a thread for the discussion of Traditionalism and Traditionalist works of Guenon, Evola, and Dugin>Question of the thread:How should a Traditionalist criticise America? Is the United States to Modernity what the Soviet Union was to Communism?
How many of these guys actually believe in God, or some Supreme Power otherwise?Don't come back to me with a so-called Traditionalist that doesn't believe in God or something like Him. What are you even doing? You'd be a shame to both Pagans and Christians.
>>25465718An freemasonic islamist, a jeetologist and a chaos magic gnostic walk into a bar
>Traditionalist>larping pseudopagan magiciansThere's only one Tradition that's worth the name.
>traditional>none of the three men in OP's pic were born before the 19th century
>>25465809christianity is an innovation on dionysus worship and jewish religion
>>25465702>A bunch of loaded questions
>>25465803Gottem
>>25465702Are you fucking retarded? Jewgin's (((eurasianism))) has nothing to do with the perennial school of thought whatsoever.Goddamn low IQ jeets/zoomers on this site I swear lol
>>25465702Traditionalism is just Advaita supremacy. All "traditions" are merely an advertisement for Advaita Vedanta, which is the Hindu plagiarism of Buddhism.Most kids getting into traditionalism don't understand this and think traditionalism is merely a type of reactionary politics. That's partly because Guenon is very cryptic about his beliefs and tries to leave it to the very end that all he really cares about is Advaita and ways he can fit other religions into Advaita. If traditionalists were upfront and said, "Look, Advaita is the best, and it's nearly identical to Buddhism, in fact the guy who made Advaita plagiarized Buddhist texts" probably no one would care about it.So if you're just getting into traditionalism, ask yourself if you like Buddhism, and if you think all religions lead to Buddhism, and if you think belief in Buddhism is what would correctly structure a society and if straying from Buddhism is what causes degeneracy. This is essentially what traditionalism/perennialism teaches. Guenon is more contemplative and passive Buddhist, Evola thinks you can be a warrior Buddhist.
>>25465975I am against Guénon's Advaita supremacy and I recognize it as a problem in his thought, yet I am also against his absolute perennialism and I recognize that as a problem as well. Some people who have a deep dislike and even repulsion of Guénon are offended by the first, some by the later and others by both. Now, if we would assume that we are christians, why would we think that the medievals using pagan philosophy and metaphysics was appropiate but us today using Guénon's writings isn't? The medievals didn't have to agree with the often non-dual pre-socratic and neoplatonist philosophy or the worship paid by the pagans to their deities, in order to acknowledge that their writings are valuable, yet for some reason it is problematic if we find value in the metaphysics and symbolism formulated by Guénon. This is simply inconsistent with basic logic and an emotional reaction of someone who is obviously offended by Guénon. Your personal trauma and paranoia of nihilism is not our problem.
>>25465809>not posting the current popeWonder why!
Faulkner said all you need to know about modernity buddy
>>25465702>Is the United States to Modernity what the Soviet Union was to Communism?No, since modernity significantly predated the US, although the US embodies many of the worse aspects of it. At the same time, some of the constitutional rights of the US allow more traditional minded people to live in communities and lifestyles as they see fit which would not be permitted in some of the more intrusive nanny states in Europe. It's a mixed bag, certainly not entirely bad, probably more bad than good though.>>25465718>How many of these guys actually believe in God, or some Supreme Power otherwise?Basically all of them. Outright atheism is completely incompatible with the Traditionalist school. Some Traditionalist Buddhists might believe that God is just a flawed understanding of Dharmakaya or whatever though. There is a reason there are not Theravada Buddhist Traditionalist school members, namely it's mostly only reconcilable with certain schools of Buddhism that adopt a more mystic higher power/principle view of the Absolute.>>25466104lol>>25465917He does have writings focusing mainly on religion/metaphysics, but he is just known more for his political/geopolitical thought. >>25465975What is it about Advaita that makes people like you act like such insufferable faggots who constantly seethe about Advaita every chance you get? Did Shankara beat you up and make you cry in a dream?>Traditionalism is just Advaita supremacy. No, Guenon says that all traditions are adaptations of a supra-formal truth to various forms, including Advaita. He just happens to say Advaita is extremely accurate and one of the most precise formulations. He explicitly says why he takes Advaita as the basis of his metaphysical exposition, not because it is "superior" but rather it doesn't have the contentious relation with the west that Islam does (which may cloud people's emotions), but at the same time it's not so alien as far-eastern thought and it still follows classical logic as does most Indian philosophy.>which is the Hindu plagiarism of Buddhism.No, it's based on the Upanishads, and unlike many other Hindu schools it sticks exclusively to the Upanishads without mixing their exegesis up with later Pancharatra and Tantric scriptures, it's an "Upanishad purist" school.
>>25465702pbuh
you’re all a bunch of cocksucking homos.
>>25466145>Traditionalist>AI generationYou don't even realize how vapid all your beliefs are to yourself
>>25465702>Is the United States to Modernity what the Soviet Union was to Communism?What an idiotic premise. Goonman and Eviloa are shit traditionalists. Some traditions are worth regaining, their's are NOT. They are, to my reasoning, mid-modernists working to keep people from realizing their ACTUAL traditional roots.There seems to me a reason why the secret societies help to promote conservative LARPers and occult woowoo shit, but at the same time try to discourage so-called paganist inclinations
>>25466250>NNNOOOO you arn't allowed to use technology to make a joke meme image if you agree with Guenondon't make me laugh retard
>>25466145>No, since modernity significantly predated the USDoes it?>At the same time, some of the constitutional rights of the US allow more traditional minded people to live in communities and lifestylesAn, okay, I get it. You’re an American pseudThe truth is this concept of “rights” itself is inherently modern and animalistic. So you basically just debunked yourself right there without knowing.Plus, your argument makes no sense. If anything, the American constitution encourages modernist mass individualism and cultural atomisation. You don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about so shut up.>some of the more intrusive nanny states in Europe.1. Europe has been culturally colonized by the United States2. As a European, I can say for a fact that we are more traditional than Americans. Americans worship the future and constantly deride us for our past.
>>25466269Kill yourself midwit. You’re just mad your shithole is the quintessential modern state lmfao
>>25466748>Does it?Yes, the Traditionalist School regards modernity as gradually emerging during the late medieval era and renaissance, this is stated in their books which you should know if you read any of them.>The truth is this concept of “rights” itself is inherently modern and animalistic. So you basically just debunked yourself right there without knowing.So? That doesn't negate the fact that for practical purposes, one can live a more traditional lifestyle in the US than in certain European countries. These rights effectively prevent the government in some US states from forcing people to conform to a completely modern, degenerate and anti-traditional lifestyle like how certain European governments try to force their citizens to conform. You must have an incredibly naive and simplistic understanding of the Traditionalist school if you think agreeing with them means that one has to necessarily be opposed to people being granted rights and protections by their governments as a matter of principle, there are countless cases of specific rites and protections being granted in pre-modern traditional societies.
>>25465890>christianity is an innovation on dionysus worshipNTAElaborate on this please
>>25466789Read up on Orphism if you feel like digging into this yourself. Basically, the cult of Dionysus Eleutherios (Liberator) was developed in Orphism to be essentially an affirmation of the suffering, death, and resurrection of the divine son, and the resurrection of all men into a future of reward and punishment. Dionysus was slain by the Titans, who were believed to be the ancestors of man, and so humanity was tainted by an original sin, the punishment for which being that the soul is imprisoned in the body (a tomb). Yet, since the Titans consumed Dionsyus, every man has a spark of his divinity within himself. The Orphists would slay a bull and eat its flesh raw as a symbol of Dionysus as a celebration of his Dionysus' passion (cf. 1 Cor. 11:25). After death, they believed that the soul went down to Hades to face judgement, yaddah yaddah. You can pretty much fill in the rest, even up to the point where Dionysus turns water into wine. This is where Greek asceticism really took off. Plato writes about them in the Republic. His dislike for them is interesting, though, since he tacitly accepts their dualism (mind good, body bad). Not that he'd have to subscribe to all of their ideas, but it's still interesting.>Mendicant prophets go to rich men’s doors and persuade them that they have a power committed to them of making atonement for their sins or those of their fathers by sacrifices or charms. . . . And they produce a host of books written by Musaeus and Orpheus . . . according to which they perform their ritual, and persuade not only individuals but whole cities that expiations and atonements may be made by sacrifices and ceremonies which fill a vacant hour, and are equally at the service of the living and the dead. The latter they call mysteries, and these redeem us from the Pains of Hell; but if we neglect them no one knows what awaits us.During the Hellenistic age it wasn't uncommon to see Jews dress like Greeks and take part in the Bacchanalia. They were influenced there as they were everywhere else they ended up. It's just that some leaned more toward a syncretism with pagan myths, and others toward adopting Platonism, or rather Heracliteanism The culmination of those to main currents of influence was Christianity.
>>25466866I meant 1 Cor. 11:24-25
>>25466866Very interesting, thank you for the effortpost
>>25465702>How should a Traditionalist criticise America?America and modernism are inseparable in the same way that America and traditionalism are parallel to each other. A nation founded on the principles of the French revolution and Enlightenment values may never have any claim to any sort of tradition without charity that one may trace freemasonry back to Babylon. All of its principles then are based not years of strife and development but rather on arbitrary (in a certain way) values decided by less that well-intending people.America itself, like modernism, is the fulfillment of Illuministic principles and they are all inalienable from each other. America can cling to no ethics, save for vague Protestant morality- which most people, never mind now, but even at its inception couldn't clearly define, let alone decisively agree on. By design, however, we all know, America was never meant to have an arbiter of Truth and morals. The god in which they trust as declared on their dollar is intentionally never made distinct, as per freemasonry- as such, he can make right anything that the ruling class decides to declare so.As some other anon pointed out, all of this is true for Europe as well, due to our being a cultural colony of America- with the caveat that we are all colonies of the Freemason.Ultimately, then, I'd say, you can't have claim to tradition in any state subscribed to Enlightenment model of democracy and liberalism/libertarianism. Tradition in the West died with the last Monarchy.
>>25466749>Yes, the Traditionalist School regards modernity as gradually emerging during the late medieval era and renaissanceAspects of it existed in those eras but they weren’t wholly uniform or universal. Refer to Evola’s quote.>So? That doesn't negate the fact that for practical purposes, one can live a more traditional lifestyle in the US than in certain European countries.This is absolutely fucking retarded and you know it. When your own country literally created Wall Street, Pornography, Hollywood, etc. how the fuck are you going to tell me with a straight face that you can live a “traditionalist” life in the most Modern polity in the world. > These rights effectively prevent The burden of the proof lies on you to prove that’s the case, because it simply isn’t. You can’t “suppress” modernity with modernity>the government in some US states from forcing people to conform to a completely modern, degenerate and anti-traditional lifestyleThrough a constitution that is completely modern, degenerate, and anti-traditional? I understand this is hard to comprehend, but every single facet of your political and institutional system is anti-traditional, modern, and degenerate. >like how certain European governments try to force their citizens to conform.Unlike America where freedom is in the negative form, which is inherently degenerate, selfish and satanic as it focuses on the individual and not the public good, in Europe freedom is positive. Freedom to live a healthy life, freedom to participate in your community, etc. Which is inherently much more Traditional and collective than the American conception of “freedom”.Now I’m not saying Europe is traditional, because it isn’t. America exported its model of cultural liberation and mass migration after 1945, and I say this as an anti-fascist.>You must have an incredibly naive and simplistic understanding of the Traditionalist school if you think agreeing with them means that one has to necessarily be opposed to people being granted rights and protections by their governments Textbook example of projection right there. YOU must be incredibly naive and ignorant if you think that a Traditionalist would support the American conception of rights at all. Unlike say, Communism where you must read Lenin to understand what to do, Traditionalists instead base their politics and opinions on history itself. So, go read about the history of humanity.>there are countless cases of specific rites and protections being granted in pre-modern traditional societies.Sure, “rights” and protections have always existed, but they were always secondary and an afterthought compared to obligations and concepts like the noblesse obligehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noblesse_obligeWhich is central to TraditionalismAmericans trying to understand pre-modern societies is so cute. Unfortunately your wicked constitution has completely reshaped your conception of tradition, for the worse.
>>25466928Mean to reply to you>>25466778
>>25466789It is the same sort of Carlin Reddit critique of Christianity which has been dealt away with 10 years ago- unfortunately, because the advent of search engines should have done the job decades prior. Feel free to look up any thing what seems strange to you in picrel and do remember to apply the same scrutiny to >>25466866 benefiting now as well from LLMs. As for him..It's yet another dishonest and frankly childish attempt at drawing parallels to scream fraud. You merely have to look at the designation "the divine son"- within the first line- to reject the argument. As though not all goods in Greek myth were divine sons... Shall we name also all of the ones who descended into Hades and returned? Heracles defeated Thanatos- Christ trampling on death presumably also plagiarizes that myth?>Dionysus was slain by the Titans (...) and so humanity was tainted by an original sinAnon here is only vaguely, as you'd expect from snakes, comparing Christ's being slain by humans as per prophecy to the fate of Dionysus. Of course, we all know, the "original sin" as conceived in Christianity has nothing to do with any killing (lest we charitably count the fall from Grace as the same type of death).>since the Titans consumed Dionsyus, every man has a spark of his divinity within himselfI'm not even sure whether anon now compares the spark of divinity within humans from a Christian perspective to that of the cult he's referencing. The knowledge of good and evil is not spark of Divinity, rather we would posses (something akin to that) through being made by God through the Son in the Holy Spirit. >soul went down to Hades to face judgement, yaddah yaddahAgain, anon vaguely brings up judgement to, I suppose, compare descent into Hades to.. purgatory? Who knows. Like in any other case, he's using terms which are (obviously) met in multiple religions to attempt to show similarities even if the notions themselves are hardly similar. >Dionysus turns water into wineAgain, is the symbology the same in those cases? Christ's first miracle, is it meant convey the thing that Dionysus' turning does? Is it done in an at least relatively similar concept that we might draw parallels and accuse of plagiarism? >eat raw fleshYes, sacrifice was only found in ancient Greece and any other instance of it has to be plagiarism.
>>25465702Glad dugins daughter got blown up >>25465809The pope is a literal gay mexican and the church says all religions lead to heaven
>>25466932I'll admit that calling Christianity an innovation on dionysus worship and jewish religion was somewhat reductive (what I think is better explained in the last paragraph of my post), but I didn't intend on it being anything more than a shitpost until that anon asked me to elaborate. In sum, your religion isn't special, but it's not like it has to be for you to follow it. You can recognize that early Christianity didn't exist in a vacuum without throwing a tantrum. Does the fact that Paul quoted Greek literature send you spiralling? I'm sure it doesn't.
>>25466990>the church says all religions lead to heavenMuslims get sent straight to the front of the line, thoughever.https://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html>But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst these there are the Muslims, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind.
>>25466928Your whole post is just a bunch of strawman and confusion. I already acknowledged to begin with that America contains more bad than good, and I never once implied that Traditionalists should support America on principle, but the same issues which make America back are not largely present in every western country and are not exclusively found in America, but many American states allow religious communities to form their own communities unmolested by state and federal governments, to own guns for protection of themselves, homeschool and raise their children as their see fit (e.g. the Amish etc), whereas this is basically impossible in some European countries. >if you think that a Traditionalist would support the American conception of rights at all.I never said that you mouth-breading retard, work on your reading comprehension, I said that the restrictions that the law places on the governments ability to interfere with communities prevents them from stopping people from forming more traditional communities while European governments usually have more power to intervene and break it up.
>>25467036*which make America bad are now largely present
>Most glorious of immortals, Zeus>The many named, almighty evermore,>Nature’s great Sovereign, ruling all by law>Hail to thee! On thee ’tis meet and right>That mortals everywhere should call.>From thee was our begetting; ours alone>Of all that live and move upon the earth>The lot to bear God’s likeness.>Thee will I ever chant, thy power praise!>For thee this whole vast cosmos, wheeling round>The earth, obeys, and where thou leadest>It follows, ruled willingly by thee.>In thy unconquerable hands thou holdest fast,>Ready prepared, that two-timed flaming blast,>The ever-living thunderbolt:>Nature’s own stroke brings all things to their end.>By it thou guidest aright the sense instinct>Which spreads through all things, mingled even>With stars in heaven, the great and small —>Thou who art King supreme for evermore!>Naught upon earth is wrought in thy despite, O God.>Nor in the ethereal sphere aloft which ever winds>About its pole, nor in the sea — save only what>The wicked work, in their strange madness,>Yet even so, thou knowest to make the crooked straight.>Prune all excess, give order to the orderless,>For unto thee the unloved still is lovely–>And thus in one all things are harmonized,>The evil with the good, that so one Word>Should be in all things everlastingly.>One Word–which evermore the wicked flee!>Ill-fated, hungering to possess the good>They have no vision of God’s universal law,>Nor will they hear, though if obedient in mind>They might obtain a noble life, true wealth.>Instead they rush unthinking after ill:>Some with a shameless zeal for fame,>Others pursuing gain, disorderly;>Still others folly, or pleasures of the flesh.>[But evils are their lot] and other times>Bring other harvests, all unsought–>For all their great desire, its opposite!>But, Zeus, thou giver of every gift,>Who dwellest within the dark clouds, wielding still>The flashing stroke of lightning, save, we pray,>Thy children from this boundless misery.>Scatter, O Father, the darkness from their souls,>Grant them to find true understanding>On which relying thou justly rulest all—>While we, thus honoured, in turn will honour thee,>Hymning thy works forever, as is meet>For mortals while no greater right>Belongs even to the gods than evermore>Justly to praise the universal law!
>>25467031I'd rope if I was catholic.
>>25467031this is based thou, imagine not wanting all to make it to heaven
>>25467054True. Whats the point of Christianity if I can rape and skip the line?
>>25467054If I were a Christian, I'd find it extremely insulting to Jesus to imply that he is not, in fact, the Way, the Truth, and the Life. Does "professing to hold the faith of Abraham" get you a free ticket to the Father? Jesus said nobody came to the Father except through him. Their adherence to the faith of Abraham means nothing since it doesn't admit Jesus in his proper place at the right hand of God as man and God. The same paragraph goes on to spit in the face of Paul, who said that "the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.">Nor is God far distant from those who in shadows and images seek the unknown God, for it is He who gives to all men life and breath and all things, and as Saviour wills that all men be saved. Those also can attain to salvation who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, yet sincerely seek God and moved by grace strive by their deeds to do His will as it is known to them through the dictates of conscience. How could the Christian God be anything but infinitely distant from unbelievers? The divine doesn't touch upon sin; it isn't even comprehensibly removed. In Eph. 4:18 the word used is "alienated". In John 3:36, we read that the wrath of God abideth on him that doesn't believe in the Son. Only by stretching the letter of the Bible can you reach the conclusion that God could be in any way near an unrepentant, unbaptised, unbelieving sinner. His mercy doesn't convey a touch upon their nature, neither does His hand draw near them, but Jesus (and only Jesus) breaks down the middle wall of partition between us. Jesus' sacrifice is turned into a joke by Christians. What need had God of sending his son to suffer on the cross for our sins if the deeds of men alone were sufficient for salvation? This contradicts their own doctrine. Where is the original sin in this? Even if the rest of the document were sound, this would be enough to dismiss the RCC, at least, as ridiculous. Not Abraham, not Job, not Noah, not Moses; not a single man apart from Jesus lived a life free from sin. Then are they to be like Jesus free from sin, yet born in sin, stained by the original sin, and even saved though not on their knees, contrite before Jesus? Are they supposed to do His will without obeying all of His commandments, chief among them to love Him? Can they love Him without loving His Son?>t. former Christian
>>25467003>I'll admit that calling Christianity an innovation on dionysus worship and jewish religion was (...) a shitpost I was able to sniff that out hence my reply was directed at the rather naive anon who sincerely wondered whether there was any truth to your claims. I should otherwise expect you to admit to error if not blatant dishonesty and not mere reductionism. >your religion isn't specialIt is special by virtue of being true. It isn't 2015 anymore and no one praises Christianity simply for displaying some sort of noble ideals, as Peterson would try and frame it (to then go on and contradict himself and point to the same values found in other religions, in the vein of the post-modern perennialist). Yes, resurrection has been fantasized about by many peoples prior to Christ...>Does the fact that Paul quoted Greek literature send you spiralling? Within the text that you posted itself it says that Paul debates Greeks and uses their own philosophy against them, much like Christ used the Torah to argue with Jews. Paul therefore does not plagiarize, rather he uses concepts found in other philosophies to illustrate his point. I mean to call you neither dishonest nor stupid, but this is overtly stated in your reference text.I won't address the rest of the verses unless you ask me to because I suspect you don't take this conversation very seriously.
As far as Christianity goes, the Quaker stuff appeals to me. Love the idea of an inward light and god in all of us, Also has an anarchistic freedom loving thing going on. Sad to say the Jews have it right as far as theology goes. Why wouldn't you go straight for God. Christians basically worship a preacher. It's lame. If I was to worship anything it would be God.
>>25467088>Paul therefore does not plagiarizeThis is what I was trying to get across. I don't consider any of this to be plagiarism. Recognizing that a religion is within the same broad tradition as others doesn't in itself repudiate that religion, but to either deny or to get worked up over that sort of consanguinity being pointed out is silly.>It isn't 2015 anymore and no one praises Christianity simply for displaying some sort of noble idealsI'd earnestly urge you to go to church, then.
>>25466414I'd love to hear your Traditionalist Argument in favor of using AI
>>25467116>but to either deny or to get worked up over that sort of consanguinity being pointed out is silly.There are such things as internal critiques, anon, which is to say that within the Greeks' paradigm, Paul found things to refer to in order to bring them to Christ. At the very least, the passages in Acts don't point to the sort of perennialism you try to suggest, though I don't even have a problem to admit that "Logos" had been used prior to John. Again, though, the concepts are hardly identical. >I'd earnestly urge you to go to church, then.I don't know what you're playing at, but I do. This sort of online discussions, by the way, is a huge factor contributing to that.
>>25467147I don't an argument for or against it, it's a tool just like any other tool. Traditionalism is not a luddite philosophy, it's not inherently anti-technology, it's just against Scientism (worship of science/tech) and things being given overly due importance more than they should to the point of them infringing on domains they shouldn't. Using technology to have a joke and a laugh doesn't contradict the premises of Traditionalism at all. Use your brain for once.
>>25467158*I don't need an argument for or against it
If it's not a cave, it's not my home.
>>25467158> Traditionalism is not a luddite philosophy, it's not inherently anti-technologysure seems the exact opposite from my assessment
>>25467108I don't like Quakers because they're proto-feminists. though a lot of politicians with Quaker roots seem okay.
>>25467275The problem with a lot of these organised denominations is that they're eventually subverted and boreholed by liberals and cultural Marxists who want to turn them into another blm gay club, especially if they're peace churches. Naturally, members leave and the organisation becomes another atheist social club.Example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mennonite_Church_USA#Conservative_exodusThe Quakers were always progressive, I agree with most of the stuff they did, including early feminism, but you can really see the neo-nonsense in someone like the public universal friend.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Universal_FriendAhead of her time. These days the nu-quakers fly blm and pride flags out of meeting houses, it goes against all they once stood for - staying away from trends and not flying symbols. For me, It was originally about not taking it from the man, equality, simplicity, and a belief that you can make things better if you get together. I believe in divinity and God, it's just not based on organised religion. If you like the Quakers, you should check out the bruderhof. They have a nice thing going on for themselves but they're don't own anything. It's a real cult. Materially, the best cult/religion is anthroposophy. They have the best material culture and the best people on their team, but keep in mind that Rudolph steiners writings are complete nonsense.
>>25467275>proto-feministsLike Christ? Oh no!
>>25466145>There is a reason there are not Theravada Buddhist Traditionalist school membersNot that Evola was confessionally Theravadin nor that picrel is the most pristine depiction of Theravada (or Early Buddhism, or Zen). Still, it is interesting that he held Theravada and Early Buddhism in high regard and considered the Mahayana sects to be degenerations from that ideal. Then again, Evola himself is also the least mystical of the bunch, sometimes doesn't feel like he's even le Traditionalist™ Perennialist™ like everyone else in that circle.
>>25467061you will eventually make it to the beatific vision but there will be chastisement through fire>>25467084yeah everyone will eventually make it, Origen talks about this>>25467275>they're proto-feministsbased
>>25467545>Still, it is interesting that he held Theravada and Early Buddhism in high regard and considered the Mahayana sects to be degenerations from that ideal.I think honestly think he takes that tack out of a lack of familiarity with Mahayana and Vajrayana source material. Some of it turns into sappy muh compassion devotionalism, but some of it also reaches a degree of metaphysical sophistication and brilliance that is comparable to Vedanta, Tantra, Sufism etc. Guenon never goes into great detail about this as it wasn't his main focus but he does briefly acknowledged this.
>>25465702I'm sure those other two retards would be horrified to fully realize it, but Dugin is absolutely their intellectual heir. It's pitiful stuff, but all of them devoted their entire lives to proclaiming the moral superiority of the lesser races; Dugin is merely more explicit about it.>>25467545I really want to understand the argument for why Christianity is innately tainted with weakness but when a Boodhist says you go to Hell for killing a bug that's just an aberration of a warrior tradition which can be dismissed.
>>25467693>but all of them devoted their entire lives to proclaiming the moral superiority of the lesser racesNo, they all held that Christian Europe pre-modernity in the medieval era was basically a traditional civilization just like the rest, they attribute the flaws with the West to the zeitgeist of modernity and not anything racial.
>>25467719Why don't you actually follow your leader and convert to Islam, chum?
>>25466250Imagine how much coal we would've been spared from if traditionalists took themselves seriously and didn't use the internet.>>25466269>Goonman and EviloaLmao
>>25466932Image shows baby Dionysus on the left and baby Jesus on the right.The reason they are both babies and in their baby state associated with Winter solstice is because they are likened to the Sun which has reached its smallest annual courset at this time of the year.In multiple source Dionysus is identified with the Sun, moving through the 12 houses of the Zodiac.
>>25465702>Guénontranslates alienation through state-enforced class exploitation into muh spiritual crisis of the modern worldencourages victims of private property to blame their souls instead of their rulers>Evolaromanticizes the total submission of citizens to state-enforced violence as aristocratic heroismpackages dying for national capital as a sacred, anti-modern privilege>Duginmystifies imperialist competition of sovereign states over global market dominance as le epic clash of civilizational destiniesrecruits exploited subjects to enthusiastically bleed for their nation state’s geopolitical business plansIn the trash they go.
>>25467693>really want to understand the argument for why Christianity is innately tainted with weakness but when a Boodhist says you go to Hell for killing a bug that's just an aberration of a warrior tradition which can be dismissed.It's been a while, but he views Christianity as a degenerated lunar religion too. Same idea, different angles/entry points.
>>25467693because early buddhism emphasizes the individual's power to reach enlightenment on his ownevola hates later bhakti forms of buddhism like pure land for example
>>25468027Out of curiosity, what is the image on the right?>The reason they are both babies and in their baby state (...) is because they are likened to the Sun Is it really, anon? To rephrase, is the reason why Christ was an infant at some point is that he is likened to the sun? (or- to not be dishonest, is that at least why He was depicted as an infant in that image?)I'd chiefly reject, though, that Christ is associated at all with the sun, other than by, yet again, stretching meanings of words to come to that conclusion from Christ's being Light. We know, however, that this has nothing to do with Christian doctrine. This is the Horus image I've posted all over again.Christmas being celebrated in December as a means to syncretize is acknowledged without any issue. It's not a continuation of whatever pagan holiday, though, like tumblr tier atheists are wont to argue. Gift-giving is Biblical as well. I'll concede the Christmas tree, though.
>>25465702> GuenonDidn't he like to go out "contemplating" with opium while leaving his young niece at home or something?I can't remember now if this was real or just a meme anons made up about him.
>guenonDude got duped by masonry being le traditional ancient magic, can't take him seriously.
>>25465702>Guenon LITERALLY believes there's a midget in the hollow center of the earth controlling everything.
>>25468923It's NOT a metaphor. Guenonians don't like to talk about this because it's so retarded. Guenon's Indian friends broke off all contact with him after he published The King of the World.
