It's the half of Protestantism that isn't outrageously uncultured or bigoted. It helped found our country. It does actual community service and largely eschews the prosperity gospel or hypocrite pastor problem that plagues Evangelicalism. It actually sings real hymn music instead of pop musicAnd yet, all its members are like 70 and those churches are all ill and dying. What a tragedy.
>>25408152Sorry, enjoy your brown catholic future. Demographics is destiny!
>>25408157Funny you say this, because Evangelicalism is actually taking off and (modestly) overtaking Catholicism in Latin America. There have been instances of 90% of towns in, like, Honduras or Brazil converting en masse to Pentecostalism. There was this instance I read about where a matriarch of a Brazilian family passed away, by which time the rest of the family had already converted to Pentecostalism, and the parents refused to even step inside the cathedral where the funeral was being held, calling it the "house of the Devil".Not even kidding when I say the CIA is literally behind this. They heavily invested in Evangelical Protestant missions to Latin America to prevent the spread of communism during the Cold War. There was a Catholic movement emerging at the time called "liberation theology" which emphasized helping the poor, labor organization, social welfare, etc. And America didn't like any of that. And that's why in places like Honduras and Brazil, Evangelical Christianity is exploding. Same with Africa I'm pretty sure, though its situation is a bit more muddied as more of it's been colonized by England and Germany, Protestant countries, from the get-go.Pentecostalism is kinda theologically idiotic IMO. The Bible says that the historical Pentecost in Acts, the original "speaking in tongues", involved being miraculously able to speak and preach in like 40 different languages comprehensibly. And since no one can do that, in practice in Pentecostal churches it often reduces to "shoulda bought a Kia shoulda bought a Toyota shoulda bought a Honda CR-V" that's frankly theologically uninspiring.
>>25408169It's short-lived. I was a Pentecostal once, and there's no real doctrine like mainline Protestantism, Catholicism or Orthodoxy, just "grace saves" being repeated ad nauseam. The pastor had to pull on so many strands to explain what a "soul" was, and how it all ties into the Trinity and Christian cosmology, and basically handwaved it all away. There's no confession other than personal prayer confession to God and public declarations of absolution. A lot of aspects from Methodists, Lutherans, and Presbyterians are borrowed willy-nilly without any concern for consistency. My pastor preached Old Earth Creationism, which I held as a Pentecostal, but we had some lovely encounters with people from a neighbouring church who were Young Earth Creationist fundies.And that's the thing: zero consistency. The Holy Spirit is supposed to guide objectively true interpretations of Scripture, which leads to two visiting pastors preaching binary opposite ideas in two Sundays. This happened several times, and you just have to trust in the Holy Spirit and "speaking in tongues", and give in to the trance-like state during worship. The trance was the height of it, entire congregations would almost long to get into that state several times. As a child, I was encouraged to clap until my little hands bled, and to "be filled with the Holy Spirit" that way.It's short-lived. Pentecostalism will decline sharply with any level of education. I lived in a third world country and myself and most of my peers left Pentecostalism and even Christianity for good. One of my friends who was educated and quite devout wanted more hymns instead of trance-inducing songs meant to screamed rather than sung, devotional prayer chanting, and a consistent interpretation of Scripture instead of Holy Spirit vibes, sadly I doubt he knew if these things are more in line with mainline Protestantism, Catholicism or Orthodoxy.
>>25408152find an evangelical church with children running around. did you expect it to be easy?>>25408169>Pentecostalism is kinda theologically idioticyeah pentecostalists are total bros
>>25408169Liberation Theology had its virtues (the concern about the poor) but had a little bit of a problem in that it in practice sometimes forgot about the whole Jesus thing.I can freely and honestly say they are better and holier people than I am, but some Catholic missionaries would go to communities and feed and help people which is great. But they wouldn't preach to them and talk about Jesus. Which Protestants did.You should very much love the poor, because you see Christ in them. But you know, helping them spiritually is good too.There are also issues that Liberation Theology sometimes didnt really give a good formation and lacked in Theology. Evangelicals might not be old school Thomists and sometimes seem to ignore how the New Testament works but they at least studied hard about the Bible.Not saying I would be a good catechist or that I would do a better job, Im sure they are good people who had good intentions. But the Evangelicals won.
>evangelicals get rekt after israel falls end of century>islam secularizes into nothing>catholics lose to freemasons>freemasons mormons and jehovah witnesses exposed and rekt>buddhism collapses under its own memes>hinduism falls as jeets become universal bad guys>judaism falls as jews secularize and society laughs at orthodox jews like islamic extremistsooh yeah gnostic chads will retake the throne. Future is defeating the demiurge and finally destroying the loosh farm.
>>25408221Gnosticism is/was fake Christianity despite any influence or cause-or-effect relationship or defensive claims, for similar reasons to why Mormonism is fake Christianity.Mormons more like Morons
>>25408213>Liberation Theology had its virtues (the concern about the poor) but had a little bit of a problem in that it in practice sometimes forgot about the whole Jesus thingthis is four chan. you can say they were crypto-atheistic communist stooges here
>>25408221>buddhism collapses under memes>hinduism falls as jeets become universal bad guysI doubt that the most populous countries in the world would have their religion fall. Even if Hinduism collapsed under the weight of its many schools and Hindus converted to Tibetan Buddhism (which retains many of the same gods btw), it's still a Buddhist India. Buddhism is incredibly syncretic to the point agnostic versions of it exist in traditional schools. If any of these religions survive, it's Buddhism.>judaismCan't wait for secular, vegan and feminist Judaism to fully integrate with Jewish existentialism to create a framework to actually bring existentialism to the masses. Atheists seething when the Jews co-opt the global majority worldview and sit at the top again. Gentle reminder that even when commies took over, Jews were still on it.>freemasonsthe true meme.>catholicsThey'll survive. They knew how to survive the Dark Ages, Crusades, Black Death, several wars, Enlightenment, and the rise of Communism and secular Fascism. They are far more resilient and cunning than you think.>islamWill have a reformation like Christianity did, and their own Thirty Years War in the middle east before they calm down.>evangelicalsAgain, meme.
>>25408245We should honestly stop thinking of Buddhism as "Indian", and start thinking of it as E and (especially) SE Asian.There is evidence to suggest that Siddartha - the historical Buddha himself - was yellow, not brown. His teachings are just so compatible with E and SE Asian culture in a way they're not elsewhere.Frankly, Nepal and Bhutan have no business belonging in "South Asia" with all the other jeets. Maybe Nepal less so since it's long been ruined by jeet immigration (a warning for Canada and much of the US?), but Bhutan definitely so. It's the closest any country could get to the CIA fantasy of a "free Tibet".A Buddhist India (even culturally) would be a vast improvement over the India in our timeline. The streets would be clean, the people would be more physically attractive, and the men would be far less rapey and gross (even if nonzero). It'd probably still be a third-world postcolonial shithole, but it'd be a rather clean and safe one, especially relative to current India.(This opinion was formulated in consultation with an acquaintance who happens to be Nepalese and practicing Buddhist, by the way. He ID'ed as SE Asian.)
>>25408245>most populous countryI think the internet made jeets the universal hated group. Anti jeet lore is the new creepy pasta so I can see hinduism becoming hated more and more.>buddhism is agnosticlurk /x/ and find they are openly mocking this now. I don't find buddhism really surviving surveillance dystopia world. Loosh farm memes hit harder to more people these days.>catholicsgonna die out desu. Mexico is becoming more pagan south america too.>judaism will create a new frameworktheir most extremist people are schizo amish with gun settlers. Take away israel and will they be around then or will they just merge with islamic schizos?
>>25408257Honestly, I've been contemplating whether Pentecostalism's rising popularity in Latin America and Africa has to do with the whole tongue trance thing's similarities to tribal indigenous rituals, with all the ecstasy and ululating and whatnot.I.e. basically 3rd world monkey brain kicking in.
>>25408253Didn't mention that Buddhism was Indian per se, though I'd argue otherwise that a lot of Mahayana thought and the lineage of Theravada that transmitted to Sri Lanka and survived to this day was Indian in origin. Of course, the Buddha wasn't Indian in the modern sense even if most of his disciples were, and Buddhist India (Ashoka and co.) were a lot better than their Hindu counterparts. India started the path of intellectual decline with Hindu dominance in the medieval period and Islamic invasions into the shithole it is today, but Buddhism is quite Indian in origin, at least.I have read Buddhist scriptures (suttas, parts of abhidhamma), as well as listened to sermons (dhamma talks) from monks. There are a lot of Indian heritage terms still in Buddhism, and this is most prevalent in the oldest Buddhist scriptures, the suttas and agamas that a lot of Buddhism builds out of, especially Theravada Buddhism and certain strands of Tibetan Buddhism.Note that Indian Buddhists are not cow poop smearing jeets, they refuse Hindu influences for the most part, including caste and retarded animal worship. They tend to lean into the more meditation-centered side (think Vipassana, which is popular amongst them) as Hinduism already has the devotional side that they don't want.
>>25408261This is true of South and Southeast Asia as well, where Pentecostalism is also growing. Probably the same reason.>>25408152For real, finding a mainline Protestant church that isn't just boomers is difficult, might as well just go to my local Catholic or Orthodox churches which somehow have young folks and kids.
>>25408273Honestly, for India, any kind of Christianity is better than the status quo and I'll welcome it with open arms. Pentecostal, mainline, St. Thomas? You name it.NE India is currently the most Christian region of India, and AFAIK has been this way since colonial times. It's probably no coincidence, too, that they're yellow, and also probably among the least rapey Indians in India. In an ideal world the NE Indians wouldn't have to share a country with, well, India.I wouldn't even mind some emigrating to E and SE countries as guest workers, honestly. They look compatible, they respect the rules, and to top it all off... they're Christian! Just hard to disambiguate them from the rest of India.
>>25408152>I want to be a christian but also being a pharisee seems ideal. okay.maybe read the book again anon.this one is about a homeless man who goes around pissing off the "cultured" class to the point they eventually execute him.
>>25408317I'd say one could also make just as tenable of an argument that the evangelicals who thumb through every other verse bashing gays, troons, fun, and Pokemon could be more like a Pharisee than the heartened charitable good-man reverend who'd let beggars of any race or religion sleep in his pew and eat from his kitchen.Jesus would've given the woman the baby formula in that one TikTok social experiment in which she went around calling (mostly Evangelical) churches in the south for baby formula, and most slammed the door on her.
>>25408325Your post reads like someone who wants to be "above" that lowley flyover sort rather than someone who's heart bleads for the trans woman.You should not forget that in most cases, this is exactly what is going on with the sort who raise concern over these things, city folks who want to feel superior to the backwards provincials and poors, rather than a genuine feeling of compassion for those on the other end.Its master psychology, and you've got it going on in your head right now.The white Anglo-Saxon protestants burden to be above the ignorant Alabama strip mall Baptists healing hands party.It is pride which drives you here, you can see that in the post and how focused you are in aesthetics.
>>25408334Jesus wouldn't have approved of most Evangelical churches. Exactly the type of situation in which he cleared the Temple, and exactly what he was referring to when he told his followers to be discreet rather than spectacular when praying. Ever been to a megachurch, a "Baptist conference"/"Pentecostal conference", or a "Christian concert"?
>>25408299The southern tip of India (the Tamil and Tamil-influenced regions) are also quite Christian and more likely to vote secular and progressive governments. If there’s one part of India that actually tries to live up to the “developed country” meme, it’s that part. St. Thomas landed there, and the church there has maintained contact with Catholic authorities during the medieval and later periods.
>>25408349>aesthetics aesthetics aestheticsEither trolling or illiterate.Read it again, in either case.
>>25408361>because he’d clearly approve of trance worship, christian rock, prosperity gospel
>>25408361>any woman who prays or prophesies with her head unveiled disgraces her head—it is one and the same thing as having her head shaved. 6 For if a woman will not veil herself, then she should cut off her hair; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to have her hair cut off or to be shaved, she should wear a veil. 7 For a man ought not to have his head veiled, since he is the image and reflection[c] of God; but woman is the reflection[d] of man.I Corinthians 11:5-6. NRSV.I don't know about you, but I'd want to attend a congregation that takes God's Word seriously.
>>25408152Unironic answer, it's because they dropped the KJV
>>25408393The KJV Only movement never made any sense to me because of how Anglocentric it is. Like, don't other countries use Bibles in languages other than English?
>>25408380Paul the kike destroyed Jesus' movement.The entirety of Christianity and Paul's authority is based on this filthy kike's personal visions, which 1) contradict each other between the epistles and Acts 2) are not as written in Acts, which were clearly plagiarized from the conversion of Heliodorus in 2 Maccabees and Pentheus in Euripides' Bacchae.If you're reading this and you're a Christian, you're a mental midget, and you'd be smarter if an African witch doctor lobotomized that worthless brain of yours.
>>25408395it's not a movement, it's a few mentally ill retards
Religion in general is facing crisis. 1. Because God and Satan are claimed to be 2 different entities, 2 different God's but only God is the real God, this is a literal contradiction and extremely schizophrenic. 2. They cannot account for suffering, suffering is handwaved away by various imaginations, it's just God testing you, it's just a product of free will, don't question it, it's Satan, it's this it's that, none of it makes remotely any sense.These contradictions lead to endless more contradictions and cognitive dissonances.If religion is to survive it must account for these 2 questions, Christianity in particular seems to be the worst at answering these questions, at least institutionally and on the mainstream level. Everything is just explained away with surface level fake feelgood bullshit that is obviously so.
>>25408929You have barely engaged in theology and it shows.
>>25408152Those Churches still very much exist.There are churches where the members are old. Doesn't mean they cant have an impact before God calls them home. But there are others of similar characteristics with younger familiesThere has been an increase in mega churches in my area (they are actually opening new churches in adjacent counties now). Why the growth? I like to think people are wanting to hear the gospel and a larger church seems easier to start going to cause you can get lost in the crowd but I cant confirm that. Regardless, if there are people that know the Lord there, they can accomplish things even if the trappings are different than the smaller churches.
>>25408915Some of whom happen to be in this thread apparently, LMAO
>>25408152>bigoted Matthew 11:8>But what went ye out for to see? A man clothed in soft raiment? behold, they that wear soft clothing are in kings' houses.>>25408943Theology is for the unsaved, to justify their opinions with philosophy.
>>25408395NTA, the use of the Textus Receptus and Masoretic texts is what puts the KJV above other bibles as a faithful translation. A faithful translation into any other language that bases itself upon these can be used similarly. >>25408845Unfortunately, the dad is doing the right thing here, what else could one do?
>>25409190>conflating defense with justification Good luck fighting against the evil that wants to destroy you with that mindset.
>>25409212The bible is enough for me.
>>25408152All Christianity is beyond saving. The religion is false and declining.
>>25409215>thinks the Bible isn't part of theologyOh you're a retard. At least you have God's love.
>>25409218Theology is the dross that arises from a secondhand study of the bible.
>>25409230No, but you're retarded so it's not surprising you'd think that. I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that you're not part of the evil intentionally trying to undermine the work of God's kingdom to defend itself.
>>25408203>no real doctrineI think that is why Pentecostal is taking off in Latin America. The same reason it is still strong in the US. It requires nothing of you but feeling. >>25408152I can't speak for how Protestantism is practiced elsewhere, but spiritually it is dead/dying in America. It has been subsumed by Mega Churches (worship of the pastor) and politics (worship of flavor of the month politician). The worship of Christ is third on the list of priorities for most protestant churches in America.
>>25408241Gnosticism is at least fun. Definitely felt like something invented to help bridge the gap for pagans and to convince people that probably hated the Hebrews that you are worshipping a different God.
>>25408261Maybe, but it also helps that American protestants are dumping a ton of money to convert them away from Catholics.
>>25408152XNITY PRIMERhttp://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1a-9eWjZWH-6uUOcRFJ4hFsgB2vOhdZZfgoogle drive easy to use interface...there are like 33,000 different prot denominations and those are the documented 1s and do not count all the little churches etc
>>25408943Not. An. Argument. This is why you are failing, I'm trying to help you guys here buddy, dogmatic athiesm and anti-religionism has by and large been a disaster.
>>25409277It also ties into the feeling of alienation/loneliness and attempts to escape from it. Mainline Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox churches tend to not be social gathering groups (some Anglican churches are the exception), and most of the social stuff happens outside of the church building and requires you to be actually engaged with the local church community. In non-mainline Protestant groups, social events happen within the church building itself and the collective trance is a powerful tool to bond total nobodies together. You can step into a Pentecostal church and revel in their songs and feel-good sermons, shake off the loneliness, and then go back home.>megachurches and politicsHit the nail on the head. Go ask them how the Trinity works, or what a soul is. Watch them, even the pastor, make vague gestures and speak literal heresy and borrow concepts from fucking Eastern religions to explain. There is no theology, only vibes and tribalism.
>>25409378There is a publication written by and for baptists priests and one of the more common letters they receive is asking for advice on what to do when your congregation really doesn't like the teachings of Christ. A common experience for Baptists is to quote Christ and for members of the congregation to approach the preacher and ask them where they got X from and for the preacher to say "it is a direct quote from Christ in the Bible" and their response being "well we don't like that sort of stuff here". There is also the famous homeless Christ statues that were installed outside well to do protestant churches and the congregation not knowing it was a statue would call the police on it thinking it was some homeless person.
>>25409395>pastors changing theology to suit chudsJesus would have a field day and need several whips for them. Do they forget Jesus was canonically a homeless wanderer in the wilderness for 40 days and nights of fasting? And that He presents himself as the hungry, thirsty and cold homeless man in Revelation when asking what the sinners have done for such people?
>>25408845Jesus himself was a kike are y'all fucking retardedThe whole religion was granted a bit of leeway by the Romans in order to stave off a Jewish revolt anywaysBut y'all are too fervent to give two shits
>>25409340>trying to help>claims Satan is another godYou would know why this is a ridiculous notion if you had any real knowledge on what Christians actually believe.
>>25409678Sounds like some Mason shit
>>25408152>>25408169It's so grim to think that zionism will replace actual Christianity. The Catholic church brought this upon themselves by failing to fight against corruption for a thousand years, but still.
>>25409908>muh based orthodox churchSame Orthodox Church with the zigger leader that can't even keep itself together?
>>25408169I dunno about anyone else but I'm getting >The CIA is behind everything!Marxoid fatigue
>>25408257>gonna die out desuYou are blindly hopeful
>>25409645Thinking European paganism is ever going to revive itself in itself in its original form is wishful thinking.
>>25409378One ive noticed in megachurch environments is they will hiss at you if you ever mention purgatory, so they have that in common.
Jesus didn't rise from the dead and he's never coming back. Just get over it anons, it's over. Christianity isn't true.
>>25409645>The whole religion was granted a bit of leeway by the Romans in order to stave off a Jewish revolt anywaysYou really don't know your history.
>>25410073Deserved imo
>>25409645>I'm just gonna assert things and when you don't take my word for it that means you're beyond reason>>25409908What are you talking about. Zionism isn't a religion. >>25410079Purgatory seems like a reasonable concept. How do imperfect people go straight to heaven, a perfect place? A place where John the Baptist is the least among them?
>>25408395> hey your movement regarding an english language Bible?> its anglocentric!> thats why you have to use our Bible of the month club "translations" by unrepentant sodomites
>>25410073>purgatoryextraBiblical
>>25410107>How do imperfect people go straight to heavenask Jesus Christ why He told the thief on the next cross over that
>>25410128Tbf depends on what books you define as canon
>>25409395What part of the gospel triggers them? All I can think of is "give away your wealth" but that's been an issue for Christians for a long time so it can't be news.
>>25410238the septuagint was the solution to the problem of inability to read hebrew where the common languages were greek and coptic, it was intentionally larger than the Bible. eusebius had the New Testament canon. its actually extremely easy to know what belongs in the Bible from undisputed historical facts
>>25409678The Bible literally says that Satan is the God of the world.The broader point I'm trying to make is, Christians say that God controls everything the devil does, he even created him, ok that's fine, but then you guys say "God can't be blamed for the devil's actions!", this is pure schizophrenia and rejecting responsibility.God and Satan cannot be 2 different entities, this is a dualism that you accuse Gnostics of heresy for. You can't have your cake and eat it, otherwise you become complete hypocrites, which uncoincidentally is a stereotype of Christians, you have to eat the shit sandwich or admit your hypocrisy, otherwise the entire theology your religion is based on is pure bullshit.In fact Gnosticism is becoming so popular because it DOES at least attempt to account for this, God created the demiurge and the demiurge knows not what he does etc etc, whereas the "non-heretical" mainstream Christianity elevates the status of Satan to the point of becoming another entire God himself. Pure nonsense.
After skimming an Epistle from Clement of Rome for a couple minutes, it seems there's no benefit to writings of the church fathers. Every secondary work just seems so empty, error ridden and pointless when compared to the bible. One feels for catholics, lutherans and orthodox Christians, who are blind and cannot understand the bible, as they are unsaved; and must only rely upon such secondary works.
>>25410342'god' not 'God', and making something your god does not give it the power of the Lord. It is said of some that their bellies are their god.
>>25410548Clement of Rome is not a doctor of the Church. Please read Augustine, Jerome, Aquinas, Bellarmine, St. John of the Cross - My personal recommendation.As for the Apostolics, reading Ignatius of Antioch would be more fruitful to you.The Bible has things which are common sense, and things which are not common sense. The things which are not common sense are subject to 2 or more interpretations. We determine which of these interpretations is true using the tradition of the Church. Catholics (and orthodox) believe scripture is infalliable, moreso then you, because most protestants use higher criticism and tear apart verses like John 7:53 as not infalliable, or attack the deuterocanonical books which are not in the protestant bible but are in the Septuagint manuscript text.
none of it is real, why do you retards care?
>>25410342There's a strong distinction between gods as in things people worship and God the one who actually did everything in the bible. Not worshipping false gods and idols is key tenet of Christianity for a reason. I can't help you with your problem of evil shit since you would know why thats complicated if you actually studied what you're criticizing.
>>25410584I don't believe you're real so you don't matter.
>>25410342Satan is the King of this world, who has been given dominion by God to test mankind, so that the weak fall into sin and that the righteous cling unto God for their salvation.Goodness is not a binary. There is not Good and Bad as too distinct things. Goodness is a spectum. God is maximally good. Evil is a degree of seperation from this good whether it be Mortal, Venial or imperfection. Think about how Hot and Cold does not exist, Cold is the ABSENCE of hot. It does not have a positive existence. Evil does not have a positive existence, it is just a subtraction from the maximal good that is God.God has given man free will, which means man has the capacity to do good or evil, and insofar as he does evil he merits hell, but this is rectified by the fact that when man chooses to do good with his free will, he is doing more good than if he was forced to do good.Christian doctrine rejects dualism, so I don't know why you are acting as though we assert it. You seem to be lacking in education. Leo XII said that youthful people tend to make false conclusions due to their lack of knowledge. Humble yourself, learn, and come back.
>>25410582Why are you trying to pretend as if catholics care at all about scripture, when you reject the plainest teachings? >John 3:15>That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.The bible says eternal life, yet catholics think justification can be lost by sin in ones life.>Romans 5:9>Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.The bible says we are justified by Christ's blood, yet catholics think they can earn justification through being baptized, living a clean life, chanting "hail mary". >Romans 6:23 >For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.Again, salvation being an eternal gift, yet catholics think they can earn it or maintain it with works.>deuterocanonical booksYou don't even respect the actual bible, what are you grandstanding about the apocrypha for? Did Aquinas trick you into falling from grace, or was it Jerome? The blind lead the blind into a ditch.
>>25410550>>25410589>>25410601None of you addressed the strongest argument, which is that God and satan are actually the exact same entity, the Bible constantly hints to this fact, but then it is ignored when convenient and said to be simultaneously true and not true whenever it sounds good.This is the critical concept that destroys most of Christianity, you really need to address this instead of explaining it away though mental gymnastics, this is not Monotheism, you have 2 gods.I do understand why accepting this fact is uncomfortable, because then every act of satan can be attributed 100% to God, but this is just true I'm sorry, otherwise you make a nonsense out of your faith.There are ways to account for this, the Gnostics have their way, you could also say that God was forced to create satan by the nature of his being, free will and he's just testing you bro arguments are obviously bullshit though and I can see why such telling of tall tales makes people lose faith. You just have to account for it or Christianity and religion in general is just going to become more isolated, despised and detached from any tangible meaning. The more I think about it the more I just feel like the red devil horned satan god should be just thrown out because the Gnostic account makes alot more sense and is far less cartoonish. Mainline Christianity seems to paint God as a schizophrenic which just seems terrible to me.
>>25410645You should actually read the Bible before making claims about what it says.
>>25410615Fundamentally there are 2 positions on justification.1. Christ died for the electHis grace is so overflowing for his elect, that they cannot lose their salvation. However for those not in the elect they cannot merit their salvation and are damned.2. Christ died for allA. Christ died for all, therefore all are savedB. Christ died for all, but not all are savedChrist died for everyone, and God has extended grace for all men to be saved. Man has a the free will to accept or reject this grace.Parable of the Sower: As for what was sown on rocky ground, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21 yet he has no root in himself, but endures for a while, and when tribulation or persecution arises on account of the word, immediately he falls away.How could man receive the Word and then lose it assuming Christ died for the Elect? that is just a non starter.As for your last part, you cannot earn salvation because you are only responding to God's extended hand.Secondly, man is in a fallen state, and by being in God's grace he can only hope to return to original justice, the state that Adam and Eve were created to be in originally, and so even then he is not meriting anything, he is only restoring himself to where God placed him originally.
>>25410645you did not even respond to these posts, you just reasserted your position. I have to assume you are a troll because if you aren't your heart must be very hardened.
>>25410128Sure, pal
>>25410079In what possible universe?
>>25410654You didn't respond to the argument I just made. Not an argument.>>25410677How about you argue against the strongest argument that I just made instead of false moralizing? I'll respond to any argument you make right now, it's just that 3 people replied to me with about 10 different arguments so I wanted to boil down and simplify the debate to prevent confusion and sophistry.How do you justify satan not just being a puppet or an offshoot of God? The Bible says that God created satan, but is not responsible for him? It is my contention that God and satan are just different parts of the same entity (God). Anything else is strictly not monotheism because there are 2 gods.
>>25410693God created the angels.The devil is a fallen angel.First, the angels are heavenly hosts, they are not God and are in a lower order than him.Yes. God created angels and gave them the capacity to fall from Grace.The reason why God allows creatures to fall from grace is because if a fallen creature returns to God it makes for a greater good than if God created a creature that was good without free will.Satan, is not the king of Heaven. He is the king of Earth.God is the King of Heaven and Earth, and their creator, which is repeated in the psalms.God has dominion over Satan, and triumphed over him, most particularly during the resurrection of Christ, and in the Judgment at the end of the world. The world is going away, and Satan is going to hell for eternity. He has no power. It is only an illusion.
>>25410655Do you really think framing the regular view of Christ's sacrifice being for all the earth in contradiction to a Calvinist one (the elect, which just refers to those who get saved) will be enough to obscure that catholics teach a works salvation?
>>25410737what a bizarre tactic
>>25410693>you didn't respond to my screed that has no Biblical basisYeah. Take a hint.
>>25410721Ok yeah I figured it would immediately devolve into a debate about how God is actually defined because sadly every theological debate inevitably goes that way, I will concede that debate immediately because quite frankly I find it a boring, stupid, facetious, soul sucking waste of time.Just know that, if God is all powerful, all knowing, and all-controlling, then every doing of satan is also a doing of God directly. Free will is totally irrelevant to it because even if you have free will God still controls everything you do, even if only from God's perspective and not yours. This is just common sense and denying it only leads to all kinds of contradictions and hypocrisies.
>>25410743Is the Earth also 6000 years old? Did Moses's staff really turn into a snake? Literalist interpretations of the Bible I find quite shallow and antithetical to true theology, but enjoy your fairy tales and dogmatic memorization of text. Maybe religion is just doomed to be cultish, I don't know.
>>25410767>literalist interpretationNope. I'm just not taking nonsense you pulled out of your ass seriously.
>>25410784>If it's not in the Bible it doesn't exist!Very stupid argument, plenty of things outside of the Bible can be true without being in the Bible, this is silly. Keep your horse blinders on though.
>>25410798Stating a fact isn't an argument.
>>25410737NTA but he does bring a good point with that parable. I was just reading Mathew and thinking that it fits with the orthodox view of salvation. Our works will never be enough for salvation, only to grace we are saved thanks to Jesus sacrifice. But we must strive to follow his will, otherwise how can we claim to love him? As James 18-24 points towards: >But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works. You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect? And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” And he was called the friend of God. You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.
>>25410318Joseph Smith be like
>>25408261Maybe. The rise and spread of Christianity is entirely to do with its ability to assimilate local religious practices.
>>25410737"the regular view"The regular view by your evaluation? The reason it is the regular view is because it is the Catholic view, from which all other denominations are an imperfect reflection. But I am glad we agree on this point.Let's use Plato for an example. Plato is a Pagan, who had no faith, but by reason believed in God. He was not saved. The reason he was not saved was because He did not have faith in Jesus Christ, who by his Crucifixion merited salvation. I do not contest whatsoever that Faith is necessary for salvation. I do contest that someone can claim to have Faith without actually acting upon it. And those who enter the Faith, and act upon it for a little while, can lose their Faith. Your view would have to defer to the calvanist idea that they were never saved to begin with, which is refuted by that parable. Any good work a man does is not by his merit, because it is a response to the initial grace that was given to him by God, when God called him into a relationship with him. It is also by a grace granted by God that he is able to follow him. If God at any moment did not extend his grace, I do not believe that a man could be saved. Mans works are done by God's grace.
>>25410883>A Siberian tribe didn't know about Jesus Christ and the trinity 3000 years ago so they're going to hellThis kind of shit is why religion keeps being taken less and less seriously, very sad to me that anyone could believe this.
>>25410939fundamentally all men deserve to go to hell because all men are evil and sin (as a consequence of the fall from grace) and so no, the siberian tribe is not actually entitled to salvation. Whether or not they were saved is beyond my knowledge though.By making the assertion that all men deserve to be saved you are presuming that men are good (if you even believe in objective goodness, which you probably don't) and is in its very self a lack of humility and an act of pride because you won't acknowledge that you are a sinner.
>>25410883>he was not saved was because He did not have faith in Jesus Christ, What?
>>25410883Plato was born 400 years prior to Jesus...
>>25410986>>25410976"wow just wow" is not an argument
>>25410946>all men deserve to go to hell, and those that by pure fate (which is then controlled by God) manage to hear the gospel have a choice, but the rest don't>whether or not they are saved is beyond my knowledgebest expression of "fuck them, I got mine" I've seen, congrats. At the bottom of Christian love is pure, unfiltered selfishness.
>>25411042>>25411042I don't think your post is accurate. The second line >it is beyond my knowledgeis because it is beyond my knowledge. I can only follow the logical conclusion of the doctrine. As for you, we don't need to worry about Pagans because we already know you reject Christ. I think it would be better for you to repent, but I also believe in justice.
>>25411038Not arguing. Questioning. How does the claim that Plato lacked faith in Christ account for the fact that Plato lived centuries before Christ's incarnation?I am genuinely curious, perhaps I'll learn something.
Every Christian I met in the past 20 years was indistinguishable from gigacucked liberals who celebrate niggers destroying the world
>>25411092That is false because contemporaneous outside sources actually do corroborate the claims lol. Christ is the most documented man in history.
>>25408395>he doesn't know about the Reina-Valera only movement
>>25411103My view would be that the Limbo Patris (Abraham, Isaac, Job, etc. the Jewish prophets of hte old testament) would have been saved at the harrowing of hades.(for context:Christ dies on FridayChrist descends into hell and liberates the limbo patrisChrist rises from the dead on Sunday)As for Pagans, I would not hold that they were saved. Dantes put them into a state of hell called limbo where they felt no pains. There is no official doctrine on where they are, but I personally take the position they were not saved. Particularly when you take into account that Plato along with many greeks molested young boys, which would be a violation of nature law (because men should not have sex with men, and particularly not with boys.)
>>25411163>bro gets all his theological knowledge from one work of biblical fan fiction by some medieval italian mob gangsterbruh the vatican literally disavowed limbo in 2007 google it
>>25411312>bruh the vatican literally disavowed limbo in 2007 google itsaid verbatim >there is no official doctrineand there isn't
>>25411163Hm, interesting, did not know that, Thanks anon. I disagree with labeling Plato and other Greek philosophers as 'pagan' but it was informative. Take care.
>>25411332But they were weren't they?
>>25411332>>25411366Ion by Plato comes to mind, where they have a discussion with a "Rhapsody" who is a wandering poet that recites the Homeric hymns. In this dialogue Socrates claims that the poet is inspired by the Gods rather than using his own knowledge. In other texts, the Illiad, Odyssesy and other greek poets are quoted many times. There is a slight distinction because most of the pagans seemed to be polytheistic, whereas Plato claimed to be monotheistic.
>>25411156>Christ is the most documented man in history.lol
>>25410760>and all-controllingThis is where your argument falls apart.
>>25411399I think you forgot the "ian Weston Chandler", honey
Amazing GraceHow sweet the sound,That saved a wretch like me!I once was lost,But now am found;Was blind, but now I see.'Twas grace that taughtMy heart to fear,And grace my fears relieved;How preciousDid that grace appearThe hour I first believed!Through many dangers,Toils and snares,I have already come;'Tis grace hath broughtMe safe thus far,And grace will lead me home.When we've been thereTen thousand years,Bright shining as the sun,We've no less daysTo sing God's praiseThan when we'd first begun.
Alas! And did my Savior bleedAnd did my Sovereign die?Would He devote that sacred headFor such a worm as I?At the cross, at the crossWhere I first saw the light,And the burden of my heart rolled away,It was there by faith I received my sight,And now I am happy all the day!Was it for crimes that I had doneHe groaned upon the tree?Amazing pity! Grace unknown!And love beyond degree!At the cross, at the crossWhere I first saw the light,And the burden of my heart rolled away,It was there by faith I received my sight,And now I am happy all the day!But drops of grief can ne’er repayThe debt of love I owe:Here, Lord, I give my self away’Tis all that I can do.At the cross, at the crossWhere I first saw the light,And the burden of my heart rolled away,It was there by faith I received my sight,And now I am happy all the day!
On a hill far away stood an old rugged cross,the emblem of suffering and shame;and I love that old cross where the dearest and bestfor a world of lost sinners was slain.Refrain:So I'll cherish the old rugged cross,till my trophies at last I lay down;I will cling to the old rugged cross,and exchange it some day for a crown.O that old rugged cross, so despised by the world,has a wondrous attraction for me;for the dear Lamb of God left his glory aboveto bear it to dark Calvary.In that old rugged cross, stained with blood so divine,a wondrous beauty I see,for 'twas on that old cross Jesus suffered and died,to pardon and sanctify me.To that old rugged cross I will ever be true,its shame and reproach gladly bear;then he'll call me some day to my home far away,where his glory forever I'll share.
>>25408152As someone who has spent most of my life sort of half-and-half split between a "non-denominational" evangelical church and a mainline (but traditional in both liturgy and theology) mainline Episcopal church (which I know attend full time), I'd say that mainline Protestantism is absolutely worth saving. The scripture itself tells us to hold onto tradition, and I've found that the hymns, service, and theology have all deepened my faith compared to the largely shallow but well meaning Bapticostal church of a lot of my youth.I'd say there are at least 3 reasons why mainline Protestantism is dying off with young people compared to Evangelicalism:1. There is a distinct lack of good mainline churches today. Every church that's liberal in theology will always be doomed to irrelevance. If belief in God or the resurrection, traditional social rules, and many other things are not required or vaguely pluralistic or universalist, than why even show up to church or believe in it to begin with? I have witnessed people who grew up in the these churches barely attend or know much about their faith, and often quit or just become vaguely cultural Christians by the time their adults because they never had any reason to believe or stay. The only mainline churches I've seen with truly active members under the age of 60 are all theologically conservative, traditional congregations. Unfortunately, I see these congregations vary in life. An old pastor leaves and the denomination replaces him with a liberal pastor, and the church slowly begins to die. Ironically, I also hear the theological liberals screech about how they are the relevant ones and the traditionalists much change or fail. Talk about the blind leading the blind.2. Although it's improving now in my opinion, I think there seems to have been a lack of dialogue between Evangelicals and mainlines. Many Evangelicals, even those with ties to mainline churches, are sometimes hostile to them for not leaving with them. Many Evangelical people that I've met deride even traditional members of these churches as lesser Christians for some reason (I believe typically random things like allowance of infant baptism and Old-Earth creationism can tick off some of them, even though neither is a test of orthodoxy. The idea of being technically "in communion" with theological liberals can also strike a chord, even if that's not something many of these people can change and probably have strong disagreements with), which can lead to some confusion. Many Evangelicals begin to see traditions like hymn-singing as something for stuck-up "liberals" and many mainlines see something like passing out Bibles as something for "un-traditional" fundamentalist people with little sense of historicity or theology. Many traditional mainlines also tend to be strongly critical or Evangelical theology. I've been glad to see some dialogue in recent years (especially through some parachurch organizations) to help them grow each other.
>>25411938 (contd.)3. Many mainline Protestants are sort of unaware or apathetic of the large decline in my opinion. Many of them are multi-generational in these churches and just assume it will keep getting passed on, which can often lead to cultural Christians and badly catechized kids over time (which often convert to Evangelicalism from what I've seen).The only sort of light in the mainlines for young people seems to be the Redeemed Zoomer/Reconquista movement, which I have very mixed feelings about (although I'm glad to see fellow young mainline Protestants work towards reforming the mainlines). I think the best approach is for traditionalists and Evangelicals themselves who are mainlines should work with Evangelicals and smaller Confessing Protestant denominations to work together and strengthen the good churches in the mainlines. The most important thing right now is to put some conservatives into the mainline leadership so they can start making a real difference.Also it's kind of weird seeing anti-theology posters in the this thread, theology has helped me tremendously and I know some Evangelicals who have recently started getting into it since they are interested in tradition and history (which their church usually doesn't have much of). I hope that this can help either strengthen Evangelical churches or create good mainline churches. I'd highly recommend reading theology.
>>25410835James 2 (verses 17-26) is indeed about being justified in the eyes of our peers.>Show me your faith>Show This becomes immediately obvious when you contrast James 2:10 with the example of Rahab the HARLOT. >For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.In regards to actual salvation though (justification in the eyes of God, instead of merely before men like in James 2), the bible says this. >Romans 4:5 >But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.Faith alone in Christ saves. By adding "But we must strive", you're condemned, in thinking that any amount of your own works could contribute to your salvation, or that Christ's work is somehow insufficient. As Paul said. >Galatians 5:4 >Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.There is no salvation inside the Orthodox church, if their view is that works "must" be combined with faith. Works, if they exist in a Christian's life, are a by-product of their being saved, and not contributory to their salvation at all.
>>25410883>"the regular view">The regular view by your evaluation?It's the view the bible gives.>John 3:16>For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.love the world (everyone in the world)>2 Corinthians 5:15>And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.died for all>1 John 2:2>And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.The whole world.> I do contest that someone can claim to have Faith without actually acting upon it.Romans 4:5 disproves this, since it's already been quoted in the thread, I will refer to an example in the Gospels to reinforce the idea (the whole section is Luke 17:11-19, I will merely post a chunk)>And one of them, when he saw that he was healed, turned back, and with a loud voice glorified God,>And fell down on his face at his feet, giving him thanks: and he was a Samaritan.>And Jesus answering said, Were there not ten cleansed? but where are the nine?>There are not found that returned to give glory to God, save this stranger.Ten were healed, but only one returned to give Glory to God. Likewise, it's practically observable that most saved Christians don't go soulwinning, haven't read the whole bible, don't regularly go to church.>Mans works are done by God's graceThis whole train of thought is perpetuated by slothful, do nothing Calvinists, I hate theology.
>>25411163>(because men should not have sex with men, and particularly not with boys.)Which, regrettably, precludes most of the Christian Clergy.
>>25410068Not in its original form, but I want to believe it will come back in some form. In many ways, we still practice it, just with a cost of christian paint.
>>254111633 Days and 3 Nights
>>25410068It arguably is surviving and thriving at present. It's called Catholicism.
>>25412231This argument is so strange. Paganism and Catholic saint veneration might share superficial similarity if you squint and have no theological literacy, but that's it. Even poorly catechized Catholics know the distinction between dulia and latria and can explain the difference. I'm not sure what the point of the argument is.
>>25412099It is already making a revival in Europe, especially in the Nordics. The vibrant rituals and celebrations of Paganism contrast with the dry, formulaic services of Lutheran or Catholic churches. It is also quite well-posed to tackle the synthesis of religion and history, prehistory, and science in the modern day, unlike Christianity where the religion is centred around Jesus in the first century and must develop post-hoc arguments for the millions of pagans that died without hearing Jesus’ name. Even atheists often identify with the atheistic Satanic church or with forms of paganism and animism, and the left anarchist and Marxist crowd are more sympathetic to animism than the brutal tool of class control that is Christianity.All the traditional and mainline forms of Christianity are rotting, and what’s left are the pagan-like forms of Protestantism where, like another anon mentioned, the focus is on the trances.
Take the Quakerpill
>>25413108Lol. Lmao, even.
>>25413108In Spain, he have a million Saints and Holy Virgins of X, where X is a place, a virtue, or a profession. All these I presume are christianized pagan gods, entities or supernatural spirits, most of which is highly local to a village.These deities have survived christianism and have adapted to it, and I suspect that when christianism goes away, they will remain with us, again in their bare pagan nature as they originally were.
Cathlocuck thread. Stop worshipping statues, cultist.
I think I finally have language for what Christian nationalism actually is: it’s paganism wearing a cross.Not paganism like witches and pentagrams. Paganism like the old kind — the ancient world’s actual default religion. Every tribe had its own god. Moab had Chemosh. Ammon had Milcom. Each one was a local, tribal deity who picked a people, picked a land, and fought for them against everyone else’s god. Jealous. Territorial. Small.That’s not a metaphor for what I’m seeing.
>>25413130Based quakers: bakers.
Catholic niggers literally do this shit on a daily basis and will STILL turn right around and swear that they're AREN'T worshipping graven images.
>>25413534I wonder (((who))) they got the idea from... (metzitzah b'peh)
>>25413534It was somewhat painful to realize Catholics are constantly sinning. Accepting that every Hail Mary is a misguided act of sin is a tough pill to swallow. I choose to believe they'll ultimately be forgiven since most of them do it not knowing they've been deceived.
>>25413731>reciting literal scripture and asking the mother of god to pray for you is a sin!!!The ways of protestoids are mysterious indeed
>>25413882You literally bow to and kiss fucking statues.
>>25413882which part of NO GRAVEN IMAGES do you guys have so much trouble grasping?
>>25413882Praying to anyone but God is a failure to have faith in him. Any prayers to Mary or Saints don't get answered because of intercession but because God listens to even those prayers and forgives their sin.
>>25414350>>25413979>>25413936You guys have never asked someone to pray for you?
>protestants:>after 1400 years of christian worship, achtually we have discovered you were doing it wrong this whole time.>*german prince holding a bag of gold coins in the background*fast forward 600 years>prosperity gospel mega church pastor:>after much deliberation, we have discovered you were doing it wrong the whole time, you should tithe 25%>*jewish prince holding a bag of gold coins in the background*
>>25414450>intentionally conflating to and forCompletely different things.
>>25414453>actually Satan's deception is the real church
>>25414472The complete rosary prayer:>Hail Mary, full of grace>The Lord is with thee>blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb Jesusstraight from scripture>Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us sinners>now and at the hour of our deathLiterally just asking her to pray for you, the same way you might ask your biological mother to pray for you. Where is the problem?
>>25414477You're disingenuously missing the point. A rephrasing would be pointless because you would just pull the same tactic again to waste my time.
>>25414491uh, okay.
>>25410548retarded take. the writings of the saints, whether they be catholic (like the ones the other anon mentioned) or orthodox (silouan the aphonite, isaac the syrian, ignatius bryanchaninov are my favs) are far deeper. more practical, and less schizophrenic than most of the bible. the saints are those who actually walked the path, trying to follow the commandments as well as they could and realizing they could not except via the holy spirit. jesus said, if you love me, keep my commandments. braindead protestants refuse to follow commandments and jewishly treat god in this legalistic way where they just want to be "pardoned" of their "crimes" instead of doing any actual work. protestantism (in its worst forms, i would exclude maybe lutheranism, not as educated about other branches but some of them do actually try) rejects the saints, the Church (with two lungs, orthodox and catholic), the Eucharist (the greatest mystery of Christianity), the commandments, all christian tradition built up over 2000 years. in other words, prots reject Christ, and God. the bible is only part of God's revelation. it is full of pointers to the point, which is the internal life, the life of prayer, fighting one's passions, getting to know God. protestants worship the instruction manual that came with the CD instead of playing the game. like muslims who think the Quran is the *literal* word of God and the final revelation, except muslims pray five times a day and Muhammad was against monasticism because he believed all people should live as monks in devotion to God. prots' devotion to the text is more jewish than anything, even muslims are closer to the truth of God than they are.the thing i like about you protestants is that you tend to not be lukewarm. you really think you are following God by "evangelizing" via spammed copypastas and such. i admire the effort, and i am sure God looks down on you with hope, knowing you have the zeal needed to be a true Christian.
>>25410677I was hardened by you're mother last night
>>25410835that was satan speaking to abraham, god will not ask people for child sacrifices or murder children. the god of the old testament is the vengeful demon Yahweh, not God.
>>25410946perfect example of how harmful protestantism is to modern society. any thinking person will recognize why someone with this mindset should not be allowed to vote.>>25411938this is true. i used to attend a "nondenominational" church, there was no holy spirit there of course, but the attendants and pastors were legitimately very faithful. but due to protestants' lack of a base in church tradition/the saints, a libtard pastor came to said church and made them jewish. very sad. i agree with your points, if these things improve then maybe protestants will get closer to being christian.
>>25414450What does that have to do with bowing in front of and kissing a fucking graven image?
>>25414450No, because you're supposed to pray your own prayers. >Jesus: when ye pray, use not vain repetitions>Catholics: say Hail Mary x1000>Jesus: when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret>Catholics: public prayers in crowds of hundreds>Paul: we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.>Catholics: mass produce prayers from liturgyCatholic prayer is so bullshit
>Praying to the virgin MaryShe can't hear you.
>>25408203>Implying that 90% of people aren't functionally illiterate and don't care about proper theology at all
>>25408221Buddhism is just Gnosticism with an actual religious structure supporting it and millenia-old ethnic traditions.In a future where gnosticism becomes more popular, buddhism will also become stronger.
Protestantism is a fake religion. There is still time for you to return to your senses.
>>25415428You worship graven images motherfucker.
>>25408152all of Christianity is beyond saving, christianity has been conquered by atheism and now is nothing but pot lucks for old womenIslam is the only real religion left and the one with a living culture at the moment and the only one that will be real in 100. I call all Christians who wish for true monotheism and real morals to join Islam. >>25412099It won't the future of Europe is atheists who hate themselves and Muslims and In Sha Allah most Europeans will revert to Islam>>25413694as a former Catholic we don't circumsize at all, baptism replaced it. Even later papal encyclicals like the ones to the Copts at Trent condemned it. Same as Pius XII said it should only be done if its a medical necessity
All the Western churches are. Orthodoxy has a future mainly due to Russia, but the Western churches will wither away into unserious little cultural colleges under the umbrella of an unserious syncretic Western Christianity.
>>25415615>Orthodoxy has a future mainly due to Russiarussia has a tfr rate of almost 1 and a shrinking church attendance rate, all eastern orthodox does.
>>25415615>Orthodoxy has a future mainly due to RussiaRussian Orthodoxy in its relationship with the state is a hideously corrupt husk rolled out as a nationalistic relic a couple times a year in a country which is in rapid social, demographic, and geopolitical decline by every measurable metric.Nothing but love for all my apostolic Christian brethren but this is an idiotic zigger meme.>>25415490>t. Abdullah from BerlinThis is absolute cope. European Muslims all become hoejabis/black american LARPers within a generation and are squatting in shithole ghettoes which are one angry nationalist movement away from being snuffed out of existence. Catholicism has been through far, far worse than what is currently going on in Western Europe, it's not going anywhere.
>>25415678>>t. Abdullah from BerlinNo, more like John from Southern Ontario Canada>European Muslims all become hoejabis/black american LARPersI actually agree and know that mass immigration causes fitna and it's a disaster for Da'wah and that's why I want mass deportations and Da'wah to do better. The fact you cannot comprehend that a White Muslim exists shows that most Western people believe in nothing>Catholicism has been through far, far worse than what is currently going on in Western Europe, it's not going anywherethe Catholic Church is the largest supported of mass immigration and the pope cries for muslim immigrants lmao, he has done more damage to Europe than any Islamic empire could have
>>25415683>The fact you cannot comprehend that a White Muslim exists shows that most Western people believe in nothingI don't comprehend how someone can inherit the full Truth as their birthright along with the full splendour of beauty it has imparted on their culture and 'revert' to schizo ramblings that deny the divinity of Christ, wants to snuff out the sound of music and cover up the beauty of women. Anon, this is an embarrassing and passing phase for a terminally online individual flailing for meaning. You likely have a thriving Catholic church near you, it is never too late to repent and come into the body of Christ and join a two-millennia ongoing epic.>the Catholic Church is the largest supported of mass immigrationRead the actual catechism, it is absolutely not supportive of mass immigration, nor blood and soil retardation. The Popes extend compassion to people that literally drown to death miserably it doesn't endorse policies of mass immigrationThere is a Christian moral obligation to extend basic compassion and i.e. save a drowning migrant right in front of you as an individual, that doesn't extend to policy decisions that only propagate death, social conflict and more illegal migration>t. John from the Maritimes
>>25415718>I don't comprehend how someone can inherit the full Truth as their birthright along with the full splendour of beautyI was Catholic/Oriental Orthodox for 10 years(I flipped between them desu) but looking at Islam it is clear the Quran is the fufillment of the Abrahamic religion and perfected the errors of Christianity.>wants to snuff out the sound of music and cover up the beauty of women.Music is awful and a woman's beauty should be for her Husband of her Mahram men, obviously women should cover up in public and cover their hair and dress modest, even a Christian should accept this, a women's Arwah must be covered.>You likely have a thriving Catholic church near you, it is never too late to repent and come into the body of Christ and join a two-millennia ongoing epic.I did RCIA in 2015 and enjoyed it and met great people, some I still talk too. But the average age is 65+ and its filled with women who hate young men and vitality, I remember a woman asking me if I was interested in dating her daughter and I asked if she is a virgin and she got furious and never talked to me. The churches around me in rural Ontario Canada are filled with Indians they brought in too.>The Popes extend compassion to people that literally drown to death miserably it doesn't endorse policies of mass immigrationBro, its 2026 even after Francis and now Leo you can see the only goal of the Catholic Church is to bring in biomass, even our Imam(who is a White revert too) was wondering why there was so much Filipinos and Indians in our town and it was because of the church>>t. John from the Maritimespic related its me
>>25415728>But the average age is 65+ and its filled with women who hate young men and vitality, I remember a woman asking me if I was interested in dating her daughter and I asked if she is a virgin and she got furious and never talked to me.Jesus Christ anon
>>25415745Yeah as I said it is grim here, and there is nothing wrong with wanting a virgin wife, the family must protect a woman's sexual purity and have ghayrah
>>25415747Don't you think it's rude and intrusive to ask a question like that? What response did you expect? It would be roughly equivalent to asking a guy you just meant how often he masturbates.
>>25415751>Don't you think it's rude and intrusive to ask a question likenot really I knew her for a few years and any man obviously wants to know if his future wife is sexually pure>What response did you expecther to say yes"she is a virgin". A few brothers at my masjid have said they have sisters and cousins who are virgins to me who are interested in marriage, but atm I am not ready as I may be moving towns.>It would be roughly equivalent to asking a guy you just meant how often he masturbatesand men should not as its haram and supports jewish pornography this is not just one case here, its mostly old women that were here that held back or scolded young men for wanting more, most "trad" women too hate healthy male sexuality and their sexual drive. I once said that a wife should obey her husband and was met with hate.
>>25415766You give me the heebiejeebies. I imagine you have the same effect on most women.
>>25415768>You give me the heebiejeebiesfor wanting a virgin wife who dresses modest?> imagine you have the same effect on most women.the brothers at the Mosque think otherwise and I have gone on a few "dates" with their sisters/cousins while they chaperone so we do not engage in Khalwa. Some of the first things they said before I went on a date were that their sister/cousin were devout and virgins and obedient, if you were a christian you should agree with me 100%
