>>65432740yes
ARs? Yes. A2 specifically? No its shit.
>>65432740I'd say it's up there.
>>65432740picrel would be the best>>65432745>its shit.it's the worst AR, but it's still pretty good. I'd take an A2 over just about anything else from it's time.
>>65432762A2 irons are objectively better than a1 irons unless you buy into the "conscript proof" retardation that stoner was peddling
i like the a1 stock lenght (not a manlet i swear1) an the a2 sights. barrel twist discussion is for virgins
>>65432740I don't have a picture of an ak74 but I'd post it here as a rebuttal if I had one.
>>65432762Diemaco C7? it's better than the A2
>>65432779>A2 irons are objectively betteryeah, but that doesn't really make much of a difference in combat, it's a 300 meter infantry rifle after all. and besides that, burst is stupid, the barrel profile is retarded, and making the stock longer for no reason is dumb. I will defend the A2 grip though, after using both it and the A1 I get it.but it's like I said, it's the worst overall AR, but it's still good. I kind of want to make an A1/A2 hybrid that used an A2 receiver set and an A1 barrel and stock.
>>65432798>C7A1 with an A2 handguard, the C7 would also be good.
>>65432762The Harrell Special
>>65432740NOT. EVEN. CLOSE.
>>65432779A2 irons was a bit overkill for something that was gonna be effective around 300-400m at most, and if you're going up to 600m, you'd be using optics instead. The very least, the elevation knob was more than sufficient, probably could've copied what the AR-10 did with it's rear sight. And Stoner underestimated the sheer incompetence of the US armed forces at the time.
>>65432740Ladies and gentlemen, FUCK the gAy2 and it's millennial white knights
>>65432981>हथियारों की रैंकिंग.
>>65432963I haven't heard a single story of someone getting killed because of a2 irons
>>65433091Or way worse than that: was there someone who WASN'T shot because of A2 irons?
>>65432762the A2 is much better than the 601 or somethingthe early flaky bakelitey furniture is like glassno chrome liningflash hider tines ringit has sovl though
>>65432779I don't get how anyone shits on the A2 sights and cry about "Think of the conscripts!" when the M1 Garand has just as "complex" iron sights and the average solider didn't even have a high school education during that time.
>>65433148Because some people truly believe that most humans are genuinely retarded for some reason. Fuck dude aiming is literally an instinct for us. They'll figure it out.
>>65432779>>65433148I think this is a claim that degenerated from the original issue present in pre-war M1 Garands where the flush nut could easily lose zero or disassemble itself if it cot bumped and scraped or otherwise accidentally tampered with under combat conditions, leading to the adoption and retrofit of lockbars starting in early 1942, something Stoner may have at least heard about in passing since he was himself an armorer for the Marines in WW2 though not for infantry. That and considering the formalization of the battlesight zero, the "Trainfire" marksmanship program, and the M16's explicit philosophy being a flat shooter across most all engagement distances all following in the lessons of the Hitchman Report, it's not a big leap to see why CONARC's Gen Wyman (who was actually the main guy behind making the A1 sights as they are, not Stoner, he just went along with it) would wonder why grunts would ever need to adjust their irons in the field anymore in the first place.
>>65433165its the bean counter perspective, make things for the absolute lowest common denominator that they can so they can reduce that on paper failure rate to its minimum
>>65432822C7 would be even better as it has the brass deflector. My A1 with A2 handguards is great but throws brass right into my face when fired from the left shoulder.
>>65433165I also think people discount how clever even big dumb retards can be when their life depends on it. Maybe billy joe over there in a trench thinks a parabolic arc is something Noah rode on but since he's relying on that gun to not get shot he might be pretty fucking keen at making sure it puts the rounds exactly where he wants them to go, you just gotta show him how to do it first, and maybe a couple more times.
>>65433666It'd be a question of training. I think they do a good job of splitting the difference. For your rear line guys that won't practice as much and aren't expected to be fighting, you leave the sight bottomed out and don't touch it. For your front line guys that can get advanced practice it's a niche but potentially useful advantage. Maybe not for accurate hits on target but for accurate enough suppressive fire it could buy enough time to set up something that can be accurate across that distance like mortars or turret MGs or calling in artillery.
>>65432740That's a carbine though.
>>65433144>flash hider tines ringLike that's special - so does the recoil spring. The whole rifle either rings like a bell or clatters like a train.
>>65432822C7 has the goofy gov't profile barrel
>>65433655>My A1 with A2 handguards is great but throws brass right into my face when fired from the left shoulder.I tried a JP captured buffer spring setup and my rifle now kicks brass just forward enough for me to shoot lefty without having to do an exaggerated posture.
>>65432779A1 can't get accidentally shift because they rubbed against something, are a solid part of the carry handle and the standard size close range aperture is better than the 0-2 ghost ring on the A2.
Basically yes. While AKs flooded the East (and are genuinely great rifles too) an AR platform is the quintessential modern service rifle. It has a storied history of development and the capacity to continue to adapt which is why the SCAR and Spear will not be able to completely replace it.
>>65433144I’m a little torn between the A1 and A4. I have A4 style, and I think they look nice especially with the knights armament hand guards. Sometimes I think about selling my upper and getting an A1 upper and stock because I don’t ever see myself getting an acog.
>>65432740put a modern sling on it (not the one pictured) and stick a nice trigger in it instead of the 3 round burst with memory bullshit and the A2 is perfectit even can fit an ACOG
>>65435139The barrel profile is retarded.
>>65435153It's still increasing the thermal mass and reducing heat which makes it superior to the pencil profile. The correct answer is the SOCOM profile where it's thick like the front of an A2 beneath the handguards as well, but it took until the late 00s to figure that out
>>65435158Everything is a tradeoff.
Mine just werks
>>65435210just shooting trash I feel pencil profile barrels with both plastic handguards and mlok freefloat handguards get too hot and make me feel like I need a vfg or gloves. couldn't imagine being in a firefight with one of those
>>65433078have the high res
The AR will be used on Mars and the 1911 will be featured in WWIII
it's not even the best ar-15
>>65432820a2 grip? the nub in the pistol grip is shit unless you are talking about the round handguards then yes
i built this as an a1/a2 hybrid since neither were perfect on their own
>>65435366Mega KEK
this is why a2 sights exist
>>65435366
>>65433769a1 build is the only ar where i dont notice the spring
>>65432981>FAMAS>TrashWhy?
>>65435648Lol
>>65435887It is. Marines were doing that to their match rifles in like 1970 and wanted a factory option. Honestly considering making a clone
>>65437608I'm just laughing at how janky it is and the lengths they'll go through for muh target shooting.Always like sharing this when applicable:https://archive.org/details/DTIC_ADA168577/mode/1up
>>65435500That sling being on backwards bothers me far more than it should.
>>65432981This chart needs an sa80
>>65433078I liked the one that was all dildos better
>>65437789>A2 stock wasnt considered going out of vehicles, body armor, etc. - Army OfficerUSMC sure was poor.
>>65437981put it between 'good' and 'deadly' and call it 'cromulent'
>>65437608nah the a2 profile has forever ruined heavy barrel ARs, pencil barrel is the only choice thats pure
it's funny that people call the M16A2 too heavy and then those same people go and fellate the SG550 which is 1.5 pounds heavier for a 20" 5.56 service rifle
>>65438385The SG550 is the epitomy of "thegrass is greener on the other side" and people just mindlessly fellating it because it's expensive and rare and "it must be good because it's Swiss like a Rolex" even though it's worse than a fucking $1,500 AR-15 in every single metric
>>65433148>>65433165>>65433666something something african AKs with the range on their sights pushed up to maximum because high number means the gun shoots harder
>>65438385nobody says its too heavy. the "heavy" profile barrel is shit and was developed by retards
>>65438447I think the Faxon Gunner is the perfect barrel weight
>>65438461hmm yeah seems like an improved pencil barrel
>>65438274How can a profile that didn't exist what that rifle was made ruin it?
>>65434391Nice. My rifle is an ethiopian or malaysian milsurp converted to semi so I'm trying to keep the original parts in - I probably won't be changing the buffer for that reason but good to know.
Hallo there Frens
heavy barrels are good though
>>65432740Considering it lost to the AUG in a direct competition, it's at least the second best rifle.
>>65432820>PAQ-4C in the wildBased.
>>65439511In an Australian trial. Australia doesn't represent the world, no matter how much you want it to
>>65439509yeah if you plan on sustained fire
>>65439508it's dogshit
>>65440501
>>65435213Use it to off yourself, tranime fag
>>65432740It's not even the best service rifle eugene stoner made.
>>65439690The AR tried to represent itself and was found inferior.
>>65432740This isn't even the best American service rifle ever issued. The M16 was iterative improvement on it's predecessor. The Garand was legit revolutionary, a full generation ahead of what came before and it's competitors.
>>65441483>The Garand was legit revolutionaryIt was a Petterson rifle that worked out because the US had oodles of really good and highly trained machinists who could work in perfect contentment.It was the Chauchat rifle through a mirror darkly.
>>65433165>most humans are genuinely retardedIt's true, though. You'd know this if you ever drove a car
>>65432740>When I grow up to be an AmericanI would totally get a fully custom/modernized M16 with A1 furniture, no optics, only carry handle and tritium iron sights if possible.
>>65441473I remember a /k/ thread several years back when Australia was crosstraining with the US, and the Ozzie guys were like "fuck this makes so much more sense" when using the M16s.
>>65441473>The AR tried to represent itselfReminds me of Peter from Family Guy when he said he disliked The Godfather because it "insists upon itself."
>>65432740Who makes the best clone of this or should I just get PSA because muh round count will be less than 1k per year
>>65439854For all scenarios actuallyrifle weight isnt a real problemAn A2 HBAR is still lighter than the garand we won ww2 with, used by skinny 1940s dyels
>>65442505Just buy a pre ban colt
>>65441492>the US had oodles of really good and highly trained machinists who could work in perfect contentment.Yes, that's what you need when you want to introduce revolutionary weapons on a mass basis; a strong industrial base. What was your point?
>>65442232I meant: "Wasn't offered as a gift with complementary APCs and mortars.", because that's how ARs normally spread.
>>65442583>used by skinny 1940s dyelsThose guys had better functional strength than today's gymrats
>>65442625>functional strength meme in 2026
>>65442587why? unless he's a collector who really needs something from a specific era just get a mid-range AR for under $1000
>>65442668>angry that farmers and laborers are stronger than you without the gym or modified dietStay mad
>>65432740How are they to clean?, heard the ammo they received during Vietnam was so terrible, the fucking rifle jammed quick/lot of carbon buildup.Then again i only trust in BLACKED.. revolvers. .
>>65442691??
>>65442687nta but its so obvious that you're weaker than both and using the former as a cudgel against the latter because you're insecure about it
>>65432740They're okay. Vz58s, ak74s, and tavor x95s are better though
>>65442691The short version is that the gunpowder Stoner originally selected to use for the .223 cartrige was't able to be mass produced while staying within safe pressure limits, so a rapid had to be made in order for the rifle to be fielded. This powder led to a slight increase in the overall malfunction rate the rifle expereinced, but those jams tended to skew more towards less severe issues than the rifle faced with the original powder. Rifles gumming up probably had more to do with logistics issues and low availabity of cleaning kits than anything else due to how rushed the adoption was
>>65445802the powder was a bullshit lie. the issue was that they didn't chrome line the chamber and bore because they have difficulties getting the chroming process to work on that small of a diameter barrel and Eugene Stoner told the government that the rifle didn't need chrome lining. This led to severe chamber corrosion being the jungles of Vietnam and all resulting in unreliable guns
>>65445879Your telling of the chroming issue is entirely correct, but the powder issue was real. Unless you think every ammo manufacturer going "lol 55gr at 3,250fps with IMR4475 cant stay anywhere near under 52,000psi" and refusing to bid on the ammo contracts was just a funny practical joke
>>65432981what kind of cave wall thirdie scribble is this filename?
>>65445879>stoner >my buffer is the best!>it's actually a hunk of shit that jammed rifles so badly that you needed tools to unfuck >stoner>my rifle doesn't need a closure device!>yes the fuck it does >stoner>my rifle doesn't need chrome lining!>stoner>my sights are the best!>no the fuck they aren't 95% of Stoners shit needed someone to unfuck it.
>>65441492>Most nigcoded fagged up post itt even when competing with seething slants and slavs implessive
>>65445944Yeah, people need to stop hero worshipping Eugene Stoner. He had one initial good idea and then a bunch of bad ones and it took Colt and the government to perfect it. His unnatural hatred of the adjustable A2 rear sight and insistence that his gun didn't need a chrome lined chamber and barrel and the fact that he went on to do absolutely nothing of note after the 1960s is all the proof you need. All his other "AR killers" after he sold the AR-15 to Colt were massive flops
>>65445907If Stoner's buffer spring wasn't garbage the powder wouldn't have been a problem. Modern ARs don't have this problem
>>65432740if you mean ARs as a whole yes, if you mean A2s specifically they are kinda mid. Bad barrel profile and twist rate to accommodate M855 which is a fucking scam and offers nothing over the M193 it replaced and in many ways its objectively worse. And yeah everyone and their mother complains about three shot cuck and its ratchet system.That said I'd take it over basically everything else available at the time with the only exception being its carbine cousins.
>>65432981>trashAs if you've ever shot one.
>govt barrel profile sucks>majority of ARs still use it 50 years lateryou're all wrong you midwit redditor contrarians. the A2 won and all its features got carried on from the brass deflector to the grip nub to the 1/7 twist to the barrel profile. the only thing it got wrong was 3 round burst
>>65432740I have A2 sights on my AR and I think they work great. Very easy to shoot with. What was the issue with them?
>>65446013Nope
>>65445987Anon you're getting confused, you're reciting the argument for why WC846 was a good powder to swap to, but replying to a post about IMR4475
>>65433148Am I not allowed to think the M1's sights were (the sight picture itself aside) stupid and overcomplicated?
>>65446344Nothing. Nothing wrong with the a1 sights either. Fags argue about these things as if it matters when optics are objectively better than both. Just enjoy your old school rifle.
>>65446385USASOC went from a govt profile barrel to a socom profile barrel with the sopmod program and then back to a govt profile with the urgi except now a midlength gas profile. If govt profile was so bad why did they go back to it when they could've picked literally any profile on the market????
>>65446344in actual combat nobody is fine tuning their sights for windage and elevation
A1 sucks shit. Gets hot as fuck after 1.5 mags, leading to wandering POI. They are like 7moa when they're moderately hot. The A2 profile fixes this completely, pretty elegantly too with no increase in diameter behind the gas block journal. Government profile has good harmonics and good thermal performance. Seeing as a pencil barrel has never been adopted by any military in the last 50 years I think the USMC was onto something man.The A1 sights are completely worthless, they were put on the rifle because it was adopted as a replacement for the M1 carbine for air force security forces, and they were retained through to the M16A1 program because the DoD wasn't sure what the infantry service rifle would look like after vietnam, they anticipated just shredding all the M16s and going back to 762 NATO, so the cheapest sights possible were fine. They made minimal attempts to make it conform to typical service rifle requirementsEvery other service rifle going back to the 1873 Springfield had at least elevation adjustable sights. It makes no sense tactically to have your soldiers just aiming at indistinct points over the enemy's heads, kentucky windaging side to side is already bad enough. Elevation is absolutely necessary, probably why even some military pistols have adjustable elevation. I do think quick adjustable windage is pointless and the A2 knob is 5x bigger than it needs to be.Anyone who hates the A2 is just a retard honestly. I don't know why it's trendy to hate on it in 2026. Just say you've never done an unknown distance course of fire with iron sights
>>65446926>t makes no sense tactically to have your soldiers just aiming at indistinct points over the enemy's headswhat did the delusional nigger mean by this?
>>65446926>all that cope about government profile
Oh sick, another 20" thread. Twink furries are seething.
>>65446926>doesn't understand the concept of the "danger space" in ballisticsIf you did, you'd understand why you don't need finely adjustable sights on an infantryman's rifle. Peacetime armies adopt and do retarded shit when there aren't wars that help them keep priorities in line. Your example of the 1873 trapdoor is retarded, because ALL of the rifled muskets and black powder breech loaders had such an intense drop at range, that any error in distance estimation would lead to a GUARANTEED miss, for example if you took a shot at 500 yards but your target was actually at 450, that big fat .45-70 bullet would sail clear safe over the heads of your target. The M16 did not suffer that issue because 5.56 is very forgiving with aiming errors
>>65446824Fine tuning? It's 3/6 clicks from 300m BZ to 400. SIBZ' 50yd/200m BZ is 28 clicks on A4 to 600m and it takes a second to yeet it from flat to flat. People who shit on A2 sights never even gave them a chance. Is it practical? Reports from Vietnam say they had to take a pig in fear of being pinned down from the leaf sighted ak beyond the A1 sights ability. No batteries, no fogging, no glass to break and lighter. Are optics better? Sure. Don't act like irons don't have a place and logistical advantage though.
>>65445980Not just the AR10/15 were utter shit, the Stoner 63 was a abject failure. The fucking thing was a long stroke piston, HOW do you fuck up a long stroke piston? SR25? TURBO SHIT. His 25mm autocannon TRW-6425 was also shit. The ARES gun? Shit. Sullivan was the true MVP.
>>65448006Hes right though only schizoid retards like edward snowden or julian assange think that the gubmint actually keeps tabs on them or is even remotely interested in any antisemitic opinion they might hold
>>65446926>DoDUuuhhh sweaty its akshually called >the department od WARAnd it raisn fire and death from the sky (which is how you tell they are the good guys) onto little schoolgirls and dual use infrastructure such as hospitals (where they could treat soldiers) so no warcrime there, checkmate antisemites
>>65451745Mr kegsbreath?
>>65445980Hell the biggest indictment against Stoner is with the AR-10. It's biggest adopter was Portugal who dropped it in less than a decade for the G3 and not even the Dutch, who were producing the guns mind you, so much as adopted it in limited numbers. No, they'd rather adopt the foreign built FAL. Imagine how bad a gun has to be that a nation can have the means to produce it, and has already produced it for another country, but refuses to make it for themselves
>>65448218>beyond the A1's sights I remember watching a video about the M16/AK from a US Army Master Sgt that showed the M16 and AK were matched in the ability to hit man sized targets up to 300 meters, but after that the AK overtook the M16A1, being able to point fire out to 400 meters and provide effective area fire past this. The M16A1 couldn't. This was the early 80's and the knowledge of the AK74 which could push out to 500+ meters, something that was keenly felt.
>>65448218>Reports from Vietnam say they had to take a pig in fear of being pinned down from the leaf sighted ak beyond the A1 sights ability.the absolute delusion of the A2 suckers/at trannies.
>>65451750i remember seeing your mom sucking off everyone present in that video, then gulping their piss too
>>65451742>the government has a record of every antiseptic comment everNO WONDER THEY'RE BUILDING DATA CENTERS GOD FUCKING DAMN.
>>65451756>coping this hard You're adopted. Multiple times.
>>65451761just like A1 sights, and not A2 or the pathetic excuse for a sight that zigger subhumans put on ak
>>65451766>A1 were adopted HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>65451772>muh adjustable marksman shit is totally da better than the fixed peepwhy am i even replying, every time you crawl out your shit gets more retarded robert
>>65451781>virtually every BUIS is A2>robert Yeah you're trolling.
>>65448006
>>65451783>virtually every BUIS is A2>none of them are adoptedyour dysgenic chinless face reflects your acute lack of mental capacity robert
>all this arguing about fucking iron sightsI swear ARfags have some kind of mental disorder. It's current year+fuck you, good optics aren't expensive and pretty fucking durable. To pick irons and to be this opinionated about them is genuinely fucking insaneAlso the G3/HK drum sights blow both out of the water
>>65432762It is certainly aesthetically pleasing I'll say that much
>>65432820>the barrel profile is retardedThis is honestly my only problem with the A2.If my A2 weren't 100% OG Colt I'd have pulled the barrel for a Criterion midweight ages ago.
>>65451786>coping this hardLet's see....The fucking Troy, Magpul/Pro, Scalarworks, all clones thereof. >robert He broke your brain.
govt profile 20" barrels only weigh 4 ounces more than a pencil profile 20" barrelthink about that before you spout off reddit fuddlore
>>65432740yup
>>65432740No but it's the good enoughest
>>65432740I'm too much of a brainlet to use A2 sights.
>>65440501i try to avoid insults, but nigga you dumb
>>65438094nope, it goes in a tier beneath Trash; U Kidding M8?
>>65432904>Jams after 400+ roundsNothing personnel kid
>>65432740Unironically the best is the Colt CM901 but nobody appreciated it while it was available, so I don’t know if you could really call it a “service rifle.”
>>65451753It's true son. The a1 was no good. I bent my barrel prying open a crate of beer. Next time I used the bitch she blew up and injured the RTO. Never liked that fairy guido.
>>65452133>leverage is reddit fuddlore
>>65451753You can instinct shoot a rifle out to 400/500 yards? Impressive.>>65452674Don't be a nit, I wasn't shitting on the A1. It is handy and works great for targets 350 and in, which is 95-99 percent of real world engagements. That 1-5 percent would be nice to cover without losing anything though. We are all going to get droned to death so I don't think it really matters. I just like A2 sights and shoot them often.
>>65432820>I will defend the A2 grip though, after using both it and the A1 I get it.I've got an A2 grip on my own A1-ish AR. I like the nub.
>>65453769The A2 grip is fantastic, I keep wasting money trying 'better' ones and they just feel wrong. The leverage is insane. One of my 20" is 11.2lbs loaded and I can throw it around and hold it out pretty easily. Hate the more angled grips, constant tipping if you have anything on the front.
>>65433144why wouldnt you want chrome lining?
>>65451742holy shit, look at that bot>>65453769me too
>>65435366Missing some tucknuts, otherwise perfect
>>65433144Practicality aside, the 601 has great aesthetics. That specific shade of green, the overall silhouette and the waffle mag just look fantastic. The slab side is a bit inelegant though.I wish the US military went with green furniture, it's just sexier. The Canadians didn't execute it well, but the Swiss also proved that green furniture is peak.
>>65453950Read my post again
>>65432740Can I have a cold hammer forged barrel?
>>65432904Prior to the ACOG/RCO, maybe
>>65432923the greatest battle implement ever invented
>>65435047ACOG is like real life aimbot but i respect shooting fundamentals and irons
>>65435618this setup looks better ironically.
>>65446926nobody likes you GAY ASS FUCK post
>>65448190love camo jobs
>>65439508the shorter variants would be better
>>65453482>You can instinct shoot a rifle out to 400/500 yards?You can hit anything past 200 yards with an AK? Keep bullshitting nigger.
>>65448190Unbelievably based
>>65452133Yeah, let me slap a quarter pounder to the end of your gun and tell me you can't feel a difference in the balance
>>65459286seems like sticking 1.5+ pounds is all the rage lately with suppressors
>>65459286The A2 balances this 1/4 pound by making the receiver and stock heavier too. Literally nothingburger
>>65432981Brown people love the guns theyve been btfo with
>>65459059I believe it was more about taking suppressive/harassing fire and either engaging with a belt fed or gtfo. >>65459286Good thing that slight weight was added across the whole rifle making the A2 balance very well.
>>65445944Don't tell the fat retard over at inrange that. He'll go on and on about how the ar15 stoner had in mind was perfect but needed to be made with a one piece plastic lower with no sights, no rails, and a pencil barrel.
>>65460150So now you have a heavier rifle that fires slower, bravo
