>red team Iran>bro, we're just going to lure a CBG into littoral waters>then we'll ambush them in an act of perfidy signaled by a call to prayerNo wonder the actual war turned out like it did if this Hollywood brained war plan was what their best mind in unconventional warfare could come up with role-playing Iran. How do you miss "just pound their bases and hqs to rubble with ballistic missiles lmao" or, "don't set the tone with a war crime"? Why is the American military mind so solipsistic?
>>65636399What blew up?
why can't i make a hunting thread?
>>65636427light speed motorcycles, 2-ton fishing boats armed with 1-ton missiles, and teleporting attack boats
>>65636441I'm annoyed that people think this guy was Nostradamus was when the actual Iranian war plans don't resemble his discount Tom Clancy bullshit at all.
What has /pol/niggers so riled up? Is just the usual midterms bullshit?
>>65636399>>65636441>>65636447My dudes. The point of wargames is to push systems to the limit. So if you can survive a scenario where the enemy can do comms without emitting via instant motorcycle message (so you can never find their HQ's and can't dergarde their command and control) then you're going to fucking DOMINATE a war where the enemy is, in reality, kinda retarded. Which is what happened irl. Iran has been preparing for this conflict for 40 years and they got raped, and then re-raped, repeatedly for very little cost.
>>65636399>>>/pol/>>>/jeet/muzzie/schizo-containment-board/>>65636427US midterm elections.
>>65636458>Noooo you can't talk about one of /k/'s favorite topics
>>65636427>>65636458>>65636468Samefag
>>65636470Take your meds and do your skin-bleaching routine.
>>65636470Lol
>>65636463motor cycle messagers wouldnt be an issue if everyonee agreed on their capabilitiesbut what happened was that he was told he could use them, then because he wasnt told what they couldnt do, made them transmit information instantly and without any way to be interceptedof course in reality, motorcycles have travel time and can be killed off their motorcycleeven the proposed method of using light signals could be detected with the technology of the time and has inherent lagan honest simulation would have been to model that, but that would mean his epic out-of-the-box tactic would be actually defeatable
Someone post the video of that US sub torpedoing an iranian ship and all the dudes flying up in the air.
>>65636480I actually don't mind it. Depends on the purposes of the exercises. If it's a doctrinal stress test let's get as absurd as possible to see how long it takes something to break, and when something breaks, then how. The reason we're so good is that we wargame shit into oblivion and those wargames will often get redone if they are determined to be too easy.
>>65636463There is a difference between pushing the limits to learn what you can do while on the backfoot and the endless midwit circlejerk over teleporting motorcycles and the US navy spawning into saturation fire already underway.
>>65636399I hate being in the timeline where I think the war with Iran is comically retarded because of the "forever war all over again" (not because Iran getting the everloving fuck bombed out of it is actually losing or some stupid shit, but because our government seems to have no real plan beyond "bomb them here and there and hope they surrender) thing and not because I think Iran is heckin wholesome Chungus Friends with us, or that a botched intel causing a civilian bombing of a school is Hitlerino 2.0I hate that there is nobody in American politics that I can even remotely agree with at large in the big 26 in any geopolitical senseNuke Israel, nuke Iran, nuke Russia>>65636488peak pseud
>>65636463>they got raped, and then re-raped, repeatedly for very little cost.very cool but this is meaningless when they need next to nothing to keep the strait of hormuz closed and cause massive economic damage to the rest of the world and the US military is unable to stop them.after all this raping and re-raping, the strait remains closed off and iran hasn't capitulated yet.meanwhile the US military got its bases in the middle east destroyed, trump lost the midterms and can't pass legislation anymore, and the war made everyone poorer.this was in no uncertain terms extremely retarded and pointless
>>65636643One wonders how far gone or brown one has to be to interoperate what is happening as an epic Iranian win
>>65636488>So how did it break?>It broke because it's literally impossible to intercept enemy comms>Well... uh... we learned that... comms are important
>>65636666Satan backs team red
>>65636399I am the only faggot in this thread who read the whole Millennium Challenge. This is what I remember>win 95 clipart>tons of misspellings >so many acronyms it made my eyes bleed>von Riper is not mentioned by name once, and its noted his tactic hamstrings the Iranian navy in the long term
>>65636643Economic damage to the rest of the world? Sounds good. Fucking hate every country that’s not the USA
>>65636643>trump lost the midterms and can't pass legislation anymoreDoesn't matter, Democrats are already committed to the Iran war
>>65636643Don't bother the delusional retards on this board will tell you we needed and won yet another sandbox war
>>65636692I cannot believe anyone ever expected anything else
>>65636666It may seem obvious to you but remember that it took Hegseth 11 months to learn that sailors on an aircraft carrier need food.
>>65636463The issue isn't the plausibility of the scenario, the issue is van riper going off script and interrupting the exercise for his own ego. It would be like running a first aid course and some retard keeps pulling the fire alarm, saying "but what if there was a fire as well, huh? didya think of that?". Its like yeah, nobody is disputing that that could happen, but were training CPR right now.
>>65636700They had food retard
>>65636672Yeah, "so we pretend to be fishing boats and then strike the colors and throw everything at the CBG that's we were able to lure into littoral waters as our opening plan and uh hope there are enough assets left to control the bottleneck" is the kind of gamble that someone who watches too many action movies would come up with, and is bad politics. Starting a war with an act of perfidy is not a good look for winning the diplomatic PR war.
>>65636399>just ignore the 30+ iranian warships that got sunk irl saaaarCurse vishnu right now.
>>65636463>Very little costDiesel is like $10 a gallon, everything is expensive, and the sitting GOP president managed to lose almost the entire South, Texas, and more.
>>65636771>decapitate Venezuela and Iran with no boots on the ground>China spiraling>Russia lmaoThis is fine.
>>65636463We can rape them as much as they want, the retardation that is the global economy and the absolute weakness of our population mean that everyone wants to pull out rather than finish the job. It even has the retard mega-chud entity that is the Hegseth Pentagon cautious to just finish the fucking job, which only prolongs the economic problem. Yeah, Iran is dead. Even if we completely pulled out tomorrow their already ailing economy was dealt a mortal blow. The coming decades will either have them lose their borderlands to rebels or rival countries, or have them get completely cored out by the Chinese into a puppet state if they're stupid enough to repeat our mistake of getting hard committed to the Middle East. Maybe it'll descend into warlordism or full blown thirdie failed state. It's gonna be ugly either way.The problem is that nobody is going to perceive it as a win, because really all Americans actually care about is being materially comfortable, and this war only exacerbated the extant decline in that material comfort. But the longer we keep it in this protracted siege state, the longer the economic squeeze will go on for. I don't know how the U.S.A hasn't figured out how to fight a war of foreign interventionism in the 70-ish years since Korea.
>>65636787>China spiralingTwo more weeks, amirite?
>>65636767Hindu Indians wouldn't be posting pro-Iran stuff. Hindus fucking hate Muslims on account of all the horrible stuff the Mughals did to them. They hate them so much, that they're some of the only people still unironically in Israel's corner. It's Pakistanis that are the keyboard warriors for Jihadis. Because, for whatever reason, they're the biggest ummah (a muslim term for the international brotherhood of muslims) glazers of all the Muslim countries. Which is funny, because the other Muslim countries tend to look down on them. Partially because their hajjis are famously provincial and annoying, praying in the street and shit. Basically, most internet political arguments nowadays are actually Indians vs. Pakistanis, with both pretending to be white people.
>>65636531>and the US navy spawning into saturation fire already underway.I dont know the full story but could that have been the point of the exercise? Start the strike group in a worse case scenario and told to recover, while keeping losses to a minimum?
>>65636794Considering their real estate and AI bubble just took another massive hit, things aren't looking great for the global south currently.
>>65636797Yeah and rightwing Americans wouldn't be posting pro-Russia stuff, but here we are.
>>65636818>American AI bubble is collapsing too>Oh no buying a place to live is cheaper this is just like the late 80s Soviet UnionI'd argue their youth unemployment rate is a worse indicator than either but that would also mean the West is fucked.I wouldn't say China's in trouble until their manufacturing declines or they have bread lines at minimum.
>>65636839>Sure China is in trouble, but West is in less trouble- in fact, I won't say China is in trouble until they collapseConvincing stuff nigger
>>65636802because the manner in which he justified getting so close, which was to use disguised fishing boats to sail to close range, required a highly contrived setup that could only exist by exploiting the abstract nature of the wargame and would immediately fall apart in real life he only managed to get that close because his justification was that he used armed fishing boats that couldnt be identified as a target until it was right next to the vessels and they were too numerous to be interceptedthe problem is that each fishing boat was armed with a missile that weighted almost as much as the fishing boatthe second problem is that the disguise was modelled as simply appearing at identification range, which would be implausible in real life because 1000 fishing boats all making a beeline to the battle group would look suspicious even outside of their identification rangeand obviously iran would invite a war to a ridiculous level of escalation that they would never realistically ever try by sending in a hundred suicide bombers
>>65637076you misunderstand my post, I'm not saying the situation wasnt completely contrived it absolutely was, what I'm asking is if the point of the exercise was to see if the carrier group could survive a scenario where they were ambushed by a saturation attack without a clear target to counter attack to end it. basically a stress test of point defense, missile intercept and damage control. Think of it like those wargame F-22 dogfights where they have to tie a hand behind its back. Now if that wasnt the case and it wasnt the intent then yeah he basically just wasted everybodies time.
>>65636399damn bro at it with his 2024 AI slop. Bombay that far behind?
>>65636771>Diesel is like $10 a gallon, everything is expensive, and the sitting GOP president managed to lose almost the entire South, Texas, and more.I'm sorry that inflicting generational damage on one of our oldest enemies has caused you some expense at the pump.
>>65636692this. They will be putting HUGE pressure on Trump (and give him a blank check) to go all out and finish it. They will only start getting antsy if he drags it out beyond the end of next year.
>>65637128>>65637076I decided to look into this myself and basically everybody involved is retarded holy. Not just Van Ripper but Blue as well as when they decided to refloat the fleet to test the viability of the rest of the exercise they rigged red to the point that they ended up learning nothing from what they could salvage from the exercise (Ripper probably did some bullshit for that too but still).TLDR it wasnt a stress test it was just plain retardation.
>>65636662>We lost trillions of dollars, but at least we killed a bunch of sand people and made israel happy
>>65636694>delusional retardsJust say JIDF shills and Mossad glowies
>>65636694Iran should have been attacked decades ago BTW
>>65636427Russian hopes of Trump saving them
>>65636692how many more dead ayatollahs will the US need before iran surrenders and the strait is reopened?
>>65636697>find iraq and afghanistan on a map>what's between them?>now imagine a world where pro-us governments were installed in both of them and remained stable>us now has secure air bases in iraq and afghanistan>remember gwb's speech about the global axis of evil>what logically follows?They've been teeing this up for literally decades at this point. The only people surprised by it are kids and midwits with the attention span of a goldfish. Unfortunately this encompasses most American voters these days.
>>65636399The Iranians only didn't commit a perfidious ambush because they weren't given a 24 hour ultimatum, and they didn't have the capability to bomb American bases throughout the region without masses of shasneeds, which they didn't have in 2002. Also, they did set the tone with a war crime by immediately bombing civilian hotels throughout the region.
>>65636463>and they got rapedIs that why they own the strait and every US base between Jordan and Diego Garcia is inoperable now? FFS, we've reached the point of them having enough control to go out in small boats and literally fuck up tankers trying to pass without their okay with goddamn limpet mines now. Like, that's literally where we are: The USN is proving powerless to stop the Iranisn from literally driving speedboats into the strait and sticking bombs to tankers by hand.>for very little costGo tell that to american people paying six dollars plus per gallon at the pump, I fucking dare you.>>65636788>finish the jobIf the US were able to do that, Hegsie would've done it months ago. You're coping.>muh economy>muh mortal blowYou are vastly underestimating just how much economic hardhsip a nation can endure, especially when it has a scapegoat for all its problems to stare at.>warlordism or failed stateWell you better pray that's not happening, because then the strait is gonna stay closed for a generation or two at a minimum. And that's if they don't do the spiteful thing and bomb the Gulf states' desalination plants as a final Fuck You.
>>65636662One wonders how mentally brown and projecting it someone has to be to look at the clusterfuck of a thirdie nation literally consistently preventing the US from fulfilling one of its primary global policy objectives for decades by use of military force and call it a total US victory.When a thirdie nation stands up to a superpower and holds its ground (or, in this case, vital global waterway), that's generally a pretty damn epic win. Sorry about pointing that out.>>65636690Damage to the global economy means even greater damage to the american economny, as the latter is entirely structured around profiting off of the former.
>>65638167>every US base between Jordan and Diego Garcia is inoperable nowanon. anon look at me and tell me you genuinely think this. please.
>>65636794>saaaar nothing bad ever happens in china saaaaaaarsI curse and shit on vishnu.
>>65638167>every US base between Jordan and Diego Garcia is inoperable nowWrong>FFS, we've reached the point of them having enough control to go out in small boats and literally fuck up tankers trying to pass without their okay with goddamn limpet mines now1 ship...at the narrowest point in the strait...that has been repeatedly shutdown since...that caused only minor damage.>The subsequent detonations triggered a fire in the engine room and temporarily disabled the vessel. However, the crew extinguished the fire, there had been no environmental impact and the tanker continued its voyage.Jesus fucking christ get out of here with this talk of "control."
>>65636788>because really all Americans actually care about is being materially comfortableNo you're entirely wrong here. Americans don't care about this jewish war at all so any discomfort that comes from it is magnified because none of us want anything to do with Israel and we certainly don't want our military might, tax dollars, and lives of our soldiers going towards a war that has nothing to do with us.
>>65637128>what I'm asking is if the point of the exercise was to see if the carrier group could survive a scenario where they were ambushed by a saturation attack without a clear target to counter attack to end it. basically a stress test of point defense, missile intercept and damage controlIt just so happened that the real ships were near civilian shipping lanes so when the exercise started they had their defenses turned off to avoid locking on to civilians. So they couldn't even test that scenario because they were completely caught with their pants down. Damage control was indeed part of the exercise.>>65637166>they decided to refloat the fleet to test the viability of the rest of the exercise they rigged red to the point that they ended up learning nothing from what they could salvage from the exerciseKind of missing the point because the exercise wasn't about who won, it was a test about the viability of coordinating the exercise itself with so many moving parts (they had aircraft in the Nellis bomb range firing live ordnance to sort of run an "augmented reality" exercise where the simulated hits in the middle of the Nevada desert were taken into account and introduced into the wargame occurring near the shore) and test the viability of concepts like "net centric warfare". Which they figured out was kind of a mess and hierarchies are important because running a war like an IRC room gets confusing if you don't separate the information at the appropriate levels.The exercise was salvaged because it was entirely about boring shit that nobody cares about. Seeing who wins or loses wasn't the point so telling Red Team to stop fucking around and just stick to the script was justified.
>>65636794Implessive
>>65638195>eglin glowie jeetposting in a completely unrelated topicyou shills are so bad at fitting in lol
>>65638623Where are the sunk carriers thirdie
>>65638623Denounce vishnu right now fecaloid.
>>65636440Why can't you make a hunting thread on /o/? You drive a car/truck to go hunting, don't you? :^)
>>65636692>can't pass legislation>didn't ask for congressional permission or a declaration of war in the first place>only used the resources at his discretion as the chief executive which is why faggots were screaming that that use was out of missiles/bombs/planes/x when are massive stocks in the reserve which Trump cannot legally access without congressional approvalI want to glass Israel then glass Iran just to make a point, so lets be clear here regardless of what you think about the Iran adventure Tump hasn't had access to what congress could deny him thus far and for that reason nothing really changes.
>>65636821TRS faggots will post pro-Russia or pro-Palestine shit either because they are libtards who turned into internet nazis and therefore have empathy for the more retarded party of any conflict or because they are being contrarian because they think it serves their purposes.I want to kill everyone on the planet darker than milk and torture every jew to death. Nobody hates these post 2012 racism tourists more than I do.
>>65636672>>65636739Also whatever retard was programming the exercise fucked up. IRL they navy couldn't position assets in the shipping lane and parked them close to shore. This wasn't accounted for. Riper's bullshit still would have "worked" within the confines of the simulation because his simulated boats were within spitting distance of where the Naval assets were to be simulated to bet sitting. But instead of their intended simulated position their actual positions were put into the simulation. Thus they and Riper's boats were nocliping into on another. Thus when the silkworms launched they immediately scored hits on the targets because their simulate position wasn't thousands of meters away but tens to hundreds.TLDR: boomer naval officiers hired Xer programmer and didn't properly instruct him so the entire simulation was fucked up.
>>65636839>I'd argue their youth unemployment rate>officially 40% in China and if you work 2 hours a week that doesn't count as unemployedNigger by your own criteria the only place doing okay is Rural America.
>>65636463>gas prices>munitions stockpile>destroyed equipment>deferred maintenance>allies pissed off (especially those relying on gulf LNG, aka Japan and Korea)But ok for arguments sake let's say that's chump change. So let's look at the other side of the balance sheet. What *DID* america get out of this? Was Iran overthrown and has joined the US as the 51st state? Is Phalavi the new puppet in charge? Is america getting a cut of Iranian oil and gas? Did the US even get so much as pinky promise they won't build a nuke?
>>65636399>Why is the American military mind so solipsistic?Like any other big organization, you only climb if you agree with the powers that be, so any truly outside-the-box thinker will never be in a position to think.
>>65640033>Was Iran overthrown and has joined the US as the 51st stateWhy is the only indication of winning a war is taking land? Iran can no longer power project over the middle east that they have been causing problems since the 80s.
>>65640066>Iran can no longer power project over the middle east>meanwhile saudis and their proxies are losing ground to houthis in yemenlol
>>65636463>they got raped, and then re-raped, repeatedly>for very little cost.besides the midterm election? lmao
>>65637370The problem should've been solved 50 years ago the second they radicalized.OR not have multiple suicidal administrations in a row that gleefully gutted and raped the domestic energy industry to ensure you can never divorce yourself from the Middle East.
>>65640033Gut another Chinese ally that you've been in a proxy war with for 50 years, weaken BRICs and OPEC's control on the global economy, and prove you're committed to enforcing freedom of navigation.
>>65640066they hit the head quarters of the Saudi national oil company in Riyadhso it's safe to assume that they can still fuck around in their region
>>65640093>and prove you're committed to enforcing freedom of navigationhahahahahahahahahahahahha
>>65640066Something like 10% of VLCCs have been hit by missiles lol
>>6564026710% is a failing grade retard.
Iran has the strategic advantage as in once the global oil and food storages are emptied, both America (which cant take prolonged high oil prices due to being #1 in diesel and gas consumption per capita) and the gulf arabs (who cant handle high food prices because they import all of their food because they live in an actual desert) will have to chose between a settlement, skedaddle or invade. The iranians know that which is why they arent quitting. Another pucker factor that works in the iranian's favor are the rising bond rates across most of the world, once they become high enough, governments who run a budgetary deficit financed with bond sales will have to make a balanced budget with some money allocated to bond paybacks or they will enter a bond doom loop. For some strange reason the saudi arabians decided to duke it out with the yemenis, probably because they appeared to be easier to deal with than the iranians, but then they promptly got rekt.
>tom clancy thread>not a single post about PREGNANCYshame
>>65636399>don't set the tone with a warcrimeyou're right, iran shouldn't have stuck those civilian hotels, then they wouldn't have been bombed flat.
>>65636488>i actually don't mind itwhich is why people consider you a retard.
>>65636643>the strait remains closed offfor iran only, actually, everyone else can go through.>got it's bases in the middle east destroyedthey didn't.
>>65638756That isn't what happened. No boats were equipped with Silkworms in the simulation no matter how much OP lies about it. In the wargame, Van Riper had his speedboats sit on the horizon from the American fleet until the last 4 hours before the end of the surrender ultimatum, then they salvoed off their Exocets right as the shore based Silkworms were approaching. The total number of missiles exceeded what the Aegis system at the time could track, and so the simulation assumed that no missiles were intercepted. I believe this was a quirk of the simulation but I'm not entirely sure.There were lots of assumptions built into the simulation going both ways. For example, all of the American ships were assumed to have infinite missiles, and REDFOR was not allowed to attack American aircraft because it was assumed that they wouldn't be able to track the F-22s (which didn't actually exist yet). On the other hand, it was an assumption of wargame that BLUFOR would not be able to intercept REDFOR's communications because it would be too easy if you just handwave the entire game away with "we hack your comms and then respond to everything you do instantly, gg," and this was rationalized with motorcycle couriers and such. However, the simulation had no way to account for communications lag, which is where OP's "teleporting motorcycles" bullshit came from.
>>65636399was there ever a war that was planned for so long that still ended up being a shitshow?Forget about the war right now for a moment. I just want to talk about the planning. Like we've seen ad-hoc planning go wrong where you have lack of training, resources or time and that's why things either go bad or you don't really get what you wanted for.But the americans had a hard-on for the iranians for like 40 years. How do you not have every eventuality planned out, with every t crossed and so on?At this point wouldn't there have been decades of planning documents sitting in a drawer? Shouldn't there have been entire graduating classes from west point or annapolis that wrote papers on how to fight Iran?
>>65643231I'm sure sure there were lots of plans in place for a war. I doubt any of those planners "large scale unsupported strategic bombing operation with limited notice where we're not allowed to touch power and water infrastructure and our 'allies' go out of their way to bomb anyone who might negotiate with us" on their bingo cards though.
>>65636399The Millennium Challenge was held 25 years ago, before the IRGC had the ballistic missile capabilities that they have now, and before shaheds were even on the drawing board. >>65636463>very little costThe US has had to withdraw from all of its bases in Iraq and the Gulf states. There's no longer a permanent USN base in the ME, the "war" is being waged out of Diego Garcia. Oil is moving through Hormuz but it's permanently constrained and requires constant escort/intervention and it's very expensive. Unilaterally fucking over Asian energy markets and withdrawing strategic assets from Korea etc has undermined those relationships (so much for the pivot to China). There's no longer any meaningful effort to overthrow the IRGC, limit their missile production, etc and there have been only sporadic bombings for months now. America killed far more people and destroyed far more hardware, but the reality is that American power and influence has suffered.
>>65637156>I'm sorry that inflicting generational damage on one of our oldest enemies has caused you some expense at the pump.I wonder who could be behind this post.
>>65643276>before shaheds were even on the drawing board.Technically it was designed in the 1980s, but Iran only got access to the plans in 2005 or so.
>>65643290>daaaaaa jooooosFucking retard, Iran has attacked and killed far more Americans than they have ever killed Israelis you fucking third world fecalderm ass licking subhuman.
>>65643434Ok grandpa, let's get you back to bed
>>65643434>Fucking retard, Iran has attacked and killed far more Americans than they have ever killed IsraelisGee, I wonder why. Maybe it is because Israel keeps dragging America into Middle East wars like a fucking shoulder devil with infinite lobbyist bucks to bribe our politicians with. Almost like 95% of our beef with Iran goes up in a puff of smoke whenever we aren't acting as Israel's sugar daddy / attack dog.
>>65636427What blew up? Neocons hopes and dreams.https://youtu.be/khtWPycU-PA?si=9EkDZ3C4vM0iDALr
>>65643276>the US has had to withdraw from all of its bases in iraq and the gulf stateswrong.>t-there's no longer a permanent USN base in the MEwrongwhere do you get all of these fanfics from?
>>65643498no, maybe it's because they chant death to america daily over there, you fucking twat.
>>65643539I believe they chant another countries name alongside America in those chants, I wonder which it is. Perhaps the country that is always getting America to bomb them and invade their neighbors against America's interest. How much money and lives were sunk into fighting as Israel's proxy in the Middle East?
>>65643498>>65643558>the heckin' wholesome Iranarinos have their nuclear blackmail, something something jewsNo.
>>65643622Exactly, another 50 billion to support our greatest ally Israel. Pay no attention to the prices on the gas station, it's for a good cause.
>>65643671The middle east being under the nuclear blackmail of Iran would be even worse for gas prices, so we're not letting that happen. Your personal feelings about Jews were not a factor.
>>65643681>The middle east being under the nuclear blackmail of IranLol, the Middle East is under blackmail now because Israel convinced Trump that wiping out their countries leadership would cow them. It took a total decapitation strike for them to play the Hormuz card. If it wasn't for Israel relations with them would have been normalized years ago. If they did get nukes then they'd just be another Pakistan, it would be unlikely though since without Israel whispering in our ear the nuclear deal would have held. Let's be real too, 90% of the reason they want nukes is because Israel illegally got them.Every fucking issue with Iran comes back to Israel stealing territory, getting nukes and buying politicians.
>>65643681NATO is under nuclear threat from russia. china and india are at war but refuse to use conventionnal weapons to avoid nuclear escalation. No one wants to be the one starting a nuclear escalation because they would be the one losing it.Iran having nuclear weapons would just mean the US or israel can't bombard them with impunity, that's it. and that's why there's a war now, because Iran know very well that once they have it, the US won't attack as easily as you do now (why else haven't they attacked north korea ?).They also know they will only lose if they start a nuclear war, politicians and leaders aren't as retarded as you are (except trump and his administration, what years of not funding schools does). And no, religious extremism doesn't change shit about that.As for muh gas prices, they didn't have the bomb and the retard you have at the head of the US fucked it up anyway, them having the bomb and blackmailing would have been significantly cheaper
>>65636802Might have been, also might have been the reason his retarded ass got kicked off the field.>you spawn>1000 anti ship missiles capable of 1 shotting your ship already mid-air to your location from 1000 different vectors all within spitting dstance>you're dead>hurr durr why didn't you teleport behind them?!?!?!Is not a learning scenario.
>>65643715>If it wasn't for Israel relations with them would have been normalized years agoPure hopium.>If they did get nukes then they'd just be another PakistanAnd did you fucking miss how Pakistan used Operation Cyclone to create the Taliban, allowed Bin Laden to set up his hiding spot there, etc?>90% of the reason they want nukes is because Israel illegally got them.I don't think they care about the legality of Israeli nukes, what matters is that they inherited a nuclear program, they beefed with Saddam, and generally speaking nukes would deter US attacks.This is textbook concern trolling. Israel could have obtained the nukes in a 100% legit way and they'll still be pursuing them.
>>65643536The US withdrew all forces from Iraq in September, minus embassy guards. The source of this fanfic is the White House. The 5th fleet headquarters in Bahrain was badly damaged by Iranian missiles and hasn't been used to service or supply US ships since the beginning of the war. It can't provide meaningful support (read: it was destroyed) and the US will not risk mooring ships there. The source of this fanfic is the NYT. Many bases around the region are running on skeleton crews and not supporting combat in a meaningful way, because it's too dangerous to park anything expensive out in the open. This has been widely reported in American news outlets, dunno why it's worth it to you to argue the point.If it makes you feel better, you didn't do the retarded Russian thing and keep parking your strategic assets where they could easily get hit. Impressively low casualties, low vehicle and aircraft losses, etc. Chalk it up to a plan of getting off the X.
>>65643715>illegal Israel didn't sign the non-proliferation treaty. So how was their acquisition of nuclear weapons illegal?
>>65643720>north koreaBecause North Korea doesn't attack it's neighbors or fund terrorist groups that attack it's neighbors? Possessing nuclear weapons DOES NOT make you immune to conventional attack, look at the utter assraping Ukraine is doing to Russia. >iran>we'll nook ook you Great Satan!>us >bet>launches preemptive nuclear strike on all launch, storage, and command and control nodes>iran>ACCCCCCCCCKTurns out the winning move is not to fuck with your neighbors.
>>65644055They literally stole the fissile material from the US, for one.
>>65643920>This is textbook concern trolling. Israel could have obtained the nukes in a 100% legit way and they'll still be pursuing them.Right back at you. Israel has nukes so it can kill all its neighbors at the push of a button. This whole nuke business is because they are terrified of Iran evening the playing field. They want to have the capability to nuke with impunity without facing the same threat back and they've wormed their way into US through bribes and lobbying to ensure we foot the bill. All these wars, the trillions of US tax payer dollars spent, the damaged international relations, the high gas prices now, all of it is to maintain Israel's dominance in the region.>b-b-but IranWe wouldn't even think about Iran if not for Israel, they'd be like Tanzania or Zimbabwe to us. Nobodies. What has Israel given us in return for all this grief, nothing.
>>65644072Nobody has ever said it's impossible to attack a nuclear state, just that it's impossible to invade and conquer one.
>>65644074>no charges were ever filed and no material was found missing Hmmmmmmmmm
>>65644115Wrong.
>>65644115If Israel didn't make Iran a concern then Saudi Arabia would.
>>65644185>wah, wah Iran, solve our geopolitical problems US and pay for itNo.
>>65644172Who went looking? Did he have a large nose?
>>65636802>>65643734See: >>65641211>be American admiral>give Iran an ultimatum to surrender within 24 hours or you'll bomb them into the stone age>20 hours later they fire 10,000 missiles at you all at once>half your fleet is sunk>"How could this have happened to me? We're supposed to win everything because we're the good guys!"Notice that we didn't give them any warning in the actual war. That's because Van Riper's play was actually 100% on point.
>>65644202The FBI. >be da joos>own america >option a>ask the cia and they slide uranium under the table >option b>use someone who isn't israeli and who is easily traced and tracked to steal materials you can get for freeGee I fucking wonder.
>>65644220>if we ignore physics and game the simulation, we can do anything
>>65644405That is Islam in a nutshell.
>>65644172The whole origin of the story is that they found almost 600lbs missing out of a facility in Pittsburgh. You know this, but you need to pretend otherwise because you're a shill reading from a script. Now go on, spin us another tale.
>>65644405Physics says you have to wait for the end of the 24 hour ultimatum to be attacked instead of attacking just before it ends?
>>65643720>why else haven't they attacked north koreaA few reasons.>they're not a thread to the us>they have nothing anyone wants>propaganda aside, they basically keep to themselvesBut the biggest reason?>they haven't pissed off israel
>>65643272But that's the point of the question: You plan for something so fucking long, you should have options planned from Defcon 5 to Defcon 1. It's not like the pentagon was unaware of the neocon/israeli intentions for decades. They knew that any day someone from the white house could come knocking and asking for their pitch on what to do. I actually think the Midnight Hammer thing was exactly such a plan. But where was plan B, C and D? >Uhhh like we bomb them and they surrender because the ayatollah is now a piece of cardboard and we paid the kurds to riot? Ok Mr. General, what is your plan B for when that doesn't happen?>>65644401Now goodle pentodes, MILCO and krytron
>>65645098Well, what happened was that Hegseth floated this plan, was told it wouldn't work, and then started firing generals until he got one that would try it.
>>65644220No it wasn't, no enemy is given 24 hours to surrender and gets to mobilize, and deploy 10,000 boats and missile launchers to within striking distance while a carrier group sits on its thumb and counts down because they can't do anything until the time is up. Not that the time limit even mattered anyways because it was a simulation and Riper had already preplaced his boats within striking distance to where the carrier group would spawn in the scenario. He could have fired as soon as the ultimatum was delivered and the outcome would be the same. It is not a learning scenario and he was rightfully kicked out. We didn't give Iran a warning about their ayatollah getting greased because we didn't do it and were in the middle of negotiations when Israel, correctly, decided that they were just playing fuck fuck games and stalling. If Riper's play was on point at all Iran would have probably done more than put some shrapnel in a pilot's ass and bitch on twitter.
>>65645159That's exactly what happened lmao, go read the MC02 report. He had 20 hours to position his boats exactly where he wanted them.
>>65645033>>they're not a thread to the usiran is even less of one, no ? at least best korea has the range to some stateswith ICBMs to my knowloedge>>propaganda aside, they basically keep to themselvesmostly due to being weak, no ? they want to get south korea at least, and used to frequently launch missiles in the direction of japan>>they have nothing anyone wants>>they haven't pissed off israelfair
>>65644000You just admitted the US still has permanent bases and all Iran managed to do was make holes in the sand. Congratulations, you played yourself.
>>65638786That sounds completely reasonable yes.
>>65640082>Muh landDefinitely Russian.
>>65640097Post tolls and sunk carriers.
>>65640719And other stories you tell yourself as Sunni militias literally take over Iran.
>>65645266Iran has killed lots of sand. The sand was very Jewish.
>>65645287Is that why Anakin said that? Now it all makes sense...
>>65645283>Sunni militias literally take over IranIs this the new JIDF fanfiction?
>>65645266guess the competency crisis has hit Eglin too if the best their shills have to offer is to go "LALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU EPIC OWNAGE" when confronted with the truth
>>65645320So the USS Lincoln was sunk in the straight?
>>65644196So there would be 100% peace in the middle east and eternal low gas prices in the west if Isreal just didn't exist? You can prove this?
>>65645235>iran is even less of oneJust ignore how they have been politically hostile since the 80s and have caused thousands of deaths and millions in damage unlike North Korea
>>65645622You people are pathetic, clinging to a decades old bombing and pretending Iran made the EFPs even after US troops found all the machine shops in iraq.The Iranians dindu nuffin. Even after they got bombed last year, what was their response? Gave a warning and dropped a few missiles into an empty corner of a US base to save face. Meanwhile it wasn't the Iranians telling Bush about WMDs in Iraq. Wasn't the Iranians flying those planes on 9/11. They were even fighting ISIS when we were fighting ISIS. Their "nuke" even if they actually made one would have been a fuckhuge undeliverable Hiroshima bomb that they'd couldn't get to tel Aviv on a flying carpet, let alone threaten the US. And the second they flex their nuke muscle with the gulf states guess who'll show up at Uncle Sam's door with a blank check and a request for nuclear material?Meanwhile the republicans sacrificed all their political power for this shit with nothing to show for it.
>>65645814>Iran didn't fly a plane into New York and kill 6 million Americans so you should be nice to themshut up *ranian
>>65645266You just admitted that there isn't much left at many of those bases except sand, because they're largely abandoned and don't house anything important anymore which was my original point.Your brand of cope is bizarre. NO NO NO WE ARE IN A BETTER POSITION THAN EVER WE TOOK NO DAMAGE WE HAVE NO PROBLEMS is retarded. Just do the normal zogbot rationalization, revel in the K:D ratio and complain that your lost cause was sabotaged by liberals.
>>65645615>So there would be 100% peace in the middle east and eternal low gas prices in the west if Isreal just didn't exist? You can prove this?Israel is more hated then ever, not just around the globe but now even in the US so we'll be withdrawing all our money and support sooner or later. Guess we'll see what happens.
>>65645021I will just say yes instead of pointlessly arguing with a reformer
THIS IS A TOM CLANCY THREADWHERE IS THE PREGNANCYWHERE IS ITIT IS CONTRACTUALLY OBLIGATED TO DISCUSS HIS PREGNANCY FETISH IN EVERY THREAD RELATING TO HIMGET TO ITTHAT IS ALL
>>65646566Explaining the factual sequence of events makes me a reformer?
>>65636399Millenials ruin everything.
>>65646572Based fellow Clanyesque preggo enjoyer.
>>65646572Care to elaborate? I re-read Clancy's books a few years back, and I still have no idea what you're talking about. Did my eyes just glaze over whenever he got too Catholic for my taste?
>>65646659Not that anon but off the top of me head:>whole preggo Icelandic arc in RSR described in lurid detail>Patriot Games, pregnant Dr Cathy Ryan's oiled up body described in what was probably typed one-handed, her co-worker admiring her body when they're scrubbing up for surgery>Rainbow Six, Ding's wife "caught a silver bullet" and a little bit of preggo description>impreg fantasy in Sum of All Fears>I think there's a couple of references in Cardinal of the Kremlin Tom was hyper based.
>>65646671It’s a shame that his type of conservatism is basically dead.
>>65646726>It’s a shame that his type of conservatism is basically dead.His type of conservatism is pretty much my type of conservatism. I grew up from about 12yo reading Tom Clancy and Biggles books and I think those two pretty much formulated my world view lol.
>>65646731I'm a dirty hippie, so when I read Rainbow Six, I thought, "my god, that jingoist fool wrote the finest tragedy of the 20th century, and he doesn't even know it."
>>65646740kek The mirror reflects ourself
>>65646605>factualdefinitely a reformer
>>65646004Yes anon, national defense ranks threats based on their actual relevance. People burning a US flag in a mudhut 10000 miles away isn't worth the hellfire missile it would take to shut it down.It's just Iraq again. Wasting US blood and treasure with nothing to show for it.
>>65646726>>65646731His type of conservatism got us into this mess. He ironically thought the Russian people would rise up against KGB mafia thugs attempting to seize power after a few years of democracy and that the Middle East and China would also become liberal democratic nations as a result of the inevitable course of history.That sort of politics died in an Iraqi ditch.
>>65646790You can see the life leave his eyes when the post-9/11 world left his worldview in shambles. He was phoning it in with ghostwriters for every book afterwards. Kind of sad that he didn't follow the wacky alt-history universe he was building in his books right up to 2000, would've been mega kino.
>>65646756except Iran isn't just burning flags retard, they're actively arming and funding terrorists who have the intent to fuck with the global economy. Dumb Iranian shill
>>65636441If a simulation can't take into account such basic things, then it's a shit simulation with questionable results, and causes flawed conclusions, plans, and doctrine. Not entirely erroneous, but flawed.
>>65646868>>65646790I have some sympathy for this worldview because it was a product of the Cold War. This was the world that had defined his entire adult life. When it was over, it really would have seemed like that was it, the end of history. One superpower, perhaps a few delusional terrorists here and there, but no dangers from other states, which were only just getting back on their feet and would eventually transition to liberal capitalist democracy.
