Imagine our world has been merged with a classic high fantasy world. Or maybe an alternate history where fantasy elements have always existed on earth.What are the implications for how military tactics, strategy, logistics, culture, or society would be different? How would biology/magic alter the way weapons are used or what's practical?
>>65450908>classic high fantasy worldwell the problem is those are all different
>>65450910True, but that's kind of up to you to decide.Yea Warhammer Orks would be a different enemy than LotR Orcs. Which one do you want it to be?
Warhammer/Warcraft Orks>Orks can wear enough metal on them to render 556 ineffective at center mass>Battle Rifles never go out of style>human/Ork conflicts mostly revolve around humans trying to remain out of Close Quarters against 8 foot tall balls of muscle and rage>Orks favor large caliber shotguns and .50 BMG smgs they are able to fire like 9mm thanks to their large size
>>65450908I’m teaching the Goblins gang signs and giving them Mac 10s and Hi Points
>>65450908We'd need explosive crossbow bolts to fire into the dragon's mouth because tanks and apaches don't work for some reason, but axes and what is basically a really shitty grenade launcher do for some reason.
>>65450927This but with the /k/obolds
Oh fuck yeah KFG/WFG is back! Just keep it alive until I get back from work.
>>65450929>but axes and what is basically a really shitty grenade launcher do for some reason.Did they actually work though? Off the top of my head the American Soldiers only killed exactly one regular dragon on screen in the movie, and that was with a harpoon cannon. Every time they tried doing the sky diving with axes shit they just got ineffectually slaughtered.
>>65450908>modern world and tech but with fantasy races and magicThat's just Shadowrun.
>>65450927If you released Goblins into a modern American ghetto, does any ethnicity stand a chance against them?
>>65450981Eh I mean sort of, but Shadowrun has a big emphasis on future tech that doesn't exist in our world, like cybernetics. Also the implications on their different biology I found to be underwhelming. DnD has the same issue. You can't have meaningfully different races that are also still balanced for an RPG
>be me.>an old rancher near the border of the so-called 'great merge'.>military has checkpoints, but the border's too big to have constant watch over.>peace deals have been made, but intrusion still happens until the damn wall is built (they promised this years ago).>me and the boys have to constantly grab our shotguns and rifles and ride out and scare intruders off with shots in the air.>some take a tiny bit more encouragement to get them moving, but some are real peculiar.elves? i aint see em, they're probably going out at night and being stealthy little buggers, not even the trail cams pick em up, and if they do, they're already gone anyhow>goblins? they take a bit more to encourage, and usually come in numbers, but when one starts running, they all run.>orcs? nah, you just shoot them, they don't understand nothin but a bit of lead tween the eyes.>"b-b-but thats illegal!">don't care, the local authorities thank me for culling their population, aint nothin but trouble anyhow.Guns I use? Why, a Winchester 1894 and God's given Browning Auto 5 shotgun, friend. Maybe my ol' single action as backup, but if .30-30 don't do it, a twelve gauge shot surely will.
>>65450973I mean, their most competent guys bother to carry them, and they look really inconvenient to carry around if they don't do shit. You'd assume they do something, right?The answer to all of these problems is clearly castles and FALs.
>>65450925>Rhodesian Bush War where it never endsBe the Ork equivalent of Valhalla. >>65450986Hispanics would merge with them.
>>65450986Nurgle’s abominations (Jeets) and Skaven (Hasidic Jews)
>>65450908HEDP grenades get a comeback
>>65451042I always thought of Jeets as being more poo undivided rather than patrons of a particular Chaos God?
>>65451077I always imagined them as Skaven. They love technology that is more dangerous to the user than to the person they are trying to kill. They live in filthy, irradiated ruins. They are slaves to a crazy caste system and backbite each other all the time. They're affiliated with like 7000 chaos demons but they aren't strongly devoted to any of them. And the skaven are almost entirely hunched, disgusting, vile, weak little male rats trying to win access to some bloated twisted broodmother churning out more little hideous creatures back in their lair. What were we talking about again?
>>65450943Kobolds get HK products
>>65450908Elves and Orcs would be the biggest gamechangers. Even with guns serving as an equaliser, an elven force will always surpass a human force due to the sheer disparity in physical prowess and endurance. Yes, they have low birth rates so obviously you cannot create a mass army out of elves, but you don't have to restricr yourself with just using elves as Special forces. They can fill officer roles, serve as pilots and more importantly, have the intelligence and willpower to become the new ruling class. Even discarding magical powers, Elves would become the new Warrior Aristocracy.Dwarfs don't have much of a use. You can use them as tunnel rats, tank crews or pack mules, but they'd onyl be a slightly more effective small human and not worth the effort to create new lines of production for equipment specifically tailored towards dwarfen bodies.Orcs depend on the interpretation as they are the race where writers usually deviate the most from Tolkien. I'll just go by Tolkien where the term Orc describes a wide range of below-average humanlike creatures to what we refer to as goblins (though in Tolkien's Mythos Goblin and Orc were just interchangeable words). They would be best served for logistical and industrial roles. Orcs are cowards and poor fighters, but their cowardice makes them excellent workers as they will almost never dare to rebel over shitty conditions like human workers. They can also be easier mass bred.Trolls are useless. It is a worse pack mule than a truck, a worse tank than an actual tank, a worse worker than large industrial machines and you have to deal with an unstable freak that is prone to kill your own men.
>>65450908Speaking of /k/ fantasy's, check out this amazing fantasy football league with 8 spots open!
>>65450908
Undoubtedly a few rascally younger Dragons would wind up unpleasantly surprised by modern weapons, but a species which combines physical might, longevity, intelligence, and magic would be devastatingly effective in the long run. If the Dragons can assume mammals' forms it's pretty much a wrap. Quite frankly I'd take a draconic banker over the goblins we have now.
>>65450908>>65451139Monster Hunter International probably has my favorite portrayal of elves ever. They’re basically a bunch of rednecks living in mobile homes and supporting themselves through illegal poaching. They still have the usual elven traits, being faster and more agile than humans, with quicker reflexes but they combine that with modern weapons (I think they were using ARs specifically) which makes them elite-tier snipers.
Good to see these threads back again. I will build a harem of elves to churn out child soldiers until I become a fantasy African warlord!
>>65451392I feel like Goblins would be more efficient. Their pregnancies are like what, 3 weeks?
Oh if anyone wants it, here is the discord link to the /k/ Fantasy Server. We were kind of inactive for a while but we're trying to get back in the swing of writinghttps://discord.gg/un9DCZbKY
>>65451042>Skaven>jewsSkaven are cool and funny though.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YH9VdFvHiO8
>>65451139Elves live on a longer time scale than humans inherently and are slow to take action, they'll always be behind the technical edge of humans and dwarves. Conflict is fought with logistics. Dwarves will probably win by having uranium nuke powered hole drillers that can burrow under enemy territory and use explosives to destabilize industrial capacity/ kill. Think of carpet bombing in ww2 but due to it being underground you don't get to see it coming with radar/fight it with drones.Humans will likely either form agreements with dwarves because we are an inherently industrious species as well, or become bitter rivals/enemies, in which case, better build a bunch of aircraft carriers/floating cities in the ocean/along the coast. Neither dwarves nor elves are as good of sailors as we are. Open coastlines and the ocean also reduce cover and camouflage for elves if they try anything and sonar can detect burrowing attacks sooner in water than 500 feet of ground penetrating radar.Likely we would have to use off shore drilling too supply fuel and move to hydroponics and then go scratched earth and starve out the dwarves and elves if possible with defoliation. Dwarves may delevop underground UV groweries but still with air superiority, paratroopers and and billions of gallons of napalm and leftover tar we could dam up their air vents and suffocate them into an unconditionally surrender. Tolkien even admits that dwarves, as from the stone they may be, have their limits about underground QOL
>>65451205“I’m gon’ make you squeal like an orc”t. Cleetomir. Probably.
>>65454650Dwarves and Elves would probably basically require every member of their species to start at the bottom of their tech tree. Apprenticeship? Bah. learning from those who came before? that's for humans. You figure it the fuck out on your own talents.
>>65454688>Dwarves and Elves would probably basically require every member of their species to start at the bottom of their tech tree.Why?
>>65454705Because he's an HFYtard that thinks things that evolved the same body and close enough brain structures would somehow have wildly different ways of doing things instead of, you know, doing things in a way that would make sense.
I'm gonna use DnD/Forgotten Realms for my interpretation because that's one I actually know.>races with racial cantrips would exterminate those withoutElves and drow would make up the master races, if they even allowed the other races to survive. Everything else (forest gnomes, genasi, tieflings) would be a minority at best. Being a child with the ability to throw firebolts and acid splashes around puts an elven child on par with adults of other races. As they get older, they get very powerful spells that don't even need a spellslot (ergo, no magical training to use them). They also live a very long time, so waiting them out isn't an option when they go to war with other races. Darkvision, some only need 4 hours of sleep, and natural weapon proficiencies (particularly with bows) make it so they would dominate before any of them could become strong enough to resist. Forest gnomes and deep gnomes could survive via guerilla warfare, tiefling populations could survive in the Hells, some dwarves could hack it if they literally never left their caves. Humans would be bred out, orcs would likely have been genocided.>weapons and tacticsOur gun designs are honestly just natural and practical in terms of launching a projectile, so we'd see the implementation of combat wands/staffs shaped like long guns/pistols. They'd improve spell damage and speed and improve accuracy. Ammunition might begin to appear later on, but only to the end that you could compress a leveled spell into a shot.Anti-magic armor would be the hottest commodity imaginable once it was invented. Pure spellcasters would not be terribly common as combatants simply because the benefit of having a few leveled spells would be outweighed by the benefits of having a few cantrips and weapon skill. Pure casters would be backliners like snipers and medics.Tactically war would be frightening. Your enemies can teleport, see in the dark without NODs, become way better at every aspect of sneaking around on a whim.
>>65454712Elves would probably have a different brain structure because of their close ties with magic. If you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail, so to speak. Magic might actually mentally handicaped their problem solving abilities and have slowed tool usage brain pathways.Dwarves are known to be stubborn and hold grudges and likely would be very secretive about tech they develop, keeping it within their own clan and probably use it to kill each other/sell to humans to kill other dwarves.
>>65454790>weapons and tactics cont.For those early centuries where elves were establishing dominance, druids and rangers would play a dominant role due to much of the world's fauna being able to act as actual war machines paired with these class' ability to commune with or become said fauna. Imagine real-world ancient warfare, but one side is riding dinosaurs and flashfreezing the others' legs. High-level druids can also create fortifications by speaking a few words, making combat impossible for anyone who can't do all of the above.After this period, combat would follow a similar path to our world's because regrettably, combat favors gay tactics.As technology began to develop more, we'd see the same tech used in combat staffs applied to cannons and later tanks and aircraft that would make everything except the biggest creatures ineffective in combat. During this historical period, caster classes would spend most of their time just manufacturing spell bullets and become irrelevant on the battlefield, with the exception of a few druids for utility purposes (casting Wall of Stone from a "rifle" would probably be disastrous). Wizards, clerics, sorcerors, etc. could put all of their relevance into a 5.56 round and the average soldier would be able to use all of their spells in the span of one combat load.Battle would become increasingly gay as drones were invented and equipped with spellshots.Surface-dwelling elves would probably outlaw spells like cloudkill/circle of death because they're kinda gay, drow would be all over that shit.
>>65454826>civilian lifeForget your dreams of private wand/staff ownership. If the feds could cast Detect Ammunition, we wouldn't have guns either. We'd likely get bands of outlaw rangers and druids that could hold onto some and hide away in nature, but anyone trying to live in the city will be unarmed.
>>65454793Tolkien's understanding of Elves is not that they were mere magicians who use magic better than the other races, but the wisest of the races who understand the metaphysical plane of existence. Their understanding of magic is like our understanding of science, just even more perfect. In fact, in LOTR magic and Science were not two mutually exclusive concepts, but heavily tied to each other, hence why the Elves were also expert craftsmen and more advanced than the other races.Granted, many pop-culture fantasies forget the original Intention behind the Elves, so they just depict them as the race good with magic, but even then Elves in Stories usually still have superior craftsmanship over the humans, they just get overshadowed by the Dwarfs who often get flanderized as the industrial race.And realistically, Elves would be more advanced than the humans. Before the industrial revolution, a significant part of the scientific progresses in history were done by bored aristocrats with too much time on their hands. And an elve with infinite life would make much quicker progress than a human institution. The problem with them is that even if we have a genius, eventually he passes away and he has to spend a significant amount of time teaching a new guy to pick up everything he discovered before the replacement can even continue to progress. The Elves on the other would have exponential progress because they have inifite time to perfect their understanding of whatever they are studying.
>>65454712>things that evolved the same body and close enough brain structures would somehow have wildly different ways of doing thingsYeah I mean have you ever seen the way indians do things?
>>65451029Not to be too anally retentive, but technically wouldn't those all be SLRs, not FALs?
>>65454790>some only need to sleep 4 hoursD&D elves do not sleep at all. They have something do that is similar, but is explicitly stated to not be the same as sleep. This is the source of their immunity to magical sleep effects, as presumably the magic is trying to trick the brain into doing something that an elven brain does not do, so it's relying on a mechanism that in the eldest case, does not exist.
>>65454851Interesting take, but we see even in humans, a lot of "experts" get stuck following dead ends after years and years devoted to something, whereas the best innovation comes from constantly looking outward and updating a strategy, often incorporating differing elements from others because we don't have the time to individually develop everything. Modern engineering is built on the logistics of incorporating pre existing components and such, to save our always limited time. Expert craftsmanship is great don't get me wrong, but ironically, the United States actually got to fight the entirety of WW2 on this principle. The weapon of supreme craftsmanship was the M1 garand. They are obnoxiously difficult to make, but superbly made resulting in an excellent weapon. C&Rsenal has a good breakdown of the topic, but Julian Hatchers book of the garand illustrates it great as well. The M1 carbine on the other hand, was an extremely rushed design, incorporating other weapons parts to save time, usually the Winchester self loading rifle... Guess which of the two they ended up making and issuing more of, and practically speaking ended up being a better firearm? 1/2
>>65454851>>65455537 The select fire, intermediate caliber, ,15/30 round detachable mag fed, half as expensive to produce, produced more of in a shorter period of time, m1/m2 carbine which weighed half as much as a garand, was of course the winner. The elves might have very experienced and talented individuals, but war is logistics, and by the numbers, the m1/m2 carbine was a much better rifle in WW2. Better than the STG as well, which while 7.92 kurtz was ballistically superior, had worse mags and a wayyyyy higher reject rate of raw stampings than m1 carbines had. The m1 carbine was designed to be made by anyone and everyone, and it was and was made well enough. Mags were made to be disposable and when used as such, worked well. Dwarves with their lifespans likely would fall into similar failings. The elves in LOTR literally did not give a fuck about middle earth and said "I'm going to the undying lands" when their first attempt at getting rid of souron with their alience with men didn't work out. They're pampered babies in 1000 year old bodies who can't stand the idea of having to evolve, try again, and change strategies, like having hobbits be the key. Tolkien was a human and he decided frodo had to to it, and Aragorn being a main character, was kind of a self insert, who shunned the power of being a king until he had no more choice to do so and deciding to live as a ranger, building skills and staying humble is human ingenuity and flexibility on the face of the failings of establishment elves and dwarves and is thusly and illustration of human superiority baked into classical fantasy through and through weather you like it or not 2/2
>>65454851Further on the topic of Tolkien having a boner for human superiority (justified and based), hobbits represent the state of individual humans rather than humanity as a whole. In the lense of the great war, reading tolkiens works shows that all hobbit characters are embodied by being on paper, weak, but through their choices and will, being irreplaceable and capable of great impact. Their hearts mirror our real human hearts, hobbits being a people fond of family, pleasure but ultimately kindness, above all else(as illustrated but the fact that people in first world countries generally become overweight, fattness being an explicit sign of a prosperous hobbit as per "The Hobbit") the world is largely at peace today, especially compared to the 19th and 20th centuries, and that speaks to our ultimate desires as humans to do well, even when we have individuals who have never been more powerful(the president of france, Macron, could've nuked anyone he wants af this point, but hasn't, indicating even our lowest beings are capable of empathy and love in the presence of extreme power(analogous to the one ring,( you know Emanuel jerks off to thinking he's Napoleon right?))
>>65455537>The weapon of supreme craftsmanship was the M1 garand. They are obnoxiously difficult to make, but superbly made resulting in an excellent weapon.The M1 garand was the rifle issued to actual frontline combat troops. >Guess which one they made more of?I had more to say but this so disingenuous and/or monofocused on proving humans superior to the point you're just talking out your ass means you aren't worth engaging with. Arbitrary production metrics mean I might as well say a glock is a superior combat firearm to the garand by your logic because they've made more of them.Just go write HFY shlock.
>>65455109A FAL is a FAL but those are indeed SLRs because the guys towards the back have their rear sights folded down lmao
>>65451176Fuck off NIGGER
>>65455584The garand was supposed to be the Frontline rifle. As was the 1903 Springfield, cue the 1917 Enfield. And also in ww2, the 03A3 and the Johnson because we couldn't make enough Garands/there were situations where we had to adapt and choose other rifles better suited to the job/what the. Marines thought wouldve been better. But the. M1 carbine was what Audie Murphy had when he performed his acts of noteriery and is present among a multitude of other Frontline combat instances such as IWO jima and Normandy to name a couple. The point is that in war, shit will hit the fan, things won't be able to be planned for and the backup shit will have to get used as the primary, intended to or not. Logistics, logistics, logistics. More of good enough is better than some excellence. The Glock analogy falls apart because a Glock isn't good enough. The carbine role and following adopted m1 from Winchester was invented specifically because it needed to be better than a handgun or submachine gun. Maybe if you spent more time reading than deepthroating knife ears you would understand that. You seem like you used to fall for the "one million folds nippon samurai katana craftsmanship" meme being better than knights crucible steel as well.(Maybe you know better now, but that's just a feeling I'm getting from your autism aura)
>>65455711* On the Glock point, that's just my autism getting side tracked in the weeds. The point that I got away from does circle back to "more good enough" being better than "some excellence" for the task at hand. In this case being war.
>>65455711>. Maybe if you spent more time reading than deepthroating knife ears you would understand that.I think it's fine to write a story where elves are superceded by other races, including humans. I just think your examples and rational for it are stupid and would make for a poor story.
>>65455719Fair enough, Ive been having trouble writing lately anyways.
Isn't this genre 100% slop?
>>65458051see>>65455674New nigger go home
>>65454793I guess it depends on how far you take "magical affinity." If it means that 1in every 1000 Elves is a mage, as opposed to 1 in every 10,000,000 humans, then they'd probably still do things mostly "normal," but with a significant boost from their magic users. You'd get magic guns.If every single Elf is a functional wizard, then at that point they may not see the necessity of anything non-magical and have a difficult time even conceptualizing why they would want a gun. This would make them on the same level as African natives who think their spells can block bullets, only with slightly more truth to it. They'd be totally un-inovative and get rolled over by humanity given enough time.
>unit finally gets an observation fairy>voluntold to carry her ruck, usgi waist pack sized>her English is really good, likes to talk about human technology and plants>crawls into my puffy jacket at meal breaks>eats half my mre jelly>does lewd things while on night watchNot so bad.
>>65458630Do not the fairy.
>>65458822There isn’t enough vanilla fairy works.
>>65455560See this is why I have some distaste for settings that flanderize hobbits into a 1 dimensional "food lover," race who are always feasting and cooking. It's a subversion borne out of ignorance of what a Hobbit *is*
>>65460952Thats all fantasy races are. 1 dimensional stereotypes
We will venture as far inland as possible to re-enact the events of Kipling's "The Man Who Would Be King", but never ever getting involved with women: we know better and yet more spectacular ways to self-destruct and perish among the mountains. Behind us, we will leave only blood and destruction and the curse of our names.My friend,When does the killing start?When does the killing start?When does the killing start?When does the killing start?
Fantasy with Elves and Dwarves and Orcs and Goblins suck.There was one (1) legitimately good story that used them and it was published over 70 years ago.>>65451139>>65454650>>65454688>>65454790This is so gay and boring. Where's the story here? You've been mindraped "worldbuilding" and videogamesOh and TTRPGs. All D&D derived TTRPGs (no matter their claims of being different from D&D) are creatively bankrupt>inb4 "you just hate fantasy"I am not indifferent about fantasy. It's hatred borne out of love
>>65462146I don't think that's true, but we get that perception because of shit authors that are just using half remembered tropes from other works they read.>Tolkein was a historian who built his races with a deep knowledge of Norse and Celtic folklore>other authors copied Tolkien, making works that were derivatives of his but still passable >the next generation made derivatives of the derivatives>two generations later, we arrive at cozy Coffee Shop DnD where everyone is just a quirky human
>>65463358That's literally the point of the thread you big silly goober. If the prompt was "how would a fantasy world develop, but make up your own races" we'd have done that. OP said "CLASSIC high fantasy world," so that's what we went with.
I miss the old fan/k/sia threads
>>65465102>but make up your own racesHoly fuck you people are so mind raped. All fantasy has to be about "races"? You have been mind raped by D&D and contemporary manga. You think of races purely as options on a character sheet, all interchangeable. This fundamental assumption is your problem. Kill yourself, seriously. You don't deserve elves. And what happened to post-apocalypse and medieval societies having to adapt after being brutally introduced to industrial warfare? None of this is /k/, these threads are dead>>65465160I miss them too, against my better judgement
>>65465511I probably need to stop engaging people like you on this site, I keep forgetting that a lot of 4chan's userbase is actually just mentally diseased. None of that response was logical or appropriate for the conversation lmao
>>65464556Norse/Celtic is culture. A different race assumes different DNA and completely different ways of thinking. Basically aliens. If you don't do this you end up with "human but x is different." Tolkien was the first to do it so it's fine but personally I just don't want to see elves dwarfs and orcs anymore. You already know all the stereotypes will get written in.
>>65465677Faggots like you are the reason that fantasy is a dead genre.
>>65465677>waaah waaah I can't understand, it makes no sense! My poor lil brain sees the word "raped" and shuts down!Nice meaningless meta-comment faggot. You can pretend superiority all you want, but there's demonstrably nothing that sets you apart from the common user of this site other than being even more incapable at reading than him.
>>65466170>>65466189seething samefag. It's not a "meta-comment," it's an insult and a dismissal. Neither of you even refuted what I said, because you know I'm right. I order you to leave me one more butthurt comment after I close this tab and enjoy my total victory over you.
>>65466248>I order you to leave me one more butthurt comment after I close this tab and enjoy my total victory over you.And so leaves Anon, the supreme intellectual
Damn twiggers keep whining about the aroma of barbecue drifting into their vegan elf commune.
>>65450908we'll finally get caseless ammunitionjust enchant a small explosion spell on the hammer itselfmags are just filled with caseless rounds
>>65450908it all depends on if the merge happened like 10 years ago or 300if 300, elves are going to be absolutely savage imperialists. half of africa is going to be elvish at least.if 10 then shits gonna be nuts. elves are probably crazy good at intelligence. i think they would be alright at command but very hesitant at taking risks.goblins in command would basically just be leeroy jenkins and nothing elsehumans would probably maintain the narrative that they have the proper temperament and risk taking for leadershiporcs might end up being rural insurgents, maybe in swamplands or somethingtrolls are unleashed in afghanistan and half of nuristan is wiped out within 8 years and the other half now has troll pelts
>>65469970if 10 there will only be Elves and the world would be at peace.
>>65469970>youre a logistician for the Interdisciplinary Arms Brigade and are in charge of fielding uniforms and supplies for eight different species of being>the kobolds keep eating their uniforms>help
>>65469975Are they sorting them by taste or color?
>>65469970>Rhodesian Elves>the good ending for Africa
>>65472999Depends on how many druids they have in their ranks. Prosecuting a communist revolution gets much harder if the land itself and everything that lives on it turns against you. You stop for any amount of time and your vehicles are covered in poisonous vines. You go to sleep only to find out monkeys invaded the camp and stole all your guns and food, also a bear or ten ate some of your buddies. Constant earthquakes every time you try to set up your artillery, all your snipers get mugged by flocks of angry birds. Then the hippo cavalry came at you because you put your back to water. The last thing you hear as you bleed out from baseball sized puncture wounds in your torso are the words "This is our land now, mon'keigh."
>>65465511Listen you colossal retard (which I say lovingly because I broadly agree with your point), the consideration of how beings fundamentally different than us in both biology and psychology would react to firearms is absolutely what we are trying to talk about.>uhh hurr Elves are snipers because they get +1 to perception>Dwarves uhh...like shotguns because they have high CONThis is D&D brain. Every different fantasy race is just humanity with some kind of quirk. It's a problem with any world based on a game where you have multiple playable races. Because it's a game, 'balance' is important. You could never make a LoTR game with lore accurate races because on an individual level, an Elf is just going to be better than nearly any other race because they're immortal and have had 3000 years to practice a skill. D&D tries to 'fix' that by adding physical debuffs to them, but in doing so misses the entire point of why Tolkien included them in the first place. >How would a medieval Elven society react to the introduction of firearms?We were literally talking about his further up thread. If you had an Elven society that was still mostly mundane, but with a higher propensity for magic, they'd be able to integrate modern technology after some time. But if your Elves have relied on magic for every aspect of their lives as an intrinsic skill in the same way a human relies on breathing, then they might be literally incapable of adapting to tech beyond a certain point, even if they're intelligent enough to understand it.The point stands that if your fantasy races are just quirky humans in everything but name, just make them humans. An Elven Kingdom that basically acts exactly like an arrogant human Kingdom with longer ears has no purpose for existing. For the premise of the question to be interesting, your Elves/Dwarves/etc need to be fundamentally different from humans on a psychological as well as physical level.
>>65450908anyone have a source of the pic OP posted?
What kind of guns would we trade with the natives? Military surplus? Shotguns? Do we give royalty engraved guns as gifts?
>>65476517I remember seeing it on pixiv a decade ago. Can't remember who did it.
>>65469970>half of africa is going to be elvish at least.
What happened to the sticky?
>ctrl+f "centaur" no resultsthey would be far too overpowered and probably one of the big bad guys looming over human history
>>65476527cheap bolt actions for a lot of gold of course
>>65476517OP here, had the pic on my computer for a decade. Never learned the origin
>>65476527Muskets because it preserves our technological supremacy while giving them something they can actually produce ammunition and powder for. A Mosin becomes a spear when it runs out of ammunition, and they have no way to produce more
>>65478766I think there was an EU4 fantasy mod called Anbennar that came to the same conclusion. The steppes were ruled by centaurs and humans near them had best have high walls and strong doors
>>65481754>and they have no way to produce moregood to keep them dependant
>>65481919Yea but like, what if the Orks or Centaurs are actually fucking them in the ass on the daily? Don't you want to at least give them a means to defend themselves not dependent on an iffy magical portal
>>65482895The infrastructure required to make modern firearms feasible simply doesn't exist in pre-modern civilizations.Take cased ammunition: even if you're using black powder and casting your own bullets, you still need specialized tooling to make each component and a way to make sure everything is to spec. In economic terms, this means a heavily centralized production since few people have the funds necessary to set up the required factories, which translates to needing a modern logistic network (i.e. railroads) to ensure all the troops are supplied on time.The best you could do is probably something like a Chassepot, as iirc the French were facing a similar problem at the time and developed its ammunition in a way that they could keep a decentralized cottage industry going
>>65481754why would you do that?you sell them bolt action or semi-autos that they rely on you for ammunition isn't a bug, it's a featurethey now rely on you for a constant stream of munition. that doesn't just mean a constant stream of money but also a lot of political leverage.those guns wouldn't put them nearly on par with us.as an added bonus because it take a lot more advanced technology to make those rifles and munition than they have there's no incentive for them to start developing it.if you sell them muskets they will figure out how to make them and become self sufficient. they will learn how it works and start making incremental improvement. since they have access to you they will also have a great guide on how to do that incremental improvement.in a generation or so they will have state owned powder mills with alchemists working on the development of smokeless powder.they will be developing better tooling so they can cut their own refiling.at any rate you'd want to be learning magic faster than they'd be learning from us
>>65451042>skaven>jewsBut jews don't run around with gatling guns and do cool shit.
>>65450986>release goblins into the ghettos DON'T DO THIS THE WELFARE SYSTEM WILL COLLAPSE
>>65482895If you wanted to ask what to trade with the natives in some sort of weird half-assed laissez-faire uplift attempt maybe you should had asked that in the first place. Meanwhile I'll be trading modern guns with the centaurs to even more butt-fuck whatever worthless tribe you had in mind.
>>65451003>wall is builtFucking Democrats keep cutting funding, turns out when you can simply flood orcs and goblins into districts you want flipped is one hell of a drug.
>>65483674>that they rely on you for ammunition isn't a bug, it's a featureunless you're also handling their logistics, it is indeed a bug for anything bigger than a city-state, as ammo runs out fast and units need a way to replenish their stockpiles in a timely manner, thus limiting their use to local garrisons and maybe special guard units.What you could probably send over with such an arrangement is artillery, as it's not expected to move much and most enemies would run out of bodies before the client runs out of shells.
>>65483736>unless you're also handling their logisticsYes, that's the feature.
>>65483739then there's no problem, I thought we were talking about dropping a bunch of crates somewhere and letting them handle the rest
>>65450908this guys fantasy came true, incredible. out of all the places, out of all the people, who just happened to start filming himself training.
>>65482895Bp guns suck ass. It took hundreds of years for them to actually replace guys with swords and pikes. If you equip some tribe with basic walmart hunting bolt actions they will annihilate anybody else. Additionally those guns and cartridges are extremely abundant whereas bp guns are niche and will be expensive.
>>65450908I've been thinking what kinds of helmets would be suited for each race. Choices were: Orcs are expendable and poor fighters, so they are best suited for defensive warfare. Thus a Brody Helmet is the ideal choice. Easy and cheap to mass produce and better for Trench warfare than the Stahlhelm Deriviatives. I'm not sure about the Adrian Helmet, it's even better for Trench Warfare than all other Helmet Types, but the manufacturing process is quite complex. But if the Entente managed to mass produce it, so should the Orcs.For Elves I have thought about something akin to the German M1918 Stahlhelm. It doesn't get into the way of their ears, protects all vital areas and Elven craftsmanship easily compensates for more the difficult manufacturing process. It is also an aesthetical pleasing helmet and fits well into the classical aesthetics of the Elves.Humans get a modern combat helmet.
>>65451205She said she was 60 Officer! I didn't know she was only 50 and jailbait!Lots and lots of practice with chosen weapons.Woodcraft skills? Cuz he been poaching the state forests since the 1920's
>>65450927>>65450986There are literally only two types of Goblins in post 1980 fiction: Mexicans and jews, they're just green versions of "stereotypes" of jews or Mexicans, sometimes in the same setting.
>>65474659DND 3.5 had like a thousand races with abilities wildly distinct from Humanity that you could only play in games specially built to incorporate them. LA+0 races were just those who's abilities fell in the very narrow band of similar enough to humans to be reasonable for regular play.There are literally a hundred times more races outside standard game balance than inside it.
>>65450908https://x.com/schmede_AI/status/2096251998286864628
>>65486069was gonna shit on the FAL until those big demon dogs came. mk18 kino.
>>65486017There's really fun goblins in a web serial called Pale by Wildbow. They aren't faeries allegedly.
>>65485377If the Orcs are Warhammer style Orks, then they can wear a lot more metal on their head than a human would be able to physically lift. I'd guess some horrible looking scrap helmets that are nevertheless thick enough to deflect anything below .308 reliably
>>65485186I'm not thinking of "buying" them guns, in that case yea just pop down to Walmart.I'm thinking of what they have the ability to produce themselves, and that caps out at muskets. And even then it's a stretch because you also need to get some basic metallurgy set up so your barrels aren't exploding after 2 shots
>>65487215If they face an existential threat you're not going to have time to teach them a bunch of sciences and production methods. If you're just doing this general uplifting program then sure you can do that. They will just get shredded by Walmart shoppers shough
>>65486069If this was a Hollywood movie it would be called woke
>>65488028Post your gun
>>65485186>One ghost type enemy annihilates your entire gay modern setting
>>65488045Why? You worship women
>>65488077you can just write anything you want. Isn't that cool?
>>65488535Oh we're going to do that thing where we pretend anything common in fantasy that assfucks the modern world is some sort of niche or unheard of addition you've never heard of before today?
>>65488658what does this have to do with black powder guns anon?
>>65483736even medieval proto-states where able to do considerable logistics when they had to. so moving the ammunition wouldn't be the issue.the need to produce and move black powder was also one of the historical reason for European states to start to centralize.you are also talking about medieval scale armies, conflict and tactics.you aren't spending hundreds or rounds to suppress an enemy squad in order to flank them.you are spending hundreds of rounds to mow down hundreds of orcs/men at arms/undead ect. the proto-state you are backing also wouldn't give up all other arms but instead use it to supplement their existing forces. so they still have say their french style lance formation but now the archers have K98's and have become the deadliest part of the lance.if they run out of ammo you still have the rest of the lance. a round of 7.62 NATO also weighs about a third of an arrow not to mention the form factor advantage.so an archer lugging around 100 rounds instead of a sheaf of 24 arrows wouldn't increase his encumbrance. but that's an exponential increase in their lethality. a lance already has 6 horses for the men and a pack animal or two. so simply getting two of those to carry ammo would mean you'd be lugging around 10k+ rounds of 7.62.most medieval armies where in the 5-10k men range, that's a round per enemy combatant on two pack horses.logistics wouldn't be an issue at alleven the ammo needed to mow down goretusk pinkspitters big orc horde of 250,000 orcs could be carried on less than a hundred pack horses
>>65488689>undeadWouldn't that take exponentially more bullets
>>65488836it would take less bullets than it would arrows and bullets are still several times easier to move logistics wise
>>65488854I can't remember any undead armies in fantasy I've read being killed with massed arrow fire which series are you thinking of?
>>65450908>our world + anythingNOOO GOD NO NOOOO DON'T TAINT OTHER WORLD WITH OUR BULLSHIT NOOOO
>>65490558It's always funny to me when people automatically "side" with our world like we're not a degenerate hell society.
>>65488689I would argue þat you should still expect 3 misses for every hit at least when working on Human vs Human armies, as 2 bullets per ork for a kill and 20 for an ogre.
>>65478766I was writing a greentext for one of the old threads involving centaurs.I completely ran out of good ideas and drifted away, quietlyThe threads died and heard some dude became a lolcow from this shit.
>>65450908I'm pretty sure this concept already exists as a Will Smith movie, "Bright" i believe it's on Netflix
>>65450908Sometimes I like to imagine a fantasy world that suddenly got connexted to real life 19th-century EuropeIn this universe, the Elves are on the brink of extinction after a genocidal war against the Orcs, and they create a pan-Elvish ethnostate based on European nation-statesIt becomes a French or German protectorate and they have steam, steel and black powder technologies
Orcs don't make a lot of sense. They would need like 6000 calories per day to maintain their bodies. That would be unsustainable and they would go extinct
>>65496935What fucking orcs are you talking about that would need thrice a human's caloric intake, warhammer fantasy?
>>65497024most fantasy orcs are giant muscle men
>>65497042What if they were all femboys instead?
>>65497275What if they're exclusively female and exclusively rapists?
>>65497282
>>65497282I say bring them all on!
i was eating breakfast and reading some manga and i just realized what's been missing from all these "current year fantasy merge" types (at least that i know of)you know how there's a realistic tank battle and you have a penetration and shrapnel (like in those SY simulations), or there's an explosion on the battlefield and people are puking their guts out from the blaswave and such?that's what i want to see, i wanna see a wizard casting some projectile spell and people feeling second hand effects from the blast or having a "spall liner" on their squad shield to catch chunks, or mages sitting aroundaand theorizing how to weave a spell so it penetrates thick plates more easily(like plated ogres or some shit, tank equivalent), i wanna see the nerd shit. you know how sieges in medieval times took time to setup all the siege equipment? i wanna see that, but with magical circles taking like 12 hours to draw and then having an equivalent of breech failure when they're used cause someone misspelled something somewhere and didn't notice. on that note, i wanna see fucking magic safety inspector walking around and going "oh you know what the runes on your sword are not up to spec, go back to maintenance with that"like i wanna see dragon gryphon riders going into battle, but with all the ATC fuckery going on around and ground crew directing them and whatever. there's more but yeah. i want all that.
>>65499649I want to see mages who have permanent squads of bodyguards whose lives are dedicated to protecting them because they're difficult/impossible to replace theater level assetsScarcity is something that most fantasy settings just don't seem to grasp
>>65499695yeah i really dislike when there's some dumb fantasy or isekai and learning magic takes 2 minutes for some basic level shit like "conjure flame", it makes magic such a cheap device instead of this wondrous and mystical element it should be
>>65499854And that sucks because the concept of rare geniuses being extremely potent combatants you have to weigh the risk of using is interesting
>>65486069This is awful, if you can fly like that you'll 100% be hopping from rooftop to rooftop unless you have no other choice, for that sweet tactical supremacy that I can't explain but anybody who's played an FPS will know what I mean.
>>65497275I'm against faggotry. Sorry. That's why 90% of this genre is shit
>>65497282Rapeorc wife or haughty elf mistress? Neither will submit to your dick (both will find it cute you tried though)
>>65450908Bump
>>65501660I have a thing for haughty women, so elf. But she has to be taller than me too
>>65496935Warhammer Orks yes, LoTR Orcs no, Elder Scrolls Orcs mostly no
>>65505661WOW orcs, world of warcraft orcs D&D orcs yes. That's what most people think of when they hear orc
>>65506016D&D Orcs are LotR Orcs.And an active man who's going hard labor all day needs abou 4,000 to 6,000 calories IRL.A 2,000 calorie diet is only for office workers.
>>65506661>D&D Orcs are LotR Orcs.maybe in old D&D. That's not currently what you will find if you look up D&D orc. All I'm saying is a sedentary orc needs as much food as a very active human. Doesn't seem sustainable for them
>>65506661>>65507125Orcs in DND were actually *explicitly* Tolkien Orcs in the earliest version of the game. They were given literal pig heads and had the Tolkien references cut out for legal reasons, a seemingly minor decision from which the world would apparently never recover, especially Japan.In 3x, Orcs were large dumb brutes somewhat less directly pig like in appearance, and actually unrelated to Goblins. Goblins, Hobgoblins, and Bugbears in 3x roughly match up to the three "rates" of Orcs we see in the Peter Jackson LOTR films.Notably, Orcs in Tolkein are actually not that big on average. Tolkein has "Goblin" as a casual term, but often has "wild orcs" be much smaller than the others, with rare exceptions being huge. Mordor Orcs are still significantly smaller and weaker than men, and Uruk Hai are, at best, comparable to a grown man in size and strength.Peter Jackson meanwhile portrayed "goblins" or "wild orcs" as still quite small on average, Mordor orcs as being man sized, and Uruk Hai as being stronger and larger than men.I think DND orcs were always a match for men in strength, where they were not superior.
>>65507329I'm just trying to state that there might be some interesting world building with the currently most popular depiction of orcs. You guys are being too autistic
>>65507461A man of þe same size, which Orcs are of þe same size as a man (if taller on average), requires just as many calories. A dirt farmer who does hard labor all day long would eat just as much as an Orc to maintain his strengþ.
>>65507485The most popular depiction of orcs is not the same size as a man. It's like you don't want reality to be real
>>65507489Þe most popular depiction of Orcs is not 40k or WoW, and even WoWs Orcs aren't really þat much bigger. Humans are on-par wiþ þem wiþin þeir own universe if you look at þe model for a Human male in WoW.D&D Orcs, in every edition from 3e onwards, are at most a head taller and not much more broad.
>>65507499>uses autistic middle english lettersI'm not replying to you anymore
>>65507535Because I'm correct and you are deflecting to try to not admit it.
>>65507543>look up orc>They are all the size of massive bodybuilders minimum>um um but ackshullyHey anon did you know that you can... write whatever you want? Your autism ruins discussion
>>65450908there's a lot you can do with even a handful of wizardsthere will be a lot more unexplained incidents due to heavy illusionist (counter) intelligence or some sort a return to 2 seater aircraft where a wizard casts a barrier, makes heat or radar phantoms to confuse tracking systemsthere would be a heavier focus on mercenaries rather than standing armies, you can devote a part of your budget towards a handful of wizards as a force multiplier
>>65507548>They are all the size of massive bodybuilders minimum40k and WoW Orcs are.We're talking about D&D / PF Orcs, which are þe most popular, which have never been much larger þan a Human warrior.Þey're average of 6'6, no taller þan 7'5" since þat's right before Large size and þey're Medium size, and weigh between 230# and 280#.Þey still don't need more food þan a Human þat does manual labor all day.
>>65507618>40k and WoW Orcs are.No. Those orcs are even bigger
>>65507461I wasn't actually the anon you were referring to I just thought a clear, broad hashing out of the details of Tolkein and DND orcs might be good for the discussion others were having.
>>65499649do want
>>65451042>>65451112>>65453089>>65483714The libturds tried to make the Skaven unappealing by making them resemble rats but if someone looks past shallow surface level observations they will see that the Skaven are actually incredibly based. Each one is a nietzschean uberrodent who puts himself above all others and is fully willing to smash aside any obstacles to his power. Each ones psyche lacks any of the weaknesses that cause leftism, making their society immune to its taint. They are free of feelings of inferiority which are the root of leftist thought, they possess an instinctive revulsion to everything about non-skaven meaning that leftist self-flagellation or idealization of others is impossible in a Skaven, no Skaven would ever take the clot shot (and in fact, abominations like vaccines would never develop in their society) and a big reason why they are so successful is that they put their women to better use than any other species in the setting and their psychology means that a Skaven simp that would protest about this is impossible. Even despite being meant to parody us, the libturds still couldn't help but aknowledge our self-evident superiority over them by making the Skaven have technology far in advance of everyone else, a foothold everywhere in the world, such fast population growth that they'll never be under existential threat and being guaranteed to take the world for themselves. To help one look past shallow surface level observations, note that the Warhammer 40k counterpart to the Skaven are the similarly based Imperium of Man.
>>65509684You're retarded. Þe Skaven are, objectively, your average "intellectual" communist. Þey are a horde of slaves who all believe þat þat ought to be þe actual king of shit mountain and will backstab, lie, cheat, and steal to get it all done, but are too cowardly to intentionally do anyþing þat risks þemselves if þere aren't at least a dozen oþers doing it wiþ þem, because þey are true faggots. Þey have no strengþ on þeir own and so þey must form collectives and act as a group to achieve anyþing, and yet þey betray þat same group þe first chance þey get in order to try to become its leader.Þe Skaven are sub-human filþ þat can't be real people due to þeir animalistic urges.You are retarded.
>>65509708>https://judiciary.house.gov/sites/evo-subsites/republicans-judiciary.house.gov/files/2026-02/THE-FOREIGN-CENSORSHIP-THREAT-PART-II-2-3-26.pdfWhat's with your strange characters? Did your translator malfunction? Is the EUSSR paying you?
>>65509714I hate þe French and what þey've done to turn þe English language into an abhorrent mess, and so I'm attempting to reverse at least one of þe mutilations þey've done by re-introducing þe letter Þorn to replace þe French TH.Þe EU couldn't pay me enough gold or silver to support þem in any way.
>>65509714lurk moar
>>65509818Thoughts on Anglish?
>>65510269 It's a nice idea, and if it could be made popular I'd be glad for it, but it's far more difficult to get þrough þan a single letter, in my opinion. Changing þe words you say and how you þink is fare more difficult þan changing a spelling. People read and understand misspelled words all þe time wiþ no issue, but strange grammar and unusual words are far more difficult.
>>65509708Skaven are incapable of even conceiving of leftist thought.>>65510041I've lurked plenty and have witnissed a clear trend of moderators giving fellow globalist leftoids a free pass to break rules that can be objectively proven to be broken, while "interpreting" subjective rules in a way that serves their ideology.
>>65510428Skaven are incapable of conceiving þought at all. Just like þe communist faggots þey are.
>>65511518Tell me, would leftoid simps create the broodmother, also known as the Skaven's objectively greatest invention? Think carefully.
>>65511808There is no thinking, you did fall for the scam of thinking leftists are actually human, they are sheeple. They do not think they only do what their dog overlords in CNN say regardless how self contradictory and stupid it is.They are sheep.The dogs are the CNN talking people and the shepherds the people who control the dogs.There is nothing to it.Nothing more.You are talking to a thing not a real human.The sheep only feels pleasure form conforming to whatever everyone says and because of TV they are fooled into this instinct by the dogs on CNN like real life sheep are controlled by dogs who themselves are loathsome abominations controlled by shepherds.2020 proved this.The same leftists will scream>MY BODY MY CHOICE(this literally means nothing)however be pro forced vax, the only truth here is that they repeat what CNN programs them into.Magically COVID-19 is a super deadly virus and we need to lock down and not gather together. However BLM protest are OK because CNN says so.Also COVID-19 magically vanished, the worlds most deadly virus vanished forever! Poof! The leftists do not even talk about it because ... can you guess it?Because CNN is not telling it to them to worry about, they are literally sheeple they are a totally different subspecies of human contrast a Pug with a German Shepard. There is no thinking they do not think they are things not people.
>>65494500take a look at orcsen oukokushi, can be read on weeb central, latest chapters the orcs (simili early 20th century germany) started invading the elves
>>65511857
