I have a hunch that a lot of the people who are interested in the classics are only reactionaries, who view the study of the classics as the natural, logical, and best cure to the ideological poisons of our current society. However, I'm not sure if a lot of people are receiving the classics in the correct way. When you read the classics, you shouldn't be feeling any strong parallels with our current society. What you should feel, is that you've somehow got a window into a lost, alien civilization that vaguely resembles something like an evolved form of humanity. You should not feel like, "This resembles me on my best behavior". You should feel like, "This is a level leagues above me, and I'd have to strive all my life to get near it". You should feel shocked, awed, slightly confused, slightly depressed, but most of all, you should feel a deep longing to bring that degree of excellence which the ancients attained back to earth. If you haven't felt this feeling, you haven't understood the classics. The specific work that gives this feeling to you will vary per person. Some get it through Plato. Some through Aristotle. Some through Ovid. Some through Plutarch. If you don't get it through one, that's perfectly fine. Just continue until you find the author that does do this for you, because when it happens, it will change your life.
I wept at the end of Euthyphro>Alas! my companion, and will you leave me in despair? I was hoping that you would instruct me in the nature of piety and impiety; and then I might have cleared myself of Meletus and his indictment. I would have told him that I had been enlightened by Euthyphro, and had given up rash innovations and speculations, in which I indulged only through ignorance, and that now I am about to lead a better life. I felt the despair of socrates at that moment. It gave me a similar feeling to reading the gospels, in terms of truly feeling the emotions present. So far I read Homer, Hesiod, the play writes, moved on to rome for a bit and read Cicero, some roman plays, and now I am returning to Greece to read the philosophy. So far only read Euthypro, apology, crito.
>>25549981does the door on the bottom left ruin it for anyone else?
I read Xenophon's anabasis and how their unit was betrayed and how the desert stripped them of everything and how they were constantly hounded throughout eurasia, but they had something more than I will ever have and that's true friendship.
>>25550054>I felt the despair of socrates at that momentYou mean, while reading that, and even while typing it out, you couldn't tell he's fucking trolling Euthyphro? You think *HE* actually thinks Euthyphro has the answers? After dogwalking him for a dozen pages and showing he doesnt actually know anything?
>>25550067I know that Socrates knows that Euthyphro doesnt know shit. But Socrates is also searching for answers. He has the question,"What is piety" and the person most likely to know doesnt know anything. I think that last part is Socrates trolling Euthyphro, but also genuine despair that he doesnt have a teacher to learn from.
>>25549981The Patristics are the classics of the classics. That Pagans did not have true virtue or gnosis because they lacked the fullness of Christ (and so too for the Jews). They had splendid vices, virtues ordered to imperfect, if not wicked ends. Plato saw further than most, but no human logos can fathom the infinite plentitude of the Logos, our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
>>25550116>The Patristics are the classics of the classics.They're really not. Derivative? Certainly.
I'm probably not alone in feeling as if most of my desire to learn from the classics can only culminate in one giant larp. Many of our enlightenment figures had this feeling too and could never quite dissolve it. But the majority either did not realize this or did not care, and so enlightenment europe is in many respects a failed larp. But I'm really curious what you all have to say about this.It seems to me that enlightement europe was permanently shackled or crippled by some invisible burden. Like the ancients were free in a much deeper sense to pursue arete, whereas the europeans were left to buckle under a certain strange pressure for hundreds of years. And I think that pressure comes from Christianity turning Europeans into a very reflective and cautious sort of people. Because to truly avoid sin, you have to stay vigilant at all times, and be prepared to second guess almost any action that you take. And this has wormed its way so deeply into the european subconscoius, that to simply apply oneself unconsciously to the external world is almost unthinkable. A modern European would be terrified of behaving like a true Roman because some deep fear would emerge from his subconscious warning him that he may be about to sin.
The classics do seem entirely alien. But nothing I've read makes them seem higher or really awe inspiring.
