Could ballistic lamellar armor work?
>>65366502https://youtube.com/watch?v=THQwO7-JMvE
>>65366502If all those lames were combined into three big monolithic plate they would resist bullets better. Lamellar will have to be heavier and bulkier to provide the same level of protection.
We tried it once and found out that a single rigid ceramic plate stops bullet impacts better than lamellar plates. This makes the wearer less likely to suffer broken ribs after taking a hit.>But what about coverage for fleshy areas?We've determined that single polyethylene plates work best for that. They're not as resistant to backface deformation as ceramic, but they're lighter and still better than lamellar plates.
>>65366548>We've determined that single polyethylene plates work best for that. They're not as resistant to backface deformation as ceramic,Ceramic plates are literally layer of ceramic over polyethylene plate.
>>65366502It could. People shat on dragonskin for not being as protective as claimed, and not being any better than issued esapis; and using shit glue, and that was all not unreasonable, but there was really nothing wrong with the concept. IMO more could be done if they were sandwiched inside a sleeve that would keep them together and had a few layers of aramid behind them to catch any spall. Its not going to outdo an Xsapi, but having flexible lvl3 protection to all areas that are currently just IIIA? Thats a hell of a thing.
>>65366573That's still heavier that a 100% poly plate, which can still stop rifle threats on its own. They just deform more than ceramic, which is acceptable when protecting a deltoid, abdomen, or thigh.
>>65366605>there was really nothing wrong with the concept.It was both heavier than single plates and less protective.
>>65366631100% poly plates almost always lose against basic steel core threats like M855 and stand no chance versus M855A1.If you want to stop most rifle threats you need to use a ceramic.
>>65366605There's no proof current Dragonskin manufactured by Stealth Armor Systems actually resolved the problems with Pinnacle's crap Dragonskin in 2007. It's a failed design and has failed to get any major adoption since it was first developed in 1997 by Neal and Bain at Armor Technology Corporation.Current SiC-TiB2 dragonskin 3.0 isn't even rated for M855.
>>65366772You're definitely wrong. They can stop those basic rifle threats.
>>65366911>he doesn't know PE plates lose to M855aaaahhh here's a top shelf onehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYJM1mY9Enw
>>65366548Who is 'we'?
>>65366993Judging by the picture, a rep from Adept Armor
>>65366605>>65366633>>65366783>failed design>total crap>could have been betterI was convinced when I watched the gunney put the vest on a dummy, put it on the ground, and then detonate a grenade sandwiched between the ground and the vest.The vest had no penetrations.Now, what piece of crap on the market does better than that?
>>65367036It fails when exposed to gasoline or some rough handling
>>65366995I think it's Gilliam because we know he posts here, lol
>>65367054Could be. Wilson is, more or less, subordinate to Adept since they supply both him and Bain at SAS with exclusive SiC-TiB2 ceramic.
Could someone explain the phenomena of military Flips or Korean-Americans larping as samurai?They are always behind this crap.
>>65366510This is great! Why isn't there more ofthis?
>>65366633Learn to read, moron.
>>65367036>Dude, it stopped FRAG shrapnel!That's the easiest stuff to stop, you know. We've been doing it with flak vests since WW2.
>>65367369People have been stopping shrapnel by jumping on grenades since the 1700s. You can't do that with a rifle round, lol
>>65367386And said Dragonskin can't stop rifle rounds unless in factory fresh condition. We gonna go back to Zylon soft armor too bro?
Why dragon skin uses gluing technique instead of textile sheet with pockets? It would be lighter and possibly more breathable too.
>>65367803Because each scale had to be adhered and overlapped to meet requirements. Once the adhesive went, as it did in the 07-08 army trials, performance dropped horribly and Level IV SOV-3000 had a 60% failure rate against the rated threat, M2AP.
>>65367849Can't you make rows of cloth ribbons for similar effect? Make the bottom one with pockets and insert disks, then top one after that, and so on till you have full panel. Stitches is typically more reliable than glue, any cobbler or tailor will tell you that.
>>65367879Adhering the scales to the aramid backer enhances the strike face-backer interplay between the two and makes them function as a unit. Same reason why a standalone plate outperforms an ICW version of itself with soft armor to compensate for the ICW plate not being standalone.Dragonskin just isn't good armor technology. Mr. Bain has tried for thirty years to make it a reality and has gone through four fucking companies to fulfill his dream, and he has failed at every one of them.
>>65366510>>65367146the discs kept falling to the bottom of the vest because the desert heat melted the cement that held them in place
>>65368727Also gasoline made that shit dissolve. Say what you will about Interceptor. ESAPIs were and are dead fucking nuts reliable against rated threats.
>>65366502dragonskin
>>65368887We tried that. It worked until the glue failed.
>>65366502Yes but you need a good way of binding the lames together. Dragonskin tried that with glue and that failed horribly if it got too warm or too cold. >>65366548I'd give the UHMWPE some thin SiC tiles for decaping plates. It should blunt any steel or tungsten tips and possibly cause incoming rounds to tumble into the Polyethylene.
>>65370263>I'd give the UHMWPE some thin SiC tiles for decaping plates. It should blunt any steel or tungsten tips and possibly cause incoming rounds to tumble into the PolyethyleneWe have recreated the ceramic plate
>>65367894>Adhering the scales to the aramid backer enhances the strike face-backer interplay between the two and makes them function as a unit. Same reason why a standalone plate outperforms an ICW version of itself with soft armor to compensate for the ICW plate not being standalone.That doesn't mean you can't just use both, actual scale armor historically had a backing of fabric and also mail to which the scales were looped into. There were also mixed scalemail designs and lamellar mixed with plate.This kind of thing should be mostly focused on areas that need a higher range of motion like the stomach and hips. A crotch flap of kevlar with solid ceramic inside is incredibly inconvenient.
>>65370607I mean, it works. More importantly, you can reshape the UHMWPE into a cuirass for better coverage.
>>65367879It will cost gazillion dollaritos if made in teh West.If you outsource to Vietnam its possible. Sew every disk into thin textile bag than sew them to backing. Easy peasy. Brigandine 2.0/
>>65370627That's a lot of weight.
>>65370626>This kind of thing should be mostly focused on areas that need a higher range of motion like the stomach and hips. A crotch flap of kevlar with solid ceramic inside is incredibly inconvenient.I should point solution attention its already was invented in the plate era.Peascod breastplate with separate tassets.Peascod forward flaring means breastplate has space for you to bend forward without breastplate immediately jamming into your abs and separate tassets are less anoying to walk with, less mass to move with each thigh step movement.
>>65370690those are just Faulds, a segmented breastplate would be more like the separation of the Plackart from the Breastplate in a Leeds-style but making the Plackart built like an Anima cuirass from the 17th century
>>65371121
>>65370626Said solid flap is however lighter. DragonSkin was extremely heavy and as a general rule did not do Level IV or above reliably at all. An M993 rated IV+ was 9.3lb for a 10x12 and needed IIIA soft behind it to work, so you're at 10lb or above. Monolithic ceramics rated to stop .50 BMG AP like the Adept Colossus Heavy are scarcely more than 9lb, and they stop .50 cal APs cold with sub-44mm BFD.Current Dragonskin is M80 + M855 and in some cases not even M855 rated.
>>65366502Just do modern brigandine, But instead of steel pieces of armor do a sandwich of hard porcelain and a glass fiber composite backing.The ceramic shatters and abrades the projectile, the glass fiber composite catches it. Put them in little bags of synthetic fiber for good measure.Not terribly difficult to remove and replace the armor packets if it takes a hit for you.
Just a reminder that the Army deliberately melted the adhesive by putting it into a 300F furnace before running the tests.
>>65373691They also put the Interceptor Vest in the same furnace and it worked just fine.
>>65373718If you've just spent 30 minutes at 300F, getting shot is the least of your problems
>>65374022I figure it's in case someone leaves their armor in a humvee in the sun.
>>65374042If the adhesive fails then the adhesive fails. You always want to subject armor to worst case because you are f-u-c-k-e-d if it fails. ESAPIs have been in service since 2005 and there are some old reinspected ones still fielded. Gotta make sure that adhesive is dead nuts and the furnace test showed exactly that.
>>65371121Animated armor doesnt really work with sapi plates. Sapi plates are 1 inch thick, not 1/10 inch like steel breastplates.
What does /k/ think of the main foundation for my /tg/ scifi armor system?>R-Suits, or Movement Restriction Suits>Picture your typical passive exoskeleton you see in scifi settings, except with a very smooth and bone-like shape to it that contours and fits very close to the user's skin. The suit itself provides no extra strength etc, and while it technically provides protection along the "bones" because they are scifi bullshit supermetal, the purpose of the exoskeleton isnt to be armor, it's "don't allow any kind of joint or spine hyperextension", (and to act as the mounting system for armor and powered exoskeleton stuff), by physically being unable to flex too far.>Because if you get shot in the head by .50 BMG it won't matter if the scifi composite bullshit helmet would protect you or not if you immediately get your neck broken from having it wrenched back at high speed, and surviving getting thrown out of a moving vehicle by an explosion etc with no real fleshy damage is nice but you're still made combat ineffective at best if your legs and arms are twisted into a pretzel because you just impacted the ground at 60 mph while wearing an extra hundred pounds of bullshit>Individual R-suits need to be custom fitted to a user, (and periodically updated as people age), but the various attachments for it such as powered exoskeletons, armor systems, batteries, and scifi bullshit like mini reactors etc. are modular so armorers can just provide troops with replacement parts instead of needing the entire armor set custom fit.>However because they have to be both light enough to walk around in as a mostly-unmodded human, strong enough to take extreme impact force, and need to be custom fitted they are typically the most expensive part of your average grunt's armor since they don't usually get the fancy toys like scifi bullshit energy shields or cloaking devicesWould it serve any real purpose or am I overestimating the danger of bending your joints/spine too far
