Putting MTF/trans woman in front of FTM/trans man like "trans women and trans men" or "MTFs and FTMs" rubs me the wrong way.The construction is usually always "men and women", "boys and girls", "guys and gals", "sons and daughters", "husband and wife" etc. with very few exceptions ("ladies and gentlemen" was ordered that way because of the saying "ladies first")It feels like you're subtly misgendering trans people when you write "troons and poons" or "mtf and ftm"
>>45206245what in the fuck are you even trying to say
This seems like a level of discussion meant for twitter.
>>45206383Writing "mtf and ftm" instead of "ftm and mtf" is a subtle tell that you think of trans women as men and trans men as women
>>45206398i dont know the last time ive ever seen someone say either "mtf and ftm" OR "ftm and mtf"
>>45206245Trans men and women feels more natural to say anyway?
>>45206245This has occurred to me too
>>45206415Well, apply it to any sort of thing meaning the same thing. "Troons and poons", "transfem and transmasc", "trans girls and guys"
>>45206477are you japanese esl. yunyun syndrome is based either way
>>45206245sexual dimorphism is not fair or equitable
>>45206245Those constructions are an artifact of societal male defaultism that remains from cultural holdovers. Mtf’s are more likely to be terminally online and dominate online spaces. They also have greater mainstream visibility and are featured more often in discussions of transgender topics. Trans women get put before trans men simply because of their cultural relevance.I don’t think it’s deeper than that
>>45206245There's linguistic reasons why we say common phrases in the order that we do. E.g. flip-flop, tick-tock; rather than flop-flip, tock-tick. It's easier/more natural to say it in a certain order bc of the phonemes used. ("Ladies and gentlemen" is said that way bc "gentlemen and ladies" sounds awkward rhythmically.)That's presumably the reason for "troons and poons" and "mtf and ftm." I haven't ever heard people say "trans women and trans men," but if they do then you're probably right about that reasoning.
>>45206245all it means is that before 2016 the number of poons was 1 for every 100 mtfs. you talk abt more commonly occuring things more than less commonly occuring things.
>>45206245you aren't wrong but I think you might be very mentally ill for realizing this.
>>45207160But troons and poons have the same vowels... mtf and ftm too.
never noticed that
>>45206245just call them fakegirls and fakeboysway easier
>>45206245why would you say "trans women and trans men" instead of "trans men and women" or just "trans people"
>>45206245I pointed this out in a irl trans support group and I got called a misogynist. Compared to wanting GLBT instead of LGBT which made no sense. Its not me favoring men its me noticing that it deviates from the order any other time people mention the 2 genders.
>>45206245What happened to ladies first?
