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I think the key is to always have an idea of what you want your art to look like. Even as far back as Jojo part 3 the art looked great because he was trying to emulate Fist of the North Star. And then Araki got really into Italian fashion design or whatever and shifted his art style to be more in line with that sort of work.
I think most permabegs stay at an amateur level because they don't commit to drawing a certain way and instead they just "do their own thing" while refusing to change.

>>7982245
hi, simon. did you get enough sleep last night?

>they don't commit to drawing a certain way
>they just "do their own thing" while refusing to change.
if you do your own thing, then you are commited to drawing a certain way

>>7982236
no. what do you think "perma" means?

>>7982246
Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit, huh?

>>7982250
Writing isn't your strong suit, huh?

>>7982236
he got published with the art on the left so how os it bad?

permabegs are literally permanent beginners, moving past that means they were never permabegs

>>7982245
Reading Araki's book on "how to make manga" was quite eye-opening. Hamon Beat has a video or two covering Araki's early manga and it's shocking how rough his stuff looked compared to his later art.

Begs stagnate because they don't get into the habits of meaningful copying and targeted learning. If you're learning how to draw as an adult, you have the advantage of being able to efficiently plan and organize what exactly you want to draw, but you have to consciously shift into "learning like a child" which means constantly drawing for fun, copying art you like, and engaging with art. The reason why kids seem to have the advantage as beginner artists is because their brains are more spongy/absorbent, but it doesn't really mean much if study isn't rigorous and consistent and don as soon as possible: most digital artists in their teens/twenties tend to be people who had tutors or mentors from a VERY young age.

You can easily catch up to and surpass the younger generations with targeted practice and consistency followed up by drawing stuff for fun that incorporates what you've learned.

Everyone can make it. It just requires showing up, doing the work, and giving yourself time to draw for fun.

I think most begs on this board would see a lot of benefits if they spent a couple weeks just working on drawing simple cuboid/spherical forms from life and drawing shapes, and in-between that just drawing their favorite anime or cartoon characters.

>>7982246
Oh sorry, I meant like they don't commit to a specific artist as a "goal" or "role model". And by "commit" I mean fully try to emulate their target artist, many permabegs only bother to go half way.
When I write all this, I realize I'm thinking specifically of our local /ic/ permabeg Gabe. It's clear that he's influenced by Slayers and other 90s anime, but he doesn't genuinely commit to emulating that style. I think a lot of artists at his level tend to get stuck in this cycle of thinking "this is just how I draw things," and refuse to fundamentally change their art, like there is some mental block to let go of their current way of drawing.
It sounds simple, but it took me a long time to realize that if my art is going to improve, it also has to change... Also I'm not Simon

>>7982273
The refusal to copy is what prevents a lot of would-be writers too. I don't think enough people get it drilled into their heads that learning anything initially requires a lot of copying.

>>7982236
i dont know what twitter faggot made the original tweet but i do hope they die

>>7982246
>on a board about critique and advice
>someone posts advice
>PUT ON YOUR HELMET AND ATTACK THE POST WITH ALL YOUR HEART
why do people do this? Do you not understand what he said? If someone says "don't jump off the roof" you come up and smugly say "erm what about birds? They jump off in order to gain speed and start flying easier." as if you just dropped truth nuke on us.

>>7982236
Left is already pretty alright. Definitely way beyond "permabeg".
Permabegs are the truly hopeless failures whose drawings on day 1,000 still look like their drawings from day 1.

>>7982273
What if there isn't an artist that I want to fully emulate? Should I just pick the closest and copy literally everything? Eh I guess that's sorta what I'm doing now anyways. But I guess my question is will my own style eventually emerge from this?

>>7982236
>Person who was already good at drawing continued to be good at drawing
Very inspiring.

>>7982269
Is targeted learning something that can actually be done as a beginner? That might sound dumb, but drawing at the most basic level is generally presented as being so heavily based on intuition that I'm not sure how to consciously practice any aspect of it beyond stuff like line control exercises. Everything in instructional books generally seems to boil down to "just do this a lot with your intuition you better have been born with," "mindlessly grind this until some ineffable concept no one can explain randomly materializes for you," or "mindlessly grind this with no idea what you're supposed to take away from it because it will totally be useful for a process you will use in the far future, trust me bro."

If I understood how to draw, or had a functional process, then even if I was still hopelessly bad at it I would at least be able to see what I needed to do to improve and consciously work towards it. The resources I've found just aren't geared towards providing those things, though, which makes me wonder if they even can be provided.

>>7982601
What's your starting point? Are you having issues with cubes or faces or what?

I'm of the belief that if someone truly wants to get good, they'll eventually get there, sometimes life has to be lived until that happens and you just have to deal with the interim

>>7982236
That's just the difference of drawing with and without reference

>>7982601
Based on what I've gleamed from the Japanese side of Youtube, targeted learning has to be done in a sequential order starting from the very basics: grinding lots of lines, shapes, and finally forms from life BEFORE using photo references and then cracking down on values/rendering.

Here's what I would personally recommend for you:

>start doing continuous line drawing
>grind lines for a week, then grind shapes for another week: when you're comfortable with drawing the basics, move on to studying forms for about two weeks
>do blind contours of household objects
>if you have a pet or if you live with someone else, do gesture drawings of them
>spend lots of time observing your subjects

At a certain point, your brain will automatically "shift" into 3D-thinking and that intuition becomes second nature.

>>7982727
Pyw

>>7982236
>Is there hope for permabegs?
No. I am still less than the one on the left, and I guess that Araki reached that stage relatively fast.

>>7982727
>At a certain point, your brain will automatically "shift" into 3D-thinking and that intuition becomes second nature.
isn't this the default?

>>7982784
Nope. This is why DRSB talks about "symbol drawing". With the exception of dyslexic children, the average human being struggles to think in 3D. When you're first learning how to draw, you're really rewiring your brain to think in 3D.

The DRSB exercises are extremely beneficial for this reason, particularly when you move on to using photo references. I'd recommend you'd also break down references into shapes and forms, as it helps with 3D-thinking.

>>7982792
>>7982727
Once you've gotten over the early humps, then you engage in targeted learning towards specific subjects you want to improve at drawing. As an example, if you want to draw hands that don't look like shit then here's what you can do:

>do blind contours and gesture studies of your hand or another person's hand
>grab references: draw them upside down, meaningfully trace them, do negative space drawings, break them down into shapes and forms
>study the bones of a hand (use refs)
>give yourself a day to rest
>draw from memory, then do it again with references, then compare the results
>draw from memory again

Then you'd move on to the wrist, the forearm, and then the upper arm.

>>7982793
has this dude that keeps suggesting these exercises ever posted his work?

>>7982793
Terrible advice

>7982793
https://warosu.org/ic/?task=search&ghost=false&search_text=%22blind+contours%22
Stop spamming you nodraw permabeg

>>7982269
>Reading Araki's book on "how to make manga
is it translated?

>>7983636
Yeah, you can buy it. It's in English.

>>7983289
I don't own anything with a camera. Sorry, anon! All I can do is offer what helps.

>>7982247
you can still remove permanent marker if you use the right stuff