>>44412334
>biological imperative
not a real thing

>>44412334
I am, I want to help others who do have kids though so at least I can contribute a little bit.
Plus I don’t want to be with a woman at all and surrogacy is morally wrong so yeah not going to have generic children anyways.

>>44412359
>surrogacy is morally wrong
Why?

>>44412334
And spread my mental illness and tranny gene? Yeah I'm good, wouldn't wish that upon anyone. Id rather adopt a million cats

>>44412382
It’s paying a woman to basically rent her body. It takes advantage of women ego are desperate and preys on exploiting them. Also the effects of implanting one woman’s egg into another woman in the development of the baby aren’t fully known. It could very all give the child more issues growing up, even severe ones like tranny thoughts especially if the sperm donor is a tranny. That sounds like a horrible thing to do to a child.

>>44412384
:(

>>44412395
>It’s paying a woman to basically rent her body. It takes advantage of women ego are desperate and preys on exploiting them.
You could say this about literally any hourly wage job too.

>>44412427
yes? what's your point

>>44412334
I have two children. The oldest is 12.
Queer people should in fact reproduce whenever possible. Raising kids is also fun, not just difficult.
>inb4 tranny gene
Even if it's real, I'd rather raise a tranny myself than a tranny be born to unprepared parents.

i'm happy no woman can ever force me to be/trick me into being a biological father

>>44412478
So employment is immoral in your opinion? To me all these arrangements are moral as long as both parties enter into the agreement freely. In fact, it’s better for vulnerable people that these opportunities exist. Without them they’d be even worse off.

>>44412484
>Queer people should in fact reproduce whenever possible
ok dood

Abandoning the idea of being able to impregnate someone wasn't hard, knowing I'll never be able to get pregnant kills me

>>44412334
>leave abusive wife
>start hrt
>she rapes me and gets pregnant
>forced to pay child support
>moves to a state where you go to prison for being a tranny so I cant see my child

I wish hrt made me infertile :(

>>44412334
I'm so relieved that my immediate family's genetic line is going to die. No way my sisters are having kids either.

Someday, I'm hoping to foster or adopt, but I want to be in a better place mentally first.

>>44412334
I’m not into cis women so I don’t care

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>>44412334

Biological imperative is not real. Bioessentialism is the equivalent of cutting iff a fingernail, looking at it and saying "it wants me to reproduce." Natural is apart of our minds. That doesn't mean all that is natural can think. Purpose is the result of thinking. Of projecting your intentions onto an unfeeling and frankly, brutal process. Nature is not your friend. It is a process of trial and error on other living things. Find inner peace instead.

>>44412334
Reproducing is immoral. Having a child is creating a human and leaving them to suffer in this shitshow of a world we've created. I'm proud to have had the luck and will not to have obeyed my biological imperative and not cause another human to suffer and die. My suffering dies with me.

>>44412870
Both your mind and body are products of your genes and gifts from nature, everything you care that is possible, is made possible by nature.

>>44412881
I'm grateful to be alive, it will be more worthwhile than not having existed no matter how much struggle i have to face.

>>44412909
>appeal to nature
lmfao

>>44412935
This is clearly a lie. No amount of happiness can make up for suffering. If you've got dental pain, winning the lottery will not make up for it. Life is full of suffering and we usually die in undignified and painful ways even if we have long lives. The best thing to do is not to have children yourself and discourage other people from having children.

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>>44412334
I don't want to being a child into the world with my genes, I'm extremely dysgenic. On top of this, no woman would have ever sexually selected for me, and even if she wanted to I think vaginas are gross and literally would be incapable of having sex with a woman.
I still have pretty bad baby fever, I'm very mentally ill, I'm a man who wants to be a mom and thinks the notion of being impregnated is erotic. If I were to have a kid I would adopt, but that's $40,000 and I am quite poor, and no I wouldn't be a parent if I was unable to give them every possible advantage in life.
In some ways I think I'm privileged because, because of my ontology, I'm forced to actually think about it instead of just popping out a backshot baby with bad genes, no plan, no support because two people were horny. My parents did an awful job of raising me because that's how I was conceived, while in wedlock, they didn't have a plan or know how to raise a spergy male child.

Anyway tl;Dr doesn't bother me because I couldn't have kids even if I weren't infertile. Not having balls is liberating also knowing that I can never repeat the mistakes my parents did even if I wanted to.

>>44412334
I was born sterile, my family tried to find a way for fertility treatments including surgery and testosterone as a child which poverty luckily saved me from that … luckily im gay and have aversions to sex to begin with sooo it was never gonna happen lol

>>44412958
I ignore the suffering because i'm not a bitch and the things i enjoy doing occupy enough of my time that i don't have much left for worries. Suffering is not a big deal at all unless you expect an easy life and your body is too used to comfort and laziness.

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>>44412909

For everything that you care about there are infinite more instances of those things being taken away from or destroyed for other living beings. I'm sorry but nature isn't like a game or anything for the animals. And it's really brutal for most people too. You just don't interact with them perosnally, they're in countries and places you don't think about. You haven't been eaten alive or anything like that. Let's take sea turtles for example that lays up to 200 eggsin a nest and up to 7 a year. 1 in 1000 reach adulthood. Most get eaten alive shortly after birth. You yourself rely on an unfathomable amount of suffering to eat meat or wear the clothes you like. I'm not condemning you for that. You just have to realize you're engaging in a sort of just world fallacy to see life as mostly good even if you can enjoy it. It's a lot like rape or stockholm syndrome. Sorry.

>>44412870
>purpose is the result of thinking
i mean sure, in a strict sense, but you wouldn't genuinely sit here and argue that the function and purpose of the stomach isn't to digest food, would you? "natural is apart of our minds" you don't understand the ideas you're throwing around. natural is just the word that describes processes and states we observe out in nature, some people use it in a woowoo way, some in a moralistic way, but really it's just... "the world as observed". we can argue any word or idea "isn't real" because it's all just
>cutting iff a fingernail, looking at it and saying "it wants me to reproduce"
a system is what it does, irrespective of intent. a process or object having an intrinsic telos doesn't necessarily pre-suppose "conscious intent"

>projecting your intentions onto an unfeeling and frankly, brutal process
>nature is not your friend, it is a process of trial and error
doofus, is nature real or is it not real? why is it real when it's convenient for your argument? you're projecting too! brutal isn't a property of the universe, it's just you projecting your own ideas out onto it! trial and error? what's being "tried"? error implies a potential "correct" result, no? almost as if the process had an imperative, a natural conclusion you could say, that it "wants" to come to, that it tends towards, as if it had in itself an essential nature that was going to be realised irrespective of whether a discrete entity willed that nature or its realisation into existence?

pick a lane or get off the fuckin road doofus

antinatalists are categorically stupid and incapable of arguing their point outside of "pain is bad so we should abort the biological imperative and all potential for human life and society to avoid potential suffering" and a prime example of why ad hominem isn't a logical fallacy.

>>44412334
no. i don't think i'd be a good parent, i think i would crack under the severity and pressure of it. i'm not cut out for it

>>44412958
You are a creature against being, please stop existing and leave us that enjoy being to exist.

>>44412958
>if you've got dental pain, winning the lottery will not make up for it
money can be used to purchase goods and services, including medical care

>life is full of suffering
>no amount of happiness can make up for suffering
it can also be full of joy. your arguments reflect nothing except your own resentment of others who acknowledge the potential for joy and contentment. schopenhauer ass thinking, eternally mad that your life sucks and you're not willing to rise to the challenge of making it worth living

you've drowned yourself, and want others to drown.
let your head go under the water and stay down there until the bubbles stop. do not come back up

>>44413124
yes the only use for infinite money is the cessation of finite pain, you've just showed how absurd it is to equate pleasure with pain.

there is no amount of "happiness" or "satisfaction" in life that can make up for the experience of even stubbing your toe let along any serious illness or injury

we're all better off nonexistent, but failing that, we should leave the world without bringing anyone else into the numinous existent.

>>44413076
**all just signs that point to things we observe and experience, and in a strict sense the sign isn't the signified. but when i say "dog", you understand the animal that i'm referring to, don't you? even though "dog" the sign isn't "real" (as in, empirically observed in the world)

>>44413039
Blah, blah, blah. You're all repeating the jargon from the same philosophy texts thinking you're so smart. The truth is that neither of us is being tortured and eaten alive right now, and those who are, had plenty of days to enjoy before that, and yes, life is not a game in the sense that it isn't the east entertainment you're used to, but it's the best thing you're gonna get.

>>44413156
easy entertainment*

>>44413039
the simple rebuttal is that if it's so awful, people would be killing themselves en masse in countries that are much more disadvantaged, and nope! we don't observe that

furthermore, the fact that there isn't mass population threatening mass suicide means that we DO have a biological imperative - because without it, there'd be no survival instinct or hesitation, would there?
your body, independent of your conscious thought, has an imperative to live and continue existing, otherwise suicide wouldn't be something difficult, even for the deeply miserable

t. suicide survivor

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>>44413076

I could argue because it is true that what something does and whataver purpose we assign it are fundamentally the same.

Or I could give the simpler argument that you don't follow your own reasoning because logistics and purpose are different to you; all purpose requires logistics, not all logistics require purpose. So at best you are using the wromg terms, because the logistics or process of a stomach digesting does not mean we have to care about that digestion or say it is the main purpose.

The purpose of a key can be to open doors or you can melt it down for it's gold. I could just say there's no 1 purpose for anything regardless of what the thing does.

Never said nature isn't real that's you reading too much into my message. Said it's brutal and unthinking. There are unthinking parts of your brain. Cells don't think but they're natural. Only when a cell becomes synapses firing in a brain is it thinking. Bioessentialism argues otherwise. Or it would simply attribute purpose to the complete thought not parts of it.

Trial and error is a phrase I use to help you envision cause and effect in a specific way, as it is within your interest presumably to live and not die. It is not to say nature tries to do anything to preserve or eliminate you in a literal sense.

Don't care enough to call you names. Stop farting up the thread with personal attacks. It's obnoxious to read when I just want to get to the points. Thanks.

>>44412334
Yes, why would I want to have kid? I can't take care of myself, how would I take care of a child

>>44413189
>the simple rebuttal is that if it's so awful, people would be killing themselves en masse in countries that are much more disadvantaged, and nope! we don't observe that

that doesn't work as a rebuttal because we have strong instincts against killing ourselves, not to mention social obligations, a desire not to hurt other people by dying, etc

just because nature built us to suffer and not kill ourselves does not mean it's right to suffer

Pretty sure your sperm comes back when you get off hrt, regardless of how long you've been on it

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>>44412334
I am a mentally ill cis man with tocd who sterilized himself with alcohol injections. I'm fine with never producing, I never wanted to spread my genes in the first place.

>>44413142
>the experience of even stubbing your toe
yeah it sucks, it hurts, then you shrug and go "damn that sucked, anyway"

using a stubbed toe as an example is so bollocks. you resent the universe for what, 30 seconds of mild pain? that's your example?

also
>make up for
like what, the universe owes you an apology? what is this "make up for" nonsense. how is the universe all suffering and no meaning or imperative or nothing, but the universe also owes you because you're too stupid to watch you're walking so you don't stub your fuckin toe?

anti-natalism and nihilism truly are the refuges of the resentful coward. too scared to even imagine a life worth living, because your hate lets your ego feel briefly smug, and lets you get away with your own apathy to the state of your life

>>44413215
Not true. After long exposure to HRT, you become permanently infertile

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>>44413156

You're making things up about me while you have no idea who I am instead of answering if nature is mostly painful or not. Just to make you aware of your behavior. It's not adult-like or rational.

>>44413189

Suicide is itself difficult and not an accurate representation of your preferences. In the same way if I offer you an apple and banana and start pressing a knife into your stomach while you reach for the banana, it would be absurd when you pick the apple to then say "see, you truly love apples." Rather our social and biologically conditioning would keep us from killing ourselves even if it made rational sense to.

>>44413248
Nature is not painful. 99% of the time i'm not in pain, and even if i was, i'd get used to it. I don't get the obsession with suffering, as if it could stop you fron reaching your goals.

>>44413288

Am I talking about just you personally. If you lie or say "I don't know" this is my last reply to you if I have anything to say about it.

>>44413197
>no one purpose for anything regardless of what the thing does
>describes thing that exists only because someone explicitly made it with an intended purpose

>bioessentialism argues otherwise
read and re-read. a process or object having an intrinsic telos does not necessarily pre-suppose conscious intent or thought. thinking has nothing to do with it. we're talking about observed properties and logistics of processes, in this sense purpose can be understood as a flow of causal relations, where the end can be understood as a natural consequence of the start

>not all logistics require purpose
of course not, i'm not saying logistics require purpose
i'm saying logistics are purpose. again, refer to above point. processes that beget each other, such that they can be described as "necessary", carrying purpose independent of thought

>don't care enough to call you names
only cares enough to post le smug monk image and still be dumb.
true buddha nature, too brain empty to be aware of how illiterate you are

>>44413303
What's your question exactly. I'm not the guy talking about suicide and your replies are vague as fuck.

>>44413303
nta
>asserts that all life isn't worth living because suffering
>anon says they are not suffering, so life can't be only suffering
>well that's different, that's just YOUR life, but i'm talking about... not you
bunch of oogabooga-tier pseuds, that lot of you

>>44413239
HRT does not make you permanently infertile

>>44413331
Some people, specially young people, don't have learned how to solve their problems and their solution is just complaining about the world, not realising they are the ones responsible for their own defeat. I used to be like that, most of us probably have.

>>44413365
agree
was also like that
shit don't change till you get up and wipe your ass

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>>44413304

Whether something was created with a purpose in mind and that things current purpose aren't the same and you don't follow this logic either. If a parent creates a child to abuse when he grows up and moves away his purpose isn't to be abused by his parents still. Things get repurposed, like the melted key example.

"Flow of causal relations" I see no reason to honor this or use it when something is being used for reasons outside it's creator's original intentions or when not everything that was created was created on purpose.

Moreover you're shifting goalposts from inherent or systemic purpose to the intention behind the creation of something being it's purpose.

Lastly when people consider what a purpose is in their lives they mostly refer to what they need currently or plan to do. Not what their creator's had in mind for them. That applies even when most people are spiritual or religious, as there is something they want from that religion currently that they use religion for. Even while they do not follow scripture strictly or interpret their god accurately.

It's just a monk.

>>44413315

The debate is over if living things experience more or less suffering due to nature's influence. As those on the fence in the thread are hesitating to appeal to nature as a source of purpose when it is such a brutal process.

>>44413331

>asserts that all life isn't worth living because suffering

If you can find that I'll paypall you 50 dollars.

>>44413406
Nta but can you PayPal me the 50 so I can buy more Hrt and needles lol. hmc2llo@gmail.com

>>44413396
>The debate is over if living things experience more or less suffering due to nature's influence
Yeah, there has never been a debate to begin with because you really have no alternative to living under nature's conditions. It is an utterly pointless topic to discuss.

>>44413432

Statements of description and statements of prescription are different. Just because we can't do anything about it doesn't mean we can't disagree on if it's true.

Plus someone who thinks natural is harmless can end up hurting themselves and others and we can do something about that so we should have this little debate.

>>44413396
>i see no reason to honor this when something is being user for reasons outside it's creator's original intentions or when not everything that was created was created on purpose
because teleology works back from end state to derive understanding of purpose, not from starting conscious intention of the creator. a tree comes from an acorn, and only ever a tree from an acorn - the acorn's telos is to become a tree, even if for specific circumstantial reasons it does not end up becoming a tree.
also,
>i see no reason to honor this
what's your reason for rejecting it? "honoring" it? it's not something you honor, you agree or disagree in some combination, and then you either say "here's my reason" or you just do what you've done, and say bollocks and pish

>when people consider what a purpose is in their lives they mostly refer to what they need currently or plan to do
ok sure, we can just change the actual things we're talking about for sweet fuck all reasons, just yolo

you're trolling and baiting is obvious to me now, and i fell for it like a fool
you're a shit cunt

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>>44413479

>matter of true or false not a matter of my choice to use a highly specific definition

But it is because neither of us have use for this definition outside this conversation. When we do It's contradictory to how we use purpose since we repurpose things all the time lol.

And we'd be right to repurpose a key or a garrage or a pillowcase when it's convenient.

I'm just honest about that. That's an efficient, widely accepted and logically consistent way to view purpose. Nothing troll about it lol.

If I wanted to fuck someone up mentally I'd actually refer them to hold onto their "teleological purpose" no matter how much harm that causes or regardless of how much it contradicts their lifestyle or future goals like you are doing. Presumably because you think it'll win an internet argument.

>you're trolling and baiting is obvious to me now, and i fell for it like a fool
you're a shit cunt

Well then you lost to a guy that wasnt even trying to win so. That response is expected.

The mind is bootstrapped on flesh, but doesn't have to be. Do you owe anything to it? Not really. It's a pile of organic memes. Do I prefer my bio-memes to others'? I mean, yeah, but where is that bias coming from. That we're here on /lgbt/ means every one of us knows intimately how nature doesn't "think", and how it fucks up. It's a pretty good algo, as far as dumb algos go. No supervision required. But then, what's the endgame? The Mormons say apotheosis. I'm gonna go with that. Why not. Fuck it.

>>44412334
No because reproduction is morally abhorrent and selfish (inb4 redditor allegations)

>>44413605
>but it is because neither of us have use for this definition outside this conversation
sure but we're in the conversation, so you derailed it and changed the meaning to just yolo fuck it because you're not being cogent. "ah but this definition is more widely accepted" except we aren't talking in normgroid regular casual use, we're talking about the ethics of reproduction and how meaning is made. you started off asserting this bollocks and that about "fingernails don't have thoughts lol", which is precisely where a teleological arguments comes in to rebut you, then you shift back and say "well actually i'm using the word in the normal every day sense" goalpost mover. every accusation has been a confession

>if i wanted to fuck someone up mentally i'd actually refer them to hold onto their "teleological purpose" no matter how much harm that causes

yeah and? i'm a tranny and i'm not going to deny that penis is meant to shoot cum at an egg. i'm denying my biological imperative, my telos, and i don't care. the biological imperative doesn't have an innate moral imperative.
i'm not insisting that people should morally be held to it, just that it's a thing and a legitimate rebuttal to your gobbledygook at the start of this thread, which you'd realise if you could read

>lost to a guy that wasn't even trying
you were trying to be a weasel snake troll cunt and you know you were
unless you are accidentally this illiterate, in which case you were trying very hard because you have been struggling to understand

dogwater, dog water, dogwater
there's no game to be lost to someone who bases his claim to victory on never having played the game at all
infinite shit cunt, eat many dicks

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>>44413714

If I say fingernails don't have thoughts therefore no inherent purpose nothing has changed in my position when I also say we don't normally consider them to have purpose lol. You can consider it to have purpose if you want. You're still doing the fingernail thing.

Which is still a personal choice to do, not inherent to the nail. It's you projecting purpose onto something. The nail didn't make you do that just because it's necessary for you to do that lol.

Which is why I point out there's no reason for you to do that. It's not just wrong it's counter-productive.

>>44412334
Everyone here is using complex terms, and I'm just like... Yeah, I want children, but I am not going to do it by putting the dysphoria stick into anyone anyway so I am infertile for all practical purposes anyway.

>>44413814
Dont worry, your fertility can come back if you stay off hrt for long enough

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>>44413805
But it's not the fingernail thing because I have given you aframework of understanding purpose that does not hinge on thought, will or intent

This is why you're either illiterate and retarded, and/or trolling

You are an insincere slithering beast. Go away forever and do not talk ever again.

>>44413212
this

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>>44413913

If when you say purpose you really mean the cause of anyone's definition of purpose then it hinges on thought to be interpreted that way lol.

Which is again why it is projecting. Not inherent or factual. You personally value the order of events that lead to someone's defined purpose. Exactly like a bioessentialist values the natural world that precedes him and confuses it for something objective.

>>44413877
Ok, but I'm not going to do that, as I said, I am not having children in a the only way my body can so I was essentially infertile for practical purposes in the the first place.

It's like saying "don't worry, we still have more olives!" So someone who would rather die than eat an olive.

I want a child to take care of and raise and be a good mother for. I don't want to put my dysphoria stick in someone else nor watch them grow the child inside their body. It's really not that complicated.

>>44414097
>I don't want to put my dysphoria stick in someone else nor watch them grow the child inside their body. It's really not that complicated.
Why do you think having a child requires PIV sex

>>44414123
Yeah, I'm still not doing the whole impregnating someone else thing, even through IVF.

Maybe I'll find a nice guy whose wife died/ran off as a deadbeat/etc.Who needs a wife to help him raise his children, IDK. They don't need to be from my DNA.

Ideally I'd like a permanent uterus implant but that's impossible with current technology.

I'm not abandoning my biological imperative. I am already sterile. In the future we will have medical techniques that give people like me and maybe even you the ability to have children.

>>44414153
if you are a giga millionaire maybe

>>44412334
i mean i banked mine before i trooned out so

>>44414835
Malebrained. Also do you really wanna risk giving your child the troon gene

>>44414933
it didnt stop elon

>>44415202
this one made me cackle nice

>>44412334
I've always found the following
>why bring a child into this cruel world!
very cringe but im over it my siblings with carry on our genes and I wont pass on my tranny gene

>>44415267
will* stupid autocorrect. I hate Samsung phones sm

>>44415267
It's not genetic, please stop parroting falsehoods and honscience about "my dad is low-key a repper!" Current evidence suggests it has to do with prenatal androgen exposure levels.

>>44412334
somehow the gayest, most faggy post on a board about sucking cocks and crossdressing, good job

>>44415353
> Current evidence suggests it has to do with prenatal androgen exposure levels.

You do understand that such exposure is likely linked to some degree to either the mother's genetics or the genetics of the growing embryo, right? And that the mother provides half of the child's genetics?

It is unlikely that there is a single trans gene, it is more likely that an interaction between a large number of genes is involved. There is also the possibility of multiple different interactions providing the same result.

While it may be environmental, it's rare for there to be no genetic interaction with environmental components.

>>44416331
>You do understand that such exposure is likely linked to some degree to either the mother's genetics or the genetics of the growing embryo, right? And that the mother provides half of the child's genetics?
Hasn't engaged with the literature award

my bf says he is going to keep trying to ge tme pregnant now that i have a pussy
every night.. it's a lot of work but it feels good at least

>>44412334
god i fucking WISH. letting my cissy gf force me to top her would be way more fun if i didnt have to be afraid of accidentally getting her pregnant. if only being years on HRT actually was 100% effective in breaking your gonads T~T

>>44412334
I always was infertile, and no, no I am not, but there are succesful ways to cope.

>>44412334
In today's dating market, even if I was completely straight and has powerful mega semen prime for breeding, I would never be able to get a girlfriend. No matter what it would be going to waste

>>44416389
Please link me to some primary research on the topic that indicates that genetics is not a factor in pre-natal hormone exposure.

I genuinely love to be proven wrong when it happens, because it means I have learned something new.

I have engaged with the literature in the past, but I can't read everything. I have not seen any evidence that genetics has no impact on pre-natal hormone exposure, and I genuinely have no idea how it's even possible that it doesn't since genetics mediate most hormone exposure.

>>44412334
It kinda sucks but 1) my options were rope or transition so there wasn’t much choice, and 2) my options were father or nothing which makes it not even theoretically appealing.

>>44412334
I don't want kids and I wouldn't want them if I wasn't a tranny. If my boyfriend wants them later in life we can get them through surrogacy though.

>>44412334
i can imagine no situation in which i would be mentally stable enough to feel good raising children and i wouldn't want to put them through the humiliation of having a tranny mother. melancholy that i can't really undo it but i don't really care

>>44416542
At least there's no hurry without menopause

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>>44412334
My parents only let me transition on the condition that I froze sperm first. It made me really uncomfortable at the time but in retrospect I think it was a good decision that saved me a lot of future worries, even if I'll probably never use it since I mostly like guys.

I also have siblings to carry on the bloodline for me anyway

I repped for a couple years to preserve fertility and now I wanna kill myself

>>44412334
Having children is turbo retarded. Bring life onto THIS earth? In this society, in this economy, in this modern age, where nothing is ever getting better? Antinatalism is the only humane stance. Adopt if you REALLY want to raise kids, if you have the time money and resources already laid out. inb4 "oh but I want them to look like me", that's just narcissistic and a selfish excuse. I'm on the side of the declining birthrate.

>>44412334
animals are propelled towards actions which only happen to propagate genes. this 'goal' isn't on their minds. they act for the sake of the action itself.
i can still fuck, i can still find a mate. if there was an animal in my situation, they would not find anything to be wrong. if that animal was then provided a baby of its species to care for, it would do so without much issue.
if you want to impose a grand purpose on it, than fine, but don't act as if it's anything other than a human invention. i have very little desire to impregnate women.

>>44412334

If anything the imperative right now is to get sterilized and avoid making more people we can't sustain. Don't you notice how the world is literally crumbling and there's swarms of refugees everywhere? What do you think shit will be like in 20 years?

>>44412334
I have zero issues with it and always have.
I've no desire whatsoever to procreate using male gametes and I don't feel like spending a ton of money or waiting to do weird dna shit

>>44412334
My biological imperative is to smoke a looooot of weed and eat a lot of yummy snacks while I play video games. That's what I'm on this earth for. I'm here to be fat and useless and happy

wait hrt makes you infertile???

>>44418648
Well, sort of. For trans women, it makes us mostly not produce sperm anymore, so yeah.

It's not a 100% guerantee so don't use it as a substitute for birth control, but if we are trying for a child the recommendation it to treat it as so unlikely that you won't succeed.

This is part of why trans women's cum runs clear and has a different texture.

-----

For trans men testosterone usually stops periods, which is to say it stops the egg from being dispensed at all. If a trans man does not have periods, he can't get pregnant.

If he still does have periods, he may be able to.

Anyway, hope you enjoyed todays lesson on trans biology here on 4chan, the leading innovators of education.

Ps. Why do you ask?

>>44412334
Every few months i have a panic attack over it, so no not really.

I have a child but you're probably not addressing me. FTM

I guess I know so many trans moms at this point, it doesn't feel to me like an either/or. I am aware of the effects of HRT though.

>>44412334
god abandoned it for me by giving me a Y chromosome as a woman. he can make me pregnant after srs mother mary style

>>44412395
lmfao no this is dumb. they’ve been doing surrogacy now for literally more than 30-40 years, and many kids who were born via surrogacy have had kids of their own. there’s not magical health risks. if you want an ethical surrogacy situation you have to be prepared to pay a LOT of money for a surrogate you feel comfortable with, and also reject a few options if you feel like they’re coerced into it at all or aren’t enthusiastic about it, or would be affected health-wise. there are a small subset of women for whom giving birth is not as medically demanding as other women, and perhaps have had a kid or two in the past and have a lot of money on their own and want to do it as a thing for another woman who can’t. it’s hard to find but you can definitely find a situation where you feel comfortable. also there’s always adoption

>>44412334
the real life trade-off for me has boiled down to losing the ability to fetishize my cum with my sexual partners and gaining the inconvenience of having to explain when i've orgasmed, but i'm hoping my body renormalizes to some extent when i go off hrt soon. i'm giving up it's been almost 7 years i think and i'm still a failure of a woman like i wasn't even really of a man so i think i made a bad decision

>>44412334
i have never in my life once had a desire to impr*gn*te a woman. that’s fucking disgusting. if you’ve ever thought about that you’re a man.

>>44413221
*never reproducing

>>44419489
How are the children coping?
I predict a lot of ''no contact'', once the kids grow up.

>>44412384
>tranny gene
Is that a thing? Kids of trannies end up trannies, at above average numbers?

>>44412484
>Queer people should in fact reproduce whenever possible
I strongly advice against it.
t. kid of queer people.
It's a tough existence, and you can never bring it up because it makes your parents sad, or angry at you for not being happy about their queerness.

>>44412870
>Biological imperative is not real
But it is when the body tells you that you're the opposite sex?