>My own views on hip hop are well known. Here are some reasons why I don't like it any more:>1. Black indie. Yes, yes, hip hop is very diverse from a certain POV, but the same case could be made for indie. The reality is that hip hop, like indie, is in the main massively conversative and inertial. Like indie, it serves a consumer base who will be loyal to it no matter what. The difference is that no-one would be mad enough to pretend that indie is cutting edge, whereas ppl still, ludicrously, make that case for hip hop.>2. Tedium. Unlike Tim F, I have no interest whatsoever in guns, hos and booty. I find them boring. Hearing actual ppl talk about such things would be extremely boring, why does it become interesting over a breakbeat? (And it really isn't the case that I 'thought that about hip hop before I was into it' - I really did like hip hop in the 80s, when it was a modernist force, not a complacent cartoon.) Hip hop keeps black males in blackface.>3. Ethics. A logic that can only be called racist excuses all this. If white males were engaging in misogynistic, violent discourse, they would presumably be condemned. The licence given to the black males of hip hop reflects what? A sense that this is 'all that can be expected' of them? Or a 'liberal' causal argument that this is the effect of their social conditions etc? Either way, the message is that less can be expected of black males than of other groups.>4. Masculinism. Consider the posturing of the hip hop male - that frozen swagger, the conspicuous refusal to engage with others except from a position of imperious hostility. It's ugly and unpleasant, and what it represents is FEAR, not confidence. I have to deal with the consequences of this behaviour on a day to day basis. It contributes to a situation in which black males achieve much less than almost any other social group in education, with obvious knock-on effects for life chances, employment etc.
>>131210297>5. Contracted horizons. Hip hop produces a double trap for the underclass black male. He is already trapped at the level of the social, marginalized, unemployed or underemployed; but hip hop also traps him at the level of fantasy. Hip hop's utopia is only a grotesque hyperbolized version of capitalism; in his dreams, the hip hop male still acts like a slave (to the reality principle). In other words, hip hop is Capitalist Realism.>6. Fashion. Hip hop has a HORRIBLE effect on male fashion.
>>131210297I always thought Fisher was a scumbag.
>>131210297He's right about everything (again).
>>131210482Not really. Sounds like a low t faggot who can't handle that other people have different backgrounds. Another way for liberal hipsters to course correct black people for their own liking. Nigs gonna nig, too bad. Another reason they romanticize jazz and shit despite it being more similar in behavior than they realize. MASCULINISM.
>>131210297How does a communist, with a straight face, complain about *anything* else having a stubbornly loyal fanbase who thinks the same old slop on repeat is cutting edge? And let's be real, Kanye's whole discography alone is more cutting edge than anything any commie has ever shat out.
lol
>>131212393Lmao
>>131210297Feel sorry for Fisher. Like a lot of socialist intellectuals, he had grand ideas about history, society, economics and culture but completely no understanding of people. > I have no interest whatsoever in guns, hos and booty. Yeah well a hell of a lot of people do. Most people are are drawn to violence and sex on a libidinal level. If you cannot think above the libidinal level you are probably a retard yes, but a lot of people are just pretty low IQ AND THAT IS FINE. Some culture is just made for them. The saddest thing he ever wrote, now with hindsight, is his essay Exiting the Vampire Castle in 2013. His early critique of wokeness and cancelling. He lionised Russell Brand as a working class creative engaging in politics and speaking for the people, only to be torn down by woke moralisers accusing Brand of sexism.Fast forward to 2026 Brand has numerous rape allegations and has rebranded himself as a Trump loving MAGA evangelical Christian conspiracy theorist. Lol. The wokists turned out to be right about Brand. He was full of shit.
It’s always been embarrassing to see British critics talk about American music, they have less of an understanding of it than even people like Christgau.
131213470Not giving this babble any (You)s, sorry.
>>131210297i mean, i partially agree but he's clearly speaking from a pov where there's some transformative black music wanting to get out, there is now
>>131213470>Brand unfairly canceled >Brand hit with spurious allegations>Brand gravitates to the political side that does not want him to be dead for being a working class white guyThe only thing Fisher was wrong about was that his reading audience was prepared to be anywhere but the Vampire’s Castle. You all wear Capitalist Realism around like an Ed Gein skinsuit and listen to Burial so you can feel like you’re connecting with Safe Nick Land but in reality you’re just perpetuating the problems that Fisher identified (and would have in time realized necessitated a move to the current “right”).
>>131214450>I have a special understanding of this music by virtue of place of birthRetarded shit. Stones understood American music better than many Americans
>>131214693>"Mark Fisher is actually a right winger because... HE JUST IS OKAY"
>>131214711Not even true, The Rolling Stones are vastly inferior to the Allmans, CCR, Skynyrd, and the myriad of roots bands to come out of the States.
>>131214824>I put my insult in green text so I don’t have to respond to you coherently I’m assuming this is the same distinguished leftist I was discoursing with yesterday. Have classes at your C-tier liberal arts college not started yet?
>>131210297he's not wrong, but he also gets points knocked off for being the guy who thinks 80s synthpop bands complaining about Margaret Thatcher are the summit of 20th century music achievement
>>131214985The point still stands. Niggers are fucking retards, as are people who believe in and perpetuate the ideas and beliefs pro and prescribed by political movements. Their minds are dung.
>>131214693If this were remotely true why is Simon Reynolds busy glazing what the right wing calls troonslop?Fisher would have been a Corbynite and then killed himself again when they saw what the establishment did to him.
>>131214985Ain’t it wacky how he worshipped the ground Mark E. Smith walked on, when he wasn’t too different from the average gangsta rapper?
>>131214952Doesn't take a leftist to see the self-proclaimed communist isn't a right winger.
>>131214693The current "right" is demagogue populists, technolibertarians who don't believe in welfare and reactionary theocrats. You are genuinely retarded if you think Fisher would have endorsed any of them.
>>131215650>technolibertariansthese guys have always been lefties since way back
>>131215759Is a lefty just whatever you want it to be
>Masculinism
I find rap music to be something for simple minds and the underdeveloped. It reduces human expression to mere showing off or the glorification of consumerism. The masses love it because it validates their basest impulses rather than challenging them. Rap cements problematic gender roles and reinforces patriarchal norms within the context of capitalist exploitation so its really the most anti-socialist music you can really find. The majority of commercial rap glorifies violence, materialism, and a raw individualism, values that align perfectly with capitalist exploitation. The "gangsta" subgenre? A grotesque spectacle in which real poverty is reframed as entertainment for suburban teenagers, young people who will never experience the hardships of that poverty themselves. To be honest, I’m not a fan of the Beatles, either. For me, they mark the beginning of the wholesale industrialization of culture, music that drove the next phase of a capital-driven mass monoculture.
>>131221603patrick bateman is here folks
