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No comment.

/gq/ Infographic Emporium:
https://imgur.com/a/gq-infographic-emporium-1-00-1lZ5xw6
Legacy Infographic Reserve: https://imgur.com/a/k-infographic-reserve-AIKzwWF

>Last time on /gq/, Lisan A2-Grip declared global jihad on dip switch jammers and swarthy Mexicans. Anon exchanged his JPC, and SB came out of retirement to talk about Botach.

>QUICK ARMOR GUIDE 2.166
CODE: * = active NIJ-cert, ^ = NEEDS SOFT ARMOR, DND = do not drop, ** = military.
>Special Rifle Threat (M855A1, no M80 <44mm BFD):
Budget: Hesco T212 or L211
Mid-Range: Hesco M210
High-End: Hesco U210 / U211, LSAPI**, or Tencate CR-6450SA.
>CONUS Minimum (M80, M855, M193):
Budget: Expired Hesco 3611C, surp SAPI**^, or Gilliam 6001
Mid-Range: Hesco 3612* or 3810*
High-End: Hesco 3811* or 3811LV^DND
Elite: Used Cercom CER-EMH**^
>CONUS Medium (M80 + M855A1 or BZ API):
Budget: Used Protech 2120-5
Mid-Range: Hesco 3411* or LTC 19513
High-End: LTC 28780**
Elite: VelSys PBZSA** or LTC 28791** or Hesco SC3812
Elite-Plus: Used Ceradyne MH3 CQB**^DND (10x M995)
>CONUS Optimal (M855A1 + M80A1):
Budget: Highcom 3S9 (SAPI-cut)
Mid-Range: Used LTC 28550** / 28590** or Highcom 3S9M* (SAPI-cut!)
High-End: Used LTC 28595**
Elite: Used LTC 28570** or VelSys TSA**
Elite-Plus: Tyr XHA4/S6/T(DND) or GEN 6 LTC TSA**
>Level IV / CONUS High (.30-06 M2AP):
/pfg/: Used Protech 2014G or Gilliam 1023
Budget: Hesco 4403* (bare minimum)
Mid-Range: Hesco 4601* (+ Level III) or surp ESAPI**^ (REV. G-J preferable, adds M995 / 3x M2AP vs 1x)
High-End: Hesco 4800(DND), 4800LV^DND, or Protech 9812-R1(DND)
Elite: Tencate CXP-800 SA or Ceradyne SOF ESAPI MK.II**^DND or Adept Emperor
Elite-Plus: Ceradyne SAEC**DND(??)
>Level IV+ / CONUS Extreme (Various)
Budget: Protech 2230 (fast M2AP, $300/set used)
Budget-Tungsten: Gilliam 8002 (.300 Winmag Swiss P AP)
Mid-Range: Adept Colossus (7.62x51 Swiss P) or REV. C XSAPI**^ (M993)
High-End: Rev. D XSAPI**^ (M993+)
Elite: ECSAPI** (M993)
Elite-Plus: Ceradyne 96034** (7.62x51 Swiss P)

>>65225762
BFD is the primary damage mechanism for behind armor blunt trauma. If you watch the Buffman colossus heavy test, you'll see those millions of newts are nowhere to be found, because the plate was built for them.

>>65225968
>fundamental lack of understanding on the optic of physics
many such cases. Adept will never put a g meter on the back of their plates. It would be marketing suicide.

>>65226274
>newton's third law: forgotten
The clay block behind the plate does not reflect any other damage than a very reasonable backface signature. There's this fuddlore that .50 BMG defies physics and autokills armor, which is false.
L. Cannon's paper on the topic even references an anecdote where someone took a 14.5mm round at extreme standoff and the plate handled it.
>a g meter on the back of their plates.
This has never been required in over fifty years of the NIJ standard and independent lab testing. The only time someone had ever died from blunt trauma through armor was a guy getting shot by a .45-70 through soft armor. BFD was over 100mm.

>>65226302
Yeah, seriously. If BFD is spread out, it's not so bad, and that .50 BMG impact was actually pretty damn mild. If the bullet is "stopped" by the armor but still pencils 5" into your body, that's another matter entirely.

>>65226274
And here is the video in question. Buffman recorded the backface signature on the clay block as 40mm. This is within the NIJ limit of 44mm. Under (modified, because NIJ doesn't go this high) NIJ requirements, the plate wins.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qwl8nZl9gjQ
If the round was able to impart massive damage through the plate, then the BFD number would be higher.

>>65226319
Yeah, it was 40mm. Less BFD than the regular Colossus against 7.62x51mm Swiss P AP (see 12/24 report) or the RMA XRT against 7.62x54R B-32 API. Significantly less than VTP ESAPI against .30-06 M2AP (max 58-62mm).

The Colossus Heavy is 9.25lb and 1.488" thick. That is extremely heavy and thick for a ceramic plate. If a plate is built proportionally to the threat, it'll handle it, even if it's .50 BMG. However, the regular Colossus needs 500 yard standoff to handle even basic M33 FMJ, because the risk of .50 BMG induced blunt trauma is still significant even though the plate can "stop" it. The BFD number is king. The the better.

>65226332
>The the better
*the lower the better

>>65226321
Is there a practical use case for such a plate? That thing is chunky.

>>65226321
... I cannot help you if you don't understand 15000 ftlbs sinking 1.5inches into your sternum in a fraction of a second would likely kill you.
>hurt it didn't literally cone into his lungs and heart, that means he is 100% safe
That's not how blunt force trauma works.
This is 100% causing a shattered rib cage and sternum along with massive internal hemorrhaging.
The best argument you could possibly have is that it's possible to survive if you're next to a hospital. Even Adept says this is not for direct impact, but for standoff protection.

>>65226340
That depends. Are you planning to get shot with a .50?

>>65226426
>I cannot help you if you don't understand 15000 ftlbs sinking 1.5inches into your sternum in a fraction of a second would likely kill you
You're forgetting that the plate's job is to first break up the penetrator, using the thick as shit SiC-TiB2 strike face, and then absorb and control the energy / fragments using the UHMWPE backer and trauma padding.
The BFD number is king. This plate controls 15,000ftlb better than an RMA XRT controls 2,500ftlb. How? Superior strike face, MUCH better backer.
>means he is 100% safe
You are incorrectly assuming I'm saying this is an all-or-nothing system. Yes, some injury will likely be received. There is no proof however that 40mm BFD will impart serious or life-threatening injuries to the average healthy person. This has been the foundation of the NIJ requirements since 1971.
>This is 100% causing a shattered rib cage and sternum along with massive internal hemorrhaging.
Find an example of sub-44mm BFD doing this. You have 50+ years of NIJ history to go back with.
>The best argument you could possibly have is that it's possible to survive if you're next to a hospital.
Incorrect. It is VERY LIKELY you'll survive.
>Even Adept says this is not for direct impact, but for standoff protection.
Two things.
1. You're likely conflating the Colossus with the Colossus Heavy. The former needs 500 yard standoff to stop .50 FMJ.
2. The Colossus Heavy is only tested against .50 M2AP out of an M82. It will need standoff to handle it out of an M2HB.
>>65226340
>Is there a practical use case for such a plate? That thing is chunky.
Well, it's nearly three pounds heavier than the Adept Colossus but only ~0.28" thicker. That means the strike face is substantially stronger because it's the higher areal density component.
What this means is that this plate will put on a likely very good show against 21st century AP loads much tougher than the Colossus' 7.62x51 Swiss P AP.
>>65226450
>*or 7N37, 7N37M, 7N51, 7N49, AP529, .375 Swiss P AP, etc

Also, new rule guys, every 20 armor posts we need 1 lamp post.

The .50 BMG debate has been settled. SARVIP and Colossus chads win. Fuddlore loses. It's over.

>>65226517
I like lamps a lot. What do you recommend?

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>>65226526
To fudd's credit, he does bring up one important point. You will receive some injury after getting shot with a resulting BFD of up to 44mm. It's not going to be lethal, unless you've got some kind of egregious preexisting health condition. The BFD number is king. That old video from Second Chance people love to post where a guy comically ignores getting shot with a .308 is with relatively good quality steel plates.
>this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNOCOAXefDs
Steel plates output very low BFD numbers unless they back spall - normally sub-20mm and in some cases sub-15mm. A lot of ceramics can do the same, against far stronger threats with less weight, and this is not a reason to run steel. Steel fucking sucks for body armor but is acceptable for helmets and shields for specific reasons. In the full vid his carrier gets popped by fragments on shot #2.
Every armor standard except current US military VTP has a lower BFD requirement than NIJ. Most Euro standards (HOSDB, VPAM, TR, DSTU) settle on 25mm. China agrees with GA141 at 25mm. Russia has a uniquely tight 17mm requirement, and while there are some differences in measuring materials, lower BFD is better. With the same materials, per pic rel bottom right, a properly worn Granit will outperform an early ESAPI on BFD despite being a weaker, technically inferior plate. Both plates had soft armor. The secret is that the Granit had a CAP, a super duty trauma pad. People sleep on these because they make you the Michelin man, but if you want to minimize behind armor blunt trauma, that's the play. They're cheap as fuck on Aliexpress. If the ESAPI had a CAP, it would have done just as well if not better.

>>65226536
I just buy shit at goodwill. My favorite are the old alarm clocks with built in cassette players and blue displays. Really gets the "Man Who Sold the World" going.

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>>65225877
Based and checked. Thank you for your service.
>>65226517
>>65226536
Agreed. What oil lamp should I get, are the old Coleman's still good or is there some crazy Chinesium lamp that last years and gives me cancer? I want to be able to keep fuel without evaporation. My cousin gave my pic related for Christmas and it's been in my car since and hasn't needed fuel changed, it's insane for a fluid lighter. I have zippos that evap in a week.

>>65226569
For me it's red displays, I think that they're easier on the eyes at night.

>>65226617
Yeah the blue blooms a lot. Red though is an angry color.

>>65226504
You're treating NIJ backface deformation as a validated medical threshold when it is actually an engineering acceptance criterion. A plate stopping a .50 BMG AP round at sub-44 mm BFD does not automatically imply survivable thoracic loading. Clay deformation is only one proxy for injury and does not directly measure rib stress, organ acceleration, vascular injury, or cardiac trauma. Your entire argument assumes that low BFD equals low injury risk, but you've provided no biomechanical evidence demonstrating that relationship at the energy levels involved.
There are a shitload of medical reports from Vietnam forward explaining how much less kinetically energetic projectiles have broken bones, created internal bleeding, and cardiac and respiratory distress. All much less the 15000 ft lbs.

Guys if we're talking about lamps can we also talk about subwoofers? I'm looking at a Martin Logan Dynamo and need to know if I should just get SVS.

>>65226664
Thanks ChatGPT.
> Clay deformation is only one proxy for injury and does not directly measure rib stress, organ acceleration, vascular injury, or cardiac trauma.
It's the best proxy we've got. Unless you have a better idea? You might need to use Fable or 5.5 Pro for this one.

>>65226675
> cannot respond

>>65226664
When in doubt, bust out the big words, right?
>You're treating NIJ backface deformation as a validated medical threshold
Because it is. See papers from K. A. Rafaels and the previously cited L. Cannon papers on BABT. From Rafaels, hosted by the NIJ:
>"Measuring the imprint of body armor backface deformation in clay is still the most widely-used method to assess BABT. "
>"This metric including depth and shape reflects the empirical evidence that deeper deformations are more likely to cause injury; but for similar depths, deformations with larger volumes are more injurious"
>A plate stopping a .50 BMG AP round at sub-44 mm BFD does not automatically imply survivable thoracic loading.
But it does, because the force impacted onto the clay is less than some plates faced with far lesser rounds.
>Your entire argument assumes that low BFD equals low injury risk
See above quote.
>There are a shitload of medical reports from Vietnam
Cite them. I asked you to produce ONE example of sub-44mm BFD producing serious or lethal injury since 1971 and you're flaking. You have over half a century of data. Shouldn't be that hard, right?
>All much less the 15000 ft lbs.
And with all much less than 9.25lb, 1.488" thick plates using materials literally not even invented at the time of Vietnam.

>>65226675
is not me. I am >>65226693.

This is gonna be a fast /bag/ gentlemen.

Plates come tomorrow (4406) and my LV-120 will officially be set up.
Not sure where I'm gonna store it, my closet has too much stuff in it.

>>65226714
>Not sure where I'm gonna store it, my closet has too much stuff in it
In the living room on a stand. flex to your wife.

>>65226714
Get one of those gucci armor stands.

https://www.amazon.com/body-armor-stand-Tactical-Securely/dp/B0C3PWVK3F

>>65226718
For me it's this stronger one, from "Pridefend" (lmaooo)
> https://www.amazon.com/Pridefend-Heavy-Steel-Tactical-Stand/dp/B0F8MVNZFW

>>65226717
>>65226718
I should've mentioned I still live with my parents

>>65226724
FLEX TO YOUR MOM AND DAD

lol chatgpt fudd got bodied

>>65226666
Depends, lamps are tactical, they provide light n shit. How are subwoofers tactical in a gear sense?

>>65226766
You can use them as a diversionary device or to mask sounds you don't want the enemy to hear.

>>65226766
>Group of 'youths' kick in the door
>Alexa, send it
>All lamps in the house start to flicker
>All alarm clocks turn to full brightness
>Sub woofers and sound system kick on full volume

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2vRLP7lfMg

>>65226802
That's what I'm talking about. Is a Martin Logan Dynamo 1100X up for the job?

>>65226718
That's "gucci"? I'd rather make my own out of 2x4s.

>>65226873
woah cool dude.

Guys at the gym are taking cialis. Is rock hard cock tactical?

>>65226926
It gives you a crazy pump, but doesn't really do anything other than that. It's a vasodilator. Might as well just pin test, it will actually do something for your lifts.

>>65226932
What if I wear a tiger stripe speedo and a multicam black rizz cloak on the stairmaster at max speed so I can assert my dominance?

>>65226517
>new rule guys,
God favors those who turn the darkness into light! Bless you, anon.

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>>65226536
>recommend
Ok, but you asked... i will restrain myself;
>bme
>3yrs otg
>kerosene and low voltage rule the night
>kerosene source gone
>I used to get it at the gas station, like gas
>right from the pump into my 5G barrels
>those days are gone
>...like kerosene in the rain
I have this in my cart: https://a.co/d/051qez31
Along with 1G GasOne Liquid Paraffin Lamp Oil.
I have seveal kerosene lamps/lanterns, but I can't cook on any of them. LED lanterns have the feature of solar recharging (yawn). Yeah, but you can't heat a room or warm food with them. Protip, a kerosene heater and 5G kerosene will thaw (save) your bacon! I will wait 20 posts.

>>65226941
Why bother with speedo? Swing it!

>>65227004
You want me to helicopter my jawn in the gym? In front of the 50 year old indian men in polos and jeans slowly walking on all the treadmills while tapping away on their phones playing shitty google play store games for an hour?

Is this tactical izzat?

>>65227016
Free your balls to free your soul.

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The Mexican / South American / Floridan armor infographic is complete.
This is also this thread's theme song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J28ttTFYVrw

The plate situation south of the border is pretty rough. Hesco has several models manufactured by Carolina Performance exclusively for the Mexican market - 3K00 (NIJ revoked), 3K10 (okay but iffy), and 4K10 (NIJ suspended but reinstated). The 4K10 is actually pretty decent and is stronger than the Hesco 4601, 2x M2AP at NIJ spec versus just one, but weighs more. Carolina also has the KH20, which is like a monkey model Hesco P210, and the XR32 which fucking sucks and can be ignored.
The rest of the situation is frankly a mess. Significant number of shady titanium and allegedly Swiss P AP-stopping plates from the early 00s are still in play, including from import-export ops like Tamiami which isn't quite dead but has gone low key, and then a bunch of shady shit like steel Level IV plates from RONI GLOCK and C/B-grade chinesium from NEWTECH.
I included Tamiami and IAC even though they aren't south-of-the-border for arcane armor lore reasons and also because, over the sheer span of 20+ years, it's likely much of their armor has proliferated over the border given the poor grade of domestic Mexican body armor. ITAR historically doesn't do much. I do not buy the Swiss P AP protection stuff for a second unless they're being sleazy and the velocity is low. 0 meters could be anything, since they won't say the velocity.
Best plate overall looks to be that MIGUEL CABALLERO, MC ARMOR USA Orion two-hit Level IV from Columbia, followed by the 4K10 and that Allight plate. I haven't investigated Brazil yet but I imagine they might have some better stuff.
I'll update this at some point with info on milspec plates in the area.

>>65227022
What happens if I rizz up the 40 year old steroid stacies?

>>65227125
>40 year old
They have a lube for that.

>>65227146
>>65227058
What about mexican dick pills? I wanna go in deep and go in hard

>>65227163
You do not need dick pills for a 40yo, just let them be grateful enough to do all the work.

>>65227175
But doesn't the cialis help my pump? O can't go soft on these philly jawns.

go birds.

What's the most powerbottom-coded camo pattern?

>>65227503
Flecktarn. Germans are unfathomably fucking gay.

>>65227503
Probably alpenflage, desu. It's pretty zesty.

>>65226993
no, that's dumb as shit
knock it off
get a solar lamp and a normal camp stove

>>65227503
ahegaopat
>>65227806
This is unfortunately correct. Watch Shiey's chernobyl adventure videos, great adverse environment camping stuff.

>>65227806
>get a solar lamp and a normal camp stove
I have several, dingus. Silar lamps don't cook.

>>65226039
>No need to control drone with modern boards like SafeGPS.
What do you mean by this? From what I gathered it looks like a GNSS fallback

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>>65228422
>Shim GPS with a microcontroller
>Set signal loss behavior to hover
>Launch drone
>Turn off remote and walk away
>Send spoofed stream to flight computer indicating "drone is drifting left and it better move right", "drifting back better move forward", etc etc
>Drone flies a mission and then returns "home" to a predesignated pickup point
>Turn remote back on and land it
>Displace
Drone itself still subject to GNSS spoofing but the lack of an active RF link makes it a lot harder to spot and deal with. And since youre feeding it fake commands derived from a truth you can do some choke rings and higher quality GPS packages than the integrate-

Wait this is a lamp thread, you should be focused on that

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>>65228388
>and a normal camp stove

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>>65228559
Next?

>>65228605
next nothing, your all set, don't waste money on a travel fire place for romantic picnics

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>>65228611
First of all, I will spend my money however I want, mom. Second of all, you WILL run out of canister fuel. A backup in kerosene, wood or other fuel type is not a waste of money. Stop bein a condescending prick and allow people to cook and see in the dark howeer they want to.

>>65228646
big REI doesn't want you to know this but you can just stack flammable things like sticks and light them on fire, they call it a camp fire, it doesn't take any equipment beyond a lighter or match and it's way better than cooking with diesel

>>65228448
neat, bit more of a niche application than my field but still interesting.

Got my 4401s today, heavy bitches but they're cheap and they work.
With how heavy they are, will they sag/damage my plate carrier over time? I don't intend to store it hanging up but I'm talking about wearing it over time.

>>65228775
not unless you have a cheap airsoft carrier

>>65228782
Will structural carriers hold it up? I have an LV-120 I'm not running heavy ass plates in a slickster or JPC

>>65228775
Your gut is going to stretch faster than the carrier.

>>65228794
>Your gut is going to stretch faster than the carrier.
Unlikely, I've been on a diet since I need to lose a few pounds.

>>65228783
>laser cut nylon
no
dead in the streets
jpc would have been fine

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>>65228747
>wood is wet
>there is no wood
There arre people living on this planet that have different environments than your limited perspective allows. Stop being a snarky cunt.

>>65228797
Doesn't laser cut only sag with pouches though?

>>65228802
>wood is wet
that's why I have my stove canisters
if it's a long term situation where I'll run out of canisters then I have time to dry wood
I'm not hiking around with canisters and jugs of kerosine on my back

>>65228808
dunno just fucking with you, I don't have experience with that carrier so I don't know how the plate bags are constructed

>>65228815
Looks like XPAC construction, plate is just secured with the velcro AFAIK I haven't put my plates in yet

>>65228812
Then stop the conversation. You will make it and never need any options. I will do anything I want my way. And not share with you or other smug jerks. Probably shoot smug jerks so wear you armored cod piece, aiming for dicks now.

>>65228775
>They're cheap
Not really...
>and they work.
Are you sure?