at this point does the AK do ANYTHING that the AR doesn't do better?
Shoot 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 reliablyAbout it, chief
>>65571359Yes
>>65571359No
>>65571359It’s long stroke piston fucks your mom better than your dad’s tiny internal piston design.
>>65571373Possibly
>>65571359Have sovl
>>65571359Part longevity. The AK bolt is simply much more robust than the AR-15's.
>>65571359Folding stock.
>>65571359If onigger and biden didn't sanction Russian weapons and ammo, they would be cheaper. But no, the AR is better in every way.
>>65571409Nah the ak was still gonna get expensive
>>65571407Nah, AK folding stocks fucking suck ass. They made so many different styles and all of them have problems.>underfolderfucking dogshit to actually use, any grips or accessories on the bottom of your fore end are likely to interfere with it>sidefolderoh you had an optic? Well now your stock doesn't fold anymore retard, maybe you should have thought of that when you decided you were better than the rest of the squad and needed to see what you are shooting at>wire sidefoldersucks ass to use, looks awful too, crackhead vibes and not in the good way the underfolder givesThere are actually viable folding options for the AR-15, even if they're complex and annoying at least they aren't fatally flawed. The bigger issue is folding stocks are useless to begin with.
>>65571407>>65571414folding stocks are arguably memes anyways. they look cool but serve no purpose other than storage I guess
>>65571359It's a hell of a club, I broke a cheek bone for a local property enthusiast. That butt plate is hard.
>>65571359Survives extreme cold weather better.Does not need lube.Easier folding stocks.Suppresses better (7.62)Barrel length less of a concern (7.62).Rock-in mags just easier to use and more reliable.Easier and faster to field-strip and maintain.All around sexier.
>>65571414FN SCAR doesn't have those problemsRobinson Armament XCR doesn't have those problemsArmaLite AR-18/AR-180 don't have those problems:^)
>>65571534>Tourist zoomer nigger does not recognize a Finnish SakoGo back to Bluesky.
>>65571530Wrong.Wrong.Sure.Wrong.Wrong.Wrong.Wrong.Wrong.And the Finns are ditching theirs too.
>>65571530>Rock-in mags just easier to use and more reliable.that's just not true
>elegantly simple>9 pound amalgamation of forged steel and plywood>doesn't break, jam, or overheat>will shoot whether it's covered in mud or filled with sand>so easy, even a child can use it>on a coin and a flag
>>65571359making you seethe.
>>65571359Cost an extra $4k for a extra ~8 inches of barrel and a bipod (fuck you k-var)
>>65571560>Shows a VZ58God I love Lord of War
>>65571405the ak bolt life is irrelevant because the gun will be trashed when the barrel wears out, which doesn't take long with the shitty steel jacketed ammo they use.meanwhile you just swap both the bolt and the barrel at the same time when they do wear out and you basically have a brand new gun again.
>>65571552It's actually "Right" on all of those.Also, RK62 and 95 ain't going nowhere for another 50 years or so.>>65571554Bitch please, you are delusional if you think that the wobbly ass shit AR15 uses to lock its mags are in any way reliable or even easy to use, double so in harsh environment.There's a reason why Burgerfags seethe about the "OMG do not grab teh mag!!!" meme of theirs.>>65571581Even the worst pot-metal chink shit AKs can take 50k rounds of grimy-ass Soviet surplus ammo before you start seeing any issues.A safe Primadonna AR15 is lucky to get even 30k rounds down its pipe.
>>65571533yes, because we're talking about the AK. Rifles that are not the AK do not have AK folding stocks.Are you retarded?
>>65571582you have to be baiting. good one, you had me for a little bit.
>>65571414>>sidefolder>oh you had an optic? Well now your stock doesn't fold anymore retard, maybe you should have thought of that when you decided you were better than the rest of the squad and needed to see what you are shooting atModern sidefolding AKs don’t have that issue. This is like comparing the AK-200 to the M16A2 and talking about how much easier it is to add an optical sight to the AK.
>>65571582>pot-metal chink shit AKsDumbass.
>>65571601I'll remember that for all twelve modern aks that exist
>>65571409why do you always have to avatarfag with your girly wrists, whats wrong with you
Shorty 762 ak > shorty ar in either 300bo or 556
>>65571714I'll stick to my AR
>>65571359I genuinely believe its easier to control when firing full auto.
>>65571719I'm talking like the 8in barrel range
>>65571729yeah that's fair I guess
>>65571359Stubby AKs are objectively cooler than stubby ARs. The only cool stubby AR is the kitty kat
>>65571745Kitty Kat mentioned!
>>65571359Different ergonomics for wierdos like me.Works better in þe cold.I like it's cleaning and bayonet better and þink þey look better.So beyond doing better in extreme cold it's all a matter of taste.
>>65571581>steel jacketed ammo
>>65571605The Norincos being expensive in the US doesn't mean they're goodThey're €400 here now and even that sounds like a ripoff
>Longer bolt overtravel for reliability in various environments and with various ammunition>Primary extraction and camming locking for reliability>Fixed ejector for reliability>Large extractor claw with a strong spring for reliability>A shelf on the BCG for the bolt to rest on while traveling to reduce friction>A roomy frame so that foreign objects have a place to go and don't jam up the firing mechanism, a single loose primer is enough to completely shut down an AR>Easier to clean due to said roomy frame, you can clean all the parts of an AK (other than the bore) with just a rag and your fingers>A BCG with fever easy to loose small parts>Constant curvature magazines that worked from day one unlike the AR whose mags were pure garbage until Magpul finally came along>Superior magazine locking mechanism that has no problem with a full magazine and a closed bolt>Charging handle directly attached to the bolt allowing the user to firmly manipulate the bolt both front and back using their strong handAnything else? Lack of rails sucks but what can ya do
>>65571552AK's are objectively by far superior in cold environments to any other self loading rifles.
>>65571359The AK is timeless. The AR has already been phased out. It shoots a baby round, has tiny rice grain sized parts, and requires lube to function. AK is built like a tank, can shoot steel case ammo, and requires no lube or maintenance.
>>65571359This is all my personal preference, but I like the long-stroke gas system and simplicity of disassembly. The AR isn't difficult to disassemble, but the BCG itself has some tiny pieces I need a tool to remove.I also find rock and lock magazines more satisfying to use, although I wouldn't say their necessarily better.
>>65571585Those are all guns with folding stocks that are good:^)
>>65571359As a left-handed person the manual of arms is better on a basic AK than a basic AR (that is before you swap the mag release, selector, and charging handle with ambi ones).
>>65571585No, we're talking about folding stocks in general >>65571407OP question was AR vs AK anyways
>>65571359Yes, night vision use. I decided to run a modernized AK for nod use because I thought they looked cool in those old videos from whats his face. Got legitimate zenitco parts and ran with an eotech. Had no issues shooting passively and couldn't understand why people were buying these giant ass optic mounts. I decided I wanted to build out an AR or 2 for night use/multi role use (LPVO with top dot for one) and had A LOT of difficulty using my night vision without an at minimum 1.93 height optic.Also, if someone can figure out a drop in left side non reciprocating charging handle while making the handguard truly free float, the AK would be an extremely versatile modernized rifle/carbine. Especially in 556. Extremely soft shooting as it is.
>>65572761Replying to myself as I forgot to add - concerning the CH I mentioned, it seems to be very possible, just nobody wants to do it because there is no market. Robinson has the basic design with the XCR already. It would just need ( I say this as if it's easy but of course it's not) to have a modified carrier that works like the XCR's and is built into a zenitco style dust cover. Also maybe add on one of those magwell adapters for stanag mags and you have a hell of a modernized AK.
>>65572290The Finns are using a domestically produced AR now. They claim that as long as you keep it lubed with lamp oil it works.
>>65572281>mags were pure garbage until Magpul finally came alongThis is absolute nonsense. As long as you didnt have one of the "constant curve" magazines that they made for like 2 years, G.I. mags from good makers are just as reliable as magpuls, and lighter, and fit in pouches better
>>65572847>They claim that as long as you keep it lubed with lamp oil it works.Sounds pretty unreliable. Especially in combat where you're not likely to have lamp oil.
>>65572847But how are you supposed to get lamp oil if they're not getting paid in rubies?
>>65572847>>65573147They buy it from Morshu with rubies obviously
>>65573145I don't live in Finland, and I especially don't live in the arctic. Sako and friends are the ones claiming this, not me. >Sako notes that both the DI and piston variants will work well in Arctic conditions, but the piston rifle will perform better, especially if lubricated with lamp and gun oil. (Sako)https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/finland-might-perfected-ar-15-151811056.html
>>65573145>>65573147Where do you live that kerosene and diesel are non existent?
>>65573167Who said anyþing about non-existent? What was said was not likely to be present in a combat zone. Finland isn't Russia or Ukraine. Þey actually have electricity and very little need to have lamp oil everywhere.
>>65573145>Kvetching about the lack of arctic reliability of ARs vs AKs>Either doesn't realize that AKs need lubrication too or doesn't know about using kerosene/diesel as cold weather lub or additive for cold weather lubeNobody should take this poster seriously at this point.
>>65573210AKs, gassed correctly, literally don't need lube. Not using lube significantly shortens parts-life, but it's unnecessary for function.
>>65573209Other than running their vehicles and equipment on it.
>>65573225Vehicle fuel is for þe vehicles only while it's in þe gas tank. Motor pools and refueling stations aren't on þe front lines, even in Finland. Most places don't have þe luxury or curse of fighting from a FOB all þe time like þese United States does.
>>65573242ZOMG IM SO QUIRKY I USE "þ"XD
>>65571359Folding stocks I suppose
>>65571414>oh you had an optic? Well now your stock doesn't fold anymore retard, maybe you should have thought of that when you decided you were better than the rest of the squad and needed to see what you are shooting atWho allowed them to live so well?
>>65571426Swefag here. I am inclined to agree. Our AK5C's had folding stocks but people usually didn't bother, telescoping is fine.
>>65573303Use a railed dust cover. Problem solved. >>65573314Why not both?
>>65573314>telescoping is fineWhy not bo-Dammit >>65573479
Guns are supposed to be made of steelThat is all
>>65573375>It's funny how in hindsight the Air Force's adoption of the AR was incredibly corrupt. I mean what else would you call a guy showing off his prototype to a general at a party and the general going "shut up and take my money" without any kind of trials or tender or anything?Not really how it happened
>>65571582>Even the worst pot-metal chink shit AKs can take 50k rounds of grimy-ass Soviet surplus ammo before you start seeing any issues.the barrel will be keyholing at 20k rounds, zister
>all the cope posts itt
>>65573610I do cope about my Zastava. I wish I bought a different x39 AK instead. Shit's a pig even with nothing on it.
>>65571359>at this point does the AK do ANYTHING that the AR doesn't do better?it looks cooler and is more fun to shoot but that's literally it.
idk, i just like my vepr. i feel like theyre just different platforms meant to do different things. imo the AK platform is better for slower heavier ammo types and ARs are better for light, high preasure types. different things for different purposes ig
>>65571409Kys
>>65572658Yes, which have nothing to do with the topic.>>65572758hope you get better soon
>>65571363I'll bet money that an AR done with intent will shoot 5.45 better than an AK.The question is why even try?
>>65575109like 20 years ago 5.45 was insanely cheap
>>65571359The AK is very cucked in the US civilian market.So if you're accounting for the value proposition, then no, there's no significant advantages.In my opinion, 5.45 is an overall better round than 5.56Unless you're using REAL 5.56(M193 with a 20" barrel and a 1:12 twist rate)A milspec AK is also more reliable than a milspec AR.People cope about it, because their feelings get hurt, but there's a reason that almost every helmet cam from the middle east will show at least one AR jamming.Also, subjectively speaking, I've never had an AK jam, but almost every AR I've had has jammed at some point.
>>65575167>M193 with a 20" barrel and a 1:12 twist rateIt's not 1968 anymore.
>>65575209Have fun with your over-stabilized M193, your ice-picking M855, and your 77 grain OTMs that penetrate 12.00000001" (on average) in ballistic gel at point blank range.
>>65571363Ars can shoot 7.62x39 and the superior 7.62x35 more reliably for a generally cheaper rifle.
>>65571405Like 75% if current import and domestic built AKs butterbolts mushroom out within 1k rounds
>>65575225ah yes, icepicking.
>>65575286Idk what is so hard about JUST BUY A FUCKING WASR.>oh but I want to spend twice as much on a worse gunDON'T
>>65575323The king of the butterbarrels, nice choice.Oh and look at that, they cost the same/more than a decent AR.
>>65575338>just making shit up
>>65575317>>65575225Also the longest confirmed 1 shot kill with 5.56 was at 700m with m855 from a 20" barrel M16a3 or 4, whatever the marines had in ~2004
>>65575340From Save The Last Bullet For Yourself.But besides that anecdote, wasrs are well known to get drooping barrels from moderate fire rates.And love for a wasr is slavboo copium.
>>65575349>wasr is slavboo copium.It's not even slav. Are you retarded? Nevermind, I know you're retarded.>it from bookOh. I've shot wasr's plenty and never seen such a thing. I understand the problem now.
>>65575349>WASR>Romanian>Slav
>>65575317>1 counter example means it never happenslmao>>65575341So what?Bullet selection matters, but shot placement is still king.
>>65575371Correct. Icepicking, specifically in 5.56, was made up by boomers to explain how they were able to dump a full magazine and hit nothing. "N-no you gotta believe me I shot him like a lot but the bullets just didn't do any damage!"
>>65575375>a highly stabilized steel core bullet cannot ever fail to yaw quicklyk
>>65575367Sucks to suck, cuck.
>>65575355All AK fetishism is derived from slavboo.And Romanian are still subhuman slav trash, cry harder
>>65575411Again lol>Romanians>Slavs
>>65575411>>65575414Romanians aren't a Slavic ethnic group, retard. You probably think Ohio is part of The South.
>>65571359The man of the century used AK that ends the debate
>>65575414retard
>>65575428>>65575424>While Romanians are not linguistically or culturally Slavic, centuries of cohabitation and migration mean modern Romanians share significant genetic and historical overlap with neighboring South and East Slavic populations.Get fucked slavboos. Cry harder about your non white eurotrash minority groups.
>>65575508>literally not slavs>AHHHH THEY'RE SLAVSbased retard
>>65575508>Romanians are not linguistically or culturally Slavic>Get fucked slavboos.I mean it really makes you think: how do people this stupid live this long?
>>65575511>genetics don't matter, what matters is if you speak nonsense language A v nonsense language B.Well shit I guess blacks who speak English are all brits then.
>>65575526Society has been made safer for the stupid. Two hundred years ago someone would have said "shut up or I'm going to kill you." And then if he didn't quit being stupid, he would have been killed.>>65575530If genetics mattered Czechs would be Germans and Russians would be mongols. Slavs are a made up ethnic group with a fake language that is simply a creole of slave tongues by those held in bondage in Scythia.
>>65572847>using a domestically produced AR nowNot yet, they are in the process of adopting it but I don't think a single conscript has seen a 5.56 AR so far.>as you keep it lubed with lamp oil it worksRandom bullshit not necessary with an AK
>>65575539>Random bullshit not necessary with an AKLittle is necessary with the AK, since the man issued with an AK isn't expected to accomplish anything.
>>65575428The rest of us Midwesterners refuses to recognize them and romanians are gypsies which makes them spiritually slavic.
>>65572847Finn here. I'm absolutely, 1000%, certain that our ARs won't be able to withstand the rigors of a conscript army, at least not at first
>>65575906And conscript armies can't withstand the rigors of combat.
>>65575013Thanks my tummy has been hurting. Took a big shit yesterday but I think theres still more
>>65571363Welcome to the futureShame the x39 taper precludes use in ICAR, it's a nice mag for 6/6.5
>>65575539>not necessary with an AK AKs short stroke, get feeding issues, fail to chamber, etc. That's why the charging handle exists so you can beat it into battery or rack it to get the obstruction out.>>65575906Your conscripts are getting piston ones aren't they?
>>65576131>AKs short stroke, get feeding issues, fail to chamber, etc.Very rarely, even in the winter.
>>65575414AK fetishism is derived from you being able to buy AKs for way less than ARs and buy ammo for a fraction of what NATO calibers was. What exists now is just a pure aesthetics thing plus the people who bought AKs 10+ years ago.
>>65571359It folds. That's pretty much it.
>>65575951Finnish conscripts are generally pretty well trainedYou don't really have much of a choice with a population of less than 6m next to Russia. It's AKs for everyone or you might as well surrender>>65576131I don't know what they'll get. Also AKs are a lot more reliable than you think. I have seen ARs jam a fair bit even at the civilian range, but with my AK personally the only real malfunctions I have had in ca. 3000 rounds have been the bolt carrier once hanging up on the hammer somehow (bizarre) and the time when I got a squib
>>65571359>at this point does the AK do ANYTHING that the AR doesn't do better?Not have an attitude about it?
>>65571381/thread
>>65576184>Very rarelyThat's just patently false.>>65576251>more reliable than you thinkI own AKs. I know how reliable they are. I also own ARs and I know how reliable they are too.
>>65571582finnish aks look nicer than russian aks
>>65576495The only feed issues I have ever had were with shitty aftermarket mags, I have never ever encountered the other problems
>>65576889I mean, my shit has only ever been used in competition style situations, never in (not yet at least) in a situation that would induce those failures. Have you?
>>65576907I only tend to shoot at the range or at competitions but even in subzero temperatures I haven't had malfunctions
>>655713597.62x39 is good at short to medium range and for shooting through cover. An AR in that caliber would probably be better.
>>65571582>Wobbly ar magsYou've either literally not fired an AK or an AR, are retarded, or are trolling
>>65571582>Bitch please, you are delusional if you think that the wobbly ass shit AR15 uses to lock its mags are in any way reliable or even easy to use, double so in harsh environment.Have you ever even seen an AR in person? It's the method literally every non-rocking rifle, and every modern pistol uses. It works great.>There's a reason why Burgerfags seethe about the "OMG do not grab teh mag!!!" meme of theirs.What year is it? 2008? I don't think people even pretend to care about that anymore.
ARs are superior, but God damn take me back to when I was 22 and spending all my money at the bars and make me get a NIB SGL-21 for $800Those fuckers are ~$2500 used now
>>65577221>tfw passed up $350 PSLsactually just kill me. Stick my skull in a hydraulic press.
>>65576495>That's just patently false.What the fuck are you trying to say?Are you trying to say that AR's come anywhere close to AK reliability in the cold?
>>65576495Post these aks and ars that you own
>>65577129>>65577190AR's used to be super delicate about their mags until the CIVILIAN MARKET came for the rescue with the PMAG.You weren't even allowed to monopod shoot the AR lmao
>>65577263I never said that but whatever you want to argue.
>>65577298Then what does this conversation mean?>>>as you keep it lubed with lamp oil it works>>Random bullshit not necessary with an AK>AKs short stroke, get feeding issues, fail to chamber, etc. That's why the charging handle exists so you can beat it into battery or rack it to get the obstruction out.
>>65577327>Anon claims that AKs rarely malfunction>I say that's not trueAnd here we are now. Some of you need to learn to read a little more slowly.
>>65577334>>>AR's require lamp oil to keep working in the cold>>AK's work fine in the cold with normal maintenance, without this extraneous addition of lamp oil>But AK's do also sometimes short stroke, get feeding issues, fail to chamber, etc.What sort of argument is this???
>>655723802/8
>>65577363>AKs rarely malfunction>That's not true(You) seething for some fucking reason that I made this statement.
>>65575225>77grain OTMs that penetrate 12.00000001" (on average) in ballistic gel at point blank range.>Pretending this is actually an issue.
>>65577378AR's need lamp oil to work in the cold, AK's don't. They work just fine with completely normal maintenance. AK's are more reliable in the cold. End of story.
>>65577391Holy low fucking IQ. If you genuinely weren't so dumb, you would re-read the post chain to understand that the claim is concerning general reliability.
>>65577412Please go ahead and read the previous messages in the chain. The discussion is related to reliability in the cold.
>>65577416Every post you make makes me feel an unearned sense of superiority. Please stop being retarded and just goddamn read.
>>65571359The primary advantage to the AK is and always has been that its use and maintenance is simple enough to be undertaken by an illiterate conscript with poor to nonexistent logistical support. There really aren't a lot of small, fragile parts to break or lose and it doesn't foul as readily. The use of tapered cases solves some problems, like failure to go into battery and case head separation, seen in poorly maintained weapons. If you are an educated Westerner with a cleaning kit and access to spare parts, an AR is fantastic. If you are a child soldier who doesn't know where your next meal is coming from and can't figure out how to tie a knot in a boot lace and pull it through the barrel every few yeas, not so much.>Amateurs talk about tactics, but professionals study logistics
>>65577477this is the type of shit people who have never handled an AK say. The AK has much more difficult maintenance than an AR. Like congrats, your retarded conscript with no training took apart his AK. He lost the top cover since it's not captive, and the bolt since it isn't captive either.
>>65577505Where did he put the top cover? His butthole? It seems difficult to lose.
>>65577505>He lost the top cover since it's not captive, and the bolt since it isn't captive either.If you're liable to lose all the important parts, maybe you shouldn't be handling firearmsDo tell why this doesn't apply to all the tiny pins and springs an AR has, especially the retarded cotter pin. You can render an AR safety inoperable just by taking off the grip
>>65577505You're never actually touched an AK have you?
>>65571359I'm no gun nerd, so all I can say is it looks better with wood furniture
>>65573209>Þey>Þ
>>65577505My top cover is captive.
>>65578484>If you're liable to lose all the important parts, maybe you shouldn't be handling firearmsExactly, excellent observation. So making a gun for retarded people serves no purpose and is not a benefit.>You can render an AR safety inoperable just by taking off the gripAnd why would you take the grip off? I think this is more a "you" problem than a conscript problem.
>>65578560You tell me.
>>65579289You're the tard here
>>65579294>nigga lost the whole AK because it wasn't captivemaybe you were right
>>65579311based off multiple videos I've seen from Ukraine, this does happen
>>65579311>>65579322when you remove the dust cover, entire AK comes apart and the pieces scatter into the ethermany such cases!
>>65579330AKs when you remove the dust cover
>>65571359AK looks cooler
>>65571359Being made by trad white skinned male, instead of nigger, spic, or.. god forbid JEW.
>>65581306>JEWDa joos, used ak like Galil tough.
>>65571593>you have to be baiting.Nope. 100% sincere and facts there, kiddo.>>65571605Someone clearly has never owned a Norinco Type-56S.>>65573596Mine lasted ~35-40K, and it just started shooting fucking high all the sudden. It's a 40 years old war horse though.>>65577129I've fired both, and own both actually. GJ for not adding ANY arguments though, buster!>>65577190>Have you ever even seen an AR in person?Good heavens no! Why would you think that!??Absolutely seething burger juniors, everywhere tonight...>It's the method literally every non-rocking rifleYeah, and it still sucks ass. And ain't as common as you believe.>and every modern pistol usesPistol grips cover the entire mag.
>>65582355I disagree with a majority of what you've posted but /k/ has truly become the epitome of>disagree with me? you must be a strawman, show proof you're notI'm starting to think this is intentional astroturfing.
>>65582372It's been like this for the past 12 years.Pretty much ever since Hiro took over and invited the viral marketers, which coincided with the iPhone mobilefags storming the internet. This is also why so many posts are like 1 or 2 sentences max, have shitty grammar, and practically boil down to "NO U!" arguments + Pepe meme pic with IMG_1245.jpeg file name.
>>65575411You're citing a book full of boomer fuddlore. It's not like battlefield las vegas has wasr's that lasted over 100k rounds with full auto. Go volunteer for ukraine, nigger faggot.
The AR does everything better except have that gun type of feeling you get handling non ARs. I'm going to call that "gun type of feeling" soul. I have an AR, I "built" it and love it but it feels soulless compared to every other gun I own
>>65582961If ARs are boring to you then you need to start LARPing.
>>65582961Strip it back to basics or limit yourself to a certain era and it feels better. Otherwise modern ARs are indeed boring as fuck.
>>65582961I agree with you. I spent like 1500- 2000 bucks on a bcm last winter and I have more fun with my police trade in mini14 and a 60 year old savage 311 shotgun.
>>65571359AR is used by white countries, AK is used by fecaldermis """countries""">>65577477>xaxaxa simple gun for simple monkey win wars trust cumradwhat blew up this time?
>>65577291Pmag shill again lol. Stanags were fixed when green followers replaced black ones in the early 90s
>>65579330>when you take the gun apart, it comes apartwow
>>65583714>AR is used by white countriesMaybe at one point. There aren't white countries anymore
>>65583773>t.pucciabot
