Whats better? AR or AK?
>>65217119my dick
FAMAS
>>65217119AK of course, not even close.
>>65217126pick any other gun
>>65217119AR won because of ammo prices
>>65217119Depends on whether your just shooting on the KD range a few days a year or actually dragging the rifle through snow, sand, and mud in the trenches.
I have both and I like both but the AR wins because of ammo pricesFunny enough the AK was probably the better option because of ammo prices but nowadays the cheapest good AKs are $1000+ meanwhile a PSA can run you less than $600 and you can save for a decent optic or go full retard and get an ACOGAnd it would probably cost less than say an Arsenal
AUG
>>65217527>nowadays the cheapest good AKs are $1000+ meanwhile a PSA can run you less than $600 yeah but what's the cheapest good AR?
>>65217552PSA unironicallyIt worksI guess for "good ARs" I would say FN is a good choice and can be bought for less than $900 in some LGSes
>>65217552Most of them these days. Just buy a better upper once you start shooting more
>>65217119the AR and it's not even close
>>65217119AK.>reeeeeThe Garand/Kalashnikov hybrid design is the most produced, copied, and utilized firearm in history, the AR15 was so "superior" that it was copied and used by nearly no-one, and the nations that did (Taiwan/South Korea) dropped them as quickly as possible. A AK can be refined to beautiful degree (Sig 550/Rk series/XCR) while the AR needs to be redesigned from the ground up to be minimally functional.
>>65217119AR is better for regulars, ak is better for conscripts.
Yes
>>65217838Colt wouldn't give the South Koreans a license to produce M16s domestically.The others I don't know enough to speak on
>>65217890South Korea literally produced M16s domestically.
>>65217119
>>65217905And then Colt sued Daewoo over it
>>65217916>Deliveries of XM16E1s began in October 1966 and M16A1s in March 1967 by the United States for the South Korea during the Vietnam War.[289][290] >Also, 1,039,599 M16A1s (Colt Model 603K) were locally produced by Ministry of Defense Arsenal (later privatized to Daewoo Precision Industries and Poongsan Cooperation) at $7 royalty paid per rifle to Colt between 1971 to 1982.[note 16][292] KATUSA (Korean Augmentation to the U.S. Army) soldiers who serve in the U.S. Army use the M16A2.[249] Retirement from active service began in 2005, and the Reserve Forces alone has 850,000 M16s in possession by the end of 2016.[293][294]
>>65217119Shotgun
>>65217890South Korea MADE M16's in house. Taiwan chose to manufacture M14's in house rather than manufacture M16's and both ran into the same problem; that being M16's failed even on the firing range. Taiwan and Colt ironically came to the same conclusion, that a short stroke upper receiver was the most expedient solution, while Stoner himself moved to the AR17-18. If the Stoner DI system was so great then everyone would copy and use a version in their own service rifles. The AIM-9 Sidewinder was so effective and groundbreaking that the Soviets copied it down to the point where K-13 components could be interchangeable with the Sidewinder. Military technology and general concepts boil weapons down to very similar weapons with few outliers that can be explained by two simple reasons.>doctrine speciality>outright corruption The M14 is a example of doctrine, and while the weapon itself wasn't copied but the concept itself was. The M16 was due to outright corruption, with Colt salesman outright having "private demonstrations" to Generals which leads to adoption without any sort of trials or development.
>>65217119The AK is better for what it was intended to be, which was an evolution of the submachinegun. The M16 is overly long, and shoots a tiny 22-caliber squirrel bullet that was an overcorrection from the 7.62 NATO cartridge. The US military has been trying to replace 5.56 NATO almost as soon as it was adopted. The reason it’s stuck around for so long is ultimately a matter of cost/logistics which makes the bean counters happy. That being said, I think the AR is typically a more well-made firearm than the basic commie AK due to the difference in Western vs Eastern manufacturing. Something like the IWI ACE is like the ultimate evolution of the AK if it was redesigned and manufactured by a first-world country. The biggest advantage of the AR will always be its weight. This makes the AR easier to live with for the average person. If you compared short (10-13” barreled) versions of both, then I think the AK starts gaining more of an edge. Think Mk 18 vs Zastava M92.
>>65218013>IWI ACENo, though it is a very good AK the "best" version of the AK is hands down the XCR.
>>65218013>The M16 is overly long, You can literally just make a shorter AR15, like the M4A1 with a 14.5" barrel and collapsing stock, or go even shorter like the Mk.18 with its 10.5" barrel, though that's less practical.>and shoots a tiny 22-caliber squirrel bullet that was an overcorrection from the 7.62 NATO cartridge. 5.56x45mm NATO M193 Ball violently mogs the M59 Ball load of 7.62x51mm NATO, and the M43 load of 7.62x39mm. M193 Ball isn't even cutting edge either, we have M855A1 Ball and Mk.262 Mod 1, both which are even better.>The US military has been trying to replace 5.56 NATO almost as soon as it was adopted.Because there's many retards in the military. Look at it now, the .277 Fury is an excellent example of retardation.>The reason it’s stuck around for so long is ultimately a matter of cost/logistics which makes the bean counters happy.It stuck around because it let you carry more than twice the ammo, makes rapid fire and full auto trivially easy, has a flat trajectory, and makes wounds like pic related.5.56x45mm was so fucking good that the Soviets had no choice but to copy it for their 5.45x39mm, and the Chinese 5.8x42mm isn't far away from it either.>That being said, I think the AR is typically a more well-made firearm than the basic commie AK due to the difference in Western vs Eastern manufacturing. It's also a fundamentally more practical and modern weapon.>>65218047Trufax.
>>65218707>You can literally just make a shorter AR15, like the M4A1 with a 14.5" barrel and collapsing stockI mean yes, but historically the M16 was already outclassed by the AK as soon as it was adopted. 30 round magazine vs 20 round, collapsible stock vs fixed stock, 16" barrel vs retardedly long 20" barrel, etc.>It stuck around because it let you carry more than twice the ammo, makes rapid fire and full auto trivially easy, has a flat trajectory, and makes wounds like pic related.>5.56x45mm was so fucking good that the Soviets had no choice but to copy it for their 5.45x39mm, and the Chinese 5.8x42mm isn't far away from it either.The major advantage of the M16 and 5.56 cartridge was always just weight reduction. 5.56 was adopted because the Pentagon thought it would be easier for Vietnam draftees who grew up shooting 22s on the farm to control with spray-and-pray tactics in the jungle. Turns out 7.62x39 still performed better in dense vegetation, and American troops spamming full auto fire burned up ammo too quickly, which negated the whole advantage of 5.56 being lighter than 7.62 cartridges. Because of this, the Pentagon limited the newer M16s to three-round burst in the 80's. Fast forward to early GWOT, and troops are on record complaining about the ineffectiveness of the M855 cartridge and the "knockdown power" of 5.56 at range (same complaint made against the .30-40 Krag-Jørgensen rifle during the Moro Wars 100 years earlier).>It's also a fundamentally more practical and modern weapon.Because of weight. Steel AK vs aluminum AR means the AR is lighter and ultimately more practical. If the AK weighed the same as the AR, then I would consider it superior. Even though it sounded like I was shitting on the AR earlier in this post, I do think weight is the most important attribute for the practical use of a firearm. Really the thing I actually hate about the AR is the fact that it's married to the 5.56 cartridge due to the design of the magwell.
>>65217119What blew up today, chud?
Iran with AKs is being the USA (fascist version) with ARs and DSAs with old sniper rifles beat chuds with necks so do the math. :3
>>65218774whatcha doin' rabbi
>>65218707>M4>make the perfect light weight rifle into an overweight unbalanced shitbrick
>>65218772>5.56 was adopted because the Pentagon thought it would be easier for Vietnam draftees who grew up shooting 22s on the farm to control with spray-and-pray tactics in the jungle.utterly retarded drivel>Turns out 7.62x39 still performed better in dense vegetationit didn't>and American troops spamming full auto fire burned up ammo too quickly, which negated the whole advantage of 5.56 being lighter than 7.62 cartridgesthis makes zero sense either> If the AK weighed the same as the AR, then I would consider it superior.lol, lmao even
>>65217119Wrong choice of guns. Here is the actual correct choice:
>>65218918gay
>>65218931yes>>>/cm/you're on a website created by a homosexual crossdresser to discuss pedophilic cartoons
>>65218772Holy FUCK are you stupid.>>65218839Gov't profile isn't that great, no, but I think you're exaggerating. Use a fluted profile and a lighter fore-end and you'd see improvement.>>65218901>>Turns out 7.62x39 still performed better in dense vegetation>it didn'tHeavier bullets deflect less when shooting through light vegetation, is probably what he's getting at, but that's not exactly some kind of pivotal factor.
>>65217928>Granite B pattern
>>65217916Clearly there was some sort of agreement (or if there was any violation, it was settled), because the Koreans manufactured a million M16A1s and paid Colt royalties for each one.
>>65218707>You can literally just make a shorter AR15, like the M4A1 with a 14.5" barrel and collapsing stock, or go even shorter like the Mk.18 with its 10.5" barrel, though that's less practical.But then you lose the wounding power you gush over.Why is it also always the same batch of photos from the era where they would only be using twenty inch barrels whereas we never see modern day wound photos where they are using the carbines you mentioned.>5.56x45mm NATO M193 Ball violently mogs the M59 Ball load of 7.62x51mm NATO, and the M43 load of 7.62x39mm. M193 Ball isn't even cutting edge either, we have M855A1 Ball and Mk.262 Mod 1, both which are even better.Yeah well that is just like.. your opinion, man, but comparing a WW2 (effectively anyways) round (M43 ball) to M855 is funny - M67 Yugo or anything commercial from Wolf or Hornady mogs.
>>65221018 (me)Quick follow up question: which would you rather be shot by in the chest - specifically the solar plexus - with no body armor?5.56x45mm M193 (it "mogs") or 7.62x39mm M43 ball?M16A1 against a Type 56 if it /really/ matters.
>>65217119Distance combat but not sniper distance: AR15 due to accuracy and since the head is more visible than the torso in window fights.Upclose: AKM, AK47, or any other 7.62x39mm AK variant mostly cause of caliber.
>>652210555.56x45mm and 5.45x39mm takes fat steaming shits over 7.62x39mm for CQB as well.
>>65221024>5.56x45mm M193 (it "mogs") or 7.62x39mm M43 ball?m43 easily, it's basically a pistol caliber fmj in terms of wounding.
>>65221823You have chosen to be shot in the torso by a 123 grain projectile based on a chart which shows that the M43 ball is still going to mess you up - M193 is not shown by M995 is closer in grain and the example gun I picked so let's go off of that - where the 5.56 round pretty much icepicks, leaves a decent wound, but then leave whereas the 7.62x39mm has tore through your entire body.You aren't serious.
>>65218047I don’t have any AK cravings but I could get erect for an XCR.
>>65222778>is still going to mess you upicepicking uselessly is the worst possible performance a bullet can have, you disingenous retarded troonit might as well be .22lr in terms of effectiveness, absolute dogshit befitting of its subhuman designers.
>>65222803>icepicking uselessly is the worst possible performance a bullet can haveAnd that is exactly what 5.56 does 95% of the time! That is exactly what the closest analog to M193 ammo did, though I see you posted a new chart where it still does... exactly that, mostly icepicks and then has a rather shit wound profile solely afforded to it by barrel length which you advocate for cutting down in posts prior.I will add that these charts are also entirely unsourced (just drawings and shit, unless you want to provide links) yet I am still beating you on them.Are Germans subhuman? You won't believe what 7.62x39mm is downstream of.
>>65223146>And that is exactly what 5.56 does 95% of the time!Actual mongoloid.
>>65223146>these charts are also entirely unsourced (just drawings and shithello newfag, reddit is the other way
>>65223281Not an argument. You admit defeat.>>65223286Not an argument. You admit defeat.Boring.
>>65217119It has been pretty definitively established that the AR is markedly superior in all regards, and any leftover rancid boomer cope about the advantages the AK supposedly had have either been exposed as simply false or made obsolete by the march of time.
>>65223146>the closest analog to M193 ammo didthat being a tungsten core AP? lmao kys troon
>>65217119>Whats better? AR or AK?>yes.
>>65223338In terms of velocity and grain it was the closet to compare to - not my fault that you posted a shitty chart (still unsourced).Posting the same tired images which are also unsourced (only the Vietnam era one has credibility but we covered why that one is irrelevant) to compare it to a FLESH WOUND GRAZE is quite funny. You're a shill for a varmint round: the most deluded dick lopping troonball has more sense than you.
>>65222791The XCR is almost the perfect rifle, a 3 lug style SVD bolt, and a L1A1 style charging handle would complete it.
>>65217119>Whats better? ARthe answer is simple
>>65223328>It has been pretty definitively established that the AR is markedly superior in all regardsIs that why it’s going the way of the dodo and being replaced by piston rifles?>inb4 but it’s not being replaced with AKsNo country officially aligned with the West/NATO would ever adopt an AK at this point, since the AK itself is associated with being a national symbol of Russia. This is why Poland dropped the Beryl and Estonia dropped their aging Galils. Instead they’re all adopting bullpups, new polymer ACR/SCAR clones, or rifles that are basically M4s on the outside, but have piston operating systems under the hood. Unaligned countries in South America, Africa, and Asia are frequently buying modernized AKs from Russia, Serbia, Poland, and Israel vs M4s from American companies like Colt and Sig.
>>65223407>barrel held in place by one allen screw
The Galil mogs the AK and the Bren mogs the AR
>>65217119Picrel mogs both desu
>>65223432>Is that why it’s going the way of the dodo and being replaced by piston rifles?What a joke, this has to be bait. More countries continue to adopt fairly basic M4 type rifles en masses than are dropping them even in 2026. The ones that aren't are adopting AR derivatives that, if they aren't just an AR, they are an AR with a very simple short stroke gas piston and otherwise retain nearly every single dimension and design element of the AR. Bolt, recoil system, magazine, upper/lower receiver dimensions, etc.The few countries that aren't doing that, are as you mentioned pursuing ACR/ACAE clones which... Guess what, are AR18 derivatives that largely use the STANAG magazine and in many cases trigger group or other core components. Guess who is adopting anything at all to do with the AK? Fucking NOBODY. No rock in mags, no long stroke pistons, norhinf using AK bolt patterns, trigger groups, anything at all. It's an obsolescent design being abandoned by literally everyone besides those who cannot afford to replace their soviet surplus or the runiggers themselves where as you mention it has become a national symbol. Even they have AR clones and derivatives lmao.AK is dead as fuck. AR and it's direct descendents still thriving.>>65223454Oh look, it's an AR with a very slightly modified gas system and zero other changes.
>>65223451Looks like ass compared to the Gen 1. I wish the mlok fad would die already.
>>65223465Sorry but this is what peak performance looks like. It's not going anywhere.
>>65223464>erm ackshually everything is an ARThis cope again
>>65223470>copeDeny it all you want, in 2026 the vast majority of issued service rifles anywhere in the world are either straight up just M4s, or are in nearly every single measure AR derivatives. AK derivatives are a dying breed and almost extinct. It's not even debatable. Rock-in mags and long stroke pistons are dead, dead, dead. The AK trigger group is dead. The AK bolt design is dead. The AK bolt carrier is dead. The receiver and trunnion pattern is dead. Every single aspect of the design has fallen out of favor.
>>65223353>lalala can't hear you source source you're a shillanything else?
>>65223480It was only ever upheld by slave labor pricing and Soviet proliferation anyway. It earned its place in history as the default villains rifle. Now the M4 seems to have won out. Finally. Just as the U.S. transitions to another weapon. Will we be forced to put it down like we were the F4 Phantom? I fear greatly for the rifle of our childhood gentlemen. Yet I know this is the way of the world. Time…she’s a cruel bitch.
>>65223492Are you ten? Are you unaware of the fact that you have to do basic source citation, or no.
>>65223510Ackshually nobody here owes anyone anything. Half the posts on this site are objectively made just to piss someone off. The fact that you’re too retarded to comprehend this makes me wonder if you belong here.
>>65223520Okay then you are wrong and suck fat penis and 7.62x39mm is better. U admit defeat
>>65223510source for your source claim? proof of your claims? citations?
>>65223526helmetard, are you having gay fantasies over a failed obsolete round again?
>>65223526NTA. Unless you disagree that shitposting is the thing here in which case my point becomes entirely self evident.
>>65223526Average zigger response desu
>>65223500M7/XM8 will never fully replace the M4 I suspect, but we'll see. SOCOM is now evaluating 80k PSI capable AR uppers to replace the URGI. Estonia just adopted LMT rifles. Sweden and Finland are adopting SAKOs own homebrew AR derivative right now. We've got a long way to go before it disappears. Unlike the AK, which has become a curio.
>>65217119AK is heavy. AR gives you cancer. Pick your poison. Any other difference is pretty irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
>>65217119THE ONE AND ONLY-Richard Johnson
>>65223528>>65223531>>65223535>>65223539Minus 4 Green Berets to 7.62x39mm during the tongo tongo ambush
>>65223600>tongoMinus 8 trillion niggers to 556 :^)
>>65223613No, they also use 7.62 for that there (by 51 and 39mm).
>>65223600>4 Green Beretsimpressiev, 5.56 is totally finished, the combined worth of every brown/yellow/russomutted person can't compare to that grave defeat
>>65217489>actually dragging the rifle through snow, sand, and mud in the trenchesIn which case the AR is better because it's actually sealed
>>65223698Dude... you won't believe what the Russians, Africans, and Southeast Asians use...It isn't 5.56: even the Ukrainians you surely idolize really only use 5,56 because guess what? They are getting it for free in a total war situation; out of all of the countries I listed only Russia really uses an intermediate in mass, but that is the superior rendition of the SCHV concept (ironically because it doesn't need velocity to yaw as much) 5.45x39mm.
>>65223744>It isn't 5.56yeah, it's a 5.56 copy
>>65223750Is it 5.69x47mmRU or 5.45x39mm? A copy of the SCHV concept, but not the inferior round.
>>65217119whichever one you can feed ammo in and keep some spare parts for.
>>65217552>yeah but what's the cheapest good AR?Either a Blem BCM Upper PSA lower mutt build or a Daniel Defense when it goes on sale for $1100 (you can usually find one of those sales every two months or so)
>>65223446>one allen screw More than enough.
>>65217197We need to lift the Russian ammo import bans i don't care about their shitty stupid war
>>65217564>PSA unironicallyThe JaG crew is always nearby
>>65218707>You can literally just make a shorter AR15, like the M4A1 with a 14.5" barrel and collapsing stock, or go even shorter like the Mk.18 with its 10.5" barrel, though that's less practical.And it well never be as short or handy as any AK variant with a side folding, top folding, or underfolding mechanism. The only AR folding mechanisms cost 1/4 of the actual rifle they are being strapped to and add a lot of moving parts to an already finicky system with a lot of small mechanisms.
>>65223454>>65223464>muh ar derivatives DURRRRRRRRRpDoesn't "mog" anything. M27 is a good rifle (for its original adopted and -designated IAR purpose), but every single post-1980s small arms procurement adoption by _____*all*_____ the U.S. military services has been a compromise slop-piece-of-SHIT train wreck.Small arms in the U.S. military services *ended* with the M16A2 (and A4 Marines). What they have now is fucking *gay* and the servicemembers are "waa-oow look how cuttingedge well equipped we are." Pathetic
>>65223699>'actually sealed'checked, no rifle is18 is minimum age to post on this website, nogunz
>>65217983Only anon itt that presents The Facts.
>>65217983>If the Stoner DI system was so great then everyone would copy and use a version in their own service rifles.Everyone is moving away from this system because it has been known for decades that the M16 shits the bed in extreme cold temperatures. This was a real concern during the Cold War, since it was believed that the commies might try to invade through Alaska. This and the controversy around switching to a small-caliber bullet are why there was such a resistance in the US military to dropping the M14 in favor of the M16. And yes the AR-15 can be made to work in arctic conditions, but troops have to take precautions like stripping the entire action of lubricants and leaving their rifles outside their tents overnight rather than sleeping with them due to condensation. With the AK you don’t have to worry about any of this.
>>65225250As the anon (You) replied to already explained the reason in post-1980s era the M16 became 'global standard' is due to the NATO-adopted western coalition and also the Colt corruption. It shouldn't always have to revert to default "M16 v. AK" (but somewhat does, because the post-1950s platform used by Warsaw Pact/Soviets were all based on AK-47 including the AK-74 derivation) framing. AK is no pristine rose either. It's just that both have become world standards and proliferated widely *not because either one of them was inherently 'better' or optimal* for the job of infantry rifle. Each (as a system/"platform") has advantages and disadvantages over each other as shooting machines and in field reliability, adaptability, durability. Neither is best, or the best option.
>>65217838>used by nearly no-oneflat out wrong. just wrong. a lot of nations use them but you are obviously to ignorant to know anything about that.>redesigned from the ground up to be minimally functionallike what? because I have an M16A1 parts kit from the 70s and all the working components are identical to a modern AR. there has been no "redesign from the ground up" because it isn't needed.>>65217983>South Korea MADE M16's in houseyeah, and they stopped, not because there was something wrong with the M16, but because the licensing fee from Colt was too high, so they designed something new. also the K1 is literally just a copy of the AR15 gas system, the K2 is the different one, and they still use the M16s they already have.>Stoner himself moved to the AR17-18only because he didn't have the patent anymore. he very famously went back to the AR15 when he could.you clearly don't know what you are talking about and I doubt you even own a gun.>>65225250ARs work fine in the extreme cold, it one of the basic requirement of the US military. in fact, a couple of the basic changes on the A2 were to make it work better in the cold.
>>65225342>textwallOk no-brain nogunz.
>>65225362>I'm not a noguns, you're a nogunsI accept your concession
>no "redesign from the ground up"Because that wasn't needed to output the M4 piece-of-garbage.M16 was the 'perfection' (of that """"platform"""<--hate the term but that's what's being referred to here). After the A4 is when the abortion era of United States military small arms began.BONUS for additional mald: Forward assist was never needed and apostasy to Saint Stoner's design.
>>65225369>(plebbitzoomtard response)See post below (You)(btw it was (You) that started the finger pointing, I'm a slabside owner)
>>65225371>>65225374what you said is wrong and supposedly owning a slab side doesn't change that. you're a midwit neo-fudd at best and a noguns at worst.>BONUS for additional mald: Forward assist was never needed and apostasy to Saint Stoner's design.ok?
>>65225403>n-no u
>>65225410literally you, dude
>>65225416>still more n-no u>'literally'Back to plebbit zoomtard nogunz *video gamer* brainlet Fuck Tard. Get the fuck off of my Weapons board and stay off
>>65225427>no argumentsee? I win.
>>65225450>muh argument DurrpNever was one. (You) were btfo by several upthread prior posters (and still are here dilating that gash)
>>65225458>1694357329890213I checked the archives, none of the images you've been spamming (on all the boards) were posted before 2025. you're a newfag and a /pol/nigger. go back.
>>65217119The real question is, 5.56 AK or 7.62x39 AR?
>>65225466>'i-i know u'Lots of other images, would you like another. Get killed nuNigger plebbitard video gamer nogunz brainlet. checkedMake another maldpost about 'muh AR' back to (You)r /containment/ thread (= same as plebbit)
>>65225479is projection all you have? because that's all you're doing and it only proves you're a faggot.
>>65225492(You) are the one paranoiacally searching 4chan images, not me. Keep dilating maldbot
>>65225497I'm not the one throwing a shit fit because he was called out for being wrong. you are wrong, you don't know what you are talking about and no amount of shit flinging will change that.
>>65225503>'ur wrong', 'i-i know everything'kek, still butthurt *shitflinging* about being BTFO lil' video gamer zoomtard nogunz Brainlet.
>>65225512you are wrong
>>65225513About what? What is even the source of (You)r butthurtspew itt
>>65225519I already pointed it out. and where are your sources, hmm?
>>65225526What?what the fuck are (You) even talking about brainlet18 years is minimum age to post on this site fwiw
>>65225534what's the problem? can you not understand the English language or have you already forgotten what we were talking about?
>>65225543What are (You) talking about
>>65225546what are YOU talking about?
>>65225547Nobody knows until (You) tell us itt what the fuck you're chimping about
>>65225554it's in the post you originally responded to. are you retarded?
>>65225560>in the post originally responded to(You) mean # 65217983 ? Yes that's the (not mine) post I originally responded to ittIt's *the most correct* post in this entire garbage topic
>>65225590no, my post that you responded to. right before the argument started.
>>65225600>'the argument'fuckin kek, *what* """"argument"""? about what
>>65225590>>65225615ok, so you're not the guy I was responding to. the only thing I said to you is that ARs work in the extreme cold and you crashed out.
>>65217119Dessert Eagle
>>65223446Literally fine.
>>65221018>But then you lose the wounding power you gush over.At extended ranges. You still get brutal cavitation within 100yds, which is what short 10.5" carbines are for.
>>65225618>extreme coldI didn't bring that up (or care), it was # 65225250
>>65225629which one is you then?
>>65217983>South Korea MADE M16's in house. Taiwan chose to manufacture M14's in house rather than manufacture M16's and both ran into the same problem; that being M16's failed even on the firing rangeTaiwan clearly did something very wrong, then, because the South Korean M16A1 rifles held up fine and they're still used by reservists today. They're about as well liked as the K2 rifle, too, which I think says a lot about the M16A1 and K2 both, people erring on if they like the M16A1 being lighter, or the K2 having a folding stock.Having seen some examples of old surplus Taiwanese ammo from their early days, I could believe that they simply fucked up trying to make the M16 at the time.>>65225250>Everyone is moving away from this system because it has been known for decades that the M16 shits the bed in extreme cold temperatures. Literally a solved problem, and it's been more about dishonest H&K marketing.
>>65225646I am # 65225186, # 65225276
>>65225659then nothing I said was pointed at you, fuck off.
>>65217119Neither. Live in US/NATO country? AR. Easier to get and better valueEverywhere else? AK. Cheap and cheerful, rifle is fineYou can get either platform in either caliber so it's all personal preference. And what you can get in your area.
>>65217983>The M16 was due to outright corruption, with Colt salesman outright having "private demonstrations" to Generals which leads to adoption without any sort of trials or development.This is comically fucking wrong. The AR15 was field trialed by American units in Asia during Project AGILE, an ARPA program. A salesman having one airforce general shoot some watermelons and convincing him it was better for guarding airfields than old M2 Carbines was beyond insignificant next to the field reports of that program.The main reason the AR15 was adopted as the M16 was simply because the M14 had truly obscene production problems, procurement went on for years and years, costing untold money, and they were still struggling to outfit many troops with the M14, which wasn't even doing everything it was promised to do.Meanwhile, Colt had their AR15, which besides showing extremely good results in real combat, being liked better than the M14 by those users, was also ready for mass production right away, meaning these rifles could be supplied in short order.This was only going to be a stopgap solution because there were still expectations on SPIW, the M14 and M16 were both expected to be replaced anyway.
>>65225668>nu uhYet (You) diarrheabombed this thread with paranoidschizo #65225342 #65225369 #65225403 #65225416 # 65225450 # 65225466 # 65225492 #65225503 #65225513 # 65225526 # 65225543 # 65225547Get a life
>>65225678>main reasonNot the whole story. By 1963 the U.S. Army still hadn't adopted a 'real' new infantry rifle and the M16 was the only thing on deck. Back to the same "well it's the default so now we have to go with it" that has been the M16's entire story all along, even into the 1970-80s later-to-present era when it became the NATO global standard.It was a good enough rifle but *never* was intended or deliberately selected by the U.S. military establishment. That's the central point of M16/AR-15 'mass adoption' criticism.(and yes beyond obviously, that the mid-1950s-early 1960s M14 program was the biggest abortion debacle of small arms procurement of the 20th century)Not even criticizing it, I like M16s/SP1s. But what came afterward was just "more of the same." "we're doing it because that's what we do." The notion that AR-15 is 'best' because it's somehow best (for the job, or engineering-technically *over all the rest* bcuzzz muh infantry's own prolific field praise of it<--or whatever) is total bullshit. It's the Toyota Camry of modern mil rifles and became so because 'the U.S. beat the Soviets in Cold War'. That's it that's all, now we're all stuck with the AR-15 as 'standard'.
>>65225684I wasn't talking to you, so why did you get so butthurt?
>>65225712(You)—as documented in the multiple (misdirected) ragebutthurt ^^^^posts—are the sperg itt, not me.>wasn't talking toWhat was that barrage of a dozen posts, then
>>65225718you responded to me out of the blue, I assumed you were the person I was talking to.
>>65217119>AR Wins wars>AK Loses wars./thread. Next question.
>>65225725>assumed(You) attacked me out of the blue, idgaf about cold weather anything. (You)r # 65225342 textwall is fucking retarded and remains the dumbest shit ever posted on /k/. Stupid fuckwit18 years is the minimum age to post on this site, stay away.
>>65225729See what I # 65225706 mean?
>>65225738I'll ask you again, which one are you? #65217838, #65217983 or #65225250.
>>65223446Hang on be fair it's a big ass allen screw! Anecdotal and I've probably put only 1250-1500 rounds through it: but mine has never had any torque or accuracy issues in regards to the barrel screw, and I check the rifle pretty often.>>65223407I think somebody does make an FAL style folder for it actually.
>>65225746None of those (and # 65217983 remains the best post in this dumpster fire 'topic')
>>65225761then I wasn't talking to you. kill yourself, you fucking faggot.
>>65225767>'n-not u'Except for paranoidschizo #65225342 #65225369 #65225403 #65225416 # 65225450 # 65225466 # 65225492 #65225503 #65225513 # 65225526 # 65225543 # 65225547 and other butthurtmaldspewGo back to plebbit Brainlet. (You) do not belong here
>>65225706Proposed replacements haven't been better.
>>65225777my original post wasn't about you, yet (You) got all butthurt and had to respond anyway. are you schizophrenic or just a retard?
>>65225787(You)r original post = worthless plebbitard dreck. Get out and stay out.>respond(You) are the schizo brainlet shitting up bandwidth on this board, not us. Begone
>>65225783Perhaps not. (But, several newer rifle designs that came along in the specific 1963-1975 time interval were also tabled or ignored because during that exact timeframe the M16 was being mass-procured. This is a complex multilayered timeline and story.) As said, we're stuck with the AR.
>>65225798>not us. Begonesays the subhuman /pol/nigger. but I'm glad the my post calling out other people made you so irrationally mad that you had to get involved. it means it hit it's mark. cope, seethe, mald.
>>65225814>'i-i don't like 4chan'Get the fuck off of this board and stay off brainlet.>irrationally mad= (You) # 65225342 #65225369 #65225403 #65225416 # 65225450 # 65225466 # 65225492 #65225503 #65225513 # 65225526 # 65225543 # 65225547 et ceteraGet a fucking life Dumb Fuck. Have mommy heat up a hot pocket to salve that butthurt
>>65225827go back to /pol/, you faggot>LOOK AT ALL THESE RESPONSES!!1!1!!two can play that game, here's yours. #65225362 #65225374 #65225410 #65225427 #65225458 #65225458 #65225479 #65225497 #65225512 #65225519 #65225534 #65225546 #65225554 #65225590 #65225615 #65225629 #65225659 #65225684 #65225718 #65225738 #65225761 #65225777 #65225798why are (You) so mad, anon?
>>65225848>n-no u(You) started it because of (You)r *butthurt* over cold weather, plebbitard brainlet. Couldn't even reply to the correct anon, that's how familiar with 4chan (You) are.>mad(You) are. Obviously (about 4chan)(You) do not belong here. Go back
>>65225869>(You) started itby your own admission, I didn't. (You) responded to me first. are you being disingenuous or are you just a retard who can't remember his own actions?
>>65225885I responded because (You)r fucking textwall was illiterate incoherent upchuck, *(You)* sperged back with two dozen posts about 'muh cold weather'. Dumb fuck underage brainlet that doesn't even belong here, go back to the kids' table. Get out4>disingenuous= (You) and doesn't know how to even use the board. Get out and stay out.
>>65225890>I responded because (You)r fucking textwall was illiterate incoherent upchuckyet you haven't disproved even one thing in it.>*(You)* sperged back with two dozen posts about 'muh cold weather'I mentioned colt weather once, you're a lot more obsessed with that than me. plus, you responded to ALL of them. you don't get to pretend you're not mad.>Get out and stay outright back at you, subhuman /pol/nigger.
>>65225915*cold*
>>65225915Go away now plebbitspergbot
>>65225918make me
>>65225921Do what you want. Stay away from /k/ and on plebbit where you came from and belong
>>65225926you're awfully obsessed with reddit. strange huh?
>>65225936? dgaf about plebbit but (You) are from there and need to Go Backrun along
>>65225948really? because you mention it in almost all of your posts. I don't know, man, you sound pretty obsessed to me.
I love those "my dad can beat up your dad" threads
