When Thou didst submit Thyself unto death, O Thou deathless and immortal One, then Thou didst destroy hell with Thy Godly power. And when Thou didst raise the dead from beneath the earth, all the powers of Heaven did cry aloud unto Thee: O Christ, Thou giver of life, glory to Thee.In the grave bodily, but in hades with Thy soul as God; in Paradise with the thief, and on the throne with the Father and the Spirit wast Thou Who fillest all things, O Christ the Inexpressible.Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit.How life-giving, how much more beautiful than Paradise, and truly more resplendent than any royal palace was Thy tomb shown to be, O Christ, the source of our resurrection.Both now and ever, and unto the ages of ages. Amen.
>>536171046The Lord is my shepherd; I shall not want. He made me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters. He hath converted my soul, He hath led me on the paths of righteousness for His name’s sake. Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for Thou art with me; thy rod and Thy staff they comfort me. Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: Thou anointest my head with oil; and Thy cup which filleth me, how excellent it is! And Thy mercy shall pursue me all the days of my life, and I will dwell in the house of the Lord unto length of days.
>>536171075O Lord, rebuke me not in Thine anger, nor chasten me in Thy wrath. For Thine arrows are fastened in me, and Thou hast laid Thy hand heavily upon me. There is no healing in my flesh in the face of Thy wrath; and there is no peace in my bones in the face of my sins. For mine iniquities are risen higher than my head; as a heavy burden have they pressed heavily upon me. My bruises are become noisome and corrupt in the face of my folly. I have been wretched and utterly bowed down until the end; all the day long I went with downcast face. For my loins are filled with mockings, and there is no healing in my flesh. I am afflicted and humbled exceedingly, I have roared from the groaning of my heart. O Lord, before Thee is all my desire, and my groaning is not hid from Thee. My heart is troubled, my strength hath failed me; and the light of mine eyes, even this is not with me. My friends and my neighbours drew nigh over against me and stood, and my nearest of kin stood afar off. And they that sought after my soul used violence; and they that sought evils for me spake vain things, and craftiness all the day long did they meditate. But as for me, like a deaf man I heard them not, and was as a speechless man that openeth not his mouth. And I became as a man that heareth not, and that hath in his mouth no reproofs. For in Thee have I hoped, O Lord; Thou wilt hearken unto me, O Lord my God. For I said: Let never mine enemies rejoice over me; yea, when my feet were shaken, those men spake boastful words against me. For I am ready for scourges, and my sorrow is continually before me. For I will declare mine iniquity, and I will take heed concerning my sin. But mine enemies live and are made stronger than I, and they that hated me unjustly are multiplied. They that render me evil for good slandered me, because I pursued goodness. Forsake me not, O Lord my God, depart not from me. Be attentive unto my help, O Lord of my salvation.
>>536171092Judge them, O Lord, that do me injustice; war against them that war against me. Take hold of weapon and shield, and arise unto my help. Draw out a sword, and shut the way against them that persecute me; say to my soul: I am thy salvation. Let them that seek my soul be shamed and confounded. Let them be turned back, and be utterly put to shame, they that devise evils against me. Let them become as dust before the face of the wind, an angel of the Lord also afflicting them. Let their way become darkness and a sliding, an angel of the Lord also pursuing them. For without cause have they secretly prepared for my destruction in their snare, without reason have they cast reproach on my soul. Let a snare come upon him, which he knoweth not; and let the trap, which he hath hidden, catch him, and into that same snare let him fall. But my soul shall rejoice in the Lord, it shall delight in His salvation. All my bones shall say: Lord, O Lord, who is like unto Thee? Delivering the beggar from the hand of them that are stronger than he, yea, poor man and pauper from them that despoil him. Unjust witnesses rose up against me; things I knew not they asked me. They repaid me with evil things for good, and barrenness for my soul.
>>536171109But as for me, when they troubled me, I put on sackcloth. And I humbled my soul with fasting, and my prayer shall return to my bosom. As though it had been a neighbour, as though it had been our brother, so sought I to please; as one mourning and sad of countenance, so humbled I myself. Yet against me they rejoiced and gathered together; scourges were gathered together upon me, and I knew it not. They were rent asunder, yet not pricked at heart; they tempted me, they mocked me with mockery, they gnashed upon me with their teeth. O Lord, when wilt Thou look upon me? Deliver my soul from their evil doing, even this only-begotten one of mine from the lions. I will confess Thee in the great congregation; among a mighty people will I praise Thee. Let not them rejoice against me that unjustly are mine enemies, they that hate me without a cause, and wink with their eyes. For peaceably indeed they spake unto me, but in their wrath were they devising deceits. And they opened wide their mouth against me; they said: Well done, well done, our eyes have seen it. Thou hast seen it, O Lord; keep not silence. O Lord, depart not from me. Arise, O Lord, and be attentive unto my judgement, my God, and my Lord, unto my cause. Judge me, O Lord, according to Thy righteousness; O Lord my God, let them not rejoice against me. Let them not say in their hearts: Well done, well done, our soul. Let them not say: We have swallowed him up. Let them be shamed and confounded together who rejoice at my woes. Let them be clothed with shame and confusion who speak boastful words against me. Let them rejoice and be glad who desire the righteousness of my cause, and let them that desire the peace of Thy servant say continually: The Lord be magnified. And my tongue shall treat of Thy righteousness, and of Thy praise all the day long.
>>536171141I will bless the Lord at all times, His praise shall continually be in my mouth. In the Lord shall my soul be praised; let the meek hear and be glad. O magnify the Lord with me, and let us exalt His name together. I sought the Lord, and He heard me, and delivered me from all my tribulations. Come unto Him, and be enlightened, and your faces shall not be ashamed. This poor man cried, and the Lord heard him, and saved him out of all his tribulations. The angel of the Lord will encamp round about them that fear Him, and will deliver them. O taste and see that the Lord is good; blessed is the man that hopeth in Him. O fear the Lord, all ye His saints; for there is no want to them that fear Him. Rich men have turned poor and gone hungry; but they that seek the Lord shall not be deprived of any good thing. Come ye children, hearken unto me; I will teach you the fear of the Lord. What man is there that desireth life, who loveth to see good days? Keep thy tongue from evil, and thy lips from speaking guile. Turn away from evil, and do good; seek peace, and pursue it. The eyes of the Lord are upon the righteous, and His ears are opened unto their supplication. The face of the Lord is against them that do evil, utterly to destroy the remembrance of them from the earth. The righteous cried, and the Lord heard them, and He delivered them out of all their tribulations. The Lord is nigh unto them that are of a contrite heart, and He will save the humble of spirit. Many are the tribulations of the righteous, and the Lord shall deliver them out of them all. The Lord keepeth all their bones, not one of them shall be broken. The death of sinners is evil, and they that hate the righteous shall do wrong. The Lord will redeem the souls of His servants, and none of them will do wrong that hope in Him.
>>536171159I believed wherefore I spake; I was humbled exceedingly. As for me, I said in mine ecstasy: Every man is a liar. What shall I render unto the Lord for all that He hath rendered unto me? I will take the cup of salvation, and I will call upon the name of the Lord. My vows unto the Lord will I pay in the presence of all His people. Precious in the sight of the Lord is the death of His saints. O Lord, I am Thy servant; I am Thy servant and the son of Thy handmaid. Thou hast broken my bonds asunder. I will sacrifice a sacrifice of praise unto Thee, and I will call upon the name of the Lord. My vows unto the Lord will I pay in the presence of all His people, in the courts of the house of the Lord, in the midst of thee, O Jerusalem.Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit, both now and ever, and unto the ages of ages. Amen.
>>536171189The earth is the Lord’s, and the fullness thereof, the world, and all that dwell therein. He hath founded it upon the seas, and upon the rivers hath He prepared it. Who shall ascend into the mountain of the Lord? Or who shall stand in His holy place? He that is innocent in hands and pure in heart, who hath not received his soul in vain, and hath not sworn deceitfully to his neighbor. Such a one shall receive a blessing from the Lord, and mercy from God his Savior. This is the generation of them that seek the Lord, of them that seek the face of the God of Jacob. Lift up your gates, O ye princes; and be ye lifted up, ye everlasting gates, and the King of Glory shall enter in. Who is this King of Glory? The Lord strong and mighty, the Lord, mighty in war. Lift up your gates, O ye princes; and be ye lifted up, ye everlasting gates, and the King of Glory shall enter in. Who is this King of Glory? The Lord of hosts, He is the King of Glory.
>>536171225Have mercy on me, O God, according to Thy great mercy; and according to the multitude of Thy compassions blot out my transgression. Wash me thoroughly from mine iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin. For I know mine iniquity, and my sin is ever before me. Against Thee only have I sinned and done this evil before Thee, that Thou mightest be justified in Thy words, and prevail when Thou art judged. For behold, I was conceived in iniquities, and in sins did my mother bear me. For behold, Thou hast loved truth; the hidden and secret things of Thy wisdom hast Thou made manifest unto me. Thou shalt sprinkle me with hyssop, and I shall be made clean; Thou shalt wash me, and I shall be made whiter than snow. Thou shalt make me to hear joy and gladness; the bones that be humbled, they shall rejoice. Turn Thy face away from my sins, and blot out all mine iniquities. Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me. Cast me not away from Thy presence, and take not Thy Holy Spirit from me. Restore unto me the joy of Thy salvation, and with Thy governing Spirit establish me. I shall teach transgressors Thy ways, and the ungodly shall turn back unto Thee. Deliver me from blood-guiltiness, O God, Thou God of my salvation; my tongue shall rejoice in Thy righteousness. O Lord, Thou shalt open my lips, and my mouth shall declare Thy praise. For if Thou hadst desired sacrifice, I had given it; with whole-burnt offerings Thou shalt not be pleased. A sacrifice unto God is a broken spirit; a heart that is broken and humbled God will not despise. Do good, O Lord, in Thy good pleasure unto Sion, and let the walls of Jerusalem be builded up. Then shalt Thou be pleased with a sacrifice of righteousness, with oblation and whole-burnt offerings. Then shall they offer bullocks upon Thine altar.
>>536171255"Now, we both know and confess that God is without beginning and without end, everlasting and eternal, uncreated, unchangeable, inalterable, simple, uncompounded, incorporeal, invisible, impalpable, uncircumscribed, unlimited, incomprehensible, uncontained, unfathomable, good, just, the maker of all created things, all-powerful, all-ruling, all-seeing, the provider, the sovereign, and the judge of all." +St. John of Damascus, ca 675-749 A. D. 'An Exact Exposition of the Orthodox Faith'
>>536171281Bless the Lord, O my soul; O Lord my God, Thou hast been magnified exceedingly. Confession and majesty hast Thou put on, Who coverest Thyself with light as with a garment, Who stretchest out the heaven as it were a curtain; Who supporteth His chambers in the waters, Who appointeth the clouds for His ascent, Who walketh upon the wings of the winds, Who maketh His angels spirits, and His ministers a flame of fire, Who establisheth the earth in the sureness thereof; it shall not be turned back for ever and ever. The abyss like a garment is His mantle; upon the mountains shall the waters stand. At Thy rebuke they will flee, at the voice of Thy thunder shall they be afraid. The mountains rise up and the plains sink down, unto the place where Thou hast established them. Thou appointedst a bound that they shall not pass, neither return to cover the earth. He sendeth forth springs in the valleys; between the mountains will the waters run. They shall give drink to all the beasts of the field; the wild donkeys will wait to quench their thirst. Beside them will the birds of the heaven lodge, from the midst of the rocks will they give voice. He watereth the mountains from His chambers; the earth shall be satisfied with the fruit of Thy works. He causeth the grass to grow for the cattle, and green herb for the service of men, to bring forth bread out of the earth; and wine maketh glad the heart of man. To make his face cheerful with oil; and bread strengtheneth man's heart. The trees of the plain shall be satisfied, the cedars of Lebanon, which Thou hast planted. There will the sparrows make their nests; the house of the heron is chief among them. The high mountains are a refuge for the harts, and so is the rock for the hares.
>>536171316He hath made the moon for seasons; the sun knoweth his going down. Thou appointedst the darkness, and there was the night, wherein all the beasts of the forest will go abroad. Young lions roaring after their prey, and seeking their food from God. The sun ariseth, and they are gathered together, and they lay them down in their dens. But man shall go forth unto his work, and to his labour until the evening.How magnified are Thy works, O Lord! In wisdom hast Thou made them all; the earth is filled with Thy creation. So is this great and spacious sea, therein are things creeping innumerable, small living creatures with the great. There go the ships; there this leviathan, whom Thou hast made to play therein. All things wait on Thee, to give them their food in due season; when Thou givest it them, they will gather it. When Thou openest Thy hand, all things shall be filled with goodness; when Thou turnest away Thy face, they shall be troubled. Thou wilt take their spirit, and they shall cease; and unto their dust shall they return. Thou wilt send forth Thy Spirit, and they shall be created; and Thou shalt renew the face of the earth. Let the glory of the Lord be unto the ages; the Lord will rejoice in His works. Who looketh on the earth and maketh it tremble, Who toucheth the mountains and they smoke.I will sing unto the Lord throughout my life, I will chant to my God for as long as I have my being. May my words be sweet unto Him, and I will rejoice in the Lord. O that sinners would cease from the earth, and they that work iniquity, that they should be no more. Bless the Lord, O my soul!
>>536171046Today was a blessed Sunday.God bless every anon who reads this
>>536171141the man in your image was a literal california homosexual who pretended to just plum not know about all the child rape that was going on around him. he was a vile person who is burning in hell right now.
a religion so good you need to shill it
>>536171705He was just canonized a Saint by ROCOR, so congratulations, you listened to gossip and slander and now you judged a holy man. Lord have mercy
>>536171999you'll live
>>536171046Axtually today is Trinity Sunday, not Pentacost. You're a fake. Pentacost was the 24th.t.Catholic.Also none of you even seem to know the prayer to the Holy Spirit an I doubt any of you are confir,ed and received the gifts of the Holy Spiritm wisdom, understanding, counsel, fortitude, knowledge, piety, and fear of the Lord, Wisdom and Knowledge,Faith,Healing and Miracles,Prophecy,Discerning of Spirits,Speaking and Interpreting TonguesOnly Catholics receive some of these gifts throught confirmation.
>>536171046Jesus didn't give a shit about This World or resisting the evil flesh and blood men who oppress the people and harm the children in it, which is the duty of any Man. All he cared about was his "Kingdom of Heaven," which makes him less than a man.
Stop spamming this shit, jew worshipping faggot. Nobody wants your shitty jew desert cult
>>536172981O Heavenly King, Comforter, the Spirit of Truth, Who art everywhere present and fillest all things, Treasury of every good thing and Giver of life, come and dwell in us, cleanse us of every stain, and save our souls, O Good One.It is Pentecost according to the Julian Calendar
>>536172981>the prayer to the Holy SpiritCome Holy Spirit, fill the hearts of your faithful and kindle in them the fire of your love. Send forth your Spirit and they shall be created. And You shall renew the face of the earth.O, God, who by the light of the Holy Spirit, did instruct the hearts of the faithful, grant that by the same Holy Spirit we may be truly wise and ever enjoy His consolations, Through Christ Our Lord, Amen.
>>536173188Wrong on the prayer and wrong on it being Pentacost. I see into you. Get help. From a Priest.
>>536173266Why are you making assumptions about my heart? If you are a real roman catholic 'priest' especially, Lord have mercy.
It was last Sunday. Why do Ortholarpers always do this kind of thing.
>>536173188Whatever it is you did, you drew evil to you. Get help.
>>536171046Sorry bro, Pentacost was last week. Today is Trinity Sunday>t. The true holy apostolic Catholic church fully purified of all corrupt medieval doctrine
>>536173103I already some of the same posters would be here screaming and dumping their meme folders as if anyone made them click this threadGood thread, OP
>>536173381Say this prayer Repeat it until you feel some peacena d get help.>>536173377St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle. Be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the Devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray, and do thou, O Prince of the heavenly hosts, by the power of God, thrust into hell Satan, and all the evil spirits, who prowl about the world seeking the ruin of souls. Amen. .
>>536171046Amen.
>>536173498I believe in one God, the Father almighty,maker of heaven and earth,of all things visible and invisible.I believe in one Lord Jesus Christ,the Only Begotten Son of God,born of the Father before all ages.God from God, Light from Light,true God from true God,begotten, not made, consubstantialwith the Father;Through him all things were made.For us men and for our salvationhe came down from heaven,and by the Holy Spirit was incarnateof the Virgin Mary,and became man.For our sake he was crucifiedunder Pontius Pilate,he suffered death and was buried,and rose again on the third dayin accordance with the Scriptures.He ascended into heavenand is seated at the right hand of the Father.He will come again in gloryto judge the living and the deadand his kingdom will have no end.I believe in the Holy Spirit,the Lord, the giver of life,who proceeds from the Father and the Son,who with the Father and the Sonis adored and glorified,who has spoken through the prophets.I believe in one, holy, catholic,and apostolic Church.I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sinsand I look forward to the resurrectionof the dead and the life of the world to come.Amen.
>>536173381We calculate Pascha according to the way set forth in the First Ecumenical Council, called by St Constantine the Great.We haven't changed it in 1600 years because changing anything in an Ecumenical Council is extremely difficult. Something Roman Catholics wouldn't understand because they change all the time; every time the Pope opens his mouth the theology changes because his word is law
>>536173534Praying to saints and angels is Idolatry.
>>536171046I don't go to church, but I need to confess. I love my family, I want them to be happy and I want to help them. How am I supposed to view them as my rightful enemy and distance myself from them?Matthew 1036 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
>>536173568You are being lead astray by someone who is unwell.
>>536171547God bless you too brother in Christ
>>536173534That's a good prayer. do you know St Patrick's breastplate prayer? Classic Orthodox theology in that one.https://www.orthodoxarkansas.com/the-lorica-breastplate-of-st-patrick/
HOLY GAY FAGGOT KIKE THREAD
>>536173675>You are being lead astray by someone who is unwell.Same.
>>536173581no no no, here you goI believe in one God, Father Almighty, Creator of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all ages; Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten, not created, of one essence with the Father through Whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary and became man. He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered and was buried; And He rose on the third day, according to the Scriptures. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father; And He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom shall have no end.And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Creator of life, Who proceeds from the Father, Who together with the Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified, Who spoke through the prophets.In one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church.I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the age to come.Amen.
>>536173498>screaming and dumpingfunny image in my head, thanks anon, God bless you
>>536173602I see you really have given yourself to evil, it has you. You invited it in. You insult the Lord Gods Anegls openly? You insult the Saints openly? "Go behind me, Satan, thou art a scandal unto me: because thou savourest not the things that are of God, but the things that are of men."
>>536173492see>>536173592
>>536173761It's Light from LIght actually and I am quite familiar with it which should be obvious.
>>536173811>You insult the Lord Gods Anegls openly? You insult the Saints openly?
>>536173631Go to Orthodox Church.Love is the first rule. Just because we love Christ, the Holy Spirit, and the Father, the undivided Holy Trinity- doesn't mean we have to distance from other people, especially not our family, who we have a responsibility to love. It only means that Christ is first in our hearts.Go to Orthodox Church
>>536173897St. Michael the Archangel,defend us in battle.Be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the Devil.May God rebuke him, we humbly pray,and do thou,O Prince of the heavenly hosts,by the power of God,thrust into hell Satan,and all the evil spirits,who prowl about the worldseeking the ruin of souls. Amen. .
>>536173871But yours had the Filioque. I posted the original.
>>536173999HereI believe in one God, the Father almighty,maker of heaven and earth,of all things visible and invisible.I believe in one Lord Jesus Christ,the Only Begotten Son of God,born of the Father before all ages.God from God, Light from Light,true God from true God,begotten, not made, consubstantialwith the Father;Through him all things were made.For us men and for our salvationhe came down from heaven,and by the Holy Spirit was incarnateof the Virgin Mary,and became man.For our sake he was crucifiedunder Pontius Pilate,he suffered death and was buried,and rose again on the third dayin accordance with the Scriptures.He ascended into heavenand is seated at the right hand of the Father.He will come again in gloryto judge the living and the deadand his kingdom will have no end.I believe in the Holy Spirit,the Lord, the giver of life,who proceeds from the Father and the Son,who with the Father and the Sonis adored and glorified,who has spoken through the prophets.I believe in one, holy, catholic,and apostolic Church.I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sinsand I look forward to the resurrectionof the dead and the life of the world to come.Amen.
>>536173811I don't hate the angels or the saints. But we do not pray to them. Is it OK to pray to Satan? He is an angel, after all, and since you claim you don't REALLY pray to them but ask for intercession, there would be nothing wrong with asking an unlikely candidate for intercession either, right?And Saints? They would not hear your prayers, they are not omniscient. How many people worldwide are praying to Mary right this second? Thousands per second? Who can sort out that many requests per second? A being would need omniscience. Then they need to redirect the prayers to God. Meanwhile the Bible (which I know Roman Catholics despise) clearly states that the Lord Jesus Christ is the sole mediator between God and man. Plus Only God knows who is truly a saint. What if the saint you are praying to was secretly a murderous pedophile? The Bible only confirms very few people are indeed in Heaven but you Papists have a billion saints which are nothing more than stand-ins for pagan gods. Which saint do you pray to when you lose your keys?It's just idolatry. It's not different than praying through a golden calf. The golden calf represented Yahweh even and God still hated it. God hates idolatry, and hates when the traditions of men overwrite what He clearly commanded.
>>536173592No, the issue is you not adopting the Gregorian Calendar or updating the computations at all in 1600+ years, by now completely wrong and ever drifting.It was attempted though, you can read more about it here https://orthodoxwiki.org/Paschalion
>>536174074still the filioque
>>536174634My jurisdiction does use an accurate calendar. It is called the Revised Julian Calendar. But not all jurisdictions adopted this become some have reservations due to ecumenist intentions around the calendar change. So this needs to be solved in Council. The solution for now was to calculate Pascha for everyone by the old (original) way, using the Julian Calendar. So all Orthodox celebrate Pascha and the feasts tied to it at the same time. This is all temporary until God sees fit to illumine the entire Church in Ecumenical Council.
>>536173988Ooga Booga
Blessed Pentecost. That prayer is from the Orthodox Paschal liturgy and it is one of the most beautiful things in all of Christian worship. Christ trampling down death by death. Christ filling all things while in the grave, in hades, in paradise, and on the throne simultaneously. That is not poetry. That is theology at the highest level. The West has the same feast today. The same Holy Spirit descended on the same apostles and the Church was born. East and West share this feast, this Spirit, this faith. The filioque is important but it is not worth the schism. The Spirit proceeds from the Father. The West says through the Son. The East says from the Father alone. Read the Council of Florence. The Greek delegates signed the union. It was politics at home that undid it. The theological gap is narrower than most people think. The real tragedy of Pentecost is not the theological dispute. It is that the same Spirit who descended to unite has watched His Church divided for a thousand years. May He heal what we have broken.
>>536173951Love cannot be a responsibility. Love is from volition. This is my dilemma, because I love my family from my heart, but I choose to voluntarily help them also when I understand that I should be spreading the gospel. I never speak of religion to my family, unless they directly ask.
>>536175151Two protestant pastors went to India to spread the gospel. They found an Orthodox nun in a rural village, massaging the feet of lepers and tending to the dying members of the "untouchables" class which society treated as outcasts and would not visit when they were sick or infirm.The two pastors were confused at this nun when they learned she moved from village to village doing this, and they asked her "How do you spread the Gospel when you don't speak the languages of each of these individual villages you go to?"Saint Gavrilia, the Ascetic of Love, responded:"I use five languages. The first is smile, the second, tears. The third, touch. The fourth prayer. The fifth, love."I live one hour away from her spiritual son, who studied and served under her for nearly 10 years when she was too old to travel the world and lived in an apartment in Athens
Pentecost was over a week ago
>>536172191I agree that that is slander. He gave up his homosexual past which is noble and to hold that against him is to deny the forgiveness in the lord.His co-founder of the monastery in California… maybe not so much. I think the core issue with his canonisation is that his soteriology was fucked. He basically reduced Christ to little more than a facilitator.
>>536175795The first portion of your post is completely accurate.>the core issue with his canonisation isNo such thing. When Bishops come together in holy synod to vote on a canonization, it is the Holy Spirit's prerogative. It's not up to us to have opinions, we obey the will of God, and whomever He has judged to number among the Saints.
>>536175521>The first is smile, the second, tears. The third, touch. The fourth prayer. The fifth, love.">>536173999>>536174752Why does so much of this love seem to go out the window when another God-loving & god-fearing Christian says “and the son”.
>>536175962>No such thing. So your position that bishops in synod are incapable of error?
>>536176101I don't love him less because of the filioque. But wrong is wrong. I wrote a comment to someone the other day, let me get it:>Do you think the hundreds of millions of Hindus in India are valid in being Hindus, simply because no christian church is in their village? Does that mean Hinduism is suddenly not incorrect, suddenly not literal paganism? Other "christianities" are incorrect in the same way. That doesn't mean they are hopeless, God loves everyone, but the truth is the truth. We can't ignore things that are core to the truth, then sing kumbaya. Martyrs died over the truth.
>>536176160According to canonizing Saints specifically, God is not wrong. Everything works to fulfil the providence of God. Saints are never de-canonized so His ruling is pure. But obviously in history there are many many times where Bishops and entire councils were compromised. But those were capable of being corrected and Orthodoxy restored. Not the same with the Saints.Not to say everything a Saint says is infallible, they're not perfect human beings. But Orthodox Bishops (especially not contemporary ROCOR) don't canonize people with questionable theology, even the slightest. There is an extensive committee to investigate each case beforehand for that reason.
>>536175962there cannot be a holy synod without permission by the patriarch of rome. There isn't even one at the moment or back when they "canonised" that guy.>>536176276You can read Aquinas' dismantling of arguments against the Filioque here: https://vulcanhammer.org/2013/06/12/note-on-the-filioque-clause-st-thomas-aquinas-on-the-procession-of-the-holy-spirit-from-the-son/
>>536176276>I wrote a comment to someone the other day, let me get it:>Does that mean Hinduism is suddenly not incorrect, suddenly not literal paganism? Other "christianities" are incorrect in the same way.Yeah I would definitely disagree with that.EOs are wrong about the necessity of icons. Does that make them literal pagans?Is being wrong regarding the ‘of vs in’ 2 natures debate make someone a pagan?Is it perfectly correct doctrine that saves or is it Christ?>That doesn't mean they are hopeless, God loves everyone, but the truth is the truth.Well anathema is a condemnation to hell. So if you hold to the doctrine that “and the son” makes you anathema then yes, you would necessarily think they are hopeless within that state.>We can't ignore things that are core to the truthNo one is asking you to.
>>536176522Yeah well we don't care what the Vatican does at the moment. Anyone outside of Orthodoxy is not in the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church, the only Church founded by Jesus Christ on this day, Pentecost.
>>536176545>EOs are wrong aboutaccording to you and your opinion.>anathema is a condemnation to hellIncorrect, and a myth perpetuated by butthurt protestants, forgive me for putting it like that but its true.Anathema literally means "lifted upward" and we use it to mean that someone, something, or some doctrine is outside of the Church, and therefore we lift them up to God's mercy because they reject the Church through their free will and we can't help them anymore. The reality of this is that it's practically impossible to be "saved" if you want to use that language, if you are not only outside the Church, but actively rejecting the Church, which is the Body of Christ, inseparable from Christ Himself. It's all very tied together.
>>536176405Incorruptible remains is one of the signs of sainthood in many different faiths. Orthodox, Hindu, Daoist. I'm with the Orthodox so I am not promoting any heathen beliefs but it is an interesting commonality. A scientific inquiry into this phenomena would be very interesting. Christ is risen!
>>536176405>According to canonizing Saints specifically, God is not wrong. So your position that bishops in synod are incapable of error?>Saints are never de-canonized so His ruling is pure. How is that not begging the question. If you say “We’ve infallibly declared persons X & Y to be saint”, and “the proof we are infallible on such matters is we have never gone back on our decision”, and “we’ve never got back on our decision because they are infallible.It’s just circular.>But obviously in history there are many many times where Bishops and entire councils were compromised. But those were capable of being corrected and Orthodoxy restored.That just seems like you can’t be wrong because by your own definitions you won’t allow yourselves to be wrong.
>>536176766yes, but not the only criteria, just like you know that miracles and "miracles" (sorcery) are not unique to Orthodoxy either. Magic and supernatural power or circumstances are not proofs of truth alone, we don't seek signs primarily. They may help faith if they really are from God, but that requires discernment against prelest.Truly He is risen
>>536176832Orthodox Bishops are wrong all the time lol. But God is not wrong. Everything works out.It must take an incomprehensible (literally infinite, divine) level of patience and nudging to deal with us fickle human beings fallen as we are.
>>536171046Remov zog and jog of frog mog and gt shit just hn loftus fat pedo baby fucking shitpig and disinfowar rotted your skull even the their lies and Zion tricks more communist empty skull jew worship
>>536176753>according to you and your opinion.In the same way your objection to the filioque is your opinion.>Incorrect, and a myth perpetuated by butthurt protestants, forgive me for putting it like that but its true.Incorrect, and a myth perpetuated by butthurt Orthobros. You’re following nu-orthodoxy which wants to soften its historic position because it doesn’t market well. Forgive me for putting it like that but it’s true. Tarasios, Patriarch of Constantinople, in an address made around 784 A.D. stated that, "An anathema is a terrible thing: it drives [its victims] far from God and expels them from the kingdom of heaven, carrying them off into the outer darkness.”(Richard Price, The Acts of the Second Council of Nicaea (787) (Translated Texts for Historians, vol. 68; Liverpool: Liverpool University Press, 2020), p. 577.)And in the Letter of the Synod to the Emperor and Empress (of Byzantium) following the council it is stated that;"Now anathema is nothing less than complete separation from God."(Labbe and Cossart, Concilia, Tom. VII., col. 577.)https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3819.htm
>>536176971now you're just being argumentative and not in good faith. I enjoyed your first few responses. Good night.
>>536176920> Orthodox Bishops are wrong all the time lol.Yeah I get your doing that thing when you are getting uncomfortable with question. You post lol after to try and play off the question. I am happy to be patient but I still would like an answer.You say >“But God is not wrong”. Which means you think it wasn’t the bishops “declaration” but God. However of course God didn’t descend physically to pen an approval of the canonisation (at least I hope you don’t believe that). Therefore you would have to be taking the position that the decision of the bishops was infallibly guided by God, similar to an ex-cathedra statement by the pope.So is it your position that bishops in synod are incapable of error?
>>536176629there cannot be One Church without the Patriarch of Rome. It makes no sense. If the orthodox church was the real church, it would have nominated a "orthodox" patriarch of rome, they can't, because everyone knows there's a schism. The difference being is that the patriarch of Rome can operate by his own authority without the others, while the others cannot do the same.
>>536176971I will respond to your last point, because I read past your opening cringe "no u"Because something is historical in the sense that one can find it at a certain point in history, doesn't mean it is correct. For example for the last 200 years the Russians particularly were using language in the anathemas that was becoming personal and a little too strong, even vindictive and indicative of holding grudges. Recently they have shifted and corrected. My point about individual (or even repeat) findings in history can be equally found in errors. Like the various heresies supported by Patriarchs, emperors, etc.God resolves everything over time. The proof is the Saints, the same heart today as in all time and places.
>>536176629I do not think anyone who recognizes Christ is God and the savior of humanity is not a Christian but I do think that the Orthodox Church has the most authentic and original methods of worshiping Christ. There's a lot of things in Orthodoxy that are missing in the protestantism I grew up with, and that is why I lost faith until I discovered Orthodoxy.However I feel that if we all agree that Christ is God then we should not waste our energy arguing the details with other Christians. Unity amongst all Christians will be very, very important in the near future, IMHO.But yeah Orthodoxy is the original and best Church. You can just sense the difference in the Orthodox clergy right away. They radiate love peace and joy in a different way.
>>536177036>now you're just being argumentative and not in good faith.How? I literally posted quotes along with citations. If that’s not “good faith” then what is?Or is it only “good faith” when you get to blow off what I say as a “myth perpetuated by butthurt protestants”.Regardless if that’s you standard then fruitful discussion would be literally impossible. Hope you have a safe and blessed night/day.
>>536177231the circumstances you allude to are already happening (and have been happening) in the Middle East for hundreds of years. Christians there are more united on the ground level like you say, but the Orthodox have never stopped being Orthodox. In fact Metropolitan Saba, who came from Syria, is like the living definition of Orthodox.
>>536177184>Because something is historical in the sense that one can find it at a certain point in history, doesn't mean it is correct. Do you think the ecumenical council of Nicea II didn’t understand the meaning of Anathema? And the Patriarch didn’t understand it either?>Recently they have shifted and corrected. Doesn’t that concede that the church can error and historically has?>If the church My point about individual (or even repeat) findings in history can be equally found in errors. Like the various heresies supported by Patriarchs, emperors, etc.Doesn’t that concede that the canonisation similarly can be an error. If your position that the “Orthodox” of the past were wrong, how do you justify the position that today’s “Orthodox” are without error in similar matters. If bishops at a council can declare anathemas while misunderstanding what that words means (according to you) then why can’t they incorrectly canonise someone? >God resolves everything over time.I agree. However Catholics, Protestant, and everyone else holds that position. Lutherans can truthfully state that while holding to their doctrines. The church was true, then took on too many false doctrines and then “God resolves everything over time.” Why must the state of “saints” TODAY be without error?
>>536171046Pentecost is a Jewish holiday taken on by the Catholics. In the Christian faith it represents the transition from baptism by water to baptism by fire. Are you ready for the fire?
>>536177471Catholics, Protestants, and everyone else, have been disintegrating practically, dogmatically, and administratively continuously. They don't correct, they are just a force of entropy. Orthodoxy corrects. Compare Lutherans today with Luther himself.I think a lot of your other questions are repeating yourself on things I've already addressed. I also don't think this is much of a conversation, more like you are just overwhelming with questions and making debatebro jabs.
>>536177231>There's a lot of things in Orthodoxy that are missing in the protestantism I grew up with.I think the core issue is that Eastern “Orthodoxy” might have a lot that Protestantism doesn’t, but isn’t that the point? Id teneamus quod ubique, quod semper, quod ab omnibus creditum est: hoc etenim vere proprieque catholicum.(We hold that which has been believed everywhere, always, and of all people: for that is truly and properly Catholic.)Saint Vincent of LerinsYou can have “less” (for example an iconostasis) while still having everything the original church had. I actually understand why “Protestants” (an absurdly large and often unhelpful category) have taken the approach they have. Most of the time they are smart and have made rational decisions based off the evidence they had.t. Catholic
>>536177231There is no Salvation Outside the Church. In addition to many heretical beliefs, protestants are not in union with the Body of Christ.
>>536177627ah, i looked it up, it's called "gish galloping"
>>536176863Ultimately it is for Christ to judge, and Christ only. This is why I refrain from criticizing anyone else's faith, and instead save my strength for following my own. Lord knows a sinner like me is going to need it. Lord have mercy.
>>536177627You ortholarpers are truly delusional. Modern orthodoxy is rife with novelties such as Palamism. All the post-schism synods aren't valid by necessity. And look at the absolute state of your church post Council of Florence to 1990. 500 years of being under Ottomans first Communists afterwards. But what do you even know, you're some zoomer american e-convert who discovered orthodoxy on twitter.
>>536173103>pagans reject every aspectthe pagans considered the god of the old testament to be one of their own - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caelus#Jewish_syncretismand as soon as a pagan became emperor and b& christianity, he attempted to rebuild the third temple - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_(emperor)
>>536173103>"chad jew"jesus's Y chromosome comes from the fatherand he wasn't a talmudic kabbalist either (books which weren't written until 600 years after Christ)>"Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” Then [the jews] took up stones to [kill] Him [...]"- John 48-49he's not "a jew", he's god
>>536173103>desert religiongod created a garden at the time of creation, not a desert.and if the religion appealed to middle eastern sensibilities, how come they reject it, while europeans embrace it
>>536173717
>>536177630Says you, but it is only for Christ to judge.
>>536176832>demiurgein bulgaria, the gnostics were known as bogomilsthey were expelled, because they mocked the god of the physical world, by having gay sexin france they were known as the cathars, and were crusaded againstin england, they were the origin of the term buggery / sodomy, in reference to their bulgarian roots trinity in the Old Testament - https://youtu.be/odNoExd8a5U- https://youtu.be/rp92-3aBL-A- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CBh8lmgecs
what's a nigga gotta do to get some christing around here?https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MPHyR92MQic&ra=m
>>536177976Christ set up a Church, just ask the ortholarper if you're hellbound or not just believing whatever you want outside of it.
>>536177627>Catholics, Protestants, and everyone else, have been disintegrating practically, dogmatically, and administratively continuously. Okay that’s awesome but do you think the ecumenical council of Nicea II didn’t understand the meaning of Anathema? And the Patriarch didn’t understand it either? >They don't correct, they are just a force of entropy.So when the Catholic Church said the Eastern “Orthodox” were a valid Christians they just had an irregular relationship with the church you consider that entropy and not a correction from its previous position?>Orthodoxy corrects.Does it? You still keep avoiding wether bishops can error?And historically the EO churches have held that they have need add or subtracted. That they are the unchanging church. How can you “correct” if you have never changed?>Compare Lutherans today with Luther himself.Which Lutherans? Lutherans don’t claim to be a single institution.>I think a lot of your other questions are repeating yourself on things I've already addressed.I don’t think you have. I feel as if you are actively avoiding them.>just overwhelming with questions Well asking questions is often a good means to get the truth. But I’ve only asked 3 which you seem to be avoiding1) So your position that bishops in synod are incapable of error?2) Do you think the ecumenical council of Nicea II didn’t understand the meaning of Anathema? 2a) And the Patriarch didn’t understand it either?Everything else has largley been an attempt to get those answered.
>>536178258you have 9 question marks in your post>>536177722
>>536177995I’m not a Gnostic. That’s what we call “a meme” anon.Also I’m familiar with Gnosticism. I think the Bogomils actually took over Eastern “Orthodoxy” in a round about way. Just my opinion.
>>536178307oop actually 10 I miscounted, see, Orthodox do make mistakes
>>536178307Because you keep making wild unsubstantiated claims that ought to be questions. And I need to keep asking the same questions you keep talking around.
>>536178360How about you just answer the 3 I listed at the end. And we can set the others aside as “too big think”.
>>536178258>So when the Catholic Church said the Eastern “Orthodox” were a valid Christians they just had an irregular relationship with the churchThey are not. They are schismatics and heretics outside the Church.Technically the Schism was ended at the Ecumenical Council of Florence. The current "orthodox" church is not the same institution of the previous schismatic church post 1092 and pre 1449. That institution was fully reincorporated with the west.
>>536178421*post 1054
>>536178379No, you're just using debatebro tactics not arguing in good faith. Standard Roman Catholic stuff
>>536178461Funny, I think you're just using debatebro tactics, talking around the question so to not argue in good faith. Standard Orthobro stuff.
>>536178511>no u
>>536178606>you can’t feel the same way as me but in reverse.Okay… you can be upset by that, but it doesn’t change how I feel or the truth.
>>5361768324 times I have had to ask>So your position that bishops in synod are incapable of error?>>536177471And 3 times asked>Do you think the ecumenical council of Nicea II didn’t understand the meaning of Anathema? And the Patriarch didn’t understand it either?Haven’t gotten an answer to any of them. >>536177851>Modern orthodoxy is rife with novelties such as Palamism. Yes that why the EOanon tried to redefine “Anathema” and then tried to use word magic to avoid the historical usage of the word.>>536177184>Because something is historical in the sense that one can find it at a certain point in history, doesn't mean it is correct. Essentially conceding that his church didn’t understand what anathema meant and only today after the EO reformation have they finally got it right. I think a smarter decision would just be to admit “our church can & has made errors in its teachings”.
>>536178958the orthobro is right about anathema, he literally explained to you how it actually works.It is not a literal condemnation to Hell but an indirect one, by means of expelling someone from the Church, where he is de facto Hellbound by being Outside of it (a requirement for Salvation). And actually there is also such thing as ipso-facto excommunication, without any formal declaration from the Church.So you could be anathemised by your own actions. Heretics and Apostates are all under ipso facto excommunication.
>>536179391>the orthobro is right about anathema, he literally explained to you how it actually works.Give me an early church text that says an anathema is just an excommunication.>It is not a literal condemnation to Hell but an indirect one, by means of expelling someone from the Church, Why have excommunication in the first place is anthema is an excommunication? Why anathematise people already excommunicated?>And actually there is also such thing as ipso-facto excommunication, without any formal declaration from the Church.I never said there wasn’t. You are shadow boxing.>So you could be anathemised by your own actions.Yes, anathemas are universal and retroactive. Again you are shadowboxing.>Heretics and Apostates are all under ipso facto excommunication.Yes. Then there are anathemas levied against people for holding X or Y belief or not doing X or Y.People are excommunicated in Palamism if they don’t fast during Easter.However you are anathema if you say “and the father through the son”.If anathema = excommunicationWhy have the two terms?Where is the early church document saying “these things are the same”.The records show that these things are not the same. We have saints outside the institutional church (i.e. excommunicated). We don’t (or at least logically cannot) have saints who are anathema.
>>536179391English (verb) -1. To utter a wish of evil against one; to imprecate evil upon; to call for mischief or injury to fall upon; to execrate.2. To injure; to subject to evil; to vex, harass or torment with great calamities.3. To devote to evil.To utter imprecations; to affirm or deny with imprecations of divine vengeance.<https://webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/curse>English (noun) -1. Malediction; the expression of a wish of evil to another.2. Imprecation of evil.3. Affliction; torment; great vexation.4. Condemnation; sentence of divine vengeance on sinners.5. Denunciation of evil.<https://webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/curse>Also, “the expression of a wish that misfortune, evil, doom, etc., befall a person, group, etc. Synonyms: malediction, fulmination, execration, imprecation”“the act of reciting such a formula; an evil that has been invoked upon one; an ecclesiastical censure or anathema; to wish or invoke evil, calamity, injury, or destruction upon; to afflict with great evil”<https://www.dictionary.com/browse/curse>English Etymology -“late Old English curs… ‘consignment of a person to an evil fate,’”“the evil which has been invoked upon one, that which causes severe trouble" is from early 14c,”“Middle English Compendium says probably from Latin cursus "course" … "set of imprecations" as in the sentence of the great curse, "the formula read in churches four times a year, setting forth the various offenses which entailed automatic excommunication of the offender; also, the excommunication so imposed."Meaning "the evil which has been invoked upon one, that which causes severe trouble" is from early 14c.<https://www.etymonline.com/word/curse>
>>536179391>>536179863Cont.Greek - anathema, “a thing devoted to God without hope of being redeemed, and if an animal, to be slain; therefore a person or thing doomed to destruction; a curse; a man accursed, devoted to the direst of woes”<https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g331/esv/mgnt/0-1/> “But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed (anathema). As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed (anathema).” (Galatians 1:8-9 ESV)katara, “an execration, imprecation, curse”<https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g2671/esv/mgnt/0-1/> “Christ redeemed us from the curse (katara) of the law by becoming a curse (katara) for us - for it is written, "Cursed (epikataratos) is everyone who is hanged on a tree." (Galatians 3:13 ESV)epikataratos, “accursed, execrable, exposed to divine vengeance, lying under God's curse”<https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g1944/esv/mgnt/0-1/> “For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse (κατάρα); for it is written, ‘Cursed (epikataratos) be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.’" (Galatians 3:10 ESV)Seeing that Galatians 3 is quoting Deuteronomy 27:26, the Greek epikataratos, meaning “accursed, execrable, exposed to divine vengeance, lying under God's curse,” clearly outlines the Biblical meaning of being cursed/accursed. This aligns with the translation of anathema as cursed/accursed given in the Seventh Ecumenical Council, the Canon Law reference work, and the Synodikon.
>>536179729Anathema is what used to be called "major excommunication" in the West. It's just a formal more solemn condemnation. Imho you're reading too much into it as the two terms are often used interchangeably even in papal bulls.Let's think of the 1054 Schism, the gayreeks anathematised, while the Pope excommunicated (in this case a major excommunication). It's the same exact sentence.Anathema is not some sort of supernatural curse as you seem to imply.I've read alot about excommunication, the various types and various opinions about it due to my research in Sedevacantism. Pic related is from the Summa
>>536171046Oh, OK.You hearing them voices then?
