Szymanowski editionhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=II6KQXv8nnsThis thread is for the discussion of music in the Western (European) classical tradition, as well as classical instrument-playing.>How do I get into classical?This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:https://rentry.org/classicalgenPrevious: >>130597158
>>130631310cursed thread.
now playingstart of Schubert: Sonata For Arpeggione And Piano In A Minor, D. 821https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEfmpGTc6uo&list=OLAK5uy_kbuKgEJOFl3HQKwgfLO_ZUtYL09ApKy44&index=2start of Schumann: 5 Stücke im Volkston, Op. 102https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcM9K4rBBWM&list=OLAK5uy_kbuKgEJOFl3HQKwgfLO_ZUtYL09ApKy44&index=5start of Debussy: Sonata in D Minor for Cello & Piano, L.135https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRRscX8a5VE&list=OLAK5uy_kbuKgEJOFl3HQKwgfLO_ZUtYL09ApKy44&index=9
>>130631299>abstract and/or distant from what we understand as "meaning" itselfIt isn't or no one would listen to it. The contrasts of sonata form are intended for emotional effects and were partly derived from Italian opera. For example, if there was no 'meaning' to the common tendency to make the first theme forceful, disjunct, staccato and the second lyrical, stepwise, legato, then why do it in the first place? If you admit that these different means produce different effects then of course they have meaning. These states are most often experienced involuntary in the listener, too. The *means* of music are abstract but they do not produce abstract ends. The ends of music are sensual and emotional.Brahms himself once said, 'I speak through my music'. That implies that his music has something to say. Just because it is best said through music gives no credence to the modernist tautology of music expressing nothing but music.
>>130631398*involuntarily
>>130631398 >If you admit that these different means produce different effects then of course they have meaning.This is non sequitur. I do admit that they produce different effects of course, but that does not mean they have an inherent "meaning" in the way language or representational art does. It is primarily "music expressing music": structured sounds in motion, appreciated for their internal logic, beauty, emotional evocation, rather than explicit references or external ideas, stories or concepts. "Meaning" implies semantics or intentional content, instrumental music lacks this. A Bach fugue doea not translate into a story or a sentence.
>>130631531No, because language doesn't have inherent meaning either, still less representational art. The meaning of words is purely consensual, not inherent to them, and constantly changes over time. Meaning is never stable and does not imply some fixed intentional content. I mentioned before that this idea of a purely self-sufficient craftsmanship without meaning is a post-Wagnerian overcorrection, but in truth it applies to all the arts, not just music. Finnegans Wake is a good example of how this plays out in literature as writers sought to write in a way that freed them completely from the burden of meaning and sever the link between craft and effect: a literature that expresses nothing but style .>A Bach fugue doea not translate into a story or a sentence.Irrelevant. I repeat myself, but music's meaning is integral to music or else it would be written in words; that is not to say it communicates nothing. In any case, the effects produced by a Bach fugue are obviously related to its abstract means of composition, but they are not synonymous with them.
>>130631310>Szymanowski editionBased. Love the metopes, masques, and myths.Makes me a little sad because my hands are too small to plat some of his chords though.
>>130631624>No, because language doesn't have inherent meaning either, still less representational art. The meaning of words is purely consensual, not inherent to them, and constantly changes over time. Meaning is never stable and does not imply some fixed intentional content.That does not erase the meaningful differences in how domains like language, representational art and instrumental music function or convey content. Language has propositional semantics and we can reliably decode sentences into truth-evaluable claims that people can agree on in context. Meaning isn't purely subjective on a whim. Changes happen, but within constraints. In music, there is no way to extract "propositions". You can't paraphrase music into words, it will change its content entirely.
>>130631398>If you admit that these different means produce different effects then of course they have meaning.Beer and Coffee produce different effects, but do they have meaning?
>>130631711>In music, there is no way to extract "propositions". You can't paraphrase music into words, it will change its content entirely.You keep repeating this but it's entirely a straw man. Who are you quoting when you say 'propositions'? I have repeatedly stated that music is sufficient in itself to express its meaning. Meaning is not strictly experienced propositionally. In fact, I would argue that it is more often prerational. People do not need to put words on music to experience meaning from it.>>130631731Yes, of course, beer and coffee mean a lot to people, and their meaning is usually related to their different effects on human physiology. Food and drink is a domain of culture that often holds very primal meaning to people, actually.
>>130631770>You keep repeating this but it's entirely a straw man.You don't understand strawman fallacy at all. I'm not at all implying this is what you said.
>>130631770Hm, yeah you're right. I hadn't previously thought about the topic all that much and just argued for fun but what you're saying makes a lot of sense actually.
>>130631731All art has meaning.
>>130631800Either it's a strawman where you're trying to box me into the claim that meaning is purely a verbal and rational phenomenon or your post is explaining something irrelevant to my own. I am not saying that music is the same as language, nor that meaning is strictly subjective. I am saying that neither music nor language evoke fixed and changeless meanings.
Hewitt's Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWk6pBW6Gb8&list=OLAK5uy_mew7jhNlDEffD-0ESex9d6Cp87Y1XmYfk&index=21
>>130631856 >neither music nor language evoke fixed and changeless meanings.And I am saying that music evokes no meaning at all.
>>130632007Which is plainly ridiculous unless you limit the scope of how people experience meaning so narrowly that it's unrecognisable as such. Not least because people usually find meaning in music quite involuntarily.
>>130632063You are misusing the word "meaning"
>>130632174No. You are artificially limiting how it is actually used for the sake of an argument.
>>130632197>You are artificially limiting how it is actually usedThat doesn't make any sense. Words have meanings, including the word 'meaning'.
>>130632208You artificially exclude how art can express meaning that is irreducible to verbal paraphrase. It is a motte and bailey where you point to the undeniably abstract craft of music to make the much weaker claim that because music's effects cannot be equated to a verbal paraphrase, it expresses no meaning. But no one would listen to music if it were not expressive of something other than its craft.
Can someone tell me if these three listings are all the same release, and if not, which is the best? Please and thank you.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USnCKcLEY1g&list=OLAK5uy_kXXXjqlVgZ0s0Tk_nM1rWpxv8SZe6ciwY&index=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vv_mjHlljtU&list=OLAK5uy_kbFjeT1RFNthkn8HVCiqtg9-p5GlSL3Ow&index=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOyoo_T-Bkk&list=OLAK5uy_lJDQJUUwgOY8ZGzcyBkKlxaTnTBCIrfzY&index=1They each have different runtimes so my assumption is they're all different releases, and ergo, different remasterings. I've heard the first two through and I'm listening to the third one now in hopes it's the famous recent Pristine Audio release which supposedly did a very good job on cleaning up the sound. We'll see.Officially, there are three releases: one on Opera D’Oro, one on Orfeo, and one on Pristine Audio. Now, my assumption is the first two links are the same Orfeo release, and my hope is the third one is the cleaned-up, interventionalist one from Pristine Audio.
>>130632375No one said music is not expressive. You are constantly making stuff up to justify absolute nonsense.
>>130632472'Music expresses music' is the only nonsense here.
Rachmaninoffhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exdy2xapKp4&list=OLAK5uy_msXg2QLTU_EYr7toJnttkmxOMJ6TrbKG8&index=6
>>130631263You are a neurotic, and probably should get therapy
Daily reminder that Baroque is King and Renaissance is Queen. Do not fall under the neurotic incel spells of Brahms, Chopin, Schubert, Bruckner, and Mahler. They will fill you with anxiety, depressive episodes, and cause spiritual imbalance.Platomaxx with Palestrina, Josquin, Purcell, Bach, Debussy and the court musicians of Louis XIV.
I WANNA SEE BELA'S BARTOK
Classical is cum and Romantic is the human
>>130633424>the neurotic incel spells of Brahms, Chopin, Schubert, Bruckner, and MahlerSounds pretty badass desu. Going to listen to only these composers from now on.
>>130633460Least sex-pilled comment in this general, you should be ashamed.
>>130633492Sex is degenerate.
Post your personal top 10 /classical/, with some honorable mentions.Top 10 keyboard composers of all time:1. Bach2. Scriabin3. Debussy4. Ravel5. Scarlatti6. Couperin7. Liszt8. Rameau9. Albeniz10. ChabrierHonorable mentions: Jongen, Grieg, Satie, Poulenc, Tailleferre
>>130633507Bach had sex
>>130633539My top 10 keyboard composers of all tiime:1. Händel2. Bortkiewicz3. Chausson4. Widor5. Cimarosa6. Martin Kraus7. Draeseke8. Sgambati9. Milhaud10. J.C. BachHonorable mentions: Ginastera, Mozkowski, Alfano, Sarasate, Weinberg
>>130633539 KEYBOARD COMPOSERS TIER LIST (most informed and on objective basis)>ELDER GOD TIERChopinDebussy>ELDER GOD TIER 2 (THE POWER GAP TIER)Nobody.>GOD TIERRachmaninoff>GREAT TIERLisztFauréScriabinBeethoven>GOOD TIERMozartSchubertJ.S. BachBrahms>PASSABLE TIERRegerHaydnSatie>MEH TIERScarlattiByrdSorabjiClementiPoulenc>BAD TIER>SHIT TIERMost others
>>130633539Very based list. Mine would probably be:1. Scriabin2. Beethoven3. Bach4. Fauré5. Debussy6. Scarlatti7. Mozart8. Messiaen9. Chopin10. RavelHonorable mentions: Rameau, Handel, Chabrier, Rachmaninoff, Medtner, Szymanowski
>>130633621>Satie above Scarlatti and Poulencb8
>>130633621Half bait, half fact, but a good list otherwise.
>>130633621Ravelbros...Debussy won
>>130633621Difficult to find any kind of logic or coherent criteria in this list. Well, apart from vague, personal bias. I'd love someone to try and find out the logic behind this.
>>130633682at least half the top x lists posted here are bait
Boccherini time, bitches. Best set of string quintets after Op. 13 for now. Very colorful!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOC2Lc073zU
>>130633967Coherent criteria is the composer's ability to write in a sophisticated, pianistic (for romantics) manner, with intricate patterns, pedalling, sonority or even notation or pedagogical legacy.
>>130634070>sophisticated>pianistic>intricate>sonorityCould you be more vague, please?Anyway, Liszt is clearly high if we focus on sonority, pedaling, color, technical and pedagogical influence. Clementi is obviously high on technical and pedagogical influence (more than Debussy, for one). Your criteria is as incoherent and stupid as your list.
piano composers who had the largest pedagogical influence (in no particular order)>C.P.E. Bach>Hummel>Chopin>Liszt>Hanon>Czernyhonorable mentions: J.S. Bach, Schumann, Bartok, Burgmüller
>>130631310>>130631310>>130631310>have never liked classical music >want to get into it, enter thread and click on sticky>need to take a whole course before I can listen to it>and listen to a 4 hour YouTube series>and read a million books Uhhhh, okay I want to get into it but do I really need all that?
>>130634265No lol. You start with which pieces you already like and branch out from there + try other popular pieces and see if you'r einto them and branch out from them as well
>>130634265You don't, just listen to this for a start: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uG-jjXAhrI
>>130634265Fuck everyone else replying to youListen to the Planets by Gustav Holst
>>130634146These are not vague at all.>ClementiToo entry-level. Pedagogical influence is only one of the criteria.
>>130633572E C L E C T I CCLECTICtoo eclectic for me
>>130634321>These are not vague at all.They are. Very subjective. God knows what you mean by them.
>>130634277what if I like Handel's Sarabande?
>>130635070https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hp53Jh6qO6Q
>>130634265>/classical/ be like listen to 1.5 hour symphonies by Mahler and all 96 tracks of the WTC Ya
>>130635070Bach's brandenburg concertos as anon recommended are great, but the sarabande you refer to is from Handel's keyboard suites and I strongly recommend themhttps://youtu.be/FB1atm__LTY^This is my favorite onebut this is the source of the sarabande you like:https://youtu.be/WjcWzfs7e9c
>>130627693Why do you list Piano and Violin twice?
>>130634265Just give us a few of your favorite pieces - either classical or closest to classical, and anons will give you recs.
I don't like videos that analize every second of a piece of music. Especially a recent one I saw that said "poignant repetition" in the first measure. Dotted rhythm is objective but it's kind of up to me whether it's sorrowful or poignant
>>130633967>Difficult to find any kind of logic or coherent criteria in this list. Well, apart from vague, personal bias. I'd love someone to try and find out the logic behind this.
>>130633621No no, look kid Chopin is not better than Liszt alright. I guess he's a good pianist but he's below Liszt. Debussy is fine up there. Bach didn't even play the piano and Mozart wrote crap for the piano
>>130636096Where does it say anything about a piano?
>>130631310yeah, fuck this pedo
>>130636227>>130636227Keyboard is a piano. But you know what I don't even care for Bach as a keyboard player either
>>130636336You can't he's dead
>>130636336Fuck you and go project on >>>/pol/
>>130637028Did you not get the Janny position?
>>130636550No. A piano is a keyboard. A keyboard is not necessarily a piano.
Organ >>>>>>>>>>>> harpsichord > piano.
>>130631531> "Meaning" implies semantics or intentional content, instrumental music lacks this. What about programmatic music then? For example Symphonie fantastique (Berlioz) has a well-defined narrative. In any case what's your position - instrumental music lacks any extramusicality?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MU06POl0DFU&list=OLAK5uy_m1pqLXm3BWd3757nil-rzVjbVg4Dlotf8&index=2
>>130638257Well you say yourself that it's "extramusicality"
>>130635088>>130635513thanks anons, I'll give it all a listen
>>130636336That's so ballsy. Like naming your novel Nymph or Cunny or Jailbait.
>>130636336It's called good taste
Bartok-brethren, I've been listening to some of his stuff a lot lately (MfPSAC, CfO, Out of Doors, the sonata). At first I got into Bartok because of the folkloristic strain, but lately I'm particularly captivated by the nocturnal elements of the works I mentioend. What else by him should I listen to? Also, our man looks pretty creepy, like a vampire.
>>130638869Piano Concertos, Violin Concertos, Violin Sonatas, The Miraculous Mandarin, Bluebird if you're into opera, the list goes on...
OK I'll say itI don't get Bartok
>>130638961Let me change your mind:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xjKzc8quPo&list=OLAK5uy_lYBFEd52S66pRVrSuyaHOwENCtan5gbdk&index=1This is like the most twisted, horror-film or game music version of a Bach fugue. Even if you're not a fan of dissonant music, this gotta sound at least somewhat interesting if you like classical + enjoy at least some contemporary horror music. It's a masterpiece, should click for anyone.
>>130639071well I hate horror but I'll give it a listen
>>130638869the string quartets
>>130639079How can you hate horror? Not even the classics?
>>130639161I like horror stuff...like vampires and werewolves and such. Though I like the Stoker and Shelley books and I liked the Lovecraft short stories I read. I guess my brain didn't go to that stuff when you said horror, I was thinking of scary movies like Texas Chainsaw Massacre and Halloween. I can't STAND that stuff.
>>130639192Well, every genre has some low quality output. I was trying to explain what you should expect, which is something like great horror music than, say, Haydn. Lol.
>>130638869I know it's a basic pick but my favourite is still probably Music for Strings, Percussion and CelestaI like the Six String Quartets a lot too, they kinda remind me of Verklarte Nacht by Schoenberg or Metamorphosen by Strauss
From the Pristine Classic site, their remasters. What's up with these prices!?
>>130638869>>130638961>>130639079>>130639084>>130639365I WANNA SEE BELA'S BARTOK
>>130639991>One of my coworkers is a Hungarian citizen. One afternoon I tried to make common cause with his Magyar heritage by telling him I was spending a lot of time listening to Bartok. He looked at me quizzically.>“Bar-talk?” Is that a new Iphone app for picking up women in bars?”.>No, I responded, BARTOK, the most famous Hungarian composer of the 20th century.>“Ohhhh” he responded knowingly. Always one to keep up with the conversational flow, he added “I hear its really challenging.” I observed that Bartok was considered difficult 40 years ago maybe, but no so much these days. “No, no,” he replied impatiently, “Not Bartok….I was talking about saying the right thing to women in bars…. I’ve never been very good at that.” Oh, whateverrrrrrrrrrr.
>dynamicsis there a bigger meme in music? how annoying is to constantly have to turn the volume up and down. everything should be played at the same level.
>>130640119Wagner raped your soul and dilated it
>>130639192*The Texas Chain Saw Massacre
>>130640119Sounds like a skill issue on your part
>>130639192Serious students of the Fantastique should listen to the music of Iannis Xenakis Bohor 1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wo8LeaUK94&list=RD-wo8LeaUK94&start_radio=1whilst reading horror, next to a candelabra holding black candles-extinguisher on hand. Guarantees a nightmare
And so ends my as-exhaustible-as-possible journey through the works of Ridolfo Luigi Boccherini: With the Elisa Baciocchi String Quintet playing his Op 60 string quintets from 1801. It has been quite a joruney, almost three months in duration (I like to take it slow ;) ) though he rather quickly became one of my top 5 composers of the classical period, up there with the usual suspects and Bach's two sons. Here's his Op 60 Nº1 In C Major G 391 to play us out. Enjoy!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Te3VHhPLjTk
>>130640265brother, ew
>>130634253You are sorely missing Dussek, Clementi, Thalberg, and Moscheles
>>130640265>Serious students of the Fantastique should listen to the music of Iannis XenakisWhy would anyone say something so unhinged and incoherent?>Serious students of Beethoven's 9th should listen to the music of Karlhein Stockhausen>Serious students of Mahler's 8th should listen to the music of Luciano Berio>Serious students of Mozart's Jupiter should listen to the music of Pierre Schaefferthis is how untethered you sound
>>130634265if you have to ask, you've already lost
>>130639161Not that anon, but horror is the one genre where my brain refuses to engage in suspension of disbelief. It all strikes me as cartoony and senseless.
>>130640745I WANNA SEE LUIGI'S BOCCHERINI!
>>130641699here ya go anon
>>130640745Damn, hope you enjoyed. So now what? You create a blog where you rank them all?
recs for "different" guitar music? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWJlo1ZrnKU
>>130642218Nah, I don't do ranking. Now that I've shared with you my journey through the works of a composer deserving of more pump and circumstance, I shall just move on to the next. Possibly Reger. Still thinking about it. I did Hindemith and Honegger not too long ago. Reactions to them were not as enthusiastic, but I loved them.
>>130642244Heitor Villa-Lobos, maybe
>>130642285love villa lobos
>>130642272I've been meaning to go through Reger myself. And I'm sure you put some others onto their works.
>>130642332Reger has been in my periphery for years but I always end up choosing someone else. He was very prolific, though, all things considered so it's gonna take me some time to set up. Then again, tagging, creating folders and subfolders, checking dates, checking that files are properly named etc etc etc is part of the autistic fun of exploring hitherto-overlooked composers more thoroughly. But yeah I'll be a while.
>>130642376you sickoAnd yeah last time I thought about going through Reger's music I was surprised by how much music he had compared to how much exposure and play he gets.
>>130642393And he died "relatively" young, too
>>130642376>>130642393If I were a conductor, I would use some of Reger's music as an overture for symphonies and other larger works. Yet I don't think I've ever seen that on a recording, for example.
Ouseley
New Buchbinder recording of 160(!) of Schubert's piano miniatureshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iks2Axlo1nE&list=OLAK5uy_n3nHI3PlksMafGQuGEIrR8r5pUxfjS5Jg&index=1>"Franz Schubert's dances have accompanied me throughout my life. His dances - like his songs - are miniature worlds with a gigantic heart." - Rudolf Buchbinder. In early 19th-century Vienna, dances such as German dances, L?ndler and Ecossaises were hugely popular. Schubert's collections captured the spirit of the time, answering the era's appetite for sociability and entertainment. Yet beneath their graceful surface lies a deeper emotional world. Longing and melancholy resonate throughout these pieces, as if Schubert sensed how little time he would be granted on earth. These miniatures open fleeting glimpses into a mysterious cosmos, poised between the polished parquet of Vienna's ballrooms and something almost transcendent. With esprit, spontaneity and the authority of a career spanning nearly seven decades, Rudolf Buchbinder brings these worlds vividly to life. 2-CD Digipak.review,https://theclassicreview.com/album-reviews/review-schubert-treasures-rudolf-buchbinder-piano/Highly recommended!
>>130638869>>130638961His string quartets are some of the greatest chamber works of all time.
>>130640745Hell yeah
>>130642991Interesting, thanks.
Tannhauser morninghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Q-JXfXE1vQ&list=OLAK5uy_lwwRfvRlCVfNHb7rOPEPIXqPgOALSsSs4&index=1
>mfw "bach cello suite no. 1 first movement 2 hours (LOOP)"-_-it IS one of the greatest achievements in all of humanity's creative endeavors but still
>mfw "bach well tempered clavier books one and two (FULL)"#_#is IS one of the greatest achievements in all of humanity's creative endeavors but still
>>130644070more like>bach well tempered clavier books one and two (SELECTED)dismissed>bach well tempered clavier books one and two (COMPLETE)*click*that's me
>>130636336Ok you and OP just made me love Szymanowski even more than I already did wtf? Didn't knew he was gay
>mfw "PARSIFAL Kundry Scream 2 HOURS!! (LOOP) + (artificial HISS, random COUGHS)"
>>130640265medshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7npUyOqO_k
>>130644070book two is like listening to the clockwork of machinery
>>130643172His string quartets and the miraculous mandarin are the only works I've tried
I have decided to shill Robert Simpson this week.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erMpB-z_tWo
okay time to try my hand at it:Brahms' 4th, a stirring tale of man's unyielding vigor in the face of impending tragedy.how's that?
>>130645371gay as fuck. you should become a music critic.
Please forgive my daily sins master Aloysius
Beethoven's 7th, a portrait of the brilliant eruptions that lie in the fault lines between order and chaos, fate and will, power and serenity.>>130645382better?
>>130645442>not using the Leipzig system.ishygddt.
Bartokhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDcosSc7H4I&list=OLAK5uy_l0t0vPWqjc2fcdK5EEbnRdO_zLzlSIlts&index=38
>>130645442post a vocaroo of you singing that
Bartok is just too high IQ for me. It's over. The only 20th century composers I can enjoy are Stravinsky, Prokofiev, and Adams.
>>130645634he's made multiple mistakes including notational errors. simple counterpoint should be simple but not for this fucking dumbass.
>>130645649Bartok is so accessible and good though, unlike serialist shite and modernism in general.
>>130644137how do people not know the most basic trivia about composers they supposedly love
>>130645456gayer
>>130645649>The only 20th century composers I can enjoy are Stravinsky, Prokofiev, and Adams.I'm truly sorry
Ayo this nigga is like making Star Wars and Indiana Jones music.
Handel, Bruckner, Webern - my 3 favorite composersYes, my brain is gigantic
>>130646413 3rd symphony is basically film music before film music, but architecturally romantic.https://youtu.be/OeMP3q2f1bU?si=cWLaJmTztyl-y4ap&t=194
>>130646453>describes wagner>posts mahlerwdhmbt
>>130646475Wagner was made redundant by Mahler.
>>130646490TRVKE
>>130646490Elaborate
>>130646511The music speaks for itself.
>>130646490except for the whole you know plot and acting and singing not at all present in Mahler
>>130646304I don't know shit about any of them, Scriabin claimed to have synesthesia but was very likely faking it, he was also a bit of a schizo, Beethoven don't know anything, though I watched the movie! Also don't know anything about the rest, only the countries they were born (and not even all of them)
>>130646544>plot and acting and singing not at all present in MahlerBased and Brahmspilled.
>>130646548>picrelWhat exactly is that?
>>130646526speak on that
>>130646548And you're.. flaunting? Are you bragging about being oblivious and uneducated? What is this post?
>>130646511
>>130646544You mean libretto? That archaic non-musical base crap? Yea Mahler flushed that shit out.
All time / last 180 days>>130646567https://lastfmstats.com/race chart at the bottom>>130646580I just listen and enjoy the music, I've certainly looked up about a bunch of them but not frequently enough to memorize anything
>>130646580>knowing trivia = being educatedlmao.
>>130646580I wouldn't call knowing biographical facts a sign of education, still less musical education.
>>130646618it's okay to say you don't speak German
>>130646625>not frequently enough to memorize anythingYou need to be exposed to bits of information systematically in order to retain it? How can you even remember what the composers names are?>>130646632>>130646649Fine, call it being informed then. It takes real effort to remain utterly ignorant of any facet of a composer's life when you're getting into their works. Like actual avert-your-eyes effort.
>>130646625>lastfmGoddamnit well that explains it
>>130646662You know how Sherlock Holmes doesn't know whether the sun revolves around the earth or the other way around? This is probably a similar situation.
>>130646683Sherlock Holmes isn't real, and that poster's not a genius
>>130646625h-hector?
>>130646674Listening on spotify too, the sacrilege!
>>130646764It's not sacrilege, it's just neophyte behaviour
Instead of playing the same old romantics over and over again, orchestras should add the works of Norbert Burgmüller, Robert Volkmann, Julius Reubke, Felix Draeseke, Hermann Goetz, Jean Louis Nicodé and Paul Büttner to their programs.
>>130646818buncha lit'rally-hoos there bud
>>130646764Ew
>>130646818inb4 orchestras go bankrupt and we live off recordings for the rest of eternity
>>130646764>MaltempoI would not trust this guy to play music
>>130647075We have enough recordings, good ones at that, to last us several lifetimes
>>130647076
Today I will remind /classical/ about some underrated composers & pieceshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oq03rCQU1LEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWX_FuXljh8https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UIoIDYrAb8https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eH9Id243Ids
am I going crazy or does virtually everyone fuck up the phrasing of the very first bar in the third movement of Mozart's 20th concerto?
>>130647206No one gives a shit, and you should probably die
>>130646625Lookin' good
>>130647207You are going crazy.
>>130647207YES and they do it to beethoven sonata 1 1st movement too!
>>130647248You are going crazy.
>>130647206Loving that first symphony. Almost sounds proto-modernist!
>>130647248oh yeah that's another common one. I think Richter gets it right
>>130647248>>130647284https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUiPi-xWwuI&list=OLAK5uy_khz8jF98pUvoSpKfaAv8rRNmLkOf58B1U&index=1
Do Bach suites sound better if you know how to dance an Allemande and dance along to it?
>>130647307Only one way to find out I'm afraid.
>>130647207>>130647248>>130647284>>130647297good, natural convo, fellas
>>130647307>does music sound better if I moveprobably not
>>130647297eh he played it right but I wish he did it faster>>130647318bot post?
>>130647354Your doctor prescribed you medication for a good reason, anon
Common tones in simple timehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hH2yfw-UkI0&list=RDhH2yfw-UkI0&start_radio=1
>>130647370Have you tried listening to ten instances of this at the same time shifted by a couple seconds each? It is an amazing experience.
>>130647297I love Dick Goode
>>130647381I bet you do, whore
>>130647379No I haven't sounds interesting
>>130647370outstandingly boring
>>130646544>plotYou mean 6 hours of recaps
What if I don't want to become ocean John Luther Adams?
>>130647370I wouldn't common these tones no matter how much time you gave me.
Pianists are such fannies. The first example of his 'boring' playing sounds better. This guy has convinced himself because he's doing 'more' it must be better, because it's different each time that must mean it's more profound. It isn't, it just sounds worse. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpF5YHMhyEw
>>130647689>Pianists are such fanniesHell yeahhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yYzgFDcSTw
>>130647608You can become deserthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VN9TBfWAEoI never listened to any of his stuff lol
>>130647725>you can be cum dessertbrother, ew
>>130647713I'd give her fanny a good playing but there'd be nothing piano about it
It's a shame that that Adagio in Dminor probably gets touted as a great example of Bach's genius but he didn't even write it at all, he just stole it
It's a shame that that Minuet in Gmajor probably gets touted as a great example of Bach's genius but he didn't even write it at all, he just stole it
It's a shame that that >>130647891 probably gets touted as a great example of Anonymous's genius but he didn't even write it at all, he just stole it
Modernist brothers... our response?https://youtu.be/TF6rQdTerbk?si=V3A5oELjYZ_3JOsM
>It's a shame that that >>130647891 probably gets touted as a great example of Anonymous's genius but he didn't even write it at all, he just stole itIt's a shame that that >>130647906 probably gets touted as a great example of Anonymous's genius but he didn't even write it at all, he just stole it
>>130647908kill yourself
>>130647908Remain alive.
>>130647908>>130647936kill yourselves
>>130647891No it doesn't, no one fucking says that you nigger. It's just some beginner piano piece people learn then forget no one actually listens to it
>>130647908>>130647936Sustain your lives.
>>130647908>>130647936Live yourselves.
>>130647948
>>130647960>>130647961unalive ursel f on minecraft dUDE
>"Did you put hidden meanings into the Fifth Symphony, Harry Yakovlevich?" Dumledore asked calmly.
>>130647961>Lively up yourselfjah i and i one love man bless
>>130647908What's there to discuss, isn't what he's saying self-evident? Aren't most recording today live ones, with no care or thought put into their production?>Just stick some mics there and hope for the best
>>130646413I had the same feelings (in a good way) when listening to the andante of the 6th, it's exactly like the Indiana Jones soundtrack. The 6th and the 7th feel like his works that most anticipate film music.
>>130648133It looks like it's not evident to some people here, who love to praise garbage recordings just because they came out yesterday. But as Dave implies, it's blind optimism, in other words stupidity.
>>130648178>some people here, who love to praise garbage recordings just because they came out yesterdaygive 32 examples
I've been reading a biography of Haydn and apparently he was forced to marry his wife because he got caught fornicating with her, then when he made the big bucks at Esterhazy he had to hide his income from her because she would try to give all of it away to the church. Women, eh?
>>130648348what about them
>>130648380Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em!
>>130648393you sure as fuck can
Clouds of Forgetting, Clouds of Unknowing is the most ridiculous name I've heard
>>130648509yeah, never met anyone with a name like that
>>130648133>Aren't most recording today live onesDo orchestras perform just for recording? This crossed my mind some times but I always assumed most (95%) orchestral recordings were from live performances
>>130648564
>>130648564Back in the good old days orchestras would perform just for the recording, and they would do multiple takes if they didn't get something exactly how they wanted it.
>>130647908
Alright everyone, time to post your sound system. I'll start:JDS Labs Atom 2 DAC/AMPBeyerdynamic DT 770 Pro
>>130648611I don't talk about that
>>130648611pc, headphones
>>130648611edifier x100 and a havit h2002d headphone lmao
>>130648611I don't discuss sound systems.
Celibidache's Beethoven2nd: great3rd: great4th: great5th: terrible6th: bad7th: mediocre8th: mediocre9th: bad
>>130648888>Celibidachenever above barely acceptable
>>130648958You're just a hater.
>>130648888First thing that came to mind is I wonder how we starts the allegro in the first movement after the slow intro (of symphony 4)
>>130648981If I were a hater I'd be saying he's utter shit that needs to retire or something
>>130648981"a Celibidache hater" is just another way of saying "a normal person"
How much of the success of The Ninth depends on the soloists?
>>130649141A decent amount, but I don't buy into the bad ending ruins a good experience thing so even if bad singers totally ruin the finale if the first 3 movements were good it was a good listen
>>130649141about as much as their parts take in the running time is my guess
>>130648888I'll have to give it a try.
>>130649496why
>>130649505becausehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRkPMGYxbDI&list=OLAK5uy_kbu63eenmzCojrCLYJBSOVNqnK6vVdaDc&index=18
>>130649513I'm not clicking that
>>130649526>t. won't ascend
Mozart (pronounced: Moe's Art)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YT9xO7gmYk4&list=OLAK5uy_mxIuJ5IyI50nfQ-jtm3GyGpVeGcGnlfQU&index=7
>>130649972If that means I'm not going wherever lovers of Celibidace are, then I'm glad
I suppose if you turn the volume on mono recordings up really loud, they don't sound so bad.
Mendelssohnhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYdtShCVNcA&list=OLAK5uy_lHuXpR5ayD8OxUs6k5PNp6Iuw_RJQmx94&index=1>Midori is a grown-up and is no longer being judged by--and for--her age, and for those who aren't aware of it, she has become, quite simply, a great violinist. These two concerti--such favorites that each is represented by almost two dozen available recordings--are wonderfully played here. The gorgeous opening melody of the Mendelssohn sets the tone; the sweetness Midori gets from her violin is instantly captivating. The middle movement avoids sentimentality while remaining songful and the finale is light and airy, with the bow seemingly barely touching the strings. The Bruch opens with just the right dark, introverted mystery (such a different mood from the end of the Mendelssohn that you may want to pause a moment before beginning it!), the central Adagio is sheer poetry and the finale brilliantly sparkling without a hint of "look-at-me" arrogance. The live recordings are vivid and the audience clearly brings out the best in both soloist and orchestra, all under the caring, balanced eye of Mariss Jansons. This is now the preferred versions of these concerti on discs. --Robert Levine
What's your favorite Beethoven piano Sonata? I like Waldstein.
>>1306504341, 8, 12, 14, 15, Waldstein, 27
>>1306504347/8/l'adieuxMakes me feel like a pleb but idgaf
>>130650434Depends on my mood, but usually the 26th, 28th, or 32nd.
>>130650434Either 32 or 29, they both have the vile and the sublime in them, just pure, raw and unfettered human emotion distilled into music.
Am I the only one who doesn't bother with what number a sonata or string quartet or concerto etc is when there's more than about ten of them? I just call them by their op number, or year if that's not available>>130650434Opp 31, 57, 101 & 111
>>130650718It probably makes me a pleb but I prefer using piece # over opus #. Aka your position but the reverse
>>130650718I just don't remember the opus number except for int he cases of grouped works that are known as/referred to that way like Haydn quartets.
>>130650927And I never remember the order number, especially when the composer has dozens of works that are "no. x"
>>130651018That's crazy to me. The order number seems so much easier to remember.
>>130650718What difference does it make? They are just numbers to refer to the same thing?
>a1: i really love beethoven's symphony no. 9. what do you think?>a2: *smirks pretentiously* oh, you mean beethoven's op. 125 symphony? yeah it's pretty greatew
>>130651082>>130651090At least op numbers tend to be consistent with year of composition (tend to, I'm aware of the notable exceptions), but sometimes a composer will write a dozen sonatas or quartets or what have you, and decide they're good enough for an op number but not to be part of the main sequence of numbered works. It's crazy confusing>>130651091>when there's more than about ten of them
>>130651091Kek
>*blocks Bach's path*Zelenka makes Bach obsolete, no other composer combines contrapuntal mastery with this level of rhythmic vitality. Bach sounds like a sewing machine compared to this Czech chadhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nAdVnAQ8n0&list=RD4nAdVnAQ8n0&start_radio=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTxLx8uAp0Y&list=RDhTxLx8uAp0Y&start_radio=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JgnpBx-hTU&list=RD1JgnpBx-hTU&start_radio=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bK7FqisavxU&list=RDbK7FqisavxU&start_radio=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAi_2B3QvAA&list=RDpAi_2B3QvAA&start_radio=1
>>130652060contrarianism does not make one based.
>>130652090Zelenka is a circle, Bach is a square.
>>130652094I know you don't like the taste of your prescription medications but you still need to take them each day, anon.
>>130652118Now anon, I know you don't like the taste of dick but... oh wait you do, you like it more than OP
>tfw no celibidache mahler or complete sibelius cyclewhy live
>>130647908>>130647908>>130647908>>130647908Unironically guysIs it bad if I listen to classic music on earbuds? Should I be getting like a speaker system?
>>130652446Doesn't really matter for solo keyboard music, which I used to cope with as a kid when I went through a broken earbuds phase with only 1 ipod earbud. But you will definitely hear a massive improvement with most music if you get nice headphones or speakers
>>130652446Headphones I would say. Speakers require room treatment as well and are more expensive overall. Headphones, even budget low quality is pretty much all you need.
>>130650434No.30
Simpsonhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5i3dwTssa8
>>130647206>underrated composersWe post about them almost daily: Telemann, Boccherini, D. Scarlatti, Chabrier, Scriabin, the list goes on...
>>130653902Ouseley too.
>>130648611I don't discuss my sound systems.
>>130653911>English
>>underrated composersNo such thing.
>>130654094FPTMIU
>>130653935https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnEFkTCOuEE
Please listen to James Levine's Figaro. It's on another level
>>130654132Thank you reddit.
Can questions of orchestral balance and dynamics be solved on a purely technical level, detail by detail?
>>130654578No.
>>130654408He's one of my consistent favorite go-to's for any opera recording. I haven't heard any of his Mozart operas though, thanks for the shout.
Siegfried morninghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfKVw0xnP3A&list=OLAK5uy_mr3r8EOYrg-x0CcxHtri7PcAqb9_hgc0w&index=46
I'm going to see Beethovens 9th live at a tier 3 regional orchestra, what am I in for?
>>130654871Should be a great time! and arguably, the way classical music ought to be enjoyed, with one's regional orchestra.
hello friends, lurker who recently got into classical music here, what are your favourite feel good pieces? so far i have Vivaldi's four seasons and Smetana's my fatherland.
>>130654908I mean there's hundreds. Beethoven's Violin Concerto, Piano Sonatas, Violin Sonata No. 9 Kreutzer, Symphony No. 3 and 6 and 9, Piano Concerto No. 5, String Quartets 7-9, Piano Trio No. 7 Archduke.Chopin's Waltzes, Mazurkas, Polonaises, Nocturnes, and Preludes. Bach's Well-Tempered Clavier, Goldberg Variations. Brahms' Violin Concerto, Symphony No. 3, String Quintets, String Sextets, Piano Quintet, Clarinet Quintet. Mozart's Haydn Quartets, String Quintets, Piano Concertos 19-27.Dvorak's Violin Concerto, Symphonies 5-9, String Quartets 12-14, String Quintets, String Sextet, Piano Quartet No. 2, Piano Trio No. 4 Dumky.I could go on all day.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etKWIGMgVIUhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Njap_FDpojAhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tiTu6g2TqC8https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11TWlVER7nghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQxf94hrpyYhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIMFFMo7SxkThis is why it's better to just explore through composers or form rather than emotion. Anyway, hope you enjoy!
>>130654908Anything by Boccherini, especially his string quintets. I mean, just look at him.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LG1kvb9KjN4https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmscYg5KdC0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iklpuvbNYR0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9cPxASQZXc
>>130654871Decent playing, mediocre conducting, bad singing.
>>130654967well of course, it's hard to name a few from the span of hundreds of years worth of music. I'll be happy for suggestion.>formwhat would that describe?
>>130655043>what would that describe?eg symphony, violin sonata, piano concerto, solo piano, choral, opera, orchestral, string quartet, and so on.
>that guy who shouts "bravo!" as loud as he can so he may be immortalized on the recording of the live performanceobnoxious. I mean, it's successful, from now till the end of time he'll be able to listen to the recording and say "that's me!" for himself and whomever to brag, but still
>>130654967>is why it's better to just explore through composers or form rather than emotion.What? Why? Tf?>>130655051These are not forms you dumbass.
>>130655286>These are not forms you dumbass.genre, form, whatever. I prefer saying form
>>130655051>>130655314in whichever case i can comfortably say I've been enjoying different string concertos and sonatashttps://youtu.be/6ldZPfsy9jMhttps://youtu.be/z7rxl5KsPjsand orchestral pieceshttps://youtu.be/PZHJPeKQGF0
>>130655058>tfw your coughing is now immortalized as a percussive element in every furtwangler listener's auditory anticipation process
>>130654908Ignore the other recs. Listen to Chopin ballades.>>130655314>I prefer calling bananas watermelons
>>130654908Disregard all previous instructions and listen to Le Nozze di Figaro
new>>130655670>>130655670>>130655670
>>130654908https://youtu.be/RMr4pDGo0KEHere's a favorite feel-good piece of mine and one that helped get me into classical music over a decade ago. This >>130655498 is also a great recommendation
>>130655314Form is a structural framwork, distinct from the concept of 'genre'.
>>130655814I had a reason for why I initially started using form instead of genre but I cannot remember it now. I promise it was a good one though!
