File: IMG_20260714_100244.png (951 KB, 1024x1024)

951 KB PNG

He was supposed to be Char, and then Tomino got approved for a movie. The End.
>Hmmmm I won't put Haman in the movie, but where else am I going to find a female VA who loves oral sex just as much? *sigh* Miyazaki doesn't have these problems.

>>23956604
lol

>>23956601
grooming victim of Haman

>>23956604
It's super obvious watching ZZ back with how Glemy is such a low ranking scrub at the start of the show and just suddenly becomes one of the most influential people in Axis offscreen with his own personal fleet, R&D team, loli clone army etc. none of that shit was meant to be for him when he was getting cockteased by Roux at the start of the show

>>23956861
>nobleman wants to experience duty as a nameless grunt and make a name for himself
>goes back to his place in power once shit hits the fan and his action is necessary
It's really not that hard to undersand, anything about Char or production details is off-screen cope by retards getting filtered.

>>23956866
He isn't even the commander of that irrelevant unit, he doesn't even have a custom MS, he was at best being set up as a recurring rival for Roux early on. The Glemy that we know from the middle to the end of the show would never just hop in a random grunt suit to probably get ordered to his death, he would always want to be in command even if he was frontlining for clout. The perspective would be "how can some peasant possibly order me around?"
This isn't him going through character development, if anything his character development is supposed to be him getting MORE in tune with normal soldiers via the Blue Team which makes him realise Haman is full of shit, but his actions show him getting farther away from a common soldier - first having a grunt suit in regular colours, then getting his Bawoo, and finally being above piloting himself at all by the time he dies.

File: gurem3.jpg (59 KB, 664x480)

59 KB JPG

Glemy is many things, but definitely not some sadistic inbred faggot

>>23956866
The staff have literally confirmed it in interviews and databooks. Glemy's original name was Soldier A. Nothing more than a blonde background character.

Originally, Tomino wasnt sure he was gonna get approved for a movie. So be planned to end Amuro and Char's story in ZZ Gundam. Char was gonna lead a Neo Zeon civil war. Amuro was gonna show up and they were going to settle it once and for all. Judau was going to play a less important role too. More of a support role.

After CCA got approved, Tomino said he didn't want to end the Amuro/Char rivalry with just a TV budget. So he changed his plans for ZZ. Amuro and Char were removed. The staff scrambled last minute to make changes to the story. Glemmy was chosen because he was easy, already existed, and was also blonde.

Tomino handed off most responsibilities to his staff to wrap up ZZ and he focused on CCA development.

>>23956601
I don't know who that is.

File: 04655out.png (418 KB, 896x1024)

418 KB PNG

>>23957736
>Soldier A.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TA-QJ2d3kk

Also good christ fuck. 18 goddamn years. Some newfaggot was barely a twinkle in his mother's customer's eye. Where the fuck did my life go.

File: file.png (879 KB, 827x1200)

879 KB PNG

>>23956601
How do we feel about the clone/Gihren retcon

File: Griff_young_griff.jpg (61 KB, 620x722)

61 KB JPG

He's more space Young Griff/FAegon

>Young pretender of dubious lineage comes to usurp the claim of a more central female character and splits Targarayen/Zeon supporters between them

>>23961178
Super dumb because Gihren wasn't some genetic prodigy, he was just an above average dude born in a spot where he could exercise his sadism

>>23961219
and despite being a genius he never actually outsmarted the federation at any point

File: file.png (3.12 MB, 1638x2048)

3.12 MB PNG

>>23961219
>Super dumb because Gihren wasn't some genetic prodigy
Isn't the crux of the Newtype mythos anyway? That the people born in Space are far better than the apes still on Earth? It's weird that it took ZZ for the eugenics angle to be played into more. Although I do like his Lawrence in Arabia arc where he starts to realize how full of shit Haman is, shame whatever goodwill that gets built is thrown away once the clones came in

>>23961227
The thing about Gihren being 200 IQ was implied to be Zeon propaganda, they also said he was a Newtype as well.

>>23957732
>Glemmy as depicted by Hasegawa

>>23961212
>Faegon
Female aegon?

>>23961399
Fake Aegon. There's a book only character currently invading Westeros who claims to be Aegon Targaryen (Rhaegar's son with Elia Martell who is supposed to be dead) but is heavily suggested to actually be a Blackfyre descendant

>>23961249
The desert arc was the best part of ZZ desu. I think the jungle village on space arc where mondo gets a gf is also good

>>23956879
>The perspective would be "how can some peasant possibly order me around?"
Marshmallow could also be a noble tbf

>>23961178
>How do we feel about the clone/Gihren retcon
Where did this idea even come from? Glemy is blonde. Gihren has purple hair. He's not a clone at all!

>>23956861
>It's super obvious watching ZZ back with how Glemy is such a low ranking scrub at the start of the show and just suddenly becomes one of the most influential people in Axis offscreen
Genuinely, why didn't they just introduce a new character? The only payoff is Roux feeling bad about his death.
But even that scene makes it seem like he's even less familiar with piloting a mobile suit than he was earlier in the series as a greenhorn.

>>23961727
>Genuinely, why didn't they just introduce a new character?
Creating a new character means hiring a character designer to make one, getting it approved, hiring a voice actor, budgeting for them, etc.

According to staff interviews, they were in a massive rush after CCA got approved and Tomino wanted to change the story. They were doing everything they could to save time and resources to make sure ZZ Gundam production didn't fall behind schedule. One of the decisions they made was to reuse an existing character. So to answer your question, it was to save time and resources.

Understandable. But in hindsight it was a poor decision. Glemy was a nobody. I think what they should have done was bring back a Zabi. Surely the Zabi family had cousins or other Zabis right? Did Degwin Zabi have a brother or Sister? Maybe have one of them return and claim the throne and fight Haman for it.

>>23961717
Implied the mom is Gihren's secretary

Speaking of ZZ is it ever explained how Marshmellow became a cyber newtype?

>>23956866
>>23956879
He's also actually shown being promoted for no reason when they had the idea to give him the role of coup leader against Haman. The problem, and what breaks any in-universe logic, is that when he returns after these promotions, he suddenly had a cloning project and fleet all along, which just makes zero sense with his early timeline (AND said promotion which was meant to transition him into his new role).

It definitely should just have been a separate character.

>>23961961
Groomed his fucking brains off.

File: 1779816488615180m.jpg (175 KB, 842x1024)

175 KB JPG

Say something nice about Marshmellow

>>23961929
THATS NOT A CLONE.

>>23961929
>>23962006
AND HOW COULD HE BE GIHRENS SON WITH THE SECRETARY???

GLEMMY WOULD ONLY BE 8 YEARS OLD IF BORN DURING THE ONE YEAR WAR.

DOES THE FANDOM NOT HAVE BRAINS??

>>23962006
>>23962012
Anon, take a breath.

>>23962012

https://zeonic-republic.net/?p=8313

>Animedia’s Mobile Suit Gundam ZZ Part.2

>GLEMY AND PLE ARE SIBLINGS!

>The relationship between Elpeo Ple and Ple Two was not made clear on-screen, but fans are still curious about it. So, we will tell you about the secrets of the origins of Elpeo Ple, Ple Two, and Glemy for good measure. It may have been unclear on screen, but the setting notes had already been fleshed out. First, let’s talk about Glemy. He was born inside a test-tube, by artificially fertilizing the egg of a woman with Newtype qualities with Gihren Zabi’s (who appeared in previous works) sperm. Both Ples were also artificially created in the same manner, from Gihren Zabi and a Newtype woman, so they are Glemy’s sisters in a sense. However, the egg used to make them were from a different woman than Glemy’s, and they are artificially created identical twins with the exact same genetics (DNA). This is why Elpeo Ple and Ple Two look identical. Ple Two’s personality was changed via imprinting after she was born.

>To add to that, the Newtype Corps, which Glemy was saving until the final battle, are also test-tube babies like Glemy and Ple. Glemy felt that the Cyber-Newtype’s used by Haman were too unstable and had limited Newtype abilities (evident from the fact that Ple Two was able to control the Psycho Gundam MK-II which Rosamia, a Cyber-Newtype, could not), so he created an army of test-tube babies instead of using Cyber-Newtype. What a ruthless person, though, to use his brethren as soldiers.

So, the Purus are all Zabi too.

Glemy being a clone has been referenced recently (like UC Engage, where it's even shown Glemy clones made alongside the Purus) but I feel like modern material is much more vague about the Purus being Zabi.

File: prodnotes.png (562 KB, 412x582)

562 KB PNG

>>23961717
>>23961929
>>23962012
>>23962006
The ZZ production notes said he's a test tube baby using Gihren's sperm with an unknown newtype mother using genetic tampering to increase the odds he would become a Newtype. The blonde hair and blue eyes were probably something Gihren threw in since he's a follower of Hitler and everything, after all.

>>23962023
>since he's a follower of Hitler and everything, after all.
he didn't even know who Hitler was until his dad called him out for killing half of the human species

>>23962022
>Glemy being a clone has been referenced recently
Does he look like Gihren? Where's the purple hair???

>>23962023
>The ZZ production notes said he's a test tube baby using Gihren's sperm with an unknown newtype mother
That's called a son.

And where Axis get viable sperm from Gihren? Gihren died long before Axis came to power.

>The blonde hair and blue eyes were probably something Gihren threw in since he's a follower of Hitler
Nonsense. Gihren didn't even know who Hitler was until his dad brought him up and even the Gihren scoffed at the idea.

>>23962026
Nah, he knew who Hitler was. People generally take it to mean he didn't know much about him, because he says Hitler was from the "middle ages", but Degwin agrees with that part during that scene, so it's likely more meant to show they're so far into the future they consider the "20th century" the middle ages.

>>23956601
He's nowhere near as psychotic as Joffrey.

>>23962032
Anon. In the UC timeline, WW2 was hundreds of years ago, and was considered the "dark ages" to them.

>>23962061
The sad part is he's probably only about as far from Hitler as we are from Napoleon.
The first colony construction project begins in 2045. It stands to reason Laplace couldn't have been too long after that.

>>23961227
1. He heavily outmatched Revil's expectations in terms of Zeon's capacity for an extended war. I think one of the most interesting questions about the OYW is if the Federation would have continued the war at all if they knew how tough it would be, in contrast with how Revil is like "bro we've pretty much won already" right after he got out of captivity
2. The Solar Ray was the only reason Zeon had a fighting chance in the final battle and it caught the whole Federation fleet by surprise

>he's blonde? LITERALLY HIGLER
I'm so tired of americans

>>23962140
I wouldn't be surprised if the entire AD calendar is "the middle ages" to Degwin and Gihren. As Spacenoids, they have a fundamentally different perspective on history than any of us would, and anything before human expansion into space probably feels archaic regardless of how long ago it actually was (hence WW2 is lumped in with the Crusades or the Viking invasions).

File: __roux_louka_and_glemy_to(...).jpg (315 KB, 700x615)

315 KB JPG

>>23961727
There isn't much, but I could see another revisit at ZZ manage to reconcile the Roux and the Zabi thing. Something along the lines of
>This woman is worthy of bearing the heirs of my bloodline

>>23962212
>if they knew how tough it would be, in contrast with how Revil is like "bro we've pretty much won already" right after he got out of captivity

If I were an Admiral, I would be pissed if General Revil said Zeon was totally exhausted and couldn't keep fighting. But then Zeon invades Earth with like 500 million troops and tons of mobile suits and armored vehicles, and then Zeon conquered half the planet.

I genuinely wonder how come no one called out General Revil for his nonsense and question his definition of "Zeon is exhausted".
>2. The Solar Ray was the only reason Zeon had a fighting chance in the final battle and it caught the whole Federation fleet by surprise

Eh it depends on what sources you believe.

- Gelgoog databooks say that Zeon would have won the war if Gelgoog had 2 more weeks of production time. So 1 extra week of production time probably means Zeon could push back the Federation or at least tie.

- Other lore books say more mobile armors were in production and needed a little more time. It's possible more Big Zams and Perfect Zeongs could have appeared if the final battle was delayed.

- Despite being ordered to reinforce A Boa Que, some books claim that Kycillia did not bring her fleet to A Boa Que. She only brought a tiny force, and purposely left the vast majority of her fleet at Granada. Kycillia wanted Gihren's faction to take the brunt of the Federation attack. She was trying to sabotage Gihren and made sure his faction bled manpower and resources. So when the battle was over, she would have the larger fleet and manpower. Kycillia never expected to actually die during the battle.

- Other sources say that the Zeon fleet assembled at A Boa Que was not the full Zeon space fleet. It was only the fleet Zeon could assemble in just a few days. Zeon had fleets all over. Other space fleets were too far away and still traveling back and didn't make it in time for the final battle.

>>23961961
Haman got tired of his constant jobbing and cybernewtyped him hoping it would turn Mashy into a more reliable asset. Which kinda happened, all things considered. Same for Chara Soon

>>23962236
All of those sources sound like Zeonwank revisionism. It's bad enough to have the revisionism of "oh Zeon might have won if Gihren loyalists like Delaz didn't desert after he died" baked into 0083's implications, but acting like there were entire massive Zeon fleets not even present at the battle flies in the face of everything the original was trying to convey.
The only one I remotely believe is the one about having more Mobile Armours ready if the battle were delayed, but how many mobile armours do you need to wipe out 1/3rd of the fleet including Revil himself?
The extra benefit of killing Revil is hard to ignore when he was the biggest hawk in the EFF, it means that after a potential victory, your odds of securing a strong peace deal are significantly increased.
I think you would need a heck of a lot of Big Zams to match the combined military and political value of that shot.

>>23961961
Same way they did it to Chara, and Four, and Rosamia
That is to say, they don't give any details of the surgery in question but it can be assumed to be very invasive (Rosamia mentions having enhanced lungs, I doubt anything was off the table in terms of enhancements)

>>23962236
>- Other sources say that the Zeon fleet assembled at A Boa Que was not the full Zeon space fleet. It was only the fleet Zeon could assemble in just a few days. Zeon had fleets all over. Other space fleets were too far away and still traveling back and didn't make it in time for the final battle.
how long does it take to cross the entire earth sphere, assuming from l2 to l3 I guess

>>23964033
>but how many mobile armours do you need to wipe out 1/3rd of the fleet including Revil himself?
Maybe 2 or 3. The original Big Zam was a monster that held back the entire Federation fleet for 15 minutes while the Zeon survivors were able to retreat safely. The original Big Zam was only destroyed because Sleggar was willing to suicide ram the Big Zam in a very difficult to hit spot. Sleggar had no family alive and didn't care about life anymore. Most pilots aren't suicidal like him and want to return to the families and friends after the war.

>>23964092
>how long does it take to cross the entire earth sphere, assuming from l2 to l3 I guess
We have to account for Zeon spotting the enemy, debating what to do, transmitting a request for help recalling all forces home, broadcast time, Zeon fleets reacting, and flight time home. So I suppose a few days The final Battle of ABQ was very sudden. The Federation blitzed Zeon and didn't stop attacking. It was only a few days between Battle of Solomon and ABQ

>>23962236
Don't forget the Colony Laser would have been repaired too. The first blast was a test fire to understand any flaws about the weapon, to fix it, and improve it. It's very likely Zeon would have gotten the laser up and running without issue if they had more time to fix it.

>>23956601
Glemmy should have been the love child of Haman and Char. Would have made more sense with how Glemmy could get more supporters.

>>23964705
he would be four years old

>>23964895
The anime doesn't care about continuity.

>>23964908
I care

>>23961991
Strongest fag with a rose in the UC

>>23964033
>All of those sources sound like Zeonwank revisionism.
Ordinarily I would agree. But I've always had a problem with how the story portrays Zeon as having less ships. Logically it doesn't make sense. Shouldn't Zeon have a massive stockpile of space war ships and huge shipyards running 24/7? Zeon has been building ships for 30 years or more. They don't need to worry about sending their ships into space either with huge expensive rockets like the Federation.

File: orbital drop operation.webm (3.8 MB, 1278x720)

3.8 MB WEBM

>>23965648
what if the feds are also churning out ships 24/7?

>They don't need to worry about sending their ships into space either with huge expensive rockets like the Federation
this is UC, at no point are rockets even considered expensive anymore because if that were the case then rocket expenditure would be even more of a problem for zeon than the feds considering any ships need rocket engines no matter what. as much as feds needing boosters to put launch a new fleet into space is a cost factor, so was zeon retrieving their earthside forces after odessa.

don't forget zeon was also dropping tons of supplies to their earthside troops with pods for at least half of the OYW and yes, drop pods need retrorockets since it's a large cargo vehicle and you can't have all of them slow down nearly enough with just parachutes if they're carrying fragile supplies

>>23965648
>Zeon have a massive stockpile of space war ships and huge shipyards running 24/7?
In their doctrine, the main purpose of spaceships is to carry mobile suits, so it stands to reason the mobile suits themselves receive significantly more resources relative to how the Federation is budgeting the war.
Plus they just don't have as many resources to begin with. We have Gihren's line about being outmatched "thirty-to-one" which is probably him exaggerating as much as possible (i.e. comparing the resources just on Side 3 to the entire Earth Federation, when Zeon has by that point taken over far more than just Side 3) but still tells us nonetheless that Zeon is up against the clock and can't just trade 1:1 with the Federation, any day where they don't measurably get closer to winning is a day they got closer to losing basically.

>>23963770
Chara Soon is my favorite schizo hag

>>23965820
>what if the feds are also churning out ships 24/7?
Zeon destroyed like 80% to 90% of the Fed space fleet during the opening months of the war. That's hundreds of war ships. And probably thousands of smaller supply ships. The Feds would spend 24/7 just rebuilding while Zeon expands their fleet even more. Because of Fed losses, there would always be a huge gap in numbers between Fed and Zeon space fleet size.

>>23965820
>this is UC, at no point are rockets even considered expensive anymore because if that were the case then rocket expenditure would be even more of a problem for zeon than the feds
I recall the writers making a big deal about how valuable the rocketships are for Zeon to get back to space. Like each ship was like a precious treasure. Meanwhile the Federation is just slingshotting ships into space easily. It's weird.

File: 20251023083328_North-West.jpg (19 KB, 350x196)

19 KB JPG

>>23964705
Char and Haman's kid would end up being North West but with psychic powers that can control deadly drones. Being a nepobaby with a racist father and a mother who does porn is rough in any timeline.

File: Dolos.jpg (110 KB, 1113x737)

110 KB JPG

>>23965844
>In their doctrine, the main purpose of spaceships is to carry mobile suits, so it stands to reason the mobile suits themselves receive significantly more resources relative to how the Federation is budgeting the war.
Not that anon, this is something that has always bugged me. Zeon really through the damn kitchen sink into the dolos. You could pretty much overwhelm anywhere with share numbers if you just deploy a few. Instead we only have two named ones. Why didn't you pull up to Luna 2 with a few of these and deploy several hundred mobile suits at once. Knock the EFSF out of the battle completely, then use the ships as Hard roadblocks to anywhere the earth federation tries to regroup in space after you lose jaburo. Effective use of these things should be absolutely devastating.

>>23966406
I guess they were waiting for the Gelgoog and more Big Zams to be finished before smashing Luna 2 ?

>>23965963
Haman canonically died a virgin so I don't think she does porn.

>>23965891
To be fair, 10% of the EFSF fleet would always outnumber the zeeks, that's how it's always been. There is no other way to resolve:

>destroy 90% of EFSF
>they're still a threat

this happens AGAIN in 0083. and AGAIN after the events of gryps war.

>>23965894
That's because Zeon has 1/30th the resources and manpower and manufacturing of the Feds, as Giren himself declares. How else do you explain:

>build ships for 30 years
>still get outnumbered when the Feds start rebuilding everything in less than a year

even losing a single zaku is fucking painful for zeon. char was rightfully scolded for losing several zakus on the attack on side 7. this repeats itself AD NAUSEUM throughout the series. zeon often has wounded pilots fielding obsolete salvaged machines in a bunch of different disparate stories written by different authors because that's like the one recurring element common to zeon

>>23966406
Still lost
Cope harder

>>23966918
Why are you telling me that. I presented an obvious strategy, but they couldn't even do that.

>>23966406
>Why didn't you pull up to Luna 2 with a few of these and deploy several hundred mobile suits at once.
Same reason why Zeon didn't roll up with a couple Big Zams to Luna 2 and wipe it out. No one really knows. On paper, Zeon should have won the war. Yet somehow the Federation won barely.

>>23966406
The easiest path to victory for Zeon would be to not sign the Antarctic Treaty, do absolutely nothing to invade Earth, and just lock down space completely after Loum and keep dropping colonies over and over until the Feddies give up.

>>23966406
The Dolos has issues deploying its MS contingency in a timely manner, was slower than Zeon engineers had hoped, and didn't have adequate point defense weaponry.

>>23967120
>The Dolos has issues deploying its MS contingency in a timely manner
Fake news.

>was slower than Zeon engineers had hoped
Fake news.

>and didn't have adequate point defense weaponry.
Somewhat acceptable.


Dolos was destroyed because the Federation sent dozens and dozens and dozens of ships and mobile suits to attack it. It was just too many for Dolos to fight alone.

>>23967091
If they did exactly what the Iranians are doing right now they would have won. Blame Zabie for wanting an empire.

>>23967197
That doesn't really map as Zeon is in the analogous position to the US, unable to strike their opponent's hardened undereground positions (Jaburo irl, Iran's missile cities in the OYW) from air.

>>23967091
>The easiest path to victory for Zeon would be to not sign the Antarctic Treaty, do absolutely nothing to invade Earth, and just lock down space completely after Loum
The strange part is I thought that's what they already did?

Also why use colonies? Just use some asteroids. You don't need huge world ending asteroids like Axis. Just use smaller asteroids like Char did with 5th Luna. It's enough to destroy a city from orbit. Just hit the general location of Jaburo with several of them.

>>23967129
That's the federations way of winning, they have the manpower to throw 1000 poor fucks in balls at the problem and if ten survive to take down a zeon division or MA that's a crushing defeat zeon can't recover from, meanwhile feddies have developed a new mobile coffin and lowered the draft age and keep winning.

>>23967264
Plenty of solid GM variants by the end of the war that can at least go toe to toe with Doms/Rick Doms, balls were clearly being phased out, they were probably only the mainstay of the space force for a month or so.

Zeon should have stolen the colonies and moved them somewhere else, starving the federation

File: mobilesuitvariation2_157.jpg (69 KB, 780x520)

69 KB JPG

I'm going to the exact opposite of the normal arguments about theone year war. The federation has ridiculous plot armor in the one year war, and Zeon loom like complete fucking idiots
>open one year war
Destroy basically everything the federation has in space except Luna ii and the single colony in side 7
>0079.01.31
Sign the Antarctic treaty
Bans traditional WMDs - fine
Bans attacks on Jupiter energy fleet attacks, attacks on lunar cities sans granada, and neutral parties (side 6) - fair
No Pow killing - fair
>9.18.79
Start MSG

For 7 months no one thought hey we should finish off the EFSF. This Allows project v to magically go through uninhibited. Damn that genius Ghiren sure is smart. He just blew an 8 month mobile suit lead. And didn't secure his own back yard (space). Hell. Somehow we don't even force neutral governments on sides 1 and 2 which we've already fucked horrible. Sides 4 and 5 for all real purposes are gone. Awfully convenient for the Federation.

Well. Maybe the situation in earth will make more sense. Let's look at what zeon occupied. After all it's resources and supplies
>every major industrial center and most population centers
Where the fuck is federation even getting Muh Population or my resources
For people side 1 and 2 should be cut off, that means you can't conscript easily from their after fucking February. The greatest population bases on earth in Asia are occupied, so you can't conscript there reliably. How bout industry, it's magically all done at jaburo while the places that logically would produce things are either occupied or getting bombed. How bout logistics. Well. We're magically transporting massive supplies from south America across the pacific and Atlantic in spite of harassment from zeon amphibious MS.

Okay so through share zeonic ineptitude
we stuck around in space
We magically conscripted unlimited soldiers before occuparion
We magically have unlimited industrial capacity in spite of occupation & magic logistics too

File: MSG2_Revil.JPG.jpg (39 KB, 699x720)

39 KB JPG

>>23967403
Obviously, He uses console commands.

>>23956601
He's more like Danny's brother. He schemes to revive the Zabi dynasty getting Zeon from under Haman's thumb, he's not particularly strong or smart but he knows how to use the trump card he was dealt to build an army.

>>23961178
Is it a retcon? Even without the production notes, he literally gets referred to as the second coming of Gihren in the show and the scene plays it really sly like it's supposed to be a deeper meaning. As far back as I can remember, people have always assumed he was either his clone or his bastard, with the clone angle making slightly more sense with him being in charge of all the Purus. I always assumed it was just Tomino being his usual obtuse self when explaining something.

>>23965820
how are those pods floating around like that? Is it supposed to be a Monoskvy drive, or just wanky Igloo artstyle? Looks fucking stupid

>>23967573
>floating
They are falling.

>>23967403
Diff anon here. Your picture seems wrong or inaccurate. I remember Zeon saying they controlled parts of Russia. They controlled a couple space ports in Russia to transfer supplies back to Side 3. Maybe I'm remembering wrong tho?

>>23967575
Not towards the end they're not, though I think that's supposed to be artistic license and it's not actually hovering for that long. Does look goofy.

File: mobilesuitvariation2_155.jpg (67 KB, 780x520)

67 KB JPG

>>23967590
Being fair, the map is from Mobile Suit Variation 2: Zeon Forces MS · MA Edition which was published in April 1984. I'm sure a lot of this has been heavily modified over the years. Hell I'm sure I've seen other maps. I just pulled it because it's one of the easiest maps I have to pull of how much of earth was occupied. The point was more to illustrate just how utterly ridiculous the "feds won because they had more resources and better industry" actually is when the base of their strength is completely on fire during the war.
Also for fun, the book has this old map of places affected by operation British's fallout. I don't think I've ever seen damage in the arctic circle discussed.

>>23967403
This is the problem with the original series. They wanted to have the Federation somehow win and make a huge comeback. But the conditions presented in the anime and manga are so ridiculously in Zeon's favor that it's impossible for the Federation to make such a huge comeback in such a short amount of time. (Not unless Jaburo is a magical place that has infinite supplies and doesnt need fuel or manpower from other parts of the Earth.)

Even if Jaburo had unlimited supplies, the Federation would need to do a slow grinding ground war of attrition to push back Zeon. And even then it would probably take years. Like World War 1 slow pushes to retake territory. The One Year War would become the Three Year War. And even then some territory would be impossible to retake for the Federation because Zeon would have fortified the hell out of them. Imagine Odessa and California base covered in heavy bunkers with mobile suits inside, giant artillery cannons, and countless traps and barricades. I'm honestly surprised Zeon never had their own version of Jaburo with it being so heavily fortified that the Federation would lose countless resources and lives trying to re-take it. Especially if Zeon had Gelgoogs and beam equipped mobile suits entrenched and defending. They should remake the OG anime but make it more realistic. I totally would support it.

>>23967403
>>23967671
>I'm honestly surprised Zeon never had their own version of Jaburo with it being so heavily fortified that the Federation would lose countless resources and lives trying to re-take it.
I mean, it's the "one year war", Zeon didn't have time to build stuff like that.

I do agree there's this core contradiction in the lore. The Federation is treated as the larger power due to controlling most of Earth and population, but at the same time, there's this focus on Jaburo as the one relevant production facility, to the point that the Federation keeping it is central to the entire comeback.

It'd make more sense if there was some kind of data that was finalized in Jaburo by the time the White Base gets there, and then they can spread it to other production facilities around the world, rather than crediting Jaburo for most mobile suits in general.

Regarding the areas they controlled though, I don't think real world geography really matters here. Jaburo is the Federation biggest production plant and it has no counterpart in reality. The problem is more how you get this vague credit to the Federation's resources and population, while also giving Jaburo almost full credit for mobile suit production.

>>23967718
>I mean, it's the "one year war", Zeon didn't have time to build stuff like that
Seriously? Are you being serious?

Zeon built Big Zams, entire factories on Earth, giant Gaw cargo transports, entire fleets of water mobile suits, a Navy fleet, giant submarines, water mobile armors, drilled deep into Mountains to create bases, and numerous other things. But you say they can't fortify one or two locations? Make it make sense anon

>>23967844
>Make it make sense anon
A vast underground bunker? You don't seem to be getting the timescale necessary for that.

>>23967851
Your telling me they could build a vast mountain base in just a few weeks in 08th MS Team complete with launch facilities to launch ships, but can't dig underground?

>>23967851
YOU HAVE GIANT HUMANOID ZAKUS WITH GIANT SHOVELS ANON. THEY CAN MOVE AND DIG 100X THE AMOUNT OF DIRT NORMAL MACHINES CAN DO.

WHY DONT YOU UNDERSTAND THIS

>>23967869
I mean they could just use guntanks to push more dirt back

>>23967888
yeah but guntanks are gay

>>23967898
that's part of the design so they don't show up on zeon's anti-gaydar

>>23967869
>>23967888
There is no advantage to that over a standard excavator
Zeon didn't build permanent structures on Earth because they mistakenly viewed Earth as accessible as a colony, not realizing the gravity well is prohibitive logistically as well as spiritually (supposedly)

File: 123412423423.png (267 KB, 552x400)

267 KB PNG

>>23967430
>>23961717
Could he be considered the first Char clone? He basically fulfills the Starscream role

>>23966884
If the Federation fleet is that much bigger than Zeon's then I don't see how the war lasted a year.

>>23968561
IIRC, wasn't Glemy's role in ZZ originally supposed to go to Char but they decided mid-show to save him for CCA? That's why Glemy goes from some random pilot to one of the main antagonists.

>>23967901
>There is no advantage to that over a standard excavator
You can't be serious. It's a huge advantage.

>>23967403
Zeon won a massive victory at Loum, but they still didn't destroy the entire EFSF fleet, the survivors of which regrouped at Luna II.
Those ships aren't easy to deal with because the Federation isn't about to lazily throw them headlong into a battlefield full of mobile suits again. They will fight defensively and inflict much greater losses on Zeon in any hypothetical battle of Luna II, and the weapons necessary to negate those tactics won't be developed until near the end of the war (beam rifle Gelgoogs, NT mobile armours, long range mobile armours, etc.) by which time Star One is underway and the Federation has a much bigger fleet and thousands of GMs.
Could Zeon have taken Luna II if they focused on doing so instead of invading Earth? I think it's basically certain they could have. But instead they wanted to invade Earth, and it's too much of a strain on Zeon's industry to fight Earth and Luna II simultaneously.
As for population, even without Earth's major population centres, they still greatly outnumber Side 3's 150 million. I know we have a few examples of Earthnoids defecting to Zeon during the occupations but it's hard to imagine this was a massive proportion.
In terms of industry, the portions of Earth occupied by Zeon naturally have no mobile suit production facilities yet since the Federation hasn't developed any (besides the guntank, whatever). And the Feddies still retained quite major production from South America, Britain, Japan, Russia, etc. Zeon clearly has them outmatched in terms of raw industrial potential but is both quite wasteful with that potential (not just drowning every frontline with Zakus before the Federation has any mobile suits, developing way too many memes in the latewar) and has a much smaller population to both work in the factories and pilot the mobile suits afterwards.

File: deformed-degraded-clones-(...).jpg (104 KB, 1080x1440)

104 KB JPG

>>23968570
>>23968561
I wonder how could make it such that the transition from
>goofy named grunt in love with Roux
to
>splinter faction insurrection leader of Axis
flows a lot smoother, without using the words "clone degradation"

>>23956601
the hardest thing about discussing ZZ is that almost everyone has watched the fan subs which fuck up a ton of characterization and dialogue and not the official subs which change a lot. It's more obvious he's a Zabi in the official subs

>>23968599
I read somewhere in a databook that Zeon thought Luna 2 had no strategic value. Thus it wasn't worth the effort to take or occupy. So Zeon decided to isolate Luna 2 the entire war with their fleet. Like a WW2 army blockading a city and preventing supplies from getting in.

Originally it was just an asteroid base where a bunch of scared Federation survivors were hiding inside for survival hoping Zeon won't attack. They didn't even have mobile suits or anything to fight back.

I have no idea how the lore changed to where Luna 2 suddenly became this powerhouse factory tmans ultra fortified base that's super hard to take. Luna 2 is pretty pathetic honestly. Char infiltrated the base twice. Once during the one year war. And again during CCA where 13 Zeon ships were able to destroy an entire fleet guarding Luna 2. Yes there was an element of surprise but come on the numbers difference was enormous.

>>23971919
>And again during CCA where 13 Zeon ships were able to destroy an entire fleet guarding Luna 2. Yes there was an element of surprise but come on the numbers difference was enormous.
Been a bit since I saw CCA. How much of that fleet was Salamises? 13 new model ships with modern (if cheap) MS against a larger force with much worse tech wouldn't be a huge upset.

File: 138617718_p0.png (3.6 MB, 2048x2048)

3.6 MB PNG

Glemmy is probably my favorite character after Amuro himself. Watching him get promoted all the way to the top in ZZ was fun, the best part of the anime.

Real shame that despite how endlessly other Gundam series regurgitate aspects of various early UC series, the random guy who gradually rises through the ranks like Glemmy hasn't been tried again.

>>23971966
We saw Clop classes mixed with Salamis classes in that battle. So the Federation definitely had new ships available too. We also saw Jegans launching from within Luna 2 as well. So it definitely a sizeable Federation fleet with modern ships and modern suits

>>23971985
>the random guy who gradually rises through the ranks like Glemmy hasn't been tried again.
Except we didn't see him rise through the ranks or earn his promotions. Glemmy was just suddenly popular and suddenly higher rank. We didn't see how it happened at all

>>23971992
It's what I mean when the idea absolutely deserved another go. Purpose built a character for it instead of retooling an existing one.

But the idea behind Glemmy is still pretty interesting to me. Also, cool death scene.

>>23967209
>Jaburo irl, Iran's missile cities in the OYW
Iran canon to UC

>>23972008
The idea was that he was originally supposed to be Char. He starts his own faction in Neo Zeon and fights Haman's faction.

Judau and the other kids were more of a supporting role and less important role.

Amuro was supposed to return as well.

>>23972011
Its actually persia

>>23972100
>Judau and the other kids were more of a supporting role and less important role.
No, Judau was still the protagonist. Char was supposed to return only around the late 10s/20s, exactly when you get Glemmy repurposed into a mastermind type since they decided against actually bringing Char to the show.

>>23964038
A series like this needs to entertain this in detail. IBO did try, but it was just neck plug level stuff. True cyber newtype frickery both mind and body for a pilot would be a cool plot device.

>>23971985
True, that's a really compelling character archetype. Especially if he proves himself to be worthy.

>>23974543
They wanted the show to at least superficially be watchable for kids. Including Zeta.

>>23974243
Why get so mad? Judau and his friends were nothing more than fun comic relief to make fans laugh. This backfired but i gotta give Tomino credit for trying something different.

File: 1234231423423421314213.png (356 KB, 1000x563)

356 KB PNG

>>23974543
>>23974568
I think Narrative is the closest they ever get (as far as anime) go towards showing the cyber-newtype surgery. I do have to wonder at which point Gundam became less "overtly" childish and went into straight Military Science Fiction

>>23975425
Neither. Childish or Military Science fiction don't matter. Tomino has said repeatedly that Gundam has always been survival story in the middle of a war. That survival and war were key elements. If any one were missing, then Gundam doesn't work.

Fans who obsess over realism vs super robot, or humor vs serious are missing the bigger picture.

>>23975457
What Tomino said in some interview has little bearing on what Sunrise actually produces, which was closer to the anon's point.
You guys keep waving that shit around like holy writ when it is wholly a corporate decision.

>>23961961
We don't know a whole lot about neo zeon's cyber newtype conversion in general. Meanwhile the titan's procedure involved shooting people up with amuro genes and cocaine.

>>23975461
Tomino may not have say on UC shows produced later on, but he absolutely has a say on the anime he Directed and created. Plus he has a point. Look at any UC Gundam created without war as a background setting. They always fail long term. Unlike 0079, Unicorn has largely been forgotten and has absolutely zero rewatchability. NT fizzled out. And don't even get me started on Twilight Axis.

Bandai can approve of production, but they show of a clear track record of failure on any UC anime that Tomino did not write or Direct.

>>23975476
>>23975457
What does Tomino have to do with that question? It's not like G-Reco was well received either tbqh

>>23967403
>why did zeon lost?
Simple jewish tunnels.
Jaburo was a underground base other than carpet bombing the only advantage i could see for it is a world wide complex system of caves and tunnels that connects to various points. Now why the fuck didnt zeon find it while controlling like 50% of the planet? idk spacenoids probably think the soil is made of steel or something.

>>23975862
Why didn't zeon make bombs with drills on them?

>>23956879
Bawoo is his custom MS you zoomie

>>23975486
I heard the G-Reco movies did reasonably well at the Japanese box office.

>>23975862
>Now why the fuck didnt zeon find it while controlling like 50% of the planet? idk spacenoids probably think the soil is made of steel or something.

The Amazon rainforest is thick, and no ground roads lead to Jaburo. It's hidden. Everything was airlifted inside using retractable camouflaged runways. Zeon had a very vague idea of where Jaburo was located but not a precise location. And even if they did, they didn't have the proper tools necessary for invasion. The base was fortified for the most part. It's like the Tokyo 3 Geofront from Evangelion. Buried deep underground and reinforced to withstand general bombing.

You need to use a high yield nuke, colony drop, modern bunker buster missile, or special drilling equipment to punch through a less defended area of Jaburo. Zeon chose to wait and use special digging mobile suits and we're planning to launch a massive invasion after digging invasion tunnels for several more months. But Char discovered an opening and Zeon gambled that Char would be able to cause serious damage to Jaburo from behind enemy lines while Zeon launched a rushed brute force air drop invasion using mobile suits. The plan failed.

>>23962031
>>23961717
>>23962006
>>23962012
Glemy's not a clone of Gihren, he's a clone in the same way Puru is, there's multiple Glemy clones running around and no one is the "original" because they made and grew multiple copies of the same egg that was fertilized with Gihren's sperm. Him being Gihren's illegitimate test tube son was hinted at in the past, but the whole clone thing was something newly introduced by the UC Engage game.

>>23976562
>same egg that was fertilized with Gihren's sperm
Nonsense.

>Gihren's illegitimate test tube son was hinted at in the past
He looks NOTHING like Gihren. Glemmy looks more like Char's illegitimate son.

>>23976569
>Nonsense
You can preserve eggs and sperm by freezing them.

>He looks NOTHING like Gihren.
He could take after his mom or one of Gihren's ancestors. Sons are not always carbon copies of their fathers, they only make up half of their genes.

>>23976579
>You can preserve eggs and sperm by freezing them.
>He could take after his mom or one of Gihren's ancestors. Sons are not always carbon copies of their fathers, they only make up half of their genes
Oh we're playing that game huh? Then why stop there? Why can't Glemmy be Kycillia's son? Maybe he's Dozle's son! Mineva looks nothing like Dozle after all. Or maybe Degwin had another kid and told no one. He could be Degwin's 6th child. Maybe Garma had a kid too!

>>23976569
just like Mineva doesn't look like her supposed father in the slightest. If their father is anything but good looking, you can rest assured his wife is, and of course their children would look good like the latter. Zeon Deikun himself wasn't exactly an adonis, but his wife was beautiful, and whose looks Casval and Artesia have took of? Same for Garma being the only good looking Zabi, only because ha had a different mother. Anime logic, anon

>>23976637
You are literally repeating what I just told you. Try again.

>>23975476
>Look at any UC Gundam created without war as a background setting
Gundam Pulitzer is very well-received so far.

>>23976232
Retard, I was talking about the start of the show. I mention the Bawoo in a later post - and eventually he deems himself too important to pilot at all, same way Haman does for 99% of ZZ.

>>23976637
>just like Mineva doesn't look like her supposed father in the slightest.
Maybe Mineva isn't Dozle's daughter then.

>>23976715
I mean, Dozle was a rapist in some side manga, so his wife cheating on him would have been a good comeuppance in that case

File: 1749919192717.jpg (950 KB, 1455x1920)

950 KB JPG

>>23976569
You have to remember that OYW aged people's appearance by a lot. Younger Gihren was a decent looking man.

>>23956601
and you FIND Joffrey and you FIND Joffrey

>>23961249
What "goodwill" are you referring to? Also, shouldn't they have been the Green Team given their Islamist shtick?

>>23956601
If Glemmy is Joffrey, then who's supposed to be Bobby B?

>>23968570
Now this is something I've always seen here but never substantiated. The actual thing I remember reading a quote for is that Char's plot in CCA was going to be in ZZ, before the movie was greenlighted. But that doesn't mean Char would have Glemy's role, and frankly I've always doubted it since he represents the Zabi loyalist take on Zeon, opposite Char's Zeon and Haman's Zeon.

My personal take is that the Zeon Civil War was meant to be a 3-Way conflict.

>>23981862
Char was supposed to lead his own Zeon faction and start a rebellion in ZZ. Most likely he would appear and shock everyone with his own faction and troops. Perhaps even some people defect from Haman and join Char.

When Tomino changed his mind and didn't want to use Char in ZZ, the staff had to rush to change the ZZ story. So they chose a random blonde background character to replace Char. Then tweaked the story a bit to have them betray Haman.

>My personal take is that the Zeon Civil War was meant to be a 3-Way conflict
Nope. That ZZ staff have already explained it to us in interviews. Glemmy was a nobody that they used to replace Char. It was a last minute rushed decision. No 3 way conflict. Glemmy's original name was Axis Zeon "Soldier A". He was meant to be just a background character that appears in a few scenes originally.

File: v5u07jb7rqfb1.jpg (24 KB, 500x375)

24 KB JPG

>>23980603
gimme a HUG man

>>23981222
He had the episode with Roux and the other blonde guy in the desert about a man's convictions, then his encounter with the arab nationalists further fuels the discontent/distrust he has with Haman's current Zeon. It wasn't shown yet that he'd directly go against her his own way until after Dublin is hit and Ple Two shows up

>>23956601
He reminds me more of Ramsay Bolton

>>23982341
You will not get a hug.

File: file.png (2.19 MB, 2048x1448)

2.19 MB PNG

Japs will draw anything man

>>23982341
Why is he all cockeyed?

>>23993077
You don't know what those words mean

>>23975425
Surgery leaves bruises?

File: 1785874924585837.jpg (26 KB, 600x337)

26 KB JPG

>>23975425
There's also what ever this was they were doing to little kid banagher

>>23995938
Yeah, typically you get bruises where they make cuts.

>>23995938
they're doing massive invasive work on your insides, why the fuck wouldn't there be bruises?