your inability to get intimate is orthogonal to hrt. by your own admission. you can still try to fix that and continue to take hrt
also by your own admission, you like the results of hrt, and as such you should continue to take it.
>fundamentally im not a troon, ive never had gender issues
and? there's a whole plethora of hrt femboys/cismen on hrt out there. there is no "rule" of the universe that says one should fuck around with his hormonal make-up only if one is a troon.
>im undeniably a moid trooning wouldn't work
by your own admission, chemically trooning IS working for you.
if you mean social trooning, then don't do that. again, there is no rule of the universe that says you have to be a flamboyant tranny just because you take some pills or inject some girljuice.
>I dont even know what to call myself
you're you. hrt femboy works, ig.
> ive gotten really weak
lower the dosage and sleep better. add some meat to your food regimen.
your predisposition to insomnia is far more likely to be the culprit here than hrt.
>I wont be able to go on like this for long
do whatever tf you want.
but from what you're describing, hrt is a marginal positive for you. you just don't like that it's not outright magic.
you still gotta fix your sleeping schedule, and your chronic fear of intimacy. hrt can't fix that for you. hrt can alleviate some body image issues, regulate your libido in a way that you may like, make your skin and hair nicer and... that's about it.
also, unironically, have you tried dating men?
t. hrt femboy

>>44137297
>there's a whole plethora of hrt femboys/cismen on hrt out there.
I could hardly call myself a femboy outside my build, cisman on hrt is, fine I suppose but impression is that its closer to a state of repping while hrt for most
>chemically trooning IS working for you.
Mostly, but boobs are an issue, I don't mind them in private, but im uncomfortable with them being noticeable to others, ive always been able to hide my frame i dont know how to handle not being able to do that.
>if you mean social trooning, then don't do that
>you're you
Which is exactly what im trying to fix to escape this limbo of undesirability
>lower the dosage and sleep better
Uh my levels are a bit of an anomaly so im not sure how to change them, my dose is already below normal, perhaps I should specify the insomnia only really happens because of mental troubles, my normal sleep is quite good
>add some meat
Im poor
>and your chronic fear of intimacy
I cant fathom how, but hrt doesn't help
>also, unironically, have you tried dating men?
No, largely for the same reasons listed prior romantically, but physically im only attracted to very feminine men/femboys in the same way as women, hrt has since muddled the way I feel about other guys but its complicated I can't articulate it well.

>>44137216
If you’re so sure that stopping hrt will make you suicidal then just don’t do it and stop giving a shit about whether it’s “supposed” to work for you. Validity is a spook.

>>44137427
>hrt has since muddled the way I feel about other guys but its complicated I can't articulate it well.
sounds like someone will end up just dating real men

>>44137447
Well issue more so is my freinds and family still expect me to do normal guy and relationship things, which arent possible with hrt, like how do I even explain my situation to a normie? And that sorry i cant force myself to get hard in bed anymore can you beat me up and degrade me like I deserve so I can instead? At best im a creep or pathetic, if I could get off of hrt and be normal things would be easier, but its doing too much heavy lifting mentally and physically ill cant live without it, where's the winning?

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>>44137547
Im still attracted to women the same, with guys its odd, I cant imagine myself in a gay relationship the idea is off putting, but if I was a woman and it'd be different, but im not so it comes off more as disembodied thoughts like "oh that sounds nice, couldn't be me though!"
But im invisible and cant imagine a woman let alone a guy showing an interest in me, its just fantasy
>dating real men
Lmao, begrudgingly its hard to call myself a real man atp, but im a man nonetheless

>>44137645
>but if I was a woman and it'd be different, but im not so it comes off more as disembodied thoughts like "oh that sounds nice, couldn't be me though
yeah indeed, indeed

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>>44137216
i never want to do t4t again but god there's something so hot about """guys""" like this they're like way hotter than normal troons to me. like the lack of dysphoria makes them easier to deal with and its so much cuter to me cause they have no idea what they're getting into to. ik this is probably a larp post but i want to rape you.

t. castrated transbian rapehon

>>44137877
I just got a message from the stars, they're telling you to...
....
kill yourself?

Did you troon bc you thought it'd make intimacy easier? Clearly you have some thoughts, so if the HRT feels good stay on it.

>Chest makes me feel like a pervert

Are you autogynophillic? Do you jack it to your own tits? If not, you arent a perv. If so, it's not inherently an issue. Plenty of people have weird kinks, mfs walk around in dog suits. It's not a big deal if you dont make it one. Maybe your nonbinary, a femboy, transwoman or guy. Just do what feels right and strive to be the best and happiest version of it.

>>44137427
>boobs are an issue
>I don't mind them
then they're not an issue, actually
>b-b-but others
nobody cares and you're simply wrong to think anyone actually does. most people don't even notice.
also most cis guys have gyno these days due to being fat or due to eating processed crap.
>Im poor
bullshit. you can afford meat if you're in the first world. period. your issue is not poverty, it's arrested development.
>physically im only attracted to very feminine men/femboys in the same way as women
then hit on those.
>hrt has since muddled the way I feel about other guys but its complicated I can't articulate it well
trial and error, anon. zero people are born with full knowledge about what they like or don't like. they ALL figure things out by trying. nobody figures things out by ruminating and doing nothing.
>freinds and family still expect me to do normal guy and relationship things
if you are older than 18, the problem is you for still thinking like this.
you don't owe anyone an explanation, anon. why gives a shit about what others expect? do they give a shit about what YOU expect from them? heck, did they ever ask what are your expectations? I'm wagering on no.
>how do I even explain my situation to a normie?
you don't. that simple.
the secret of life is that you can do whatever you want as long as you're not harming anyone. STOP GIVING A SHIT! it never ends well if you always wonder what others think while putting yourself last.
>can you beat me up and degrade me like I deserve
>begrudgingly its hard to call myself a real man
MEF.
Take your pills and date men.
/thread

>>44137216
Really the deeper issue with you and many men is that you're not trans or a woman in any respect. Unlike them your entire experience revolves around external expectations and the stories society has fed you since before you could talk. At this point you can no longer tell the difference between the stories and your own feelings. The effects of HRT are because you treat it like a new beginning, a new story about to start. It's too simple to call it a placebo effect but it does depend on your own psychological processing of the implications of taking it. Men like you have almost always turned aggressive on real trans women and disrupted the community as a way to try and maintain control. You see when it becomes routine or when it's too difficult to keep up the cope you will become agitated that HRT seems to no longer hit like it did at first. Your agitation will force trans women to distance from you and that will either cause you to detransition or spiral out of control more and more. Eventually you will realize after all the damage you gave done that HRT didn't work and you were only running away from your real problems. You will think back to when that annoying anon said this would all happen and how you should just get the right therapy for your problems. If only you had done that in the first place, but you probably won't and just fuck things up for others will your sheer egotism.

>>44137877
>lack of dysphoria makes them easier to deal with
I think its offset by everything else, you underestimate just how debilitating these issues are
>>44138182
>Did you troon bc you thought it'd make intimacy easier?
No
>Are you autogynophillic?
No hrt or what its doing doesnt get me off inherently
>>>44138185
>MEF.
>Take your pills and date men
I dont know what that means, I was just abused physically and verbally most childhood and for some stupid fucking reason it gets me off but being normal doesn't.
>>>44138193
>your entire experience revolves around external expectations and the stories society has fed you
>you can no longer tell the difference between the stories and your own feelings
I wouldn't say my decision was influenced by much other than purely what I wanted for my body
>you treat it like a new beginning
More so it feels like im kicking the stone down the road on my issues
>Men like you have almost always turned aggressive on real trans women and disrupted the community as a way to try and maintain control
I have deliberately avoided getting involved with the community i dont want to make light of actual gd by conflating it with my strain of retardation, and I cant really act aggressive in the first place that emotional response is broken in me
>when it's too difficult to keep up the cope you
Ill probably rope? Why do you assume id take it out on others? Im the only one to blame for this
>HRT didn't work and you were only running away from your real problems.
Yes and no, objectively hrt been a plus for me overall, but I am using the mental effects to keep my issues at bay, because I cant handle them all at once
>the right therapy
Therapy is for people with gained issues and rich people, also I dont trust mental health people
>you probably won't and just fuck things up for others will your sheer egotism.
I clubs never let myself get that bad id kill myself if I started fucking others lives up because of my personal issues

>>44137877
Op again this is a side note but you make me uneasy, I don't feel id be safe if I met you without a trusted adult lol

>>44139122
Placebo objectively works too, people often forget that and brush it off as meaning some subjective uncertainty. The problem is that placebo works regardless of composition and is present with all medicine because there is an expectation for change. You will only realize this when the hype wears off in a few years and it becomes just part of the routine. Your life will not improve and the subconscious expectations will have evaporated and physical changes will have stabilized. At that point you have nowhere else to go, your ride has run out of gas, you're at the destination already. Because statistically you're stupid you can't really understand this until it has happened. Then you will realize you're like all those manmoders on HRT for years, or they're like you. You're all coping and the only choice after that realization is to repress the thought and lash out at others in fits of rage or detransition.

>>44139382
Im genuinely curious what you think is placebo, think ive made it clear i like most of the body changes so far, its following through on my expectations , its not all im doing for physical changes, but another layer of complexity to my intimacy challenges, given its fundamentally changed what I can do as a man and therefore taken away a part of the small appeal I had, and i dont know any other way to live.

Tldr is I only know how to live as a man and hrt is impeding that, but I cant live without hrt

>>44137216
>but my chest makes me feel like a pervert predator
Why? More than half of all humans have a "chest".
>ive never had gender issues
>If I think abt going back to before hrt ill kill myself 100%
These things are completely mutually exclusive, lol. You don't even need to claim to be something other than your AGAB, and you don't have to call yourself a tranny. By being a male on HRT though, you have to at least acknowledge that your physical reality and lived experiences are going to be different from cis men for as long as you're modifying your endocrine system.
>I dont even know ... what my sexuality is let alone what to do
It's ok to experiment to learn more about those things. I didn't accept that I'm into men exclusively until years into HRT.

>>44137216
I mean if u were 5'4 cis male pre HRT you really have nothing to lose taking HRT cause people aren't going to treat you like a real man.

>>44139819
>Why?
Because it feels disrespectful to women and im scared of them
>acknowledge that your physical reality and lived experiences are going to be different from cis men
Yeah but thats like 70% of the people in my life, socially Ive always been weird but I atleast had the same physicality and goals even if my methods were different, not sure anymore though and feel estranged from the one group I wasnt completely disconnected from.
>It's ok to experiment to learn more about those things
Hard to do that with the terror and guilt, I did do a little bit with a tgirl freind who came onto me when I started hrt but I genuinely turn into a mess with any affection its not manageable, it was good overall I think but ran into the same issues, the only reason I did it was because I was very drunk, my hormones were a mess, and i'd been freinds with them for years, but it took me a while to just get through the mental backlash its not sustainable

>>44139820
Maybe, I could always put up a good enough front to get treated like one eventually, the only issue is intimacy I cant keep a front while opening up, its one or the other

>>44139122
>I dont know what that means
masochistic emasculation fetish
>abused physically and verbally most childhood
>for some stupid fucking reason it gets me off but being normal doesn't
like this.
now take your pills, accept you're not a real man and look for a bifag bf. it's okay. failed males need a real man in their lives to function. no need to be angry about it. embrace it and enjoy it.

>>44137216
>going back to before hrt ill kill myself 100%
you might just be repping because this isn't a thought a cissoid would have, also you don't just take hrt on a whim. i hope you find yourself eventually.

>>44140863
>you don't just take hrt on a whim
nta/not OP but this really is false a lot more often than turboideological online shut ins think.
I got on E pretty much on a whim because I was envious on what it did to a younger faggot friend. That was 8 years ago.

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>>44140863
>>44140906
My body image issues had hit an all time high, I guess i was seeing that i was about go from a body i could just about tolerate, to being irredeemable, body hair thickening, ribcage flaring, hair completely falling out, and hrt offered a fix to those, as to why I feel that way, probably bdd and autism, my ideal is to look more feminine, but my face and hair make that impossible, its not like I couldn't do well as a masc short guy, it was just incredibly forced and painful to do so, now im somewhat estranged from society because I feel fundamentally incompatible with people bar a few.

>>44140803
>now take your pills, accept you're not a real man
You havent seen my face im nothing but a man, side note maybe my levels being weird aren't helping me

>>44141024
holy shit, those E levels are insane indeed.
get that under control anon. you're gonna give yourself a bloodclot or tumors if you don't.

>>44141111
Since then I dropped to 3mg of valerate from 4, I do monotherapy IM though so I dont think blood clots are a big issue, also worth adding my SHBG is normal, so most of that is also actually active in my blood, need a new test to see if its dropped a bit

>>44137216
Why do zoomers just go and take estrogen instead of seeing a doctor first?

>>44141341
I have bad experiences with health care professionals in my country, the waiting lists are absurd, and my problem arent real what would they even do?

>>44141363
What do you mean, not real?
Theres a combination of PTSD/personality disorder/depression in what little you have said already.
Taking the first drugs that comes to your mind isnt going to help you, you dont even have a plan what youre trying to do here, you just went ahead and took it.
If you had bad experiences with a doctor then see another one, but gambling with random pills isnt going to work, your blood work is already fucked up as you can see.
The reason you feel better is either because you subconciously want to troon for real or its because lowered testosterone can reduce stress and anxiety.
Anyway, no matter what you do, you have to get your blood values in order or you dont need to worry about suicide for much longer.

>>44141428
>What do you mean, not real?
Theres a combination of PTSD/personality disorder/depression in what little you have said already
Yeah but everyone goes through those to an extent, its not like ive had any particularly bad thing happen, and others have gone through far worse, so its mor an issue of my inability to handle basic things that everyone goes through
>Taking the first drugs that comes to your mind isnt going to help you,
I did do some research and had sperm banked i wasnt completely blind going in i was aware of hrt and its effects already
>no matter what you do, you have to get your blood values in order
True i have cut my dose by 25% since then and have felt better since, but I should see where they're at, my biggest worry is becoming insensitive to estrogen

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>>44139162
I'll rape you and your trusted adult

>>44141962
>>44137877
>transbians are real women, and just like any other girl!~ ^,^

>>44141962
>>44142075
This is why they scare me because if I met one I wouldn't stand a chance irl, all I can do is hide from them

>>44137877
hey bb I'm
>checks notes
totally taking them there whoremoans, I'm oh so defenseless and rapeable, please don't rape me with your butt and or srsussy

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>>44137216
>ugly twink
>twink
>ugly
You don’t know what a twink is, you’re just a skinny loser.
>im an ugly prettyboy
Retarded lmao

>>44143372
My face looks younger than my age but ugly, my proportions have always been feminine e.g wider hips than shoulders, all my fat round my thighs hips lean upper body etc...

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>>44140022
>Because it feels disrespectful to women and im scared of them
It's not disrespectful to have a normal human body. It's not like your breasts were stolen from a cis woman.
>Ive always been weird but
They could probably always tell all along, anon...
>not sure anymore though and feel estranged from the one group I wasnt completely disconnected from.
LGBT stuff aside, is it too late to reconnect with them?
>but I genuinely turn into a mess with any affection
A mess in what way? Lots of people like that in a partner, especially guys.

>>44137645
>with guys its odd, I cant imagine myself in a gay relationship the idea is off putting, but if I was a woman and it'd be different, but im not so it comes off more as disembodied thoughts like "oh that sounds nice, couldn't be me though!"
I'm not going to call you a tranny, but this is the same way every single straight tranny out there felt prior to transitioning. I felt that way a decade ago, and now I have breasts, a vag, and a husband...

>>44137216
>>44138193
The simple fact is that women have easier less stressful lives then men.

Estrogen makes you more calm, experience emotions fuller, less aggressive, more content. From an evolutionary standpoint it makes sense that men are always on the edge competing with each other.

There's really nothing wrong with taking estrogen if you don't want to experience male life anymore. Generally MTF, you're going to have an improvement in your life and mental health. You don't need to have "gender dysphoria" to justify taking HRT.

>>44144759
>LGBT stuff aside, is it too late to reconnect with them?
The only thing relating me to normal cishet dudes was my body and goals with it, but thats gone now
>A mess in what way?
I start shaking, my heart rate gets scarily high and I get lightheaded my breathing becomes a mess, start sweating buckets, and become defensive and hypervigilant because im terrified of how it feels.

>>44143372
this

>it made things a lot more bearable mentally

you are a tranny who hates herself, retard

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>>44143372
>>44145528

You can have these things without being attractive facially

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>>44145546
>you are a tranny
My soul is undeniably male, and the face is a window into said soul, therefore it is also undeniably male
>hates herself
Himself*+i am simply viewing my objective reality, which is undeniably male
>retard
Trvke! >_<

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>>44145643
you cannot be using the >_< emoji like this as a cis man OP. That is so bottombrained and a trans indicator. I bet you would melt when given headpats, love and affirmation by someone :3

>>44146040
A real man uses whatever emojis he sees >_<, ill drop this as much as I like
>bet you would melt when given headpats, love and affirmation
Nuh uh, this has happened once, and it was like a sweet and sickly panic attack on steroids which made me dissociate hard and then pass out, after I woke up all that was left was the emotional backlash and anxiety pangs for letting it happen in the first place, idk how ppl do that shit its terrifying and pathetic turning into hyperventilating shaking mess, im never subjecting someone to that again -_-