I juts realized how Conquistadors conquered America.They just bashed toddlers with swords.
>>65139782The Spanish aren't exactly known to be giants themselves though.
>>65139787They were taller, but averaged about 5' 5.5"What made them nigh unstoppable was steel armor and war dogs.Also native allies.
>>65139797Nobility was 5'7" on average>inb4yea they were kicked out from North America
>>65139782why is it that throughout North American history, everything is bigger and cooler
>>65139782plains indian mustardrace
>>65139797The weather was too hot for steel armor, they switched to cloth armor. It was steel swords that gave them the edge, they could stab someone at sonic speed before they even had time to wind up their macuahuitl.
>>65139782Spaniards have always been really short historically. Only now in the modern era have has Spain's mean avg. height gotten similar to the rest of Europe>t. spaniard
>>65139797>180lb mastiffs obliterating 5 foot pygmies like they were warwick d avisnow i get the hype around the dogs
>>65140367To add to this, the pygmies kept pygmy dogs (xolo was the largest) which were significant source of the meager protein they consumed. Seeing those mastiffs was like experiencing a mountain lion attack after only knowing the existence of low-rider ragamuffins.
>>65140072Buffalo meatAccess to red meat is a 1 to 1 correlation with height in humans. Not a single culture that has eaten beef or venison or some kind of ungulate has stayed short.
They were all toddlers? Where were their parents?
>>65140455died tragically in a sacrifice accident
>>65140459Many such cases
rapechink is unusually active today. maybe sister brought a new boyfriend?
>>65139782>Chink spammer is backhe has a seething hatred of the Turkish and Iranian bvlls that constantly mog him
>>65140513>>65140513>chinkspammer seething over Turkish bvlls and Muslims nogging him
>rapechink out of nowhere
>>65140548I am not German lmao or Europeanchinks have a lower tfr and below replacement and asian H.AN are often inches in the west and mogged by Indians who rule their stuff. Japan and Korean Mog China u are Latinx me think
>>65140547asiaNs especially Chine get mogged by IndIAN and aRab and they are obsessed with rape and interracial Sex more th.an ytChinese are bug mogged by Indonesian warriors
>>65140552Meanwhile in reality:
>>65140571>>65140571in.Dia still mogs Chinese and Vietnamese e mog. ch.ese
The dutch were also under spanish colonial rule for centuries
You guys wonder if rapechink is so schizophrenic he thinks anyone actually reads his shit instead of just laughing at how utterly mentally ill he is?
>>65140579we where under the Spanish for centuriesthe low countries where a Hapsburg possession before they even got the Spanish throneand they stayed as their own distinct, legal, self ruling entity until the start of the 80 years war when due to the rebellion a Spanish noble was put in charge, but he never ruled over more than half of the low countries and by the second half of the 80 years war the part of the low countries under Hapsburg rule had gone to the Austrian Hapsburgsalso the most know Hapsburg and Spanish emperors Charles V was born in the low countries.the only reason that the Hapsburg where even in the low countries was due to them marrying with the count of Flanders last remaining daughterthey where as much from here as from anywhere else in both blood and birth maar dat verstaan spleetogen natuurlijk niet, die kunnen niet verder denken dan hun flieterke lang is
unfiltered Muslim posting?you haven't even called me a mutt
>>65140608Spain still trashed you though
I'm glad English is the current lingua franca. One of the better threads this week.
>>65139797Also disease
>>65139782>the Chad Northern nativeHow can Mesoamericans even compete?
>>65140687I was just going to comment on the terrible state of this thread. Can we go back to talking about mastiffs and pygmies?
>>65139797>Also native allies.that's the really big one. one swordsman vs a million midgets isn't going to work out, unless you've already convinced 850k of those midges to switch sides. reminder the aztecs were turbo double minus brutal murderous dictators to everyone else in mesoamerica and it wasn't that hard to convince the others to murder rape them back.
>>65139782The average Spanish height at the time was 5'3"~5'4". Ironically the Mayans were those who held out the longest and have most of their culture intact still. At least in Mexico.
>>65140749I work with an indian who looks like this unironically. He once accidentally screencast his personal computer at work and we could see one of the tabs had junker queen futanari on it.
>>65140652He's mass reporting people for making fun of his dumpster sand people religion kek
>>65140833>junker queen futanaribased as fuck especially if it was nyl2
>>65140681jokes on you I'm Flemish and frankly the Spanish didn't go hard enough
>>65140552>>65140569>>65140572This is a schizoid Muslim Indian. He chimps out on /int/, /sp/ and other boards and accuses you of being a Spaniard, Chinese, British, Mexican etc
>>65139782I don't think Spain did shit in their conquest because they were taller - because if they were at all, it was by a tiny margin.
>>65140814It's also always fun to remind mexicans who try to claim aztec heritage that they're actually descended from the people who genocided the aztecs.
>>65144547>GenocidedAztec royal family literally became the Mexican nobility after Spain told them to cut out the human sacrifice shit and accept Jesus in return for having their claims recognized by the crown. Mexican culture is Spanish sensibilities tacked over Mesoamerican customs.
>>65144547Mexicans are still 52% Injun
>>65140681Where did your silver go, Pedro?
>>65140313Cortez and gang wore it into Tenochtitlan at the height of the Mexican conquista.also,>>disease took a major toll on both sides
>>65139782what were plains natives doing that made them such chads compared to everyone else? was it the nomadism?
>>65145085Meat based diet vs corn slop.
>>65139797>Also native allies.Basically this, the conquista was more of a revolution than an actual invasion. Everyone was just tired of the Aztecs' shit.
>>65139782My grandpa said the same in Korea and he was only 5'8. He said he thought they were fighting children because they were all so tiny
>>65145085Height correlates very strongly to meat availability and the plains Indians' primary food sources were buffalo and such.
>>65140833We have much to learn from these noble people
>>65140718Debunked.
to this day I and my people still fantasize and worship big european colonizers
>>65139782North America was populated by proto-turkics that crossed the Siberian land bridge. South America was populated by South Asians and Polynesians.
>>65140313Wouldnt steel armor both reflect sunlight and dissipate heat?
>>65145392>t. turkroach mutt retard
>>65145410Steel gets hot in the sun and would conduct heat directly to the wearer. That plus the fact steel has 0 breathability means it's a heatstroke machine.
>>65139797>>65145033>>65145410>>65145701Keep in mind that many Conquistadors may not have had steel armor.EX: in early 16thC Mexico, most Conquistadors were unarmored, or had leather jackets or mail, with only a few owning steel plate armor because it was expensive. Hence why many Conquistadors adopted Mesoamerican (Aztec, Maya etc) gambeson armor ( in fact, even in the Coronado expedition in the 1540s, decades after Cortes, and which travelled all the way up into Kansas, Conquistadors still were used Mesoamerican armor and most of the expedition was manned by subject Mesoamerican armies from Central and Western Mexico, see pic)In some cases even Conquistadors WITH metal armor still switched to Mesoamerican gambeson/Ichcahuipilli, because the heat and humidity made the former uncomfortable, as >>65140313 mentions, though this is sometimes overstated as a reason since only parts of Mexico are that hot and wet.>>65140814>>65144547>the aztecs were...brutal murderous dictators to everyone else in mesoamerica and it wasn't that hard to convince the others to murder rape them back.This is a misconceptionThe Mexica of the Aztec capital of Tenochtitlan were militaristic conquerors, but they didn't usually raze cities or massacre or mass-enslave their populace. Also, once in charge, their rule was typically hands off, leaving existing kings, laws and customs in place, so they could continue to self-manage, provided they paid taxes of economic goods (not usually of slaves or sacrificial victims), labor or military service, didn't block roads, put up a shrine to Huitzilopotchli, and did other basic obligations. That's not to say they were always that loose, sometimes they did raze cities if they incited others to stop paying taxes, or replaced unruly kings, or gradually increased their influence over local affairs and replaced officials in subject states within the core of the empire, but generally speaking, they were hands off1/2
>>65145889>>65140814>>65144547Cont:>but generally...they were hands off...See picAnyways, this hands-off system (which was common in Mesoamerica from the lack of draft animals + difficult terrain) left subject states with their own identity, agency, and interests, so they had both the ability and incentive to opportunistically secede, defect etc, especially when their capital was in a weak position. You'd often see a state allying with or pledging themselves to a second state (as subjects mostly got left alone), so both could work together to take out their capitals or rivals, then the first state would get high status within the new kingdom/empire they helped prop up for the second stateThat's how and why Cortes got alliesThe Mexica themselves rose to power in similar circumstances, and even after they fell to Cortes etc, Mesoamerican states continued to ally with Conquistadors against their rivals. Also most states who allied with Cortes only did so after Moctezuma II died/smallpox broke out, so Mexica were already weakened, and most of those allies were "core" states that benefited (to a degree) from Mexica conquests, so they just had less to lose & more to gain by switching sides when they did, as those benefits were already jeopardized. Also, only some Aztec subjects defected to Cortes, not most, and many only switched sides after being beaten or conditionallyFor more info see pastebin.com/h18M28BR & arch.b4k.dev/v/thread/640670498/#640679139 & desuarchive.org/his/thread/16781148/#16781964 & desuarchive.org/int/thread/220614413/#220624574 & desuarchive.org/k/thread/64935126/#64961571 & a bunch of the posts in desuarchive.org/k/thread/64434397/#64469714>>65140406The Mesoamericans protein deficiency is a debunked theory. Nixtmalized maize and beans give all the needed amino acids, plus they ate chia, amaranth, spirulina, turkey, dog, deer, rabbit, fish, and some amphibians, reptiles and insects2/2 for now, happy to answer more questions
>>65140571>>65140572What is this garbage?State your point, pussy retard.
>>65139844Nobility lead, but didn't make up the rank and file.
>>65140313>>65145889This seems like a perfect use for brigandine in canvas.Hemp especially as it is rough to allow breathability but strong.
>>65145889>leather jackets or mailSo still far beyond royal Natives, who had the equivalent of linothorax decorated with feathers?How was crocodile/cayman scale not a thing?
>>65145900Cont:>>65145126Forgot to quote this in >>65145889 and >>65145900, please see my posts: Cortes getting allies against the Mexica of the Aztec capital was less a result of them "being tired of the Aztec's shit", and was more those allied states opportunistically trying to gain or hold onto political status, though obviously different states had different motives (EX: For Tlaxcala, trying to resist Mexica aggression really was their primary motive, but even they used the Conquistadors to attack other targets, and most of the other states who allied with Cortes were not in the same geopolitical position Tlaxcala was and didn't share their motives)>>65139797>>65139844>>65140072>>65139782>>65140749To be clear I have no idea if the height values here are accurate or not, I've never looked into the topic of average height in Mesoamerica beforeI don't have time to read them right now but I did a cursory search and found these papers, if anybody else wants to skim them and see what they say:egrove.olemiss.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=3489&context=hon_thesisresearchgate.net/publication/293204931_Height_among_prehispanic_Maya_of_the_Yucatan_Peninsula_A_reconsiderationresearchgate.net/publication/361070595_GENERAL_TRENDS_IN_SIZE_IN_MAYA_POPULATIONS_OF_THE_YUCATAN_PENINSULA_FROM_THE_PRECLASSIC_TO_THE_2010S_A_Diachronic_Perspective_From_Human_Ecologyojs.lib.uwo.ca/index.php/uwoja/article/view/8890/7084aquila.usm.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1888&context=masters_thesesThese are Maya but i'm sure you could find stuff from Oaxaca, Central Mexico etc if you look enough. EX this paper: cambridge.org/core/journals/ancient-mesoamerica/article/human-skeletal-remains-of-the-moon-pyramid-teotihuacan/DF606E91F351FF72A5FE513B620C1FD7 seems to briefly estimate height from some of the remains at Teotihaucan, and Table 8.3.2 in the longest URL I sent above includes some height estimates from other parts of Mesoamerica3/3 for now
>>65145889They conquered a city by public and ritualistic living vivisection of any remaining leaders and then demanded yearly sacrifices of doezens or hundreds of sacrificial victims.You are trying to excuse murdering, torturing idiots who could not see their system only existed as long as the situation stayed the same.They were stupid and subhuman.
>>65145889Aztecs were demons Like jews
>>65145972>by public and ritualistic living vivisection of any remaining leadersNo, that's bullshit, I'm honestly curious where you even heard this, please by all means give a sourceI already posted the entirety of chapter 2 from Hassig's "Aztec Warfare" in the pic in >>65145900 and it talks about the Mexica generally leaving rulers in place, and other sources on Aztec politics, militarism, and economics say the same thing like "Aztec Imperial Strategies", which is a collection of papers and essays on those topics>and then demanded...doezens or hundreds of sacrificial victimsThis is also mostly incorrect, and easy to disproveWe have multiple surviving Aztec tax documents like the Codex Mendoza, the Paso y Troncoso, the Matricula de tributos etc, and in them demands of sacrificial victims and even non-sacrificed slaves are very rareIt shows up zero times in the Matricula as far as I recall, and it only comes up as a tax demand for a single province in the Mendoza, the province of Tepeacac (pic, you can read the Codex yourself and look through it to see it's the only time it comes up here: https://codicemendoza.inah.gob.mx/index.php?lang=spanish&folio_number=48&type=r§ion=m) and even that demand wasn't for Tepeacac to provide it's own denizens as captives, for the province to send the Mexica enemy soldiers it captured from Tlaxcala and it's allies: In other words, this was a indirect demand for Tepeacac to go to war against Tlaxcala and coIn the Paso y Troncoso, it's also pretty uncommon, only showing up as a demand for a few cities and towns and a few provinces, and (at least in the translated tables of the Paso... I have access to in the aforementioned "Aztec Imperial Strategies") the wording also implies most of those are demands of captured enemy soldiers, not for the subject city, province etc to supply their own peopleTaxes were mostly of economic goods, or sometimes military or labor service. Demands of captives are rare, as I said4/?
>>65145972how would they predict that the entirety of their reality would be changed drastically in a matter of less than 20 years because of some alien people with borderline godlike technology? They had every reason to believe that things would largely stay the same.
>theres a fucker up here trying to prove that massive sacrifices didnt happen using only some remaining fragmentary sources while theres literal archeological evidence of mass killings near their pyramids.
>>65146000>>65145972Cont:>You are [excusing] murdering, torturing idiots Please point out where I defended or excused human sacrifice: I didn't. All I did was provide factual information about how their political system worked and that they had a hands-off hegemonyAlso, you (and possibly >>65145987 >>65145126 >>65140814 and >>65144547) seem think that the Mexica were the only ones doing sacrifices, which is wrong. Sacrifice was a widespread (possibly universal) practice in MesoamericaIt was not something unique to the Mexica or that they forced on others, they all did it, the Mexica just did it the most, as they were the most powerful and militaristic group and had the most opportunity to get captives. Even the states which allied with Cortes did sacrifices, including DURING their alliance while they fought alongside the ConquistadorsYou can see this in the image in >>>/his/18466191, where Cortes, after allying with Tlaxcala, tries to convince the Tlaxcalteca to cease their sacrifices, and the Tlaxcalteca senators tell him no and Cortes gives up and drops the issueThis is part of why the idea that states allied with Cortes against the Mexica due to them doing sacrifices or being hated is wrong, as I explained in 65145889 and 65145900: They all did the same shit the Mexica were doing, the Mexica were just the best at it>>65146009No, you're just accusing me of saying shit I didn't say againI never denied they did mass sacrifices: They did. The Mexica sacrificed 100s to 1000s of people a year (but not 10,000s or 100,000s, as some claim), as shown by the Huey Tzompantli Skull rack excavations (pic, I can talk more about it in depth if people are curious)But the vast majority of victims did not come from taxes on already conquered states, most victims were enemy soldiers captured DURING wars, or people given as spoils by cities as they surrendered and first became subjects (as well as the slave trade, some local "volunteers" etc)5/?
>>65145149>>65140833He used to be the janitor part time while he was in college then became one of the tech guys after he got his degree. The Mexicans at work started calling him "El Fabuloso" and he thinks it's because there's a cleaning product the janitors use called Fabuloso but they actually do because they know about his futa files.
>>65139782>swordsThey never discovered how to smelt metal. They had sticks and sharp rocks/glass called obsidian. They also couldn't carve stone, look up the dates the pyramids were made and the date of Spanish arrival. Hmm...
>>65146259They didn't make any decent steel. They made plenty of things out of other metals, largely copper, gold and silver.
>>65140681I'll never understand why most of the States-general commanders/leaders names were Walloon names?I was mocked for pointing it out once and still haven't had an answer for that
>>65146040Cont:>>65146259Anon there are literally Maya structures which are inscribed with the dates they were built and under which king, sometimes the sculptor even signs the piece with their own name/signature. These same structures sometimes have the tombs of those kings or sacrificed individuals, and those remains are of genetically Indigenous people. The Florentine Codex also discusses Aztec stone masons and sculptors (florentinecodex.getty.edu/book/10/folio/17v), as does other accounts like the Historia de la nación chichimeca which describes the construction of Texcotzinco (a hilltop royal estate/retreat for kings of the Aztec city of Texcoco, it's one of the coolest examples of Aztec engineering, please ask me for details) and how it was carved out of the hill's natural stone formations, I quote some of that description here: desuarchive.org/his/thread/17713702/#17722781>They never discovered how to smelt metal.Incorrect, they obviously smelted gold and silver, as >>65146369 says, hence the treasure the Spanish were after. But they also smelted copper and various alloys including bronzeMetal was used not just for ceremonial and decorative items but also for some tools (such as hatchets adzes, fishhooks, sewing needles, burrins/styluses etc), and there are accounts (tho some people are skeptical of them, I don't really get why) which describe copper or bronze weapons, namely metal axes being used by the Huastec(?) and maybe the Mixtec, as well as morning-star like maces with metal spikes/tips used by the PurepechaThis: forums.sufficientvelocity.com/threads/119652/ is a great overview about Aztec bronze metallurgy, tho it dismisses those examples of metal weapons I mentioned>look up the dates the pyramids were made and...of Spanish arrival. Hmm...I'm not even sure what you're implying here (there are thousands of pyramids in Mesoamerica, made on different dates and periods, so it's not like there's one singular date?), so please clarify6/?
>>65145276explain
>>65146624so no one will answer this?
>>65146259>They also couldn't carve stoneGiant Olmec stone head stares at your dumb post.
>>65147473...and also at me as i forgot to attach the pic.
>>65145889>>65145900>>65146000>>65146040Good to see based MesoAnon is still posting.
>>65146040>bestYou mean worst. All you seem to be saying is that natives were scum and deserved to be genocided.
>>65146064>The Mexicans at work started calling him "El Fabuloso" and he thinks it's because there's a cleaning product the janitors use called Fabuloso but they actually do because they know about his futa filesi dont get it
>>65147808Gay people say fabulous a lot.
>>65146259>They couldn't carve stone My good nigger are you retarded?
>>65139844Do you really think the entire British army in North America consisted of nobles?
>>65139797People underestimate just how much influence native allies had. Indigenous peoples FUCKING hated one another. They would much rather side with what are essentially aliens than with people from other tribes.
>>65146040>>65145972Cont:Also, for you and >>65145987 and possibly >>65140814:Not even Cortes thought the Aztec and other Mesoamericans were "subhuman": Most conquistadors and many Catholic friars, even Italian and German authors who saw it, all praised their art, cities, architecture, even their governance, system of laws and social order, moral virtues etc, comparing them to the Greeks and Romans as "civilized pagans": See quotes in pic relatedIf they can appreciate all that in spite of their sacrifices, I don't see why you can't, and especially why you flipped out the moment I said something even somewhat non-negative about them (despite the fact that I was just giving factual info and cited a source)Still waiting for you to post a source about them publicly vivisecting rulers of the states they conquered, as I asked in >>65146000 by the way(To be clear, not all Spaniards respected them, some like Sepulveda argued they WERE "subhuman" and didn't deserve rights, but the Spaniards who actually saw and interacted with Mesoamerican societies and wrote about them tended to praise them a lot, and Sepulveda argued that all natives were subhuman, not just the sacrificing ones)>>65147778"Worst at it" implies they were the least powerful, the least militarily capable, etc, which is the opposite of what i'm saying>All you seem to be saying is that natives...deserved to be genocidedIf you think doing any sacrifices justifies them being genocided, then yes, you should want to genocide all Mesoamericans, not just the Mexica. But seen above, not even the Spanish thought their sacrifices invalidated their other achievements, and even the Spaniards like Sepulveda who argued they should lack full human rights AFAIK didn't argue they should be genocidedI also don't get why Mesoamerican sacrifice is worse then the Roman's ritual killings (assuming equal scales anyway) or medieval religious wars , purges, and inquisitions in the Middle East, Europe, Asia etc7/?
>>65139782>4'11"Damn son they must have some nutrient deficiency or something
>>65146686Give me the details of Texcotzinco.
>>65148986Almost net 0 animal husbandry and living in a jungle and or mountain will do that to you. See pygmies.Also they’re Asian.
>>65148957Cont:>>65145966>...royal Natives...had the equivalent of linothorax...with feathersI don't know much about linothoraxes, but maybe, kinda?The most basic form of Aztec armor was Ichcahuipilli, which, again, basically a gambeson vest or tunic (Some depictions show what may be full body suits of it, but it's not clear if that's what they really are): It was made of quilted cotton ('"a finger and a half thick, sometimes two"), but not if it was stuffed or layered or paddedOver that, higher ranked soldiers wore additional full body warsuits (often called Tlahuiztli in modern sources, tho apparently this was actually a term for military equipment in general or a full set of wargear) or skirted wartunics/jackets (Ehuatl), which were both also made of thick cotton (the exact thickness isn't specified the way Ichcahuipilli was), and then covered in a layer of feather mosaic, tho some sources allege that commoners who earned the right to wear Jaguar themed equipment via earning a title of honorary nobility (as opposed to natural born nobles) had warsuits with Jaguar fur instead of feather mosaic (It would presumably still be a full body processed garment, just with the fur replacing the mosaic, not a hercules style raw pelt/hide), and we also have some accounts which mention metal wartunics/jackets, with gold or silver "mail" presumably in place of the feather mosaic over the clothAztec shields were generally made from a backing of two layers of bamboo rods/slats (some sources discuss wood backed shields, some also describe body-length flexible shields that could be folded up) with wooden crossbeams and rim frames, over which they had feather mosaic or furs, sometimes with precious stone or metal plates, inlays etc as part of the shield's insignia, or even the full front being covered with metal (like with the metal jackets, this metal would presumably be more decorative then protective), one account even mentions shields made from tortoiseshells8/?
>>65146000stfu spic>>65146009Yeah that's the part that made me realize he's a coping beaner.
>>65150893>>65145966Whoops>but not if it was stuffed or layered or paddedis meant as "we don't know which of the three" Cont:Some modern sources mention Aztec shields having layers of cloth in them too, but IMO this a misreading of the line in >>65150893 that describes the cotton thread that tied the bamboo together. Helmets were similarly made of wood (Maybe some had a bamboo frame instead but that's my speculation) with a covering of feather mosaic, precious metal/stone pieces etc. I'm less informed about the armor of non-Aztec Mesoamericans. The Mixtec also used Ichahuipilli (They seem to depict it with vertical stitching, rather then the cross-hatch/diamond or horizontal-dotting pattern the Aztec/Nahua ones had), the Maya also used a form of it, and both also did have some form of Tlahuiztli warsuits (tho the Mixtec ones, if they are the same garment, were used ceremonially/ritually rather then as military equipment?), but the Maya also had a bunch of their own esoteric armor and equipment (EX: search "warrior" here: research.mayavase.com, tho the search misses some soldier depictions like pic related; and look up Jaina warrior ceramics)West Mexico and the Gulf Coast also had a lot of unique weird armor, for example the latter had some sort of rope/knot-cloth armor like dma.org/art/collection/object/5282910 or reddit.com/r/PrecolumbianEra/comments/1t1fv6s/veracruz_remojadas_standing_figures_of_a_warriors (tho I question if these are really soldiers/if it's "armor"), and the the former often had barrel shaped torso armor that sometimes had an extended tall backplate (see lelandlittle.com/items/197421/pre-columbian-nayarit-pottery-warrior/ and collections.lacma.org/object/56518, compare also to the Maya soldier on the far right in pic related): Some people think this is just a form of Ichcahuipilli with a thick collar, I wonder if it's wicker, one of my friends think it's wool over a wooden frame. Maybe the backplate is a back mounted shield etc9/?
>>65151039>>65145966ContIn short, yeah, mail was probably more protective then the best armored Mesoamerican soldiers, unless you think that the metal mail ehuatl variants that the Anonymous Conqueror mentions in >>65150893 were also sometimes made with Bronze rather then just gold and silver, but that'd be speculationBut i'm less sure that Spanish leather jackets would be better then ichcahuipilli (especially with tlahuiztli warsuits or ehuatl worn over it) tho I've never worked with leather, gameson etc so I don't really know. If nothing else I'd take Ichcahuipilli (esp + Tlahuiztli or Ehuatl) over the normal unarmored clothing that the worst-equipped Conquistadors had. But unarmored clothing is better then the "just a loincloth" that the worst equipped Mesoamerican soldiers had>How was crocodile/cayman scale not a thingI guess Ichcahuipilli was just better? There were crocodiles and caiman in Mesoamerica, some (including preserved skins) were in ritual deposits at Tenochtitlan's Great Temple, they show up in art and myths, one of the Aztec's calendrical signs was even a crocodile, but I've never seen Croc hide come up for armor or clothing>>65150951I'm not Hispanic>Yeah that's the part that made me realize...Except if you actually had reading comprehension you'd know that, contrary to what that anon claims, I never denied the Mexica did mass-scale sacrifices, they absolutely did do them. See >>65146040What I denied is rather the idea that kings of conquered cities were vivisected (we have ample sources which talk about the Mexica typically leaving existing kings in power), and I denied that the Mexica of the Aztec capital frequently demanded sacrificial victims as taxes (All our manuscripts that show Aztec taxes only very rarely list captives as a tax demand, which were usually economic goods and labor or military service)I gave citations and posted manuscripts which list out Aztec taxes, the other anon is citing nothing for their claims10/?
>>65150951>>65146009Anons seething because somebody actually knows what they are talking about for once and reads academic sources
>>65140424Also because Ungulate milk is easy to consume.
>>65147095I like this but the guys on horseback probably would have shed some of their armor by now judging by how everyone else looks or they'd just cook in it.
>>65153079Always the case, I did an effort post on the Eastern Algonquian peoples only to get called a retard and a hyper leftist, despite being entirely neutral for the whole thing. There's just a couple /pol/ types who see red whenever you mention natives or African in any capacity. It's annoying, because the history of New English Natives is a truly underrated and there's a lot of interesting things to discuss. You all should read about King Phillip's war the fox war and the Beaver wars if you want to be exposed to some serious matchlock era kino.
>>65148957Bless you mesoautist, your one man war on Spanish slanted history has made my boner for stones and my stone mason homies even greater
>>65153346I desperately seek a first person account from a Frenchie living with the tribes in Canada, seems crazy to me they don't have a well known memoir or story from the period
>>65146998Germ theory is still only a theory. Wonder why that is?
>>65139782Yeah, it was the 5cm height advantage. Not their guns or anything lol
>>65140833>one of the tabs had junker queen futanari on it.based Injun>>65146064>>65148143>thinking futa is gaythe spics really ruined these people culturally speaking
>>65155136It is explicitly gay man, I don't know what to tell you. Doesn't make you a prancing lala homo man or whatever, but jacking off the shemales is 100% gay.
>>65148507The Spanish were kicked out of North America because of their retarded feudalism and no guns policies. They were worried that Mexico would rebel (as it eventually did) and so banned civilians from gun ownership. Only the military could protect Spanish colonists from native raids, and the military couldn't be everywhere. That's why throughout the Southwest the Spanish built their missions as fortresses.Meanwhile, the English handed out guns like candy and the English colonists slaughtered the Natives when they tried to raid.
>>65155158>jacking off the shemales is 100% gay.>shemales>futas>implying
>>65155189You are jacking off to somebody with a penis. Not saying that makes them a man, but it does preclude you from absolute heterosexuality.
>>65155212>t. projecting fag
>>65153346Thank you for your work, anon.
>>65140313>It was steel swords that gave them the edgeCarlos!
Haha imagine some tight 4’11 (18 years old) jungle pussy sees you and starts sexually worshipping you as a god haha that would be awful…
>>65155189Aren't girls with penises just men?-Mom
>>65139782Th3le Tarahumara and other norf Indios were actually taller than the Spanish of the colonization era. Average Spanish male height at the time was about 5"2"
>>65139797>steel armorMaybe their helmets, but they usually wore linen curaiss and held shields of boiled leather and iron boss that they adopted from the Moors
>>65156667
>>65157174Bark!
>>65145900>Nixtmalized maize and beans give all the needed amino acidsSorry, but a uni professor with an annoyingly grating voice and a Spanish-sounding last name on YouTube said otherwise. Also,>SpirulinaI tried that shit. No way did they consumed it in the quantities required. Absolutely disgusting.
>>65139782>I juts realized how Conquistadors conquered America.>They just bashed toddlers with swords.actually it was mainly the toddlers bashing each other with pointy fruits and rocks dressed in animal oufis while he conquistadors picked alliesgo watch he man who would be king to undersand the basic mehods
>>65140459F
>>65151113Cont:>>65157558>bashing each other with pointy fruits and rocks dressed in animal oufisI'm not sure what you mean by "fruits" here, but Mesoamerican weapons were not simply sticks and rocks. As seen in pic related, they used a large variety of bespoke, designed types of weaponry: Sure, there were simple clubs, but also maces with torus, disc, spherical, flanged, and spiked/morning star style heads, batons/bats (possibly sharpened, some spiked or bladed), spiked clubs/"war-picks", axes (both stone and bronze/copper), "swords" and bladed clubs, simple spears, "glaives", slashing spears/"halbreds", very long pikes, serrated spears, atlatl, bows, slings, and more.Also, most Mesoamerican soldiers did not have animal themed armor and uniforms. Not to say that it was super rare or anything, but it also didn't make up most of the equipment they used: As I explained in >>65150893 and >>65151039 and >>65151113 Lower ranked Aztec soldiers would have no armor or a gambeson vest/tunic, higher ranked ones wore full body warsuits or skirted tunics/jackets over that, and while some of those were Jaguar, Coyote, or Eagle themed, many weren't animal themed and just had nonspecific helmets and geometric patterns/designs, or were mythological themed like the skeletal tzitzimime themed helmet/warsuit, etc. And animal themed equipment is even less common in military contexts for non-Aztec groups> while he conquistadors picked alliesThe Conquistadors were really more at the mercy of Mesoamerican groups wanting to ally with them then the other way around: They were outnumbered, had limited supplies, lacked lodging, and directions. On that note, Cortes was absolutely being used and manipulated by local kings and officials like Moctezuma II of the Aztec capital of Tenochtitlan, Xicotencatl II of Tlaxcala, Ixtlilxochitl II of Texcoco, Xicomecoatl of Cempoala etc, as much or more then Cortes was using them. 11/?
>>65156728source?
When you kill your best and most athletic specimens every day to make the sun come up, what's left tends to get worse.
>>65155254 (NTA)You're the one coping that getting off to cock isn't gay, anon. You can enjoy it all you want, but it's still gay at the end of the day.
Spanish STD are the real WMD.
>>65145410Non-parade steel armor is not particularly reflective.
>>65159153>I'm not sure what you mean by "fruits" here,nta, but it's a blackadder reference
>>65161877>getting off to a woman is gay because... uh... it just is OK!lol, whatever you say homo
>>65140749some Incas are pretty tall.
>>65155136It's definitely gay. Just help the Bi guys and own up to it. There's too much bi-erasure thanks to the likes of you
>>65162067Women don't have cocks, anon
I'm getting really sick of the autistic college kid who shows up to post his doofus infographics everytime something remotely related to the history of the Americas is discussed.
>>65159153thanks for dropping science anon>On that note, Cortes was absolutely being used and manipulated by local kings and officials like Moctezuma II of the Aztec capital of Tenochtitlan, Xicotencatl II of Tlaxcala, Ixtlilxochitl II of Texcoco, Xicomecoatl of Cempoala etc, as much or more then Cortes was using them. what role did la malinche/malintzin play here? was she merely a translator or was she also a true diplomat?
>>65162105bisexuality isn't real, it's just faggot cope>>65162112men don't have tits and pussies.
>>65155189>>65155136¡Dios mío, el Fabuloso está aquí!
>>65162128>Facts and information have no place on my 4chan! Only arguments about futanari and gay injuns!
>>65139782I thought they just bred them into submission
>>65162617How do you explain the people who find both men and women hot then?
>>65166114Gay
>>65139782NO MAMES WEY WE WUZ ARYAN TRAD CATH INCAN AZTEC WARRIORS O ALGO WEY
>>65167935But they like women too?
>>65164359>No new posts
https://voca.ro/17ostYH5Snlv
>>65146624The Netherlands as a separate political and cultural entity was only just emerging during the 80 years war.Before it was just a bunch of county and dukedoms on the edge of the HRE and northern France. Thus a lot of the nobility was French, German or larping to be
>>65162128I'm pretty sure he's also a high profile poster on r/dankprecolumbianmemes and sufficientvelocity.He really is noliving this.I don't mind, though, His posts are great.
>>65169186>chel
>>65169186i saw the new ones
>>65150893ooh interesting, Its no steel but they had better armor than I thought. If the helmets were made out of something like imbuia wood which is super strong i can see them being quite effective.
>>65162159From Diaz (who really didn't understand the details of interactions alot of the time) i get the impression she was outright lying to manipulate events, the Aztecs thought she was alot more important than many of the Spaniards thought she was. They depicted her during the storming of the temple not just as a leader but as an armed combatant. At some points she was wearing armor in battle, my guess is because Cortez couldn't give detailed orders without her so he needed her close.If Diaz's (misunderstanding) of what was going is as he wrote it on several occasions when he thought they were trying to kill Cortez they were actually trying to kill her.
>>65153346>>65153079Intellectual discussion on my anti-intellectual anime website? The horror. Keep up the good work, anons.
>>65169186>ai slopboo
I love brown gurls
>>65171966same
>>65172025This person's art is pretty good. Love their patterns. This is the type of culture and aesthetic we lost and chose imported Euro culture over this.
>>65172025
>>65140313You forgot the majority of conquistadors where from Extremadura (literally Extremely hard), so 40cº and the like were known and used to. What happened with that is lots of them either lost they armor or didn't even have more than a gambeson and steel helmet, so they procured the local stuff because war get trough armor, weapons and the like like nothing. >>65162128It's the same graphics again and again. It's some kind of bot or some autistic german kid? Because even some tangential meso american stuff get him going.
After many years of study I have decided all natives (everywhere) deserved it (whatever it was) not because they were subhuman, but because they were human and nothing is more evil than that.
>>65169199>https://voca.ro/17ostYH5SnlvKommando? I vouched for Grimsrud, don't know his buddy, don't vouch for him.
>>65153496>Germ theory is still only a theory.This. Germs aren't real.
>>65147778If we genocided every ethnic group that had ever done a little human sacrifice there would be no one left
>>65140406Imagine riding into battle with a fleet of golden retrievers. No duck or bird would be safe.
>>65171966>>65172025>>65172649Sorry to ruin the fantasy for you, native American women, both from the north and the south, look like fucking goblins.
>>65170806>If Diaz's (misunderstanding) of what was going is as he wrote it on several occasions when he thought they were trying to kill Cortez they were actually trying to kill her.Diaz is not wrong and "Maliniche" was the primary target of targets and was absolutely the seething obsession of the 'natives' to kill her
>>65179821>'natives'
>>65179821I meant he thought Cortez was the target not her. There are a few parts where Diaz gets frustrated because they will not listen to him and only do so when she 'conveys orders' from Cortez, it seems that it never occurs to him that she is making up half the orders herself.I suspect that it is possible that that last part was an act on Diaz's part to inflate Cortez; in his account he makes it very clear that he knew the part where they used a black slave to infect a a few dozen Aztec nobles with smallpox was her idea and that while they were in the city she was using their slaves to spy on them.
>>65171966So did Johnny cash
John Smith was knighted for slaying three Turkish champions in single combat. He beheaded each one and made their heads his coat of arms. This took place while the Christian forces were besieging the fortress of Alba Iulia, a Turkish soldier road and demanded a duel where the winner would claim the other's head. John defeated him in a joust. A second Turk rode out and demanded to duel John, after exchanging blows the duel ended with pistol shots being exchanged. John took one to his breastplate and the Turk took one in the arm and died. A 3rd Turk rode out demanding a duel to redeem the Turks' honor. A fight with battle axes ensued and John slew the final Turk.This is who England sent to set up a colony in Virginia.
>>65153496That's how scientific theories work
>>65140749They still exist. Kind of a big one.
>>65162105futa is a straight fetish according to neurosoyentistshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-A8GvUehq4
>>65162105>>65182159I will make the case that, for a male audience at least, the answer depends on the interests of the individual consumer.From what I've seen of such material, it and its audience can be divided quite neatly into two categories:>just wants to have two girls going at it but with more options in the bedroom than regular lesbians, giving the same overall content as with hetero stuff without half the stage being taken up by a guy they're not attracted to who is only there for the sake of making the sex happenabsolutely hetero, in the same sense that yaoi is for women>specifically focuses on the penis itself, wanting to personally interact with it and/or be forced to interact with itthis where things get very sus, although could potentially be attributed to unresolved self-esteem issues rather than just latent homosexualityThe core dichotomy between these two categories is that the former treats the penis as a means to an end, while the latter treats it as the end itself.Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
>>65145410Never touched a hot car anon?Few factors at play with your theory:1) steel back then was carbon steel, not stainless. It was a lot darker and heavier, because carbon steel isn't as flexible so it needs to be comparatively thicker to have the same strength. This makes troops heavier and slower than the cloth armoured Spanish-allied natives whose militaries were moving rapidly into Aztec territory. 2) carbon steel rusts like fuck. Armour needed to be either painted, waxed, or lacquered, and even then it regularly needed to be cleaned. The best way to clean it is scrape the protective coating off over a low heat, boil the armour in vinegar, and sand the rust off. So you need a supply chain just to maintain the armour.3) the best way to keep the sun off armour is insulating it, to reduce heat transfer. This works in arid conditions (such as the Mexican highlands), but the coasts and lowlands are humid as fuck. Jungles are obviously jungles. Big problem for hydration. And the conquistadors were in an unknown land with unknown water quality and very limited means to brew the low alcohol % isotonics that European militaries of the era used and move them with the troops.4) cloth armour was actually really good at protecting against glass weaponry, hence why the locals used it. Steel armour, obviously harder than glass, was likely too hard: the glass would shatter on contact and now you've got shards of glass flying in your face.End result being fuck the plate armour unless you need to show off. The locals have designed PPE that works for their climate and all the supplies associated with that are readily available, so they just used that instead.
Isn't the average Sicario a fat midget?
For me it’s the Pacific Northwest natives
>>65182529HEYA HOYA HEYA HOYA
As an adult male with a height of 4'10 can I ever be a /k/ommando?
>>65145410>>65145889Platefag here:Most of them didn't have much armor, if any. Plate is hot. Sweat can't evaporate under it, so you WILL run hotter than everything around you, to the point where if I fight in it for a bit, opening up my curiass in the middle of summer feels like I walked into a room with AC. I've fought in freezing rain in the winter and not actually known it was raining because I was so warm. On the other hand, it's not so hot that you CAN'T wear it in shitty weather. It's ass, and you need to drink a lot of water, but it won't kill you. That's full harness.Half armor or just breastplate and helmet is whatever, you barely notice it. If there's a serious threat, you'll wear it. If there isn't, you won't. It's also reliant on leather straps that can rot and would probably need replacing pretty often in that environment. If you look at the weapons used, and firsthand accounts of what fighting the locals is like, it's less >Armor too heavyand more>Most of us don't have armor, and these people are so easy to defend against, with such shitty weapons, that we don't really need it anyway
>>65164359>>65169186>>65172025i want to be a conquistador
>>65185258you were born to be a tunnel-rat, the most /k/inetic of /k/ommandos
>>65139782The horses were one of the main reasons. The Americans had nothing similar and were afraid of them.
>>65185258Hahaha I know exactly how to make you properly /k/
>>65187512Initially yey, until they realized that it's just a large animal that can be killed like every other animal.
>>65187680too bad they never got good at it
>>65182159Interesting vid, but I'm not sure how much of it holds to scrutiny. The amount of reliance they have on information from porn sites for example probably skews the results considerably since those always tend to cater towards the compulsive porn consumer, whose brains are always fried on this shit. It'd be like data-crawling on youtube; you'll get insights into a decent chunk of the average population, sure, but it's mostly going to be pre-teens and third-worlders. I'd also object to the part about men having no internal cues. The prevalence of /ss/ and mommy-dom has taught that this absence is nowhere near as universal as this guy makes it out to be. There's other parts that I feel the same about (like the part about how male physical arousal = psychological arousal is bullshit iirc), but suffice it to say, I suspect this research might be a bit outdated at least, and the heterosexuality of futa needs more study.
Kind of misleading starting that graph in the late 18th century when we modern research shows that was one of the lowest points in Western European history when it comes to height.
>>65189041meant to reply to >>65142273
I always laugh seeing Meso-anon beat the shit out of brownoid Iberians feelings with his facts and logic.
>>65189235if only that could undo the conquest
>>65163167>¡Dios mío, el Fabuloso está aquí!>El futa de Jonker Quín no es homo, es two spirit o algo
>>65139782The average Spaniard was 5'3" to 5"4" at that time. Not drastically taller. US and norf Mexican Injuns were often taller than them. In Mexico the natives from the north are still taller on average and have gotten taller over centuries like Europeans have. They're very prominent in running and endurance sports and are very overrepresented in winning races. It's not rare for them to be 5'10" to 6'+. Mayas are usually short but they've gotten taller (and fatter) in the last few decades too.
