How did Kalashnikov manage to make a MMG with the weight of a LMG? Only the recent XM250 manages to beat It in terms of weight and firepower
by being kalashnikov
Light stamped receiver (1.5mm wall thickness same as an RPK, M240s are somewhere around 2mm), fabric belts meaning no delinker and relatively light barrel (notably the PKTs have a much heavier barrel profile, while M240Gs and Hs use the same barrel as every other M240). Its a good design, but there were some material concessions made.
>>65394269>How did Kalashnikov manage to make a MMG with the weight of a LMG?By having it lose any notion of accuracy with any kind of sustained fires. The PKM is practically an LMG. It's genuinely not suitable for the MMG or GPMG role, which is why you don't see it used as such anywhere. It's far too lightly built to work properly in the role.
>>65394354>It's genuinely not suitable for the MMG or GPMG role, which is why you don't see it used as such anywhere. ...except you do, to the extent that for many of the countries that use it, its the only infantry belt fed they have and the next thing up is .50s.
>>65394365Yeah, I fucked up. I meant to type something along the lines of >why you don't see it used as such in any serious militariesOf course it's used in third world shitholes who bought Soviet equipment packages for themselves. "Weapons & Equipment for an infantry brigade 30% off" kind of deal is how all those countries armed themselves, and so their weapons companies have PKMs used as MMGs.
>>65394354The entire point of NGSW was to get a gun that could touch the PKMs used by the Taliban in Afghanistan
>>65394381And that's completely retarded. Demanding infantry rifles to be capable of engaging at those ranges is a ridiculous notion and shows how detached from any kind of military realities the people in charge actually are.Get some platoon mortars into your units, loitering munitions, FPV drones, whatever. Just drag some M240s from the weapons platoon into your unit if nothing else, the Brits do just fine with plunging fire drills. There is zero need for infantry rifles to touch enemies at 800+ meters.
>>65394354>implying you need accuracy when dumping ammo belts in the general direction of the enemyAccuracy autism comes from noguns
>>65394419I'm not talking about marksmanship type of accuracy, nor am I talking about the kind of inaccuracy you have in systems like the M240. I'm talking about 24 MOA with sustained fires kind of inaccuracy.You still want your machine gunners to be able to hit point targets if they need to.
>>65394392Is that the .22 fireball one? You'd think they'd just try to make an infantry rifle with a reciprocating barrel in 338 norma like the new mg for ammo interchangeability if they wanted extra range.
>>65394381>The entire point of NGSW was to get a gun that could touch the PKMs used by the Taliban in AfghanistanAnon, the Taliban didn't just have PKMs; they also had plenty of SVDs and tons of bolt guns that could outrange our M4A1s (and be more accurate than a PKM).
>>65394419NTA, the smaller the MOA on your MGs, the farther away your machine gunners can effectively suppress I'd rather have a 3-6 MOA MG over a 15-24 MOA MG.
>>65394269The reload operation is broken into 2 parts. There isn't the same single violent impulse of a push feed that throws stress and deformation in all directions making a relatively long heavy receiver a requirement.
>>65394292>fabric belts meaning no delinker
>>65394428>reciprocating barrelLong recoil fucks accuracy.
>>65394392It is, but it isn't.When you have comms and optics like the US, having a rifle that will one shot at any reasonable engagement range isn't stupid. There is much about the whole program that is BS though.
>>65394269Just trolling a bit but it is an inferior design, even Russia uses Type 73s these days.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_73_light_machine_gun
>>65396345>even Russia uses Type 73s these days.The ones they scrounged after all the Norks got obliterated or did they buy some?
>>65396345>3.5# heavier
>>65396354They show up every now and again. They are weirdly made but they work pretty well. They take standard belts and the top mag can be fed with strip clips. It would be the best thing ever if it was 1980.>>65396358It is a better all around platform and it actually weighs slightly less if you strip it down. The Norks had to mill out a lb of steel for that top mag feed feature. You can also strip it down more if you take out the under barrel attachment that lets it fire rifle grenades.
>>65394381Why don't they just make a PKM in a Western cartridge?>inb4 they do. it's the something-or-other built by so-and-soI don't know anything about machine guns.
>>65394354>>65395758>>65394426https://youtu.be/EZhGSh16kcE
>>65396427 the main issue is how the feed mechanism interacts with belts. the PKM pulls cartridges out of the belt and then into the chamber (a bit like how the maxim gun does it if you've seen that) while most NATO guns push the cartridge through the belt into the chamber. to feed the PKM the usual NATO belts you need to redesign the feed mechanism and therefore lose the PKM's handling characteristics
>>65396427 oh, i also forgot to mention yeah it exists https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UKM-2000 again, the feed mechanism is different and all
>>65396687>Bringing up the M249 in a conversation about GPMG/MMGYou must be desperate, anon.
>>65396687>videos of slavboos telling fairy tales about slavshitHere are fun facts for you. According to Soviet ballistic tables, of bipod, 5 rds bursts, PKMAccuracy of top 25% machine guners is 27 MOA 500 meters rangeAccuracy of average machine guners is 40 MOA 500 meters rangeEffective range (if defined as 50% probability of hit of one burst vs E-Type silhouette)500 meters for top 25% machine guners 300 meters for average machine guners
>>65397240Thats pretty normal for the time. Current M240 ballistic charts cite a max effective point target range of 800m WITH magnified optics, presumably much less with irons due to limitations of the users eyes. You are aware of these factors, but wilfully ignore them because you're upset.
>>65397275Thing is untill this day you weren't aware about group size PKM shoots, now when facing these surprising (for you) facts you try to quickly assemble some cope.
>>65396784Hmm, why not just copy it wholesale belt and all? >>65396790>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UKM-2000THAT'S COOL
>>65398276 >why not just copy it wholesale belt and all? it's essentially creating another bullshit ammo type for logistics people to have nightmares about
>>65398318Oooh, okay. that makes sense
>>65398318Just use m13 links upside down like the navy 7.62mm 1919s did
>>65397275>You are aware of these factors, but wilfully ignore them because you're upset.NTA but
>>65397240>According to Soviet ballistic tables, of bipod, 5 rds bursts, PKMAccuracy of top 25% machine guners is 27 MOA 500 meters rangeI call bullshit because soviets don't measure accuracy in MOA, or miliradians for that matter. Their method is to measure r50 for horizontal and vertical dispersion. this can't be directly converted to MOA
>>65398947>I call bullshit because soviets don't measure accuracy in MOA, or miliradians for that matterThat's true.In Soviet ballistic tables they measure dispersion in the 1/8 strip of the dispersion ellipse size. Two numbers: one for vertical axis and for horizontal axis. Called вв and BБ in Russian.>this can't be directly converted to MOAObviously it can, because it's literally 1/8 of the largest axis of group size.
>>65397240>>65398947>>65399640Now post the indirect fire tables and how with tracer ammo and observation drones a MG becomes artillery. WW1 Indirect rifle volley fire documents would be really nice, those sights go to 2000 meters for a reason.
>>65396391>make your lmg take top feed mags and fire grenades sometimesWhy do the norks have such kooky ideas
>>65402142As far as i can understand they know they have a huge disadvantage when it comes to airpower. They have abandoned the idea of ever having air superiority besides briefly over Pyongyang. So their doctrine is to avoid having to worry about enemy air power by blowing them up in their bases.It is worth noting they can blow up most airbases in the RoK. Oh wait, you were asking about the Type 73 light machine gun. It worked for them but they don't use it anymore besides WPK Guard units. Russia is getting Syria tier left over Nork shit that even the DPRK thinks is obsolete.No refunds.
>>65402200Almost forgot: Type 73s have a rifle grenade capability although i doubt Russia would ever use it since they are inmcompetent.
>>65394269>>65398276>XM250Because this exists
