful girl.lol
>>18768348Plato and Xenophon’s dialogues show a heavily homosexual milieu
>>18768348>These just read like ancient smut.That's part of it. Ancient graffiti was an outlet for Dominance (bragging about sexual exploits) and to humiliate rivals (I fucked Antonius' butthole in front of his family)The Thighs vs. Anal Same-sex desire was certainly a recognized, structured part of ancient Greek elite culture, but upper-class same-sex courtship (the pederastic relationship between an older citizen and a younger youth) was bound by strict, highly conservative social rules. It was supposed to be an educational, honorable relationship based on restraint, mentorship, and mutual respect.The Norm: Literary sources, legal speeches, and high-end vase paintings emphasize that intercrural (between the thighs) sex was the socially approved, noble standard. It preserved the physical integrity and future citizen status of the youth because he was not being "penetrated" or treated like a woman or a slave.If a citizen crossed the line from the socially sanctioned, restrained courtship into what the culture deemed excessive, passive, or purely hedonistic, he faced severe political disenfranchisement
>>18766937I mean he could have seen it coming seeing he had no chin
>>18768520No? Xenephon maybe, but definitely nothing in Plato.
I have a theory that sylphium consumption was the cause, altering hormonal conditions in the womb causing homosexuality
>>18768454Yeah he's saying any sinners including fags, both effeminate bottoms and sodomites alike, are not making it to Heaven, because these are examples of sexual sin. Is he not saying fornication, idolatry, and adultery are sins either? He didn't say "any sinner, man, woman, and femboy alike." He listed other obvious sexual sins, then listed what was basically a gay bottom femboy in ancient Greece, then listed sodomites of such boys. Once more, you're completely ignoring obvious context clues because you don't want it to say what it says.https://biblehub.com/greek/3120.htmhttps://biblehub.com/greek/733.htm
>>18766413Everyone enjoys femboys. Only people who haven't tried it don't enjoy it. No homo.
>>18768454>>18769076This is the following verse btw, which is a continuation of the same sentence as the original manuscripts didn't have verse separations:>nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.So Paul listed all of these sins in the context of those not entering God's kingdom, and in the middle of them he decided to randomly list these words that merely mean "feminine and masculine" according to you?
>>18768599
whenever I'm having a bad day, I remember that most anti-polychromy brainlets are that way due to one German poof's fetish without even realizing it
>>18766761Transsexual certificates were still issued in Nazi Germany. The German homosexuality law wasn't any more punitive than the British one. Modern /pol/tards just like to project their boogeyman of the week back onto Hitler.
We have had so many threads about this. It's what happens when your ideology is centered on worshiping masculine virtues. It inevitably attracts homosexuals, who can be open about their adoration of masculinity without people calling him a faggot. And yes, fascists basically worship men, and at best view women as unfortunate domestics they have to provide for. Mussolini was nonplussed by women, he had no real place for them in his vision of society. He didn't overtly oppress them but he deliberately excluded them from fascist politics and the new social order. Women in fascist Italy had to find some way to cling to relevance in a society that treated them like baggage.Hitler and the Nazis, at least, had a place for women in the Reich, it was just utterly menial, confined to the role of a domestic servant. You read the undercurrent of Nazi philosophy and it's clear they saw women as inferiors, as weak, and wanted to minimize their influence on society. Hence: women were banned from politics, like Italy, and also from higher education (which not even Mussolini did), and were not even really trusted to raise their children which is why they had so many youth programs and an emphasis on public education.
>>18768538The heavy scent of olive oil hung low in the palaestra of classical Athens. Beneath the shaded colonnade, Adolf Hitler, a pale, narrow-shouldered youth with dark hair brushed severely to one side, stood stiffly against a stone pillar. While the other youths wrestled in the sand, laughing as their skin caught the Mediterranean sun, Adolf remained solitary, his intense blue eyes fixed on the dust, his jaw clenched.He was an eromenos—the beloved youth—courted by an older, prominent citizen of the polis, a decorated hoplite named Cleon.By the immutable laws of Athenian elite culture, their bond was meant to be an initiation into the highest echelons of civic virtue. Cleon was his erastes, a mentor responsible for molding the boy into a future leader of the state. Yet, where other boys accepted the courtship with graceful modesty, Adolf approached it with an obsessive, dogmatic gravity. He did not care for poetry or the lyre; he was transfixed by the absolute order of the phalanx and the merciless structure of Lycurgus's ancient laws.Cleon stepped out from the shadow of the portico, his chlamys draped elegantly over a scarred shoulder.
>>18769478He carried a gift—a sleek, well-bred hunting hound—and offered it to the boy with a warm smile.Adolf did not smile back. He looked at the hound, then up at his mentor, his voice sharp and high-pitched. "A gift of the chase," Adolf murmured, his eyes flashing. "But a state is not preserved by hunting rabbits, Cleon. It is preserved by the unyielding purity of its bloodline and the absolute submission of the individual to the collective body of the city."Cleon blinked, unaccustomed to such fanatical rhetoric from a youth whose beard had not yet grown. "Quiet, young one," Cleon said gently, placing a hand on his shoulder. "Virtue is found in sophrosyne—restraint and balance. Do not let your mind run wild with the extremes of the Spartans.""The Spartans understand strength!" Adolf snapped, stepping back so the hand fell away. "They do not allow the weak to dilute the state. Athens is too soft. It listens to the rabble in the Assembly."That evening, the strict boundaries of their structured relationship were brought to the ultimate test of Athenian tradition. In the private quarters of Cleon’s estate, away from the prying eyes of the public, the ritual of intimacy was to be observed.
>>18769479On the red-figure vases of the city’s finest potters, the scene was always depicted the same: the older man standing before the youth, offering guidance and affection, while the physical act remained strictly bounded by honor. The law of the elite was absolute: intercrural sex—between the thighs—was the only noble standard. It was a practice designed explicitly to preserve the physical integrity of the youth. To be penetrated was to be subjugated, reduced to the status of a slave or a woman, a stain that would forever ruin a boy’s future right to stand as a free citizen and vote in the Assembly.Cleon moved closer, the torchlight casting long shadows against the polished plaster walls.
>>18769480He reached out to embrace Adolf, expecting the customary, passive modesty of a beloved boy who yields only out of respect for his mentor's virtue.But Adolf stood rigid as a herm, his body locked in a state of absolute tension. His breath came in short, ragged bursts. When Cleon attempted to guide him toward the couch, Adolf fiercely resisted, his eyes burning with an almost hysterical fervor."It must be pure!" Adolf hissed, his voice echoing in the small room on the polished plaster walls.
>>18766413>Rome when they were massive degenerates who enjoyed nutting inside puer delicatiOver 1200 or 2200 years of romanity (depending on your opinion on byzantium) child diddling was considered less than absolutely abhorrent for less than 500, and better than tolerated but degenerate absolutely never. Even in the most hellenized periods of roman history chasing boys was used as political slander, just look at Tiberius and his little fishes.It's honestly ludicrous how people can see nowadays how ridiculously small minorities of degenerates have such an oversized weight on cultural discourse, but fail to realize that the same shit has applied all through history. Are we tolerant of pedophilia today because nobody got punished for going on epstein's island?
>>18769484something like this probably happened, germanic slaveboys were prized in rome and among them there would be some with adolf's chud temperament
>>18769091Depending on which dialogue and author this is from, Plato would go on to write extensively against "homosexuality" as it was practiced in Greece. To maybe give you an apt modern comparison that will explain the apparent commonality of this particular sexual practice in antiquity, you can find correspondence of a well respected Ivy League professor with an international sex trafficker and child rapist about how to make infants more pliable. He recommends playing audio of their mother's voice. If you look only at what is outside of the ability of the state to stop; i.e the behavior of pedophilic Jewish billionaires, our civilization has a homosexual milieu as well.
>>18769520Emperors like Hadrian were openly homosexual, though I believe Antinous was over 18 so it would be more controversial than illegal nowadays.
>>18769987The evidence for their relationship is sort of conjecture pieced together by the deification after his death, it's not without evidence, but it lacks definitive proof. I don't think many contemporary sources exist, and those that do avoid talking about the sitting emperor, much less who he was molesting at any given time. Antinous was a slave boy that was part of Hadrian's regular hunting parties and, if you put any stock in the rumors they had a relationship, then he was a slave boy who was raped until he committed suicide or was killed off by Hadrian. He is maybe a few steps above Sporus in terms of treatment, but to any sane person his fate is so horrific that it is almost unbelievable.
>>18766413>puer delicatiYou have to make the noun plural too latinlet retard, not just the adjective.
>>18766413The top is in complete command and control. What part of that simple logic do you not comprehend? You verminous liberal cunt. Tbh, me thinks behind all the slimy subversive bait/rhetoric, you're just craving big blackshirt cock.
>>18769987Right, a 'homosexual' that somehow managed to command the respect and loyalty of a 100,000 trained killers and one of the most illiberal socially conservative empires that's ever existed. I hardly think it's fair or realistic to place beardedkikekiller235AD into the same category as James Charles.
>>18770796>managed to command the respect and loyalty of a 100,000 trained killers and one of the most illiberal socially conservative empires that's ever existed.You're projecting your own values on the past.
>>18770796Hadrian ordered "one of the most illiberal socially conservative empires that's ever existed" to deify Antinous and produce dozens of sculptures of him so he could be worshipped in temples. Clearly homosexuality and the illiberality of the Greco-Roman world was not mutually exclusive.
>>18766491>fascists hated fags>posts two fags the Nazis shot in the fucking face for being degenerates
>>18771046NTA, but what you are describing sounds horrific. A slave boy getting molested until he kills himself isn't something to idealize. Surely I don't need to explain the implications of a case like this for the broader practice, so why is that broader practice something you appear to celebrate.
>>18771210You're thinking of Sporus
>>18768473No, Plato was not monotheist, nor did he actually reject paganism. He did believe in a transcendent first cause, but this was merely good itself and it doesn’t have a will, so to call it “God” would be a misnomer. Plato didn’t reject pagan gods either, he frequently affirmed the existence of the Greek gods and outlined in his Republic that impiety towards the gods should be punishable, meaning that any Christian who calls Zeus a false god or demon would certainly be imprisoned or executed in Plato’s ideal society. Plato’s actual cosmology consists of a hierarchy of gods and goddesses and this wasn’t even just limited to the Greek gods as Plato accepted the existence of foreign gods and was even willing to borrow many of his doctrines from the Egyptian and Zoroastrian religions (which he admits to several times btw).Yes, Plato did reject mythology and believe that poets should be banned from society. But this wasn’t because he rejected pagan gods, but rather because he thought the myths were slandering the gods and were therefore blasphemy, there’s a massive difference between “I don’t believe Zeus had affairs” and “I don’t believe in Zeus at all.” If anything this makes him more pagan than other pagans, especially since his critiques of mythology also equally apply to the Abrahamic religions. In fact, the vast majority of Plato’s doctrines are at odds with the Abrahamic religions (e.g. reincarnation and pre-existence of the soul) and the Gnostic ideas that early Christians spent so much time condemning have their roots in Platonic philosophy.
>>18768473>Ultimately, Augustine argued that Platonism was the closest any human philosophy came to Christian truth through natural reason alone—yet it remained inherently fractured by its pagan, polytheistic compromises and lack of Christ's direct revelation.Nah, Christianity is a falsehood, paganism is the truth
>>18771211Antinous' fate was the same, just a slight bit less cruel, if you accept that he even had a relationship with Hadrian. I mean I'm sure you can rationalize for quite a while, but at the end of the day why do you think a teenaged boy molested for years by an older man might kill themselves? It's not exactly hard to piece it together.
>>18771226It would have been difficult to commit suicide just by jumping in the Nile.
>>18766413Because fascists are gay
>>18766937He just didn't care
>>18769666Nta but I’m pretty sure that’s from polis. Also Socrates is quite explicitly a massive fag in symposium. That being said, in his times being a bottom bitch was actually enough to lose your citizenship in Athens, which is what he alludes to in Gorgias. So it’s not exactly a simple case of everyone just constantly fucking other men.
probably had something to do with slaves, there was a lot of buckbreaking going on in the south back during slavery
>>18773206obviously, white mens love for black cock isnt arbitrary
>>18773262is that timmy
>>18766669Damn, some Greeks were genuinely obsessed, maybe jews are right about the goyim. Maybe Christianity coming along wasn't too bad after all?
>>18771817The dude is telling you how it is and you are just coping trying to justify Hadrian's (and probably your own) degenerate impulses. Antinous killed himself, if Hadrian cared and wasn't a violent autist in private he wouldn't.
>>18773262zesty post
