I know it's not the best armor out there, but suggest a comparable alternative!>IIIA+ soft armor panels>VI plates>MOLLE carrier>slick carrier>$1200 ($1300 with side armor)Where else can I get a rig for bugout or home defense that can be split with a family member in a pinch at that price?I'm not expecting cinematic gunfights with operators. I'm talking about some basic armor to have in a state of emergency.
Safelife is shit armor. The plates provide undersized coverage and are underbuilt. The IIIA+ soft is over 1.5 pounds per square foot which is horrible.The rest is underwhelming.>I know it's not the best armor out thereYou are about to blow $1.2k on garbageFirst order of business, decide your actual desired protection level. Buy Highcom soft armor and run a BALCS vest from Beez or another company, then decide what level of plates you actually want.Then buy your senpai a loaner shitty Condor vest or something for $45 used. Still better than Safelife.
The plates are shit, cheat-ringed single-curve trash. The soft armor is shit, literally 3x as heavy as the good stuff available to cops. Both carriers are shit. It's not worth nearly $1200. I wouldn't take it for free, lol.
>>65299027You beat me by seven seconds, you son of a bitch.
>>65299028>>65299033Suggest an alternative
>>65299033Seven seconds. Seven seconds is all the time I have to proofread.>>652991041. Highcom SA3920 for your soft armor unless "IIIA+" is a hard requirement, in which case Omniprotex Ultra HG2. That's the strongest soft armor around which isn't untested turbo chinesium.2. A BALCS vest for the Highcom panels if you go that route.3. Since you're rolling soft, you can do ICW plates. Are you positive you want Level IV?> that can be split with a family member in a pinch at that price?This makes me think maybe not. IIIA is useless in a rifle fight and the plates both require soft armor and lack the coverage of the soft armor against pistol threats. I'd say look at some ESAPIs, REV. G or later on the second hand market.
Waiting on Nick Groat to come in here and try and shill his ass cheese armor.As already said, 1.54psf is EXTREMELY heavy for soft armor and the panels is frankly weak for its weight.
>>65298956>paying NIJ certified prices for uncertified "compliant" armorWew lad. If you're buying uncertified Chinesium you can (and should) roll a Botach or LAPG setup roughly identical to that for like half the cost. Hell, it would likely be better since the goddamn Safelifes are BACKED but still require ICW while Botach/LAPG are standalones. Let that shit sink in. They already HAVE a built-in PE backer like a standalone plate but are such shit they need an additional IIIA panel to work, and at about the same weight as a Botach Battle Steel Chinesium special IV. All that AND the Safelifes are cheat ringed to boot so you're effectively getting an 8x10" plate for the price/size of a 10x12". God damn they are selling you a line of absolute shit.Jesus you are getting rolled. Do you also buy bridges from Nigerian princes?
>>65299431>roll a Botach or LAPG setup Militech or Gilliam is better chinesium, although LAPG's new aramid backed made-in-US Level IV is actually pretty good.Gilliam has a major sale on Model 1635 Level IVs for $150 a pop. Six hit Model 1023s for $199 a pop, and those two are standalone.
>>65298956I call upon armor anonI summon the forces of /gq/Plate carrier autists, arise!Safelife is dogshit senpai. I get it, you're not an optimizer going for high end stuff, but consider buying quality budget gear instead of garbage at twice the price.
>>65299445We're already here, lol
>>65299440You're right. What I meant was, even the funkiest Botach or LAPG setup would be better and far cheaper than whatever that overpriced Safelife shit is. ICW IVs that ALREADY HAVE A PE BACKER AND WEIGH AS MUCH AS STANDALONE IV PLATES BUT STILL NEED ICW. Jesus Christ, it's probably QC-failed armor from a previous contract they're hoisting on unedumacated people like OP.
>>65299445Like imagine buying a Safelife armor set. It's the ultimate pleb move. I think I'd bury the set in the backyard out of shame. lol, in all seriousness, Militech mogs it so badly it's not even funny.
>>65299485>ICW IVs that ALREADY HAVE A PE BACKER AND WEIGH AS MUCH AS STANDALONE IV PLATES BUT STILL NEED ICWMost ICW plates are like this, they're not literally just a strike face unless they're REALLY hard on the ICW part. The built-in PE backer provides safety margin and works more efficiently than soft armor not adhered to the plate itself. It takes nuance to determine whether a plate is soft ICW and just needs the soft armor for BFD purposes, or hard ICW and it needs the soft armor for it to work at all.However, the fact this plate is marketed with IIIA+ 1.54psf soft armor is telling, because that means it's weak. Not to mention that it LACKS DROP PROTECTION. It's Alumina + PE and way too light for that layup even with a moderate cheat ring.>>65299488Thousands of security guards nationwide shall commit burysetduko out of shame.
RMA is preferable to Safelife. Safelife frankly is bottom tier and competes with AR500 and fly by night chinesium.Safelife is also an example as to why you cannot trust just the NIJ compliant product list. Yes, all their soft armor is NIJ certified. No, that doesn't make it good.
Ask when they will have a sale makes em very affordablehttps://www.downrangeind.com/Body-Armor_c_39.html
>>65299104Temu $25 per plate armor level 3 hard armor with $6 trauma pads for pistol or go big with cheap surplus 3a Italian armor or temu 3a armor.
>>65299673These are terrible. Actual ebay steelshit brand with 5.5lb 10x12 $200 Level IVs? Underbuilt, cheat ringed, nominally sized and probably not true 10x12. You name it, they're probably doing it. Their steel plates sell like hotcakes with the ebay crowd, but that's because ebay is a fuddfest and fudds prefer steel.If you're broke, Militech or Gilliam. If you are broke and cannot do Chinesium, buy surplus Protech or Point Blank plates from Hudsongunner or Botach Surplus, respectively. $100 a plate for good Point Blank IVs. If you can swing some more cash and still cannot buy chinesium, Hesco. The 4601 is really good. Otherwise just buy better Militechs.
>>65299678Homes is about to blow $1,200 on Safelife, he doesn't need to drop to graveyard shift 7-Eleven cashier tier armor.
>>65299534Yeah, I was gonna say it was probably cheat ringed to hell and back at that weight for a ICW IV. You think it's really 6x8" or similar under all that shit?
>>65299723The easiest way to check is to run the plate against numbers from other plates using the same materials. The Safelife plate is 5.8lb and 0.72" thick, which is damn thin for a IV. It's Alumina+PE. The Gilliam 1635 is Alumina+PE, standalone, and 6.35lb / 1", so somehow the Safelife needs to come down 0.55lb and 0.28" thickness. Making a plate ICW usually accounts for about 0.2lb, then removing drop protection gets you another 0.2lb, so you're almost there. I don't think the cheat ring is really that big, but it's definitely there. I'd reckon half inch.The Gilliam is also very light for an Alumina-PE IV and itself lacks safety margin. It's comparable to SiC-PE IVs like the 6.4lb / 1.18" Hesco 4601.The 5.5lb Level IV >>65299673 is shucking is more suspect since it's standalone. I think that's nominally sized at 10x12 nominal, probably 9.5x11.5 actual and then has a bunch of other shit tricks.
Not the OP, but figured I'd ask since this thread is up. If I have a budget of two grand for a set of lvl 4 plates, whats my most reasonable option?
>>65299759Two grand is an awkward spot because you're way overboard for top-shelf chinesium like the Militech RF3 Black Label but way under the lightweight IVs such as the Hesco 4800. You might be able to catch some LTC 26310s on sale for about that, but they're outdated 0101.04 holdouts with minimum multi-hit and have no drop protection. They're also down 30ft/s versus modern 0101.06 IVs.What matters most to you, strength (Adept Colossus wins here at $1,280/set) or minimum weight (Hesco 4800 at about 3k)? Are you positive M2AP is a problem or are you really just looking for an M855A1 type plate? In which case you have other options.
>>65299783I suppose lighter weight at the cost of ultimate strength is a trade-off I'm willing to make, I'm not expecting AP .30-06 anytime.
>>65299788Then you can get a pair of 4.15lb SAPI M VelSys PBZSAs for $2,200 and 0.52" thick. They're SOCOM type plates good for 7.62x51mm M80, M855A1, and 7.62x39 BZ API. Won't do the full Level III battery of six M80, but they cover those other threats well above III at a low weight and thickness. The PBZSA has been out since 2014 and enjoys a very good reputation. The OEM is Tencate (Integris), which is the only major armor manufacturer to have never had a product recall or NIJ suspension.https://offbase.co/products/velocity-systems-7-62x39-api-bz-multi-hit-stand-alone-rifle-plate?They are not rated for 7.62x51mm M80A1 and are outmatched by 7.62x51mm M61 AP, 7.62x54 B-32 API, and of course M2AP. It has a secret big brother, the VelSys TSA which adds up to B-32 API at 4.6lb SAPI M, but no M2AP, and that's a rare plate. It'll command $3k a set used.
>>65299814Hmm, so it seems the real tipping point is the .308 family? Forgive me, I'm pretty uneducated about plates.
>>65299819That's right. You usually need a pretty substantial backer to handle even basic 7.62x51mm M80 versus 5.56 and 7.62x39mm threats, which is why there are SRT plates which handle M855A1 fine but lose to M80 (strong strike face ceramic, weak backer) and basic Level IIIs which handle M80 six times no sweat but fold to M855A1 or even just M855 (weak or no strike face, basically all polyethylene - so the entire plate is backer). Those PBZSAs are in the middle between SRT and III. Technically they are SOCOM Tactical Stand Alone - Less than Overt, with the VelSys TSA the "Overt" counterpart.The .308 and 7.62x54 family of actual APs have larger penetrators than their 5.56 and 7.62x39 equivalents, so they need even stronger strike faces coupled with robust backers.This gets really dramatic if you compare 5.56 M995, the tungsten core AP, and 7.62x51mm M993, its immediate big brother. M995 can be stopped by most IVs except the steel or boron carbide ones. M993 at 3,050ft/s (XSAPI spec) will beat them all except for a handful of especially strong models. It is the "de facto Level V" threat.
>>65299431>>65299440>>65299607>>65299783>>65299814I just want>2 carriers>2 sets of armor (at least one rifle-rated)For <$1500I just want ease of purchase, that's why the bundle appeals.
If this is how you treat people who ask innocent questions I'm not surprised /bag/ got raided back in the day.
>>65299845Hi Nick, your armor sucks and I laugh at the fact some retired armor autist's reddit post still makes you seethe over half a decade later.>>65299835Alright I think I can come under your $1,500.>2 carriersJPC 2.0 for $280 and Beez BALCS LVBC for $200.>armorPair of Gilliam 1635s for $300 shipped.>softMilitech IIIA BALCS $289
>65299868Quick correction, BALCS LVBC is $261, price went up recently.
>>65299868Actually helpful! Thank you!!
>>65299884Not a problem!
>>65299835You're stepping into a virtually unregulated, Wild West-style market full of slickly advertised con men where bundled "ease of purchase" often means "complete and utter rip off that might get you killed". Most of the time the result is at least moderately unsafe in that it doesn't stop the threats its advertised to, is drop-unsafe to the point where the plate can be effectively destroyed by a single bored FedEx employee, is oddly vulnerable to some common ammo that can be bought cheaply at any sporting goods store, and so on. I mean, Shotstop got shut down by the DOJ for fraudulently selling random Chinesium as American-made NIJ certified armor to police departments and even the feds. They were not amused, to the point where the owner is now spending the next few years in federal prison for his idiocy. Also don't forget Zylon, which actually got cops killed and took down the industry leader Second Chance.Learn from /gq/, dive deep, do (a lot of) your research, and build your own setup. Decide what's worth to you it in terms of protection, weight, and size. Not to dox myself but for my area real live AP of any kind isn't a big threat but durr rifles firing JSPs and the odd M855 round are, so I'm happy with III and III+ plates. Your mileage may vary depending on your threat estimate. I'd start by putting a lot of thought into your potential local threats/use case before diving in.>>65299868This guy knows what's up.
>>65299868You treat someone asking IF something is a good purchase as if he already actually did it. jfc you're the reason red flag laws are a good idea.
>>65299918Seconded. The body armor industry is about products that you have no way of ever knowing they work unless they're shot. The vast majority of armor is never shot because most people don't like destroying things they spent good money on. Even most military and law enforcement plates and soft armor panels are never shot even in the line of duty.For one example, in decades of basically supplying a huge chunk of US law enforcement all their armor needs, Safariland has only noted about 2,250 saves. What this means is that companies can shovel straight up garbage and it may take years before anyone finds out their product is shit. This has happened.1. Zylon armor was around in the late 1990s. Took until about 2003 for a fatality. PDs were buying that shit like crazy because it made soft armor incredibly light.2. Dragonskin was first manufactured in 1997 and existed experimentally as early as 93-94. Took until the infamous US Army trials after 2006 for the truth to come out. Bad fucking adhesive!3. RMA launched the 1189 plate in 2013. They did not admit on their site it only had 8x10" protection on a 10x12" plate until 2018.There are more examples, too, like the Hesco 4600 or the RMA ESRT or the GEN-III Ceradyne SPEAR plates.The point is, body armor is extremely shady. Comically, hilariously shady. You gotta be cautious. Use test reports, NIJ compliance on the actual NIJ CPL list, and your own research. Do not rely on just the CPL alone. That's a rookie mistake. Safelife's soft armor is flush with NIJ certs, but their plate sure isn't.
>>65299959You're conflating me with several anons Nick. >jfc you're the reason red flag laws are a good idea.Wow please don't tell me you're actually Nick Groat. Wouldn't be surprising since he used to argue on reddit defending his product. Bahahahaha....>This guy needs his second amendment rights infringed on!>Why, citizen?>He said my... *sniff* body armor products are HEAVY and the plate is UNDERBUILT.I am the paragraph dude >>65299832. I am not >>65299431 who you seem to be very upset about.
>>65299832Dang, thanks for the education. I plan on getting plates after finishing my MR556 11" build, just rolling chest right for now.
>>65299990*chest rig
>>65299990Glad to help. The new NIJ 0101.07 standard is finally, possibly, probably, ACTUALLY getting released either end of this year or the beginning of next, so many new models will become available as they are certified to 0101.07 prior to launch.If you want reading material, there's a lot of armor infographics from /gq/ in:https://imgur.com/a/gq-infographic-emporium-1-00-1lZ5xw6
>>65299992What rig is that? I've been needing one.
>>65300014NTA but Haley Strategic D3CRX?
>>65300021Thanks, I'm using a P84 placard now and it's fine, but I'm trying to slim down the width of my PC.
>>65300014>>65300021>>65300031Yup, Haley Strategic. Its pretty solid but I would prefer the H harness desu, been too lazy to get it.
>>65300070Love your set up. Its very clean.
>>65300079Thanks, looking to get a better battle belt and get some plates down the road.
Wait so did the safelife guy literally show up here to just get fucked up and bail?
I remember like 3 years ago I bought a SLD 3A vest for under 500 bucks. Absolute nogunz at the time so didn’t know any better. Been my only armor ever since cuz poorfag
>>65300958That's a blunder but you didn't do terribly.The soft armor is still on the NIJ CPL and fundamentally works. I'd hold onto it and then just spend $450 on a rifle plate setup.Two Point Blank 10079 copsurp IVs from Botach Surplus and a used JPC. The plates are $200 for the pair. JPC is variable but it's gonna be under $250. That gets you legitimate Level IV.
>>65301049I’m not super concerned about rifle threats in my area but I’d buy some plates if I could get a slick carrier for them.
>>65301068Slickster runs out of gas with plates above 6lb. Maybe look into Hesco T212s to handle M855 / M855A1
>>65301068Also, if you're not even worried about M855 and just want lead core protection, consider lightweight PE plates that pair with the IIIA you already have.https://www.gilliamarms.com/products/garms-1-icw-rf1?M855 will pop them easy and they need soft armor backing them up to handle basic 7.62x51mm FMJ.
>>65300201yeah
>>65299700He didn't ask for what else he could buy for $1200. He asked what was better than safelife. Not my fault safelife is such shit that even $70 of temu tier stuff out performs it.
>>65303866Checked.STRIKEFACETRIKEFACE$70 "STRIKEFACE" = better than Safelife.
>>65303936yes
>>65303866>>65303936>Safelife sales team wondering why they don't make their own eBay store when they find out that's $70 for the full armor and trauma pads. Add $30 if want an okay carrier, that's still better than the safelife $150 carrier in every metric. Can even drop ship from temu.
>>65298956>>65299868Thanks, all. I ended up ordering Gilliam 1635s ($298) for a Crye JPC 2.0 ($294) and Militech HG2 BALCS/CIRAS panels ($449) for a BCS BALCS LBAV ($231). $1,272 for a concealable soft rig and a hard assault rig. Thanks for talking me though it.
>>65304161Glad to help.>>65304144Damn man you can just buy that shit bulk on alibaba. Negotiate special deal with manufacturer, buy a hundred and start your own poorfag armor trading company.HIT THE MUSIChttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Olgn9sXNdl0
>>65303936>>65303866Also you can buy .50 caliber AP-rated plates from China with that same "STRIKE FACE" on the front, it's kinda funny actually and yes they do check out on specs. 8.8lb and 1.44" thick, 1x 12.7x108mm B-32 API at 2,722ft/s with 50 meter standoff. Silicon Carbide strike face, PE backer.Since nobody here is actually getting shot with .50 caliber AP anytime soon (I think...), the benefit of a plate like this is that it has significantly more strike face than even beefy-ass above-XSAPI IV++ plates like the Adept Colossus and Gilliam 8002. This means it can handle many additional kinds of lower-caliber exotic tungsten AP and probably has a monstrous M2AP v50, probably close to 4,000ft/s. It is indeed worthy of its IV+++ made-up rating.
>>65299969> RMA launched the 1189 plate in 2013. They did not admit on their site it only had 8x10" protection on a 10x12" plate until 2018.Did they change that? I thought their plates now don’t have cheat rings?
>>65304560Their current lineup is free of cheat rings, but the 10x12 shooters cut plates really measure 9.5x11.5 (with variance) and have bottom corners cut out. This significantly reduces coverage to significantly reduce weight, so they basically just made the cheat rings invisible.Also many of their plates like the new 1165 and formerly the XRT are light on drop protection. The 1165 GEN2 straight up cannot be dropped (see Buff video and RMA's test reports omitting a drop test) and RMA failed to disclose that.Hell, they failed to disclose the original 1165 was light on drop pro until it was discontinued.Every plate RMA sells has a catch. I mean every single one. It's hilarious.
>>65304624Good to know.> This significantly reduces coverage to significantly reduce weight, so they basically just made the cheat rings invisible.Personally I don’t think it’s that bad. Yeah it’s a fucking lie to say 10x12, but a .5” around isn’t “significant”. It’s a hell of a lot less than an actual 2” cheat ring.
>>65304860The cheat ring on the 1189 and 1199 was 1" on each side, so a 10x12 only had 8x10 coverage. NIJ rules do technically permit 2" rings (so a 10x12 only protects 6x8 like a side plate) but nobody does that except D-list chinesium.>but a .5” around isn’t “significant”It results in major coverage reductions, plus the bottom corner cuts. Not to mention it's nominal, so there's +- leeway that lately just goes in the direction you don't want. Plates are smaller and heavier than advertised. Highcom does the same thing, 10x12 advertised, 9.5x11.5 nominal, and then their 10x12 is really more a 9x11 and weight-wise compares to a SAPI Small.>Personally I don’t think it’s that badWith the bottom corner cuts, you're down over 10% coverage versus a "legit" 10x12, assuming it's honest 9.5x11.5. That's bad chief.
>>65304161Next, find the joy of vests. You can run different gear quickly and easily without having to undo stuff on armor all the time.>>65299992Like what this dude is doing. Makes it easy to swap out different armors and gear load outs easily and quickly.
>>65304887BALCS stuff is neat because you can simultaneously run soft armor and hard armor. More coverage and the ability to rapidly up or drop protection in the field rather than all-or-nothing.
>>65304887>find the joy of vestsI'm pleased with the choices I've made. I'll now have a slick, concealable soft vest and I'll lay out my plate carrier with just mag pouches.I don't have enough guns to need to move MOLLE very often. Plus, it looks like I can just jam the plates into my BALCS vest if I want slick + hard. (Har!)
>>65304955That's good because the 1635s are low safety margin and put out 39mm BFD per the latest test report, which is fine per NIJ but high. Soft + hard will shore them up and reduce backface deformation.
>>65304869> you're down over 10% coverage versus a "legit" 10x12, assuming it's honest 9.5x11.5. That's bad chief.Again, I wouldn’t call that a “major coverage reduction” or “significant”. That’s my opinion. Is 109 sq in vs 120 sq in going to drastically alter the outcome if you’re shot at? I doubt it. A 1 or 2 inch cheat ring puts you at 82.5% and 66.7% coverage, respectively. That seems far more impactful to me.
>>65305020Considering a plate already only covers a fraction of your body, yes, that's a problem. Said area is also your vital organs.>Is 109 sq in vs 120 sq in going to drastically alter the outcome if you’re shot at? I doubt it.with the bottom corners cut, 10% lower chance of the plate catching the hit. That's with 9.5x11.5, and the plates are prolly closer to 9x11 most the time. Do you want to roll the dice three times on that? >A 1 or 2 inch cheat ring puts you at 82.5% and 66.7% coverage, respectively. That seems far more impactful to me.If you don't put your foot down with the 0.5" nominal sizing and bottom corner cuts, then the next RMA plates will be 1" nominal. This is only happening because the market tolerates it (and is likely misinformed) and they want weight savings.
>>65305020The numbers are also even worse if you compare their 10x12 to SAPI M. For reference, a true 10x12 should be 0.2lb lighter than a SAPI M. Hesco's plates reflect, as do LTC's more recent models.The 1165 GEN2 is 5.3lb 10x12, 6.1lb SAPI M. That is a 13% loss in weight and therefore coverage.The 1155 GEN2 is 6.6lb 10x12, 7.4lb SAPI M, 11% difference. All sizes nominal by +-0.125.
RMA also just got caught in another incident of sneaky shit. Their 1165 and 1155s just magically went down by 0.2-0.3lb on all weights and are bumming old test reports from before that change. see >>65305129.The principal concern is that since the plates are lighter, they either changed the layup and the plates are now even more underbuilt, or they are now even more nominally sized including the SAPI-sized plates. The fact the listed thickness is the same strongly supports the latter conclusion.
my friend jeff was working at allied universal and he shit his ass on the clock but couldn't reach around to wipe because his armor was too thicc
>>65305045>Said area is also your vital organs.The 0.5” isn’t where your vitals are. If it’s left or right it’s ribs and arms. If it’s high, it’s neck and you’re fucked with either. If it’s low, a gut shot and also likely fucked without immediate medical aid. >That's with 9.5x11.5, and the plates are prolly closer to 9x11 most the time. Based on what? You could say that about someone else’s 10x12 is actually 9.5x11.5 “most of the time”. If they’re actually 9x11s then why didn’t you start with that. I don’t have the 1165s to measure. If you do, please post it. >Do you want to roll the dice three times on that?What?>If you don't put your foot down with the 0.5" nominal sizing and bottom corner cuts, then the next RMA plates will be 1" nominal.That isn’t happening and opinions change if circumstances do. You’re basing you judgment on a what if. I’m not going to pretend RMA is the best option, even the best for the price, but you seem like you have a hate boner against them.
>>65305750>The 0.5” isn’t where your vitals are.Your lungs are vitals. You kinda need those to breathe and if you get hit in them sans major medical aid you're kinda fucked mate.>Based on what?Based on the fact they just randomly dropped 0.2lb without explanation and they were already 9.5x11.5? See >>65305241.> If they’re actually 9x11s then why didn’t you start with that.Because the 9.5x11.5 is the nominal size which is advertised in the fine print below the part where it says 10x12.>What?RMA's the ones advertising the plates as multi hit, not me. Their old XRT was RF2 and that's a three hit req, with the same nominal sizing bullshittery as these. NIJ finds three shot protection is needed for RF2, so statistically you'd have to think about whether those three hits would even HIT the plate. Smaller the plate, lower the odds!>That isn’t happening and opinions change if circumstances do. You’re basing you judgment on a what if.Dude, it literally just did. The plates all magically got 0.2lb lighter since April 2026 with no change to thickness, which would be indicative they are now smaller. See >>65305241.>I’m not going to pretend RMA is the best option, even the best for the price, but you seem like you have a hate boner against them.They made their bed with how they failed to disclose past issues, failed to make good on the 1155 suspension, sent Buff 1192s 10oz heavier than advertised, made him pull a vid where their ESRT failed because of bad optics, and more! They're a shady armor company, but not the only shady armor company. If you like I can talk about AR500 or Spartan or Tactical Scorpion instead.
This bread went from safelife sux to RMA sux
>>65298956>VI platesWhat is this chink sorcery lolIs that rated for 14.5x114 mm or something
>>65306899Safelife sux is too ez, too obvious.Imagine actually spending $1200 at Safelife, hahahahaha
>>65298956You people in the states live on easy mode with cheats on Best i can do for me and my gf is a 6Bsomething out of the fucking Soviet Afghan war (it was rated for M855something if I remember correctly, but you can't get your hands on any NATO AP ammo in eastern euope so ive only tried it with regular FMJ and of course it stops it) and a Swiss soft vest from plenary tactical (best prices ever around 180$ for a perfectly functional Finnish made kevlar/aramid (i dunno)
>>65306960You should still be able to order Militech plates from their official store or from ali, that's what I got, saw some German dude testing them using everything from steel core 7.62x54r to 8mm Mauser and it they took it like a champ.
>>65298956Will this stop you from getting stabbed in the neck from behind?
>>65306932He must be talking about the EDUN NIJ-IV+++ plates rated for 12.7x108mm B-32 API, homes. See >>65304214, right above Xi's head.>>65306936Imagine spending $600 on RMA 1165s and actually thinking you're getting 5.3lb Level IVs for that with no strings attached.
>>65306980>EDUN NIJ-IV+++ plates rated for 12.7x108mm B-32 APIHahaha holy shit I knew there were .50 BMG rated joke plates but that's sick.Is there any additional info on these? Google is fucking lobotomized lately.
What do you even need armor for in the first place you larper
>>65306998Yeah, they're diverted PLA plates like the rest of EDUN's schitt, you can buy them on Taobao. I remember seeing them on Chinese sites a year or two ago, but it's now commercially available. SiC+PE construction, 8.8lb for a 10x12 and 1.44" thick. They are strict single strike versus 12.7x108 B-32 API.The numbers check out fine but I don't have a BFD number and dunno the OEM, possibly Norinco.>>65307053Why do you need airbags in your car?
>>65307078Apples to oranges comparison. Just admit you like to larp and there is no real world practical use for armor for non leo/military. There's nothing wrong with playing pretend
>>65307149They're both things you don't need until the day you do. Better to have and not need than need and not have. I just ordered a slick PC I'll start wearing to the range because I can't guarantee the people in other bays aren't retarded. A good set of plates is $300 or less and lasts virtually forever if stored correctly. Apples to apples.
>>65306899RMA isn’t great by any means, but I think it’s one autist having a melty.
>>65306960>so ive only tried it with regular FMJ and of course it stops itYou shot it? And still expect the plates to protect you?
>>65307155>wears pc to the rangeHow embarrassing>doesnt shoot on blm/wma/his own landEven more embarrasing
>>65307198Exposing their constant bullshitting passes for a meltie these days? That's funny. Maybe they should try making an honest plate again. Then nobody would be having a "meltie.">>65307241Yeah I live in an... urbanish area. Sucks!
>rma defender gets ass kicked with facts and logic>switches to ad hominemspottery
>>65307502Have you noticed that there's one guy who starts shitting up threads as soon as the RMA criticism gets too heavy? It's literally every single time for years.
>>65307565I have, actually. Over in /gq/ you rail on RMA enough and the same guy shows up to bitch about AAAAGH THIS THREAD GOT TAKEN OVER BY /BAG/. /GQ/ IS DEAD. IT'S OVER, NOBODY POSTS GEAR EVEN.Then we post gear and he vanishes into air. I don't think it's the RMA paid shillposter on reddit but I know that guy lurks here.
Instead of doing this stupid deathrace into who can make a lighter plate using tricks, RMA can fix all their problems by just beating Hesco and gang on headroom.The Hesco 4403 loses to M2AP around 50ft/s above NIJ spec. Make a new 1155 that copies the 4403 layup, but beefs it up by 0.2lb. Repeat for every notable Hesco model. Then get everything on the NIJ CPL, and then do comparison videos using guntubers showing how much stronger the RMAs are versus Hescos. No undersized plates, no missing drop protection, no cheat rings. No tricks.Gilliam is about to undercut both their asses on price AND weight. Many people will value a tougher, more reliable plate over just pure weight savings.But RMA won't do that... pity.
>>65305020
>>65298956dude you can get a set of level 4 plates for like $100 and some 3A surplus vest for like $100 from quality american manufacturers
>>65308164>a set of level 4 plates for like $100>from quality american manufacturersDamn mfer what kinda crunk plates forged in the trenches of detroit are you buying?
>>65307489>Maybe they should try making an honest plate again.That would be great.>>65307502Where is this RMA “defense”? Please point it out.
>>65308506>That would be great.But not going to happen unless they're willing to do a total reversal on the current 1155 and 1165. Even the XRT is pretty questionable if you subject it to an NIJ 0101.06-style double drop (see Buffman test) and the ESRT for most purposes gets completely mogged by the Hesco M210.That leaves a bunch of PE plates that get their asses kicked by Militech and Gilliam. There's no redeeming plates in their current lineup.>Where is this RMA “defense”? Please point it out.Probably >>65305750, >>65305020, and >>65304860. Basically just cope that the plate being undersized isn't that bad even though it's something RMA very explicitly criticized a year before they started doing it themselves (see pic rel). Very hypocritical.
For another example of nominal sizing, see Highcom's 10x12 and SAPI M next to eachother. There is a 1.4lb difference between, for example, the "10x12" 4S17M and the 9.5x12.5 SAPI M version. 16% difference in weight. For the RMA 1155 GEN2, there is a 13% difference in weight.Highcom's 10x12 is really closer to a 9x11 and is in fact 0.2lb LIGHTER than the SAPI Small, measuring 8.75x11.75. The fact Highcom does this does not excuse RMA, especially when the margin between how Highcom does it and how RMA does it is only 3%. Guys like Gilliam are very upfront with sizing, and Hesco is usually very good about it too, although they had some issues with a guy's 3811s a little while ago.
>>65308570It does man there's no clear direction in it. I personally own ar500 steel plates with a coating I'd never count on working. At work I'm issued SAPI plates that are serialized and technically I can't leave with unless I'm on orders
>>65308606Basically it can be recapped like this:>Past: /gq/ is now /bag/ wearing /gq/ as a skinsuit.>Present:>1. Armor newbie is interested in buying Safelife, asks for help>2. Entire /gq/ crew of armor autists rolls in and gives Safelife's IIIA+ bundle the firing squad seventeen shots no 38>3. Safelife shill BTFO'd in a ridiculous shitstomp not seen since the Agilite dude in /gq/ years ago>4. Armor newbie buys Gilliam and other stuff, thanking the armor autists for their valiant efforts.>5. Armor autists bring up how sketchy the armor industry is, with examples>6. Guy asks about RMA's cheat rings>7. Armor anon explains how that's a past thing, but now they just undersize the plates completely>8. RMA defender bro rolls in and gets his cope beat with facts and logic>9. Armor autist in chief continues beating on RMA and Highcom for some reason>you are hereI'll cut it to you short, /k/ has a cadre of very elite armor autists and they maintain a naughty list of bad armor companies that they beat on regularly if brought up.
>>65308606>I personally own ar500 steel plates with a coating I'd never count on working.Steel is terrible, generally, and you're correct in assuming that won't work reliably. If it's AR500-brand AR500 your odds are worse.Some steel plates like the Caliber AV2 are "workable" if compared purely against bottom-barrel ceramics like the Highcom 4SAS4, first-gen RMA 1155, RMA 1145, and Protech 2014G that are either not drop-proofed or have very poor multi-hit.>with a coating I'd never count on working.How much do they weigh? If they're over 8.5lb odds are good enough the coating will hold at least for a few hits if applied correctly. The problem is that you're probably cooked versus M193 at 3,250ft/s +-50 and M855A1 is a no-go even though your plates are comparable to good IVs in weight.>At work I'm issued SAPI plates that are serialized and technically I can't leave with unless I'm on ordersI mean people do "surplus" those a lot if you check ebay. Wouldn't be hard for you to get a second set if you really wanted. Are they ESAPIs (green or sometimes blue) or the OG SAPIs?
>>65308211hesco and rma
>>65309100>hesco and rma4403s start at about $340/set on a good day. You're not getting any RMAs for under $200/set unless somebody somewhere still has old 1155s in stock, and they suck.
>>65308521That’s not defending RMA. That’s not even recommending buying them. That’s saying MY OPINION doesn’t think it’s as severe of a problem as you say it is. Which is exactly what I stated the first time if you could read. I’m not whatever RMA shill you think I am from /bag/ or /gq/.
>>65309500>Which is exactly what I stated the first time if you could read.>lemme just ad hom like a 15 year old lolololAnd as said before, it's actually a huge problem and the fact you're even trying to play it down is suspect. Look at >>65308549 and tell me that's not a problem. Are you seriously gonna argue that?RMA is only doing this because they want to cheat on weight. That alone is shitlist worthy, because there are companies that don't do this and thus, RMA is not worth anyone's time. The only people buying RMA plates are the tragically uninformed.This is besides the fact the 1155 and 1165 magically got lighter, and therefore, likely even more undersized.
Why not just wear 2 plates on top of each otherThats gotta be like nij IX at that point
>>65309753Gecko45 returns!This has been experimented with in the past, it's diminishing returns and generally not worth the weight.Example, if you take two 3/8" AR500 plates you'll get to about 18lb assuming both have good spall coats. This will probably handle M2AP but you're into ridiculous weight territory. If ceramics weighed over 18lb for a 10x12 they would be stopping 14.5mm AP, and I'm not talking B-32 I'm talking the real hard Chinese shit like DGJ02 APIDS.
>>65309120i picked up a few sets of hesco 4401MC for $100 per pair last year and same with RMA 1189 for touch more they are not hard to find. check botach and outbuyer and stop being a pretentious faggot this is the most glorious time to buy cheap armor because of the glut. get it now before the next panichttps://surplus.botach.com/hesco-model-3410-lvl-iv-plates-set-of-2-police-trade/?query_id=8a320195881aadfefe3b6fc4dcd95240https://surplus.botach.com/rma-armament-lvl-4-10x12-armor-plates-2-pack-model-1189-expired-police-trade/those were both in stock with hundreds of sets available for the past 2 years up until a couple months ago.
>>65308621They're doing a community service
>>65310406Homes the 3410s were one of the four problem Hescos (they had major NIJ FIT issues years ago, hence why there's a 3411) Botach sold after the warranties expired and the 1189s have a 1" cheat ring. You basically bought 8x10s masquerading as 10x12s.You goofed and should have done Militech RF2 Aluminas instead of the 3410s and Protech 2014MCs from HUDSONGUNNER versus the 1189s.
>>65310501Appreciated.
>>65310406>4401MCThis isn't a Hesco model number. There was the 4400MC unrelated, technically, to the 4400 which got NIJ suspended then reinstated, and then the 4401 which was single curve and replaced the old 4400.You got some kinda bootleg plates?
>>65310683yeah i just misrememberd the number. i got botht he single and multicurve version theyre constantly available for cheap
>>65311785The original single curve 4400s aren't great if you're buying the Botach plates. /gq/ seems to be in agreement they're the recalled 3410s, 3610s, 4600s, and 4400s from the NIJ FIT failures. Somehow they went out the back door at Hesco and Botach stalled until the warranties were all done.The 4400MC is however fine. 4401 is also solid.
>>65313826i dunno man whenever i see a set for $100 i buy a pair just to stack. always got family and friends or neighbors who might need spares some day if SHTF and theyre chepa enough
>>65314085Well, on one side the NIJ does encourage officers to wear suspended armor until it can be replaced, because if you're gonna get shot, shit armor is better than no armor. On the other, that's a lot of weight for unreliable kit. A pair of 4400s is nearly 16lb. Average redditor gets winded going up a set of stairs in those. Is your crew fit? If not, maybe grab everyone cheap IIIA panels (Botach should still have some for $20 a pop or so) and duct tape ghettovests. Save the plates for when your dudes are stationary and on defense.
>>65314119yeah i like grabbing cheap 3a too theres alwasy plenty of it around. botach has some for $100 right now too
>>65305750Not to take a victory lap, but RMA admitted in a buried subreddit post they did, in fact, make the plates smaller.>As many people noted during our first run of 1165 and 1155 Generation 2 plates last year, the finished plate ended up being a little bit larger than actual medium because we were using true-to-size ceramics and then wrapping them. That meant they ended up being a bit wider and longer than they should have been for a proper medium plate.>To rectify this, we shrunk the plate down by a fraction of an inch so that the finished and wrapped plates will be properly sized Medium to properly fit everyone's carriers, even if they don't have stretch material or a gusset in the plate bags.Note this is a total dodge, because they made the already undersized not-10x12 smaller too. The 9.5x11.5s should have no issue fitting in 10x12 platebags. Very sneaky shit.https://www.reddit.com/r/RMAArmament/comments/1t14o8z/may_2026_updates/?
bump
OP, update us when you get the 1635s in. Curious about Gilliam's turnaround time because Midwest and Apex are both sucking the D lately and the guy running Apex might end up doing major time for something totally unrelated.
>>65319187Gotta keep those bangers on hand for the babesTacticalEdgeAndArmor shipped pretty fast, stayed just ahead of their stated lead times for me, and have solid prices. Was going to go with Apex but didn't wanna risk issues with receiving things with what he's got going on
>>65322067Tactical Edge? Did you buy 4SAS4s? Christ man could have bought Gilliam 0425s for $240 negotiable.
>>65322067>Was going to go with Apex but didn't wanna risk issues with receiving things with what he's got going onHe's manning the customer service email personally now so I think his staff might have walked.I was told he sold the joint. Apparently not true...
>>65322099Good looking out, was never aware of this brand, and see why but likely would trust their service given what I've seen so far. I got some 4S17Ms for under $400 before taxes and such, and knew going into things that was about what I should expect for entry IV recognized plates. Not sweating the extra $1-200 on something I don't expect to own many sets of.Might just snag some from GARMS now though given their cost.
>>65322280Yeah, not gonna pretend I know whether or not he did those things, but it's concerning that the state is criminally on his case for reportedly flashbanging someone
>>65322425Yeah they're a newer outfit but have a strong selection, including the 8002 IV++ rated for tungsten 7.62x51 AP and even some .300 Winmag AP business.$628 a set if you want that one. Prices are negotiable since they're moving facilities and will have a new lineup soon.>>65322428The facts are pretty specific. I was expecting something would catch up to him but I figured it would be a fatality from the shitty 4SAS4s failing or someone suing because he falsely advertised some plates, which he does regularly and a lot of armor dealers do.Apex, Hoplite, and Midwest all falsely advertised the B-32 API rated LTC 28590 as Level IV, contradicting LTC's own spec sheets where M2AP isn't even listed, and even sold it as the current GEN-V SOCOM Tac Standalone plate when five minutes of research would immediately tell you that plate is the 28595, not the 28590.They then sold those fucks for mega money.
>>65322463Doubly duly noted. Asked them about sizes available and some other things but I'll see if they're willing to cut a deal. Honestly makes me wanna just pay their already incredibly fair asking prices. I'll certainly hunt for deals, but don't mind supporting the right businesses fairly.
>>65322513I'll probably be buying some of the RF1 plates or something to uparmor a Jinwudun IIIA ballistic skirt. Email them and if they accept your price you'll get an invoice.He can also do custom commissions. Any protection level in any size. I've debated on hitting him up for some .50 BMG plates since I have a Tasmanian Tiger PC that can accept 1.5" plates.
>>65322588This is a pretty great service. What a time
>>65322948Yeah, benefit of small business armor.
