>one man gets the rifle, the other man gets the bulletsWhy did the Soviets do this? Why not give one man the rifle AND the bullets, and leave the other guy empty-handed?
>>65452461The rifle was loaded.
>>65452461They read the training manual for a machinegunner and applied it to a mosin nagant for some reason.
>>65452461They didn't do it, Hollywood made it up.
>one man get the cheeto, the other man gets the crumbs
it was okay because german bullets were handcrafted by artisans that took frequent time off / the avergae Soviet woman laid 100 soviet eggs every day , which took only a month to hatch and fully mature / soviet troops had iron-infused exoskeletons and 3 pairs of hearts so germans needed either a full mg42 belt or a direct hit from an anti-tank rifle to kill one
>>65452512Literal fucking orcs
>>65452497Commies always lie, therefore Hollywood showed the truth.
>>65452461Rifle was loaded and Lend-Lease needed time since the Soviet agents of influence had to work their deception in Hollywood and the US Federal Government according to the Verona Papers and defectors.
>>65452461Its a myth. >Fucking nu-/k/ casuals.
>>65452461Such an aweful movie. Not suprising /k/retards cherish it.
>>65452632Its an awesome movie, if you accept that it is a movie and not a documentary.
>one man get the dildo, the other man gets the dress>>65452597At least orcs would only eat each other sometimes
>>65452598Hollywood is composed of commies. Well, uber rich commie advocates.
>>65452461>Why did the Soviets do this? Why not give one man the rifle AND the bullets, and leave the other guy empty-handed?This never happened. The Soviets were faced with a shortage of Mosin Nagant rifles throughout the war.
>>65452632>Ed Harris>Bob Hoskins>Rachel Weisz's butt>terribleYou disgust me.
>>65452597even orcs arent this sadistic unless the writer is really going for some edgelord shit. its really beyond fiction at this point, you would think its over the top if you saw it on screen
The thing is, Soviets had tremendeous difficulties of getting their supplies to where it was needed. It wasn't that they didn't have rifles or ammo, it was that the transprotation and logistics network was a total clusterfuck. A lot of the times their men didn't get stuff like clothing or food or ...well, anything else, because transportation capacity is limited and some other things took priority. Sure, trains might carry tanks, but tanks need things like ammo and fuel. Men might be delivered, but men need food and shoes and tents and such, and those are NOT the highest priority (for whatever soviet commisariat reason). So by the time the battle is upon you, you might still be missing half of your stuff because it's on another train on the other side of the country. But you sure have those parade uniforms and the marching band ready for the inevitable victory parade. Shit like that happened all the time in soviet military.
>>65452598Nah the autistically-detailed Soviet archives revealed the actual nature of the Eastern Front when they were finally opened. They were suffering supply issues, yes, but not so bad that they couldn't afford to issue rifles and ammunition to mobiks.
>>65452597Orcs have the concept of honor
>>65452636>they always use a dildo in the beatingsAt this point I'm starting to believe this is standard issue kit for the Russin army, like an entrenching tool or a canteen
>>65453151at the beginning of 1942 the red army had most of its forces concentrated around moscow, the south was less protected and struggled when the germans decided to push there. it probably took the soviets some time to get stuff 900km further south.
>>65453158>one man get the dildo, the other man hangs on the treeIt's a very unique and traditional military accessory, the tactical rubber dick
>>65452656for me it's Ron Perlman's ridiculous accent
>>65452630>>65452632GTFO back to /pol/, tankie. You don't belong here.
>>65452598more than likely some russians saw this and took it as good advice
>>65452461>one man gets the rifle, the other man gets the bulletsThat's what Hitler thought.
>>65452461Did the movie mention that the master race was so tough at that time that it wasn't even supposed to use winter clothing during winter? Just asking, I don't watch slop.I would watch it if they mentioned it tho.
>>65453203Didn't the guy know that the vatnik didn't have any bullets in his ppsha? And that it doesn't work anyway as it's just communist crap? Was he stupid or he just didn't pay attention during his party meetings?
>>65453203>Seething so hard about a movieLmao, this is why you're a fading power, Ivan.
>>65453274>they might have raped us without lube but they were stuuupiiiiid! boohoo!Naziboos are reaching levels of cope only Andrew "the bullet might have just disintegrated mid-air" Wilson was capable before.
>>65453203They did have clothing in stalingrad and in 1941 too. The decision to prioritize ammo and fuel in logistics over things like clothing as they pushed towards Moscow was intentional. And then it bit them in the butt. And of course unnecessary if not for germans changing plans like 3 times instead of deciding to go for Moscow and staying with that decision in June.
>>65453312>They did have clothing in stalingrad and in 1941 too.I'd bet my left nut that this is not what the Soviet movies have already established beyond doubt tho.
>>65453312>they did have clothing>they prioritized ammo and fuel over clothingAndrew?
>>65453312Going for Moscow was retarded since Germany would not have had fuel to go any further or do anything else. It was Halder being a mouth breather, completely lacking any kind of strategic understanding of Germany's situation and thinking they could kick Russia out of the war by taking their capital city.
That scene with Rachel Weisz made my teenage peepee diamonds. Good movie just because of that.
>>65452461Add it to the "List of things that never happened at The Battle Of Stalingrad" along with human wave tactics and infantry being machine gunned en masse as they retreat.
>>65453308>tankie is so retarded he answers to the wrong commentThey are not sending their best
>>65453349germans winning the war was predicated on a lot of things that were not possible due to strategic errors made by them in the past, such as prompting the US to do lend lease and making it clear they were going to genocide or at least horribly mistreat any soviet states that did surrender
>>65453369We’ve literally seen the Russians apply these tactics to the Slav bumfight war.Frankly at this point I fully believe everything this movie says because reality has proven it true in real time.
>>65453394"I reject your reality and substitute my own because I don't like Putin." - Average /k/ommando
>>65453394Russians today are not fully engaged in a world war
>>65453397Nigger we literally saw trench raid footage against mobiks who weren't issued any ammunition earlier in the war. The Russian Army gets dunked on here because they managed to limbo under everyone's lowest expectations for them time and time and time again. Get the fuck out of here.
>>65453405And what the fuck does that have to do with the reality of Stalingrad? Literally nothing
>>65453386Are they in the room with us right now anon?
>>65453409What indeed, pidor.
>>65453389>such as prompting the US to do lend lease What prompted the U.S. to do Lend-Lease was the Axis fighting against countries that were important trading partners of the U.S. and the U.S. being smart enough to know that sitting idle while two rival powers try to become hegemons on their respective continents.Hence why the U.S. already wnacted the Lend-Lease act minths before the Axis declared war.https://www.archives.gov/milestone-documents/lend-lease-act?>least horribly mistreat any soviet states that did surrenderWouldn't have made a difference. There is not a battle that would have been won by the Germans if they treated the Soviets differently. Any organised group opposing the Bolsheviks has already been depleted during the Civil War and Stalin's purges. Not to forget, the Germans got millions of Eastern Collaborators, in fact they got more than they could arm, yet alone supply. A few hundred tousand more wouldn't have made a difference, what Germany needed was Industry and capable soldiers, not a rabble of anti-Soviet rebels with a rifle. You can see how non-chalantly annihilated the non-German Axis Flanks after the battle of Stalingrad with negligible casualties, Soviet collaborators would have fared even worse.What caused Germany to lose the war was that there were unable to mobilise Europe for Total War. Germany pulled its weight, so did Italy after 1942, but the occupied Territories and minor Axis nations were incapable of providing a satisfying amount of military help, yet alone cover the industrial needs of the Axis. And desu, there was no possibility of the Axis ever archieving sny better results, regardless of how well they treated the other European Countries. Europe simply hated the Axis, they preferred Britain and the US, long before they were even invaded by the Axis. Germany simply did not have the global support and was unable to ever regain it after they lost WW1 and were strategically isolated by the Entente.
>>65453414Yes, talking to one rn
>>65453158>standard issue kit for the Russin army, like an entrenching tool or a canteenAs if.
>>65452461They didn't want the second man getting shot searching the first man for ammo.
>>65453441>the conscripts could go fuck themselves IF I DIDN'T BUY ALL THE SILICONE COCKS
>>65453404Functionally, they are. Hell Moscow is getting bombed.
>>65452497They absolutely did that and are doing the same in ukraine today
>>65453369Why do you lie? Pidor stupidity and savagery was well documented throughout the OstfrontWhat's next? Katyn never happened, but if it did, it was the le heckin naziiiiis
>>65453349In their defence, they assumed the soviets would surrender at that point. They where wrong in hindsight. But you gotta remeber they've already snuffed out over 110 divisions at this point, any other nation would have surrendered way before anything close to those numbers.
>>65453404That is not what their propaganda machine and war economy is saying
>>65453203>one man gets the rifle and shoots, the other man in the pit gets the bullets
>>65453349They did knock them out just 20 years earlier so bad it led to the imperial collapse. Then the winter war happened just before barbarossa. Why the fuck do you think it was stupid for them to assume pidors were doable going into the invasion? Your hot takes straight from your ass with 20/20 hindsight?Especially given that pidoraskha cockroaches were massing gigantic formations into the border regions looking for an opportunity to strike first. Where do you think the 110 divisions smashed in the first six months of the war came from? They were sniffing flowers and dindu nuffins
>>65453500People don’t want to admit that you can make the smart choice, in this case Hitler attacking Russia before Russia could attack Germany, and still lose.Sometimes things don’t go right no matter what.
>>65452461>Why did the Soviets do this?For context, this was only ever done for penal battalions, and very rarely. Generally, even penal battalions were usually actually just given gear like normal, because you kind of fucking need that shit if you're expected to do soldiering and produce some sort of useful result.Sending dudes out like that was more like a sort of special semi-capital punishment, you've really pissed of your superiors and the state, especially so, but let's see if you can actually pull through and live to see another day.>>65452497They DID actually do this (on at least two occasions, maybe a couple more), but it wasn't standard or widespread practice by any metric. It's the kind of dramatic and striking thing which is good for a movie though, and it's a shocking idea, which is what makes it stick in the popular imagination.>>65453151Soviet Russia in WW2 got very substantial help from the American Lend Lease. Food, fuel, ammunition, trucks, etc. Good shit which they needed and put to good use.>>65452598>the liars lied about the liars>therefore one of them aren't liars after all>>65453369"The Bolsheviks can be very cruel."
>>65452461That was only at start of Barbarossa when Red Army was in middle of fixing it's shit. But this was no longer thing during Stalingrad. They fixed their shit to actually start winning more (also allied gibs helped). They would never win if they had situations like "2 guys for 1 riffle" so far into war, or they would lost at this point
>>65453500>>65453525The Soviets were not planning to attack Germany any time soon and the Red army concentrated in the western districts of the USSR only represented half of the Red Army strength, far too low to actually conduct a succesfull defense against the Axis forces, let alone go on the offensive.Kind hard to destroy the Red Army on the border in a battle of encirclement when more than half the Red Army isn't there. Its those divisiosn that were shifted west to replace losses, fill gaps and conduct constly counter attacks while a general mobilizitaion of millions of reservists started.
>>65452512I'm actually starting to think calling Russians "the niggers of Europe" is kinda unfair to niggers
>>65453564>russia a gud boi he dindu nuffin
>>65453492Are these the guys without rifles or without bullets, because I am confused?Are you sure that they aren't some deserters which the Nazi Germany was executing by the tens of thousands but they are getting some hazing in Putin's Russia?
>>65453564>not planning to attack Germany anytime soonSo they were going to attack and got preemptively attacked before they could do everything they need?Wow! Thanks for playing! Goodnight folks!
>>65453607It says in the subtitles you fucking retard
>>65453655Just checking if you're even literate. kek imbecile
>>65452461one man bends over, the other man spreads the cheeks
>>65453667>I was only Pretending to be retarded!
>>65453681Fucktard, did you even read the OP? It's like talking to apes with you.
>>65453570calling russia "nigeria with snow" has been unfair to nigeria for quite some time now
>>65452512Are these ziggers feeding penalized and likely raped ziggers? If so, I wonder, if he fell into the hole, would one scream "Looks like meat is back on the menu, boys!"
>>65453680Assisted rape IS pretty hot.But only if it’s women on the receiving end.
>>65453570Niggers are Niggers because either they didn't know better, or they were too stupid to know better, so it is entirely true that "Russian" should be a worse slur than a "Nigger", because Russians are creatures that know better, but consciously decide to behave like Niggers. Well, there are already languages, where some variant of Russo already means that, but it's a shame that English is not one of them.
>>65452512>>65452636every time I think zigger inhumanity can't get any lower, they manage to surprise me again>>65453158why yes, he's obviously using the Izdeliye-69 Disciplinary, Interrogation, Leadership, & Drill Object>>65453559> trucks, etc. Good shit which they needed and put to good useat least half the Red Army's logistics trucks was American Lend-Lease; without it they would have been rail-bound and all those encirclements would never have been pulled off in time
>>65453917>Assisted rape IS pretty hot.>But only if it’s women on the receiving endand she is doing the assisting, i.e. spreading herself for the rapeperfection
>>65453485moscow was the logistic center of the entire soviet west. taking it would have cut the country in half and make north-south and west-east logistics very difficult. it probably would have knocked out the soviet unions ability to concentrate its forces around stalingrad later on.
>>65453158Many such cases.
>>65453432as i said, nazis were never going to win ww2 because their whole ideology was comprised of doing stupid shit that made everyone else hate them. they were so retarded and insufferable that the western world preferred a commie rape army over them. hence the lend lease and the world ganging up on them>Wouldn't have made a differenceit would have but it's hard to say how much. maybe germany wouldn't have been stretched so thin camping out in those soviet satellite states if they didn't all hate them. having ukrainians, poles etc. hate the germans more than they hated the russians did not help the germans at all. of course the nazis really did not care for them much at all and never intended to "liberate" them from the soviets, so its a moo point anyway. like a cow made it.
>>65454079https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2dJ-JUzhVs
>>65453175>Basic historical knowledge makes you a tankie One thing the Russians were not struggling with was manpower and equipment. The thing they were struggling with (and still do) is wildly incompetent leadership and zero regard for the lives of their men.
>>65453151>autistically-detailed Soviet archivesverified by whom exactly
>>65452636These looks like caveman hobos. They can barely stand
>>65454363Not him, but I know that the whole Katyn Massacre thing was actually documented in extensive detail by the Soviet Russians, and it was found after the end of the union and it was declassified, even if modern Russia still pretends that Germany did it.
>>65454363Sekrit dokuments comrade ))))))
>>65453349>Going for Moscow was retardedI take it you have never seen the railway map
>>65454034That’s neither assisted nor rape.Come on man, read the goddamn post before replying.
>>65454684I believe that's the joke
>>654541031) >as i said, nazis were never going to win ww2Yes, because Germany was unable to win WW2. If anything, only the Fanaticism of the Nazis could even bring Germany that far into the war.>because their whole ideology was comprised of doing stupid shit that made everyone else hate them. Diplomacy is a skill, but not magic. The countries that the Nazis were going against were all already opposed to Germany becoming a hegemon (USA, France, Britain), the USSR was only trading to buy time, but still hellbent on turning Germany into a Soviet puppet state as soon as they reorganised their military and industry,... . The Nazi's racial ideology did not change much about how Germany conducted its foreign policy, in fact the Nazis seperated their "irrational views" from the Military and politics quite successfuly, at least until 1944 where the war was about to end anyway.>they were so retarded and insufferable that the western world preferred a commie rape army over them. hence the lend lease and the world ganging up on themAllying with the 3rd strongest power to defeat the 2nd strongest one which is about to become the 1st strongest has always been French and British Policy. That the USSR became a world power afterwards is solely owed to the weakness of the West to proceed with Operation Unthinkable. Your dream of the le based West was only possible if Germany just decided to become a vassal of Western Interests. In hindsight it may have been the wiser choice, but just put yourself into the boots of a German at the time. Did you seriously want your nation to be denied the place at the sun to have an alliance with the people that just imposed a (from your eyes) harsh treaty and starved your country in WW1? And to prevent a missunderstanding, I'm not insinuating that Germany was an innocent victim oppressed by the evil western powers or anything, I see Germany like I see France and Britain,
>>654547852) as an European power trying to establish itself as a hegemon. It failed in the end, but the rationale at the time was supportint the Nazis.>it would have but it's hard to say how muchAgain, it wouldn't. If you give a bunch of illiterate peasants a rifle, they will only hinder your actual forces. Look at the non-German Axis Forces, they disintegrated at the first contact against the Soviets because they were essentially WW1 militaries in the wrong war. What do you think could a few hundred tousand more starved russians with even worse training and equipment hope to archieve? And again, even if the Germans acted nice, they still wouldn't have enjoyed wide support because shocker, people don't like conquerers regardless of how benevolent they act, just look at the U.S. deployments in Iraq, Somalia and Afghanistan. The vast majority of people will root for their own butcher over a foreign benevolence. The Germans still would have struggled with Partisans, to an even worse degree because acting nice would have allowed the Partisans more freedom to operate inside their country without fearing civilian casualties.
>>65452461>>65452512One man enters the other man and soon everyone will know everything
>Why did the Soviets do this?1. Soviet army was gearing for an invasion into Europe, it planned to fight an offensive war on foreign soil. Everything was geared, planned and prepared for this. 2. Thus, when the Germans struck first (critically during the pre-invasion preparations), the whole system collapsed on itself, even more so in terms of logistics. And without logistics they weren't able to move enough stuff for soldiers, even if they did have it in stock (often they did not). Literally all of the soviet logistics had to be re-created with the help of lend-lease from allies.3. This was even more fucked up due to the command structures and army purge Stalin did due to his paranoia. Basically the army was cucked from acting independently and waited for a top-down command for everything, which never arrived during the first days because Stalin went borderline catatonic since all the years of planning his "Invasion into Europe" fell apart once Hitler invaded. Up until the day of the invasion Stalin though that he outplayed everyone, fooled everyone and was the smartest guy among leaders. To the point that he ignored his own foreign intelligence reports from all sides which were screaming bloody murder about the German invasion. "Nah, couldn't be. I'm smart, I fooled Germans, I'll stab them in the back." and shit.
>>65453151My nergo, the soviet archives in mosqueov are stilled closed. Why are you trying to fool here?
>>65452630It's not, faggot. Painting it as a myth is russia propaganda which you faggots ate up for decades.
>>65452656>Rachel Weisz's buttPost it
>>65454922They were open in the 90s and through the early 00s.
>>65454964Just a small bit of them and they weren't fully open. And definitely for not as long. AFAIK specific people would have to request specific things and it they'd think about providing access to a limited set of shit. A ton was and still is classified. They extend the classified status every few years by 20+ years into the future. It's an open secret that none of that crap will ever be opened because it would undermine the state and regime's founding myths and such.
>>65454785>The Nazi's racial ideology did not change much about how Germany conducted its foreign policy, in fact the Nazis seperated their "irrational views" from the Military and politics quite successfuly, at least until 1944 where the war was about to end anyway.>Germany foreign policy of invading and genociding it's neighbors didn't have anything to do with their "racial policy".Yep it was only those crazy ebil SS not that stalwart and morally clean Wehrmacht. Most of Germany didn't even like Hitler!
>>65454925>Painting it as a myth is russia propagandaBeevor, Glantz and House are soviet propagandists? lol, get the fuck out.
>>65455174glantz definitely has some bias even though hes very knowledgeable. he has a slant toward rehabilitating the image of the soviets from the western perspective after years of mainstream glazing of germany
>>65452461I used to think this was a myth until I saw Russia rapidly degrade into this same kind of shit in Ukraine.Enemy at the Gates is 100% realistic
>>65452512something you'd expect to see in a nazi death camp or maybe soviet gulag
>>65454684>>65454737what I mean is, it'd be hot if you are blackmailing her or have a gun or something and forcing her to rape herself, if you know what I mean
>>65455385>one man gets the stick, the other men get the whacksHow its always been!
>Why did the Soviets do this?they didn't. besides the first few months of the war, what the Soviets usually lacked was manpower
When the soviet union collapsed and Kalashnikov was free to be honest, he made it quite clear how catastrophically fucked the small arms situation was. It doesn't matter what soviet archival sources are released, the "it never happened" tards don't read anyway.
>>65455654There is quite a bit of stretch between "they lacked guns" and "they were giving guns to some people and bullets to somebody else". The former might be a historic fact in certain periods and fronts of the war, the latter is a sheer pathetic idiocy - but not of the Soviets but of the contemporary germanophiles.
>>65455170Small, slightly unrelated story. In school I have always hated the text comprehension tasks and wondered what use they could have in real life. Thanks for enligthening me how useful it actually is by demonstrating a total lack of reading comprehension. Seriousness aside, that's not my point retard nor what I even try to imply. Let the text run through chat gpt and then try again.>Germany foreign policy of invading and genociding it's neighbors didn't have anything to do with their "racial policy".How about you actually read Mein Kampf before trying to engange in a discussion about nazis? German expansionism in the East had nothing to do with their racist beliefs against the Slavs which don't get me wrong, certainly were present. Hitler said that they needed the territory and resources to survive a prolonged Conflict against the other great powers. They did not invade the USSR to kill a bunch of people for the sake of it and if that's the view you have on WW2, perhaps /his/ might be more suited for you.
>>65453265>PPsH>doesn't workBruh.
>>65453425>because jews staged color revolutionsI love how Jews are able to seamlessly manipulate people, especially those who opressed jews and actively were the biggest jew haters until mustache man.
>>65454917>the commies were planning to invade Europe >they get completely blindsided by the ReichOnly one of these happened.
>>65454115>reeee ruslims had enough rifles n shiet nibba I swear!>disproven by mobiks getting rusty aks and ww2 helmets with rusty holes in them>also disproven by rusnigger columns running out of gas in the opening days of invasion>also disproven by ziggers buying everything they need on wb and ozonGet rekt, subhuman.
>>65455628Of course when you make your platoon run into mg fire and lose 50% of your men on the first day on the frontlines, you now lack 50% of manpower. Just like a week ago.
>>65455853the soviets had already invaded finland, the baltic countries, poland and romania at this point. they got blind sided by germany, because they didnt think the germans would attack them while the war against the commonwealth was still going and italy kind of being in bad situation and needing help.
>>65455721Ironic trolling is still trolling.
>>65454785>The Nazi's racial ideology did not change much about how Germany conducted its foreign policy, in fact the Nazis seperated their "irrational views" from the Military and politics quite successfulyNot really; if Hitler and his cabal had been less irrational, they should actually have allied with the French against the British (which ultimately did happen) instead of the other way round, because the French fascists were far more sympathetic to their anti-Communist viewsbut the Nazis and most Germans were hell-bent on making France pay for WW1 and Versailles>Allying with the 3rd strongest power to defeat the 2nd strongest one which is about to become the 1st strongest has always been French and British Policy.that's Nazi and Soviet cope and is as reductive as claiming that Nazis didn't ackshually have any racial policy or even German unity, their policy was only to ally with whichever major European land power was convenient, whether it was Stalin, Napoleon or Wellingtonwhich is nonsense, just to be cleargenerally until recently the French and British pursued their own ends, which was to set up a putatively Christian chivalric kingdom / empire / sphere of influence>>65455840>How about you actually read Mein KampfNAYRT but I did
>>65455840>you have to read qaran to know that muzzies are evil>you should read russian constitution to know they're evilStinks of wehrapoo in here.
>>65455840>How about you actually read Mein Kampf before trying to engange in a discussion about nazis? German expansionism in the East had nothing to do with their racist beliefs against the Slavs which don't get me wrong, certainly were present. Hitler said that they needed the territory and resources to survive a prolonged Conflict against the other great powers. They did not invade the USSR to kill a bunch of people for the sake of it and if that's the view you have on WW2, perhaps /his/ might be more suited for you.>uh listen chud Germanys racial policy had nothing to do with her foreign policy of conquering her eastern and ethnically cleansing them of slavs, gypsies, and jews for "living space" Imagine being an unironic wehraboo in fucking 2026.
>>65455853>Only one of these happenedread your Hemingway, idiotthe Commies were supporting with guns, arms and volunteers the Communist uprising in Spain, China, and various other nations; supported Communist political parties in UK and France, and proceeded to Domino much of the rest of the world after WW2>>65455879>they got blind sided by germany, becauseStalin kept insisting that Hitler would never do that, thinking he was the clever one for tricking Hitler into the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact to buy time to reform the purged Red Army, and Hitler would never be as clever as to do the exact same thing to Mr Iosef Clever Clogs that he was doing to Hitlerand his cringing lackeys, not least his intelligence chief Filipp Golikov, were happy to indulge him in his delusion because it meant their jobs and probably their heads if they contradicted himit turns out that as much as a full year before Barbarossa, both UK AND US intelligence had sent Stalin reports from their German spies and other intercepts on the German buildup on the Soviet border, but Stalin dismissed them allreportedly, just days before Barbarossa itself, Stalin scribbled a note on another Soviet intelligence report on the German buildup: "More British tricks!"
>>65453425>picPhonefag detected.
>>65453126>The thing is, Soviets had tremendeous difficulties of getting their supplies to where it was needed. >It wasn't that they didn't have rifles or ammo, it was that the transprotation and logistics network was a total clusterfuck. A lot of the times their men didn't get stuff like clothing or food or ...well, anything else, because transportation capacity is limitedunderrated post
>>65455840it's funny to read this wishy-washy pilpul defending a meth head retard and his cadre of other nazi retards that all believed in magic and ghosts and other shit like that
>>65455969by the same logic, you're defending snowniggers
>>65455877>muh asiatic hordespick up a book, retard
>>65455721>There is quite a bit of stretch between "they lacked guns" and "they were giving guns to some people and bullets to somebody else". What fuckin stretch? lmao.>ALRIGHT YOU FUCKING BITCHES ATTACK! >B-but saar tovarish we have not enough g-guns :(>*bang* FUCK YOU FAGGOTS ATTACK ANYWAY I DON'T CARE IF YOU HAVE A GUN OR AMMO OR NOTHING AT ALL!>80 years later >umm aktually they didn't distribute the guns and ammo to different troops on purpose that's much much MUCH different from reality
>>65454983Shrug, a whole bunch of people got in and a lot of papers and books were written with them. Up to you whether you choose to accept them or not.
>>65455896>Stalin kept insisting that Hitler would never do that, thinking he was the clever one for tricking Hitler into the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact to buy time to reform the purged Red ArmyExcept that it was the Germans (and Ribbentrop in particular) that came up with the idea of this pact. Yep, they were _that_ stupid - they basically doomed themselves into a two-front war _again_ the moment they signed the pact. You couldn't offer the greater gift to comrade Stalin. >read your Hemingway, idiotI am not saying that it didn't happen but referencing the works of fiction AGAIN as your source ITT is just further evidence that naziboos are simply unhinged and must not be taken seriously.
>>65456032>zero mention of asiatic hordes>brings up /pol/ out of nowhereyou are delusional
>>65456034Have you tried to find a publisher already? Another failed artist maybe? That would explain the affliction.
>>65456057No need for fiction. Barrier troops, penal battalions, and unequipped/underequipped troops being forced to scavenge supplies from the dead are all well documented features of the Soviet military in WW2. Especially the Narodnoe Opolcheniye civilian levvies formed from order 227. It's pretty much 1:1 what happened in the movie with unexperienced/untrained troops, random or insubstantial weapons (irl they usually had knives, sticks, fireplace pokers etc.) and machine guns at their backs.
>>65456128>they had no weaponsStill waiting for a shred of evidence of giving guns to some soldiers and bullets to somebody else. Your undeniable creative genius won't cut it.
>>65456052>Except that it was the Germans (and Ribbentrop in particular) that came up with the idea of this pact. Yep, they were _that_ stupid - they basically doomed themselves into a two-front war _again_ the moment they signed the pact. You couldn't offer the greater gift to comrade Stalintrue, but that says nothing about Stalin's intentionsthis line of reasoning is as silly as claiming that the Munich Agreement is proof that Hitler really only wanted peace >AGAINthat was only my second post, and I don't think I replied to you earlier>as your sourcethere are umpteen sources for Communist influence in Spain, but yeah sure, keep pretending this is just a naziboo opinion like the disingenuous cunt you are
>>65456140Frozen Tears: The Blockade and Battle of Leningrad. Nigger.
>>65456178A search for "bullet" in this book returns 7 bulletins but no bullets. You must try harder hans.
>>65453564>they, unprovoked, attacked finland >they, unprovoked, were planning to attack the baltic states before they cucked out>they, unprovoked, backstabbed poland and carved it up with the germans>its UNTHINKABLE they would ever unprovoked backstab germany. No, they dindu nuffin when the hitler chud got the jump on them firstKYSOnly insane thing about barbarossa was the allies looking at all of this and deciding to bail out fucking stalin with everything they had. Instead of doing the sane thing>yes, now we can get two flies with one swing
>>65456226>Only insane thing about barbarossa was the allies looking at all of this and deciding to bail out fucking stalin with everything they had. Instead of doing the sane thing>yes, now we can get two flies with one swingto this day, Communist sentiments in Europe and USA direct the overall course of national policyarguably the Communists are winning now too
>>65456226>>unprovoked, attacked finland>he doesn't know how incredibly reactionary White Finland was>he doesn't know about the Kinship Warsthe Soviets were proven right by Finland's actions during the genocide-siege of Leningrad. the only thing Stavka did wrong was not training a new officer corps quickly enough after executing the remains of the imperial corps>Only insane thing about barbarossa was the allies looking at all of this and deciding to bail out fucking stalin with everything they hadinvading France will do that. the Anglo-French imperialists actually wanted Germany to attack the USSR. hence why they rebuked the latter's attempts at forming an anti-Hitler pact
>>65456274>reactionaryOpinion discarded, Communists are not humans.
>>65456274>Kinship WarsOh yeah, Finns who just fought to liberate themselves from Russian Imperial occupation should definitely not go and fight to liberate Finns in other occupied territories.
>>65456301>I'm such a based ethnonationalist!>Finland gontrolled by Swedes? no broblem
>>65456274bait used to be believable
>>65453564Real tankie hours.>>65456274>he doesn't know how incredibly reactionary White Finland was>he doesn't know about the Kinship WarsYeah, ok.>>65456322Exactly! Instead it should be ruled by Finnish Communists controlled by Russia, so that Finland today instead could be a completely rundown and economically/culturally dead shithole like Karelia is! WORKERS OF THE WORLD UNITE!
>>65456322>One intellectual rung below declaring victory by posting a drawing of him as the soijak Gulag yourself commie faggot
Tim Curry is dead btw. He has joined Dolly Parton in jannah
>>65456274>>he doesn't know about the Kinship WarsSo, about that, why did the Russian Bolsheviks genocide all of the Ingrian Finns? Were they being reactionaries?
>>65456351he's gone to the one place uncorrupted by Communism
>>65456274>picY'know, it's funny how people talk about how the Reds would've sold out Finland to Soviet Russia. Sure, whatever, but the Whites actually DID sell our country out. To the Germans. Their Baltic Sea division wasn't sent here out of sheer good will.The Whites signed treaties subjugating our surprisingly autonomous economy to Berlin, as did they in terms of foreign policy, also. The Kaiser would have bases and unrestricted access to our markets, while we would not have even the shadow of such liberties in turn. Ludendorff himself was enthused by the promise of Finnish raw materials under Berlin's yoke.The Whites actually realized their mistake, calling Rüdiger von der Goltz a military dictator. Nevertheless, many still believed in German victory as late as mid-1918. They even declared a German prince to become our king. In late October 1918(!), no less, though he refused, and the defeat of Germany that soon followed struck that off the table for good.Personally, my relationship to our civil war is a bit idiosyncratic, but in a way I see justified. In a sense, Finland has more to thank Russian and German revolutionaries for our independence, for dismantling the empires throttling us. More so than the Whites, who functionally, ACTUALLY did everything in their power to reduce us from an autonomous grand-duchy to a mere protectorate.Markku Kuisma has written about this quite thoroughly at the University of Helsinki, though from an perspective of economic history./off-topic autism
>>65452461They didn't
>>65452597
>>65452461tl;dr - even with all the manufacturing that Soviet slave labour could produce, and all the Lend:Lease they got from America and Britain the Soviet logistical chain was so utterly fucked that they couldn't get the shit they had to where they needed it.
>>65452461Some boomer with a 100 IQ heard the factoid "only half the Red Army had rifles" once, and his retarded TV-addict brain interpreted this not as "only half the units were equipped", but as "they went to battle with half of the soldiers unarmed".
>>65455977Nive projection, zegro.
>>65456989cause its a movie. its a dramatic and legible visual shorthand that tells the audience very quickly the desperation and dire situation faced by the red army and it works better than a line of exposition. that's why we're still talking about it right now.
>>65456380>why did the Russian Bolsheviks genocide all of the Ingrian Finns? Were they being reactionaries?>he doesn't knowhttps://moodle2.units.it/pluginfile.php/790166/mod_resource/content/1/Engels%2C%20The%20Magyar%20struggle.pdf>>65456512>Finland has more to thank Russian and German revolutionaries for our independence, for dismantling the empires throttling usthis is the essence of Stalin's view on the national question. same goes for Ukraine btw. see here if you're curious: https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1913/03a.htmanyway good post finnanon
>>65456989>the red army would never send troops into combat unequipped, that's ridiculous>later...
>>65453696No, he'd say >Looks like meat's back on the men, you boys!
>>65455174>Beevor, Glantz and House are soviet propagandists?Yes, western cocksuckers were glazing russians for the last century. You faggots can't help yourself but to try and find the mysterious russian soul. Just like Bush, who looked into monke's eyes and found a nice guy there.
>>65455628>what the Soviets usually lacked was manpowerDelusional
>>65457456i'm not gonna comment on anons thing but by the time of the offensives the soviets were reliant on manpower from the reconquered territories because they didn't have shit or balls left elsewhere
>>65456051>a whole bunch of people got in and a lot of papers and books were written with themMy negro, you have no idea how much shit is in those archives. What was looked at is not even the tip of the iceberg, more like a grain of sand in the desert.
The Red Army's tactic of early withdrawal in 1942 to avoid encirclement fostered Hitler's illusion that their organized combat effectiveness had collapsed, thereby luring the German forces into a trap deep within the Caucasus.
>>65457340tl;dr
>>65453484At the Battle Of Stalingrad specifically this shit didn't happen.
>>65457368>EVERYTHING IS ABOUT THE WAR IN UKRAINE EVERYTHING IS ABOUT THE WAR IN UKRAINE EVERYTHING IS ABOUT THE WAR IN UKRAINE EVERYTHING IS ABOUT THE WAR IN UKRAINE
>>65457368At The Battle Of Stalingrad, Soviet troops were guaranteed one hot meal a day, were properly dressed for the weather, and never lost their supply route
>>65457526Newfag detected. this board is all about war in ukraine and iran right now. If you don't like it you can go back.
>>65452512>>65455585Context?
>>65457526my bad. of course everything is about the Great Patriotic War. everything.
>>65457526Two points make a line.
>>65457524The movie is not a historical account of Stalingrad, it just uses a specific location to act as a mosaic of the broader Eastern Front around this time period. Stalingrad is useful thematically because of its importance and because it serves as the turning point. Is it really that much of an injustice that it borrows from accounts that happened concurrently or around the same time at other parts of the Eastern Front?
>>65457604i remember this documentary, this guy's tears actually got to me.
>>65457608lmao it totally happened at Stalingradall of it, plus a very large amount of even worse shit toothis the soviets we are talking about - the levels of stupidity and incompetence present are literally impossible to overstatethe combined fantasies and creativities of all the world's writers are not enough to envision the retardationkvetching nigger commies can go kys
>>65457766>He Doesn't know about Chuikovoh boy> Could have stationed his HQ on the East bank of the Volga, instead he stationed it on the Western front lines within sniper and mortar range> Made sure every man in his army was properly dressed for the cold, had a warm place to sleep and had access to at least one hot meal a day.> Never used human wave tactics, despite modern media depicting otherwise. His only advantage besides logistics was manpower and he wasn't going to waste it.> Not above putting hands on officers who wasted men and supplies> Universally loved by rank and file.> Regularly inspected the front lines personally and listened to the needs of his men.
>>65457855yes and comrade khuikov personally jerked off each mobik to bid them goodnight before tucking them into bedany more delusional fucking commie fantasies you've dreamt up tranny?
>>65453478the soviet actually did won their war, so putin is literally worst than Stalin
>>65452461it's a movie.a british movie.from like the 2000s.
>>65457855TBF,>Could have stationed his HQ on the East bank of the Volgahe wrote Stalin for permission to move even just half his HQ to the east bank and Stalin said no>human wave tacticshe did that a lot though>>65457861I think anon got turned around and went from unironic to sarcastic after the first line
>>65453409the soldier actually had ammo at Stalingrad yes, period.
>>65457887There were desperate assualts but not human waves of unarmed men being machine gunned by commissars.
>>65456226we actually know Stalin was buck broken to be attacked by Germany,
>>65453265the fucking ppsha is still used today retard
>>65457900>not human waves of unarmed men being machine gunned by commissarsexcept we saw exactly that happen in Ukraine, so the reports of WW2 commissars forcing conscripts and penal battalions into such assaults are probably truealso,>by commissarslol there are multiple eyewitness reports written by Russians of their own people shooting other perceived traitors and men running back to their own lines, so technically wrong as well
>>65453404the russian regime is nowhere near as competent as the soviet, it's a miracle they still a power plan working there
>>65455872you start to piss us off with your >Muh russo-Ukraine war we know the russian army fucking sucks. it sucks in Chehcenya, in Syria and all. it doesn't change the fact that soldier in Stalingrad did got rifles and ammos. the thing they were lacking were good tanks, planes, trucks, and IFV
>>65457918>the russian regime is nowhere near as competent as the sovietman this is some top tier rose tinted revisionism. the soviets were absolutely retarded in the same way, how could they not be with the russians being their direct descendant with so many of their current hierarchy being former government officials OF the fucking soviet union.
>>65457916"When I got to army headquarters I was in a vile mood. I only saw three people: comrade Gurov, Chief of Staff Krylov, and Chief of Artillery Pozharsky. Three of my deputies had fled to the east bank. But the main thing was that we had no dependable combat units, and we needed to hold out for three or four days. The divisions had their respective headquarters on the Volga, and we were still forward on this hill. We were in this tunnel alongside the Tsaritsa River, while all the command posts were farther back. This turned out to be the right decision. And then there's one thing that went well, if we can use such a word. We immediately began to take the harshest possible actions against cowardice. On the 14th (September) I shot the commander and commissar of one regiment, and a short while later I shot two brigade commanders and their commissars. This caught everyone off guard. We made sure news of this got to the men, especially the officers. If you go down to the Volga, they said, then you'll find Army HQ right ahead of you. And so they went back to their places. If I'd gone across the Volga myself, they'd have shot me when I got ashore, and they'd have been right. The needs of the day determine what needs to be done."- Vasily Chuikov
>>65457926they were fucking retard, but current russian regime is so fucking retard it's amazing, a perfect mix of corruption cowardice and incompetence
>>65457939but even so they haven't topped this perfect example of retardation, which was just 4 years before stalingrad and directly contributed to the initial poor performance of the red army. i don't believe the picture shifted so dramatically that they went from this retarded to somehow being competent, even with the germans breathing down their necks
>>65457943I disagree you don't even need purge in modern russia since every head standing above that could threaten the mafia state is immediately cut. I can almost guarantee that if every general killed by the regime those last years got into commanding position, the situation for the russian wouldn't be currently as bad
>>65457504>tl;drthe money shot is right at the end>The next world war will result in the disappearance from the face of the earth not only of reactionary classes and dynasties, but also of entire reactionary peoples. And that, too, is a step forward.Engels has some absolute bangers>>65457456the Soviets were stamping out SMGs by the buttload even inside Leningrad. they were not lacking in industrial capacity, partly because they up and moved entire factories east of Ural. the notion that the USSR didn't have fucking Mosins or all things is nazi cope repeated by nazis and useful idiots for nazis to this day. read the reactions to Enemy at the Gates by veterans who were actually there. it's an incredibly dumb film for many more reasons besides "hurr durr no supplies">>65457943the purges were good and necessary
>>65457939Don't forget the factor of Viciousness To be in any kind of power in Russia, you don't need to be smart, being as fucking savage as possible means you get to run the prison block until someone even more violent, brutal and vicious comes along to overthrow your position. From the cop swinging a bat or stomping on someone's dick all the way through the government is some kind of immoral cunt that stole, lied and brutalised their way into a job.
>>65458028>the Soviets were stamping out SMGs by the buttload even inside Leningrad. they were not lacking in industrial capacity, partly because they up and moved entire factories east of Ural. the notion that the USSR didn't have fucking Mosins or all things is nazi cope repeated by nazis and useful idiots for nazis to this day. read the reactions to Enemy at the Gates by veterans who were actually there. it's an incredibly dumb film for many more reasons besides "hurr durr no supplies"Nationwide industrial capacity doesn't definitively mean there were no units short of equipment. This is from the 138th Rifle Division's combat log for Stalingrad.>The division has a personnel strength of 4,367 men; 1,019 rifles; 222 submachine guns; 21 light machine guns; 3 heavy machine guns; 36 anti-tank rifles; mortars: 50 mm – 47, 82 mm – 64, 120 mm – 18; 76 mm guns – 9. Out of the 2,000 reinforcements assigned to the division, 1,500 have arrived—all without weapons or entrenching tools. The division has enough arms to equip only 50% of these reinforcements. Artillery shells remaining: only 187 rounds; 120 mm mortar shells: 240; draft power in the 292nd Separate Mortar Battalion is sufficient for only 12 mortars. The division commander requested that the front commander urgently issue the missing weapons for 1,250 men and deliver ammunition using front or army transport.can't copy the link cause its in cyrillic but its on divizia-rkka.ru you can look it up yourself>the purges were good and necessaryah you're a retarded tankie, that explains it.
>>65458058no one is denying that there were units that were low on supplies. the issue is when you put this shit in a movie, retards are going to go "huh guess the Red Army was full of retards that wasted men for no reason because gommies are le ebil">ah you're a retarded tankie, that explains it.you tell me anon, do you think it is a good idea to keep a bunch of tsarist officers around for longer than absolutely necessary? the issue with the military purges is that they weren't done sooner, so that the Red Army had time to train replacements. it also serves as a good example why anarchism is retarded, since anarchists tend to believe it's possible to just magic officers into existence when the need arises, rather than having a standing army
>>65458086>no one is denying that there were units that were low on suppliessure there are. you were just now.>the issue is when you put this shit in a movie, retards are going to go "huh guess the Red Army was full of retards that wasted men for no reason because gommies are le ebil"interesting, now the argument has shifted from "they were never short on mosins" to "well you see, people might draw the wrong arguments if you put it on screen". and as to the conclusions those retards draw, even a broken clock is right twice a day.>do you think it is a good idea to keep a bunch of tsarist officers around for longer than absolutely necessary?Sure, sure, the Purges were famous for their high accuracy rate, hardly anybody innocent was caught up in them. It was certainly only former or current tsarists. You figure since they were so good at weeding out ideological traitors like you're saying, why didn't they just do purges all the time and build their perfect society? were they stupid? should've had more purges since the this one went so well, it just had bad timing is all :).
>>65453432>but the occupied Territories and minor Axis nations were incapable of providing a satisfying amount of military helpyes who could’ve known that terror bombing cities, razzias for forced labor, reprisals, etc. would not enlighten spirits to help the nazis.
>>65455844>>65457914I was obviously being ironic but I see what led you astray - when I said about not paying attention at the party meetings it should be an instant give-away of the non-serious meaning but it can be easily misanderstood by people living in countries when the single ruling party is still sacrosanct and can do no wrong (irony). Nazi party was as much detached from the reality as the communist party is my stance.Chill out Ivans; think of it like if it was a Stirlitz joke.
>>65458093>Sure, sure, the Purges were famous for their high accuracy rate, hardly anybody innocent was caught up in themdo you believe you know better than the NKVD or the CPSU(b)'s internal discipline organs?>why didn't they just do purges all the timewhy indeed
>>65458125my main man "russia claims" is literally on the very bottom of the pyramid for scientific hierarchy of evidence
>>65458158the Party is always right, anon. it's literally in the song
>>65457938>If I'd gone across the Volga myself, they'd have shot me when I got ashore, and they'd have been rightnot denying he said this, but given that he did first write for permission to move back and was denied, this smacks deeply of ex post facto justification>This turned out to be the right decisionand this of course is with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight, and he's not hiding it either, phrasing it that way: "that turned out to be", acknowledging the possibility that it might have turned out otherwise
>>65458028Tankies are ontologically evil people, as always. Marx, Engels, Lenin, Stalin, they are all burning in the fires of hell for what they've done, for all of eternity.
>>65455891>uh listen chud Germanys racial policy had nothing to do with her foreign policy of conquering her eastern and ethnically cleansing them of slavs, gypsies, and jews for "living space"Do you know often Hitler mentioned slavs in Mein Kampf? 4 times, 3 times in relation to the inner political turmoils of Austria-Hungary and how multiculturalism doesn't work. Nazis certainly had racial biases against the slavs, but it was not an ideological corneestone of their ideology, hence why 3 out of 7 minor Axis powers were slavic nations themselves. Lebensraum was just treated as a concept to expand the German population and multiply German industrial and agricultural Production, it included genocidal actions, but they were not the goal by itself.>>65455884>Not really; if Hitler and his cabal had been less irrational, they should actually have allied with the French against the British The French literally allied with their generational enemy the moment Germany started becoming the hegemon of Europe and the right wing of France regularly advocated for the dismantling of the German Nation State? In what timeline would the French voluntarly ally with Germany?their policy was only to ally with >whichever major European land power was convenientYes, that means allying with the weaker power to bring down the stronger one.>>65455890My bad, I just see now that you are merely baiting me. My mistake in believing a person on the internet could unironically be this retarded.
>>65455969Oh my hecking science. You just owned this drumpftard chud. Have my umble upvote, epic stranger.
>>65458671>In what timeline would the French voluntarly ally with Germany?the one we live in, after 1941 that is>the right wing of France regularly advocated for the dismantling of the German Nation Stateau contraire, in the run-up to WW2, the French right-wing was actually very active in saying they should team up with Nazi Germany against the Communists
>>65458699>the one we live in, after 1941 that isIgnoring that this was only possible because the war and the defeat of the Nazis brought down Western Europe's Status as the center stage of the global powers which forced the European Countries to work together. Not to forget Germany has effectively been vassalised by the U.S. and was suppressed to become a hegemon ever again. Even then it still took decades before France considered Germany a reliable Ally, and even in 1990 the Allies still didn't trust Germany enough to the point the 2+4 treaty prevented Germany to aqquire a military larger than 360.000 men and the creation of nuclear weapons. France didn't just decide to become Germany's friend for the fun of it.>the French right-wing was actually very active in saying they should team up with Nazi Germany against the CommunistsThe only relevant party that was more anti-German than Anti-Soviet was the PPF and they peaked with 100.000 Members and immediately declined in relevance when they supported the Munich Agreement.
>>65458740*Less anti-German than anti-Soviet
>>65458642salty chvds are my favorite
