>>6550647250/50, you can't go wrong either way. Sks has the lighter wieght advantage
>>65506472SksWhat even are the advantages of the garand here? Slightly better rounds and that's pretty much it?Less capacity, heavier, worse sights, lower rate of fire, higher recoil
>>65506486>Garand>Worse sights
>>65506472there's no debate, sks is not even in the same class.
>>65506486Soul and a round that isn’t low range shit
>>65506486>What even are the advantages of the garand here? Slightly better rounds and that's pretty much it?>Less capacity, heavier, worse sights, lower rate of fire, higher recoilFirst of all, better ammo is the key. It has better sihts, not worse, longer sight radius, power tp 600 yards, barrier penitration, better ergonomics, unless you are a 5'1" Mongolian conscript. As to recoil and weight, stop being a bitch and if 2 shots makes such a difference, learn to rifleman.
>>65506472I can load a garand like 3 times as fast as an sks
>>65506472a generation apartthey keep playing catch up
>>65506472The SKS isn't bad for what it is, but unless it's a Yugo model with a grenade launcher and which has been converted to take 30rd AK mags, then I feel the M1 is kind of better.>>65506486>worse sightsJesus Christ.Advantages of the M1 rifle:>much more range and power (admittedly not as important for an infantry rifle)>slightly less capacity but MUCH faster and smoother reload>much better sights, much longer sight radius>has a grenade launcher (vast majority of SKSs don't)>available in alternative cartridges like .308, .243, .270, etc>>65506566The lightning fast reload of the M1 does not get enough credit.
>Itt pre WW1 generals that think the average range of engagement will be 900 meters just because the round can carry energy that farHow about multi war winners? How about 8.5 pounds and slim? How about reliable In harsh conditions? How about consistent, and forgiving? I lost my political officer 10 weeks ago. 21 years of party service. But you want a old rifle with en bloc clips.
Extremely telling that the wars in which a faction that used the SKS won was essentially fighting impoverished rebelling peasants or ideological holdouts of the former admin...also equipped with SKS rifles (and other combloc shit)>but Vietnam!Lost to impoverished rice field farmers in Cambodia lmao!!!!
>>65506621M1 is also several times as accurate as the sks.
>>65506639>deliberately ignores all the other points because he's dishonest and gay>>65506646Cambodia lost to Vietnam. China also lost to Vietnam.
>>65506663Vietnam lost to America :^)
>>65506472>50/50, you can't go wrong either way. Sks has the lighter wieght advantageLighter ammunition too, you get what, 50% more rounds for the same weight?
>>65506692lmao, no. like 2 extra rounds per dozen at best.
>>65506472I'm never ever wanted that gay tranny fag looking SKS. The M1 is sexy big gun. Nature could only balance its superiority out by making it go ping and that just made it even more likeable
>>65506621Fuck that is aesthetic. How can filthy commies even compete?
>>65506646What is even the point of an Sks when AKs exist?
>>65506735Soviet doctrine in the mid-late 40s envisioned the SKS being the rifle of the average infantryman, with the AK47 being the replacement for the squad level SMG.
>>65506735Give the SKS to the dumbest most likely to die conscripts as the limited fixed magazine capacity conserved ammo and allowed the troops you did somewhat care about have access to the AK and its accessories.The SKS is also a more accurate rifle than the AK, but not enough to warrant giving up select fire capability + 30 rounds on tap. Something the Chinese learned the hard way.
>>65506472Dude one fires an intermediate cartridge and the other fires fully powered cartridge, how can you compare them?
>>65506884Into the 50's actual, the SKS was still the standard infantry rifle of the Soviets during the Hungarian Revolution, pretty much the only case of the Russians using the SKS in actual combat outside if a small number of border skirmishes by security forces.
>>65506692If the SKS had been made in 5.45x39mm, then that could have been true (along with some overall lightening, together with a new peep sight on the rear of the receiver, then this would actually have been a very appealing rifle still), but 7.62x39mm is not nearly as lightweight as that. It's a bit shorter and lighter than M2 Ball, but not hugely, the bullet is similarly heavy, and the case is only a bit shorter.If you look at AK mags also, they are these big fucking banans because of how fat the 7.62x39mm's ass is, so that affects hypothetical weight savings even further for that rifle (though a 30rd detachable magazine is obviously much more practical than clips).7.62x39mm is usable for sure, but it's very much a 1st generation intermediate rifle cartridge from WW2, just like the German 7.92x33mm, and they are roughly about as inefficient and clunky, the only actual optimizations either made was towards recoil for controllable rapid fire, everything else was second thought. The most optimal approach towards a cartridge with ballistics like these is supersonic loads of .300BLK, which gets extremely close in terminal ballistics to 7.92x33mm, only with slightly better exterior ballistics, and it's much slimmer and a bit lighter than the old cartridges, having the same footprint as 5.56x45mm and using its magazines.That said, that .308 caliber bullet the .300BLK uses adds up, so you're looking at fairly heavy ammo anyway. This is one of the multiple reasons that SCHV reigns supreme in the end.>>65506735Orphan of older tactical thinking and planning. The idea was that M43 would be Russia's universal cartridge, for the rifle (SKS), subgun (AK47), and machinegun (RPD). Not an entirely blitzed concept, but turns out the AK47 can do everything the SKS can and more, and by adapting it some into the RPK, it's a bit more practical LMG than the RPD (can share ammo and mags freely with your squad), and also you can't get away from needing a GPMG anyway (PK/PKM).
>>65506919True. The AK was inevitably replacing the SKS, but they still had the SKS rolling and they needed a more practical rifle for frontline troops than fucking old 91/30s, so pressing out a lot of SKSs while AK production trucked on, and they were resolving the problems of that, was the natural choice. If you can't give all the grunts AK47s yet, then the SKS is the next best thing.>>65506906Broadly, they can be compared, even if there's key differences.>.30 caliber self-loading infantry rifles>fixed magazines loaded with clips>rugged as fuck and can be used as blunt weapons no problem>easy to use overall>will for the most part be used for the same engagement ranges even if one can reach out much farther>Yugoslavian SKS even has grenade launcher10 guys with M1s vs. 10 guys with SKS would not be too terribly uneven of a fight.
>>65506886>The SKS is also a more accurate rifle than the AKnot even, despite the ak being more loosely build the tilting bolt action means they're basically equal. sks has a longer barrel so a bit more velocity but that's about it.
>>65506966>10 guys with M1s vs. 10 guys with SKS would not be too terribly uneven of a fight.it would be, M1 outclasses the sks in everything once you look past broad superficial similarities like caliber.
>>65506486I mean technically yeah the garand has a lower rate of fire because smaller magazine capacity but the fire rate is entirely dependent on how fast the user can pull the trigger on either rifle.
>>65507009>M1 outclasses the sks in everythingIn what regards that would make it an uneven fight?
>>65507073range, firepower, accuracy, ergonomics, ballistics. it's not even remotely close.
>>65506472Controversial opinion but i'd take a straight pull bolt action in a real round over an sks.
>>65506472Welp, Canadian /k/ids, psycho's and murderers seem to love the SKS. .
>>65506472SKS obviously.>>65507338
>>65507263Those might be worth considering in a long range engagement but at more typical combat ranges I don't see that being decisive. The SKS side is going to be able to carry substantially more ammo for the same weight, be able to make followup shots easier due to lower recoil, reloading will probably roughly even out.
>>65506906Daily reminder modern .3006 would break a garand
>>65507352You don't see anything that would interfere with your vatnigger cope.>The SKS side is going to be able to carry substantially more ammo for the same weightIt won't and you'll be dead long before you could reload all your ammo with an sks.>be able to make followup shots easierIf you're not a malnourished 12 year old child soldier, you won't.>reloading will probably roughly even outLol
>>65507353Modern factory ".3006" still runs at the same pressure as it did when it was used in Garand.
>>65506472G41
>>65506472SKS>two more rounds>lighter ammo, 7.62x39 has less recoil>fixed bayonet, so always have a stabby at the ready>no risk of getting your thumb bit>easier to field strip and cleanIf I was shooting past, I dunno, 200 yards, the Garand would probably be a better choice, but I'm not a marksman so that's irrelevant to me
>>65506966>They can be compared if we ignore reality>all .30 caliber is the same>all clips are the same>all engagement ranges are the same>hurr durrkys
>>65507358Call me a cocksucking faggot a thousand times before you call me a vatnigger, I drink coffee while watching ziggers die well deserved deaths every morning. Based on the rest of your post I have to assume you think replacing the M14 was the greatest mistake in military procurement ever made, if big bullet equals killing your opponent before they can fire off their intermediate caliber
>>65507383Replacing the M14 would be the greatest mistake in military procurement ever made if they replaced it with an SKS.>their intermediate caliberTheir slow ass flying turd, you mean. "Muh intermediate caliber" cope for shistkin subhumans gargling backwards and inferior technology while trying to pass it as modern is the most repuslive fallacy in the world of small arms.Why despite being anti-zigger you still behave like the typical slavaboo licking their anuses over their shitty, antiquated and shoddily built guns?
>>65507263>rangeMight come into play, but we're talking below 200yds for what's actually normal for infantry engagements. The guys with M1s might try to engage from beyond the SKS's effective range, but that's a big might, they are likely to even miss spotting each other at that kind of distance.>firepower.30-06 is more powerful, but is it more powerful enough to matter as a rifle cartridge? 7.62x39mm is going to be pretty deadly anyway.The M1 has a faster reload, but the SKS has 2 more rounds and recoils less.>accuracyUnlikely to be a deciding factor, this isn't the National Match, the SKS isn't a smoothbore musket.>ergonomicsEXTREMELY unlikely to be a deciding or even contributing factor. Comical point for this comparison.>ballisticsWhat's your argument here? See firepower.>>65507380>They can be compared if we ignore realityAre YOU ignoring reality?>all .30 caliber is the sameMy point here was less the power, you faggot, rather the weight of ammunition, which is a more important consideration, and M43 ultimately isn't going to weigh less enough to be a big deal. Both M43 and M2 Ball will reach and kill at enough range to matter.>all clips are the sameWhere did I ever argue this? Again, the M1 has a faster reload, but it also has a smaller magazine. The M1 may have the edge here on its reload, but is it a critical factor?>all engagement ranges are the sameAmerican soldiers fighting with M1 rifles in WW2 and Korea were statistically fairly unlikely to fight at 200yds or further, and VERY unlikely to fight at 300yds or further, so broadly, yes, the longer range of the M1 is unlikely to be a deciding factor on average, because both sides are most likely going to fight below 200yds, and both rifles are going to reach within that envelope.
>>65507398>you still behave like the typical slavaboo licking their anuses over their shitty, antiquated and shoddily built guns?If that's what you call defending the idea that "10 guys with M1s vs. 10 guys with SKS would not be too terribly uneven of a fight" then I don't know what to tell you, especially considering I outright agreed that the M1 has advantages over the SKS,
>>65507398you don't shoot and have womanly fits of hystrionics
>>65507411>If that's what you call defending the idea that "10 guys with M1s vs. 10 guys with SKS would not be too terribly uneven of a fight"Yes. Eat shit vatnik cocksucker.
>>65507363Then why does cmp warn you not to use modern .3006?
>>65507415Are the vatniks in the room with us right now?
>>65507414You lie through your teeth and can only get your lies through the door by spamming false equivalence and semantic association.
>>65507375Not a marksmen? Will you be my girlfriend instead?
>>65506621Yugo with a gas cutoff lets you fire subsonic to take out sentries without making noise. Very niche, but cool nonetheless.
>>65507418You are here shilling for their antiquated shitrod so yes.
>>65507263You're being irrational. I own both, and I love the Garand, but I'd honestly take the SKS in an actual firefight. In the end the other anon is right, 10 v 10 of equally skilled men with one side having M1s and one having SKSs is going to be a practical draw.
>>65507358>vatnigger copeSchizophrenic warble. The M1 being a nicer rifle overall, or having a lot of potential extra range, isn't going to fucking matter, it's a rifle, not a sniper's rifle or a machinegun.>>65507398>Replacing the M14 would be the greatest mistake in military procurement ever made if they replaced it with an SKSThe M14 having actual 20rd detachable magazines would easily tip it over towards being decidedly better than the SKS, but we aren't comparing the SKS and the M14.>>65507422>slav derangement syndrome
>>65507405>but we're talking below 200yds for what's actually normal for infantry engagementsactually my asshole said 10 yards is when all infantry engagements ends therefore a full auto luger is the ultimate weapon.>.30-06 is more powerful, but is it more powerful enough to matteryes, it'll also fly flatter, be less deflected by the wind and destroy cover vastly better.>but the SKS has 2 more roundsso for the duration of those two rounds is the only moment sks has any advantage.>Unlikely to be a deciding factoryes, a full auto luger is clearly the best.>What's your argument here?range, trajectory, penetration, lethality, etc. not firepower, but capability.
>>65507419post your garandpost your skspost any gun you own period
>>65507428post your asshole not ravaged by chechens and bottles, pidorlover.
>>65507432are you just bored and wanting attention or did you forget your medication this morning, nogunz?
>>65507425>isn't going to fucking matterVatnigger cope. "Hurr durr nothing matters unless it specifically benefits my side".>The M14 having actual 20rd detachable magazines would easily tip it over towards being decidedly better than the SKSM14's mags are less of an improvement over enbloc clips of M1 than the enbloc clips are an improvement over the shit ass sks loading.>slav derangement syndromeSlavaboo mental deficiency syndrome.
>>65507434no, i am just waiting for you to kill yourself whenever you are cornered and exposed enough that your bullshit lie about magical superior "intermediate rounds" doesn't work anymore.
>>65507435Admitting you're getting filtered by the SKS stripper clip is certainly a choice but you do you anon.
>>65507437>your bullshit lie about magical superior "intermediate rounds"The sole argument made in favor of them up to this point is that you can carry more for the same weight and they have less recoil.
>>65507439Admitting that you're filtered by guns that didn't come from the asshole of a communist slave is pathetic no matter how much you pretend it isn't. Or sucking so much at reloading an enblock that fiddling with a stripper clip is in any way comparable.
>>65507444No, the argument is that they do better at everything that matters, and do worse at everything they don't and this is justified because everyone switched to SCHV "assault rifles" therefore guns that share absolutely nothing with them are better.
>>65507450meds
>>65507456For you, cyanide specifically.
>>65507446You're being silly. En bloc loading is fine. The SKS stripper clip is fine. Between the two neither really has a decisive advantage over the other, and I can attest to this by experience. I'm not sure why you're overblowing one feature or the other.
>>65507459>Between the two neither really has a decisive advantage over the otherEnbloc is almost as fast as a magazine, a stripper clip is almost as slow as single loading. You might as well be pretending a single shot gun or a muzzleloader "doesn't have a decisive advantage" here.
>>65507464Christ almighty you're retarded
>>65507464>a stripper clip is almost as slow as single loading.why do you lie?
>>65507464>a stripper clip is almost as slow as single loadingIs this some sort of prank or are you just nightmarishly bad at handling firearms?
>fuming manchild going off of paper stats screams at people who actually own the gats in question and says theyre wrong classic
>>65507478Why do you? Stripper clips hardly ever go smoothly and twist around and the rounds pop from the internal mag and need to be shoved back in, if you want to actually use them in combat conditions without scattering them around they'll take twice as long as an enbloc which is completely self contained.
>>65507482>fuming manchild going off of paper statsBut enough about you and your "all clips are the same, all .30 cals are the same" bullshit.
>>65507464retard
>>65507491I'm afraid you're getting either skill-checked by an absurdly simple system or just making things up for the sake of argument.
inb4>merely pretending
>>65507464>Enbloc is almost as fast as a magazine, a stripper clip is almost as slow as single loadingIt's so slow that the US Army even dropped detachable magazines as a requirement for the M1 replacement for a period of time because they found stripper clips were nearly as good
>>65507506You're not "passing" it because you sat at the table and aligned the clip perfectly one time for a smoothg load, dishonest nigger.
>>65506486outed yourself nogunz
>>65507527your posts get more incomprehensible the more your fat hands try to type while shaking with rage induced adrenaline, schizo
>>65507524This totally happened and you didn't make this up. US army really wanted to replace both enblocks and mags for stripper clips on their future rifle. Surely.
>>65507531If you had more than one brain cell you'd see that my posts are perfectly legible. No i won't proofread and correct typos when shitting on you in this cesspit of a thread.
>>655064722 different jobs for the tool, not the other way around.
>>65506472Ultimately neither would have a decisive edge over the other. We're talking about shooting with irons so your max effective range is ~3-400 yards regardless of what cartridge you use. It's all splitting hairs really, the SKS has a slight advantage in ROF use to the lower recoiling round and higher capacity, Garand has better sights and a slightly faster reload. In a 10v10 setting I'd be willing to bet the M1 Garand team would win but that mostly comes down to superior training and gear that we had circa 1947 versus what the Soviets were batting with. Still, it'd probably be a close call
>>65507533Technical Information Report No. TIR 4-4-4A1 on the 7.62 mm Rifle, M14 (T44E4): "proposed that no rifle loaded with a removable box magazine be considered as a replacement for the M1"Following design meetings dictated that a top charging device be incorporated into the design and "the magazine to be considered a semi-permanent part of the rifle, not to be ordinarily removed"
>>65507464Noguns.
>>65507524Remember this is the same US army that'd adopt the M14 so maybe the brass at the time was just fucking retarded
>>65507426You're absolutely prolapsed, I see.
>>65507599To be fair the only other actual option they had at that point was the shitty domestic FALs
>>65506472people can actually hit targets with the m1. SKS is semi auto spray and pray.
>>65507527still no evidence that you own any guns at all, loser
Two best semiautomatic infantry rifles of the past century. Each has its own advantages; SKS is better for shorter ranges under 300 meters, urban combat CQB etc., is lighter, smaller, easier to manipulate (yes: you need to learn to use stripper clips), wield and carry. Garand has better sights and long range punch.>>65506480fpbp
>>65507435>Hurr durr nothing matters unless it specifically benefits my sideYeah, not like those statistics actually came from anywhere or actually mean anything, you petulant fucking child. The M1 has a potential range advantage, that means it will ALWAYS come into play and always decide the outcome.>M14's mags are less of an improvement over enbloc clips of M1 than the enbloc clips are an improvement over the shit ass sks loading.Absurd statement, the M14 has twice the capacity of the SKS, and more than twice the capacity of the M1. You fumbling like fuck with stripper clips because of bad Asperger's fine motorics doesn't mean anything at all, en-bloc clips making for extra fast reloads gets negated by detachable magazines holding 20 or even 30 rounds.>>65507527You're getting redfaced.>>65507495That guy isn't me, there's multiple of us bullying you.
>>65507650lmao learn to shoot
>>65506472M1 Garand>better sights, sights influenced all future US infantry weapons & its impact is still seen today>better caliber>better trigger>better ergonomics>better aesthetic & classic ping>won WWIISKS>better capacity & reload design>reliability>better bayonet>extremely easy to takedown & clean/maintain>dead simple design even illiterate farmers can learn how to use, disassemble, & reassemble in half an hour>made GI go home
>>65507464>a stripper clip is almost as slow as single loadingmaybe if you are retarded
>>65507650the sights are just different than the peephole style, they work just finei will concede the SKS/AK pistol style sight with the bad sight radius are not good for marksman shooting & lead to slower target acquisition that gets worse the further out the target is but its mainly just a skill issue with not having much time behind that type of sight picturesome competitive pistol shooters that are shooting irons on a rifle gravitate to the AK/SKS platform because they its the same sight picture on their pistols, granted now everyone uses red dots so that is a moot point now
>>65507375>lighter ammoOnly slightly. Recoil is the significant advantage.>>65507695How would the stripper clip be better than the en-bloc? I'm not developmentally challenged so I can actually use stripper clips, but en-blocs are much faster and smoother anyway.
>>65506472You have made the mistake of thinking there could be a purely technical conversation with such politically charged weapons
>>65507714en bloc is better if you are firing 8 rounds and reloading the full 8 rounds but outside of that specific scenario, the stripper clip is superioryou can just push down a new strip at any time to top off the internal magazine, they lay flatter and it is easier to carry multiple of them on your person, and with the sks you can also single load bullets if you dont have stripper clips and you arent out of the fightplus with the SKS you can just flip it upside down and dump bullets into the internal magazine and they basically just arrange themselvesplus the SKS has the advantage of being able to clear malfunctions/jams by dropping the internal magazine out & then you can mortar the boltwith how reliable it is, its unlikely but unlike the m1 garand, if shit wound up getting into the action of the gun the sks is piss easy to clear out & reloadplus it holds an extra 2 rounds so it has that going for it
>>65507802>politicsNothing to do with it at all. These are the two most influential and prevalent mil rifles of the 1940s and 1950s (from the two most powerful militaries on Earth)
>>65507840A third of this thread is some guy screeching that anyone who says anything positive about the SKS is a vatnik shill
>>65507527Okay how in the actual flying fuck are you managing to cock up stripper clips? Yeah there are shitty ones (almost all of them are for rimmed cartridges like x54R and .303) but outside of those what are you doing to mess that shit up? Do you actually have a rifle that uses them?
>>65507708the only situations where a peep sight isn't massively superior are situations where you might as well point shoot or aim only using a front sight.
>>65506692>Lighter ammunition too, you get what, 50% more rounds for the same weight?Pretty sure I addressed that here: >>65506480>>65507674>fpbpSmart money is have both. Pic today's victory.
>>65507860i do think peep sights are a better design but people do just fine with the pistol style sights on rifles tooi only had fudd rifles & SKS for a while & my first time behind peep sights, i was doing awful and it took me a bit to understand how to use themi imagine its the same feeling going from peep to the pistol style sights, its just differentthe SKS/AK sights also do not get nearly as precise as most peep sights for adjustments either in my experience and that is a drawback for it as well but at the end of the day it boils down to a skill issue, the sights are fine
>>65507682>Yeah, not like those statistics actually came from anywhere or actually mean anythingyeah, they didn't, you made them up by twisting the ww2 only statistics and pretending that every war was exactly the same.>a potential range advantagean ABSOLUTE and TOTAL range advantage, you mean, you fucking slime.>that means it will ALWAYS come into play and always decide the outcome.it'll always shoot better at any distance, just to a different degree.>You fumbling like fuck with stripper clips because of bad Asperger's fine motoricspretending you wouldn't be fumbling with it when under fire and trying to not drop the gun or the ammo into mud means everything, and you just lack the human dignity to admit it.
>>65507871>ww2 only statisticsGee, I wonder why anyone would be inclined to use those statistics when comparing the M1 Garand and SKS
>>65507869it takes a ton of shooting to get good with leaf sights, the people who do fine were just stuck with them enough to eventually reach adequacy, either because they couldn't get a gun with better sights, didn't know how to use them, were misled or a combination of those.there's a reason why every non-subhuman military switched to peeps after ww2.
>>65507878good on you completely ignoring that you lied and twisted those statistics too.mind telling me when did sks serve in ww2? i must've forgot.
>>65507847How the ukebro 'war' destroyed /k/ since 2013
>>65507847>anything positive about the SKS compared to a Garand*and slavaboos are objectively the only segment of the board population that still genuinely believe that shit.
>>65507883>mind telling me when did sks serve in ww2? i must've forgot.I never claimed it did and if you think I did you're either retarded or deliberately misinterpreting my argument. Again, why do you think people would be inclined to use WWII statistics, or as >>65507405 argued, Korean War statistics when comparing these rifles? Could it be that those wars were the most recent ones fought prior to the point that they were in parallel service? Or do you think that wars were going to revert to the Boer War style of combat where the M1 would outclass the SKS?>>65507897>recognizing objective facts about the difference in the rifles is fake news
>be sks>be developed by famous soviet gun designer Simonov>be garand >developed by stupid homosex Canada man John from Canada One is clearly winner here and he is the sks from RUSSIA and not garand from C*nada. USA should have adopt sks in 308 instead of M14 who was shit.
>>65507909>Again, why do you think people would be inclined to use WWII statisticsthey don't, they just repeat the garbage they've heard elsewhere to peddle their falsehoods. again, this isn't even an accurate recount of those statistics just fragmented cherrypicked misquotes.>recognizing objective factsif you did you wouldn't be a slavaboo or you'd already kill yourself like every ak tranny should.
>>65507837>en bloc is better if you are firing 8 rounds and reloading the full 8 rounds but outside of that specific scenario, the stripper clip is superiorI mean, that was how they trained around it, and it worked well. You could trust to just go through your magazine because of the quick and easy reload.>you can just push down a new strip at any time to top off the internal magazineThat's nice too, but the en-bloc being so fast to load I feel is a worthwhile tradeoff. If you absolutely want to, you can top off the magazine on the M1, but I don't think it's all that important.>they lay flatter and it is easier to carry multiple of them on your person, Assuming ideal webgear for either, this one seems like it wouldn't be that different, the en-blocs are still small and are shorter, and grunts would plain get issued a bandolier full of clips which was practical for the rifle.>and with the sks you can also single load bullets if you dont have stripper clips and you arent out of the fightYou can single load the M1 as well.>plus with the SKS you can just flip it upside down and dump bullets into the internal magazine and they basically just arrange themselvesI guess?>plus the SKS has the advantage of being able to clear malfunctions/jams by dropping the internal magazine out & then you can mortar the boltI suppose.>with how reliable it is, its unlikely but unlike the m1 garand, if shit wound up getting into the action of the gun the sks is piss easy to clear out & reloadThe SKS might have a somewhat more protected action, but they're both old style guns with pretty wide open actions. You don't have an exposed op-rod and track on the SKS, but if you get sand in there, it's not gonna be fun anyway.>plus it holds an extra 2 rounds so it has that going for itNaturally.
>>65507920You are so fucking assmad lmao.
>>65507920>own more western guns than slav>believe in the particular matchup this thread is about it's a wash>get called a slavaboo by some mental midget malding online on a Sunday eveningstill waiting on you to post any evidence you actually own guns
>>65507847I think that's less politics and more that anon is low functioning autistic.
>>65507941i've waded through your slimy disingenous sophistry so many times i've come to despise you so much you cannot even imagine. the worst part is that you scum always repeat the same falsehood and fallacies, always, like a broken record.
>>65507943still waiting on you to actually make an argument that isn't "hurr durr skill issue just deal with the gun being shit".
>>65507527Do you have empirical evidence that stripper clips were a problem for infantry in the seven odd decades they saw frontline use?
>>65507949they weren't a problem, they were a solution to having loose ammo and loading it one by one. they've done this for decades too.
On one hand it's funny seeing a retard getting ganged up on, on the other it's also kinda sad and feels a bit mean
>>65507802How the fuck are the SKS and Garand politically charged weapons? You must be severely poisoned by identity politics if you make it an east vs west debate over two obsolete service rifles. Like imagine getting this buttmad over a Springfield vs Mosin thread
>>65507491>if you want to actually use them in combat conditions without scattering them around they'll take twice as long as an enblocso you're shitting yourself in rage because, even in your own anecdotal scenario, loading 10 rounds will take about 4-5 seconds, and you think that's a huge deal...
>>65507966>ok it takes twice as long to reload but it's actually irrelevant and you're shitting yourselfwhat a wonderful post, somehow i feel like i've already seen this cope before itt
>>65507972yeah you're talking about 2-3 seconds vs. 4-5, that isn't a big deal, again *IF* your scenario was actually true.are you one of those faggots who thinks the SVT was a better gun than the M1 because it had 2 more rounds and a detachable mag?
This dude is either trolling one thread for hours on end or he has actual mental issues and I'm not sure which is more sad.
>>65507978>yeah you're talking about 2-3 seconds vs. 4-5, that isn't a big dealit's a pretty big deal compared to shitters itt pretending that sks shoots faster because of lower recoil. >are you one of those faggots who thinks the SVT was a better gun than the M1 because it had 2 more rounds and a detachable mag?no, because SVT is a shit gun in general.
>>65507985but anon, it holds two more rounds and has a detachable mag! it's totally great because of that, right? you're going to at least be consistent in your arguments, right?
I like the SKS, but I am not going to pretend it's even in the same class as a Garand.
>>65508002it's a shit gun and a single design feature doesn't redeem it. if it wasn't a shit gun then it'd have better firepower because of this. this seems like straightforward reasoning but maybe it's hard for you to accept so you feel the need to strawman instead.
>>65507982I remember him from earlier this year, he exploded when someone said the AK is a better rifle than the FAL.
>>65507367If you had said G43, I would at least understand it, but both the G41(M) and G41(W) were turds, which is why Walther said fuck it to the retarded stated army requirements and made the G43 anyway, and thus won over Mauser.
>>65507951Correct, but this is in regards to the claims made in>>65507491>Stripper clips hardly ever go smoothly and twist around>the rounds pop from the internal mag and need to be shoved back inand>>65507464>a stripper clip is almost as slow as single loadingIf these issues were so prevalent, surely they'd be documented. I'm asking for this.
>>65508055Fucking hell, that's a gorgeous Pinger.
>>65508066Not trying to be an asshole and also NTA thats been pissing and moaning ITT but that isnt an sks
>>65508060It's a '54 Springfield I got about 12 years ago through the CMP, fantastic use of $499.
>>65508073yeah, an SKS is actually going to load easier because the cartridge doesn't have a fuckoffhuge rip, so it kinda puts things into perspective about how much of a nothingburger it is.
>>65508074Bless the boys at the CMP. As I understand, there's actually still absolute shitloads of old Cold War era military aid M1s (and other stuff) out there in the world which could hypothetically be imported back to the U.S. Won't be anytime soon, since stipulations of said aid program makes that annoying, but they exist out there in large quantities still, so there's a lot left to go around, in case something was ever done about the restrictions.
>>65508088I think Greece still has some, that's where mine came from.It kind of spoils you for the other WWII-era rifles, every other one I shot just made me wish I was shooting my M1 instead.
>>65508079From my experience the mosin interruptor prevents any rimlock issues and the longer length and greater friction of the sks stripper actually makes it more difficult than a mosin. But I only had a couple stripper clips for my sks and I cant find them, they may have been aftermarket
i think i understand how people trying to be right on an internet chinese cartoons forum leads to people spilling tech manuals on the mil sim videogame forum.
>>65508071>fumbles the mosin despite having the rifle completely still and going slowgood job proving my point
>>65508121Because the SKS takes a 5rd clip of rimmed 7.62x54mmR
>>65508129you seem to insist on pretending that it's impossible to fumble the clip stripping despite doing it under the most ideal conditions you could create, why is it hard to admit that it's inherently a more fumbly and failure-prone system that needs extra time and attention to do right?
>>65508121still faster than single loading
>>65508147duh. a clean reload is obviously faster. now try doing this with haste while laying flat on the back or belly down while pulling the ammo out of your pocket. it'll still be faster than single loading, but in a quite different way.
>>65508071I wish my Mosin loaded that quickly. I've never managed to get stripper clips to work on mine.
>>65508121Wow you might actually be a gunless retard
>>65508052I know what I meant, and I stand with my choice.
>>65508074>12 years ago through the CMP, fantastic use of $499.But,but,but boomers ruin everything?!?
>>65508129>the SKS takes a 5rd clip of rimmed 7.62x54mmRAll these years I have been feeding my sks the wrong ammo! Thank you /k/!!
>>65508286Anon do you really need him to type /s afterwards?
>>65508280Yes, they have, thats why CMP garands are now $1200 for reactivated refinished drill guns with aftermarket sights, furniture, and barrels
>>65508134>you could fumble a stripper clip, therefore you always willMight as well argue that you're guaranteed to get Garand thumb. It's not a realistic argument and it's not hard to strip rounds from stripper clips, which is objectively much faster to do than to load single rounds, no matter how you twist it.
>>65508280Anon appears to be lysdexic.
>>65508121
>>65508161>>65508121you had better be a woman, this kind of disingenuous, bad-faith arguing should not be coming from a man's mind.
>>65506472I used to walk around the woods shooting shit with an SKS, and I would always end up with loose rounds in my ammo pouches and stripper clips missing a bullet or two. For that reason alone I would take the Garand, though I think they're both too heavy for anything beyond fucking around in a field plinking targets.
>>65508537>therefore you always willcool strawman. you are still very likely to, and it's realistic to expect it when you're not doing it leisurely while sitting on your ass at the table.>Might as well argue that you're guaranteed to get Garand thumbyou aren't because you can just hold the carrier, or do it in a myriad other ways but i'll take a garand thumb over scattering your ammo and fumbling the reload any day.>which is objectively much faster to do than to load single roundsrefer to my post about doing it while prone. notice how i didn't even mention that you'd act differently if you were being shot during the process and needed to return fire. unless you're super drilled or have nerves of steel you'll be rushing it even if you realize that being careful and controlled is better.>no matter how you twist ityou're the one twisting it by intentionally ignoring that you have to sit on your fat ass with the gun posted at the perfect angle and slow load it to make it look good and smooth, despite it being nothing like the guns are actually used in combat.>>65508554>this kind of disingenuous, bad-faith arguingbut enough about your slavaboo mental gymnastics and falsehoods. try to come up with something, anything different for once before you blow your brains out you filthy herbew tranny.
one is 450 the other is 1000
>>65509081post your guns
>>65509102post your arguments
>he's still at itI'm starting to think he's just a dedicated troll
>>65509103all you're going to do is say the same bullshit you said throughout this threats since yesterday. the people you're arguing against have proven that they have experience with this topic by owning and the implements in question, now you do the same or confirm that you're just some loud retard with an opinion going off of assumption
>>65509121>is say the same bullshit you said throughout this threatsthe bullshit you cannot counter or disprove, the bullshit you have to run away and distract from? that bullshit? why don't you bring up how "intermediate rounds" are all totally just better, how range, handling, accuracy, power never matter and whatever other bullshit you peddle to defend your shit ass guns that you decided to idolize?>the people you're arguing against have provenyou haven't proven crap. kys nigger.
>>65509129>brownskin screens that nothing has been proven while arguing that stripper clips are impossible to use in combat without anything to back it up noguns
>>65509111Best case scenario, the other option is he is just genuinely mentally unwell. So being a troll on 4chan in 2026, or brain damage. He loses either way.
>>65509145>He loses either way.yeah
>>65509138>noguns quisling cannot argue with reality so he has to invent more and more blatant strawmen to try to distract from the facts and arguments he cannot countercall me something else next, this'll show me.
>>65509154>guy who refuses to post his own guns cause others nogunsyeah
>>65509157is that why you don't post yours? to show me how it's done? it's not like you have anything else to say or show otherwise, given how you've lost and abandoned every argument you attempted to make.
>>65506472For Americans, it's the M1. For Europe and other parts of the world with M43 ammo, it's the SKS. Ammoless gun is not a choise, supply lines matter.Also I'd love a SKS that's 5,56 and eats USGI 5,56 clips.
>>65509081>cool strawmanIt's not a strawman when that's what you are actually arguing, you dishonest spastic. You very much said that loading with stripper clips is just as slow as loading with loose rounds.
>>65509273>It's not a strawmani've never argued that they are slower or just as slow as single loading or that they always fail, just very likely to delay your reloading because you need to adjust and fiddle with it. why do you feel the need to lie not just about the guns themselves but also about what i said? is it because your opinions are so worthless and self-defeating that you're not comfortable stating them in any other way?
>>65509280>>65507464
>>65509287>almostis the key word here, do you need a dictionary to held comprehending it?
>>65509280>womanly backpedaling in a medium with visual archiving of what was said>>65507464
>>65509293ok, so you ARE a troll. thanks for clearing it up.
This is either a 13yo or a shitter fishing for (you)s
>>65509299>womanly backpedalingis this what you're doing? am i right about you because that's all you're doing too, instead of arguing like a person?>>65509293
>>65509293
>>65509357>stating exactly what you said instead of what i declared you said is moving the goalpost>also you're mean and ugly and offend me by stating things i won't argue directly against
>>65506654>M1 is also several times as accurate as the sks.They were both 5 MOA rifles from the factory, anon. Having nice target sights does nothing for shitty production QC.
>>65509163I'd actually like to see your Garand and strip-fed rifles
>>65509371no they were not, 5 MOA was the wartime M1 rejection limit and prewar M1s were sub 3 MOA guns.an SKS that shoots 5 MOA is a well built sks.
>>65509453>an SKS that shoots 5 MOA is a well built sksDo you actually think the average SKS is a 5+ MOA rifle?
>>65506472Wow a thread I can actually weigh in on. I own both. Garand all the way. Much larger round, both are benchmarks for reliability, Garand is simply more accurate and has sights built for real marksmen. The SKS I do appreciate however for it's light weight simplicity. It also is significantly easier to field strip and maintain. Its a close one, but the Garand wins it.
>>65509579It's basically a pick ypur poison situation, just choose which one suits your prefs. I'd honestly go SKS just for the size and weight factor. The sights do suck compared to my Garand's for sure, but its biggest sin is how utterly ass the cheekweld feels.
>>65509453SKSs aren't sniper's rifles by any stretch of the imagination (mounting optics to them is misery, zero likes to wander on glass), but well built ones with some actual match ammo can shoot better than 4MOA.You're kind of at the mercy of the ergonomics, trigger, sights, and ballistic rainbow trajectory, but adapting to all that, and again, using match ammo, and you can still get respectable accuracy out of the best of them.
>>65509371>M1>5MOAlol, Jesus, maybe with some very shitass modern steelcase stuff.>>65509453>and prewar M1s were sub 3 MOA gunsI think this also hinged on the prewar ammo also being a bit better than wartime stuff.
If I was the president I would make it a legal requirement for every home to have an M1 Garand and a dakimakura of M1 Garand from Girls Frontline
>>65507464
>>65509793>but well built ones with some actual match ammo can shoot better than 4MOA.Select vintage M1s with original barrels in good condition shoot ~1 MOA with handloads in related competitions. I was trying to compare them with the configuration they would be serving in, not what is possible to wring out of the system, but you're right.
>>65509928I was talking about the SKS in that post, I'm well aware of the M1's good precision with good ammo.
Why the fuck are people getting this worked up over some antiquated guns? Especially these turboautists >>65507398 >>65507358 >>65507425 >>65507415 >>65507432 >>65507435 >>65507446
>>65509993I'm half convinced it's OP being intentionally retarded to keep his thread alive
>>65509993that's one schizoid malding, why are you referring to it in the plural sense
>>65509993Probably because of the russian association.
>>65506472I choose the M1
>>65509993Why'd you tag me for? I was saying he was wrong.
>>65509804>maybe with some very shitass modern steelcase stuff.maybe with original wartime factory ammunition*They loosed up standards hard to meet quota
>>65510217Wartime ammo was worse but not that much worse.
>>65510225Depending on how they were tested (there were at least three different methods and they all produced different ceilings) the most inaccurate an M1 rifle could be and still be accepted was 5.5 MOA. That's if they were individually tested for accuracy at all. On some production lines they were only batch tested.
>>65507491Are your clips made out of chinesium or something?
>>65507802The only place where the sks is politically charged is canada lmao
>>65510018>>65510128Just had to maintain the illusion of being impartial, lol. Although it did seem to me like "both sides" issue at the first glance.
>>65507491>has never even touched a Garand in his life so has never experience a stiff follower arm, a bulged clip because the rounds were slightly misaligned, smacking the everloving shit out of the oprod because it just won't pick up that first round etc. etc.The enbloc is great but glazing it and overlooking the difficulties they also offer while acting like stripper clips are uniquely finicky is just fucking retardation.
>>65510581This. Each system has its pros and cons. But whining about stripper clips particularly those of the SKS (that are simple and quick to master) is a skill issue.
>>65507375>two more rounds*twelve more ftfy>>65507424You happen to have the name/model of those rifle racks? They look perfect for my needs.
>>65507421lol noguns retard
>>65506735Looks cooler, feels better to shoot.
>>65511058how about you try it with limp wrists and see how easy it is
>>65506669America lost to Vietnam militarily and diplomatically. Vietnam lost to America economically. So you are partially correct, just not in the way we're talking about.Honestly, I blame the goddamn french. We could have chosen to support Ho Chi Minh instead of the retarded fuckwad french, because the original Indochina War was just a bog standard ass colonial independence war. It became a war against "communism" because we tried to prop up a government set up by ungrateful french bastards. Look at all the shit we did for the french during and after WW2. And look at how they repaid us during the entire Cold War and beyond. If there's one country in the world that deserves total annihilation, it's France.
>>65506472All I got to say is that the SKS is basically to the AK what the Mini-14 is to the AR (in ban states)Also I want a Yugo. With the grenade launching spiggot.
>>65509993European war tourists who have never even held a gun in their hands have extremely vitriolic opinions about russians and anything remotely associated with russia. You're not allowed to say anything even remotely positive about anything russian in origin in their minds, because merely saying shit like "I prefer the SKS to the Garand" means in their european minds that you're a raped ziggerslave. Even Ivan Chesnikov posting will drive their kind into a seething rage.It's not even a "butthurt belt" thing, this is more a germanic way of thinking if anything. It's a very all-or-nothing no nuance kind of stance that I do not nearly see as much of here in burgerland as I see coming from europeans, and specifically autistic rule-follower germanics.
>>65507380If all those things were equal, there wouldn't be much to compare.
>>65511401Can we just ban all Euros from posting. Its honestly sad seeing some fags ignite into a fuming homosexual rage when they see anything related to Russia or the Soviets. The fact that he is a a noguns retard yet claims he knows better than people who actually own not just the SKS but Also the Garand, makes this even funnier. I still can't believe this whole Ukraine war has mind raped all of the reddit fags on this board. Saying that the SKS is as good or can be the better choice in fight doesn't mean "I support Russia and all of its political and military actions". Seriously if the mods just IP banned all Eurofags, this board will improve tenfold.
>>65508079SKS clips are the worst because of the steep taper and high number of rounds. 5-round full power cartridges are a dream in comparison, and the C96 isn't bad because the clips are flat.
>>65511088>name/model of those rifle rackschecked
>>65506934Man I wish there was a common 5.45 or 5.56 rechambering of the SKS. That would be a very interesting rifle.
