So anyway what advantage do Cruise missile have over balistic missile and vice versa?
>>65339258cruise missiles are cheaper and may be harder to detect if they ride close to the surfaceballistic missiles are faster
>>65339261>ballistic fasterAnd better payload.
>>65339261What if ae get one of those scramjet/ranjeet cruise missile though
>>65339261>may be harder to detectWhy does it matter if you can detect a ballistic launch when it's over an order of magnitude more complex to actually shoot it down?
>>65339282that's why we have both anon.
>>65339266And usually much harder to intercept.
>>65339258Bad idea. Monke can claim they thought it was a nuclear missile and use it as an excuse to drop a nuke themselves
>>65339258tomahawks can loiter, circle around, loiter, and play peek-a-boo with HVTs, ballistic missiles are hitting something.
>>65339321That's the most retarded thing I'll read all day. Ukraine doesn't have nukes, everyone knows Ukraine doesn't have nukes, and puccia has been using "it's totally not a nuke" nuclear capable missiles for years now and crowing about it.
>>65339321Bad idea. Zlonsky can claim they thought it was a nuclear missile and use it as an excuse to drop a nuke themselves
>>65339258please please god it would be so fucking funny if Ukraine got ICBMs working
>>65339258Please, Ukraine! Please bomb Russia's space program into an unrecoverable oblivion!
>>65339282>Why does it matter if you can detect a ballistic launch when it's over an order of magnitude more complex to actually shoot it down?Because a man likes to have options.
>>65339474ROSCOSMOS is genuinely fucked already.
>>65339442>hello, Khartron?>are you still of having plans for RS-16?>tak, four thousand by next week
>>65339282>detect a ballistic launchI seriously doubt Russia has the radars left to actually detect the launnch.
>>65339474If it got blown up that might be seen as an excuse for why they're not doing jack-shit
>>65339282https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_drone_attack_on_Benjamin_Netanyahu%27s_residenceA low flying tomahawk with the rigjt mission planning could have killed Netanyahu, a balistic missile will just result in him relocatinf.
>>65339551I will provide a counter-example:- when ukies launch drones at russia, they have their planes take off from the airfields (e.g. in Engels) to avoid getting hit, since they have the time to do so, since the drones are slow;- a ballistic missile would take ~2 minutes to reach the same airfield and would fuck up the planes in question, leaving no time to remove them once the launch is detected;
>>65339590Given Russia's careless losses of things like the A-50's, never making the A-100's they might not even get any kind of warning in some areas.That shit could just turn up, slap their arse and call them Natasha
This reminds me. Isn't that self imposed medium range missile ban we signed with Russia expired now? You'd think we'd start working on something of our own, maybe even a smaller air launched one like Khinzal.. but it seems all the military is interested in is ground launched tomahawks
>>65339601i mean without AWACS they'll still get warning, it'll just be far too late.
>>65339590Isn't constantly having to take off and land a risk to the planes as well? Guess the pilots get a lot of practice at least.
>>65339601They still at least one A-50 working. That's how they've recently got lucky with shooting down 5 out of 5 Flamingo missiles.
>>65339612Yes, but less of an issue than staying there and getting hit. But overall there's a reason why planes aren't usually kept at Engels long-term and just are sent there before an attack to get armed with missiles.
>>65339612It introduces wear and tear to the engine, airframe, landing gear, etc. as well as wasting fuel that is increasingly becoming harder to come by these days
>>65339442they don't need ICBMs for striking their neighbour they share land border with
>>65339606Precision Strike Missile (PrSM) is sorta the bigger boy version of the ATACMS fired off the old HIMARS
>>65339618Russia is pretty big, there are refineries and airfields in Siberia
>>65339606The US is. PrSM is in production and issued for deployment.It's the yuros who don't have a ballistic missile design yet. The Bongs, Frogs and Krauts all have programmes but no designs have been specced. I think they'll buy some PrSM as a stopgap.
>>65339619PrSM is actually smaller and with less payload. It's cool and all, but we definitely need something that can throw more mass from further range
>>65339618My friend, consider the following
>>65339618Also consider this
>>65339635>throw more mass from further rangeDark Eagle
>>65339650Awesome
>>65339614Mind you, if they've got more than two-three capable of working and one up in the air is still a hilariously bad track record for early warning and integrated AA defense hub!>>65339635Its definitely something of an intermediate between tactical-strike and mid range strategic But the USA had heaps of med-range stuff in their bag of tricks that just got shut down, panned with the agreements and could pop back up into active development again.The fact the gulaghomo south decided to just let-fly with not keeping them in the box, violating the treaties and stuff is some remarkable hubris
>>65339662>The fact the gulaghomo south decided to just let-fly with not keeping them in the box, violating the treaties and stuff is some remarkable hubrisTheir entire worldview simply boils down to capability=willingness. They see Western countries unwilling to do something, which in their mind translates to being completely unable
I wonder how long will it take before they roll out their own hypersonic wunderwaffe.
>>65339606>You'd think we'd start working on something of our ownTwo weeks after the treaty disintegrated the US released footage of a Tomahawk being launched from a ground-based cell and I would be amazed if the BGM-109G hasn't already quietly been reincarnated in a makeshift way; on top of the Gryphon (RIP in peace you were too pure for this world) the Patriot and the Pershing II AND the Dark Eagle can all basically be summed up as slightly different flavors of "what if we used an HEMTT to tow a TEL".
>>65339691> BGM-109G hasn't already quietly been reincarnated in a makeshift wayPretty much is with Typhon
>>65339696Shit, I completely forgot that that existed.Pity it's so fucking ugly though the Gryphon was beautiful.
>>65339705>Gryphon was beautifulCorrect>>65339683>They see Western countries unwilling to do something, which in their mind translates to being completely unableThey are partially correct. What use is a weapon if you don't have the guts to use it?
>>65339590Reports of a Tu-95 destroyed at Engels now anyway. Don't even need ballistics to do it, it seems..
>>65339710It was a special operation to hit one plane. Ballistic would be able to hit all/most planes on the airfield without having to do much.
>>65339708Not building something you don't immediately need =/= unwilling to use it. In fact it's quite the opposite and can easily turn into a "everything looks like a nail" problem if you have something with no immediate need for
Is this their 'own' ballistic missile or one of the three the Bongs made and gave to them?
>>65339728It's a domestic shitbox of a missile which is based on the cloned aerodynamics profile (to skip R&D time) of an S300 interceptor.
>>65339733Ah OK. Because the Bongs made Crossbow (MBDA UK), TigerShark (MGI Engineering), and a propeller-driven design (Rotron Aerospace) and deliberately made them without US components so Trump couldn't cry. The goal was to give them to Ukraine and I assume for them to make them themselves, or to give them to 'friendly' nations to make instead.
>>65339705Gryphon definitely looked better, but I give typhon a pass because individual launchers can carry a mixed bag of Tomohawk and SM-6. Giving crazy flexibility to what they can do when the situation calls for it
>>65339735>>65339733>>65339728Wait, my bad. None of those were ballistic, just cruise.
Demilitarization status?
>>65339442that would set an interesting precedent. has any icbm, conventional or nuclear ever been used in anger? anyway, us and eu would never allow it.
>>65339735>so Trump couldn't cryGet your TDS seen to; ITAR-free has been a brit procurement spec for like a decade now
>>65339726>Not building something you don't immediately need =/= unwilling to use it.NTA but global turdies aren't convinced because the West has beenbtoo soft on them and retreated from multiple red lines and even their own borders for years now, and still show no indication of changing.If you don't even have the spine to enforce immigration and border laws, you'll have a hard time convincing people you will drop a ballistic missile on them.
>>65339755Yeah man, totally 'TDS'. Nothing to do with European countries worrying that Trump will throw a fit if they give weapons to Ukraine that use US parts. It's not like Bloomberg et al reported this was the reason. It was 'TDS'. It is only 'TDS'. There is nothing else than 'TDS'. All these massive governments and military companies are suffering from 'TDS'. Are you paid to just post that over and over again whenever somebody mentions Trump or something?>Unlike Storm Shadow, the new systems will not contain U.S.-made components or depend on American data, allowing them to operate independently of Washington.>The requirement reflects growing concerns among European governments about reliance on U.S. military technology as President Donald Trump's administration reassesses America's security commitments on the continent.>Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth recently announced a six-month review of the U.S. military presence in Europe, fueling concerns that Washington could reduce support for European allies.
>>65339750Russia shot a few at Ukraine.
>>65339755>TDSnot a real thing, you are literally faling for a NYT meme from 2008
>>65339781those were irbm's though, not true icbm's.
>>65339770>Bloomberg et al said it, it must be true
>>65339786The headline of OP's post doesn't say ICBM, it just says ballistic. Chances are it's just the Sapsan missile, which is basically a super small missile with ~500km range. This thread is lame af and clickbait OP should end his miserable life for making me hope they developed ICBMs
>>65339826Would stil be devastating for Russian airfields, command posts, ports, etc.
>>65339618it's not untrue, which makes it very funny every time russia brings their ICBMs closer to the border as a sign of hostility, completely missing the point of why they're icbms and not thrown by hand
>>65339836Idk I feel like Russia AD is so incompetent that this doesn't change much, for russia a slow moving cruise missile vs an ICBM is still a 0% chance of intercept. The range is basically the same too
>>65339846With ballistic missiles there is no time to sortie the aircraft, get into the bunker, etc.And they do get a number of Flamingos most of the time, so they're not completely ineffective.
>>65339258theyre slow and sneakyballistic missiles are fast but not sneaky
>>65339826The news is about FP-7 from FirePoint
>>65339612>>65339617Tu-22 engines have to be fucked at this point.
>>65339650My body is ready.
>>65339696>.webp.png
BUILD MOAR! MOAR!
>>65339942yeah, using them at this rate will backfire at some points
>>65339916Are you sure ? The other news sources said Ukraine did not disclose which missile it was so I just assumed the journalist from OP post is retarded and took a random pic from Ukraine arsenal. But anyway both of them are short range, nothing exciting
>>65339951Didn't one crash in Siberia last month?
FUCK. It's a pun. Fuck you, Anon.
>>65339258Variety is the spice of life
>>65339634>It's the yuros who don't have a ballistic missile design yet.ArianeGroup has at least showed renders. It's called B-Strike and comes in a 1,000km and a 2,500km variant. (the smaller launcher & missile on the left are called X-Fire and basically a HIMARS / GMLRS clone.)>I think they'll buy some PrSM as a stopgap.doubtful, the US probably wants all the production capability for its own stockpiles, in fact Norway requested it and the US denied it.
>>65339953>Are you sure ?They are the main driving force for ballistic missiles. Unlike soviet uncs in state enterprises who smelled their own farts for a decade, these niggas are doing very lean and agile production.
>>65339970Yes. Irkutsk region on training flight.>>65340000 checking
>>65340021>Unlike soviet uncs in state enterprises who smelled their own farts for a decadeIs Rostec really as bad as I've heard with gatekeeping new blood out?
>>65340032I meant the ukie ones. State-owned MIC is turbo-slow and filled with dinosaurs.
>>65340038Ah. People deride the "shock therapy" of the 1990's in the ex-USSR and ex-Warsaw Pact, but IMO, the slate had to be wiped clean.
>>65340047True, true.
>>65339634The frogs literally have domestically produced nuclear ICBMs carrying multiple independent reentry vehicles.And the Krauts are working on this thing (partially funded by Porsche for some reason), which is totally just a civilian space rocket and ABSOLUTELY NOT an ICBM.
>>65339951CARLOS YOU SPIC PIECE OF SHIT
>>65340055We are working on two different orbital launchers.But only small payloads.
>>65339949
>>65340082Yeah 50-100kt nukes aren't very big, all things considered.
>>65340055>ICBMsObviously I meant the SRBMs we were discussing
>>65339606I forget which of the various missiles it was, but essentially the only thing limiting it to the treaty was software which is why even on the spec sheet it essentially said max distance = MRM distance minus one yard. It was pretty clear the US mil had realized Russia was going to renig on the treaty and as such, already had a design that was ready to go and just needed a software patch to enable the capability.
>>65340643>"The missile is an expert on international arms controls agreements." >"It knows this because it knows where it is."
>>65340643A reminder that the US always lies about its capabilities by severely understating them.
>>65340650>the drone knows where it is because it can look at the compass
>>65340680Kek.
>>65340680Turboencabulator status?
>>65340688Fitted to the ambifacient lunar waneshaft, connected by a non-reversible tremie pipe to the differential girdlespring on the "up" end of the grammeters. (not visible in the pic, behind the panel)This allows the drone, or the missile, to substract where it is from where it isn't, or vice versa.
>>65340643NTA, but since Tomahawk was always present on ships, and mounting one of the original box launchers on a trailer would take around five minutes the whole treaty was always a little make-believe.The US abided by the lltter of it, at least to my knowledge, but in practice the Soviets kept missiles in silos in Estonia.It did end up removing some of the 'fast' balllistic strike options, though. Overall one of teh more reasonable treaties of the 80s even if it wasn't watertight or trully enforceable.I always wonder if the Reykjavik summit could have actually worked, seeing how SDI (on whcih Reagan insisted and which Gorbachev wanted to also include) never went anywhere.
>>65340760>ynr that a Soviet strategic bomber base in Estonia is now a museum of Estonian culture
>>65340730Hah, Rookie mistake!Even a novice engineer should have realized that the quantum fields interfering with the fixed polarity of the reciprocating gimble carrier would disturb the laminar harmonic magnetic flux required by the astropathic logic gates to perform multi-sequential vector calculations.The basics principles of Nolan-Howard-Et:Al's law makes it self-evident that you can't break the basic rules of physics like that and expect to get away without having to deal with interspecific covalecy disputes.
>>65340767kek
>>6533983715 minutes from launch to obliteration is much better than 2 hours headstart for the defense/evacuation
>>65340767>A>FUCKING>RAMP
>>65339258high altitude easy to detect vs low altitude loiteringcruise missiles can do more than just hit the targetand they can avoid defenses using preprogrammed pathsballistic missiles just go really high then fall on the target>>65340767hideouslooks like another culture got decimated by socialist invaders
>>65339951>yeah, using them at this rate will backfire at some points
>>65340088
>>65340767>museum of Estonian cultureI can see Red Bull paying a few bucks to shoot some sick stunts there.
>>65340863assuming you know the position of every air defense position including manpads, interceptor drones, old flak guns, skynex, iris-sls etc. and assuming your target isnt protected by close in weapon systems that will engage incoming cruise missiles and also assuming gps isnt jammed or spoofed.
>>65340972are you underage?
>>65339301>orion drops his belt
>>65339770>Nothing to do with European countries worrying that Trump will throw a fit if they give weapons to UkraineThe same Trump that ok'ed sending Ukraine Javelins in 2017?The same Trump who has been continuing to send Ukraine weapons since taking office again in 2025?The same Trump that just announced he was allowing Ukraine to license Patriot interceptor production?Tell me, is this weapons-banning Trump in the room with you right now?
>>65339942>>65339951>>65339970Lots of them have crashed or been blown up.Russia is down to 10 or fewer of them now.
If you could design a ballistic missile that was specifically intended to destroy bridges, how would you go about it?What kind of warhead?What kind of guidance?What level of penetration? And of what?
>>65340997nah, with trump its always an unstable back and forth, hypocrisy and chaos. he gave javelins in 2017 but then withheld a crucial military assistance package in 2019. before his second term he critized biden for sending weapons to ukraine, immediately halted the shipments when he took office, then later allowed them to continue. biden supplied atacms but with a range limiter, which trump critizised, but when biden lifted the range limiter, trump immediately put it back when he took office and to this day restricts atacms use and i think there have been no further deliveries of atacms missiles since biden left office.
>>65340972Context for the video?
>>65341107i think its a soviet kh101 or kh55 cruise missile getting hit by a short range sam, maybe igla.
>>65340972>>65341107>>65341131Better video with sound and aftermath:https://files.catbox.moe/8n3eo7.mp4
>>65341131Thanks>>65341456Video is fucked my man
>>65341477The fuck? That's odd. Works fine in my files. I think it has something to do with catbox. I had issues with uploading it there, earlier.
>>65341003>ballistic missile that was specifically intended to destroy bridges>What kind of warhead?Penetrating, with as much HE as possible.>What kind of guidance?I gues we'Re down to inertial and GPS, a seeker might be possible in principle but bridges really don't move very much>What level of penetration? And of what?Well, it'll be concrete. How much? No idea, most road bridges are not massively overbuilt.The modern way would be to hit supports with a penetrator that explodes in teh foundations, but that is probably hard to do with a ballistic missile.
>>65339640>Ukrainka airbaseSho?
>>65341559It's named after the nearest village.
>>65339442MRBM and IRBMs are more likely, and essentially guaranteed in a post-war context. Likely as out-growths of FirePoint's TBM/SRBM capacities. The value proposition for non-nuclear payloads on an ICBM isn't really a thing. You're already stretching that with an IRBM.
>>65339618This is ICBM territory
