My car (2009 Grand Marquis) is on it's last legs and even if I can keep it running I'm just ready for something new (to me). I've driven panther platform cars exclusively since I was 17 years old and I am 35 now, I just want something different at least for a little while. Ideally...I really just want to get a car that's reliable and cheap like my MGM but still somewhat fun to drive. Frankly the state of the used car market has me extremely dismayed. In 2018 I paid $6k for my '09 grand marquis and it had 110k miles on it. It was $31k brand new in 2009. To me that's a reasonable amount of depreciation. 100k miles and 10yrs later it's worth 20% of what it was new. That's fair. Today I go to look for the closest modern equivalent, a V6 Dodge Charger or Chrysler 300 from 2016 or 2017 with 100k miles...and people want $15-20k for that. That car was also about $30k brand new 10 years ago. I understand inflation, but this is insane. To me it would be reasonable to pay $9k-$10k for a 10 year old v6 charger with 100k miles and even that seems high, but dealerships and private sellers want at least 15 or 20 grand, I don't get itNot even set on that car, I think they kind of suck anyway, it would just be practical for me. Anyway, I've narrowed down my list of vehicles to the following 4 in order from cheapest to most expensive. 1. 98-03 Jaguar XJ82. 2016-2023 Dodge Charger V8 AWD Police version3. 2018-2020 Cadillac CT64. 2025-2026 Ford Bronco Sport Badlands I've already test driven two of those. The Jaguar's I love the styling but I felt cramped while driving it. But still, there's another one near me in a beautiful color, I'm wondering if I could learn to get comfy in the car. Also test drove a clapped out v8 police awd charger and it was awesome. Only issue is finding one that isn't beat to shit with high idle hours
>>29064319I generally prefer rear wheel drive or rwd based sedans, but recently saw a good deal on a '25 Bronco Sport Badlands and was intrigued. Of course it sold immediately, but it got me thinking. I like the 4wd capability. It would be good in the snow, and if I want to camping it could be a fun car. It also seems a bit more practical than a sedan. It probably wouldn't be very fun to drive, but I could see that being a car I have for 5 or 10 years. Whereas if I end up getting an old jag, as fun as it might be, I know I won't hang on to it long. Also, like I said, I want old and cheap. You can get those Jags for like 5 or 6 grand in fairly decent condition (under 100k miles). The Police AWD V8 chargers you can also get between 10 and 15 grand, which I think is fair for the amount of power, but I'm not going to buy one with high idle hours. Realistically I won't get a police charger because of this. The Cadillac CT6 recently went on my radar. There are some in my area in the 15-25k range with well under 100k miles. I figure if I end up getting a "newer" car it would be the CT6 or Bronco Sport Badlands. If I get something under 10k I'll pay cash. Even 15k I can pay cash with some help. But something 20-30k I will finance. And I'm not going to go over 30 grand. Yes, I know with a 30k budget I could get a lot of cool old cars, but I'm not trying to finance something with over 100k miles on it. Anyway /o/, of my choices here which do you think would be the best?
The Jag if you don't mind wrenching and taking care of it, will be a total other level of driving experience than the others. Bronker will get you into nature though, don't expect it to be any different to every other modern appliancemobile.
>>29064319The Bronco is a genuinely awful vehicle in almost every aspect. The other three would be fine choices, each with some positives and negatives (I'd go for the Jag), but for your own good don't go anywhere near a Bronco Sport.
>>29064319I don't like any of those except for the jag and even then the jag's probably a worse choice than a Mercedes or a Lexus from that era, they'll also fit you more comfortably than the jag if room is the issue. The inline 6 Jags from that era were a fair bit more reliable than the V8s and still plenty of engine for the use case (wafting around). I'd be getting an LS430 if I were you. They are kinda fugly tho.
>>29064327>>29064331Aside from it being a compact crossover what's actually wrong with the Bronco Sport? Do they have reliability issues? My parents have a Ford Escape and its on the same platform and while I'm not the biggest fan it is fairly comfy for what it is. I rode in a Bronco Sport once and it seems pretty similar to the Escape just slightly bigger, which I like
Bronco sport with 1.5t or 2.0t? Both will pop like balloons at some point lol but i'd trust the 2.0t
>>29064546The 2.0 is a brilliant engine. Every iteration in every car it's been in. They're insanely reliable as far as modern engines go. The only downside is the direct injection so you have to budget intake valve cleaning every now and lspi isn't an issue on automatics. He shouldn't get it because the bronco sport is awful but the engine is at least a good one
>>29064319I drove a crown vic for 7 years and then went to a fwd sports car with a manual transmission. Felt so good to be driving stick again. I'd pick the Cadillac if I had to choose something on that list.
>>29064580And what about the timing belt in oil?
>>29064323The Bronco Sport is just a Ford Escape in drag that happens to have a 3 cylinder with 4 cylinder option. I wouldn't consider it an upgrade from even a clapped Panther car, and even if you were so set on an SUV/CUV sort of vehicle I'd look elsewhere, at least until we can be talking about them as used, cheap shitboxes (certainly not something to pay tens of thousands of dollars for).I happen to really like the late model Cadillac CT6 on the other hand, Cadillac barely marketed the damn thing but it comes the closest to being a proper, full size RWD luxury car as it should be. Between all the CT4/CT5 I see roaming around, it's always nice seeing the rare CT6 since I find it's proportions work so much better. I would just avoid getting one with the 4cyl, it may be fine in a smaller CT4 but you want the V6 or (rare) non-V Blackwing V8 that they were offered with.The Jaguar would be fun, if it's not going to be your only car. I'd take my chances with an M113-powered W220 if I had to pick a cheap, full size used Euro V8 sedan personally (S55 or E55 if you want "fun", yes they're reliable, yes I'm biased), but the "practical" option that would still be far cheaper than your newer choices is going to be something like a Lexus LS400/LS430.
>>29064319If you want a newer Charger, don't get something that was driven by the public sector. I work for DPW and ALL vehicles get driven hard, it's not just the police.Get one that was privately owned and preferably has service records. I would not recommend any British luxury vehicles if you care about reliability.I don't know about the Cadillac but I wouldn't trust any of the lawnmower engines in the Bronco. If Ford put an inline 6 or V8 in there, that would be great. And naturally aspirated of course.I'm not of fan of newer vehicles as most have horrible build quality and the lawnmower engines are highly stressed. It's ultimately your choice anon.
>>29064624You're referring to the timing belt on the 2.0L ecoboost, which is an engine that uses a timing chain?
Just forget the "Bronco". To get decent durability with Ford you have to move up to Explorer level or better. The Jaaaag offers pretty much the same driving experience as a GrammaCar but is more complicated in design and parts sourcing. Not a good combo unless you just love the things.Caddy. I'll only point out that it's a GM product with all that that entails.IMO, you want the Charger R/T but can do without the AWD. Honestly, if it's that bad out there you don't need to be out in it and RWD is fine the rest of the time. Don't forget to check CoPart auctions in your area too.
>>29064546>Bronco sport with 1.5t or 2.0t? Both will pop like balloons at some point lol but i'd trust the 2.0t>>29064580>The 2.0 is a brilliant engineOnly interested in the 2.0 liter turbo Bronco Sports, which is why I specified I was looking at a Bronco Sport Badlands as that is the only trim level where you can get the 2.0 turbo engine. I would never contemplate owning a 3 cylinder engined automobile. Even 4-cylinders feels wrong to me, but if it's the same horsepower and torque as the 4.6l v8 in my grand marquis it's hard for me to discount it.
>>29065668Look beyond the specs anon. One is a high strung engine. The other engine is built for durability. I have the 2 valve 4.6 in my F-150. Is it fast, no and trucks aren't supposed to be fast. Is it durable, hell yes.
>>29064720Ohh the 1.5t uses a belt
>>29064393Stiff seats and suspension, detached steering feel, cuts the power when you're turning, that manner of fuckery. Just a generic modern shitbox.
>>29064580>The only downside is the direct injection so you have to budget intake valve cleaning every now and lspi isn't an issue on automatics.The 2025 models and newer use direct AND port injection. Pre-2025 is just direct injection though>>29066798Is the stiff seats any different from the Ford Escape? Again I've driven a 2021 Escape extensively and it's boring but fairly comfortable. Also the Badlands models seem to have softer suspension for off-roading according to what I've read
Why not get the regular Bronco with the V6 instead of the girls version?
>>29066960If the escape is comfy enough for you I doubt you'll appreciate the jag, it'll just be a headache then.
>>29066962>Why not get the regular Bronco with the V6 instead of the girls version?You must've missed the part where I detailed my budget. I'm not trying to spend more than 30k on a car especially something with high mileage. I just saw a listing for the regular Bronco but with the dinky 4-cylinder engine, and that was going for $38k. I'm not prepared to spend like 45 grand on a used Bronco V6 with like 100k miles
>>29066964>If the escape is comfy enough for you I doubt you'll appreciate the jag, it'll just be a headache then.I've test driven at least 4 separate x308 Jaguars over the past few years. They're nice but not really any more comfortable than my Mercury Grand Marquis, in fact I'd say due to the smaller interior they are considerably less comfy. I am primarily drawn to them due to the styling. In 95% of situations I would have the best looking car if I had the Jag, and that does mean something to me because I appreciate beautiful things
>>29064662>W220 if I had to pick a cheap, full size used Euro V8 sedan personally (S55 or E55 if you want "fun", yes they're reliable, yes I'm biased), but the "practical" option that would still be far cheaper than your newer choices is going to be something like a Lexus LS400/LS430The problem with the old Mercedes-Benzes and the Lexus LS400/LS430 is that they have shot up in price over the past few years. If you could still get a used LS400 or 430 with under 150k miles for about 5 grand I would buy oneThe problem is that whether it's the LS400 or LS430, people are trying to get between $10,000-$15,000 for them even when they have around 200k miles. Trying to find one with under 150k miles, let alone under 100k for under 10 grand is very difficult. Also I fumbled one back in 2020, could've bought one for 4500 with 110k miles and I declined to due to a trivial reason and now I can't find any for that price in that good of condition so I kind of don't want to pay double than what I could've bought one for just a few years ago
There's a dude in town selling a v8 police charger AWD. Looks like he's done a lot of work to it per his own description. 120k miles and he's asking 15 grand. New transmission at 80k miles apparently. No hemi tick. I think I'm going to try to check it out this weekend and buy it from him. Going to offer around 10k but work my way up to 13 and hope he accepts that
>>29064319>I've driven panther platform cars exclusively since I was 17 years old and I am 35 nowCongrats on your autism diagnosis, how much do you weigh?
>>29067537I'm a little over 250lbs at 6'2", anyway this is the problem with the Jaguar, I just feel like I'm too big for it since I'm used to driving Lincoln Town Cars and my Grand Marquis, the driver's seat of the XJ8 seems small. Anyway, another question, what I'm really after, is there a car that would be faster and more fun to drive than V8 AWD Charger that also costs less than $15,000 for a decent version with under 130k miles?
>>29067605Out of all the shit you've been talking about the only reliable option would be a RWD RT Charger. The Bronco and Caddy are both parts bin junk with shitty drivetrains that constantly break. The differential and trans in the AWD Charger are also gay and also break a lot.If you're not handy with a wrench stay away from all that shit and just get a rwd Charger and pay way less to get shit fixed when it does happen. Kinda ironic I'd ever be saying that about a Dodge.....
>>29067605>is there a car that would be faster and more fun to drive than V8 AWD Charger that also costs less than $15,000 for a decent version with under 130k miles?v6 rwd challenger with the zf8 is just as quick as a 5.7 with that shitty merc 5 speed, handles better and is much cheaper to buy and operate. 5.7 takes primo only, has mds and 16 spark plugs, 3.6 runs on e85 from factory and has no eco cuck shit
>>29067646>>29067650To spell it out, the AWD V8's come with the Mercedes-sourced 5 speed NAG1 instead of the superb 8 speed 8HP70 by ZF (ZF8). In fact, any cop car V8 Charger comes with the NAG1.
>>29067650>v6 rwd challenger with the zf8 is just as quick as a 5.7 with that shitty merc 5 speedThat's not what the internet says. It says v6 challenger is 6-6.4 0-60, but the V8 AWD Charger is 5.0-5.4 0-60. That's a full second faster. >>29067843According to Michigan State Police, the V8 AWD Charger went around a track at basically the same time as V8 RWD Charger. If they're both equally fast, I'd prefer the all wheel drive. I test drove one, and it just pulled you hard. It also handled really well
>>29068167yeah that's what google says based on forum anecdotes but in reality the v8 is not really that fast and the v6 is not really that slow. you're not racing it, it's being used as a commuter so how fast it gets to 60 is irrelevant and the additional care needed to keep a police-used hemi from eating itself is not worth it for a mere 80 extra hp.
>>29068185>it's being used as a commuter so how fast it gets to 60 is irrelevant and the additional care needed to keep a police-used hemi from eating itself is not worth it for a mere 80 extra hp.I can get one with the same mileage as a used V6 rwd charger though. That's part of the issue too. At least where I am at, a used v8 charger from 2015 or newer, even with 100-120k miles people want over $20,000 for them which is insane. I can get v8 police chargers in the 10-15k range. Also, the 0-60 time is important to me. I need a car that is faster than my friend's 2021 Honda Accord 2.0tIt's also important to me that I get a faster car than his while spending nearly half of what he spent on his honda
>>29068190well according to google the cop charger isn't supposed to be any faster than the accord. your friend and you aren't going to be doing any serious racing, and on top of that he drives some ugly fwd shitbox so who cares what he thinks?either way if you get a dodge product buy a tazer so you can unlock the srt gauges on the dashboard.
>>29068197>and on top of that he drives some ugly fwd shitbox so who cares what he thinks?he's constantly hyping up his Accord, and it's alright, sure, but he needs to be put in his place, and I need to do this on the cheap Now I'm seeing 6 second 0-60 when I google it. It felt faster though, I still like it for the handling. There's a guy selling one near me that still has working cop lights, that could be fun
>>29068201the nag1 tranny is really slow to shift and obnoxiously clunky, the awd system is basically throwing like an extra 200 lbs on top of an already 4000 lb car but it's very reliable, and yeah it's a killer platform that handles way better than it should. if you are looking at ex-cop cars from previous civvie owners just ask if they've disabled mds or checked on the cam and rockers recently, if they've been driving the car around they probably have, but a cop car fresh out of gov auction is going to need some top end work.legend has it the cop chargers are slightly more powerful than the civilian variant by an undisclosed amount
>>29068216>legend has it the cop chargers are slightly more powerful than the civilian variant by an undisclosed amountI know that they don't have a speed governor/limiter. But yeah, if I get a sedan I'm really leaning toward the police charger IF I can find one in good condition. I may have found one, will look at it this weekend once the owner gets back in town
>>29068547Speaking from experience with building mopars if speed is what you're after the awd Charger 60 foots better than a rwd v8 Charger on stock tires and runs out of steam faster and is also limited to 140-ish by gear. It absolutely will not handle better and isn't as fast as a 2015+ RWD with a 275 rear tire and something like Conti DWS06 or Sport 2s and that includes acceleration even with the AWD stock for stock.The bigger outlying issue is the NAG sucks ass and soaks a lot of power loss and won't take to upgrades as readily and if you do want more power you're doing the entire drivetrain from end to end unless you wanna chase problems and your car's broken every other week.Instead of starting out with something you have high hopes for modding just buy the RWD v8 with the 8HP and save yourself 90% of the headache that's gonna come from "Why is this costing me another 15 grand to upgrade when it should have been 4?" once you realize none of these cars are fast stock.Also before you buy ANY car run the vin and check out the order packages to see if what rear gear is in it and if it has limited slip.
>>29068611> check out the order packages to see if what rear gear is in it and if it has limited slip.you can also just peek under the rear bumper and if the diff has some obvious cooling fins molded into the case it's the lsd, no matter if it's the getrag or zf diff
>>29068628OP is retarded so I figured it's easier to read the build sheet
>>29068611>Instead of starting out with something you have high hopes for modding just buy the RWD v8 with the 8HP and save yourself 90% of the headache that's gonna come from "Why is this costing me another 15 grand to upgrade when it should have been 4?" once you realize none of these cars are fast stock.Ok sure but how are RWD V8 charger in the snow? It doesn't snow a ton where I'm at, but at least 4 or 5 fairly big snowstorms per winter of 3+ inches or more. I've always handled it fine in my panther vehicles, but since the Chargers have much more power and torque, are they worse in the snow?
>>29068726Significantly better in both than a Panther. These cars are HEAVY to the point it's damn near a truck how it stays planted. Besides that the traction control won't let you spin more than like 1/8th of a rotation while it's on and if you shut it off you can use throttle to steer it. I've had my current Charger for 6 years in Illinois weather at north of 450 wheel and has a big ass converter to boot but still drives in inclement weather better than most of the other cars I've had including a lot of trucks.I would suggest getting the DWS06+s so you don't hydroplane on water, though.
>>29068907>>29068907Okay fair enough, I might expand my search to include the rear wheel drive charger as well. It's just that, from my research, I can get a police one much cheaper. Again, dealerships and individual sellers seem to want close to $30k for any rear while drive charger 10 years old or newer that doesn't have a salvage title
>>29070655>dealerships and individual sellers seem to want close to $30k for any rear while drive charger 10 years old or newer that doesn't have a salvage titleJust look at a W211 Mercedes E500 then, less than $10k and you can even get a 4matic wagon and have an AWD, V8 wagon with a bulletproof M113 that'll last 500k+ miles. Rear facing third row seats, too.$30k gets you into a low mileage, RWD AMG version of the same thing.
>>29070655I guess it depends where you live at because where I'm at you can get post-facelift Chargers and Challengers with the 5.7 and track pack for 13-17k and for a lil extra not have 150k miles and be able to choose colors other than white, black or gray.The reason why the police version is cheaper is because they beat the dog tits off them and have a fuckload of idle time which isn't good on any engine with cam phase limiters and vvti. You also run the risk of buying one with a clapped out suspension from them running over curbs and medians at speed which is why the two classes of people you see buying them use them for either a project car or bought it from a buy here pay here lot with a payday loan for a job they already quit
>>29068190>Also, the 0-60 time is important to me. I need a car that is faster than my friend's 2021 Honda Accord 2.0t>It's also important to me that I get a faster car than his while spending nearly half of what he spent on his hondaThen you 100% do not want a V6 Charger/Challenger, they're slow af and get walked by stock 2.0t Accords. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/QWrC2GKxeGk
