The Sazabi had WEAK beam sabres...

I was just watching the 08th MS Team, and some guerillas take out a Zaku with fucking grenades. Aside from some very basic rules like the Gundam being immune to most projectile weapons, there has never been a second of thought put into the capabilities of weapons and armour in this universe, they really do just decide what should happen completely at random.

I'd also like to know why it's possible for a melee weapon to project a continuous beam when beam rifles run out of power rather quickly.

>>24030036
>Geara Dogas have paper armor
>Sazabi has weak beam sabers
>Char wanted to be defeated
Or maybe CCA has shit fight choreography.

>>24030003
How would lost its legs it hit one of thickest parts of the armor?

>>24030056
Armor was meaningless at this point in the Universe.
Nu was killing Dogas through their shields with its head Vulcans.
A beam shot or saber only gets stopped by I-fields at this point in canon (unless plot armor)

>>24030003
How? You can clearly see the saber is pointed right at Nu's groin, between the legs. The angle is wrong to destroy the waist and therefore detach the legs, it can only take out the frontal groin and front skirt, neither of which are critical components since Amuro wasn't intending to literally assrape the Sazabi.

>>24030042
>I'd also like to know why it's possible for a melee weapon to project a continuous beam when beam rifles run out of power rather quickly.
It's only losing mass when it comes into contact with something and the containing i-field is breached.

>>24030067
if you pay attention to angle relative to the start of the gash, the angle would have bisected the pelvic region

>>24030058
it still a thick part of the body. It's not a beam rifle shot, it's a beam saber glance.

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>>24030003
stfu char

more like plot armuro amirite

>>24030081
>it still a thick part of the body. It's not a beam rifle shot, it's a beam saber glance.
>saber glance
It's a saber at a 45 degee angle at the top third of the waist section.
sabers don't glance in gundam
they go right through

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>>24030092
it still hot a non critical part full of fucking mass. Why didn't you think it took that long for the beam saber to burn through the cod piece. it's not the same as the nu cutting off sazabi's arm at the elbow joint

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>>24030003
>>24030042
beam sabers aren't always at full length . They have a start up and full power for every swing. Though char did whine that his beam saber was running out of charge

>>24030098
>beam sabers aren't always at full length . They have a start up and full power
you do realize that low level industrial plasma jets emit particles at 10 km/s?
larger units are in excess of 120 km/s.

>>24030098
>beam sabers aren't always at full length
This was only a thing during CCA for some reason.

>>24030125
the speed only helps if they didn't set the beam edge to be shorter on purpose

>>24030098
You are right. At that angle, the beam saber should have melted the chest and cockpit. Or at the very least melt the cockpit door open.

>>24030139
Turn A and Victory do the same thing with beam sabers most of the time

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>>24030139
>>24030190
F91 did it as well sometimes, but just as often the beam saber might stay extended or even turn all the way off instead of just shortening itself, so it might be a thing the pilot can set as a preference on his MS. Some old sources said sabers would shorten when not attacking since it was for saving power, but newer ones like Unicorn have added that certain sabers can switch to a higher power but shorter length mode as well.

>>24030219
If beam sabers can turn off and on instantaneously, then Why bother with a "low power" setting? Just keep the saber off until you need it.

Char canonically wanted to get cucked by Amuro. He literally gave him the data.

>>24030058
The Sazabi literally tanks a beam rifle hit in the movie.

>>24030003
For one the Sazabi shouldn't even have the beam tomahawk. The Sazabi only has one, and is only ever shown with one, and he throws it tomahawk style at Amuro earlier in the battle to take out the Nu's rifle and loses it, then magically gets a new one. And the Sazabi should've lost first. There are multiple occasions before that fight where Amuro's saber cuts through just Char's weapons without extending through to the suit, even though there are multiple occasions where both of their sabers fully extend through enemy suits. Literally the first battle where Amuro gets the edge over him with the ReGZ and cuts his rifle, when he cuts through Char's beam beam rifle in the final duel, and when he cuts through the small saber.

And Char's saber being short is his own fault because he was spamming everything he had at Amuro. The Sazabi starts running low on power earlier in the fight.

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>>24030149
You realize if the Nu's saber was at full length Char would've died sooner right? Char's saber was out of juice and Amuro's wasn't and the Sazabi's cockpit is in the head. It would've destroyed the Sazabi's head before Amuro even thrusted. We see shots of the Nu's saber's full length flickering and it's as tall as the Nu Gundam

Tomino has never really cared much about consistency in "power levels" like that. He wants the world and tech to make sense but he doesn't care about armor penetration.

I get the feeling that his number 1 priority in fight scenes is looking cool and appealing, if he wants the fight to last longer he does that staging thing where they shoot each others equipment off piece by piece first. Otherwise he lets the animators do what they wanna do.

Pretty sure his personal annoyance is when the mobile suits look too human and he still lets that slide sometimes.

>>24030283
The sabers retracting and extending in CCA was really him trying to make them make them more realistic, since they aren't solid blades, there's no reason they'd be on all the time and could be done withem just extending when necessary. But it resulted in odd animation at points. There's a reason no other director tries to mimic that.

>>24030306
Yeah beam sabers are closer to fucky plasma torches than lightsabers or at least should be on paper. Probably a pain in the ass to keep track of that for most fight scenes

>>24030247
I dunno, in Gundam they're kinda autistic about response and reaction times and a beam saber already lit-up is half ready to use compared to a saber that's totally off. That why I already said there's some fights where the saber just turns off after a swing instead of shortening

>>24030272
>You realize if the Nu's saber was at full length Char would've died sooner right? Char's saber was out of juice

Char's beamsaber wasn't running out of power. Beam sabers connect directly the hand plug on the mobilesuit which connects to the reactor. As long as the reactor runs, the beams saber will have power.

>>24030346
Amurofags reach deep into their asses to explain his plot armor

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>>24030190
>>24030219
A Jegan does it in unicorn too

>>24030346
The tiny handplug providing both enough power to run an active saber and the plasma to replenish it seems highly unlikely. A data connection and maybe the electricity would be much more plausible.

>>24030346
Sazabi was also using its mega spray launcher a lot in between the fights so its probably running low by the final fight.

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>>24030346
there are so many things in animation that wouldn't work if what you said was true

>amuro's saber running out of power while it's in his hand, so he has to manhandle the gouf in 0079
>gato throwing a beam saber as a decoy to trick and confuse kou during the duel after the EFSF fleet got nuked in 0083
>yazan grabbing a gelgoog's beam naginata to use while fighting kamille inside the derelict gwazine in 0087
>alternatively there's kamille throwing a spinning beam saber and shooting at it to disperse beam energy in ANT trilogy
>yazan in a junior MS stealing the zeta's beam saber to try and roast judau alive with it in 0088

>>24030346
Yes it was. Char remarks that he's losing power after using the stomach mounted mega particle cannon and then during the duel that his saber is weaker, which isn't normally the case.
>As long as the reactor runs, the beams saber will have power.
If this were the case beam sabers from UC0093 forward wouldn't have the idling limiter which specifically exists to save power.

>>24030399
The beam saber has its own internal battery, but it also has a connection to the hand plug of the mobile suit. It does not run out of power if the reactor is running.

>>24030306
It shows up in 0080 in a small way, with the alex holding its saber in the zaku fight with only a small amount of energy coming out until it swings.
I guess tomino changed his mind because things post CCA have beam sabers and shields being active for free.
>>24030399
Beam sabers staying active while released shows up a lot, there's also a fun discussion in how beam sabers have a habit of sticking to things. You can shove a beam saber into something and let it go and it'll somehow hold there. One or two scenes where things are suspended in the air by being held up by a beam saber, too.
I think tomino just places a cool scene as being much higher priority than always making sense. Usually. And everyone else has their own taste and expression. Yas loves to depict the mechs as acting like big humans, which tomino doesn't like.

>>24030378
>>24030401
>>24030399
A Zaku II cannot grab and use a beam saber because it doesn't have the required hand power plug to use it.

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>>24030426

>>24030139
And interestingly enough, the Gustavs at Ayers Rock are seen doing this too, specifically that shot after the first swing against the Xi at the beginning of the skirmish. It's blink and miss, but it makes a bit more sense in 3d I think.

>>24030003
It should have but it wouldn't sell any many toys if it was thrown into the pile of absolutely shit mobile suits that are 100% at fault for getting their pilots killed like the Re-GZ

>>24030446
Lack of maintenance.

>>24030437
it doesn't need a handplug to power a saber when the saber already works without needing a handplug at all

>>24030480
Then a Zaku 2 should have no problem using beam sabers and beam rifles.

fuck Amuro, he deserved to die

>>24030485
>>24030480
Beam weapons need to be plugged in to start up, but don't need to be plugged in to keep going. A zaku could pick up a light beam saber and swish it around, but couldn't turn it on.

>>24030488
That's not what you said earlier.

>>24030487
>t. Nanai

>>24030485
why the fuck do you think the zaku beam sniper has the oversized backpack to make the rifle work? literally think before you speak

>>24030488
>>24030496
Worker MS with shitty claw hands can pick up beam sabers and turn them on

>>24030558
>why the fuck do you think the zaku beam sniper has the oversized backpack to make the rifle work? literally think before you speak
Because it needs...shocking...a reactor to power the beam rifle and beam saber. Just like anon said.

>>24030559
then why is some fucker above claiming it needs a handplug?

>>24030565
The original claim is that beam sabers will not run out of energy when connected by a handplug. The reactor can provide energy to keep the beam saber going.

Several anons are arguing no. Other anons don't think there's a handplug for beam sabers and only for beam rifles. Other anons think the beam saber runs on a battery and the hand plug isn't needed or can't provide power to the beam saber.

Didn't the original Gundam's rifle and sabers have their own power supply which is why they conked out so often and he had to go for fisticuffs? And Handplugs and ecaps only became a thing after MSG

>>24030739
Yeah. New mobile suits made after the original generation have handplugs. And they definitely have them by the time CCA roles around.

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>>24030739
>>24030754
No, handplugs were always a thing. We see Shiro adjust the Ground Gundam's beam saber from the wrist as well as a shot of the actual handplug and locking mechanism. And the Ground Gundams were built before the RX-78-2, being made from the -1 leftovers at Jaburo. That doesn't mean they can deliver enough power to keep beam sabers running indefinitely. We know that for a fact because the Gundam runs out of beam saber juice more than once in the show. And only beam rifles are pointed out, as of Gryps-era suits, to receive enough power to fire continuously, but even they can run out of energy momentarily. And beam rifles also have more parts and functionality than beam sabers so there's no reason to assume that beam sabers can do the same.

>>24030754
>>24030739
8th MS Team has ground Gundams with handplugs in 0079

>>24030789
>That doesn't mean they can deliver enough power to keep beam sabers running indefinitely
So they do deliver power via the handplug. Finally you admit it. Case closed.

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>>24030789
>>24030346
>>24030378
>>24030399
>>24030480
>>24030558
>>24030565
>>24030739
The handplugs DO deliver power. As we see in 0083 when Gato increased the power level of the Gp02 hand plug to give his beam saber a bigger beam. The handplug and wrist are even sparking and shooting out bits of electricity. So they clearly provide plenty of power.

Lmao at this all these losers not using newtype hax to increase the size of their beam sabers to cut all the way across the battlefield

>>24031353
Or running a plasma torch at well over its recommended levels produces arcing around nearby metal. Also worth keeping in mind that this is a series that doesn't understand how its own bazooka works and they just drew something they thought looked cool (which it does, so good for them). Strict adherence to realism or physics was not a priority.

It's plausible, but not certain, that they run power to the sabers that way, but it's also clearly demonstrated that that's not enough to run them indefinitely because we see them run out.

>>24031467
>It's plausible, but not certain, that they run power to the sabers that way, but it's also clearly demonstrated that that's not enough to run them indefinitely because we see them run out.
I recall the Sazabi databooks say the reactor size and output was specifically increased because of all the demands of the beam weapons.

>>24031503
And yet it's not enough. The Sazabi experiences power issues in the movie. And it's rare but recurring issue with MS with high firepower. The ZZ also has power issues. So does the V2 when it overuses the wings of light. MS can exhaust their reactors and whatever internal reserves they have.

>>24031509
>The Sazabi experiences power issues in the movie
Just an excuse to give Amuro a win he doesn't deserve

>>24031509
>And yet it's not enough. The Sazabi experiences power issues in the movie.
I think that has more to do with the Sazabi already suffering battle damaged. By the time the duel happened with Nu Gundam, Sazabi was already somewhat battered and suffered reactor damage. Amuro forced Char to chase him throughout the battlefield and Amuro landed several hits to the torso of Sazabi.

>>24031514
movie amuro was a monster who nearly mogged char in a fucking regz.

>>24031514
If anything the movie is exaggerating Char's talents by implying him vs Amuro is a close fight when they are in basically equivalent MS. Remember that Amuro completely mogged his special Gelgoog in gramps without breaking a sweat, and even pulled out a minor victory against the far superior Zeong (enough of the Gundam was intact to help Amuro escape later, whereas nothing was left of the Zeong).
Then in Zeta, Char gets outfought a few times whereas Amuro only shows any signs of struggle the first time he gets back in a MS after many years without using one.
If anything the Nu should be slightly superior to the Sazabi (more time to get psychoframe tech working right, Fin Funnels, stronger beam saber) so Char fought better than he ever had before on-screen just to make it a close fight.

>>24030003
>Char aims for Amuros metaphorical dick
>Later rants that the women he killed could've been Chars mom
What did Char mean by this?

>>24031619
>minor victory against the far superior Zeong
It was a tie.

>>24031622
Char aims for the metaphorical dick because he literally got cucked by Amuro

>>24031568
Wut? Sazabi never takes damage prior to engaging Amuro. Char spends most of the battle picking off nukes with his funnels. The only time he engages in MS battle is against a few Jegans escorting Ra Cailum that he effortlessly slaughters without any of them landing a hit on him.

If anything the opposite is true. Amuro actually had to fight his way through most of the Neo Zeon army, Quess and Gyunei before he even got to Char, lsong his shield and most of his funnels in the process. It actually makes his victory more impressive, since he's been fighting for maybe hours at that point while Char is well rested in comparison.

>>24031758
You are misremembering events. Char and Amuro had multiple clashes. Char takes damage to the chest area where the reactor is located. Amuro ran away several times forcing Char to chase, fight through Jegans, and reach Amuro again. During the final clash, the Sazabi was already battered. I'm guessing that was Amuro's strategy. Slowly drag Char through the whole battlefield, make Char use up his weapons, and wear down Sazabi. A smart move.

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>>24030003
The Nu Gundam is not just for show

>>24031619
Char's Newtype abilities hadn't even fully manifested in 0079; he was the underdog in every fight. He also has arguably the weakest non-grunt suit in Zeta yet still manages to (just) survive while having to contend with Haman and Scirocco at the same time. There isn't a single pilot who didn't almost die more than once in Zeta; you people peddling this ancient "Char is a bad pilot" meme simply didn't watch the same shows I did.

>>24030003
>dealt by beam sabres in established canon, the Nu should have lost its legs and been defeated here.
Did you miss Char's complaint of his MS:
>POWER DOWN DATTO?! EIIIIIIIII

>>24031854
Amuro isn't even paying attention to Char at all. He leaves the Nu Gundam out in the middle of Axis's surface to go see if the nukes are ready to blow inside. The entire fight is Char chasing after Amuro trying to get his attention. The entire "battle" is underneath Amuro. He gives more attention to gas tanks and ships on Axis rather than Char. It's only when they come out of Axis that Amuro finally has no choice but to give Char the attention that he wants. Char's like a little boy angry that daddy is too busy for him the entire film.

>>24031885
>>24031858
The best part about the Sazabi is that it was Char's first time using it. Yet he did that well in it.

>>24031893
>Char's first time using
He sortied in it against ReGZ to pick up Gyunei?

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>>24031858
>He also has arguably the weakest non-grunt suit in Zeta
Where does this delusion come from? The Hyaku Shiki is the mid-stage prototype for the Zeta Gundam. It's the Gundam half of the Zeta Gundam, with the flying armor being the waverider half. It's one of the best suits in the show and even in ZZ Judau's crew fight over who gets to pilot it. It even has the same kit that the Zeta does, like the Mega Bazooka Launcher and the Hyper Mega Launcher (which is weaker but can fire faster).

>>24031896
Because it's a stripped down version of the Delta Gundam with an inferior moveable frame. It doesn't even have a shield. At best it's about the same as or weaker than the Gundam Mark 2. Hyaki Shiki was definitely outdated by the time of the mid Zeta anime.

>>24031906
It's literally a direct improvement over the Mk-II.
>Because it's a stripped down version of the Delta Gundam with an inferior moveable frame.
No? It's a prototype of the Zeta's frame. The Delta Gundam didn't even have a movable frame, and the design failed before it was even constructed. The Hyaku Shiki is 90% of the way to the Zeta. The fact it got a ton of spinoffs and an attempt at mass production is proof of how good it was.

>>24031909
>No?
Yes. It's a stripped down Delta Gundam with a hastily produced moveable frame that was quickly cloned off of Gundam Mark 2 and quickly shoved into an existing design. It was rushed and quickly given to the AEUG in Episode 9 because they wanted to attack Jaburo with it. This was super early in the anime, and the Shiki never got any upgrades or improvements unlike the Gundam Mark II with its Super Gundam upgrade. Char had to use the same suit for 40 episodes.

>The Hyaku Shiki is 90% of the way to the Zeta.
Nibba the thing doesn't even transform. Don't give me that.

>>24031928
No, it wasn't. >>24031896 is from the official Sunrise website.

>stripped down Delta Gundam
>movable frame
Make up your mind. It's either a stripped down Delta Gundam or it's a new design with a new frame. You're saying two totally contradictory things. Movable Frames ARE the MS, the armor goes on top of the fully functional frame. They even suggest it in the show when they fix up the old gelgoog for Reccoa and say it's basically a Nemo underneath. The Hyaku Shiki can't be both a stripped down Delta Gundam and a clone of the Mk-II. It inherited features from both machines as well as the Rick Dias. It's the culmination of three streams of designs. Even the most vague and word salad databooks that try to contradict Sunrise admit that much.

>improvements unlike the Gundam Mark II with its Super Gundam upgrade
Because it doesn't need them.
>Char had to use the same suit for 40 episodes
And Kamille had the Zeta for nearly 30.

>Nibba the thing doesn't even transform. Don't give me that.
Neither does the ReGZ but it's repeatedly said to be equivalent of the Zeta.

>>24031966
>Make up your mind. It's either a stripped down Delta Gundam or it's a new design with a new frame.
They are not mutually exclusive. Hyaku Shiki is a modified Delta Gundam with a moveable frame that has been tweaked after studying the Gundam Mark 2. It's not a 100% brand new suit and it's not a brand new frame. It's also a very early model that was rushed into service for the attack on Jaburo.

>>24031639
>Amuro can at least evacuate using his Gundam
>Char can't evacuate using his Zeong
That's a minor victory for the Gundam in my books, if the circumstances were slightly different Char would have died due to lacking an escape option.
>>24031858
I never said Char is a bad pilot, just that he is consistently shown to be a full level below Amuro until CCA, where they are almost equal.
The fight inside the colony laser is weird because the whole reason Char shows up is to prevent Scirocco from disabling the laser. He gets rekt, understandably considering the quality of their respective MS and Haman's involvement, and retreats further in. Haman follows. At this point, there's absolutely nothing stopping Scirocco from just smashing up the colony laser and achieving what he came here to do, but he chooses to follow Char and Haman instead, which directly leads to the Titans fleet getting wiped out. Char succeeds in his mission, but only because Scirocco has a retard moment - easily the biggest plothole in Zeta's conclusion.

You people are funny. Did all of you have amnesia? The Zeong was originally designed for TWO pilots. One on the head and the other in the chest. Char piloted the entire thing himself despite the huge strain it put on him.

>>24032783
>That's a minor victory for the Gundam in my books, if the circumstances were slightly different Char would have died due to lacking an escape option.
The head was the escape option. Char could have run away and Amuro would have lost. Amuro is lucky that Char wanted to keep fighting and not get on a ship and go elsewhere.

>>24033524
At that point the Zeong was far more damaged than the Gundam was so I really don't see your point. Amuro would have "lost" what exactly? Just the head of the Gundam? That's at best a mission kill, far less substantial than what had happened to the Zeong.

>>24034009
Amuro's objective was to defeat Char and kill the Zabi family (particularly Giren).

Char's objective was to defeat the Gundam.

It was a tie.

>Just the head of the Gundam?
No. The Gundam head, left arm, and both beam sabers were destroyed. The only thing left was the right arm and the beam rifle (which only had 2 or 3 shots left and was low on energy).

>>24030003
Truuuue.

>>24031890
Not really. Amuro was doing hit and run tactics and wearing down Sazabi's weapons. He knows he can't take a fresh Sazabi head-on without taking serious damage. By the time the final clash happens, Sazabi is a bit battered, the chest has been blasted twice and made the chest cannon broken, and Char's beam sabers seem to be running low on power for whatever reason. Sazabi is literally running on empty.

>>24031894
Not only that but he'd had it for a while even before that part. Anaheim had built it months prior.

>>24034635
>>24031894
Char said it was his first time using Sazabi. I don't care what manga says.

>>24034753
The movie itself shows Char using Sazabi several times prior to their duel.

>>24034762
Anon. He's talking about the opening of the movie. During the entire conflict, this is the first time Char has used the suit. Char didn't have many months of live training and experience like he did with his older suits like his Zaku 2, Gelgoog, or Hyaku Shiki.

>>24034802
Well why is that anything to be admired? Sazabi was so overpowered compared to the ReGZ that it could have crushed it effortlessly with no training if Char wasn't holding back because he knew Nu Gundam was being built. By the time they have their major duel he's had time to get a feel for it

When in the movie does he say it was his first time in the Sazabi? All I see him saying is that it was Neo Zeon's first major battle which doesn't mean the same thing

>>24034814
No stop. Shut up with that nonsense. We don't need a manga story where Char uses the Sazabi for an entire year before the movie because you say "even though this is neo Zeon's first battle well technically they never said he didnt use it so we can make up a story where Char fights Amuro months before the movie in Sazabi."

Same nonsense where Tomino said there were no more wars or battles between CCA and Gundam F91. That they entered an era of peace.

Then fans like you said "lol. Tomino never said there wasn't any CONFLICTS though. So we're gonna make a bunch of mangas where the Federation continues fighting Neo Zeon and a bunch of other factions leading up to Gundam F91 movie. But it doesn't count because the Federation never officially declared war so it doesn't contradict Tomino!"


Get out of here with your word games.

>>24034819
that's all well and good but it doesn't really answer the question

>>24034808
>By the time they have their major duel he's had time to get a feel for it
The entire conflict only lasts a few days. A week tops. Do you seriously think Char mastered Sazabi in such a short time? If so, then you must admit Char is a better pilot than Amuro since Amuro struggled with Nu Gundam for several days and didn't adapt nearly as quickly.

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>>24034884
that's the thing, ain't it? char is more consistent of a pilot in general but amuro has the potential to hit higher highs and lower lows

>>24031890
>He leaves the Nu Gundam out in the middle of Axis's surface to go see if the nukes are ready to blow inside. The entire fight is Char chasing after Amuro trying to get his attention
Amuro literally hijacked a couple bazookas and tried to kill Char inside the asteroid. Char dodged all the attacks. Your memory is bad.

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>>24034802
>>24034762
>>24034753
yeah, about that..............

>>24035058
This makes even less sense.

1. If Amuro knew the Sazabi existed much earlier, then he would have pushed for Nu Gundam much earlier too.

2. If Amuro knew the performance of the Sazabi, everyone would be analyzing the combat data and redesigning the Nu Gundam to be much better.

3. If Amuro knew the performance of the Sazabi, he would not take the Re-gz (no offense to regz fans) to fight Neo Zeon. Amuro would have taken a Zeta Gundam or demanded something better. Even a ZZ Gundam or an S Gundam.

>>24035090
easy answer is the federation said "no"

that's all there is to it, and it makes perfect sense.

>>24035125
Doesn't make sense. Londo Bell has special privileges and gets new ships and the latest generation mobile suits.

People shit on the Re-gz, but people forget that the other suits didn't exist.

In Tomino canon basically has Amuro go from:

Gundam ------> Dijeh ------> Re-GZ

All those in-between suits Bandai shoved in there never existed when Tomino made the animes.

Re-GZ WAS groundbreaking. A high performance limited mass production suit for the Zeta Gundam. It used a lot of Jegan parts. So that made repairs cheap and easy to repair in the field. It just wasn't quite enough to deal with Sazabi. So Nu Gundam was basically Amuro's Trump card. Him stepping into a Gundam for the first time in 14 years. Amuro's great return.


All the other shit Bandai added for Amuro piloting ruined the timeline. Zeta Gundams, custom Jegans, Rick Dijehs, more custom Re-gzs, and like 3 or 4 other suits I can't remember that Amuro also used. It makes no sense.

>>24035150
what are you talking about, how do you be a fan but not know that londo bell is always told NO because the feds don't care about them?

>Londo Bell has special privileges and gets new ships and the latest generation mobile suits
they receive NO reinforcements from the federation for a PLANET-KILLING threat. getting a couple of jegans (DEVLEOPED IN FUCKING 0089) is fucking nothing much in 0093. explain that

>All the other shit Bandai added for Amuro piloting ruined the timeline. Zeta Gundams, custom Jegans, Rick Dijehs, more custom Re-gzs, and like 3 or 4 other suits I can't remember that Amuro also used. It makes no sense.
how did you forget all the gundams they invented between 1979 and 1988? the zeta gundam, the ZZ gundam, the S gundam, the gundam mkV all exist and would have been better alternatives that already existed and didn't even need to be developed. even captured enemy suits could work.

THE REGZ NOT EVEN HAVING GUNDAM ARMOR IS A SHAM so that means they didn't even care about his well-being and protection

>>24035125
This anon is right. >>24035090 and >>24035150 don't understand that the Federation refused to give a Gundam to Amuro because they knew he would use it to overthrow the Federation. They knew that if they give him a fake Gundam, the enemy would laugh at Amuro, it's canon that Gyunei called the ReGZ a wannabe at least twice. There's also the fact that the Federation is known for being stingy and relying on Char to kill some poors on Earth so they can have more rich people on Earth. Dublin and Tibet were inside jobs by the Federation for the Federation.

>>24035161
Everything you are quoting is from extra manga that Tomino never approved.


>>24035167
>Federation refused to give a Gundam
No they didn't. Nu Gundam was already under construction.

In the Tomino timeline, all the other Gundams were destroyed.

1. 0079 Gundam was destroyed.

2. Gundam Mark 2 was half destroyed and abandoned.

3. Zeta Gundam was half destroyed and abandoned.

4. ZZ Gundam was stolen and went to Jupiter with Judah and never returned.

Amuro had no other Gundams to summon.

>>24035203
F91 wasn't destroyed

File: UCE_Narrative_B2_04.jpg (76 KB, 1000x562)

76 KB JPG

>>24035203
>>24035167
>>24035161
>>24035150
>>24035090
Unironically, if Amuro was given the prototype Nu Gundam/Mu Gundam or even the Narrative Gundam while Nu is still being built, he would have killed Char before the first asteroid drop.

specially if its Narrative, since it was built as a variable weapons platform of Nu, it can equip various equipment designed to defeat Sazabi.

Narrative B2packs would definitely kill Sazabi, A Gundam close to the performance of Nu, Jegan rifle and bazooka and 2 incom gatling guns that are anti funnels by spraying their beam everywhere Sazabi's strenghts are heavily countered

>>24035203
>3. Zeta Gundam was half destroyed and abandoned.

Nah, in Tomino's High Streamer, the Federation was explicitly said to be keeping the Zeta, or something else on its level, away from Amuro. Now, this is a different continuity and such, but it's clear he writes this with the idea of a following the previous tv series (like how the Zeta novel isn't a sequel to the MSG novels), so it's clear in Tomino's view the Zeta was a possible option.

>4. ZZ Gundam was stolen and went to Jupiter with Judah and never returned.
Is this actually Tomino's idea? I can't remember Judau taking the ZZ being mentioned in the ZZ finale.

>>24035254
>Nah, in Tomino's High Streamer, the Federation was explicitly said to be keeping the Zeta, or something else on its level, away from Amuro.
Seems dumb since Zeta isn't cutting edge anymore by 0093. It would just be collecting dust in some storage warehouse.

>>24035257
>24035090
Zeta was an overengineered monster and the Bio Sensor is always OP when a Newtype is in control of it. Amuro wasn't as powerful of a Newtype as Kamille, but he was much older, much more mature, and in better control of his emotions.

File: MSZ-006-3A_Zeta_Gundam_3A(...).jpg (77 KB, 536x879)

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there's no point in trying to make sense of Amuro in between Zeta and CCA.

he has a Zeta in space, he has a Zeta Plus in earth, but used a Dijeh and modified it for able to use it in space and bring it to space but got stomped by Sazabi.

everything is just to make more toys and sell them as "Amuro custom"

>>24035257
>>24035288

The Federation is also not a monolith. The faction blocking him from using the Zeta during CCA was likely different than the faction that funded the development of the ReGZ and the Nu.

>>24035429
Zeta was built and funded by the AEUG. Maybe AEUG forces rolled back into the Federation after the Gryps conflict and Neo Zeon war, but maybe not.

>>24035479
They were implied to have which is why the Federation is shown to have access to A.E.U.G. stuff later on.

>>24035486
Well like both sides, it's all designed by Anaheim, so it's not unlikely that Anaheim was selling the same tech to both sides (highest bidder.)
I think only Neo Zeon (non-Char) was making their own tech.

>>24035288
>Zeta was an overengineered monster
Not really. By the end of the anime, Zeta was starting to be overpowered by real monsters like Quebely and The O. Kamille designed the Zeta to be a fast and agile machine to make up for the Gundam Mark II always being slower than Titan's suits, and always being on the defensive in MS battles. We can see that during ZZ Gundam, the Zeta is completely outclassed by many Neo Zeon ace suits. Especially those that spam beam weapons.

>and the Bio Sensor is always OP when a Newtype is in control of it.

The Bio Sensor is a downgraded mass production version of Zeon's psycommu according to AE. It helps the suit respond faster if the pilot is a newtype but many other functions have been stripped out. Such as the ability to control funnels and bits

>>24035662
Fair. But remember that by ZZ, the pilots in the Zeta were not Newtypes (aside from Judau), and not of the same caliber as someone like Kamille or Amuro. Of course units like Quebely and The O were outstanding in their performance. They were one-off, custom-built monsters.
Stripped of funnel and bit control doesn't mean it's less effective. We've seen what Kamille did with the Bio Sensor.

>>24035690
>They were one-off, custom-built monsters.
not the qubeley. the MP models improved on the original qubeley in terms of firepower and the original qubeley probably also didn't fare well in terms of other specs like mobility

>>24035716
But the bits are undeniably a force multiplier against pretty much anything.

File: Evolve Psycho Finger.webm (3.79 MB, 640x360)

3.79 MB WEBM

>>24035662
>The Bio Sensor is a downgraded mass production version of Zeon's psycommu according to AE
that's just the fake excuse AE gave to hide development of the biosensor, how could you fall for marketing like that? you're the kind of titans officer in-universe who would actually fall for dumb shit like "oh this rick dias can't be an enemy design because anaheim developed it with the RMS model code". where's the original zeon version capable of even greater feats then?

it's an eldritch black box that allows supernatural powers, it's the fucking psycoframe before psychoframe, moving objects with the power of the mind, locking them in place with supernatural grip, and adding minovsky particles to beam length, and you still think it's mass production when that was the first model made lol

>many other functions have been stripped out. Such as the ability to control funnels and bits
haman didn't dare use her funnels more than she already did against the zeta because she'd be the victim of the first funneljacking, that's the canon reason why you don't see kamille controlling funnels with the zeta

>>24035761
>That webm
That red Zeta doesn't have a biosensor. Iirc it has some sort of special upgraded psycommu with reality bending powers built by Karaba.

Don't ask me how Karaba, a ragtag rebel group that survives on stealing surplus mobile suits and constantly being on the run, has scientists able to design a brand new cutting edge special upgraded psycommu system. Let alone have the money to fund such a project when Karaba is seen begging AEUG for spare mobile suits and supplies.

>you still think it's mass production when that was the first model made lol

Delta Plus had a biosensor but didn't do anything you described. The Zeta also didn't do any of the tests you described during ZZ. So I can only assume that Kamille was the actual powerhouse behind the Zeta. His newtype power is what created all that.

>>24035805
>Delta Plus had a biosensor but didn't do anything you described.
Mashymre's Zaku III had a biosensor and did similar feats. sounds like the delta pilots were just chud duds, like riddhe who didn't awaken until after his delta plus already got destroyed

>The Zeta also didn't do any of the tests you described during ZZ. So I can only assume that Kamille was the actual powerhouse behind the Zeta. His newtype power is what created all that.
It's a combination of the two. Kamille couldn't do any supernatural feats in the MK2 and judau never got angry enough while piloting the zeta, only with the ZZ.

>Don't ask me how Karaba, a ragtag rebel group that survives on stealing surplus mobile suits and constantly being on the run, has scientists able to design a brand new cutting edge special upgraded psycommu system.
>Let alone have the money to fund such a project when Karaba is seen begging AEUG for spare mobile suits and supplies.
you could literally replace the word karaba with AEUG and it'd still be the same thing. AEUG is simultaneously rich as fuck with anaheim money and poor and starving at all times to have to steal suits and ally with karaba AND haman's axis at times. I blame Tomino for not fixing the hypocrisy

>>24035826
My headcannon is that Karaba were Earth forces splinter groups that lost access to decent supply chains, while AEUG was space colonist billionaires/corporations/governments who could fund from the shadows, but had to be very careful with how they handled supplying things so they didn't get exposed to the Titans.

>>24035826
>Kamille couldn't do any supernatural feats
Kamille never got angry enough. For some reason, Kamille got extremely angry at Scirocco and triggered the newtype feats. I don't know exactly why he got so mad at him. Kamille barely knew Scirocco. If anything Kamille should be mad at Haman. She tried to kill Kamille and Char several times.

>>24035866
I think Scirocco pissed him off the most because of the way he kept using his newtype powers to hypnotize people.

File: Zeta Define Scirocco hypnotism.jpg (2.82 MB, 3432x1618)

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>>24035870
This is true

>>24035870
But how is that more infuriating than someone trying to kill you. Of all the things that could Kamille could get angry about and the crazy things he saw the Titans do, Kamille chooses to get mad at a random guy from Jupiter who was barely involved in the conflict until the last episodes of the TV show. It makes no sense

>>24035957
everyone's already out to kill him. scirocco's apparently a rival when it comes to newtype harem so he's especially a target to bear hatred on

>>24035981
Wait didn't Jerid kill Kamille's mom? Why not unleash newtype hatred on him?

>>24036001
Kamille moved on from the senselessness of his mom's death to the senselessness of all the death that was going on. He was reaching ascended space autism god head status,.

>>24035805
>So I can only assume that Kamille was the actual powerhouse behind the Zeta
No. Emma straight up tells Kamille the Zeta Gundam is a machine that can use the power of people's souls.

>>24035254
You're thinking of Beltorchika's Children where Amuro is spiritually a cuck. Even after he gets the Nu he implies it's trash compared to the Nightingale and laments barely getting "that" when Char has a fancy MS with a big cock. And the ReGZ's performance is equal to the Zeta's, it just lacks an actual transformation. And by some accounts it does have a biosensor.

>>24036063
>cuck
You use that word, but you don't know what it means.

>>24035058
Aren't most of the CCA cutscenes in Engage adapted from the Novel's take of events?