>>222375848its a truke nuke doe and Christ won seethe muzzie cuck
>>222376353Its false because its paganism not monotheistic
Yes, we do, and you don't understand. We're not claiming that there are three gods, but that the one God subsists in three coequal modes eternally. There is the Father, God qua God, the arche or first principle of everything. There is the Son, or Logos, the Father's eternal contemplation and knowledge of himself. And there is the Holy Spirit, that bond of love that exists within God, the eternal affirmation that exists between God qua God and God's contemplation of himself, the Good's eternal affirmation of the Good. It's tawhid that is absurd, not the Trinity, because the Islamic construction of divine simplicity necessarily results in the collapse of creation into the divine being, makes everything a necessary emanation from the One. That is, Islam is fundamentally pagan.
>>222377473As opposed to the quran being uncreated and co-eternal with god...
>the Son ONLY has One Avatar throughout human history Mormons actually have a point that the Americas alone Prove how retarded mainstream Christians are At least Muslims have that "I sent Hundreds of thousands of Prophets to every nation" line
>>222375848So true!!!
>>222377674There is nothing pagan about tawhid the thing is you guys claim to be monotheistic but trying to falsify monotheism at the same which is more absurd also 3 does not equal to one
>>222377867Christ is not an "avatar," the eternal Logos is permanently united without mixture to a particular expression of the human nature, and through that nature God is revealed to man in comprehensible form. Through Christ God reveals himself to man perfectly, and man is able to make perfect atonement with God. There is no need for any kind of additional Incarnation because the one sacrifice of Christ is sufficient for all people in all places and times and is offered eternally before the Father in Heaven. The sacrament of the Lord's Supper is a temporal participation in that one all-sufficient sacrifice.
>>222377735we still do not worship the quran though
Christ is King
>>222377934Tawhid is the height of paganism. It necessarily implies pantheism. We are not saying that there are 3 gods, we are saying that the one God subsists eternally in 3 manners. There is one divine mind, one divine will. It would be irrational for us to say that there are 3 Gods and also 1 God, but that isn't what has we are saying or what has been revealed. You literally just do not understand what we are saying. Do some reading before you go around accusing people of paganism.
>>222377473Go praise a rock you fucking clown
>>222377877Wtf does «throat cheesed» mean?
>>222377948The Logos wasn't Mary's son, it was Mathew btw By the way, the Holy Spirit is literally a ripoff of the Jewish Shekinah which is God's presence in the world
thomistic metaphysics is proof that only grace can elevate the human intellect to that level
>>222378023LMAO THIS BEANER WORSHIPS A FUCKING DOVE NIGGA
>>222378064Your first point is flatly wrong, and the Holy Spirit isn't a "ripoff" of the Shekinah, he IS the Shekinah. The Trinity is manifestly in the Old Testament, Jews just stubbornly refuse to see it.
>>222377992so god has 3 mechanism to work like a god sounds like paganism to me. And also your church fathers also accept it as a unsolvable mystery so you do not understand it either
>>222375848why is that so? it's makes very much sense when you look at it as a certain form of abstraction, let's say: water, ice and steam; All three have separate qualities and uses but at the end of the day they all are just water in different forms. I don't know if I can give simpler example
>>222378023sennnnooooooor we are trad caths sennnnoooor we are definetly not brown mutts sennnoooor
>>222378117He does not have "3 mechanisms to work," he subsists in three manners or modes. God IS the first principle. God IS his eternal knowledge of himself. God IS the eternal affirmation that exists between himself as known and himself as knower. There ARE things that are mysterious about the Trinity, but it is not how God can be three-in-one. The mystery is in much finer points of metaphysical disputation.
>>222378125I have realized that maybe I should have replaced the part>they all are just water in different formswith >they all are just hydrogen and oxygen particles in different configurationsthat sounds much clearer
>>222375848No
>>222377934when will the muslim iq reach the point where you niggas will be able to understand indiscernibility of identicals and how that only applies to numerical identity and not relations of opposition?
>>222378153Salamalekum this is the Turklown show now try to get this shitty ice cream made of Pajeet piss
>>222378093Go back to your shelter made of foreskins
>>222378098The Logos cannot exist without the Universal Mind or the Universal SoulThe idea that it could, is why Christian Theology is so worthless
>>222378326Thomas Aquinas wrote long time ago about natural law that every human with a reason is able to realize, your point is valid within the bounds of ignorance
>>222378125>>222378172Isnt that idea of god can change modes is a heretical belief according to christianity
>>222378505He doesn't "change modes," he subsists in three manners forever. A "hypostasis" is a mode or manner of subsistence. There are three "hypostases" in the Triune God. He isn't changing back and forth, he simply IS the origin of all things, the knowledge of all things, and the love of all things.
>>222378505I tried to highlight the ability of human mind to grasp the idea of something existing in 3 different states while being the one and the same, not some shapeshifting superpowers, you retarded kurd
>>222378213
>>222378064>>222378093>>222377867Okay israelbros but kabbalah does the same thing by splitting God into 10 aspects.
>>222378611nigga you type a lot of things but still achieve to be not fucking anything sense
>>222378504He had to add in Greek philosophy in order for it to work btw>>222378670How is that relevant to me?You could have brought up Al Hakim And even that would be different because we don't believe in God's avatars being separate from him
>>222378766What is Al Hakim? I don't know all the desert rune legends.
>>222378766>He had to add in Greek philosophy in order for it to work btwand how does that work against him, if the argument is about that God made world and human mind in a way that it naturally leads to God?
>>222378755Okay, fine you don't get it! Don't go around accusing people of being pagans for believing things you don't understand!
>>222378856The problem is not my misunderstanding your religion problem is your religion theologycally, interently flawed and you dont accept it to yourself and type lots of nonsense on top of it
A god you can fully comprehend with a human mind is not a god
>>222375848The Trinity or God? Most Christians put very little thought into their own religion or theology in general, they're just happy going to church and hearing the vicar say 'Be kind to one another because that's what Jesus taught us'. The average Christian would struggle to explain the paradoxical Trinity.
>>222379035You don't understand the theology, so you shouldn't be making theological judgments. It's very simple. You don't get Christianity, so stop talking about it. Easy!
>>222377674>but that the one God subsists in three coequal modes eternallyYou've already fucked up mate, Modalism is considered a heresy.
>>222379275You don't know what modalism is. I can say "manner of subsistence" if you'd prefer. The word "mode" itself is not heretical. In using that formulation I am following the example of Karl Barth. Modalism is the teaching that God changes masks or modes like a performer, that is one moment he is the Father, the next he is the Son, the next the Spirit. Obviously not what I am saying.
>>222379176you can still logically comprehend who you are worshipping to if you asked me the show me the power of god yes thats uncomprehendable but still you can got the idea of one god and he is not made in 3 in 1
>>222379392>you can got the idea of one god and he is not made in 3 in 1Just because you don't understand how it can be one God in three distinct persons doesn't mean it can't be so.
>>222379301I think theologians would still disagree with your definitions. The Trinity is a bit of a minefield to define, it doesn't take much to stray from the orthodox view when defining it.
>>222379176I think that's what makes Christianity appealing to many people, rather than some distant unknowable God there's a person they can strive to be like and look to for guidance.
>>222379491The phrase "mode of subsistence" is literally lifted directly from Karl Barth, a canonical modern protestant theologian of the orthodox school. Literally everything I have said in this thread has been liftend from the Bible, Augustine, Aquinas, Mascall and Barth.
>>222379591If you look up 'Karl Barth' and 'modalism' you will find that his views were controversial.https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/scottish-journal-of-theology/article/abs/reproach-of-modalism-a-difficulty-for-karl-barths-doctrine-of-the-trinity/0A63CDFA5850113D24A948FC29EE2B1D
>>222379591>>222379701I would like to add I'm not claiming you or Karl Barth are Modalists, more that it's very easy to cause issues when defining the trinity.
>>222379701>>222379749People take issue with Aquinas' views, people take issues with Augustine's views. The entire Christian east has a constant bone to pick with those two, and in the west they are the definition of canonical theologians. The point is that I am not teaching anything eccentric. I am teaching mainstream western Christian orthodoxy.
>>222379275The trinity should be the Heresy Not even Paul claimed it , he just believed that Jesus was God's son
>>222378794Our Lord Al Hakim was the latest avatar of God
>>222379936When will the next avatar of God manifest?
>>222380013Apparently in a few decades And he will be Chinese
>>222379439you still dont get the key point god shouldnt contradict himself and prove himself wrong like this.
>>222380031Zànměizhēnzhǔ...
>>222378028>Wtf does «throat cheesed» mean?When god shoves his uncut dick down your throat.
>>222377968>missed the point about identity and monotheism
>>222379836?Aside from the multiple "My Lord and My God" descriptions of Jesus, start with Philippians 2:5-8
>>222375848Sneed.
>>222380264You're the ones who struggle to explain how the islamic allah is either ignorant or incompetent when making his "timeless guidance for mankind"Q5:116Either the islamic allah is an incompetent fool, describing a supposed group that can at best be connected to the probably mythical kollyridians and that is in complete opposition to Christianity in the 7th century; or he was an ignorant fool completely misunderstanding the Trinity.I mean, even Q5:73 is insane. How can you prove the vast majority of Christians believed in that bizarro Trinity in the 7th Century? You're historically disproven in fact.Where is that mythical "Injil" book given to the islamic isa? Virtually unheard of. Mohammed probably saw an early gospel harmony and mistook that for the "Injil".Honestly, the whole thing is ridiculous.
