A lot of countries have them.But everybody is afraid to use them on the front lines.Instead they send their 4th gen stuff.So far all the F-22 raptor has shoot down are some balloons.
>>65331024depends on your country and it's goals.are you a massive superpower that needs the world stable and trade flowing to maintain prosperity and the promise of taking others under your wing which allows you to base forces there making life difficult for any possible ideological or economic adversary anywhere around the world?then yes.are you less big but still relatively large, wealthy nation that also relies on stable trade routes and has the money to afford the best of the best so that lesser developed nations basically have no chance against you in air battle? then also yes.are you some small backwater that doesn't have any developed land worth stealing anyway and doesn't have any powerful, imperialistic neighbours? then no.
>>65331024> Aren't 5th gen figthers a huge waste of money?No> A lot of countries have them.They do not> Instead they send their 4th gen stuff.They do not> So far all the F-22 raptor has shoot down are some balloons.This is wrong.
>>65331024f35s are basically invisible flying awacs that can launch missiles u dont send awacs to shoot balloons
>>653310245th gen fighters are useless to an extent it would be a role way better suited to more expandable furtive loyal wingmensince these planes are so expensive to replace or maintain they cannot be upgraded to a rate that matches air defense capabilities, high end radars can't fit in the small nose cone, and are essentially jewels of technology, but that's not for a practical use, its just that on paper, from a seller's point of view, since these planes are better in most ways in isolation to every other plane it looks well on paper. However most militaries lack strategic thinking and they first need to get their shit kicked in to get their ideas straightenedrafale is still the most useful plane on market
>it sets in that China will never have modern jets>thirdies start to shriek that modern jets aren't real
>>65331286I don't know which part to laugh at first
>>65331304>ctrl+f "chi">only (You)You're mentally ill
>>65331307not an argument.
No, why?
Why china waste soo much money?
Why china soo wasteful with their money?
>>65331024No.There is a thread already for stupid questions
>>65331286>high end radars can't fit in the small nose coneis this guy really this retarded or is he just baiting?not even going to bother addressing the rest of this godawful post.
>>65331358that's a nice 4th gen aircraft you've got there, they really tried their best to make it look like a stealth aircraft.
>>65331024>But everybody is afraid to use them on the front lines.huh?hasn't Is real been using them pretty extensively?who is everybodywhat where and for what use are they afraid to use them?give an example
>>65331425retards think that just because they're not seeing the F35 that's 20 kilometers away from them and deep within enemy radar coverage automatically means that it isn't responsible for the explosion that happens 10 seconds later.keep in mind that out of thousands of sorties over the past 10 years 1 (one) F35 got hit, landed safely at it's own airbased, and this is is considered a great victory for thirdies.if people take this oppertunity to whine about how righteous or unrighteous le sandwar nr.5643 is i'm going to pop a vein, simple fact of the matter is the F35 can go completely unimpeded into deep radar coverage for years and strike shit with literally nothing stopping it, and the only time it's been hit is one IR missile getting extremely lucky.
>>65331411not an argumentyou people seem keen not to actually bother replying in good faith probably since you know I'm right
>>65331526>not an argumentnobody needs an argument against a statement that retardedthe radars inside the nose of the F35 and F22 are not measurably smaller than that of their non-stealth competitors, you're just a fucking idiot.
>>65331024>So far all the F-22 raptor has shoot down are some balloonsThe F-22 dropped JDAMs in Syria
>>65331024The F-35 is basically an American security hedge Same reason countries bought the F-104 en masse despite all of its problemsYou pay for American MIC in exchange of American securityWhen the F-45 shows up someday, if you want American MIC guarantees countries will buy them too no matter what
>>65331548>are not measurably smaller than that of their non-stealth competitorsmoving the goalpostthe size of a radar changes its resolution and range
>>65331660>moving the goalpostno, literally answering your extremely retarded "argument" that honestly didn't deserve a reply because it was that fucking retarded.>the size of a radar changes it's resolution and rangeand this is irrelevant because the F35 and F22 do not have smaller radars than their competitors, now shut the fuck up retard.
>Things my country can't make are a waste of money.Does that about sum it up?
>>65331660>rafale antenna diameter: 60 cm>F22 antenna diameter: 1 meteryou. are.a.fucking.retard.now.shut.the.fuck.up.
>>65331328You don't argue with jokes like "rafale is most useful plane, Saar", you laugh at them.
>>65331024>But everybody is afraid to use them on the front linesUm Israel and the US have used them in Iran. Prior to that there wasn't really many chances to use them. The F22 was used in Syria and before that there was what Libya?
>>65331327Be less predictable if you don't like getting caught.
>>65331758No, you're mentally ill. Seek professional help.
F-35 s dunked on chinese radar that were in Venezuela and Iran.
>>65331024The F-35 has been doing fine in its job as a bomber-hunter. F-22 though, trashing its assembly lines have ensured it'll pretty much remain a novelty as the sort of high-intensity war it was designed for would wear it out to extinction by its end.
>>65331286>Drones which get outperformed by WWII fighters can totally replace jet-powered precision interceptorsDronetards are almost as bad as reformers when it comes to praising shitty field performance as a boon
>>65331692>>65331711I'm gay and retarded its not fair to be mean to me like that
>>653310244.5 gen fighters are also useful. The USA now has the F-15EX, and it's better than the F-35 in a lot of ways. Popping enemy A2AD isn't one of those ways. We need other nations on board with our capabilities to defeat the A2AD of Russia and 3rd world shitholes aligned with Russia because that's the only really dangerous thing Russia has a lot of besides nukes.
>>65331804I'm surprised Congress didn't ask Northrop if they could build an assembly line for the YF-23 because Locksneed decided they wanted to toss out critically important stuff so we couldn't build any more of our 5th gen air superiority fighters.
>>65331870You have a very warped and uninformed view of how procurement works, as well as the history of the F-22
>>65331024>So far all the F-22 raptor has shoot down are some balloons.It hasn't been around in any areas where the enemy launches any actual adversaries.
>>65331886There haven't been any actual air to air capable adversaries. When is the last time someone fired a missile from the air at a US combat aircraft?
>>65331893I don't remember. Did migs get any missiles off against the F-14 scramble? That may have been the last time. Everything since seems like the same pattern of thirdies have no idea they're even being targeted before the missile impacts.
>>65331877I just remember people saying Lockheed couldn't build more F22 airframes because they tossed out some critically important molds or something like that, I'm sure it's steeped in bullshit. Why did we earmark over a trillion building the F-35 when we could have rolled that money into a F-22(EX) modernization program?
>>65331902Because a strike fighter has more utility than an air superiority fighter, especially when everyone refuses to engage you in the air? Are you seriously against the F-35 after so many years of it proving itself?
>>65331902Because it's better to have several F-35s instead of one F-22. It's more universally capable of an aircraft. The data link shit alone may as well be magic to anyone who doesn't have them.
>>65331906I think it's a great aircraft but it's not an air superiority fighter. I suppose that's why we had to develop the F-47. I understand the niche the F-35 fills, I just don't know why allied nations would necessarily care about popping soviet S-3/4/500 radars and launchers enough to want to put tens of billions into such a niche system. The Canadians don't want it, it's not a great aircraft for what they need. Russia just got its air force deleted, and while the F-35s easily took out Iranian SAM sites that were supposedly China's latest and greatest, where's the real value proposition for everybody else?The F-15EX is just a better all around aircraft when stealth isn't required.
>>65331902Lockheed stopped making F-22s because the government said it would never buy another one and wanted all their effort making F-35s. This happened around ~2009. They did not get rid of their tooling, and in fact spent a large amount of time interviewing line workers on how every process functioned in case a production restart was called for. There was no serious talk of this until things began heating up with China around ~2015/16. At that point every subcontractor who had supplied parts for F-22 had either gone out of business or found new work and no longer made those parts, as it had been the better part of a decade since they got any orders. At about the same time, contacts for the Aerospace Innovation Initiative, the NGAD demonstrator program, are signed. Numbers are run because there is some Congressional interest in why F-22 procurement can’t just be put in the budget. The answer is that rebuilding the supply chain to get Lockheed the parts to build more F-22s would be so expensive and take so long that we could have NGAD or we could have F-22. Naturally it is decided it would be smarter to spend that money to get NGAD through EMD rather than restart production on a decades old design. Similarly, to take YF-23 through EMD and start a production line for F-23 would be as expensive as funding NGAD, so there was never any interest in it. Lockheed did nothing to prevent the government from buying F-22. The government chose on their own to stop, and by the time there was any reason to think of buying more 6th generation fighters were already in development. There is an F-22 modernization and upgrade program running now, and it will add significant capability, but F-35 and F-47 are both much higher priority as they will both deliver much greater capability
>>65331926> I think it's a great aircraft but it's not an air superiority fighterThe F-22?Not an air superiority fighter?Are you actually retarded?
>>65331926dude was saying 3 smaller fighters is better than 1 super fighter, and wasn't calling the f35 an ASF
>>65331926> The Canadians don't want itPurely for political reasons. > it's not a great aircraft for what they needIt absolutely is, being a fairly fast, long range aircraft that has a powerful radar and is fairly robust as far as 5th generation fighters go.> where's the real value proposition for everybody else?Simple. It’s the best fighter for sale today, it’s cheaper than a souped up 4th gen, and the US has gone all in on it which means there will be a bunch of spare parts and technical support for several decades.
>>65331942Also, a hidden benefit of buying into a project that has big time US buy-in is that, in fifteen or twenty years when the US starts rolling out upgrades to an F-35 D-E-F standard, or Block Whatever, or Super F-35 or whatever nomenclature they use, pther countries can hop onboard rather than have to purchase whole new models.
>>65331926>air superiority fighterI hate the fighter mafia so much. You don't need some hyper maneuverable aircraft with a Vulcan. It's not 1966 anymore. The F47 will never actually be produced and instead will basically be a test bed for the actual new generation of fighters which will all be drones.
>>65331958There are budget line items for 6th generation integration for every weapon system that the F-35 employs that the F-22 cannot. Not a pound for air to ground died decades ago. Stop getting all your information from slop sources.
>>65331926It’s not an air superiority fighter, it just happens to be so good that it can easily beat most dedicated air to air fighters as well.
>>65331793Wasn't this because the Chinese engineers behind their stealth program lied about their own aircraft's RCS, and their MIC took those lies at face value, tuning their new anti-stealth radars to detect their domestic "stealth" fighters? I distinctly remember the head scientist behind one of their stealth fighters getting executed over this after Venezuela went down.
>>65331926>The Canadians don't want it,Who gives a shit about the contrarian leafs? The juice, Aussies and Euros are all aboard because it dunks on thirdies and ziggers.
>>65331926>it's not a great aircraft for what they need. Canada is run by boomers whose #1 priority in life is hating Donald Trump and the USA
>>65331073with the "taking under your wing" part including a noncompete clause
>>65332217>the country with a shrinking population has a shrinking economyChina is set to lose almost the population of France in the next decade based off current demographic trends btw. It’s difficult to say exactly how much worse it will get after that, just that current birthrates guarantee it will.
If F-35 are so good.How come Trump didn't use them to destroy 100% of the military forces in Iran?It means americans are afraid to use them "uhhh, what if one is shot down, it is over for us!!!"
>>65331910Because the F-35 is more greater than the F-22.Just look at them. The F-22 fuselage is mostly flat.While the F-35 has a lot of muscles and structures.F-35 looks strong.
>>65332263 You do not get how big a flex it is to use B-52 bombers on Iran?
>>65332195t. cried over Charlie and Lindsay dying
>>65332260Japan's economy collapsed after the US gave them the ultimatum of, "Either you make it collapse or we will."
>>65331931I was talking about the F-35, can you not read?
>>65332438It is entirely Japan’s fault that they maintained a deflationary spiral for almost 30 years.
>>65332438Japan's economy is in the shitter because 1, its workforce is old and retired, its birth rate/replacement rate are at China levels, 2, Japan failed to innovate and in many ways is much more protectionist of its workforce, it can't compete with SK and Taiwan as efficiently, and while it does still make many great exports...3, Japan is propping up a lot of companies that should have realistically failed a long time ago just to maintain their industry. Japan's debt/gdp is at China levelsThe whole USA putting the brakes on Japan thing is overplayed and not entirely why Japan's economy is stagnant. >>65332217the only 4 profitable Chinese provinces, good job. >>65332143i would have given Israel F-35s because of how well they sold just having them to the rest of the world. Israel is part of the reason everyone rushed in to buy F-16s, the heebs just fuck shit up when they get American tech. >>65331974it's true, it's just not the one-size-fits-all solution it's being sold as. It runs on internal fuel, has a very limited payload, and we don't have the wingman drones online yet. Right now it's like the F-16, we have it down to production costs, it's highly refined, deadly, and quick to manufacture.
>>65332084Yeah, and if you think that the US magically hit the only piece of Chinese gear that is affected by corruption like that, then I have some timeshares to sell you, suckerAlso aside from simple lying, there's no evidence to suggest that they do have anything close to the capabilities they claim, in any regard. They have repeatedly pursued mini-conflicts that do not use any of their implessive weapons, even when it made sense for them to do so (e.g. they were positioned closer than the US Navy when Houthis started firing on Chinese-flagged vessels, and instead they called in the US to help)
>>65332084>I distinctly remember the head scientist behind one of their stealth fighters getting executed over this after Venezuela went down.The chinkshill will inform you that the sentence is actually symbolic and in one year it will be commuted to life in prison, and that this means that China has no corruption.
>>65331358is this a video game image?
>>65332217>random seething about japanimplessive, did you tell your japanese granddaddy about this?
>>65331024Who do you expect to fight and what do they have?Cameroon doesn't need them because no likely enemy could defend against F-16s. China does need them because they will need to be able to attack ships, SAMs and fighters with modern AESA radars.If you have domestic manufacturing you always want to make the most advanced systems you can at least in minimal numbers to keep your engineers and builders sharp. Many countries have made the mistake over the decades of building a heap of "good enough" systems and not producing anything new for a long time leading to a skills shortage.
An entire /k/ thread all 68 posts of anons that don't know what the fuck they're talking about. Not one of them>natch it's a stealth fighter thread
>>65332217Those 4 Chinese provinces have to subsidize the other 27, everyone else bleeds money
>>65331776>Stop noooooticing
>>65331642>Same reason countries bought the F-104 en masse despite all of its problemsBeing the best interceptor in the 50s?
>>65331024Dumb third world anon here, tho one that knows his place and understands he's below first worlders, since this is a thread related to air force can any anon here shed light on two questions of mine?1 Do pilots have specific aircraft allocated to them that they always use? Like for example, will an F-35 pilot always fly the very same F-35 (provided the plane isn't shot down or crashes in an accident, tho that's unlikely since F-35 is a good plane) whenever he's on sortie? 2 I heard from a friend about the F-15 air superiority incident or something like that, forgot the exact name, but it basically states that after the US made the F-15, the soviets and now russians never really managed to catch up due to how superior it is, even to this day being above even the best of the best of russian fighters. Is this true or just a myth?thank you in advance
>>65333439>one that knows his place and understands he's below first worldersWhat the fuck. What kind of slaves mentality is this.Rejoice Anon, the age of first worlder dominance is coming to an end thanks to their degeneracy.
>>65333452Eh I don't mind, I don't like how my peers behave here and I understand it can be infuriating to others and I also understand that my english is awful and gives my origins as a third worlder easily, so I like to come out in a position of honesty, so other anons can understand that I'm not here to shit up the place, it makes it easier to have honest conversation
>>65333466Then you dont have to place yourself below first worlder. They are our equal. english is just a means of comunication not sign of social status.
>>65333452>>65333485What country?
>>65333536Revealing it will create so much seethe here. Can you guess it?
>>65333452that's not really a slave mentality because you don't need to be enslaved to be incomparably towered over by the white man, not even with him really doing anything but existing within his usual lifestyle>>65333439>Do pilots have specific aircraft allocated to them that they always use?yes, pilots train on specific planes, although they also fly other ones as part of their training. squadrons have pilots and specific planes assigned to them. this is the case not just for pilots but for ground crews doing maintenance also.>will an F-35 pilot always fly the very same F-35pilots often share a single plane between each other but this is often the case.>I heard from a friend about the F-15 air superiority incident or something like that, forgot the exact nameOperation Mole Cricket 19? yeah, that one made it pretty obvious.>after the US made the F-15, the soviets and now russians never really managed to catch up due to how superior it isUS planes had dominated long before the F-15 but with it came the current era of virtually unmatched superiority, with the only case of a russian plane netting a kill on NATO 4th gen being a foxbat ambushing an F-18 because of IFF confusion.
>>65333536Brazil>>65333592Thank you for the comprehensive answer, may God bless you and your country
>>65331024>Are 5th gens useless?No. A more interesting question would have been, given the era they were in development, should the 5th generation have been skipped and efforts made to leapfrog to 6th gen?
>>65333452>t-the age of first worlder dominance is coming to an end!!!HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA>thanks to their degeneracyHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>65331024>chinks can't build 5th gen shit>Oh wow gwailo 5th gen fighters are a waste of money stop building them!Can you be any more transparent?
>>65331434>simple fact of the matter is the F35 can go completely unimpeded into deep radar coverage for years and strike shit with literally nothing stopping itBro an F-35 got hit by a fucking AIM-9P launched from a Kei truck a few weeks into an Iran campaign and you're still spouting this absolute hilarity. Actual cattle. Do you have a parasocial relationship with American airpower or something?
>>65333439Anon, 95% of the retards on this board shouting "muh turdie muh firstie" are noguns Mexicans and are thus less than human. They exist to be pointed at and mocked, not appeased.
>>65333984>b-but what about the only incident we can keep mentioning!sweetheart, the F35 was dunking on iranian military installations for years before that.you're literally proving my point lmao.>t-this a-absolute hilaritythen why are you crying? you don't seem happy.a-actual cattle!i'm not a shill for some third world shithole though, that's you>inb4 i-israel bootlicker!i don't like israel, and i think this war is retarded, doesn't stop the F35 from dunking on thirdie heads unimpeded, this is the serbian nighthawk incident all over again, except this time the enemy missile was so impotent it couldn't even down the actual aircraft.>noooo telling the truth is not allowed!!!i have no particular love for the US airforce in particular, nor the US itself, i just live in the real world, and in the real world the F35 is one of the most unstoppable aircraft in the world.
>>65334002>unstoppable aircraft>actually very much stoppable by an AIM-9P clone from 40 years ago>first major war it takes part in is a total loss against muh heckin turdieYou can like an aircraft and not have it be the bestest ever ever ya know. Aircraft design has been basically meaningless since Vietnam anyway.
>>65333585So an irrelevant shithole that is objectively inferior to the US, lower your tone.
>>65334008>Stopped>Because one caught a straylmfao
>>65334008>total lossAh the old "we wanted to lose our entire economy, military, and nuclear program while the US runs a tollbooth on the Strait."
>>65334029That anon is not me and his behavior is exactly the reason I feel ashamed of my peers in this space, see >>65333673 for the answer
>>65334043Nah Brazil is fine and that's why I left you out.
>>65331024F-22 is T-14 tier /x/ vaporware./k/ will deny this because they are Americans but consider this>shown on shows>Bombarded some shitty thirdies with no AA>shot down a balloon>Somehow undisputed king of aerial warfareLook, Americans make many great things. F-14, F-16, F-15, F-35, but F-22 ain't one.
>>65334008I dont know a single person on earth who would genuinely rather live in iran over america during the iran war. Aircraft appear to matter a great deal
>>65334036By an objective metric, that F-35 was stopped by the SAM hitting it so the F-35 is not unstoppable. It's still the best plane in the world so I dunno why you're getting so upset over it.>>65334040Man, its really impressive how Iran can keep Hormuz closed and drive the US President into schizophrenic AI slop posting on TRUTH SOCIAL without a military or economy. Must be high level Persian rug magic or something.
>>65334065>imagine being this wrong
>>65334008>unstoppable aircraft>has only been hit once by enemy forces in it's entire career, with an IR missile getting extremely lucky at very close range>doesn't even down the aircraft, lands safely back at airbaseso yeah, pretty much unstoppable, as i said.>first major warsweetheart, it's been involved in thousands and thousands of sorties directly over iranian air defenses and that of other countries long before this war started, and even after the many many sorties they've completed during this poorly planned boondoggle, they've still only hit one (1).>is a total lossthen how did this total loss fly back to it's airbase?>you can like an aircraft and not have it be the bestest everit's one of the bestest so far, in strike missions it's basically unmatched, and in air-to-air engagements it is matched/exceeded pretty much only by the F22.you realize that you can make statements that are just true right? like >zywoo is one of the best awpers of all timeor>brazil has won the most world cupsyou don't have to get so upset about it, it's just true.will the F35 be dethroned some day by a better multirole stealth aircraft?sure, eventually, but right now it's pretty much on top of the world.>o-oh it's all meaningless anyway why botherthen why the fuck are you a part of the conversation? if you're so retarded as to think that aircraft development doesn't matter why do you get so angry when a better aircraft proves itself to be a better aircraft?
>>65331157retard boomer postelaborate on any or all of your claims pleaseif you say some gay boomer shit like "i'm not responsible for teaching you" then you are conceding the point btw
>>65334065>yeah sure every american fighter made before or since has been incredible but this one wasnt used very much so its not good at allThis seems like an overcorrection, i absolutely agree the F-22 is not a massively significant strategic asset, but we have zero reason to believe it wasnt incredibly capable for its time. We used them against basically every enemy we went up against while it was our top stealth fighter, and its largely superceded by the F-35 these days. The T-14 is russia’s claimed modern MBT. It would only be a logical comparison to the F-22 if Russia made a new, fancier tank than the T-14 that was wildly successful. They havent.
>>65334065>F-22 i-is v-vaporwareis this the mentally ill SU-57 shill that had a meltdown not too long ago?wrong, you have no argument. end of discussion.>/k/ will deny falsehoods because they are not truecorrect.>made everyone so fucking scared of US airpower that lesser thirdie powers basically haven't tried to start any air battles with us since it was made operational>numerous recorded instances of it hanging over the shoulder of some enemy bandits just waiting for them to throw the first punch so that they can rape them.yeah i'm thinking you're just mad, i'm not an american, i just live in the real world.
If you have smart leaders any plane will do
>>65334073He said “one of the most unstoppable aircraft in the world” so one being damaged really doesnt refute his claim seeing as nearly every other combat aircraft has lost multiple airframes to enemy fire. Its clearly among the least stoppable aircraft of all time seeing as its only been “stopped” once in tens of thousands of sorties.
>>65334070All aircraft do now is sling standoff munitions or drop bombs on the frontline before scurrying back under friendly aircover. Planes are just too valuable to risk sending into dangerous situations. See Ukraine. A2A kills are very rare and are only done at BVR ranges. Its why we keep the F-15 and F-16 around. F-35's stealth is basically meaningless.
>>65334083>N-NOOOO SPOONFEED ME!!!!!nta, but no, eat shit faggot.t. zoomer.>n-noooo only boomers can deny my delusions!!!!nope, pretty much everyone disagrees with you because you're wrong.
>>65334108i'm guessing he was a bit mentally frazzled from being angry and didn't properly read my post, give him some slack.
>>65334112>stealth is useless, thats why stealthy US planes can flatten iran unopposed while russia loses dozens of unstealthy planes after literal years of SEADOkay. Ill still pay extra for stealth, thanks.
>>65334092>>numerous recorded instances of it hanging over the shoulder of some enemy bandits just waiting for them to throw the first punch so that they can rape them.F-5sbombingCampBuehring.jpg>>65334108Most of those sorties were F-15s and F-16s slinging standoff munitions or dropping JDAMs on the border regions. There's little to evidence of extensive F-35 use over Iranian airspace, and even if there was, the war was a total failure so the I guess the F-35 really isn't that great, huh.
>>65334112>sling standoff munitions or drop bombswhich is easier to do when you can just slip through radar coverage to get close enough to do that.>planes are too valuable to risk sending into dangerous situationswrong, that's literally the reason why the F35 exists, it has gone into "dangerous situations" thousands of times and come back unscathed where 4th gens would get lit up and destroyed within minutes.>see the conflict where neither side has any stealth aircraft, any good EW aircraft nor any real proper SEAD doctrineyou sound like a fucking idiot. neither side can afford or build those things, dipshit.midwits and pretending the ukraine conflict is every war ever from now on, name a better duo.>F-35's stealth is basically meaninglessobjectively wrong.
>>65334131Mainly done by emptying our stockpiles of JASSMs and Tomahawks, not really with F-35s flying 10 hour sorties from Jordan and refueling twice to drop two (2) JDAMs (accomplish nothing).
>>65334043Brazilians are funny, self aware, not a face culture as far as I can tell, a lot of you speak English, and you like big revolvers. That's a far cry from being an Achmad or an Ivan.
>>65334138>theres little evidence of F-35 usage so its bad>the war where the F-35 was apparently barely used has strategically vague war goals so the F-35 is badIdk man zero shootdowns despite the Us apprently horribly losing a war is crazy good numbers. Usually when people lose a war their air force gets pretty decimated, so i guess the F-35 is incredible. The iranian air force being almost completely destroyed despite them winning seems to be firther evidence of this.
>>65334138>We bombed an empty supply tent, America is lostIran is a rubble pile and it's getting worse, do you think just saying America lost is going to manifest it into reality?
>>65334138>completelyunrelatedtowhatwasbeingsaid.jpgi accept your concession.pretty clear at this point that you're not some "neutral observer" that just gosh darnit wants those stupid people to stop talking about those stupid stealth aircraft.you're just an actually deluded retard who gets angry at the superiority of stealth aircraft and is trying to discredit them because whatever shithole you live in doesn't have them.>t-there is little evidenceexcept for all of those videos showing F35's targeting things deep within iranian airspace far beyond the range of a Jdam being launched from the border of course.seriously, you are just deliriously mad at the F35 for no reason, check yourself before you wreck yourself son.
>>65334112>stealth is basically meaninglessCurious how all of these posts cropped up when China realized it would never have a stealthy jet.
>>65334145>our
Latest iteration of "F-35 is a $1T boondoggle" Leftist shills constantly screeched years ago. The script's authors were just as obvious then as it is now.>One F-35 limped back home. Great Iranian victory!!!How far you've fallen since we lost hundreds of Phantoms over Vietnam.
>>65334145>thirdie dropping 1 (one) F-5 dumb bomb payload is proof america cannot defend itself>hundreds of american bombing missions with JDAMs and glide bonbs are proof america cant meaningfully attack with aircraftYou know what? I accept this. America is such a league of its own that such insane double standards are perfectly fair. We must do better. I will not rest until one american fighter can solo an entire enemy country like in ace combat. God bless.
>>65334152>For no reasonOh he has one.
>>65334147Never said the F-35 is bad, retard-kun. I actually said its the best plane in the world. Do try to keep up. Also America lost more planes than Iran.>>65334149Failing all your war objectives and being left in an objectively worse position compared to pre-war conditions is a loss. Hate to break it to you.>>65334152>except for all of those videos showing F35's targeting things deep within iranian airspace far beyond the range of a Jdam being launched from the border of course.May we see them? Majority of deeper Iran strikes were done with standoff munitions since an F-35 in stealth mode can carry a grand total of two (2) JDAMs. F-35s used were likely used for interception.
>>65334145>n-not really with F35's flying 10 hour sorties from jordan and refueling twicethey do in fact do that, and they also fly from numerous other airbases all around the middle east>a-accomplish nothingexcept hitting military targets with pinpoint precision of course.you're very clearly emotionally compromised dude, i have no dog in this race, i don't consider this war a success, but it's very obvious you're doing the thirdie thing again of>l-le US came at them with ALLLL their might and they LOST!which is not true in any capacity.>US wages exclusively an air war against iran, with very little preplanning because trump is a baka>US barely loses any aircraft>extreme damage to iran's military is caused, US wins the actual kinetic exchange>winning this kinetic exchange does not garuantee the achievement of their objective because that would require employing a politically untenable ground conflict>"s-so that means they lost the kinetic exchange then!"nope, they didn't, they just jumped into a stupid war without thinking and then didn't account for what it would take to actually accomplish their goals.
>>65334166They got brain damage when the great socialist hope fell in Venezuela, or else in the riots.
>>65334113i accept your concession
>>65334172>never said the F35 is badyou have been lying about it's capabilities for a solid 40 minutes now, so i doubt that.>america lost more planes than iranwell yeah, iran had already lost most of it's airforce in previous exchanges, kind of hard to own the iranian airforce than israel and the US have already done.>n-no it didn't happenlol.
>>65334172>Objectively worseYou mean we wanted Iran to have: an Ayatollah who isn't made of cardboard, an intact government, an intact economy, control over the Strait, a military, an air force, a navy, and a nuclear program? Those things that got deleted?>America lost more planes than IranAnd 1000000 Boris Johnsons died on Snake Island, saving Putin's bootyhole.
>>65334183>n-no ui accept your concession, you have lost and are completely emotionally compromised.
>>65334177>fly from numerous other airbases all around the middle eastNo, they mainly flew from Jordan or KSA. Other bases were emptied of planes because lmao Iran drones.>extreme damage to iran's military is caused, US wins the actual kinetic exchangeCouldn't even suppress a single Iranian missile city award.>>65334166You're the tards constantly screeching that le F-35 is le undetectable lol.>>65334185>well yeah, iran had already lost most of it's airforce in previous exchangesZero proof of this btw. Strange how we keep seeing Iranian planes pop up despite being decimated 40 times over. Here's an Iranian MiG-29 that escorted Khamenei's body xd.>>65334186>an intact government, an intact economy, control over the Strait, a military, an air force, a navy, and a nuclear program?They have all of these things? What planet are you on?
>>65334138Major cope lolInbred?
>>65334211Your parents were first cousins kek
>>65334211It doesn't stop being real when you close your eyes and lie to yourself.
>>65334211>were emptied of planes because lmao iran dronesno, because those countries wanted to stay neutral and requested the US to abandon those airbases temporarily, the US obliged.iran then struck a bunch of neutral countries who weren't part of the conflict because iranians and their shills are completely fucking retarded lmao. good job pissing everyone off for no reason.>n-no, e-extreme damage to i-iran's military w-was not causedcould you say that even more pathetically next time so i can keep laughing at it?it was, iran's military was hit very hard, numerous ammo stockpiles, aircraft, command and control centers, radar sites, and other military targets were hit.>y-you are the tards constantly screeching that le f-35 is le undetectable!!!no, that's a strawman that you're attacking because you're a fucking retard, you'll notice i don't use absolute statements, but the fact that the F35 is nearly undetectable is true, considering the reality that what it took to damage, not even destroy one, was a single IR missile battery getting extremely lucky.>z-zero proof of this btwother than the fact that a bunch of F14's were seen getting pancaked in previous conflict with iran and numerous airbases of theirs were struck.every time you desperately screech>n-nomy boner gets a little bit bigger.
>>65334211>We can TOTALLY shoot down F-35s if we want to!!!
Can someone tell me how the f35 radar compared to ship mounted ones?
>>65334280Smaller but can reach somewhat higher elevation
>>65334250>iran then struck a bunch of neutral countries>neutralWonder where those ATACMS and PrSM missiles came from.>you'll notice i don't use absolute statementsMost of this thread does and that's why I mock them.>could you say that even more pathetically next time so i can keep laughing at it?Iran's primary mode of power projection, its missile cities and mosquito fleet, were not degraded in any meaningful way and are fully operation and active right now, bombing American bases and keeping Hormuz closed. Meanwhile, America is running this war from fucking Ramstein because all of our bases are just Iranian missile food. Who's military has been degraded more?>other than the fact that a bunch of F14's were seen getting pancaked in previous conflict with iran and numerous airbases of theirs were struck.Trust me goy, those F-14s that have been sitting out in the hot Iranian sun for literal years, not ever moving once, are DEFINTELY 100% fully operational aircraft and not stripped airframes. We're way too smart to fall for decoys.This F-14 landing a couple weeks ago is just AI, don't look at it.
>>65334266BROZZER AGAIN PRAISE BE TO ALLAH DURKA DURKA MOHAMMAD JIHAD WE HAVE GOTTEN MORE THAN JUST THE ONE SNEAKY JEWISH WHALE! A SHOE UPON THE PAPER SATANS!
>>65334266>>65334291Funny how I've never seen official Iranian media or Iranian officials use AI slop as proof for kills yet the actual literal President of the United States posts a non-stop stream of AI slop on his account as proof of his claims of total destruction of the Iranian military.
>>65334280See >>65334287They will both bake testicles in front of them
>>65334280the F35's radar is much smaller, has a much lower power draw, and operates in a different spectrum (X-band compared to the the S-band of those large shipborne AESA search radars like your picrel.)the F35's radar is designed for high getting high-resolution weapon's grade tracks of both air and ground targets with a minimal chance of it's signal being intercepted. it can track dozens of targets at the same time out to distances likely exceeding 300 kilometers.the shipborne radars on for instance the arleigh burke are meant for shitting out absolute fucktons of electromagnetic radiation in all directions and getting good solutions of 100's of tracks at the same time from very extreme ranges, the main limiting factor being the horizon, it can track ballistic missiles from thousands of kilometers away but only once they're above the horizon.
>>65334297SLOP, HOW DARE YOU! INSHALLAH BOOM BALLAH MY SHOE AWAITS YOU!
>>65334303Couldnt they use the same principle behind this to get a return on sea skiming cruise missiles?
>>65334288>most of this thread doesnot really, i've seen most people here agree that the F35 is an incredibly powerful aircraft that's very hard to beat, but not invincible, just better than all it's competitors, which is true.>were not degraded in any meaningful wayis that why iranian missile attacks started fizzling out after a while?look you can deny blatantly true instances of missile stock being hit but that won't make it not true.>who's military has been degraded moreiran's, by far, why are you so delusional about this?>all our bases are just iranian missile foodnope, they're not.>t-trust me goy>n-no you're a jew because you're not falling for my propaganda!i'm not an american, i'm not a jew, i think the war is a dumb idea, it's just that i don't blatantly swallow propaganda talking points like you do.the problem with you, and the reason you keep getting dunked on by absolutely everyone in every thread you enter, is because you keep trying to use doublespeak to twist>the US lost for political reasonsinto>t-the US would lose to s-sandals ackshually b-because they decided not to start a ground war and iran wasn't raped hard and onesidedly enough for my tastesyou try to extract statements on the actual physical, kinetic and technological capability of both armies out of political considerations that make achieving it's goals impossible for the US, this is dishonest and annoying even for neutral observers who just want to discuss the conflict in peace.whenever you get called out on this it's always>w-well the us still lost so whateverno, not whatever, you obnoxious rat, i AGREE with you, the US lost the conflict, but it's not "whatever" for you, the actual real, honest, facts-based conclusion is not enough for you, you have to masturbate a new alternative reality into existence and whenever it's questioned you flip back to>y-yeah well it doesn't matter if they lost politically they still lostclearly it matters a lot to you.
>>65334329>get a returnprobably not a return that's useful beyond what that radar can do, which is tell you:>something is somewhere beyond the horizon somewherewhich isn't very useful actionable data.what the navy actually uses to detect these things beyond the horizon are AWACS aircraft.
>>65334340If they re outside a carriers range do they have any way to get a return?
>>65334350>if they're outside the carrier's rangeyou mean the carrier's radar range?i mean the majority of the work is not being done by the carriers onboard radar but by that combination of destroyer escort radar and both ship launched and land-based AWACS aircraft.those ships, aircraft as well as other land-based radar sites could often be much closer to the attacking sea-skimmer than the carrier itself, so it depends on what you mean by carrier's range, do you mean like the range at which a flight of fighters from the carrier could go out and intercept the sea-skimmer?
Su-57s are 5th gen aircraft and they get used against Ukraine regularly. however it doesn't seem like they're doing anything that couldn't be done with Russia's best 4th gen planes (Su-45, Su-34, MiG-31)anyway "5th gen" is a good marketing label but not a useful classification
>>65334376>SU-57's are 5th gen aircraftwrong.>and they get used against ukraine regularlynot really, their sortie rates are ass and they only do what every other non-stealth aircraft in the russian arsenal does, which is launch glidebombs from over the border.>it doesn't seem like they're doing anything that couldn't be done by russia's best 4th gen planescorrect, because the SU-57 itself is also a 4th gen plane.>5th gen i-is a good marketing label but not a useful classificationconsidering 5th gens keep dunking on 4th gens that seems to be very not true actually.
>>65334430that fucking retard is really out here in 2026 trying to create a comparison between the US airforce and the russian airforce as if the two are in any way comparable LMAO.>w-well if russia can't do it then surely nobody else can!
>>65334365Outside the range of friendly awacs
>>65334455yeah, at that point the only way you're detecting it is with land-based early warning sats that might be in a better position to detect it, or you might be able to see at least the launch from a satellite, since that usually uses an SRB, but that's about as far as it goes.
>>65334430>>SU-57's are 5th gen aircraft>wrong.congrats on outing yourself as a contrarian retard>>and they get used against ukraine regularly>not really, their sortie rates are ass they get used pretty regularly these days>and they only do what every other non-stealth aircraft in the russian arsenal does, which is launch glidebombs from over the border.I have never, ever seen a Su-57 with glide bombs equipped. Could be just me though.>>5th gen i-is a good marketing label but not a useful classificationconsidering 5th gens keep dunking on 4th gens that seems to be very not true actually.if you consider the yak-130 a 4th gen then they dunked on 4th gens exactly once. otherwise, they haven't.anyway nobody has a useful definition of what a 5th generation fighter is. there's basically just consensus that a 5th gen is a plane from the list [F-22, F-35, J-20, J-35, Su-57] and people trying to make up a definition just so that it fits the list. "5th-gen" is useless for understanding what the planes can actually do.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifth-generation_fighter
>>65331808>almost as bad as reformersNo, they're far worse.
>>65331804I’ll always hate Obama for that. That retard purposefully fucked future generations out of the Super Raptor and C/E models for nothing.
>>65335332>c-contrarian!No i’m living in the real world, you’re contrarian shilling for that proven to be unstealthy 4th gen.>they get used pretty regularly these daysFor an aircraft that they have so little of, perhaps, they also don’t do anything that actual 5th gens can do.>NOOOOO STOP IT 5TH GENS DONT EXIIIIST!They do, and their existence makes you mad lol.>there’s basically just consensusArtificial consensus based on constant shilling and visual cues only lol.F22 and F35 are the only truly stealthy aircraft on that list.
