The whole benevolent God thing just collapses once you stare at the mind-independent reality and see how it's this fundamentally indifferent void that doesn't give a fuck about your values or meanings. Nature is just blind idiot hyper-chaos without norms or wisdom tearing through absolute time and ruining every future-oriented faith. Believing in some sky daddy who gives a shit is just this urbane creationism where you drape purpose over an aimless arbitrary history because admitting we're peripheral ephemeral accidents in a cosmos headed for solar catastrophe and cosmic asymptopia is too much for your self-esteem. Extinction's the final truth anyway, every vestige of sentience wiped out so nothing will have happened and all that fideist cope about mystico-religious illumination is just post-Kantian nostalgia for a concord that never existed. Fuck off with your sop to pathetic twinges, the realist conviction leaves no room for that shit.
>>25383008That's a good thing though? If nothing lasts forever then life inbetween can be a hedonistic, creative sandbox. Alan Watts called death "the ecstasy of disappearing".
>>25383008Yeah but like, what it you’re wrong? Then the pascal’s wager enters again. Also look up the fine tuning argument, in my opinion that best theistic argument to date.
This is something I would throughly enjoy reading. Yet, it’s over £100 on Amazon.Is there a potential PDF version available anywhere?
>>25383008>mind-independent realityNo one knows what matter even is or how it arises. Our best models are extrapolations of extrapolations and what we call matter may indeed be information (or "mind") at base.>muh creationismReddit-tier aspersion. Atheists preferred the steady state model until the universe having a beginning became the dominant model. How the universe came into being and why anything exists at all are still open questions>Cope, fuck off, patheticAppeal to emotion. By your own logic the universe doesn't care about your faux stoic "I embrace horrible truths, only I am in touch with the Real" posturing.
>>25383008>indifference, no values or meaning, blind chaos, aimless, no purpose, accidents>still claims to know of a final truthYou guys just can't help yourselves
>>25383155Just DLed it from libgen
Sounds like atheist cope. Ironically, the truth is far worse than he says. I'm not in the mood to go into details, but the bottom line is, our universe is a series of enclosing prisons, and we're in (as far as I can tell) the second-to-lowest level. So it's not that a benevolent God doesn't exist, it's that He's far, far away.
>>25383008>The whole benevolent God thing just collapses once you stare at the mind-independent reality and see how it's this fundamentally indifferent void that doesn't give a fuck about your values or meaningsNo it doesn't.
>>25384340why does god being very far away matter?
>>25384354Because, without God, the universe looks like a meaningless, mechanistic death trap...kind of like the viewpoint expressed in OP.
>>25383008Chaos? Chaos only exists in a world where order is presupposed. Accidents? There are not even accidents, since that presupposes intention. You still use theism to define your atheism. No wonder you rely on the same eschatology. Even when you remove God you use his shadow to outline the way. You're still only a Christian. Every certainty is a defense against helplessness. At this stage, you'll only either return to religion or smuggle it back into your own thinking unbenknownst to yourself.
>>25384368God is omnipresent and omnipotent though?
>>25384392Yes, but he doesn't necessarily care about us. We're more like venues of entertainment in a gazillion-channel cable-TV system, and God sits in his recliner, eats popcorn, watches our lives, and laughs his ass off.
The central flaw of Brassier's argument is that he assumes our current cosmological understanding of time and extinction is the final, absolute truth. In "Infinity And The Mind" by Rudy Rucker, he notes that fourth-dimensional space-time is curved, and that the universe is expanding at a rate that contradicts our understanding of gravity, and one possible explanation for both of these phenomena is that our three-dimensional universe is the surface of a fourth-dimensional hypersphere which is expanding. New three-dimensional universes are being created in the "inside" direction relative to our own. So even though our current three-dimensional universe may experience heat death, there is a new three-dimensional universe to go to, and the fact that there is an inexhaustible source of energy that causes the three-dimensional and fourth-dimensional universes to expand, is as much of a proof of God that we need.
>>25384445>God is just as vain as me, because...he just IS, okay?
>>25384468Recall that we were created in His image and likeness. Which implies he's a right bastard. Which is the central thesis of Gnosticism.
>>25384481Then why don't you and your liberal neighbor think and act the same?
>>25384485That's the point of our separation and contraction from God–to allow God to experience an infinity of viewpoints.
>>25384481He created us in his image of what he what he would like us to be, then gave us free will.There must be a very good reason he does not intervene in most human affairs.I believe this earth/universe is a test, we must pass this test to go onward into the light of the other more benevolent worlds god may have for us, or if we dont pass it we either come back to earth to try again or we get to discover true darkness depending on how evil we were in this life.For all we know, maybe earth is some form of purgatory and we are all in this together for a very long time, kind of like that From tv show, we reincarnate due to past lives being lived incorrectly, destined to stay in purgatory forever. Ever had dejavu?
>>25383008It's the complete opposite. Human beings began as something like the high priests of the world. And even after the Fall, they retain a place of privilege. For we are the only things capable of understanding and apprehending meaning, beauty, or truth, and it does not matter how large the world is or what its distant future may be, in the face of the meaning which human beings find in it, which no other thing is capable of finding. >>25384503Weird viewpoint, implying that God (omniscient and omnipotent) would lack knowledge or understanding of any viewpoint, or desire any such viewpoint. >>25384481"In his image and likeness" is not the same thing at all as the implied reciprocity of man's limited, finite, and less flattering qualities onto God. If you're going to appeal to Christian doctrine for your arguments, remember that it is a major point of that doctrine that human beings are fallen, and that even without the fall, they were limited and capable of error in ways God is not.
>>25383008Except reality isn't mind independent
>>25384507Oh, this world is definitely purgatory or worse. See picrel.>>25384510You're coming from an invisible-sky-daddy viewpoint, not a Prime Mover viewpoint, i.e. I wasn't coming from a Christian viewpoint to begin with. My version of Genesis 1.1 would be "In the beginning, Infinity sought to understand itself."
>>25384517It makes way less sense to imagine God as something that did not understand itself than to imagine God as omniscient or omnipotent. Solid arguments to this effect were made hundreds to thousands of years ago. You, again, project human qualities onto God and turn around to accuse others of believing in a "sky daddy" (a person-like thing with more power than any other person).
>>25383008God is so unconditionally loving that it respects your free will and allows you (who is also God) to go through this illusion of separation from knowing oneself as God called "physical reality" and experience what it is like to not feel the immediate love of (and as) God. Have you had your fill?
>>25384517Do these extraterrestrials have hooked noses and beady eyes? I read somewhere that the Sumerians started the downfall of humanity with greed, as soon as they discovered how to count and became conscious of the thought of wealth, that was the end and they have conspired against humanity ever since.
>>25384503ok, so his "image and likeness" can vary in perspective and decisions, but NOT in a way that allows him to be better than you?
>getting caught up in shit like this Just be.
>>25384523I feel you've got an axe to grind, and are deliberately misinterpreting my arguments.>>25384524I've had my fill. How do I get out?>>25384529No, these extraterrestrials are (largely) the Grays. As I'm sure you are aware, they have no visible noses. You can read the book yourself. Unlike most books about custodial alien societies, this one comes with dozens and dozens of pages of footnotes, so you can see where he got his information.
>>25384553>just beThat's a very unpleasant place to be, given the soul-draining realities of day-jobbery (as well as many other parasitic barriers).
>>25383008>stare at the mind-independent realityAnon that's literally impossible. Once you stare at it it's no longer mind-independent.
>>25383008NIHIL!
>>25383008>25383008anon , why do you just claim things.
>>25384666Technically, the book is claiming things. And anon is repeating the claims because it meshes with his worldview. But both are making assumptions and taking an unrealistically narrow view of reality.
>>25383008>The whole benevolent God thing just collapses once you stare at the mind-independent reality and see how it's this fundamentally indifferent void>Extinction's the final truth anyway, every vestige of sentience wiped out so nothing will have happenedYou’re saying two conflicting things here. On the one hand you’re claiming that there IS a mind-independent reality; and on the other you’re claiming that reality ceases to exist without sentience. Even though I don’t wholly agree with him Meillassoux is much more convincing on this point with his notion of the arche-fossil. >Nature is just blind idiot hyper-chaos without norms or wisdom tearing through absolute timeThe irony in attacking religion while joining a murder-suicide cult. Sounds like you’ve found your own blind idiot God to worship.
>>25383008You sound like Terance McKenna after his first bad trip
>>25383008>Atomist babby having its first nervous breakdown: The postChill bro. God was always in control
>>25383146Pascals wager does not work because there is no chance of the abrahamic god existing.
>>25388044How do you even begin to construct that sample space?
>>25387369>murder-suicide cult
>>25388048This isn't an argument.
>>25383008bot post
>>25388044How do you know?
>>25387690kek
>>25388085Because he was clearly made tf up by a bunch of barbaric shitskins.
>>25388059Yes it is, if you knew anything about probability you'd know why. What is the space of outcomes where one event is "God exists" with measure 0? How did you construct it?
>>25388096naahhh fuck that shit
>>25383008What is the apeiron?
