But how do you approach a publisher in the big 2026?
>>25409687You change your fucking story around to fit the needs of the current audience of novel readers, idiot
>>25409691Can I get around this by having a 'disturbed' protagonist?
>>25409687you have an agent.
>>25409735So basically, you pay a guy to forward the e-mail with your script but his name attached so it doesn't get put in the trash folder instantly?
>>25409752Uhh I hope its not so simple but now im thinking you might be right.I was on randomhouse.ca because they published a book i thought was a lot like mine and I found out it was the same as penguin. My book is so close to being uhhh polished so I'm in this boat. We need some non meme answers.
>>25409759It probably helps if the book isn't shit.But based on pulling a random new release from a bookstore shelf, you have to come to the conclusion that it's not the primary factor.That's the first mistake. You look at the competition and think>I can write just as well as (some of) themAnd you can.But that doesn't actually indicate that getting published is easy due to the lack of a quality bar. It indicates that there are other factors at play and just writing something decent is actually insufficient to get published, if you are lacking in other areas.
>>25409687No point if you're not writing rapeslop and use a female pseudonym. Publishers are last century.
>>254096871). Know gatekeeping agent2.) Don't be a white male
>>25409692spbp
>>25409687The first and really only step is to shop around for agents.You don't pay for agents (or publishers for that matter) up front. It's a common scam that everyone warns about yet people still fall for it. Agents are paid as part of the publishing agreement.Agents have connections, but what publishers care about is their role as gatekeepers. There are millions of "prospective writers", but a tiny fraction bother with an agent.That's it. The hard part is writing the manuscript. If you haven't done that yet then put all thought of publishing out of your head entirely, you aren't even close to ready.
>>25409944I regret ending my reply so pithy like, because actually getting an agent is pretty hard. It's essentially like applying for a job with all that entails, and very few agents are accepting new authors. Prepare for dozens or likely hundreds of rejections or blanks.However, in my experience as an unemployed guy I can say that's true of just about every single job right now, so it's not a unique pain of writing anymore
>>25409687You don't. I'm not going to grovel at the feet of kikes and feminists who are going to throw my manuscript out for the grave error of being a white man. I'm not going to pussyfoot around trigger warnings and sensitivity readers just who will comb through the book counting how many black characters there are just so they can come back and tell me "this part sounds accidentally Islamaphobic so you should cut it." I don't need these cowards whose track record is habitually publishing books that sell only 12 copies. The only reason anyone submits to this incestuous industry is because they monopolize shelf space at Walmart and B&N. They have the "I went to the store for Bluey crocs for my 5 year old and found this paperback at the checkout counter" market cornered. Without that, they have nothing.
In all seriousness, would any of the great writers of the latter half of the 20th Century be welcome in modern publishing?Would a modern agent accept Pynchon? Or McCarthy? Or Philip Roth? Or DeLillo? It feels like the industry genuinely isn't interested in books like that, in writers like that, any more.
>>25409692>>25409687>I don’t write for niggers>the big 2026that's odd because you sure as fuck write like one
>>25410050just read those books then. this is what i don't get about this "woe is me, i'm just a poor victim for being a white guy...there's nothing for me to enjoy!" you have, i don't know, a couple of thousand years worth of shit to consume. why not do that? you can spend the whole rest of your life doing that and still miss most of it.
>>25409944Getting an agent is a hell of a lot harder than writing the manuscript. It's like a hellish combination of online job applications and dating apps where you're trying to prove your professional and personal worth to countless strangers who won't even bother reading your submittal.
>>25410101This. It's easier to market a self published book yourself, rather than find an agent who will find a publisher who will force you to market yourself anyway.
You dont, just self publish. Fuck publishers
>>25410111>>25410113Whether you're promoting a self-published book or promoting yourself to agents, it takes a lot of work either way and requires totally different skills from actually writing a book (which is why agents and traditional publishers are helpful, in theory).
>>25410071>just accept being oppressed!
>>25410071But what if I'm a straight white male writer, and I aspire to be published? What if I want to write books like Suttree or Gravity's Rainbow or Underworld, and get them published? What then? Am I just fucked?
>>25410180>Am I just fucked?Absolutely
>>25410180>What if I want to write books like Suttree or Gravity's Rainbow or Underworld, and get them published?Then you better make it good. The fact that you want your book to be so explicitly modeled after other books is a bad sign though.
This board worries about publishers before actually writing their book
>>25410274this you gotta start with a logo
>>25409687am i the only one who sees evil in her smile
>>25410274This board is filled with people who want to write for some emotional reason, for example, few want to write nonfiction. The profit motive really messes up the average person's creative expression. You start wrestling with if you're trying to write to make money. You sense its influence on your writing. You doubt if you're writing something authentic or something you think you're compromising for imagined market trends and reader interest.The publisher is the personified gatekeeper. They are the ones who would pay you. People mentally panic over how to please the publisher, because on some level, they have a desire - or a fantasy - to make money with what they wrote and invested a lot of emotion into.That's why you gotta write with zero expectation of getting published or making money. You can still try to make those things happen. But it's better to do your book right than to do it wrong and fail anyways. Don't sell out in your writing before you even get the first check is what I mean.Worry about the publisher after you finish your book. You just need to have put in mechanical work at that point to correct as much punctuation, spacing, etc. as you can.
>>25409691No thanks, I don’t write for niggers and women.
>>25409687I read a ton of self-published books but most of them are nonfiction for some very specific hobby or technical tool.
>>25410273>it's BAD if you want your own writing to approach the levels of greatness that past writers have achieved
>>25410335I mean, hardly anyone reads those books Publishers don't care if you're a genius, they want to sell shit.
>>25410071>good stuff exists already so why shouldn't the future just be all shit?Interesting perspective, though I don't really approve of it.
>>25410335Someone describing their future art by comparing it to other artists is the sign of an amateur or someone very untalented.Aspire to greatness, write whatever is in your heart or mind, but whether you achieve it or are comparable to others is out of your control and may not even be decided on until you're dead
>>25410614>Someone describing their future art by comparing it to other artists is the sign of an amateur or someone very untalented.Wow. So Dante was just an untalented amateur when he compared himself to Virgil? Every single writer to ever write as part of a tradition has been an untalented amateur and only you alone have understood this absolute ironclad rule that no one in the history of mankind has ever thought to be of any value?Jesus Christ you're functionally illiterate if you're this ignorant
>>25410647Anon, you are not Dante, or Virgil, or McCarthy or Pynchon or whatever. You're arguing with strangers on a Manchurian moving picture forum when you should be writing your genius masterwork.
>>25410660>completely evading the issueWill you for even a moment consider that maybe you were wrong? Can you do that? Can you reflect on the utter stupidity of your statement and maybe adjust your attitude toward influence accordingly?No, you can't do that. Your ego is too strong to allow for any acknowledgement of being mistaken in anything.These great writers all had no trouble naming their influences and singing the praises of those who came before, yet you alone of all mankind think you have everything figured out, that you are the TRUE ORIGINAL who spawns your works ex nihilo.The sheer hubris of this is staggering.
can someone explain to me like i'm retarded why a publisher is needed.
>>25410724Because the publisher makes money from your books, surely you wouldn't let the poor little publisher's children starve! Have a heart!
>>25410335There's a difference between naming your influences and wanting your book to be "like" them. You have to cultivate what your own special ingredient is. You should be ready to say how your book is not like those books too.
>>25410724If you are writing literary fiction and self-publish, no one will read it. If you're writing slop then you can self-publish if you put in the work of marketing.
>>25410050Penguin-Random House literally refuses all White male submissions. So no.
>>25410866it's a good thing then there's no such thing as race or gender and that they're only social constructs
>>25410660>You're arguing with strangers on a Manchurian moving picture forumYou guys really think you're cute and quirky with this meme don't you
>>25409687Holy fuck, look at her pupils. The ring light reflected looks like a second demonic set of eyes, pure silver malignant silver.
How come chuds and the Right don't just try and destroy the major publishing houses?They won't publish straight white males, or anyone with conservative politics? Well, fine, then why don't those sorts of people try to take them out? File frivlious lawsuits against them, use legal wrangling and the power of the state, target their editors and executives for harassment. Penguin, Random House, Scholastic, Harper-Collins, if they're absolutely not going to publish straight white males, why don't straight white males try to eliminate them? Bankrupt them, jail their editors, that sort of thing.If it's a war then it's a war, why not fight it like one? They are, why don't you?
>>25409687Just straight up post your shit to Amazon kindle, and run ad campaigns from there. If your book and the price are good, you will have sales. If you have sales, you can use that as a leverage to convince publishers to work with you
>>25409691>>25409981>>25410050>>25410135>>25410335>Current audience of novel readers predominantly considered to be liberal women aged 16-50>Look inside>They're the only demo being catered to>Too few mainline publications of science-fiction, adventure, or fantasy in the last 5-10 years apart from well-known authors like Sanderson or Abercrombie>Par at best, progressive mediocrity at worst>Every online store has an algorithm that specifically favors what is already selling, rather than promoting anything new and attempting to harness the untapped markets>Every bookstore from Honolulu to Vienna is filled with row after row of cheap, tumblr lemon fiction for repressed college-aged feminists>Actual, non-pornographic fiction - both literary and genre - are relegated to the back of the store on a single shelf, and its primarily seminal works like Tolkien and PKD>No new lineup of young male authors>Nothing new for young male readers>Young male diehards who grew up reading Narnia and Dragonriders ultimately look backwards to the past, and go to used bookstores to find what their dads and older brothers used to read>The rest of the young male population continues to play Fortnite and COD: Warzone after streaming the Beast Games on Netflix and jerking off into a tissue>The publication industry continues to bleed out>Nothing of value is produced>All potential for value is lost>I reread Shadow of the Torturer for the fifth time
>>25411378because rich right wingers don't really care about literature, there's a few wealthy liberals that are happy to burn money on literature, but people like musk or whoever would get no credit or chud points for funding the publishing of literature by/for right wing men. Or at the very least, something for straight, young, men who want something semi-serious to read that isn't just straight YA.No one's interested in funding that, not even wealthy right wingers. Why is that?
>>25411459All of the hyper-wealthy, would-be right wing donors are preoccupied with technology, space, and AI atm. They couldn't give a shit about the culture war so long as it doesn't jeopardize their own autistic personal projects. Wealth forces people into an echo chamber, and each wealthy group has its own. Silicon valley has their heads in the clouds (their own asses), thinking they're manifesting an Arthur C. Clarke novel. The reality is that they're living in Cyberpunk 2020 and The Camp of the Saints.
>>25411465And none of them read. Rich liberals still like to read, and they want to throw bread crumbs to support the industry. I very seriously doubt someone like Musk has read a modern, literary fiction novel for a long time, alongside any of the other techbro billionaires.
>>25410135It's your turn now. Hope this helps!
>>25411200I don't think I ever seen a face where no one feature looks misshapen individually but her face in its entirety looks so horrifying.>>25411378>>25411459>>25411465>>25411526Did you...did you just seriously pretend to have a conversation with yourself?
>>25411378Why do people like you act as though only right wing chuds can or should be outraged by blatant racism against White people?
>>25411378Any conservative worth reading will do just fine with blogposts or going on a podcast and using monosyllabic words to basically convince Joe Rogan to bulldoze the Cathedral, chuds are inherently hierarchical, they get some meathead to argue either for or against H1Bs for them. The real problem is a lack of conservative literature, which I think ultimately comes down to modern conservatives basically needing to read Ralph Waldo Emerson. When you start venerating the canon, it's super easy to think, "what do I, random chud in Wyoming, have to contribute to literature?" Conservatives are too impressed by institutions and canons and all of this garbage, while liberals are held captive to consensus and lowest common denominator publicity.
>>25411648They're probably a progressive woman, in which case they are literally economically and ideologically benefitting from your exclusion in the humanities. In that case, it's nothing personal, they have every reason to argue in bad faith and mock you when you call them out on it like it's not the point. That, or they're a retard, because what kind of moron fits the demographic of /lit/ but also cheers on the wholesale exclusion of men in publishing?
>>25410071Because every age is different and we need men of genius to rise up to define and analyse our own era. It's great reading books of the past but you're peeping into a different culture which makes you an outsider by default.
>>25409687why would you>watch this one bitch on youtube>most things sound reasonable>suddenly she goes: dont be out of touch, dont put an old wise man character, put a young wise girl in your story instead
>>25409735my fbi agent
>>25409691KEK
>>25409687Do:>be black>be gay>be a feminist>be a woman>be transgenderDo not:>be white>be male>be Christian>be straightIt's that simple really
>>25410135you already are, you're just whining about it online like some fat 16 year old femcel
>>25411459>>25411715You people are lacking in creativity and ambition and aren't fully grasping that Anon's point. He means just straight up trying to get companies like Penguin-Random House or Scholastic shut down. Shuttered. Bankrupt.And why not? You could probably pull it off with a coordinated campaign of legal actions and targeted harassment. The legacy publishing industry, by all accounts, is on thin ice. Most new writers don't sell; we learned that with those leaks a few years ago. Most of the big houses are barely skating by on a combination of legacy writers from decades ago (ironically, lots of white men) and nonfiction book deals from celebrities.It probably wouldn't be as hard as people think to just take them out.
>>25413122“take them out”? what does this mean? by your own description the market is already slowly taking them out
>>25413289They're being kept afloat because nobody puts pressure on them right now. So put pressure on them, legal and financial.
>>25409687The traditional book publishing industry has been completely infiltrated and subverted by unhappy feminist women. They are culturally marxist in nature.In order to get a publisher you have to get a literary agent. The literary agents don't hire based on the book, but on the race, gender, sexual orientation of the author. If you are a straight white young man you almost have no chance.The book that get published are mostly talentless garbage with good vs evil (black and white morality), something that a child would write.Then the money-men at the publishers see that these books are selling in the shops (because they are the only books published and available in book shops) and claim that "this is what the market wants". This creates a negative doomloop causing modern literature to get increasingly worse.It all started when the unhappy feminist took over the literary agencies.The best way to find god new literature is to find young white men who self publish. This is hard because the book publishers have a monopoly on access to reviews, press releases, bookshops etc.Eventually traditional publishing will collapse under the weight of it's own bad writing compared to Independent publishing
>>25411433Based and truth pilled.
>>25414509ok if there's a market opportunity why isnt there a publisher that publishes young white men who would sell out bookstores?
>>25414509If I write about being bisexual can I still get my foot in the door of this system or is that not enough to counteract being a white guy?
You write a book about a young male author trying to get published in the actual environment that exists nowadays. Shine a big spotlight on all the things that actually happen when you try that. Immediately get noticed because it's not only correct but allows an entire half of the population to feel like oppressed victims (which I'm not saying they aren't, sometimes.)
>>25410660>Anon, you are not Dante, or Virgil, or McCarthy or Pynchon or whateverMaybe he is. How would we ever know? Even less people are likely to figure that out because he can't get his foot in the door. This is the problem. If you do le roles le reversed you see what is actually happening very clearly:>>25409691>Listen babe, no one wants to read some doll's prattle. You've got to write for the market, which is white men.>>25409944>You can't make it on your own! It's just not an environment for you. What you need is a white male who knows what he's doing, then they'll listen to you.>>25410071>Can't you just go re-read Jane Austen or something? The upper ceiling of what a woman can achieve has already been done.>>25410273>It's not prejudice. If you were good enough you'd be getting published. What bias? Quit being hysterical.
>>25414709but have you tried to get published? how do the white men that arent old established authors get published? or are there zero?
>>25414690This will just be Pierre by Melville but racist and misogynistic. But now I think about it, that sounds like it would be good.>>25414709TRVKE
>>25414680Why indeed?
>>25414684It will increase your odds but only if your books is written through the lens of cultural marxist ideology
>>25414680For the same reason Hollywood pushes the agenda. And Universities.The first step was convincing Christendom to abandon God and rebrand as Western Civilization. Only then would you be forced to rationalize obvious evil through the narrow prism of Newtonian physics and our 5 senses. Because then you would be no longer be allowed to claim that a supernatural force of evil exists for its own sake, even when its plain as day. An act being obviously evil is no longer proof that it is evil, you have to make the case for a material/economic advantage to the act, otherwise the post-modernists will dismiss it.
