>>44588460
the male gaze and what men are willing to do for you in exchange for sex obviously

this has nothing to do with self expression, that's just crap women say, all that stuff is about highlighting the female face and body in a way that gets men interested

>>44588460
That's why I choose to be a masculine woman. Never liked being feminine before I was trans, wouldn't start now.

>>44588488
Based tomboymoder. Good luck to you.

>>44588460
>why do <group of people> like <thing> when I don't like it?
because they're different from you. consult this whenever you get confused in the future.

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>>44588460
>Femininity is lame. It's just less cool than masculinity.
Says you. I much prefer it desu.

>>44588499
I'm a cis guy.
Why are you all so hellbent identifying with the trans/femme/woman label at all costs?

>>44588503
I mean it just seems self-evident to me. Isn't it much cooler to be into things traditionally associated with masculinity? The chibi anime twee version of femininity that trans people seem to be drawn towards just aggressively shrill and puerile. It sucks.

>>44588524
>>44588510
refer to >>44588503

>>44588531
That's a non-answer homie.

>>44588541
I hate stereotypically masculine things. I think it's very much uncool. do I need to ask why you like masculinity and act confused? of course not.
I don't like macadamia nuts, but some people will eat an entire container of them in one sitting. am I going around saying "it seems self-evident that macadamia nuts are nasty, no one should be eating those!"? no.
why? because I understand that life takes a different course for every single person. it doesn't have to make sense to me.
this is something that even grade-schoolers can understand, right? what am I missing?

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>>44588460
Well let's see... I pressed the barrel of a loaded gun in my mouth 12 years ago because I ACHED for femininity, I personally believe God saved me and made the primer on the round a dud so it didn't fire when I pulled the trigger. I bought hormones the next day when that happened and haven't missed a dose since.

So for me being hyper feminine is WORTH DYING OVER

>>44588510
You literally called yourself trans and a woman??? What the fuck, are you stupid?

>>44588619
That was a different person. I'm the OP, a cis guy.

Mtfs dont want coolness they want beauty

>>44588633
I think being cool is more appealing than being "pretty." "Beauty" in the way that MtFs obsess over is, like I said, so often just overly puerile.

>>44588619
>>44588510
Oh. I just realized different poster maybe? If that's the case, because we like having a woman's body? And when we have a woman's body and like it, that makes us women in most people's eyes. I personally don't care about pronouns and such, i consider myself enby, but all that is with the context of having and wanting those feminine primary and secondary sexual characteristics.

To me it's self evident that you're retarded. But I don't come to your living room and your socialization space to tell you that.

>>44588645
The curves of a woman's body don't have enough contours on them. They lack anatomy and structure, it's like being attracted to a vase. The male body is just objectively better in every way.

>>44588641
>can't imagine that the world is not formed of just carbon copies of himself
Yeah, it's self-evident now. You're retarded.
Calling others puerile is ridiculous when you have the reasoning skills of a 2 year old, at best.

>>44588662
Its almost like you like men and male bodies, and some of don't. See >>44588503

>>44588662
you are officially dumber than a toddler. seriously, even toddlers understand the difference between objectivity and subjectivity, even if they don't know the words.

>>44588693
>>44588698
I legitimately just can't understand why someone would want to give up the prowess of masculinity for something incredibly shrill and distasteful. I cannot. It is incomprehensible to me but it feels like 75% of the guys on the forums I went on back in 2010 thought it was worth it.

I would've been ok with it if they wanted to be like Audrey Hepburn but no they wanna plaster themselves with makeup and be like Hatsune Miku.

>>44588772
you don't live in the real world. you should see a shrink.

>>44588772
>I am 2 years old
We get that already, anon.
Hope one day the tech will allow to do age verification by mental age rather than physical. You may be an adult biologically, but you shouldn't be allowed to post here. You are not mentally prepared to discuss like an adult. Not even by a long shot.

>>44588872
>>44588871
This is starting to make sense. You seem to associate masculinity with immaturity and femininity with maturity, on a very fundamental level. It checks out because so many nerds and academics, people with "mature" interests, often become trans.

I could go on a diatribe about how being "pretty" and "graceful" has nothing to do with maturity but I'll save that for now.

>>44588618
Cute, the stuffy is alright too I guess ;)

>>44588926
it's because being a man did nothing for me except ruin my life. a lot of things ruined my life. fml

>>44588939
How could it possibly do nothing for you? Didn't you bounce around your room to music in a manic display of testosterone-fueled energy feeling like you could do anything?

That was my experience being an (autistic) teen boy and I'm still kinda like that. I wouldn't give it up for a billion dollars.

>>44588460
>What's the appeal?
Physicsl dysphoria. I like to be pretty but if im naked im happier having a girly body than a guyly body. I had phantom sensations in my breasts and anorexia pretrans. Now i feel more free to live and being pretty opens the door for me to express the sensitive parts of my heart

>>44588954
i .dont listen to music and when i do i listen to the same song over and over and then just stop and go back to shitty websites that ruined my life

>>44588965
>i .dont listen to music
Fascinating.

>>44588965
that's pretty interesting lol. what's the song, just out of curiosity??

>>44588996
i've listened to pumped up kicks, this random RAC song called wachter europas, a song from a schizo called socialized trance (randy prozac is awesome tho), evil by interpol, the kids aren't alright, californication, hatsune miku leek song it's nostalgic (the nostalgia is from when i was five btw), billy talent fallen leaves, zombie by the cranberries, labyrinth by oomph, i forgot the rest rn this is over several years

>>44589022
There are literally hundreds of stylish, talented male musicians and artists to listen and model oneself after, and you decided to explore none of them over the course of your life.

No wonder you have dysphoria.

>>44589022
as someone who literally listens to multiple entire albums every single day this is very interesting to me. good songs, I like your taste!

>>44588488
Same

>>44589042
You literally eat oatmeal for breakfast every morning no wonder you have cancer

>>44589061
I genuinely think the reason that there have been so many more MtFs recently is because they were generally very unworldly and uncultured on very accessible (and handsome) masculine figures of history's past to look up to as role models, and spent far too much time focusing on anime girls and video games with le epically pretty and beautiful female playable characters.

You all blew it.

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>>44589042
id rather look like fenix from straykids but thats not really feasible so trooning is like the next best thing.

>>44589082
god what a dreamboat

>>44589079
men and extreme masculinity are not attractive to me.
women are the pinnacle of attractiveness. a woman with aspects of "handsomeness" is amazing, obviously, but "handsome" and "man" are not words that I can put in the same sentence. nor are "role model" and "man".

>>44589110
hes literally so pretty
>>44589079
i want to fuck the handsome men, and handsome men dont like ugly skinny twinks in my experience

>>44589148
>"handsome" and "man" are not words that I can put in the same sentence. nor are "role model" and "man"

Again, how? Isn't George Harrison pretty handsome? Isn't Beethoven a good role model? Do you know literally anything about masculinity other than the memes you see online?

You all have dysphoria because you uneducated on the potential of masculinity. I am 100% sure of that.

>>44589181
>George Harrison
very, very ugly (obviously)
>Beethoven
I'm not a musician by trade and I don't know his life story, so he's not a role model to me.
>Do you know literally anything about masculinity
of course, and it's not for me. there's more to this than "memes I see online". I exist in the physical world with other human beings that I can see, touch, and interact with in various ways. I have dysphoria because of some sort of chemical imbalance in my brain or disagreement between my conscience and my physical form, just like every single other person who has dysphoria. you are not 100% sure, you are just misinformed and willfully ignorant.

>>44589181
idk who that is and damn who is looking up to beethoven nigga how old are you?

>>44589224
>>44589231
So long story short, MtFs don't actually know shit about art or history or culture at all and just know about video game girls and anime girls? Figures.
Again, your dysphoria doesn't exist in a vacuum.

>>44588460
>online dorky guys transitioning by the hundreds over the last 15 years.
Out of millions of dorky guys online? That's not even 0.1% of the population especially over 15 years. Just sounds like massive confirmation bias to me.

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>>44588772
>Audrey Hepburn
Well to me, she just looks like a closet pooner. At least for me, I like a bit of muscular androgyny of women. If I ever want to exercise masculinity, I can literally just dress masc (which I like anyway?) or out myself with my voice or more masc hairstyle. Not that hard.

>>44589250
oh, I know plenty about history and culture. I don't know who mentioned video games or anime, that doesn't seem relevant to the discussion aside from being aspects of culture.
>>44589256
so many of these "why is such and such...?" threads can just be chalked up to confirmation bias or people pretending not to understand personal preference (like this thread)

>>44589267
oh my god what I wouldn't give to look like her

>>44589289
Boobs suck though.

>>44589301
You can just bind or get a mastectomy. Its okay to hate your boobs being too big or heavy and also be a woman.

>>44589301
nope, that's incorrect. have you really no beautiful women role models in your life? why wouldn't you be attracted to gorgeous women with large breasts?
I guess you just don't know shit about appreciating aesthetically pleasing things and people.

>>44589316
I'm a cis guy. It's really funny how cis gays can't say "boobs are ugly" without being chastised for it but trans guys can say it and get unanimous praise.

>>44589337
that doesn't happen.

>>44589350
Yes it does lol

>>44589337
I'm not an ftm though. And that's because it's not about sexual aesthetics, it's about practical lifestyle of big and heavy boobs. If you don't have to live with boobs and don't want sex with people that have boobs, then yeah stfu, we don't want your opinion.

>>44589337
im a cis gay on estrogen and i think boobs are ugly and ive said it and never been chastised.

>>44589352
no, it doesn't. don't "lol" at me, young man.

>>44589356
Estrogen makes you lose energy homie lmao. Get off that lame shit and run a marathon to the cocaine-fueled performance of Crocodile Rock that Elton John played in the 80s.

>>44589372
cocaine isn't good for you. stop advocating for people to harm themselves.

>>44588772
you are aap, they're agp, your dick gets hard from being a man, theirs from being a woman

>>44589384
I'm advocating that people go on mania-filled music binges

>>44589459
that has no bearing on the post. you should be locked up for your crimes.

>>44589372
Id rather listen to like slayyter or sevdaliza for that

>>44588460
Femininity is ritualized submission constructed to be sexually appealing to heterosexual men

crazy how some people literally just don't have theory of mind

>>44589751
then why do I only use it to be appealing to homosexual women? and why are there feminine tops?

>>44589806
Not "feminine" enough

>>44589889
wrong! *loud buzzer sound*

>>44589896
I'm right and you know it, tranny.

>>44589800
Real
>>44590762
Nta, but my gender presentation is not your masturbation fuel. I don't need to be validated by your dick or your idea or real femininity.

>>44591643
I'm not talking about "genduh presentachon", you don't even know what you're talking about, you just think about yourself. And I hate femininity, could never be aroused by this shit.

>>44591659
>You just think about yourself
Ahh yes, I feel so insulted by being confident in my gender. I would feel sooo much better about my chud life if I went onto an anonymous tranny basket weaving forum to argue with people about why I don't like the other gender.

>>44591706
This is not about me. I don't like genduh, but you miss the point thinking about yourself. You are very much obsessed and I don't want to talk with you anymore.

>>44588618
we disagree on a lot of things Kayla but I will always respect you

>>44588488
i would to if i could properly troon out, though i worry about the efficacy of passing with short hair

The appeal is that my soul aches when anything masculine is associated to me in any way. Femininity is freedom. I hated to be a man.

>>44588460
When people say shit like this, or post "girl's locker room boring, boy's locker room quirky" memes, I just remind myself of my rich friend's 18th birthday where I had go outside like 3 seperate times because of how akward the drunk guys made it. I guess I just don't see the appeal in singing songs about shitting and cumming on the loudspeakers and slapping my friend's ass with a belt "for good luck".
Also when talking more about just broad masculine culture, the picrel pretty much sums it up, guys love sports and guys love war, I don't like either
Don't mind being "boring" at all

>>44592674
>>44592775
What versions of masculinity were ppl like you 2 exposed to that made you hate it that much? Weren't you ever into like... Pink Floyd or something? It just feels like you internalized really stupid and narrow conceptions of masculinity and then concluded that somehow femininity was better.

Also.
> I guess I just don't see the appeal in singing songs about shitting and cumming on the loudspeakers and slapping my friend's ass with a belt "for good luck".
lol awesome

>>44593620
I concede that I like a lot of male music artists. Pink floyd is awesome.
Still I think a lot of women do and just because something was made by men doesn't mean it's masculine, or even gendered at all. Pink floyd is just really good music that is universally beloved.