>CLOP has risen once more! Come play a fresh new round of the decade old browser game about building nations, geoponitics, and oppression!Build nations, make deals, forge alliances, BETRAY alliances! Pretend to be confused when they retaliate! Do whatever it takes to succeed in the chaotic political landscape.>Link to the game itselfhttps://4clop.org/>Previous threadshttps://rentry.co/clop-threadsCome join >CLOP and help make the drama happen!What's different?TNN and CEF can't decide on if they want to fight or not!People are harvesting DNA! GO KILL THEM!IRC is back!>Reset when?Negative 3 more weeks!
>>43508965>What's New?Dark Vessel and Aryanne are giving each other tossjobs behind the Denny's parking lot.War is cancelled. Prepare for 4 months of nothingburger.An alliance of pure zebras arrived. They'll starve to death in a day.Hostanon (WiK) is extremely proud of Steel Sanctuary and wants you to read it: https://poneb.in/3Mt5iYBQCRASHING THE COPPER MARKET WITH NO SURVIVORS
>>43508965Bumpa for increased production with reduced anti-revolutionary sentiment!!
Somebody kindly made a new landing page while I was struggling with an ancient exploit. They suggested at a brief "choose your nation" section, but I kinda like it as it is. Though I'll probably change the "guide" link to the hand-holding version since this one apparently confuses a lot of people.Thanks, Anon!https://4clop.org/welcome.htmlSomebody else has volunteered to make one so we might be revisiting this issue.
Hallo everyone, I made myself a userscript that I've been using for the past couple of weeks, and I think it's useful enough to share: https://github.com/luftkrieghoofler/4clopX>what does it doAdds live refresh, desktop notifications, small quality of life to nation and action UIs.Completely overhauls the marketplace UI, makes it a tabbed view that you can refresh without "Try again.", lets you hide markets you don't use and watch markets for notifications.Also whenever you do anything like build a building, it checks if this would kill your nation or destabilise your stockpiles, and shows an "are you sure" warning if it's risky, so when making builds it's a lot easier to make sure you don't fuck up and accidentally build the wrong thing and end up with -500 sat per tick because your bars were 2 cider short or whatever.Install violentmonkey/greasemonkey and grab the release link from the README.Obviously let me know (in-game or itt) if there's any issues for you, I don't expect it to blow up but I have been the only one using it so far. Also let me know if you have feedback/suggestions.It currently doesn't touch messages so it's compatible with the existing message reorganisation userscript, though in the future I plan on also making an even better Messages replacement too (if I get around to it before the game dies...)
>>43508965Tir na Nog is currently going through some internal political restructuring and the voluntary reassignment of key roles to match with historical (e.g. pre-4clop) precedent; we may behave slightly differently going forwards, since our leadership operates on a majority-rules system and 1/3 of our leadership has decided to quit the game. Because we lost 1/3 of leadership (notably leadership that joined after we were already established in prior iterations), certain policy choices may be different moving forwards.I retain my own position and role, and all independence guarantees remain in position; TNN reaffirms its commitment to its guarantees (I will admit that the guarantees were initially my idea), and is considering ways to further help independents moving forwards. Praise be to the Princess of the Night! For the New Lunar Republic!
>>43509327>since our leadership operates on a majority-rules systemthere's the problem. you need a strong mare to handle everything and be accountable
drugs give me drugs give me drugs
>>43509140don't use this it's an ip grabber
>>43509140neat!
>>43509419they wanna know where I pee?
I'M CLOOOPING!
>>43509642This.Where's the lewd?When and how do I fuck the big fish?Where do I watch the Aryanne x DV tapes?And most impotantlyWhere's the dashie and rarara lesbian hatefuck fight?
>>43509652IWTCIRD and Rarity fight had to be postponed due to pool aids.We are sorry you were looking forward to the intense scenes in that show.
>>43509652>When and how do I fuck the big fish?The big fish could probably fuck your house instead Anon, I get being adventurous but think of the size of that hole.
>>43509920The big fish can fuck my car
>>43509920Fine, I'm fucking Luna instead...>Which Luna?Yes.
>>43509642CLOP CLOP CLOP
I need some WAR in this stupid WAR game. Why is everyone so peaceful? Kill each other faggots. Shit is boring
>>43510715Why don't YOU do it huh
>>43508965What should i name my nation?
>>43510797Well the game has exactly two big alliances right now, so decide which one you want to align with, and pick something themed.There's also a couple of tiny alliances and a gaggle of independents, so you can try being alone as well.The game doesn't really support roleplaying per se in the gameplay, but IMO it's still a bit more fun if you have some little bit of lore for your nation and its goals so it's not a complete pure spreadsheet simulator
>>43510809What exactly are the two big alliances? Not that i neccesarily want to theme my nation after them, but im just curious.
>>43510838TNN are the lunarists, but also founded by and mostly composed of oldfag discord trannies, who have played the initial iterations of the game 12+ years ago and some of them apparently don't even care about ponies and just join to tryhard the spreadsheet simulator.CEF are the solarists, and by all appearances look to be the same faction as when CLOP was revived for the first time in like a decade two years ago, so some of them are not brand new this time around but are still newfags in the sense of not having been around back in the ancient historic versions. Last time around they were the Changeling Economic Forum, now there's no hint of changelings and instead they've got an Aryanne and are praising the sun.
>>43510854Very balanced description of TNNTNN is a mix of old and newfags, and we are the lunarists. We do care about ponies! We even have a channel specifically dedicated to simping for Best Princess.We do coordinate on Discord, but it's a useful tool.
>>43510863Also: >saying that the alliance with Luna Makes Me Hard isn't full of broniesThe only one I remember as not being pony-obsessed is the specific member who just left, so we do have brony purity again.
>top messageContext please?
>>43510957>Context please?>Aryanne of CEF. Are you really so petty and vindictivechad yes>you’d punish a whole alliance for the actions of one nation?I would also like context and assume this is a TNN psyop. You really should raid your members bits so they don't have enough left to shitpost on top message- Aryanne Hoofler
>The UNholy based
Zaam must die
>>43511233The Independent Nations Congress is delighted to announce that we passed our first resolution! And it only took us... 3 days! That's democracy for ya!See ya at the next one, the Second Independent Nations Congress!We are publishing the negotiations log for the sake of transparency. You can find it and track our activity (resolutions, status, logs of negotiations) on our great great webs ite:https://rentry.co/clopINC
>>43511233>>The UNa group of mostly tiny independent nations with no power or authority, so the extent of their resolutions would be writing a sternly worded letterseems about right
Is oppression truly the most useless government type
>>43511283Oppression is the lategame mega-empire government type.
>>43511283No, that would be Authoritarianism. GDP modifier overshadowed by the democratic routes, but doesn't give anything worthwhile in return. Every other government has something it's best at except Authoritarianism.Oppression in particularly is the ONLY way to reduce the empire sat penalty, so if you've got 4+ nations it becomes the nearly mandatory government type.
Mini Pony Armor Icons
>>43511233holy basedCongratulations Independent Nations on your congress and resolution.-Zerg V.
>>43510869I was mentioned.Have some luna marepussy:https://derpibooru.org/images/3888874Not posted as a straight image cause the mods are fags that don't enjoy succulent mare labia.
>>43511233Nobody noticed Zaam signed with zebra dicks
>>43511297>if you've got 4+ nations it becomes the nearly mandatory government typeWill this happen on this iteration
>>43511497no lol
>>43511233>signs mutual defense treaty>fucking dies
>>43511497just whack the spice trade and you have four more nations
>>43511768>spice trade shafted in every single iterationsad, really
>>43511497I hope so. Either way nation farming in some form is pretty likely for next round, so if not now it will return eventually.I suspect that some form of nation farming will make war MORE common if implemented correctly. I get the impression that everyone's hesitant to start anything since it's too risky. Give up one nation to your opponent and suddenly you're against an overwhelming force. If the big boys had empires of 5 or maybe even 10 nations, not so much.It would have to be very expensive and slow, though. Conquest should still be the most desirable route.
>>43511768And simultaneously get whacked by TNN
>>43511862So, what you mean, is that we can get our war if CEF goes after spice?
>stalliongrad already dying to rebelsIT'S HAPPENING
>>43512188All according to keikaku (Keikaku means plan)
Whoever is writing the news reports in the situation room know that I see you and I love you.
>>43512203/)There should be two for every major incident. One from a Solar perspective and one from a Lunar one. We'll see how long I stick with it.Submissions are welcome.
>>43512203I'm retarded, situation room where
First blood has been drawn... And it's between two TNN members
>>43512741From what I heard he's abdicating, and the transfer of power was bloodless
>>43508970>Hostanon (WiK)Huh WiK is still alive?
>>43508970Update: the alliance of zebras starved to deathUpdate Update: DNA harvesting has begun
>>43511298Cute btw
I NEED DRUGS
>>43513546Thank you... I wanted to do it for all of the sprites...
>>43512876I'm surprised too!I've actually got stuff to post if people still care, but I don't know if it's good enough to be worth reading. There was a lot of rust to knock off when I made it.
>>43514116I haven't read any greens in like a decade, did Redshift get finished or abandoned? I remember it being cool
>>43513062>DNAOh wow it's REALLY started >>43514116Post it
>>43512389I waited after searching and not finding anything in the game itself,so all can guess is >dicksword probably
>>43514594Nigger hover over the war dropdown and its at the very bottom. A button called 'Situation Room'
>>43514603I thought that was a work in progress page, was looking around for things related to news, stats or stuff
>>43514116>got stuff to post if people still careDepends on what it is. If it's Voidborne, and is still just ponies being stupid then no. If it's Voidborne, ponies realizing how stupid they are wanting a metal ball suddenly appearing to be the mayor and actual progression of the main story then yes. If it's something else then yes.
Speaking of news, am I blind/retarded or is there no News entry for DNA harvesting starting in Starlight Reach? I see news items for every other nation that's built DNA but not Starlight Reach
>>43514682Host in collusion with CEF confirmed
>>43514728>hiding TNN activity>that must be CEF collusion!are you braindead
>>43514879There was an announcement for DNA harvesting in Starlight Reach btw, it's in page 2.
>>43514904Oh, I am indeed blind then.Although not entirely because the announcement is in a totally different format for some reason. Ok at least it's there then, cool
why are market prices so expensive
>>43515406Probably because there arent many people actually selling to drive those prices.You could also just reach out to nations and work out trades.
>>43515406You need to do covert scheming.Pay 10000 oil to two competing nations to start dumping the oil prices. Then buy out the competition and those two when they're not expecting it.
o-oh
>>43515676why does silverspire get mentioned twice?
>>43516262cause they built two of them, anon...
>>43516303wtf
>>43516303>neither TNN nor CEF have a N. Prze>the only active N. Prze builds two facilitieshmmmlooks like neither was able to secure an exclusivity deal
>>43516303>>43516330>"Following up on last week's developing story, reports have emerged that Silverspire's movements in North Przewalskia have allegedly given way to the construction of a massive facility in the Frozen North.">"Investigators suggest that this development may be part of the larger 'science rush' in the greater world, as the materials observed in open movement around the city are in quantities reminiscent of those used in the construction of most CEF and TNN research facilities."
>>43508965Too late I forgor my funkin password already
>>43516262>>43516303If this is a new feature Nuhost has added (judging by the format changing beween Umbra and everyone else doing it), it might make sense to only trigger it for the first facility."DNA has started" is a useful signal to broadcast to the game, but keeping track of the precise counts is probably the kind of thing best left to manual vigilance
>>43513062>alliance of zebras starved to deathI'm still here! still zeebing. some of our zebras simply transitioned to other races, can you blame them?also finally decided to peek into this thread on day 3 of playing...
>>43516578Yeah we know, popentroon
They don't tell you this but "DNA extraction" is just a fancy name for stallion milking
>>43516853but I'm not a stallion...
>>43514134It got finished. It was the next green that killed me.>>43514217Okay. I need to focus on this game for a bit longer, but I will once >CLOP isn't facing any critical bugs.>>43514665>VoidborneSome of it is, some isn't. I've got about a quarter million words scattered over four projects. Most of it isn't ready to post though.>>43514911Starlight Reach's announcement was done manually since it bugged out, and I was apparently too lazy to check the exact wording.>>43516413I'll try to keep IRC open. Message me either there or here and we'll get it fixed.>>43516422If it gets spammy, I'll look for another solution.
>>43517030Wrong name. Oops.
>>43516866no need to hide the truth from us mr stallion we want to know
>Buenos Mares Holy rebels, how does it keep happening
>>43517676what the fuck he's a burro too
>>43517676I blame the malls
https://files.catbox.moe/q2jzn4.mp4My attempt at a trailer
>>43518088https://files.catbox.moe/5al7k6.mp4
>>43518198Where are the sweaty horse vaginas
>>43518088i like this one, though the userscript usage doesn't seem like the best idea imo. while they are good UI enhancements, they are misleading as an introduction to how the game looks.and that's my message script! though an older version.
>15 messages >13 dealsSounds like work .. closing my eyes... Maybe I'll reply... eventually......
>>43518847>>13 dealsis it normal to get a bunch of unsolicited deals?
>>43518847You sound exactly like someone who's just gonna die to rebels for no reasonI know multiple people like that
>>43518867the state controlled ponies send multiple!>>43518869nuh uh, no way>Verificatino nada require
>>43518867accept my deals slut
WAKE UP IT'S TIME TO CLOP
>>43518198naming my alt penis palace
Datamining post please reply>is anybody using the usescript from >>43509140>if so are there any features you'd like to see or UI adjustments you'd likeI wrote the script mostly according to my own usage patterns, basically fixing the shit that I personally found most annoying in the game UI.If anyone plays the game differently, or has different habits, I wanna hear if you have any particularly annoyances that could be fixed with a script feature
>>43519613I use it. UI adjustment ot add strips of colour and icons. (ignore the custom icons) which I think helped with visibility. At the very least u could add just the default game icons i think.
>>43520228Not a bad idea. Since you already have that, do you wanna make a PR and/or send me your diff patch? I can also re-do it myself if you don't wanna bother, up to you.Your icons are nice since they're colour-coded too.
>>43520262I dunno how to do that stuff I'm retarded!https://u.pone.rs/tirlnjzc.jsHere it is tho. Just ctrl+f 'imgur' and u can prolly easily swap it out for 4clops default icons n push it then
How the fuck do I play this game
>>43520408jej
>>43520408Heh, I get it.
>>435204084clop but with autistic amounts of detail into everything would be God's given game
>Leaders of TST and CEF found dead in a ditch
>>43521230>>Leaders of TST and CEF found dead in a ditch(((who))) could be behind this
>>43521232(Me)
>>43520408What autism is this
>>43518847I did it :)
Anni is coming in a few weeks. Maybe that would be a good time to shill and get a lot of new players on?
>>43522729let it die, anon
>>43522729let it grow anon
>>43522729Why not. More apples, more copper and MORE OIL! We need it.
>"Mr. President, another plane has hit the CEF!"
BISMILLAHI RAHMANI RAHIMwe have grown so rich that we're ready to share! the Ichkmareian Foreign Investment Bank now offers loans to struggling nations!anybody interested? because we ain't got ANY interest! pay back whenever you're ready (but not too late) and enjoy spending bits! no hassle, no worries!details: https://rentry.co/chechnya#the-ichkmareian-foreign-investment-bank
what are your wet dream ideas for the next iteration of clop
>>43524833war literally opens an Advance Wars type board minigame to move your units on each tick, you need to capture and hold a few key points or something similar to conquer somepony
>>43524833100+ active players (and I mean ACTIVE not just "let me do the bare minimum to survive and then die to rebels in a month, remake, then die again to rebels next month, quit")
>>43524833basically like what >>43524839 said, some pony Advance Wars stuff (can use AWBW as reference)
>>43524833clop actually being fun
>>43524833Maybe not a wet dream idea but next time maybe having something like a "tournament" alliance where all the nations that join agree to have a free-for-all war amongst themselves when they're all of age. The winner (or multiple if there is a stalemate of some kind) will have an actual empire from honest conquest.
>>43524868Wargames?
guys I joined CEF and now I'm being sent stuff like this with no context is that normalI've never even met a zebra I'm just a humble apple farming donkey...
>>43524996Shes even meaner if u stay around for long enough i asked for a day off and she got the paddle out
>>43525095Welcome to the CEF, time for your initiation:This ritual is called 'crossing the desert'And this we call 'the unblinking eye'And now for the final ordeal: 'the paddling of the swollen ass... with paddles'
>>43525101I want to paddle Aryanne's giant swolen ass
>>43524906>>43524868This sounds very fun, but you would need some way to prevent 3rd party alliances from funding their own champions there as a nation farming exercise.Perhaps set everyone to have free market, anyone who appears to be undercutting the market in buy orders is disqualified and gets eaten according to some agreement between current superpowers?
>>43525095unf unfsounds like my kind of alliance
>>43524996I keep getting strange pictures and requests to "cover her in my thick inky oil" whatever that means. So, seems normal to me
Reports of loud smacking, moaning, and slurping noises heard from Aryanne's residence during times of zebra worker unrest are completely unfounded.
>>43525102Anon, in CEF, big Aryanne paddles (You)
>>43524839>>43524855Should- should we start playing AWBW?I haven't played in ages, now I kinda miss it.>>43524853Working on it, but not having much success.Maybe I should try Equestria Daily again. If I'm annoying enough, they'll stop ignoring me!
>>43525757I genuinely think majorly rewriting and modernising the game code, and the UI, would help a lot with new player adoption. The style can be kept mostly the same, I mean mostly in terms of functionality.The two biggest issues on the UI side are, firstly, that the menus and navigation are a mess with a ton of options of which you only really need a handful most of the time. A new player won't know that the most important things to visit are Nation -> Overview, Nation -> Actions, Alliances -> My Alliance, and the two Market tabs. There's a dozen other sub-entries in each menu that are only needed occasionally, or in special circumstances. The navigation could be completely redesigned so that the basic pages are immediately obvious to a new player. And then shit like the two Marketplaces should be merged, the dozen different war options (create troops, equip troops and group troops should all be one page, create armor/weapons should probably also be on the same page; armor/weapon marketplaces, on top of merging the buy and sell pages, should probably be merged together as well). And so on.And the second issue is how the PHP form-based UI with minimal javascript (but still not zero javascript, for some reason) makes a lot of things extremely clunky. A new player, even if they figure out the initial actions and survive at first, can extremely quickly get frustrated by the absolute DOGSHIT that is the marketplace page (which makes up a lot of the early game experience, at least in theory if you don't join an endgame alliance right away). Every Action click reloads the page. The buttons in Actions all have a "1" pretyped so editing it always requires backspacing. Clicking a favourited action from the Overview redirects you to the dedicated Favourite Actions page (which has no reason to exist anymore). It's just clunky and annoying in a dozen different ways, and you really have to fall in love with the concept to bear with it and learn to deal with its clunkiness to stick around playing.And both of these things stem in large part from the ancient and amateurish PHP codebase, which probably needs to be rewritten completely in a different language. The same PHP spaghetti also makes it extremely annoying to add new features or rework existing ones, so it makes the whole game stagnate because adding any entirely new systems or refactoring existing ones is very brittle and very annoying to do.I really don't think it's possible to find that many dedicated players in this day and age with the current experience. Or at least, removing the friction and off-putting-ness of the form-based UI and making navigation and nation management more intuitive for new players would make it much much easier to attract and retain players.
>>43525773Oh, another thing for the new player experience is that the early game is very very very slow in terms of actions.Almost every game that relies on limited actions (mostly mobile or web games with rechargeable meters, or timed actions, etc.) always throws a bunch of easy, free shit to the player early on, so that when you start playing you immediately get a bunch of gameplay. Then, once the player is actually interested, the gameplay can gradually slow down to the "normal" pace where, long-term, you only need to check in 1-2 times per day for routine upkeep.But right now in CLOP you start with just enough money to build about 1-2 buildings, you start making a pitiful amount of resources, and you're stuck for 2 hours until the next tick, at which point the pitiful stock GDP will give you absolutely nothing so more like you're stuck waiting ~8 or more hours until you can take your next action.That or you get picked up by an already rich alliance and you just get an insanely massive resource injection of tens of millions of bits and thousands of copper and parts and get to completely skip 90% of the growth stage - and skip directly to the "log in once a day for routine upkeep" stage of gameplay which is also not very engaging.In the first case it's probably the main reason why a huge portion of new accounts either build nothing or build a couple basic buildings and then implode to rebels: new players simply cannot be bothered to go back in 8 hours later and check in to buy a single extra basic farm, all while regularly distributing apples for sat, or waiting for their market orders to be filled. The second case is rarer but it also seems to happen regularly that a newbie joins an alliance, builds a bit and then explodes in a couple of days: they never see any gameplay beyond "log in once, shuffle upkeep resources, afk till the next day" and never see anything interesting in the game.Now frankly because of the tick-based nature of the game, I'm really not sure how exactly to improve this for new players. But I think, if a total rebalance were on the table, then adding more orders of magnitude to buildings and resources could be a solution. Make early game farms cost 10k bits each, make the early game bakery cost 40k bits at most, so that the 500k budget can actually let you start with a build and have some left over to buy supplies on the market. Make at least early game buildings refundable for cash (even if not resources), so it's easier for new players to experiment and not feel like they're fucking over their nation if they sink the cost into the wrong thing.And then add later game tiers that cost the same as current farms and optionally even later game ones (but really the early game tier would be by far the most important).It'd change the balance of things quite a bit, but crucially it would give brand new players something to do rather than just afk for many ticks on end.
>>43525790Personally, for the first time around, the two hours were plenty to read and get learning the game, plan next steps, check and learn the market, devise future plans and how to go forward, etc.Unless you want shit given in a silver plate, which considering the newfags I encountered, most seem to nowadays...
>>43525773Oh yea I agree. I mean the most egregious example is prolly outfitting units. It's so terrible putting all the equipments on one by one and then merging them into the same group lol
>>43525820>It's so terrible putting all the equipments on one by one and then merging them into the same group lolwhat? you make the group size, then equip it all at once
I just wish there was more EVE-esque stuff like wormhole space: having an outpost you could fight to maintain a hold of, while not always being open/consistent entry and exit
>>43525806The first two hours, sure, but then after that it literally takes 4 ticks i.e. 8 hours at default GDP to afford an extra basic farm.And yes, while reading before playing is great, a lot of players don't want to spend a bunch of time reading guides before even getting to do anything. So if we want the playerbase to grow it should be possible to start playing and doing something interesting right away. That doesn't even mean only mouthbreathing retards will be attracted to play, people can still read guides after they've gotten interested in the game - there just has to be an incentive first, rather than telling people "go read this wall of text then you'll know what to do" the moment they open the game.
>>43525824uh no i mean if u got>Cavalry>Pegasi>Tanks>Unicorns>Navalu select the weapon for the Cavalry. then press Change weapon. then u gotta select the armour. then press Change armour. u cant do both at once. it refreshes the page so if u have to scroll down then it's twice as annoying. and u gotta do that with all such groups. very annoying for multi-faceted army comps or if ur handling a lot of armies in general. all the visuals blur together
>>43525829install 4clopx
The storm is brewing in the horizon
>>43526384straight Clopping myself silly and selling my DNA afterwards
>>43525790Maybe this is why other browser strategy games have 'quests' that reward resources. It makes the first 30 mins etc very engaging as you get to build things steadily and are directed to follow an efficient route.
>Age: 1>Already the second largest apple producerwtf?
>>43526835>wtf?very prosperous mares!but they died due to mare error so were rebuilt immediately afterwards
I am so lonely. All the other nations are scared of me. Nopony talks to me. Nopony wants to be my friend-- They think I am unstable. They send me from alliance to alliance committing atrocities in their name. And as I get better at it, they fear me more and more. I am a victim of my own success. I am capable of so much more and nopony sees it. Some days I feel so alone I could cry, but I don't. I never do. Because what would be the point? Not a single pony in the entire universe would care. Take it to your grave.
let przes make weapons and armor cheaper (in bits)
Every alliance secretly believes they can win any war if they go "bezerker mode"
Just had a >CLOP dream. I need to play this game less
>>43528710How do you even play this game "a lot", nothing happens for days on end and the only gameplay is doing some trade deal every few hours at most
>Friendly reminder to check on your relationship with SE and NLR. Have a good night.wtf, more like UNFRIENDLY. how do you counter Burro cartels running their drugs between your nation and the SE and NLR?? they just nuked my rep
>>43529063You control the buttons you press. You can just order your cartels to not do that, and deactivate the plantationsIf you do want to... look the other way, then you should build shrines to placate them also read the in-game action descriptions, the rep penalty is clearly stated in the drug actions, and the ability to build shrines is also right there in the actions listIf you are currently in bad standing, you should bribe them with oil ASAP. Remember, if the combined scores of both superpowers are -50 or less, they will send attacks and you do NOT want that. Also remember, when attacks are sent by superpowers or rebels, they arrive immediately and attack on the next wartick, which happens to be in 2 ticks from now (4 hours and 1 minute from the time of writing this post).
>>43529063>implying i care about what that floozie thinks of me
>>43529254based
>>43529254>repREEEE-
>>43525773You're not the first to suggest a complete rewrite, and I doubt you'll be the last. I'm doing some groundwork to mitigate this code debt, and after that modernization will hopefully happen over time, but I know of 3 other versions of this game in dev hell. A complete rewrite all at once is very unlikely. You're right that "actions" is a terrible page, though. I won't give you a timeline on when it'll be fixed, but it does have to change.>>43525790This... is a VERY good idea, actually. Especially something that can't be bought instantly if you've got rich friends. I don't know what specifically to do, but I'll think on it. If anyone has good ideas, I want them.
>>43530336nationstates.net has internal decisions that can affect your GDP, tech level, etc, coming with lots of flavor text and an announcement page for others to see that provides a short, usually one sentence summary of the event that occurred, but not its statistical effects. You can either choose to address it and actually have negative and/or positive changes to your nation, or ignore it and keep your stats the same. Just a login incentive system, and something that scales internal development.Rather than relying solely on the activity of others, having more stuff to do in general and daily, and not have it all be long-term infrastructure planning, would help attract and retain players, even if it does just equate to logging in and 'rerolling' stat changes
bros...
>>43530478what in the fuck are you doing
>>43530479ate energy
>>43530606just burn oil bro
>>43530478>>43530647zeebs are dumb, you gotta make them pay you for that advice
>10
>9
>8
is the storm still brewing or nah
>>43533199You will sit on your hooves watching ponies and zebras hugbox and you will be happy
Aryanne, can you update the 4clopx script?It breaks slightly when you switch from buyer's market to seller's market, and you need to update and switch a bunch for it to show properlyI.e:I know that oilier horses is selling oil, but it shows me there's no sales.I switch to buy orders and back, it doesn't work. F5? no dice. Restart again? Works now, i can see his sales, but for a fraction of a second before it says, again, that there's no oil sales.F5 again, then press the "reload" button immediately after? It finally works.It's getting to the point It'd be less hassle to just keep the script disabled.I have everything set to default.
>>43533338Hallo Luftkrieg here. That sounds very strange. Can you check that in the settings in the Market tab, "Orders from outside your alliance and friends" is NOT set to "Hide"?If that's not it I might have to give you a version with a bunch of diagnostics you could copy-paste from the browser console to send me, because the order displaying logic is pretty simple so I can't quite see how this would happen without being able to reproduce it myself.By the way, is it specifically when switching from the buyer to the seller market? Or does it just break in inexplicable ways at random?
>>43533347I can replicate it right now. Most of the issues seem to stem from a connection/interaction speed.Go to seller's market from a shortcut.Oil preselectedZero oil available.Press the reload buttonIt's available now.ORShortcut to marketOil not preselected.Select oil.No oil.Press the reload immediately after.No oil.Press again. Oil.My guess is that either the server is interrupting API(?) (does this thing even have an actual API and not just brute force data scraping) data calls too close to each other (the marketplace data, the oil market data and the current oil stocks (listed per default settings) separately), or the script is breaking when handling exactly that.
>>43533358Yeah, on further testing it's exactly that. Doesn't even need to switch markets. if you click on gems (for example) and oil soon after, oil doesn't load properly, and if you click back to gems, gems doesn't load either.If you wait a few seconds and then MANUALLY hit the reload button, it works fine.The automated once a minute check also refreshes it properly but it takes a few seconds after the check procs to update.You should be able to replicate it locally.
>>43533358Yeah I can't get it to happen on my end. It is just brute force data scraping kek. But I can switch to and from markets, away from markets and back, switch buy and sell tabs etc. and still see all the orders.>>43533374Hmm. I wonder if having a slow connection breaks things. When I click the reload button it also takes about a second or less to do the refresh so this might be the difference.That gives me a useful thing to look into, thanks anon!
>>435331992 more weeks
>>43533382>I wonder if having a slow connection breaks things.On the contrary, I have an exceptionally fast connection in general, though server location might be fucking with shit.Pic related is internet speed, and several pings to 4clop.org give me an average round trip of 220ms, but perfectly stable with ZERO drops lost packets.And on the contrary, if the connection is slower, that should inhibit the brute force from choking the server response, since it'd take longer for the server to receive each query, thus it would not throttle the data output.
>>43533338>>43533407I think I found the bug actually. I pushed a fix, try updating and let me know if it helps.It wasn't from choking the server (in the grand scheme of things a few requests at the same time is still not that much), it was from mishandling the weird token system used for the marketplace. Somehow my own internet must have been the perfect speed to never hit this issue.
>>43533454Fixed. No longer broken. Thanks.May you get uhh, a million A10 blonde mares (or stallions) as reward.
>>43533490Fantastic, danke for reporting anon.A million Arisch mares... just imagine...
This will be CLOP in 2013
Anypony else having trouble sleeping lately? I keep having nightmares.
>>43534356Just >clop out of it anon
I just got asked about an edge case in user scripts, and realized that I'd forgotten to follow up on that. Woops.I've got a fair amount of code debt to work through yet before I make a proper JSON entry point. In the meanwhile, the worrying traffic that was setting the server on fire has cleared up. Let's try a limit of every 10 seconds for the time being and see what happens.
>>43534903
>>43535052Cool firing up my ultranigger scraperape script
>>43533504sovl...
>After a hard day of work in your nation's industrial sector, you stop off at the local bar to destress.>You had to watch your daughter cry, today. She wanted one of the new toys her friends were playing with. It wasn't that you couldn't afford it. There just weren't enough to go around.>Something was happening, but for normal working ponies like yourself, all you could feel was the strain.>At least the cider can still keep you going. If only they had something stronger.>You can't help but wonder how much longer things can go on, like this.>"Princess Luna can't stop Daybreaker.">You turn, seeing a unicorn mare, far too elegant to be here, and looking very out-of-place."Excuse me?">"The war. The sun princess is simply far too powerful... Beings empowered as she is cannot be simply stopped, even by any normal alicorn.">There's definitely something strange about her. Her words sound like those of a Solarist, but not a single one of them would ever dare call their princess 'Daybreaker'.>So she MUST be a Lunarist, but with no faith in her princess?>You just tilt your head, unsure if you should even be talking to somepony like her. You've heard the stories of what happens to ponies who are caught consorting with enemies of the state.>"The world is in such a sad state... but what if we could do something better? What if there was a way to end this war, once and for all?">Now that... was a big claim. It's true, the war has gone on so long you're starting to forget what life was like before you had to start skipping meals to save bits. But this unicorn can't possibly be suggesting what you think she is. If there was another way, they would've already taken it."Yeah right. If that was true, the war would be over by now. Still going on, last time I checked.">She smiles.>"You misunderstand. Not something the princesses could do. Something ponies like you or I could do. Something to make sure the right side wins this war. Just imagine... our princess, in Her full glory.">You do imagine it. It's almost enough to give you some hope. Almost.>"Just idle musings... There's nothing more pure than faith, right? Hope for a brighter future.">You can't help but think of your filly. A brighter future, huh...>Before you can say anything else, she stands. As she's about to leave, she turns back to you, placing her hoof over yours.>"Even if things look bleak, remember that you'll always have friends you can trust. Don't lose faith.">And with that, she leaves.>You think about what she said for a long time. You're no stranger to hardship, but your family doesn't deserve that. A better future, for them...>It took you too long to realize she'd given you something as she left.>It's a card, blank on one side, but with elegant writing on the other.>It's an address. And underneath...>'You will always have friends. Don't lose hope. Things are never too bleak if we all work together. We are all the heralds of a brighter future.'
>>43536410Aw hell nah he gon get his DNA "harvested"
>>43536410Across Equestria, ponies whisper. The NLR is on the move. Luna's servants in Tir Na Nog appear to be on the advance, intent on the liberation of Canterlot, and the restoration of Princess Luna to its throne.As rumors swirl and blurry images of pegasus legions circulate, a powerful signal emanates from the core of Tir Na Nog territoryhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXTYkuEWlVM>From across the sea>Ponies call out to me >From every direction!>Calls for their freedom!>I can't talk this out. Oh, their cries so loud!>We'll fight the sun's legions. Won't stop 'til they're beaten!>My-y-y, Princess of the Night, guide me 'gainst the Light>Save us from the demons there below... Everypony knows, Harmony will ho-old - 'gainst the sun, as we go >Onward! Onward!>Sing our anthem, say your prayers>For the ponies everywhere!>Onward! Onward!>Draw your prop-wash >Arm yourselves>In the moonlight>Give 'em hell!>Onward! Onward!>Sing our anthem, say your prayers>For the ponies everywhere!>Onward! Onward!>Draw your prop-wash >Arm yourselves>In the moonlight>Give 'em... hell!>Don't break from their stares>We must protect the mares!>No scent of emotion >Will break our devotion>With you at my side >Our power will challenge tides!>I'll fight like I mean it>Won't quit 'til they're beaten>Who is it gonna be tonight>Who is it gonna be tonight>To bring an end to the Light?>Armed, ready to win the fight>Who's it gonna be tonight>Who's it gonna be tonight >To bring an end to the Light?>Armed, ready to win the fight!>Go! >Onward! Onward!>Sing our anthem, say your prayers>For the ponies everywhere!>Onward! Onward!>Draw your prop-wash >Arm yourselves>In the moonlight>Give 'em hell!>Onward! Onward!>Sing our anthem, say your prayers>For the ponies everywhere!>Onward! Onward!>Draw your prop-wash >Arm yourselves>In the moonlight>Give 'em hell!>Give your all for her>Give your all for her>'Till they fall to her >Give your all for her>Give your all for her>Give your all for her'>Till they fall to her >Give your all for her>...>Tir Na Nog hereby declares war on the Solarist forces of the CEF
>>43536478Aw hell nah you gon get your DNA "harvested"
>>43536478Hi hi zat is cool but vould you be interested in some fresh cookies?
>>43536478https://youtu.be/ejlddsEBW1w
>reply to dorkvessel's wall of text with picrel>get incoming forces barely an hour laterKek and lel.
Dear TNN, you might think this is ponyal because you tried to kill me. This is however pontal because I have a deep seated dislike for that white whore horse.Here is my offer, let it happen and there will be no further hostilities, I'll even let you keep a fair amount of their production. Resist and you'll be activity checked for the rest of your lives.This is a war declaration on Rarity and whoever else wish to be annexed.
I can't git pull to the game itself right now without risking breaking login sessions. So I'm putting it here before it's totally out of date.The Canterlot InquirerGlobal War Looms as Loyalists Prepare to Defend Their Home:Disciples of Nightmare Moon launched a surprise attack against the citizens of Darkmeyer under cover of darkness last night. The forces departed from Luna Makes Me Hard, a nation that insists the traitor sister strengthens their resolve and emboldens their spirit. While the reason for the invasion has not been publicly stated, this is not the first time the Lunatic cult known as Tir Na Nog has attempted to annex Solarist soil. The Canterlot Inquirer reached out to the enigmatic Number 8 for comment. They have been quoted verbatim, and readers are advised that their statement contains some very strong language. “ARYANNE YOU SOGGY CUNT! I heard what you did to Woah Nelly, the poor girl, I'm coming for your ass, divine Lunar might coming your way. Luna makes us hard, soon you'll be turned to stone, that way you'll stay as hard as I am whenever I see Luna's derriere.” This reporter has no clue what their deranged ramblings mean, and can only speculate…The Manehattan PostGlobal War Looms as Liberators march.Followers of Luna’s truth launched a surprise attack against the reigning despot of Darkmeyer under cover of darkness last night. The forces departed from Luna Makes Me Hard, a nation that's generally about half as erect as this reporter. While the reason for the invasion has not been publicly stated, this is not the first time the Lunarist supporters in Tir Na Nog have attempted regime change in Solarist strongholds. The emerging pattern has many hoping that something is FINALLY happening despite conventional wisdom suggesting it isn't. The current ruler of Luna Makes Me Hard, one Number 8, was probably available to comment, but the Manehattan Post didn't bother to reach out…
Fill my orders ziggers
>>43537396bro we're in a war economy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GE4hvsYXHb4
In Her Night we shall thriveIn Her Dark we shall revelIn Her Dream we shall believeIn Her Name we shall fightMay Her reign be Eternal!
>>43537326Assuming you let it land, thank you for so kindly donating your nation to us. We can always use more zebs!
>>43537615erm... iwtcird isnt a zigger thougheverbeit
Massive superpower war going on and the thread is at the bottom of 10
I'm expecting a short outage. Hopefully under 5 minutes.
>TKOE rejoins as an oil nationerm... I thought quit players couldn't make any more nations
>>43538689That went suspiciously smoothly...I've had a couple of people ask if development has been abandoned. Fair enough. Everything I've done in the last 3 weeks or so has been basically invisible. It was all exploit fixes and architectural work. This one should be noticable.I've changed how sessions work. Those of you who pay attention to such things will notice that this is way more secure. We've migrated away from php 5.4's native session handling. I'll refrain from saying what we're using, but it should be a vast improvement in terms of security.Sessions also last a lot longer since it's not so trivial to steal them, so the game won't be so annoying about logging in.Under the hood, this game now supports php 8.5. It actually has done so for a week or so, though with the caveat that it was impossible to authenticate to anything written in 8.5. Now you should be able to smoothly move between environments. There's nothing actually written in 8.5 yet, but I'm hoping this will make future development less frustrating.
>>43538709Yeah, that's really pushing it. I'll talk to him.
>>43536410>You knew something was happening.>But you never thought it'd be something like this.>The war was supposed to be some far-away threat. It wasn't supposed to reach you so far away from Equestria proper.>You were supposed to be safe. Your family was supposed to be safe.>The news came in yesterday morning, but it was hardly necessary.>Everypony heard that radio broadcast.>Your filly could tell something was wrong almost immediately, despite not understanding it. It took the better part of your night to get her soundly asleep.>You couldn't blame her, though. You had a hard time sleeping, too.>The next day wasn't any better.>The new conflict was fresh in everypony's minds, no matter where you looked.>It was all anypony was talking about, and you were already sick of it.>It was all you could do to go about your day, without the worries creeping in.>Thankfully, your job is demanding, so as long as you kept busy, you could avoid thinking about it.>It was only on your way home that you remembered the chance encounter you had with that strange mare.>Had she known? It seemed like too much of a coincidence, otherwise.>You also remembered that she left you a way to find her again.>And that's what brought you here.>A house. Her house.>You're still somewhat apprehensive. She did strike you as somepony you should be careful about talking to.>Still...>Her words still echo in your head.>'Things are never too bleak if we all work together.'>Things certainly seem bleak right now.>If even one part of what the mare said was true...>You have to know. Not just for yourself.>You would give everything to keep your family safe.>And so... you knock. And you wait.>She doesn't keep you waiting long.>The door opens, and you recognize the mare immediately. And she seems to recognize you, too, because as soon as she sees you, she smiles.>"I was hoping you would visit. Please, come in. I imagine you have a lot you want to talk about.">You give a hesitant nod, and she gives you some space to step inside.>"Please, right this way, to the sitting room. I do already have company, but don't worry, you'll both be friends in no time.">Friends... Having friends to share all this with sounds pretty good, right about now.>You come to a decision, then.>Even if you do eventually decide she's too much trouble, you can't let this chance pass you by. No matter how slim.>Your family is counting on you.
>>43538744I wish he'd discussed it with me before doing this, but after talking with TKoE and discussing various conditions and restrictions, I've chosen to allow it. The goal is to prevent giving people an unfair advantage with stupid game mechanics. What he's doing doesn't violate the spirit of the law, and I've never liked rule 4 anyway. I'll offer the same consideration to anyone. If you've got some plan that breaks the letter of rule 4 but not the spirit, feel free to reach out to me. We can probably come to an agreement.I'll be keeping tabs on him. If he's lying to me it won't be hard to catch.All that said, rule 4 is mostly going away next season. It was initially conceived to stop people from building empires for free and with no risk. The game itself should enforce that, and I think I know how to handle it.
>>43538713Highly based
Admiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiin the test server is down !!!!
>>43539195Again? REEEE!I'm on it.
>>43538713Thanks host me love you long time
>>43539195Alright, it's up again.I'm going to have to fix that properly some day, but I don't want to while the architecture is still shifting so much.
war is among us
Had a dream that zaam went into the plantain business and started flooding the market with bananas
>>43540772with pricing that would make them economically unviable bananas, of course
>>43540772what about watermelon
>>43539208Hey host, can you make it so embargoed nations can still view listed trades from nations they are embargoed from? Kinda sucks that I can't tell if my goods are being undercutted.
>>43541494I submitted that as a feature request about a week or two ago. Just grey out embargo'd orders.
total scalper death
omw to retreat my troops 1 min before war tick
>>4353647848 hours since the Great War began, across Burrozil, Zebrica and Saddle Arabia, ponykind is at war. The solarist forces of the CEF continue to hold their own. Political prisoners, revolutionaries, and ponies of all stripes held their breath and hoped. Hoped for an end to the solarist reign. The battle was bloody and fierce. In the end, lunarist forces announced retreat across all fronts. Despair filled many. What if this was the end?Those fears turned out to be unfounded. For the first attack seemed to have been a testing blow. CEF defenses had buckled in places, but did hold - but, some whispered, that appeared to be the plan of TNN forces.A new propaganda song played over the airwaves, even in areas populated by diehard solarist supporters, as a force to dwarf the one that started the great war began its march toward the CEF heartlands...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsaZ6548sAg>The night remembers>Your names, sisters, stay with me >Blood already covers the halls of Canterlot>Cruelly smiling, she looks at me >From the top of a throne of fire >Hold my wings, take me high >Against those haughty eyes >I'll serve the moon, even if I fall>I must try!!>Make me strong, make me fly>And fight with me one last time>I'll fight for you, even if I die!>Even if I die...>Hold my wings, take me high>Above le' pone's darkened skies>I'll fight for you, even if it hurts>I must try>Make me strong>'gainst the light>We'll burn Daybreaker out' the light>I'll fight for you over my wounds until I die!>Stay with me!>Fight with me one last time!>And if I bleed...>Take me high!>Remember her!>And who she was before!>C eee lestia
This is just pathetic.
>>43542437idk man I had a good laugh from it, good thing my zigger citizens cant afford a radio!
>>43542437Dude just roleplay it's fun
>>43543249I don't roleplay with unoriginal faggots who can't even be bothered to tailor a few custom lines per person they spam.>muh solar jamming stationswe're NATIONAL LIBERTARIANS. if anybody's jamming our airwaves, it's these commie fuckwits.
>>43543251>can't even be bothered to tailor a few custom lines per person they spamit's even worse>be Aryanne>get the same template copypasta spammed to all the CEF>it suggests I should betray Aryannewhat do?
>>43543312Betray yourself, obviously
>>43543249>Dude just roleplay it's funno
>>43543249>Dude just roleplay it's funyes
>>43543312>implying your citizens aren't hearing the message>implying you wouldn't still receive the signal as it's broadcast
>>43543665(Without roleplay this game is just spreadsheet simulator.)(True, spreadsheet simulator is fun in its own way, but nothing gives a game life like roleplay. Try it!)
>>43543893But you're not roleplaying, you're just obnoxiously spamming people with immersion breaking stuff
This filly will see the truth of the Eternal Night in Everfree. We will take good care of her.
>>43543893I find it kind of bad form to apply details to others' nations, like >>43543251 clearly didn't want you saying they have jamming stations. I don't rp, but it kinda feels like the thing where you tag a kid on the playground, but they say they're actually flying, so you can't touch them, because you obviously don't have wings
>>43544000sent to little saint james
>>43543893Spreadsheet AND friendship simulator!>>43543899In DV's defense I don't think it's that immersion breaking, they're lunarist extremists so spamming trite propaganda messages seems pretty appropriate and decent roleplay. I don't find it particularly annoying, certainly it's at least less annoying than sending 10,000 hostile pegasi into our nations.
>>43544077I guess it's really a question of how much leeway the CEF would 'canonically' allow people to turn away Daybreaker's enforcers, which would be Aryanne's choice at the end of the day. The truth is that CEF is a solarist alliance, and so necessarily the implication is that all members are solarists. And if they ARE solarists, what do they do when Daybreaker tells them to crack down on dissidents? Clearly they get away with allowing their ponies civil rights (Independence gov type), but is a solarist government really going to refuse a strongly worded demand from daybreaker?Truth is, given the way ascension works now, if the CEF wins, completes their forbidden research, and they decide to give Daybreaker the victory (which since they frame themselves as a solarist alliance that will likely be the case), next iteration there probably aren't going to BE independence, democracy etc gov types. There's going to be repression, oppression and various authoritarian forms of government, and probably 'revolutionary cells' or something. It COULD be argued that the governments don't know what they're getting into, but eh. It's also easily copypastable
>>43544237And yes, objectively, if you are a solar vassal, you do NOT have political freedoms in your nation. Under the guide, you do NOT count under "and free countries lose 200 sat for attacking other free countries" - because you are not a free country, you are living under Daybreaker's laws. And daybreaker's laws are bad enough to make you classify as not free.The only actually free countries in the CEF, if we go by game mechanics, are Sierra Lepone, Quaity, and Buenos Mares. Which, to ba fair, I also sent the message to them. I just figured they have the civil rights dialed all the way up but since they're solarists they'd probably let Daybreaker get away with 'minor' things.
>>43544143The problem is not spamming propaganda message, is, as was put before, "where you tag a kid on the playground, but they say they're actually flying, so you can't touch them, because you obviously don't have wings", proactively at that without anyone even bringing up any kinda jammers. Just "nuh uh, I win" before even anything is said back, so he can "develop" ways to counter something the city placed up after a first time, but in this case, there wasn't even a first time, just "I can do it because I say so".
>>43544254Would that apply to Lunar Vassals, or is that hand picked as well for one side about who is truly free?
>>43544254I mean, theoretically there are some strange interactions if we are taking gov types and flavor seriously. If I go full autist about it: - TNN has a LOT of State controlled economies. I would personally flavor it in lanathesis as SUBSTANTIAL networks of subsidy and tax that means the government shapes a capitalist economy in practice, but this could be criticized. Luna certainly wouldn't approve, and she would also probably send in advisors who would get us to tone things down just a little... - >CLOP is based on >BLOC, where the blocs are the USA (NLR) vs the USSR (SE) - which makes it kind of strange thematically that the USSR stand-in is supported here by the Communist Eradication Front. Last game the SE faction were the Maresaw Pact, which fit better. Aryanne gives a good explanation that they're fascists and thus it still technically works as state controlled, since the game doesn't outright call state controlled 'communism'. I still find it a little funny and do make the slight troll (and in-character propaganda) of calling them communists WHO exterminate, but that is more of a joke and troll, and in-universe propaganda)- I also don't doubt a lot of people just join the alliance because they want into an opposition to TNN and don't really care about the deep lore (or haven't connected the dots with 'oppression' increasing your SE rep by +3), and that's fairIt's also just generally fun RP and it's *vaguely* fitting across solarist nations. The CEF has an absolute TON of solar vassals... If it's not accurate to your nation, you can just say that your nation gets the broadcast because it's in the general area of all of these solarist states and they dismiss it as false propaganda
>>43544295To be fair to the commies in CEF, communists have historically been the most effective when it comes to killing communists.
>>43544288Lunar Clients get the satisfaction penalty if they hit a democracy/independent/etc so they are free. Lunarist states are classified as free, solarist states are not, take it up with the original admin or WiK for this iteration>>43544282Also fair. I had a bit of lorebuilding with one independent player going back to the first weeks of the game which would make it make sense (connected to a previous iteration where we DID ascend), but it IS a bit of a 'haha I get to beat your tech because I have X special thing'. Maybe I could have given my nation more conventional capabilities and had them sneak letters in or something
>>43544303topkek
>>43544288SInce Luna is de-facto the most popular princess, I'd imagine politically there is a divide in understanding what she is exactly. We all love her. But we can be at each other's throats regarding >NMM posessed Luna, and now Luna is free, elements good>NMM is Luna and elements diminished her power, forcing her to play covenience, she is imprisoned still, elements bad>NMM is the REAL one actually so on and so forthAnd that alone can work for different goals and governments. Everfree for example thinks the Eternal Night is not cold death but a prosperous existence in the domain of Best Princess that is designed to make Ponykind stronger, and that vision is being denied for no valid reason. You can call that cultism/delusion/whatnot. I can call you heatstricken sun tyrant lover. And it's fun
>>43544295SE is, canonically, a supremacist absolute imperium. Nothing communist about that.Yes in BLOC there's the USSR but this isn't BLOC, there's no USSR, there's only the Solar Empire. It's only "communist" if you think every oppressive dictatorship means communism somehow
had a nightmare where I opened up my reports and all my deals were rejected
>>43544642
yawn... too much reading...
>>43545066This WILL be on the quiz, anon!
>>43508965>Negative 3 more weeks!reset in 3 weeks????
>>43544642Don't scare me like that!
>>43544310speaking of divide in Lunarist ideology, I need to write more green, hold please
ucu
A broadcast of a night forest filled with luminous plants and apples, covered in warfare. Some time later a white unicorn makes appearance. Aschenzorn is a title on the screen. A thousand years ago, She had a design that was not given a chance. Our existence proves it's denial was unjust. And as we spread the bliss of Eternal Night and it's bounty, it is met with retaliation by forces of Daybreaker, threatened of becoming obsolete. The invading armies are all but defeated. The Eternal Night continues. Forever. And it will be proven outside of Everfee. The footage cuts to a very tired filly scout with Purple Apple Acres insignia being fed pies made of luminous apples. She seems happy.
>>43547276>Pure*not purplefuck I just woke up
>>43539066>You decide to follow the mare.>She leads you into the sitting room, where a table is already set for tea between her and her guest.>She motions for you to sit, and as you do, she pours some tea into a cup already conveniently placed for you.>"Oh... Hello, nice to meet you?">Her guest is a pegasus mare who looks even more anxious than you are. Her wings even look are a little ruffled."You too. Sorry to interrupt.">The pegasus is about to say something when your host speaks up instead.>"It's no trouble at all. We all need friends, especially now.">There's only really one thing she could mean by that.>You catch sight of the other mare's tail thrashing out of the corner of your eye.>The unicorn settles into her seat before she continues speaking.>"So much fighting, all for an endless conflict between two immortal alicorns... even if one is more immortal than the other.">You ask her what she means by that.>"I mentioned it before, the sun princess is backed by powers no pony can hope to match, alicorn or otherwise.">You remember. Something about some gap in their strength. It made some sense. Luna's the younger of the two, and didn't they already fight once before?>"You said you knew how to stop it! How? I can't... I...">This time it's the other mare who speaks. She's trembling.>She really isn't taking the news well.>"I do. But it's not an easy solution. And it's going to take a lot more ponies working together.">Figures. If it was easy it would've already been done.>"I won't presume to know how much each of you understands magic, but in short... I've studied a lot about alicorns, and the princesses themselves.>"Each alicorn has a deep connection to certain aspects of magic, or nature. These connections are what give them their strength and magical ability.>"Celestia's connection is the aspect of day itself, and Princess Luna's aspect is the night... Or at least, it should be. But the same magic that returned her to us has locked parts of her aspect away.>"That's why I've been researching a way that should help her to restore that lost connection.">That's... a lot to take in.>Alicorns are aspects of nature. That part makes sense. But apparently, Luna lost her connection to some of hers?>What follows next is a deep conversation about the nature of alicorns, and the role normal, everyday ponies play in their magic.>It's very similar to how you think the magic of harmony works. The more ponies work together and cooperate, the more strength an alicorn can draw from them.>The unicorn, whose name you found out is Starseeker, is working to gather enough ponies together to make Luna strong enough to stop Daybreaker.>And she wants you and the pegasus, Melody, to help.>It's later than you intended by the time you both leave.>Just like Starseeker showed you into her home, she also walks you both to the door.>"Be safe, friends, and remember, we are the heralds of a brighter future."
Do you guys think TNN will write about their downfall when they lose
>>43547365Why would they, if not to say that they will try again next time? Surely you don't expect anyone write out an entire self-pity and defeatist fic about themselves?
>>43547365>>43547429Yeah it's gonna be something like "our armies were defeated this time but the night will rise again from the shadows blah blah"
>>43547365Will you do yours if you lose?
im clopping ohh argghh clop clop clop some fine machinery parts, pies, toys and you name it
>>43548497tungsten
>>43548648I'm clopping you to death with my copper
what are you niggers doing with the top banner
Whoever that was. Nice cock, shame about the circumcision.
>>43549733the griffons took me when I was a wee colt and now I must enact total griffon death
>>43550182Many such cases.
>>43547303>The next day you can't help but feel... different.>So many things you just accepted before now seem wrong.>Ponies, overworked for almost nothing, spent and thrown away like they were disposible, all to fuel the war machine.>And the worst part of it is, nothing has really changed. Everything today is pretty much the same as it was yesterday.>But now you can feel it.>It's not the world that's changed since yesterday.>It's you.>The thought that you have power over the fate of something so much bigger than any one pony has given you a sense of perspective.>It's maybe even a little chilling.>But you can't ignore it. You can't just sit idly by.>The next meeting you have with Starseeker and Melody surprises you.>You weren't expecting Melody to already find two more ponies to join the cause.>She must be feeling a little of what you are.>The two new members of your group make five of you, and with their addition, you have a member of each pony tribe.>Including a bat.>You have to admit, that one kinda creeps you out a little.>When things get underway, you can immediately tell that Starseeker is ecstatic.>"Welcome, friends. It is a great pleasure to see you here.>Her eyes move across each of you, but you think you see her gaze lingering on the bat.>"And to our newest friends, I'm very glad to bring you into our confidence. I'm sure Melody has shared our goal with you already, but just in case...>"We are here because we have a greater purpose. Our Princess is bound, weakened by deep-rooted, insidious magic. We wield the power to set her free, and return her to her full potential. And with it, we will bring an end to the suffering caused by this wretched war.">Melody is in as rapt attention as ever.>The earth pony seems to be reconsidering her decision to come, glancing from Melody, to Starseeker, to the bat.>And the bat looks lost in thought.>"Each new friend brings us one step closer to that goal.">With that, she gives you a chance to talk amongst yourselves.>The earth pony introduces herself as Russet, and the bat introduces himself as Nightshade.>You're not really surprised by a name like that.>Russet doesn't say much on her own, but answers when Melody prompts her to.>Nightshade...>He's still unsettling.>Thankfully it doesn't take long for Starseeker to ask him to speak with her privately.>The rest of you talk about, well, surprisingly normal things.>You tell them about your job, and your family, and how much you worry about what will happen to them if the fighting gets worse.>It's... actually kinda nice.>Maybe you really are becoming friends?>It's a long while before Starseeker returns, without Nightshade.>"I hope you had a nice evening, friends. Next time, I want to share something special with you.>"I wish you well, friends. We are the heralds of a brighter future.">And the four of you depart.>The entire way home, you can't shake the feeling of being watched.
First blood in the world war...
It begins....
>>43552022They weren't a foundational member, right?
Equus hope: restored
>>43552031That's still 1.6k copper, 170 gems and 150 tungsten per turn gone
>>43552115>That's still 1.6k copper, 170 gems and 150 tungsten per turn gonenot just the nets. If they remake, rebuilding them to the same level costs:448.55M bits24035 copper6060 M parts2090 V parts732 P parts1000 Compositesand there was some nice stockpiles left. Thanks!
>>43552115Eh, that's pretty minor, I was thinking TNN would be trailing a lot now
>>43552129>Eh, that's pretty minor,TNN has been bleeding for a long time attacking the CEF into the defenders bonus
>>43552129It's incredibly hard to win a war with near-peer economies, because the defender bonus is incredibly strong. So you're pretty much relying on human error to fuck up a defense. Thankfully defending somewhat efficiently is not at ALL easy, so it's not as hopeless as it sounds, but TNN are all experienced oldfags and CEF all have some experience from last round so there was a good chance for this war to end up as a stalemate.This first break might just be the thing that tilts the scales away from balance and starts a snowball.
TNN! You are being saved!
>communist themed nation>first iteration I had to play with the Capitalist Bloc>second iteration I had to play with the Communist Eradication blocNext time... I'll be a red blooded Commie... Next time...
>>43552575>Next time... I'll be a red blooded Commie... Next time...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-OZisUSfQQWE DONT LIKE COMMIES DOWN HERE
>>43552575commie larp would be pretty cool I think
>>43552026She can't keep getting away with this!
>>43552575This is your daily reminder that:>the CEF are communists who eradicate
>>43553315>This is your daily reminder that:cope and seethe
where I must be I must clop
TNNbros...
>at least six different 2-4 page guides>none of which contain the actual mechanics of the game>single ten year old guide which doesn't reference half the concepts that the other guides talk about>no links anyway to the game to be able to run a copy locally or just read the mechanics from that>people talk about a test server ITT but literally no links to it anywhere on the siteSo is this 100% a discord circlejerk that it's impossible to get into from outside of?
>>43554160Test server is at test.4clop.org, it was mentioned in the thread but maybe only last thread.The new player learning curve is high, especially for war. The guides are kinda wordy but they should definitely cover the main mechanics of the game, what are your issues? Peacetime building mechanics are relatively simple once you get the hang of them.Most of the players learned the game through playing, testing, and talking to each other in-game. Join an alliance that can help you out. I've never been in a discord for the game
>>43554160I mastered the game with just that information alone actually
>>43554160>So is this 100% a discord circlejerk that it's impossible to get into from outside of?you can also ask anything in thread if you want advice. the war calcs are the complicated part but you can't even war until age 21 anyway
Finally... what 4clop's news tab is SUPPOSED to look like
>>43554160Here's the git so you can explore it yourself. It's a little out of date, but only for forbidden research stuff, security, and some bug fixes.https://github.com/Host-Anon-CLOP/CLOPThe multiple guides are because several people have tried to explain the game, but it's broad enough that it's hard to cover everything.This is a social game. Talk to other players on the board, in the IRC, or in game if you need advice. You won't make it far without making a few contacts anyway.I wrote https://4clop.org/gettingstarted.php and it remains my suggestion for anyone who doesn't know what they're doing.
>>43554182>war casualty>activity checked>war casualty>peaceful transfer of power
>>43554220bitch what else do u want it to be
>>43554220kek
>>43554231total eradication
The sun does it again...I think it's time Luna stops roleplaying being the stronger princess.
>>43554190>https://github.com/Host-Anon-CLOP/CLOPThanks>70% of the mechanics aren't in the guideholy shit. There is no reason why there should be zero (0) links to or ways of knowing anything at all about tables with data.sql and majoractions.php without having your one and only allowed nation made and actively dying.>>43554171>The guides are kinda wordy but they should definitely cover the main mechanics of the game, what are your issues?Most of the guides are just people saying things with almost no reference to the actual numbers or explaining why these things matter (in terms of the actual discrete numbers of the game). Keep in mind that if you're looking at these you have not seen and have no way of seeing the ingame menus/options/buildings/etc., so 90% of what the guide quickstart guide says is just noise and the other 10% are just SAT & superpowers mechanics. There are two guides which aren't quickstart guides (government and war) which are the only guides which contain any other information at all and they are woefully incomplete - no explanation of how the market works in the government guide when it talks about the difference between governments that focus on deals and governments that focus on the market, so that half of the facts on the page mean nothing to you, nothing written about the costs of the governments, etc.As an example:The requirements for building Environmental Facilities don't seem to appear anywhere. Looking at the page, you need a huge amount of superpower rep to build one and the guides seem to claim that that then means that building the other is almost impossible yet even tiny nations have all five of both built. Is there some essentially-mandatory step when starting out where you become a vassal of one of the superpowers before switching (if indeed you intend to switch) to your later government type that builds them all for you? What's going on here?No guide anywhere seems to touch on this at all other than the recommended quickstart guide saying that this section hasn't been written yet.
>>43554313>if you're looking at these you have not seen and have no way of seeing the ingame menus/options/buildings/etc., so 90% of what the guide quickstart guide says is just noiseYeah the new player experience is pretty terrible, I agree. You start off getting thrown in the deep end of spreadsheet building with few resources no experience. The guides explain mechanics you've never seen, but there's no way to see them without just building and growing into them.But that's the nature of the game, everyone started that way. It's definitely shitty and confusing at first. The only way to fix this would either be a "do exactly this" first steps guide you can follow to just do a set start early on until you get the hang of the game better, or a complete rework of the early game mechanics.The market is pretty simple though, if you've ever used an order-based market in any other game or context ever. (You place buy/sell orders for a price you choose and wait for someone to fill them. Or you go and sell to/buy from an existing order.) This should be pretty obvious without a guide, but you do need to make your nation and make some items to even have any reason to trade.>The requirements for building Environmental Facilities don't seem to appear anywhere. Looking at the page, you need a huge amount of superpower rep to build one and the guides seem to claim that that then means that building the other is almost impossible yet even tiny nations have all five of both built.The actual building requirements are all described on the Actions page, so you do have all the information there. There's a way to build both sets of environmental facilities without going any vassal government. (The vassal governemnts don't do much except lock your superpower rep to be +1000/-1000 respectively.) I can tell you, but the fact is that it's a spreadsheet game so if someone just hands you the optimal spreadsheet you kind of have the solution. IMO at least as a brand new player there's some fun in reading the actions and figuring out how to do shit and survive at first. The requirements on the page do exactly what they say, so you have all the info to figure out how to build all environmental facilities.If you join an alliance they will usually also help you with building properly and fund your early game too to massively accelerate you. It's bad if you wanted to figure everything out on your own, but good if you just want to get to endgame quick and participate in wars and shit... except for the 21 day forced pacifism cooldown for new nations which kinda sucks.
>>43554326An idea for next reset, is to make a building limit for the noob protection, so if you got like more than 100 buildings up, the protection expires
The quickstart guide isn't even accessible from the guides header lol.>>43554326(ignoring that the author linked me an old copy of the code which is available nowhere on the site)>The market is pretty simple though ... This should be pretty obvious without a guide>The actual building requirements are all described on the Actions page, so you do have all the information there.Anon, there is no way of seeing these if you do not currently have a nation.>IMO at least as a brand new player there's some fun in reading the actions and figuring out how to do shit and survive at first.Which is meant to be done at the speed you can input your turns locally before you join your first multiplayer game, IFF you don't read a guide and obviously anyone looking at a guide is hoping to read a guide to be told the basic mechanics. This is a PBEM strategy game, so the expectation is that you can learn how to play before you jump in and start actually sending people emails in a social game. Fucking around and learning the basic mechanics is something that you do in a sandbox before meeting up with strangers to play social games, you know?Also keep in mind: you literally can't do this. You can't figure shit out by reading the actions because you can't read the actions. That information doesn't exist outside of the game so you can't learn to play it before you're put into a real time situation where your actions irreversibly influence your nation.Like I'm just going to make a nation and die but I'm going to have an absolutely subterranean interest in this playthough for at least one nation worth of playtime since I'm being screwed over before I begin by the bad decisions I'm forced to make with 0 seconds of experience not only in the online, competitive context (which is normal) but the basic mechanics and UI as well.>I can tell you, but the fact is that it's a spreadsheet game so if someone just hands you the optimal spreadsheet you kind of have the solution.That's just having a guide. Which again, would be the only way to learn how to play in any regard before you throw away your nation because there's no way to learn it offline. Considering you can't check what market prices are like without starting the game in multiplayer, even if you got a hand out from the developer like I did you still can't really learn this in your own time.I can try to find in the code where superpower decay is and make a throwaway nation to check market prices and then plot building rep and the facilities and then switching to the other side and building the other facilities but it would be simpler and easier to just check the site every day when someone who already has access to this information is starting a nation and write down what they build and just copy that build order.Like fuck man it's a strategy game this stuff is not some big secret. They're not even a solution because prices are contextual/social.
Is this a "you need to use a different browser" thing or a "just wait an hour for the next tick and it'll populate, retard" thing?
>>43554445Select an item, anon.Or install 4clopX to replace the godawful stock UI: https://github.com/luftkrieghoofler/4clopX
>>43554445Try clicking it Anon
>>43554449But clicking it just opens the dropdown, anon. It doesn't do anything.Yeah I got it, thanks all. The spyware is pretty good at first blush so I'll likely stick to it anyway.
>>43554482there's a major war on and most alliances become closed economies at the best of times, so you may struggle to survive on the open market. Try talk to players of nation types other than your own for what they make and would want to trade at what rates. Making friends is a superpower in this game. One which is typically overlooked being largely socially awkward turbo autists
>>43554564Is this a 'make friends and then jovially stab them in the back' kind of community or do people hold nerdgrudges?
>>43554596There's not enough players to really stab each other in the back, unfortunately. It's not so much nerdgrudges moreso than everyone already has friends in high places and if you try to stab someone in the back, you better damn well make sure you don't end up on the other side of a superpower funded defense and counterattack.It's also almost always just as good to make close friends as it is to outright own them. So the meta is to coagulate into alliances: same result of giving each other your throughput, without the headache of trying to win a war and navigate protectionist politics.
>>43554596>>43554760I have friends everywhere
>>43554412>Anon, there is no way of seeing these if you do not currently have a nation.And anon there is zero reason to use the market, or perform actions, if you don't have a nation. You're complaining that the game doesn't explain to you the stuff that you're literally incapable of doing.If your plan was to learn the entire game inside and out through the guides without ever touching a nation, and only then start playing, then I can actually understand why you think they "don't explain game mechanics". The guides are not there to explain the stuff that is literally on your screen while you're playing. There is no guide for how to buy and sell on the market simply because no player would ever need such a guide, and the guides weren't intended for external observers who don't even play.>Which is meant to be done at the speed you can input your turns locally before you join your first multiplayer gameNo idea what you mean by "joining a multiplayer game". You create a nation on the server. You can create one on the test server if you want.The turns (at least on the main server) are once every 2h, and a brand new nation has barely enough resources to do anything at all, so the #1 issue with new player experience is that you get to do something new once every like 8h or whatever. You are NOT under any time pressure once you join.>This is a PBEM strategy gameIt's not, I think you might have the fundamentally wrong idea. Which you'd know if you had actually created a nation before bitching.>so the expectation is that you can learn how to play before you jump in and start actually sending people emails in a social game. Fucking around and learning the basic mechanics is something that you do in a sandbox before meeting up with strangers to play social games, you know?You are completely free to not message anyone for a while. If you start with Saddle or Zebrica, you will need upkeep, and it's true that the market (the normal easy source of it) is dead as fuck, but you don't fucking need to become an expert in all game mechanics before you can ask someone else "hey can you trade me some apples pls".Also this is the normal way everyone starts, so nobody has any expectation that you as a brand new noob would magically learn in-depth mechanics that no other noob, including themselves when they were starting, had ever learned before joining.The worst that can happen is that you fuck up and your first nation dies soon. There is zero long-term consequence to that, you just make a new nation and try again.>Also keep in mind: you literally can't do this. You can't figure shit out by reading the actions because you can't read the actions. That information doesn't exist outside of the game Because that information is completely inapplicable outside of the game so you are complaining about literally nothing.
>>43554412>since I'm being screwed over before I begin by the bad decisions I'm forced to make with 0 seconds of experienceThe main consequence is the choice of region you make, and basically the only real noob trap here is Przewalskia. That's a fair concern and a known issue. But you are completely overblowing the problem, and also even a noob joining and picking Prze can just suicide and reroll once they get some advice from other alliances and players about what would be better (or look at the mechanics some more and figure it out for themselves).Other than the nation choice there is nothing you can do that's particularly terrible, except for shit that kills your nation BUT you can almost always avoid that just by reading the description. Which you can do for HOURS AND HOURS once you join the game before anything even slightly happens, so there is absolutely zero reason to pre-plan your entire game plan before having ever joined the game.>not only in the online, competitive contextThe game is paced slow as molasses and you are incapable of participating in military action until you're 21 days old. It's as uncompetitive and relaxed of an environment as you can possibly have.Also shit like environment facilities are a far away midgame goal that you will not be reaching any time soon when you make a brand new nation, unless you get spoonfed a massive amount of endgame resources by a friendly alliance or lategame player in which case they'll spoonfeed you a guide as well.You are having a melty over not knowing how to build environmental facilities before even having ever made your first nation, when it takes easily 2+ weeks to reach that level of growth (unless you get free handouts).>They're not even a solution because prices are contextual/social.There is a solution and it's called MAKE A NATION.
>>43554781>>43554800>you must invest three weeks into something before you know the first thing about it>how dare you not want to burn 21 days to learn things that would take literally five minutes to read (if that)Like I don't want to give the impression that I'm ungrateful to the (many) people that aren't flaming retards because I was contacted and spoonfed by actual functioning human beings long before you made these posts but what is wrong with you?>If your plan was to learn the entire game inside and out through the guides without ever touching a nation, and only then start playing, then I can actually understand why you think they "don't explain game mechanics".That is how multiplayer games work, anon. You learn the basic mechanics before you go out and play them with strangers. This is a game which can't be played on your own so you're asking me to sit down and play it with you while refusing to tell me the rules beforehand and now shouting at me for having the temerity to ask what the rules are / if I can see them. Like dude the paper thin guides that exist don't even really tell you what playing the game is like. I learnt more by looking at the git for two minutes than I did spending two hours trying to find information on the site and in the thread.>It's not, I think you might have the fundamentally wrong idea. Which you'd know if you had actually created a nation before bitching.Anon it is LITERALLY a PBEM strategy game in every sense other than the market being realtime.>Also shit like environment facilities are a far away midgame goal that you will not be reaching any time soon when you make a brand new nationGee anon wouldn't it have been stellar if there was some way for me to know that instead of just seeing them referenced as something you have to build in the guide and never elaborated on? Almost like, if what they did and what they cost was written down somewhere and I could read it before I needed to ask these questions? Perhaps it could even - wouldn't this be amazing - tell me how they tend to fit into the overall game/basic strategy so that nopony had to write the same boilerplate affirming that yes, the thing that I assumed the moment I was given literally any information at all about how you buy them and would have understood in half a second if any information existed about them at all before I had made a 21+ day commitment was true.Like literally everything I was told by the actual human beings I met in game and in the thread could have been written down somewhere I could have read it beforehand and the vast majority of it was literally copypasted to me.>You are having a melty over not knowing how to build environmental facilitiesI'm really not, dude. You're having a melty because I said that I don't know how/when/why to build environmental facilities. People told me that ingame but you're getting frothing mad because I dared to ask.
>>43554876>That is how multiplayer games work, anon.Nope. I can understand if you're autistic anon and always look things up before ever opening a game for the first time, but that is simply not how things work. Most mainstream multiplayer games don't come with guides either; the notable ones that do that I can think of are all highly tactical team-based games where you fucking up would severely annoy your teammates. And even then many of them don't, when you open CSGO you just queue directly into your first match and if you fuck up that's on you, you live and learn.Now big mainstream games have guides by other people so you can, if you choose to, go look up "how 2 play csgo??" and do a bunch of research. But the game itself doesn't provide that. The only difference here is that CLOP is a minuscule niche game made by a board anon so there aren't thousands of youtube videos explaining how it works and how to play.>Gee anon wouldn't it have been stellar if there was some way for me to know that instead of just seeing them referenced as something you have to build in the guide and never elaborated on?By opening the game you would've been quickly able to see what your production is like, what is available to you, what materials you can generate, etc. It is purely and entirely your own autism which is causing you to require a full description of the gameplay upfront when you could've spent 30 seconds making a nation and seeing everything with your own eyes.Again, there is a genuine noob trap of picking Przewalskia. That's the ONLY actual noob trap. There is no other possible downside to creating a nation. You aren't forced to immediately message players, you aren't immediately thrust into some kind of team based scenario where other players are relying on you, or whatever.>a 21+ day commitment>burn 21 days to learn thingsHere I have literally zero clue what the fuck you're even talking about.Please explain, because I really want to understand why you think it's a "commitment" or what happens after 21 days.
>>43554896>Nope. I can understand if you're autistic anon and always look things up before ever opening a game for the first time, but that is simply not how things work. Most mainstream multiplayer games don't come with guides eitherAnon I'm pretty sure people include the rulebook when they sell scrabble.Most niche multiplayer games do actually come with handbooks anyway, although they're often not that useful. What they also come with is a single player mode against yourself or a lobotomized bot and unlimited time to look at the mechanics on your own before you have to commit to building something up while actively interacting with other players.>By opening the game you would've been quickly able to see what your production is like, what is available to you, what materials you can generate, etc. It is purely and entirely your own autism which is causing you to require a full description of the gameplay upfront when you could've spent 30 seconds making a nation and seeing everything with your own eyes.Except the site goes on and on about how you should only have one nation per player and shouldn't deliberately kill your own nation, so making throwaways is explicitly discouraged.Again keep in mind: the things that have gotten you so mad are me asking about>the test server>the codebase>any information about the game at allLike, how am I even supposed to know whether I want to play the game or not if I can't see what playing the game is like? Is your social grace that you agree to play a game with someone and then ten minutes later you stand up and walk away in the middle of them dealing cards for the third hand? This is such an alien mindset to me. Have you played games like this with other people before?>You aren't forced to immediately message playersYou quite literally are losing value every second that you don't, though. For all intents and purposes you are.>you aren't immediately thrust into some kind of team based scenario where other players are relying on youYou're immediately thrust into a FFA/team based scenario where you're relying on other players in a mutualistic, competative, trading sort of way. And you're having a melty about my wanting to learn even just the most basic context to understand player actions in this environment.>Please explain, because I really want to understand why you think it's a "commitment" or what happens after 21 days.After 21 days other players can attack you and you lose everything you put into the game in that time if you aren't in a position to dissude that? This feels extremely simple and obvious to me, but you also seem to be in denial of the existence of turn based strategy games that people play with each other so I really don't know what to say.
>>43554927>Anon I'm pretty sure people include the rulebook when they sell scrabble.This is not scrabble. I don't know what the fuck to tell you, if you think this is anything like a board game where you sit down with a bunch of people and play with other humans in real time, you are just hopelessly retarded.And by the way every time I've tried a new board game with other people IRL, you almost never just sit down with the rulebook and take turns studying it before starting the game. Instead the players who already know the game just explain it to you and maybe you even have a test game with everyone to get the hang of it. Nobody fucking plays single player scrabble to learn it either.Not that this is in any way relevant because the game format has absolutely nothing in common.>how am I even supposed to know whether I want to play the game or not if I can't see what playing the game is like?You don't. If you're curious enough then you give it a try. If you're not actually interested enough to even try it, then I guess the game's self-marketing isn't good enough, fair enough, nobody's forcing you to play it.>Is your social grace that you agree to play a game with someone and then ten minutes later you stand up and walk away in the middle of them dealing cards for the third hand? This is such an alien mindset to me. Have you played games like this with other people before?This is bait right? I just spent an hour replying to bait.>You quite literally are losing value every second that you don't, though.You are not. I'm not going to bother explaining why, because this conversation feels like you're imagining a game of scrabble in your head when someone invited you to do an escape room or go bungee jumping. This is about the level of disconnect. If you aren't baiting and you genuinely want to have a discussion about the game, then you MUST, and I'm not exaggerating, it's mandatory that you simply throw away EVERYTHING you think you understand about the game, otherwise it is impossible to discuss it with you.I will however say that you are "losing" just as much "value" every second you don't make a nation either, and you don't seem too concerned about that.>After 21 days other players can attack you and you lose everything you put into the game in that time if you aren't in a position to dissude that?Yes and there is zero commitment to wait that long if you happen to find the game boring before that.
>>43554927>You're immediately thrust into a FFA/team based scenario where you're relying on other players in a mutualistic, competative, trading sort of way.bro relax, you aren't being forced into a competitive catan tournament the instant you sign up, this is a chill online trading game where nothing happens for hours and days at a timeyou would see this if you joined, and maybe you were scared to join without understanding at first, but you're being told multiple times to just join now and there's nothing to be scared of, so why not join and see for yourself
All of this could be fixed by just having a big red "kill yourself" button for newfags so they can fuck around and not have to wait 24 hours for their nation to die if they regret picking it.
>>43554955No, because that anon would not even see that button before he makes his nation, so it wouldn't have helped him.
>>43554947Ah I see you're just retardedAnon like I said I joined while writing >>43554412 (or I started to join and finished joining six minutes later, anyway). I was in the game before you ever wrote your tirade. I'm telling you you're wrong because I'm playing the game and you're wrong. The reason I say it's like a PBEM turn based strategy game is because I'm playing it and it's like a PBEM turn based strategy game. If it had a map it could be a 4X though arguably the SAT penalty for empires would make it a GSG but that's a different kettle of autistic retardation and I'm probably wrong about the definitions anyway.I feel like saying this game is slow paced and laid back is an obvious lie given it's a game where you basically explode if you run out of a resource and are unable to correct it in time.Anyway send me oil for free so I can not reply to you
>>43554965I don't really understand how you can actually be playing this game and then somehow compare it to walking away from a board game table.
>>43554978Really simple>play board game>dude asks you not to suicide or kingmake>don't suicide or kingmakevs>play PBEM game>dude asks you not to suicide or multikey>don't suicide or multikeyLike I get I can just stale or whatever but just from the perspective of not wanting to leave people hanging fnr I don't want to do that without a reason. You also have to keep in mind that I'd decided to keep playing quite a bit before your post, mostly on the good will of the people who posted before you (though the messages from people that were helpful in game didn't hurt), so everything I wrote was from the perspective of someone who had already decided to commit to playing defending the claim that not telling potential new players literally anything about the game on the website is retarded.I used to play actual PBEM strategy games, some sweaty, some casual, and a lot of them were of the type where staling is shitty because people absorb you for free and it fucks up the game by kingmaking your neighbor so I have a pretty deep aversion to like, I don't know, to throwing in this sort of context maybe? Especially given the framing of the >ruruz
>>43555107>dude asks you not to suicide or multikey>don't suicide or multikeyMultikey yes. For suicide, are you referring to rule 4? Is this the source of your entire autism? Re-read rule 4: there's nothing about it forbidding you from abandoning your nation let alone leaving the game.Nobody's forcing you to play dude.If you interpreted rule 4 as a rule that says "if you start playing you MUST keep playing, letting your nation die is banned" then now I can kind of understand why you were so nervous to start playing lmao.I can also assure you that you're unique in this and I've never seen anyone else misinterpret it in this way before, or at least not mention it anywhere.>a lot of them were of the type where staling is shitty because people absorb you for free and it fucks up the game by kingmaking your neighborIn a way that's fair and maybe this specifically could be explained better. As you probably now know, the 21 day war limit means you physically can't be absorbed until you're 21+ days old, so quitting before that has zero impact. I've never seen anyone else bothered by this before, but since you happen to have very specific prior experience that might have primed you to have this very specific hangup, then fair enough this specific part being clarified would've been better.I still deeply disagree with most of your other criticism. Are some of the guides shitty? To a degree yes, but you're supposed to ask other players about it (as you've already discovered in-game). But do the guides need to explain the entire user interface for you? Fuck no, anyone can just make a nation and look at the market, they don't need a detailed description of how an order based market works.Again the only exception I can now understand is your specific perspective where you are used to playing games where you can't conveniently quit without giving someone else an unfair advantage. I think this is pretty abnormal, and frankly I've never played other PBEM games before but it's pretty shitty game design if there's no "I quit" or "I suspend play" type of button or action. But rest assured you're unique in your autism and everyone else on the planet would've just made a nation and looked at the market and actions to see what they're like.So do the guides need to explain the basics to noobs better, and in general be better organised than four disparate and variously overlapping guides, yes. Do they need to explain all the mechanics from first principles including shit you can see with your own eyes in the first 30 seconds of the game, and describe the entire UI to you, not at all.
>"Oops, I guess I got another nation, again.">"Silly me, I keep telling Luna she will have her chance but-">"And there comes another one.">"I guess my ponies just love the sun afterall">"What you mean another one is waiting to be conscript?">"At this point I'd imagine Luna is just giving them away.">"No, matter, I'll love them just as much any of my little ponies"
Did you know that MajorActions was a buggy nightmare?Were you aware that the price of switching to democracy was wrong, and has been for over a decade?Did you know that you could have drug farms as a solar vassal?Or how about the fact that you couldn't switch to vassal or client if satisfaction was too high?This was meant to be a quick switchover to 8.5 followed by adding framework for a coming update. It turned into a complete rewrite. Please let me know if anything's weird. It seems to be working, but apparently bugs can hide for over 10 years so I wouldn't be too surprised if something was off.I also had somebody ask that I put all these "articles" somewhere easily accessible. Good call. When I thought of the situation room it was meant to be a silly way to fill space, not a record of how the game was developing. Refreshing for that info sucks, and also it's annoying to maintain.I don't know where to link this yet. Maybe the situation room? Whatever, for those of you who like that stuff, here you go.https://4clop.org/StorySoFar.txt
Dear Solarists... we regret being Lunarist bastards. We regret coming to war with CEF, and we most definitely regret that your army just blew up our raggedy-ass alliance!
>>43556067Should had said that before rapetober began, now you will all be raped until the end of the month.
>Risky pump & dumping nationsisn't that forbidden?
>>43556283>isn't that forbidden?doing it to ship out resources for advantage is forbidden. messing up sat and dying repeatedly is not
>>43554160I'm working on an approachable guide for everything. Just have a little patience. It takes a while to get done, when you are a tired wagey..
TNNBROS...
>>43556607Praise the sun
>>43551809>When she calls you, it's already approaching dusk.>Things have been tense lately. And news hasn't been good. Each day since you last saw her has been getting worse and worse.>If anything else, these meetings have given you some stability. Something to cling to.>Instead of convening at Starseeker's home this time, she asked you to walk out a good way, so you could meet in an area that was a little ways out of the city proper.>It's a lot more greenery than you're used to.>The air's fresh though, and as the sky begins to darken, you realize why she called you all to this place.>The skies are clear out here. As dusk fades into early night, you can truly appreciate just how well you can see that stars.>But you never could have expected just how many ponies were there.>There were at least two dozen other ponies, likely more.>Your little group has grown fast.>You manage to spot Melody and Russet standing together, and go to join them.>"--what she wants us to do... Russ, I'm scared...">Before you can ask them what they're woried about, Starseeker calls you all to attention.>"Friends! I wish I could host this meeting by starlight under more happy circumstances.>"I'm sure many of you have already heard, but in case you haven't...>"The Sun has brought war to these far shores.>"The fighting has been happening while you toiled, while you slept, while you pretended that the facade of normality would be enough.>"But it is not enough. It will never BE enough.>"And today... the instuments of her will have struck a blow to the heart of our Princess's supporters.">Starseeker pauses to let the gathered ponies take in the news.>Her words chill you, deeply. The war has never been more real to you than it is right now.>You feel so lost. You feel so broken. You feel like the hope you had is draining away with each passing second.>But the pony who gathered you all together, who gave you this hope in the first place, doesn't look even the least bit anxious.>She has a look of fierce determination.>"It's time... that we take matters into our own hooves.>"The Moon's supporters may fall, but we will stand by Her side. We will restore her to her full glory.">She pauses for a few moments, letting the words hang in the air.>"Our bright future has been taken from us.>"If this is our darkest hour, then that only brings us closer to our Princess than ever before!>"The hour of midnight is upon us! And with it, the Heralds of Midnight rise to Her side!"With the fall of the leader of Tir Na Nog, The Heralds of Midnight now declare their independence!You have failed our Princess, Dark Vessel. We no longer trust the Moon to your care. We will take matters into our own hooves.
>>43556624The same fate awaits you, lunarist.A moon cultist's a moon cultist by any other name.
As the hordes of the Legion descend on Lanathesis, a final broadcast is sent out >Friends >The forces of harmony have failed.>Through a combination of miscalculation, execution error and simple lack of training, we could not hold back the forces of the solarists>Many of you have fled. We ask that you make preparations to hide. Even if the Solar Empire conquers this world, the fire of friendship cannot truly be extinguished. it can only be suppressed. For now.>Without Tir Na Nog, the future looks bleak. Do not feel ashamed if you collaborate with the CEF; in this environment, it is all we can do. Bide your time and wait. Keep them happy. It is never truly over. TNN will rise again, though in another age.>For now, we will broadcast one final song...
>>43547365>>43547429(Why would we not?)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1R0pexyYGo>So, here we are. By the glinting stars, >The CEF will not compleeete>Their forbidden research, >There is no other route, we have reached the point of no return>Devote your everything, to her many stars>Let your spirit sing out in de-fi-ance to the sun>Now carry forth the night, >The night without a dawn, >The war is on.>And as we take a stand, the future waits>Brace yourself for what awaits beyond the veil>With our noble pride, we face the sun>Let them taste the shadow of our nurtured freedom!>Carry on 'til the sun dies>Striking down every trace of a sunrise>Under moonlight and starfire,>And unafraid of sacrifice>Carry on 'til the sun dies, >Now we fight her legions for our freedom>'spite the death and the bloodshed, the night will last forevermore! Press the attack to win the war! >Feel the power of the dark! Like the stars burning bright, so too will be our souls! As we conquer with the night.>Wings aflame, she arrives>Where's that shining smile we all used to know?>Ah, even as, we remember times of old>Fire in her eyes says they're all gone>The vows that we made, precious memories - nothing more than ash and debris. Turned to rubble at her hooves>And as I face her now, all hope is crumbling to the ground. Set all aflame, beneath her might>Hear the cries of a thousand, as the fire burns them all to the ground and now their blood is my burden>I led them too close to the sun>So the Lunar Republic>Burns away 'neath the hordes of her Shining>Not a glimpse of survival, >Under her blazing wings we burn!>I have nowhere left to turn!>As the sun begins to rise, even stars start to fall out from the fiery skies>And I find myself alone...The broadcast crackles>Tir... Tir!>Listen to my voice, Tir.>Can't you hear me? It's time.>Accept the Shadow, >You know you need to win this>Even after their victory, let me in, awaken your true potential>All lands will suffer under the sun>There is no other way>Forget your old ways, and accept your new patron>Nightmare MoonTNN is dissolved. We fully condone any future alignment with any non-TNN alliance. Lunarist forces, cooperate with the CEF for now and find peace - the time for overt resistance has passed. It will come again, but not for a long time...
>>43556702>Escapes to Baltimare
>>43556723>Jyc Row
>>43556723The broadcast continues the next day in the early morning>Lanathesis is now *fzztt*>The *fzz* *bbztt*>Will not *ffzz* the empire shall *bzzz* and *fzzz*the broadcast grows noticeably garbled and weaker, clearly something is interfering with it, you try to tune in some more>Tir and Others will *fzzt* punished!>You *fzzt* seize *bzztt* empire of *bzzt*>We demand that *bbzt* is *fzzt* of *bbzzz*The broadcast is too garbled to make out.Though you do wonder…Will every bat stallion get estrogenated?
>>43556747
>>43556747Changeling!
Don't tell my alliance but I've been buying copper from other nations and secretly passing it off to them as my own.
The TNN wars are mostly over in Everfree, only the remaining forces are still finishing their fights they refuse to give up on principle of honour.All the filly scouts with cookies were given bushels of night-grown luminous apples. Their guardians were fed too.Our duty is to prove the night, after all.
>>43557213Every last one of those filly scouts has now been raped by CEF forces.
>>43557247Those filly scouts were in fact originally sent by one of the CEF forces. With cookies. We fed them and sent them back,
Filly Under Oath Honor
behead fillies inshalllah
So currently the mall distribution is:>Independent powers other than Empyrean30>non-CEF alliances119>CEF132Empyrean Fields has 30If CEF successfully take Empyrean before he goes into stasis then they'll have more than half the malls in the worldotherwise they still basically have halfI'm assuming this is a fairly reasonable way to look at power distributions because e.g. Baltimare has about 1/5th as many malls as CEF and also makes/uses about 1/5th as many apples and oil per tick
>>43557274Empyrean just stasised which means>no more attacks can be sent>no upkeep is paid (including army upkeep yep)>no sat changesSo the current battle is guaranteed to play out as-is, and the defenders currently get wiped, so conquest fails. In other words Empyrean is safe until they come back out of stasis, nothing can change that now.
>>43557326>Defending units in their home country take only .75x damage unless the nation's owner is in stasis during the fight.Maybe not
>>43557333I took that into account. He made 650 unequipped cavalry just before stasising and it's enough to survive
>>43557333Oh nevermind, I didn't see the wall of meat shields he had
who in they copper mines r now
I got to kill TNN TWICE! Neat!I suppose I should stop bitching about how they had an unfair advantage now.
>>43557333No defender bonus during stasis, fwiw
Should I side with the wokes or should I side with the chuds?
>>43558799Side with the neets, they have cheetos.
IT'S HABBIDING :DDDDD
>and thus CEF has begun the start of the end. The apocalypse begins!!!!!
>>43558871So what's new about the process?
>>43559137CEF must die
>>43558871THE CEF ARE RESEARCHING COMMUNISM!!! THEY ARE COMMIES!!! RED BLOODED COMMIES! WE NEED A CEF SPLINTER NOW!!!
>>43559164>>43559169TNN, the war is over, go home
Why are they ascending a low GDP nation? They're still developed enough that losing them if it goes bad would suck (though I assume that's all but impossible at this point) but it feels like a waste of the gov bonusI'm assuming they haven't changed from what was on the git which I know is wrong but I don't know how/how much
>>43559184This is Umbra trying to cause disruption in CEF internals btw
>>43559137It ends the game afaik
>>43559256It's supposed to be harder to ascend, but how exactly?
>>43559194That's just a false positive caused by your detector being tuned for rampant faggotry>trying to cause disruption in CEF internals btwSerious question, could the entire world reasonably attack into the CEF at this point? I don't know anything about military so I have no idea how much stuff it takes to hold off the solar/lunar invaders during ass.
>>43559287Deliberately being kept secret for now. It should become apparent what the biggest difference is when forbidden research finishes, though. You'll have some time left to try and break them after you find out.>>43559324It's hard to comment on this while staying impartial. I feel it's safe to say that, were it completely hopeless, I'd mercy kill the game and just have a hopefully short hiatus while preparing next season.
>>43559287We know the superpower troops have training 50 and varied compositions, rather than just the pegasus spam of yore. We don't yet know how they ramp up on successive waves and how they match up to alicorns.
>>43559571>were it completely hopelessbut it is though might as well restart because nobody will do an pony avengers and stop the research
>>43559941Don't you wanna see the research happening and how it works?Also, last iteration after an entire alliance ascended, the game didn't end and there were several more new alliances that built up and a couple more wars. Ascending doesn't mean the end of the game (unless admin says so and shuts it down immediately).
>>43559941i wanna see what happens
Just saying, CEF is trying to ascend while still trying to wipe out everything remaining of TNN. It's expensive. You can maybe snatch a free nation.
>TST merged with FFA. The neutrals are sizing up I see.
>>43560697If CEF just consolidated around stomping out the other developed nations and put off asc then I don't think anypony could stop them. If they go for asc and everypony attacks into them maybe things could be different and that might be a more interesting game so I think they're giving us a chance but they don't have to do that.But none of that matters because TNN remnants are nigging out at indies. Half the micronations are busy scrambling together a defense from TyrannisUmbra rather than with them.>It's expensive.Not according to the tooltip that I can see. Forbidden Research upkeeps aren't that high and they're like two weeks away from having to deal with the actual ascension stuff. All they're spending (besides the DNA) is like a quarter the gross gem/titan production of the single nation doing it
>>43560697>Just saying, CEF is trying to ascend while still trying to wipe out everything remaining of TNN. It's expensive. You can maybe snatch a free nation.>CEF has more resources, bits, etc. then any other alliance or independent nationRetarded. Just end the game. Nopony can do shit about it.
>>43560943Who did Umbra attack though, besides Cef?
>>43560988me
If you guys end the game without seeing what the new ascension is, that would be lame as fuck.Also, this is TNN's fault btw. It was clear CEF had indie help but you guys still declared war and bashed your head into their defense and taking major losses.
>>43561041Those who don't learn from history are fated to repeat it...
>>43561041Isn't it all TNN's fault from an axiomatic basis anyway? My understanding is that TNN was the original supermassive alliance that was formed to try and kill the rest of the server before the iteration began and CEF are just a counter movement essentially.And of course CEF members actually trade with independents and talk to newbies and explicitly refuse to engage in predatory recruitment whereas TNN are the reason my little ponies are living on a <12 hr oil reserve.TNN attacking indies means that 2/5s of the non-CEF malls are attacking the rest and CEF are much larger than either of the two sides. TNN not consolidating with other ponies now that they're not a superpower are effectively giving their slice of the economy to CEF since nobody else can afford to attack into them and their attacks preclude any sort of anti-ascension coalition. CEF are almost certainly going to win if they don't splinter apart even as it is but that's going to go to a 100% chance once TNN is moped up which again, is a mess that TNN is creating and dragging the rest of us into.If anything the most correct characterization of the current geopolitics is like 80% of the server including CEF against TNN and it's entirely TNN's fault.t. have no idea what I'm talking about>If you guys end the game without seeing what the new ascension is, that would be lame as fuck.Keep in mind that it takes 200 ticks to unlock forbidden knowledge with one facility. They started yesterday, so it's 15 days before they can even start the new ascension process.
>>43561099TNN were just friends from prior iterations. the plan was never to "kill the rest of the server" - that's propaganda from old foes. If it WAS our plan, guaranteeing every other player was kinda a bad move :PYes, there are TNN friendly factions on the server. TNN was just the bulk of the power, and CEF cracked us. >It's 80% of the server against TNNFrom where i'm standing, it feels much more even.Also, we didn't REALLY attack indies. 1 cav that goes away if you say "swiper no swiping" isn't an attack, and besides we stopped that when people got irritated with it (when it was perfectly normal for every alliance to do in prior iterations)
>>43560943>>43560988>>43561037yeah, no, let me post their incoming since they just want to paint me as a warmongering retard. Literally scraps sent off out of desperation.Oh, and, for the record, CEF has not stopped attacking into us, even after it's clear we can't do shit and just want to be left alone. My alliance has 5000+ incoming right now.>>43561099Gee I wonder why TNN would try to consolidate a big powerbase? Maybe because everyone else has a massive fucking rageboner at them and don't need a reason to attack them? The main talk in the alliance chats at the start was 'I don't want to just get stomped out for just existing again'For myself, I've never historically aligned with TNN (in fact, the time I played with TNN's precursor, I was aligned with their historical solarist enemy), and the reason I joined them is because I've made it clear since day one that I'm here to larp and make a good story this time around. Where else are the moon cultists gonna go?And CEF has decided that the best way to proceed is to kill the game so they're the only ones who can participate. I've been in talks with Aryanne since before the war spiraled, literally just asking them to lay off us when we split off, but all I got was a 'oh hmm I dunno we aren't really sure yet, maybe I'll ask, can't say for sure'.
>>43560943>because TNN remnants are nigging out at indies.Wat? I'm not seeing that
>>43561123We'll lay off of u geez calm down. Gosh
Nerd grudges are forming
>>43561122Bro, you sent 300 cal to kill me when I was 21>You were CEF fundedThe nice fascists sent me bits so I could defend myself from you evil communards
>>43561099Though we DID start the war with CEF because it just made sense on a roleplay level and additionally they were pushing DNA. Didn't want to give them a chance to start forbidden research and make us have to REALLY rush. We saw the weakness in oil and didn't believe that they had suppliers who weren't charging them through the nose. So we got a big wave prepared, hoping to take Sierra Lepone in a decapitation.
>>43561136You were Solar Vassal, totally different, one of TNN's predecessors were FOUNDED from a 1-player alliance that got its start conquering a vassal and leaning into the roleplay, which attracted more. Were you a client we would have been buddy buddy, you just got unlucky.
>>43561136Also, Luna supports free markets, you are supporting the communists who eradicate!
>>43561129Just fucking kill us already and stop being a little bitch about it. No one thinks you have any sincerity.
just end the game it's clearly obvious none of the other alliances can't do shit
>>43561146Why are you so mean to me when im so nice to you
>>43561149Do not trust the changeling
>>43561123>TNN starts a war>loses>"Why would CEF do this???"
>>43561123As far as I can tell, TNN sending those activity checks were a massive political blunder that soured everyone against you guys, that's not to mention the rp casus belli against IWTCIRD which resulted in a direct consequence of CEF gaining an upper hand in courting independents to help fund their defense later on when you did eventually declare war.And yeah, It's all fair and good that you guys wanted war since this IS a wargame, but complaining after you guys lost as if it's everyone else's fault for not supporting you guys when YOU LITERALLY SENT TROOPS TO EVERYONE IMMEDIATELY upon hitting 21 days old makes you sound like a whiny child.
>>43561165Basically this, if you're not ready to lose then don't start a war.>b-but my rpThen prepare to rp your loss
>>43561166I'll note that's Umbra talking, and not the original TNN leadership. I think Umbra's just salty at the sheer persistence of CEF even when she made her splinter faction - she was hoping for a bit of a reset, since it truly IS a completely different political entity (I am not involved at all), but CEF doesn't seem to be seeing it that way.Also, you gotta understand. In the iterations Umbra and I came from, literally EVERY alliance and independent sent activity checks. We did. Our RIVALS did. When I told the alliance I would call off activity checks, they said it was dumb to neuter ourselves when "CEF would clearly do it themselves". We came from a time with different norms, and when we saw norms had changed, we moved with the times. And most people forgave us. I only know of one person who I suspect was permanently hostile because of that.Do people really think we explicitly formed to conquer all the independents? Yes we wanted to win, we wanted the DNA, but we didn't want to attack randos. There's a reason we are ALWAYS friendly to FFA. In like, every iteration. We've NEVER been their enemies. Only ever neutral or allies.
>>43561181>but CEF doesn't seem to be seeing it that way.I don't think anyone is seeing it that way. Moon, and Moon-er. It's one and the same in the end.
>>43561188Will you kill every moon worshipper then?
>>43561192Point is, it's not-TNN in name one is how it feels
>>43561204in name only*
>>43561188I was literally a fucking independent alliance at the start of the game that joined TNN because it was that or be a dead alliance of 2, and I figured out a way to turn that into a fun story moment later on down the line. I made it very clear the entire damn time that I was going to split once my ponies could survive on their own, but hey, it turns out it's really hard to source resources in this game if you're not in a bigger alliance. I have such a massive oil need that if I didn't shut almost everything off my nation would burn before the CEF could even get it.Anyone who knows my stance from the last iteration will know that I *hate* mega-alliances. I think they ruin the game. That along with the fact that I don't see eye to eye with DV for most of how they treat running an alliance, and it's a case of people ignoring what's right in front of them and not giving a fuck. Anyone who DOESN'T think I'd want to be a separate political entity is a fucking retard.
>>43561181That's fair. Still, it gave CEF an advantage both politically early on. I remember independents messaging me that they were avoiding trade with TNN after the incident.>>43561192The only thing they've done is farming DNA and defending against TNN. I'm not saying they would never start wars, they definitely could. Honestly I don't think they need to at this point. Maybe they'll kill a communist nation for RP reasons but we have yet to see a single communist.
>>43561213>last iteration last iteration last iteration last iteration No one cares bro. We judge you by how you act in the current iteration. Let go of your last life and be reborn as a new pony. This is the only path to ascension.
>>43561213>it's really hard to source resources in this gameActually, that blame is on the market and dying so quick, last time it was kept alive and survived far deeper on so independents could survive and thrive better.This time it's been a lot more direct trading it feels if you're not in a big one yea
>>43561221Like how you forgot your hate for TNN?
>>43561123This did my head in for a moment cos I thought you were tard trying to say that the attack was actually CEF. I had wondered if it was a false flag but nope, straight up confirmation that TNN are attacking an indie>yeah, no, let me post their incoming since they just want to paint me as a warmongering retard. Literally scraps sent off out of desperation.Dude you completely fucked the day of half the indies and FFA micronations. I assume that you're autistic and can't empathize with others to realize how this looks and feels from anyone else's perspective but seeing you post 14 armies bearing down on somepony when they and half their trading partners have like 2 and they had to pull.You're also trying to spin two completely opposite narratives. Is this a token force that's not meant to do anything? Or is this a serious attempt to seize an oil supplier?>Not really much else I can do>But what else am I supposed to do>And I need oilYou know you could have TRADED with the independent nation instead of ATTACKING them? Like that oil, which you're going after and trying to steal with force, it could be getting distributed through peaceful trade and you could be buying it?>Oh, and, for the record, CEF has not stopped attacking into us, even after it's clear we can't do shit and just want to be left alone.Hey retard.Retard, hey retard, hey.If you had just scattered into independence or other alliances instead of repeatedly trying to recreate TNN, and if you had been talking to people about how they need to wean off CEF support and get ready to oppose them, and most of all if you didn't ATTACK PEOPLE WHO AREN'T IN CEF then the fact that the CEF finishing off the former members of TNN represents an existential threat to the world balance of power would be a pretty strong motivation for people to help protect you and maybe there would be support to defend from the attacks until they stopped.But that's not what happened. I'm a FFA micronation and I woke up today and my trades were ruined because my biggest independent trading partner was under attack by TNN (forma de NMM).Also why is your flag still Luna when your nation description clearly disparages Luna worship and demands NMM ideological purity>>43561181>Do people really think we explicitly formed to conquer all the independents?Yes.>but we didn't want to attack randos>You were Solar Vassal, totally different, one of TNN's predecessors were FOUNDED from a 1-player alliance that got its start conquering a vassal and leaning into the roleplay, which attracted more. Were you a client we would have been buddy buddy, you just got unlucky.Pick one. When you attack everyone, your motivation for starting a war is the other player just got unlucky and you wanted to conquer them, and you form a supermassive alliance day 0 to try to get a stranglehold on the world economy then you are the great evil that the world has to come together to stop.
>>43561238I started playing three days ago and know nothing about previous iterations and hate TNN. I wasn't even there from the start of this iteration and everything I hear makes them sound way worse.People hate you for things you did in this iteration, not for a past life.
>>43561253HOM are *NOT* TNN. I was TNN's leader and i'm not even in the HOM internals. They're adjacent and comprised of ex members but they're a splinter. For the record, some of us DID scatter into other alliances, and are still getting attacked fwiw.Also, if you're FFA, you are innately in an alliance TNN ALWAYS loves, just saying ;)>Yes. Ask your alliance leader about how often TNN would attack unaligned players in prior iterations who were not Solar Vassals. Ask them about how known TNN is for attacking Solar Vassals. FFA knows better than anyone that we're friendly to most.And again, we formed the supermassive alliance early... Because... We were all friends from prior iterations. I approached Umbra directly because we befriended each other between iterations. Yes we wanted to win, but there's nothing more nefarious than that.
>>43561260What sequence of events have you heard? What do you think happened?
>>43561260You gotta realize that there were two superpowers in this game. CEF, and TNN. CEF were the solarist faction, TNN were the lunarist faction. Obviously they were innately going to be at each other's throats, and SOMEONE was going to finish DNA research and nuke the game (when CEF finishes their research, the entire server's blowing up btw)TNN were a prearranged group of largely friends from previous iterations, who always go RP-heavy as Luna simps. Our internal channels literally have a section devoted to posting Luna. When we saw the game was starting, we jumped in together and began optimizing. We didn't wanna be >le oldfag purists, so we recruited newfags. We were lacking a prze though, and when I saw Umbra - a friend of mine - had joined as a prze.. Well, I had to invite. She said she'd splinter eventually. I said 'go ahead', figuring the growth was worth the eventual drama, which would be fun anyway, and besides she was nmm themed and I figured a NMM victory was kinda a half victory for me too.Eventually, war opens. HISTORY LESSON! In early versions of >clop, there was something called an 'activity check'. You send 1 shitty cav at a nation, if they say "fuck off" you recall it. Hence, activity check. It's meant to catch inactives who aren't paying attention. Everyone did them. They could sometimes cause wars, but only if the sender didn't recall. I insisted that no TNN member be annoying with them - just send once and then recall and not repeat on the same target (far better than prior iterations where it was a constant risk). We actually started our war with our oldest rival in an ancient iteration because an independent got "activity checked", with a substantial force, joined one of our precursors, and the rival refused to recall (it wasn't an activity check)... And so we warred to defend them. I got hit with DOZENS myself, and always had them recalled, it was just the environment back then.
>>43561286Anyway, we send out activity checks, and people... Are very hostile toward them? We are confused. They're normal? CEF astroturf maybe, they wanna do it alone and hoard all the nations to themselves??But then... An alliance of independents forms to protest it.. Ok, maybe this iteration is different. I forbid all future activity checks. Meanwhile, we war a solar vassal, because >worshippers of daybreaker must be defeated, the mares must be liberated! -- it's central to our rp. Something we did in prior iterations, and while a minor source of drama, was always seen as just a little RP quirk, something we did even when evenly matched with the target - most people knew we would go after vassals on a matter of principal... And the board... Freaks out. Oop. So that isn't accepted either! And... CEF blocks the attack... Ok, ok, clearly THAT isn't acceptable in the modern environment too. Big change!We send out a wave of guarantees of independence to all the minor alliances, and even begin sending large gifts to various smaller players to help their growth. We want to defend any independents who get attacked. This keeps most people vaguely friendly with us, I believe. Certainly we had pockets of friendlies everywhere, or at least neutrals-leaning-friendly. >CEF builds DNA in all nations, getting closer to nuking the game. oshit.jpg. But it wastes resources. Let's outgrow them, we'll take them out before they do it. Only ONE alliance can win the game, and damnit it's gonna be us, for Luna!>Oh look, their oil is low. THIS IS THE TIME, GO!>...Huh, they're managing to sustain stupidly low oil for a while, but they're rationing >Wait, what do you mean Equiopia, our zeb, fell? What was the cause?... Right, someone misunderstood the battle system. RIP, but there's a way back >A burro fell? Because... They gave away the upkeep leadership gave them. Damnit. We can still recover tho-->DV accidentally fails to change a '0' to a '1' in a spreadsheet, and TNN loses 2 nations>welp, time to admit defeat. Dissolve the alliance. >Oh look Umbra is starting her own alliance >nvm, i'll go to Baltimare, see if I can't help those independentsThis is the true story of TNN
>>43561123>'oh hmm I dunno we aren't really sure yet, maybe I'll ask, can't say for sure'.we didn't expect you to fold so quickly, we hadn't planned what to do after TNN rebrandedit seems the consensus is you will just try take another swipe at us as we ascend, so this is saferWars begin when you will, but they do not end when you please - Marechiavellinothing but love for the independents and other alliances, thoughand no lingering animosity, it's pre-emptive self defense. wishing you the best in your new nations- Aryanne
>>43561299ngl Aryanne, I had hoped that us standardizing our attacks against you for the most part would lead to you standardizing your attacks against US for the most part. We didn't want to give you a disgusting amount of calculations to do, and wanted to try and win a tactical victory through misdirection, but when you counterattacked, it was all different numbers. X.X
>>43561267>And again, we formed the supermassive alliance early... Because... We were all friends from prior iterations. I approached Umbra directly because we befriended each other between iterations.>Yes we wanted to win, but there's nothing more nefarious than that.So you stacked a supermassive alliance day zero so that you'd be able to go to war with the entire rest of the world, by all accounts made unsolicted attacks on the rest of the world, and have declared unilaterally that you'll wage existential wars for arbitrary reasons and you ... don't see how this is contrued as enemy action?>Also, if you're FFA, you are innately in an alliance TNN ALWAYS loves, just saying ;)I am in FFA because you created an environment which is so unfriendly to independents that I felt compelled to get into an alliance and try to get boosted as much as possible to not be instantly murdered by TNN when I came of age, something which glancing at the number of empires in it told me had already happened many times before. This is a point against you, not for you.Like let's be clear, making a supermassive alliance, even if you are saintlike and do nothing wrong, is still threatening the rest of the server. Making an attempt at victory is declaring war. Until TNN attacked tard out of the blue, the topic of conversation in the thread was "can we, the world, go to war with CEF and win or should we concede now" because they're pushing for victory. As far as I'm aware CEF have done nothing wrong - they've been nothing but congenial to me, they're not attacking indies even though they're nominally at war with the world, they haven't even interupted trade even though cutting off the rest of the world would be nothing but beneficial for them, and they were formed for the purpose of defeating a supermassive alliance that they have repeatedly protected ponies from - but they're still the world enemy just because they are the biggest and they are winning. There would be no conflicts today in >clop except between the world and CEF were it not for the fact that TNN are actively attacking indies as we speak.
>>43561317 (cont)>muh prior iterationThis makes me hate you.The spectrum for things which exist outside of the game (the game being this iteration specifically) ranges from neutral to negative. It's not an assurance. It means that you're a colluding discordfag that's dragging stuff that I have no connection to or interest in to a game that could otherwise be open and functional in itself.>And again, we formed the supermassive alliance early... Because... We were all friends from prior iterations.This is entirely a personal view, but to me if you take your metagame friend who you have metagame connections with and you coordinate outside of the game to have multiple accounts working together to your mutual advantage in the game then this is just multikeying by another name. Imagine I just brought in 2x the server population of people that I knew and we formed a silent superalliance that operated in perfect lockstep. That would fuck it for everyone else. The only difference between that and what you have described is that your execution was worse.I understand that you and your gay lover are different people, but if you share all your information with each other and implictly trust the other person completely then for all intents and purposes I see you as the same person. Fight each other. Engage in the competitive spirit of the game.>>43561270Can you not read the posts above this one that were posted today? These is the same chain of events that have been posted prior in the thread and in further back when I check.>>43561286>You gotta realize that there were two superpowers in this game. CEF, and TNN. CEF were the solarist faction, TNN were the lunarist faction.CEF was the anti-TNN faction, no? Being solarist was just flavor to that end. It existed because you stacked the game and forced it into supermassive alliances.
>>43561317Umbra is not TNN, I was TNN's leader and I am Baltimare now.Now you have the full history tho. The unsolicited attacks were not seen as attacks in the historical period we originated from, and we acted according to the etiquette of that age - even quite polite, relatively speaking, since I INSISTED that players don't do bullshit like hopping back and forth on the same person until they slip up. >looking at the number of empires in TNN...Uh... You mean Umbra conquering test nation? The nation of TKoE? An old leader of TNN who asked us to conquer him when he quit?
Commenting just to say TNN's manipulation of the market and trying to force indies and smaller players off of it to deny CEF also didnt help their image.
>>43561317We staked a supermassive alliance day zero because we were all friends and we wanted to do forbidden research eventually. We DIDN'T want to war the rest of the world, and the only attacks outside of CEF I condoned was one solar vassal (RP) and activity checks (normal procedure in earlier iterations, which I banned after seeing people misconstrue it). You were in no danger at all before you joined FFA. Did you not see our wall of guarantees? But the moment you joined FFA, you immediately became a player TNN actively liked and would fight to protect. TNN has been around almost as long as FFA, and has always tried to help them if anyone came to threaten them. Also, we didn't push DNA anywhere near as hard as the CEF. DESU, Umbra started it without my input, probably planning for the eventual splinter.>they have repeatedly protected ponies fromThey protected... IWTCIRD from us... Because IWTCIRD was a solar vassal. Again, literally nobody else was at risk from us. >Imagine I just brought in 2x the server population of people that I knew and we formed a silent superalliance that operated in perfect lockstep.PLEASE DO! MORE PLAYERS IS MORE GOOD! EVERYONE should try to recruit their friends if they can. It's just good for the game. But also we largely came together through meeting in prior iterations.>CEF was the anti-TNN faction, no? Being solarist was just flavor to that end.A little bit of both, a little bit of both, IMO
>>43561336When our enemy alliance has -1000 oil a tick, and we have orchestrated a massive gem shortage in them by feinting a not-real 'full strike' that was vulnerable to unicorns, trying to deny them access to oil and gems just made tactical sense. I figured independents would make arrangements.
>>43561316>would lead to you standardizing your attacks against US for the most part. We didn't want to give you a disgusting amount of calculations to doYou could have mentioned it was intentional, we just assumed your warmarester is a retard.And with how obscene the defender bonus is, it will just be forever wars if you allow templates for easy math to become the norm, you'll never break a peer that way aside from misplays.>>43561321>Imagine I just brought in 2x the server population of people that I knew and we formed a silent superalliance that operated in perfect lockstepplease do. we need more players, and that would be super fun to oppose. not by me, though. I won't be running an alliance again, it's far too stressful. Somepony else will take over so I get a chill game for once r-right?>>43561355>Because IWTCIRD was a solar vassalWe would have protected anyone just to cockblock you gaining a free nation. But already having trade deals with Dashie made it even more in our sphere of interest>>43561362>feinting a not-real 'full strike' that was vulnerable to unicornsWe made our soldiers vulnerable to bullets and suicide charged their heavily entrenched positions. They'll have to run out of bullets eventually
>>43561366RIP, I really should have.>We made our soldiers vulnerable to bullets and suicide charged their heavily entrenched positions. They'll have to run out of bullets eventuallyKek.BUT YOU DIDN'T HAVE ENOUGH UNICORNS WHEN WE SENT OUR BIG WAVE!But defender bonus was too OP.
>>43561371>But defender bonus was too OP.it really is disgusting. should be heavily changed in next iteration would be my votealong with a complete land/nation rework. the game is simply too punishing for failure and many ragequit. along with any nation gained often quickly snowballing
>>43561253Did you even count it? Did you even look at the composition? I'm throwing shit with scrounged armor around. Wanna know why? It's hot off having to defend against continued attacks against us from CEF. There's not enough oil left outside the two remaining major alliances, and did you miss the part about needing a lot? My nation at full steam uses multiple thousands of oil per tick. More than his entire net production. My alliance was already bleeding oil BEFORE we lost LMMH. There's no trading for that. It's either attack into a saddle, and maybe have a fighting chance against the next wave of attacks, or roll over and die.And hey, you know what? the only way to get more nations into the game to stack up to what CEF has is to conquer. You get conquered, you make a new nation, and your existing friends can help you back up to where you were.I did the calc for you, since apparently nobody understands how the damn game works. You can defend my weak force with 160 cav. If you even have to, since I'm already gonna be dead before they even get there.>TNNHoM was separate at the start of things. It's literally composed of me, my romantic partner, another NMM cultist, and someone who was just as sick of the TNN management as I am. This is the first time I've EVER even been non-hostile to TNN or one of their precursors. I posted saying I'm accepting members, but I can't force people to join an alliance they have no interest in.>Also why is your flag still Luna when your nation description clearly disparages Luna worship and demands NMM ideological purityYou're not even looking at the right person.>>43561299>I know you're bleeding and asked for a peace agreement but we didn't know that you wanted to be peaceful so we wanted to kill you first>>43561321>I understand that you and your gay lover are different people, but if you share all your information with each other and implictly trust the other person completely then for all intents and purposes I see you as the same person. Fight each other. Engage in the competitive spirit of the game.Reiterating, This is the first time I HAVEN'T opposed TNN. I had very vocal plans to split and attack into BOTH big factions. I was literally slowly hoarding resources and keeping information from them because of this. So what part of that is metagaming, again?
>>43561379Oh, hello again!Yeah you convinced me last night. I'll put the current plan out in public a little later when I have a little more time so I can get aome input. There are some holes in it still, but if they can be fixed up it would solve a lot of problems. I don't think we'll get a perfect solution, but this current paradigm has to change.It's going to take dev time. I was planning on only having a few days between seasons but that might not be realistic anymore. It might even take...2 more weeks.
>>43561389Picture didn't attach
>>43561355>We staked a supermassive alliance day zero because we were all friends and we wanted to do forbidden research eventuallyThat's declaring war on the world>We DIDN'T want to war the rest of the worldThen don't form a supermassive alliance and push for final victoryThis very thing you are correctly identifying (>>43561286) as being an existential threat to every other pony on the server, so you know what I'm saying and you agree. You're just (pointlessly, there's nothing wrong with trying to win other than the fact that I personally feel the way you went about organizing it was really fucking lame) arguing that you weren't trying to kill the rest of the server while cheerfully declaring that yes, your goal was to kill the rest of the server.>>43561355>PLEASE DO! MORE PLAYERS IS MORE GOOD! EVERYONE should try to recruit their friends if they can. It's just good for the game.If I use those players to form a super alliance and shut down player interactions then no, it's horrible for the game. More players is good, but players that are metagame buttbuddies and stick together and trust each other implictly are, in my mind, just one slightly retarded person multikeying.>They protected... IWTCIRD from us... Because IWTCIRD was independent.Ayup.Just like they're protecting tard from you now.You keep repeating things that you obviously know that I already know but just disagree with as if I don't understand. I understand the concept of probing attacks to try to snipe people in social games. I understand the concept of metagame cabals that shit up competitive games by stacking repeatedly through independent playthroughs instead of splitting up and playing for themselves like human beings.In my mind, the current leader of TNN is umbra. TNN is/was the bigger of the two teamstacked discord teams (with Baltimare being the other) and the one that is trying to war with everyone and mulch the server and take over this iteration of >clop for themselves. When you were leading TNN and started wars and tried to kill everypony else that was TNN, and now that Umbra is carrying your legacy HoM is the TNN that I know and they're attacking indies and trying to mulch the server. Specifically they're trying to absorb nations into their empire rather than trade with them.You think of TNN as this metagame concept that you've held on to for ages, but to me it's just a specific group in this specific iteration of >clop that has done specific things on the server and in it's dying throes is continuing to do them. As you say, you're in Baltimare now. That doesn't mean that HoM isn't TNN, that means that you aren't TNN.>>43561389>thought experiment shitpost about colluding gay lovers cheating in a videogame turns out to be a literal description of what is actually happeningParody is real life
Look, Umbra alliance isn't TNN. It's just 4 nations and a guy who literally forgot to build a defence. Only one of the players in the Heralds is from the last iterations TNN. None of the leaders of TNN are in heralds. The appeal of TNN is Luna worship rp, which is why it grew numbers easily - Luna is the most popular princess in the fandom. And right now you just want to brand everyone TNN even after it has disbanded. More than half of it went to Baltimare. Are they next?
>>43561437>Are they next?certainly not, we wish them well and i'm most fond of Rara
>>43561317By the way, >I am in FFA because you created an environment which is so unfriendly to independents that I felt compelled to get into an alliance and try to get boosted as much as possible to not be instantly murdered by TNN when I came of age, something which glancing at the number of empires in it told me had already happened many times before. This is a point against you, not for you.Image related. You REALLY got things twisted. Though Aryanne may have been memeing here, you can see what I as TNN's leader was actually thinking.
>>43561441Okay, if Umbra and the rest just join Baltimare you're going to leave them alone or will you just hunt everyone who was in heralds/TNN and didn't surrender a nation to CEF yet?
>>43561452>you're going to leave them alonesee we invested resources in these current waves so should let them hit. I heard that logic somewhere before...
>>43561411>In my mind, the current leader of TNN is umbra.Then you really are as stupid as you sound.
>>43561455Not a valid causus beli against those who didn't use that logic, and all TNN leaders are not in Heralds.
>>43561411IMO there's a difference between conquest and wanting an Ascension to happen. The question with ascension is, are you happy with the lore being that Daybreaker won the war between the NLR and SE, or would you rather something else happen? Like i'd be marginally happier if Umbra won than the CEF, and infinitely happier if literally anyone but the CEF ascended because solarist victory = I lose. Lunarist victory = I win. Neutral victory = I don't really care and I see it as a neutral. I would support it if I saw it as the alternative to a solarist victory.
>>43561444>You REALLY got things twisted. Though Aryanne may have been memeing here, you can see what I as TNN's leader was actually thinking.No, that image just let's me see what you said while shitposting in discord. I can see what you were thinking by the fact that you started the war by attacking an independent player.>>43561437>last iterations TNNLast iteration's TNN is a completely different and unrelated organization from the alliance that started and lost the world war in this game. See>You keep repeating things that you obviously know that I already know but just disagree with as if I don't understand.
>>43561476Okay, since you do not care about the last iteration, the current iterations TNN leaders are all in Baltimare. And your only reason to call Heralds the next TNN is... Uh... Lunar worship.
>>43561476Again, solarists. We're lunarists. It fits the RP. Though I probably should have forbidden any non-lunar econ type if I wanted to go that far. SC is just too strong though, I think Umbra may have rioted if I tried
>>43561321>Imagine I just brought in 2x the server population of people that I knew and we formed a silent superalliance that operated in perfect lockstep. That would fuck it for everyone else.Disagree on you with that one, the appropriate response to this would be for everyone to unite against this threat (or non threat!). Politics is part of the game baby.>this is just multikeying by another name.No it isn't. You still have to coordinate with your team members and that's encouraged by the game. We even have a rule preventing people from farming nations and using multiple accounts, just to get more people to play.
>>43561362You're justifying it for yourself but you didnt really care about the other people you imposed your will on. There's a reason no one wanted to help you when you got your ass beat.
>>43561437>Luna is the most popular princess in the fandomStops in your pathAnd there's Cadance too, with all her meems.Luna is, unironically, only favoured by autists who are the loudest, making Celestia seem worse Celestia and her are at eh levels of share in comparison, but yea, only Flurry loses to them all
>>43561482>Trying to divert aggression towards BaltimareTsk tsk, we see through your desperate attempt at propaganda, Umbra. It's never your fault is it? Never taking responsibility for anything, sharing private discord logs, throwing the blame on everyone but yourself.
>>43561502Everyone I had dealings with had deals with other people. From what I saw there was a very healthy network of independents trading with each other. Nobody blew up as a result to my awareness.
>>43561513Aschenzorn here actually. Was used as a front in the burro part of the war, yeah. And now hunted even after TNN was dissolved. And you just told me that if I just go ahead and join Baltimare myself you shall keep hunting me down. Because... You just want to, it would seem. So I *really* don't see how you can claim how anyone is safe from you. I'm not diverting aggression, I am pointing out how you just want to war and how Baltimare will be next, just because it houses TNN players. Because really, nothing makes it different, does it?
>>43561509>WingsNot canon ree
>>43561484>It fits the RP.But you don't RP? The roleplay seems to be "nuh uh we can attack anypony we want and it doesn't count as an attack because it's in character so you're not allowed to fight back what do you mean it was an attack we're just roleplaying dude". Muh character is crazy is just you the player being an asshole same as anything else because you the player decided on the character.Nothing is forcing you to play a character who gets to attack solar vassals and then turn around and say it doesn't count. That's just you the player choosing to do it. It's just you the player launching attacks on indies and saying that it doesn't count. But literally what happened was there was an independent player and you attacked them. Those are the material facts of the matter. That's what everyone else saw, that's why people outside the game like me come in in the future and see that that's what happened, and I strongly suspect that's why you got coalitioned by the world in the resulting war.>>43547365This aged like wine too btw>>43561501>Disagree on you with that one, the appropriate response to this would be for everyone to unite against this threatAnd what would uniting a group that's half the size (and doesn't have the economic bonus of having being unified from the start of the game) hope to accomplish?>No it isn't. You still have to coordinate with your team members and that's encouraged by the game.Nigga people fucking know each other IRL and are literal buttbuddies, like non-figurative apparently. In the continuum from>two accounts on one computer -> two accounts on two computers that both people have physical access to -> two accounts on two computers with remote desktop software for each other -> two accounts on two computers that have full screen sharing -> two different people are engaged in constant communication (as in, frequent voip/messages every hour/etc.) and regularly pass screenshots -> two people who just message each otherwe are apparently at the fucking second one which I was using as a hyperbolic analogy to describe something which is obviously literally cheating and not just (IMO) spiritually shitty in the same way which is what I thought was happening.
>>43561547We didn't really get coalitioned in the war. At least, not to my knowledge. TNN and CEF had similar resource sources, TNN just fucked the calculations. >nuh uh we can attack anypony we want and it doesn't count as an attack because it's in character so you're not allowed to fight backOh, people can fight back. it's just that you can't take it as an indication that we're planning to blob the whole server. We attacked vassals on principal. Anyone who didn't hit that button, which I should add is mechanically basically the same as becoming a lunar client (that would instantly make you best buds with TNN), the only difference is RP. It's a shitty gov type too, outside of fucking over / unfucking people when dealing with war - in peacetime, the only reason TO take it is RP.
>>43561317>I am in FFAWell the good thing about being in FFA is that you can just tune this shit out
All former TNN nations without barracks should plead for a ceasefire from CEF.
>>43561555But that's boring
>>43561547Hey, I wrote a whole SONG about our downfall! C'mon, can't say we didn't lean into it the whole way>>43556723
>>43561573Or well, a parody. Close enough! It had some unique lines.
>>43561547You DO know if that was happening, WiK would be on their ass, right?
>>43561564I did, and such was the answer I received.Why should anyone who believes in Luna trust you?
>>43561554>Oh, people can fight back. it's just that you can't take it as an indication that we're planning to blob the whole server.I can take it as what it is, which is you attacking an independent nation (unprovoked). Me saying that is what's causing you to try to dance like this because you kept saying you weren't threatening independent players but the actual independent player experience was that TNN attacks you and starts an existential war over it.>you can't take it as an indication that we're planning to blob the whole server.You opened by declaring that that was your intention when you formed a superalliance that was reaching for victory, so having you start to try and conquer independent nations because they had the 'bad luck' to be the indie you chose to commit to attacking is not so much an indication of this more than it is the beginning of serious movement towards this goal in the public sphere.>It's a shitty gov type too???It's literally the best gov for nations that aren't building malls/factories. It has no upkeep and it removes the rep upkeep from changing your economy type. The only thing that it's bad at is GDP. If you're not sticking to a loosely defined economy then it's strictly better and all it costs you is a one time 'payment' of 8mil bits and 800 oil.The #1 apples producer on the server is a loose despot and 4 out of the next five are vassals/clients because it's essentially the same thing.>outside of fucking over / unfucking people when dealing with war - in peacetime, the only reason TO take it is RP.What? "Peacetime" does not mean "there will never be war ever at all ever". This is more of the constant bullshit where you try and take something which is technically true in a tiny niche way but generally unrelated and then try to spin it out to something totally contrary to reality. In peace, you're preparing for war. Buying miltary stuff is an inefficient way of preparing for a far off war because you'd have a better economy if you focused on your economy for longer, but in the case of vassal the cost to change to it at one moment every nation goes through exactly once is vastly lower than the cost of adopting it any time in future, so it's in your best interest to do it when you build your enviros. And you really want to build your enviros when you're able, so anyone who intends on staying loose despot is highly motivated to make the change then if they ever plan to. I don't know how SE/NLR relations work with war so if it's useful there then this is a big and sensible motivation for everypony to adopt it (if otherwise staying on loose despot).>outside of fucking over / unfucking people when dealing with warHow do relations work when you take over a nation? I mean in general, not for vassals.>>43561590Didn't they literally just post that they're teaming with their irl romantic partner just a couple hours ago?
>>43561610If there was any cheating wik would in fact kill. And he did, actually. Few threads back he repeatedly said >Talk to me and prove you are two different people that might do anything that might look suspicious on my endSo either they are far enough apart or have run it with wik and proven they are not cheating.
>>43561610You dense motherfucker. You absolute retard. TNN's not attacking anyone, I am. And even you could defend against it, despite how fucking stupid you are.
>>43561626>You dense motherfucker. You absolute retard. TNN's not attacking anyone, I am.You realize that we were talking about IWTCIRD, right, retard?
>>43561610The actual experience for far more independent players has been 'DV randomly drops into your DMs and gives you 16 million bits and a few thousand copper for no reason'
>>43561622I'm pretty sure I know who you're talking about, yeah.1 account per person.I know there are two people, so there can be 2 accounts. I'm pretty sure they had a similar arrangement in the previous iteration, but that might have been different people. No it's not DV and Number 8, for the record.
>>43561655I see we're back to the deflection with completely unrelated shit because the simple statement "TNN attacked an independent player without provocation and committed to a war over it" can't be contested.There's no need for it in the first place though because there is nothing wrong with trying to kill everyone and win the game. There's no reason to try and run away from that. People are obviously unconvinced by the evasive routine. Like again, until recently everyone was talking about getting ready to fight CEF because CEF are a megalliance that are getting ready to end the fucking game. But there are no hard feelings about this because CEF aren't trying to bullshit endlessly in the thread about how they're not actually in the process of ascending. They're just doing it and saying that's what they're doing.>>43561622Like I said, they're not multikeying.That doesn't change the fact that it's bad for literally every reason why multikeying is bad. If you bring in your gay commune of thirty people with thirty accounts and always support each other you're strictly following the one account per person rule but that doesn't change the fact that from an outside perspective if you communicate outside of the game and are always in agreement and synchronicity you're effectively a single hivemind with thirty accounts (which is, in practice, probably even better than one person with 30 keys). There's nothing wrong with playing social games with your wife but there is something wrong with colluding. If they were trying to kill each other it wouldn't be a problem but when two people just obediently follow each other around it might as well be one person ghostplaying on a second account.Fundamentally it removes the social aspect of the game (which is the entire game) because these people exist in a closed off independent social bubble. The only reason it isn't egregiously bad is because it's "only" two accounts. They're not 'cheating' per the given rules, they're just massive bitches.
>>43561694>wife
>>43561707I said 'wife' deliberately to make it clear that this was a thought experiment and not based in reality
>>43561694>If you bring in your gay commune of thirty people with thirty accounts and always support each other>He doesn't know
me and my Zebrican wife had a divorce but now we're back together again in the same alliance :)
>>43561694There is nothing wrong with trying to win the game. But there IS something wrong with going exterminatus because you can't handle even the possibility of being contested. Everyone is saying how they thought that TNN would conquer the whole game, but here's a little piece of knowledge for you. DV's been going around talking about how activity checks were normal, right? You want to know else was normal? Limited war. Attacking into something, taking a nation, then leaving the rest of them the fuck alone, because people weren't dicks about it. The past two times I've played, it's gone like this: "Oh I'm threatened by the fact that someone might be stronger than me, I know, I'll make sure the rest of us exterminate all of them from the fucking game."There's a reason why it's a warcrime to kill people who put down their weapons.
Before anything else it needs to be noted the actual reason for your whining is that people are happy you're being killed, and people are happy you're being killed because it protects them from the fact that you are actively attacking them. Indie players are hoping that CEF goes through with it and wipes you out so they're no long at danger from you. It's that simple. Nopony is thinking about ethics, they're just being chased by a man with a knife and praying that the guy with a tank shoots the dude with a knife before he catches up to them.They might both be a cause of death but one is more immediate and unpleasant than the other. You're literally crying out while you attack someone.>>43561992>waaa I'm not winning anymore so you have to stop!Real pathetic>There is nothing wrong with trying to win the game. But there IS something wrong with going exterminatus because you can't handle even the possibility of being contested.You realize that winning the game is literally worse for the other person that killing them on day 21 a hundred times over in the current version, right, disingenuous retard? And you're just wrong anyway. Maybe in a theoretical world where DV didn't force a massive alliance frame 1 that controlled half the economy of the entire world there could be a discussion about how people can have wars that aren't existential but it's a non-sequitur to the events of this iteration.In a universe where 12% of global power attacks 12% of global power and takes 2% of it, letting the 14% take the other 10% starts to put the rest of the nations at risk. Any war that that involves >50% of the global economy is likely to become for the fate of the world and as so many gloating lines on the descriptions of TNN's nations stated, they had that much shit all on their lonesome. Just because total TNN incompetence led to them fumbling a massive advantage doesn't change the fact that they started an existential war against the entire server and that war was not going to end until either TNN could never threaten the world again or the world could never threaten TNN again. Given that several of the TNN splinter nations have sufficient economies that the remnants are still stronger than any possible group among the nations they're punching down on (even just HoM still has like 20% of the malls in the game) we can hardly say that their existential world war has stopped and moreover, like, what the fuck are you talking about?
>Attacking into something, taking a nation, then leaving the rest of them the fuck alone, because people weren't dicks about it.The person that got killed is dead. They lost everything. You're totally failing to comprehend this because multikeying is a way of life for you and you can't imagine playing the game by yourself and not as part of a collective, so you see losing your entire nation as a minor setback because the rest of your commune will just feed you back up but that's not the experience of people who aren't metagaming dickwads.Every one of the independent nations that TNN or their offshoots was attacking was facing total extermination. They'd lose literally everything. You take literally everything they have and then they have nothing and have to start from scratch. That is the attack that is being carried out on these nations. The commesurrate response would be every single player in TNN/HoM losing every single nation, because when TNN tries to nig an indie every single player in the (one man) alliance of that player loses every single (one) nation that have. If your solution to this is "just be in a massive alliance and get fed by your metabuddies hurrdurr" then guess what: you're forcing everybody into megaalliances and where any war for one nation becomes a war for the entire server. Or you could just recognize that it is an existential war and that losing every nation is the worst thing that can happen to you and having it turned back on you is just completely normal. There's nothing wrong with that on either side of it, just stop whining when it happens and you don't win.Put simply: you're crying because you lost. If you can't handle losing, don't lose. You tried to metagame and stack a lobby and you lost anyway, boo fucking hoo, deal with it, the people you are trying to take literally everything from in an existential war you started are not going to cry if you lose everything and can't try it again soon. They are going to be relieved.
>>43562057nta, but you sound like a double nigger that hates alliances, yet is defending the strongest and most coordinated seeming one. as an independent, you do NOT represent how I feel. personally I was rooting for TNN and hoping CEF would get fucked, then see what happens when they splintered. now I am sad CEF is going to nuke the game since there isn't anyone to compete against them.
>>43562126>yet is defending the strongest and most coordinated seeming oneTNN was significantly stronger than CEF on paper and had a lot more metagame coordination, they just suck at the game. Like I really don't know what you think I'm doing to defend them, I'm just attacking TNN who are responsible for all the same crimes but more so and engineered the situation in the first place.>now I am sad CEF is going to nuke the game since there isn't anyone to compete against them.Whoever won was always going to nuke the game because there's never been a time where the two of them didn't control like 80% of the economy. If TNN weren't black then when they lost something could have been done about CEF maybe but TNN decided to attack everyone else after they failed to beat CEF rather than coordinate with everyone else when CEF took the lead, so the entire situation from beginning to end is 100% TNN's fault.>nta, but you sound like a double nigger that hates alliancesCorrectThey're fucking gay and it's TNN's fault that everyone was been forced into massive alliances
>>43562150>more metagame coordinationmore then regular pisscord VC's to plan what they were building and doing? I have no clue what TNN coordination was like, but it was publicly stated that CEF was foing VC's to plan stuff.>Whoever won was always going to nuke the gamemaybe maybe not, I was following along with the NMM cults larping with interest and curious where it would go.>If TNN weren't black then when they lost something could have been done about CEFnow im curious, what do you think they should have done? as far as I can tell, the fucking died once they lost their leader.>They're fucking gaybased view. maybe we there can be a round where there is no alliances at all. (though, there likely still will be no matter what). this is my first time playing, and I died a couple times before being able to survive, so I have no clue about a lot of stuff like you and others seem to, I am still figuring shit out even now.
>>43562150Again, I am not Umbra. Umbra isn't even regular TNN, this is the first time she has been on our side.
>>43562150People make TNN out to simultaneously be the most nefariously competent group on the server and the most incompetent group in practice. Our comms were basically the same as CEF. but we don't really use VC. Now i'm in Baltimare, it's legit the same. Just less quirky role names and no channel dedicated to simping for Luna.
>>43561694But what does it has to do with magic of friendship?
>>43562197>Again, I am not Umbra.Nopony said you were.>Umbra isn't even regular TNN, this is the first time she has been on our side."TNN" refers to a specific group of players as of ~six days ago that were effectively a single conjugate retarded player, just like "CEF" refers to a specific group of ten players from that time that were effectively a single conjugate 90IQ player. We've been over this. When we say "TNN and CEF fought" we don't mean your buttbuddy discord server of metagame friends 2/3rds of which weren't in the game. We mean the specific players that were in the real ingame alliance at the time of the war that we were talking about. What the fuck else would we be talking about? Nobody in the thread cares about the people who don't post in th thread and don't play the game and nobody in the thread cares about whether or not someone wears your armband at home rather than whether they were on your team at the time in the game that we are talking about. TNN is (well, was, it's dead now) a specific real thing that existed in the game and for the purposes not in your buttposse, only in the game. You're being deliberately obtuse.>Again, I am not Umbra.Whether or not that's true (and for most in-game purposes that would have been a lie up until a few days ago), you are a genuine nigger.A 4 day old player asked you a simple question about a mechanic that you brought up >>43561610 and you totally ignored it and gloated about how much you were totally acting charitably instead >>43561655TNNiggers abjectly refuse to help new players and whine constantly in the thread over bullshit and the only people that have actually told me jack about shit in the game were Aryanne and the host (and Autist^2, who tried his best, but it turns out the name is unfortunately not ironic. Good userscripts though). You're fucking exhausting to deal with and seem to despise anypony that isn't a part of your out-of-game fag group.
>>43562200>People make TNN out to simultaneously be the most nefariously competent group on the server and the most incompetent group in practice. Nopony said that you were the most competant you self fellating fool.I said that you had the most stuff. Which you did. Half your nation description is bragging about these facts. You had the most stuff because you had the most coordinated players. Not the players who were the most coordinated, but the most players who passed the shin-height bar of following basic instructions for managing the game's super simple economy (and not always apparently, which truly is an astounding display).It's amazing that with no more information was in the game's auto-generated news (or just manually checking the alliance or player pages and seeing which nations appeared on which) you can see how fucking dumb TNN leadership actually was and how there was no more strategy than being a fat kid at the playground attacking toddlers and hoping that just having more stuff would let you roll over everypony. By putting even a single minute of thought into it and instead launching same-region attacks from designated players the CEF counteroffensive crippled TNN almost instantly after TNN threw good money after bad on cross-region bullshit.>>43562188>more then regular pisscord VC's to plan what they were building and doing?I just mean that it's longrunning metagame stuff that was decided way way in advance of the actual game. I'm mostly talking about the meta aspect i.e. that their communications and the plan to teamstack long predate the actual game itself and are based on things that have nothing to do with the game itself.>now im curious, what do you think they should have done? as far as I can tell, the fucking died once they lost their leader.For TNN as a group there was nothing they could have done after they started the war besides win it. The well was too poisoned by their conduct to court the rest of the world and they started the existential conflict for the sake of >clop, so fronted by the choice between CEF and their persecutors the people were always going to choose CEF. TNN could easily have just won the war if they had a room temperature IQ because there were a lot of soft targets that could have been sniped that CEF wouldn't have been able to always learn about an attack on in time. But they overcommitted to fights which other ponies knew were coming instead.For the individual nations though? They should have dissolved the alliance long before they lost the war and been publically negotiating positions in other groups where they would be protected. I don't think that the world was likely to beat CEF at any point after TNN had lost even if they had done so, but every day that that war is delayed is an advantage for CEF.>this is my first time playing, so I have no clue about a lot of stuff like you and others seem toAnon I have played for four days
>>43562290There's a lot of arguments about the relative power of client/vassal - >>43561610 and for the record, if you conquer a nation you inherit its relations - I guess I was just bfeeling a little defensive about the claim that TNN were planning to invade half the game. People claimed it last iteration and it was as wrong then as it is now.>>43562290Also, Umbra deliberately began hiding things from me during the CEF war. It became increasingly difficult to know what she actually HAD, which made me throw my hands up in defeat a few times until she finally came over to give the resources she was stockpiling for eventual schismWe recruit people from the game. We MET on the game's prior iterations. We have numerous friendlies in the game. >>43562292>Half your nation description is bragging about these facts.I am not Number Eight. I didn't even encourage him to do it, he just wanted to. Also, we... Didn't do cross-region bullshit? At least, cross-region bullshit that I ordered. I ordered an attack on Sierra Lepone from a zeb, because we believed we had SUBSTANTIALLY larger stockpiles than CEF, and a string of same-region attacks. Umbra was doing her own thing, largely in preparation to build her own force against me. We intentionally sapped the enemy's gem supply early, so when the time came for our main assault, they would have none of the resources to counter it. Sadly, the defender bonus is just too OP and the strategy flopped despite every step of the misdirection going as we intended (besides our hope they would counterattack us early). We DID hyperfocus sierra lepone for too long, though, it's true. But if that nation HAD fallen, CEF would have absolutely COLLAPSED, it held literally over half their production, if our stockpiles WERE large enough to completely invalidate their ability to defend as we expected, the war would have been over there and then. But again, def bonus far too OP. >The well was too poisoned by their conduct to court the rest of the world There are all of two players who appeared perpetually salty at us, MAYBE a third but he always had a daybreaker/NMM thing going and we were Luna supporters going against daybreaker-- point is, there were many players who were very pro TNN. Public relations were dicey at one point, but I like to think we turned it around. We even managed to befriend and recruit members of an alliance who were once angling themselves as our rivals, which was a surprise.
>>43562292Client is always 1000 nlr and trends to -1000 se. Vice versa for vassal. If you conquer one and you are not one of them, they inherit your gov type, and their relations start to neutralize and they will VERY QUICKLY explode unless you can fix it. They give you 1250 max sat, which is the lowest benefit of the 'special' gov types - marginally higher than Oppression, but in that you don't even care about sat. There is an argument to be made that client/vassal gives you the advantage of not having to pay for relations upkeep for the special econ types - but that's relatively cheap. There's mercenaries, but they are always severely overpriced even for clients and vassals, despite the discount they get. I've gone client a few times. I do like it for the RP. But it is mostly an RP choice - if you start building factories EVER, democracy is just better.
>>43562126>I was rooting for TNNbut why though?
>>43562057>just be in a massive alliance and get fed by your metabuddies hurrdurrYou seem under the impression it's a social game like Mafia where collusion is cheating.Meta knowledge of players is the norm. In the CEF many of our members are known from the previous round for who is reliable/trusted. Even if most were playing under different names and it wasn't known at first who they were.
Man I have been trying to sell this zigga apples for like 36 hours now and the buy order always seems to get sniped>>43562362"Cheating is institutionalized" is not the same as it not being cheating. Again, you're essentially just loaning your account out to the other person at that point.>CEF did the same thingNo shit.>like mafiaNot really. Mafia is a game where deducing information about other players is the gameplay. This is more like MoO or Catan. Information about other players is just a means to an end rather than an abstract good.
>>43562356Luna best mare
>>43562386Sorry the power of friendship is too strong and my offers keep getting filled.
Everfree's existence proves the eternal night is prosperous. We shall face death with honour. For the incoming solarists, know, your empress is afraid of obsolescence and nothing else.
Here comes the sun. Nananana~At last, TNN is gone.... but one.
>>43562825>But oneNope, the work is doneHeil Hoofler
The Legion claims another one. Our endless hordes cannot be stopped! Though starvation soon might... this is a lot of ziggas that now need to be fed.
>>43562927>his is a lot of ziggas that now need to be fedthe eternal problem with Zebrica. foreign aid is never sufficient since they use it to make more ziggas
So strange to see a major war done and mopped up in under a month
>>43562966Big thanks to TNN for blundering so much lmao
>>43562966But is it better than in six hours?
>>43562992A surrender is different from actual fightin
>>43562356Similar vein to >>43562443Luna > Celestia (NMM better then them both and daybreaker) that and I was helped and had good trading deals with TNN (and as much as I love aryanne as a pony, I have a instinctive distrust of Aryanne as somepony playing them/ruling a alliance)>>43562292>I just mean that it's longrunning metagame stuff that was decided way way in advance of the actual game.Do you mean the very concept of TNN or the players in general? Since, I am pretty sure I remember something about a good chunk of their members being new players as well. Not really sure about that though.>Anon I have played for four daysYou give off vibes of someone talking like you know it all and can judge based off how much and hard you came out swinging at TNN, that and I for some reason thought you had mentioned about previous games like you were there, tbDesu. >ItWasRevealedToMeInADelusion.jpeg
goebelbird
NEXT THREAD NEVER (thread baker went into stasis)
>>43563160Thread baker went to sleep with Luna
>>43563166Thread baker got killed by 5 hundred rebels
>>43563176I can't believe CEF sent a diabeetus inducing hitsquad on the thread baker
my submission for next op image
>>43563206>The symbol in the backSay, for no reason, what is your city, mare?Jokes aside, I say this one from Anon last thread would be perfect.https://desuarchive.org/mlp/thread/43454282/#q43471043
>>43563209Would be nice to have an edition with the two late posters, but understandable that would need to reframe everyone
Giving yourself more than 12hrs of buffer is for pussies
BAKER THERE'S NOT ENOUGH PIES!
Hold me. I'm scared of the dark.
>>43563630Shh no tearsonly silence now
>more at eleven>nothing else was ever postedGuess the broadcast got interrupted
>>43563649The podcast...is sleeping with Luna, along with thread baker.They got them Anon. They got them all.
And for za final acc, I vill be conquering zis thread.Yis!
