Looks and aesthetics aside, how does feel and performance differ from the M16a1, M16a4 and the m4?
>>65627774AR peaked with pic related.
>>65627774heaviershittier trigger in the GI/none export A2/A4A1s legit sound like the stock movie sound effects the sound of charging the rifle and shooting
>>65627774Full stocks have a springier sound when shot. A1 are surprisingly light and point better even if the overall weight is more than a m4. Shorter doesnt always mean lighter. The 20 with a2 profile and quads are fucking heavy
>>65627774The thing that surprised me when I first picked up an A1, and I think would surprise most people, is how obscenely light they were. Like even people who have shot AR carbines and know how light they can be would be surprised how featherlight an A1 is; especially at the front end. Obviously we cant go back, everyone has optics on flat top receivers, suppressors are considered almost necessary and nobody wants a pencil barrel and its just expected that a handguard be free floated but solid enough to mount lasers and lights and optics and still retain zero; that's all extra weight that I agree cannot be compromised on, but I do fundamentally think something was lost over the years.
>>65627806>we cant go back because of massive faggotsstop listening to faggots
>>65627779>sold as A2>still has A1 sights
>>65627815(((Colt))) probably charged extra for those at first on the export/commercial models
>>65627774why does it have a carry handle when every drill instructor will yell at you for carrying it by the handle?
they are all the same
>aestheticsFriggin zoomers can't just say "hey this looks cools" they have to use gay descriptions instead. Never, ever, ever listen to anything a zoomer has to say on firearms.
>>65627844This. If you think 5.56 is harsher to shoot out of an M4 then you need to eat a steak and do some curls or something. That being said, I'm god's biggest musket defender because it's easier to get a good check weld for me because I'm a 6'2" lanklet with long arms. Also I found it easier to fire with the rifle supported on trees and fighting positions and shit out in the woods.
>>65627815Exactly, it's a transitional model>No gov barrel>No deflector>A1 or A2 grip>3 rnd or Full autoI don't think any got A1 stocks. Its brother, the 715 became the C7.
Would I be crazy to sell my a4 clamshell upper and get an a1? Or should I just build something like pic rel?
>>65627774A1 with A2 handguards
>>65627774Everyone I've ever heard glazes the M16A1, and mechanically they seem to be rightGenerally speaking, the only REAL improvement the A2 made was the ribbed handguard, most soldiers and civilians really preferred that round one over the triangle one, but the rest of the ergos and function of the A1 are uniformly considered superior and nobody defends burst-fire as anything but idiocyThat said, like >>65627806 said, nobody is willing to go back to the days of purpose-built vanilla weapons. The sheer amount of customizable toys tailored precisely to your biology you can add to an AR that has a picatinny rail system is indispensable to 95% of shooters and 100% of servicemen. I think they're ugly, and I don't like em, but I can't deny that having laser pointers and flashlights and reflex sights and night vision and suppressors and hogue grips and PMAGs and curly straw foregrips with optional motorized Lovense blowjob support is useful
Feature / Specification M16A1 M16A2Barrel Profile Lightweight "pencil" profile Heavy profile (forward of the gas block)Rifling Twist Rate 1:12 twist 1:7 twistStandard Ammunition .223 Rem / 5.56mm M193 (55-grain) 5.56×45mm NATO M855 / SS109 (62-grain)Firing Modes Safe / Semi / Full-Automatic Safe / Semi / 3-Round BurstRear Sight Flip aperture; tool-adjustable windage only Click-adjustable dial for windage and elevation (300–800m)Handguards Triangular (left/right specific, fragile) Round, ribbed, and interchangeableButtstock Shorter; smooth buttplate 0.62 inches longer; checkered, slip-resistant buttplatePistol Grip Straight, smooth polymer Finger groove/molded ledge, textured polymerCase Deflector None Integrated raised shell deflectorFlash Hider Open bottom (3-prong or early birdcage) "Birdcage" with closed bottom slots (acts as compensator)Forward Assist Plunger Teardrop shape Round shapeStandard Magazine 20-round (later 30-round) 30-roundUnloaded Weight ~6.4 to 7.1 lbs ~7.5 lbsOverall Length 38.8 inches 39.6 inches
>>65627774Real talk though, I have a Colt M4A1 and want a carry handle for it. Any of you know where to find a decent one? Please no Chinesium
>>65627774The A2 is the A1 after letting itself go to the lunch buffet too many times
>>65629156If I had to carry one all day, I'd take the A1If I had to shoot one all day, I'd take the A2
I've only shot an M4A1 and an M16A4. I loved the M16 because of the much longer sight radius. Felt like shooting a laser beam compared to the M4.
>>65628251Just buy multiple uppers and have 1 or 2 lowers to swap them around on. A rifle lower and a carbine lower.
>>65628901>>65628901https://ebay.io/m/miQhfc
>>65627800RIS rails are a fucking plague.Glad mlok is taking over.
>>65627905aesthetics is the correct term you millennial faggot, maybe you'd prefer HECKIN CHUNGUS WHOLESOME 100!
M4 is louder and has more recoil. Muzzle velocity is a little less
>>65629908>HECKIN CHUNGUS WHOLESOME 100!Kek'd t. millennial
>>65627826Its not and has never been a carrying handle. Its a post for the sight and protective wings, with the secondary function of protecting the extinct old vertical charging handle.
>>65629908that's 100% right doe, the m16 is kino
>>65629908That's a cool story there bro
>>65629966yeah no, it's a carry handle faggot, it always had been and always will be. Do people actually carry it by the carry handle? no.. is it still called the carry handle? yes.
>>65628251If you want optics, keep the flat top. If you just use a picatinny carry handle, ditch the upper and get the a1. The best gun for shtf is a handgun you can ccw anyway.
>>65629908Aesthetic is used by everyone
>>65630467a pistol is a shitty toy, it's only used as a cope to get to a rifle. you should be carrying a rifle at all times btw, anything less is will get you killed
>>65629908low quality bait, read a dictionary frognigger>>65630471foreigners like you should be rangebanned desu
>>65627774I think A1 is great in terms of balance, ergos, and basic utility per pound, but for me the M4 just works
>>65627774fudd shit, 11.5 PSA AR mogs it hard
>>65630511You say "mogs" therefore you are a larper fag whose opinion means nothing
>>65630511>heavier than an a1 since every SBR faggot uses an HBAR for some reason>as long as a 20in since you're required to run a suppressor, if you don't you get instant hearing damage even with earpro>requires $5 a round hirtenberger buscadero ticondas to do anything past 25 feet>only used because golems need to shoot illiterate nigger children inside mudhuts
>>65630561>$5 a round hirtenberger buscadero ticondasTook all my power to not laugh like a retard in the taxi I'm in. RIP Paul
>>65630561you forgot>no bayonet mountif you can't charge the enemy lines you're NGMI
>>65630467Well, my thing is weight saving, plus I don’t see myself ever mounting any kind of optic.
>>65627800In terms of weight, how much lighter is an A1 vs an A2?I’ve got an A4 upper and get an A1 clone if that’s the case. Besides, I don’t see myself ever putting an optic on anyway.
>>65627815Colt built guns with whatever they had on hand. I had an a2 with a slab side lower.
>>65630802>hadYou sold?
>>65630780About 2.2 pounds
>>65631365I mean 1.2 pounds
>>65630780A pound something half of that is the barrel profile. Then the a2 plastic furniture is slightly heavier for each piece. But the barrels the thing that really changes the balance.
>>65631379The a1 upper also looks good with clam shells or triangular handguards. The a2 upper only looks good with clam shells. On a rifle length ar15 at least.
>>65631367>>65631379Thanks anons. I’ve never really been happy with my a4 upper. I mean it looks cool, but I just can’t make myself like it honestly. Now that you guys mention it, the thing does seem to be a bit front heavy. I think my best bet is an a1.
>>65631444If you cant get an a1 upper and have to settle for a flatop thats fine unless you were trying to clone. The important part is pencil barrel. You need that 20 inch pencil barrel.Hell 16 pencil is fine too if you are fine with shorter. The pencil barrel makes all the difference. A 20 inch pencil is lighter than your standard 16 a2profile.
>>65631454>lighter than a 16”That’s crazy. Yeah, unfortunately mine has the thick barrel, I bought it years ago, but it’s a PSA, not chrome lined.I’ve been looking at the H&R a1 uppers on PSA’s website. They’re like $700. For me that’s a little much honestly.I appreciate the encouragement though. Thank you.
>A1 stock and barrel>3x microprism>A2 handguardsyes its peak, fuck carbines
>>65631413Okay but why does a lizard have tits? I'm not mad, just curious how you explain that from an anatomy perspective
>>65627815For Colt commercial advertising and markings during this era "A2" meant 1/7 twist rifling and "A1" meant 1/12 regardless of anything else.
>>65631987Yeah.
So does a 55 grain with a 1/12 twist rate pen the same as out of a 1/7?
>>65631987>no light >non free floated>nonadjustable stock>fixed magnificationdead in the streets
>>65632368NTA but other than the light everything you mentioned is faggot shit. >hello, I'd like my rifle to be as uncomfortable as possible: one wobbly stock, a burning cheese grater handguard, and a 5 pound MPVO dot stack please!
>>65631987gayron?
>>65627905You should immediately buy an AR-15 with a 20” heavy barrel upper and get a bipod, FRT, Arken scope, a few drum mags, and six gorillion boxes of .223 Remington before the democrats stop allowing fun.
>>65632368You just don't know what success looks like
>>65631996thats where the cum is stored
>>65632343I wouldn't think so because 1:7 is borderline over-stabilization for M193 and clones of it as it is
>>65629966It has always been a carry handle
This is the peak of AR design and the world just refuses to accept it
>>65633227In what way is that better?
>>65633230Collapsing stock with the triangular cheek rest design that is much more ergonomic and also storage spaceinternal oil spring buffer that reduces the felt recoil and makes the full auto firing rate more consistentoptics ready out the box with a weaver rail(precursor to picatinny) flat top and a quick aiming rib that negates the need of a back up sight as well as force air in to keep the barrel coolermuzzle brake-flash hider device that combined with the oil buffer reduced recoil down to 40% or more making burst firing with duplex round deliver a shotgun-like effect on targets 300m
>>65632368A sling and forward assist is all Rittenhouse needed
>>65633241>internal oil spring bufferDo you mean a hydraulic buffer? Because that'd be at least half the reason no one wanted it, they wear out, leak, and cause malfunctions. You're better off sticking without something that works and can't be fucked up
>>65633245Not him but not every engagement is the same as Kyle Rittenhouse's
>>65633248No, it still contained a spring along with an oil buffer and they tested them pretty hard during the ACR program and it worked pretty reliably, the only reason the ACR program didn't prosper is that it was too expensive when they could shit out A4s fairly easily.
>>65633257I need to look into it more, I'm not willing to argue in bad faith just because I think something is ugly and probably very nose-heavy
>>65633267if nothing else the muzzle device definitely should have become standard because it also reduced rapport somewhat. But thinking about it, the ACR could have given every infantryman an optic almost a full decade before ACOGs. It would have given full size barrel rifles the collapsing stock that was becoming necessary for troops wearing plate carriers too.https://armourersbench.com/2018/03/09/colt-advanced-combat-rifle/
>>65633227>20in barrel>collapsible stock with storage>flattop with fixed magnification opticother than the goofy handguard/hydraulic system it's peak
>>65633319>almost a full decade before ACOGsthe ACOG was part of the ACR trials
>>65627774Sample size of one but I used an M4 exclusively for years until I qual'd with a guard unit that still had M16A2s. It was legitimately one of the nicest shooting rifles I've ever used, it was blemmed, beat up, used for many a year, and I still shot 40 with it (old qual)May have been my imagination but it was also surprisingly light for a 20 inch barrel rifle, either lighter or just as heavy as the M4 with a cco and the quad rails and all that shit. Don't get me wrong, I still love the M4, but it just blew me away to use and do well with this old workhorse.
>>65633432Not adopted though
>>65633227what was the reasoning behind the weird ass design for the handguard? Did they plan to sell these in vending machines?
>>65633505Its the same concept as a shotguns vent rib. Easy to sight down and reduces heatwave distortion.
>>65627774I guess I've only shot the M4, A2 and a generic 16" AR and between all of them the actual felt recoil and operation is imperceptible. You'd probably have to shoot a full mag out of each of them side by side to get a better sense of how they differ. The major differences between them come down to handling/ergonomics, attachments, and the optics configuration.
>>65633241So an a4 with a sopmod stock and kac muzzle brake
>>65633432It looks so weirdly out of place on that rifle.
>>65635331Well, its just because we're used to seeing it on ARs and not weird 1980s prototype rifles
>>65627774I have a 20 inch HBARA2 and a normal 16 inch AR. The HBARA2 is less springy, has a way lower recoil impulse, not that 5.56 really has one and the hbar ways a lot more. The HBAR is also quieter and more pleasant to shoot (though again, 5.56 isn't unpleasant to shoot) and the stock feels so much nicer since it doesn't have sharp angles like the M4 stock
>>65635821Idk, rifle looks "melted" and smoothed on the lower and stock, probably one big polymer piece. Heat shield is stamped but matches close enough with the rear/lower and doesn't clash. The ACOG, in comparison, has a cast and bolted together "industrial machine" look which really contrasts. It really fits in with the look and design choices of 90s to moderm free float uppers on AR-style rifles. However, I will say the ACOG does look like some "heavier duty" (body style) older optics stylistically and in its design. The SUIT, the M38/M40 tank sight, or maybe even the PSO/POSP scope bodies come to mind. It looks so modern despite resembling those in design being cast/forged and bolted together. Idk, maybe if you gave the ACOG a coat of black oil paint or japanning, engraved and white paint filled its model name, and hid the fiber optic, it wouldn't look so "modern" and "new" to me. Hell, don't give prop makers any ideas (or COD devs) but you could probably make the ACOG look much older with little more than the right coat of paint now that I think of it.
>>65633432>>65635331This explains so much about the acogs "bad" eye relief window. It wasnt designed for the ar.
>>65627774A1 belongs in the trash simply because of the iron sights.
>>65637240>put the acog at the back of the rail>adjust stock as neededwhy cant noguns understand this
>>65633257>>65633241>>65633227I like the handguard because you can't costa grip it
>>65629778It's ok to be wrong.
>>65637644even with it back that far it doesnt change the stock drop
>>65637240>>65637644>>65638233the ACOG is at the same eye level as the A2 sights. the eye box is shit because it's a prism with a huge field of view. the physics of the FOV and size of the optic shit up the eye box. You must exclusively shoot offhand. ACOGs are in the right place if you're shooting prone. ARs/M16s are designed to be shot while prone. Like the toggle lock winchesters have super hard stock drops because they were designed to be shot while standing and they suck being shot prone. some shotguns and rifle have buttplates you can move up and down to make it easier to shoot standing vs prone
>>65638472scale might be slightly off cause i tried to base it off acog and mag size. the lop doesnt count cause the stocks in. you can see the difference in stock height. thats not a small amount. thats the whole charging handle.
>>65638493I have an acog. the eyebox is fine when you shoot from the prone. it's only gay offhand
>>65637430AIDS tier opinion
>>65638512you completely miss the point. nobody said that you cant use an acog when its mounted on an ar.
>>65638532he's complaining about the eye box. I get that, especially with an A2 stock, the acog is both low and far away which means you have to do that gay ass nose to charging handle thing that's not super comfortable, especially if you're wearing a PC, coat or webgear. Like I have a gay ass fixed stock because of cuck state and I can't do it with alice gear on and when I shoot offhand I usually like to keep my head up anyway and not do nose to charging handle, but when you shoot prone, the ACOG is in the right spot and the eyebox is in the right spot. I'm sure the army cared more about prone shooting than offhand
>>65638582>gay ass nose to charging handle thingI also hate that. It's like wearing shoes that are the wrong size or something. I get if one learned to shoot that way, but I didn't
>>65638594I did when I was starting, but the guys at the high power thing told me to do the head up stuff and move the rifle up and it's just way more comfortable. I can tell when I do it too, so I have a red dot on my AR right now and it has a fixed front sight post so unless I put the rifle itself up higher the dot is above the front sight when I stand and behind the front sight when I'm prone. If I mount by going cheek first like you would a shotgun then it's better and the dot's lower than when I was just doing shoulder first while standing
>>65633252It literally is tho. Everyone is just a mega niggerfaggot and buys guns for combat in lala land.
>>65631987>>65632368>>65633245>>65633252>>65638639I don't think you need free float on an AR just based on what the max effective range is. like a 4 moa gun is fine out to 400 yards, that's 16 inches at 400 yards and 400 yards is pretty far for 5.56 anyway and you need a bdc or to dial by that point. t. has a float tube on my hbar, but not on my carbine
>>65628901Pretty sure PSA has colt carry handles. I actually have a spare one in my closet here but I been hanging onto it.
>>65632343>>65632803Which means it would pen more.Overstabilization detracts the yaw that helps produce fragmentation.
>>65633241>>65633257Before I google; Does anyone make a modern version of that buffer that is good, not ridiculously priced and able to be fitted to a standard milspec AR?
>>65633319>rapportAm I a newfag?
>>65627815Yes, it's basically the C7
>>65627774A1 and A2 are stupid light. A A4 has zero fucking recoil.
