Do we like or hate Elon Musk now? I can't remember.
>>538511159Elon is like Steve Jobs. He didn't build anything, or design anything, he just paid other people to do it.
>>538511159I heard Elon Musk is an engineer that does engineering things all the time
Shut up, elon. Just fucking kill yourself.
1) It is theoretically impossible for someone to earn a billion dollars in their lifetime. The top competitive salary in the world is a fortune 500 CEO, they are only paid on the order of ~$10 million. As for being an inventor, the top patents only range around $~10 million as well, a couple super valuable patents are owned and developed by massive corporate conglomerates and can range as high as $100m but never into the billions.So given that it's impossible to become a billionaire legitimately and/or honestly, how are people doing it?In every single case they are exploiting sole type of "hack" or "flaw" in the system. Something that enables them to leverage gains far in excess of what they produced
>>538511159>>538511159Bernie was in Congress for decades. He only became popular in recent years because he said some magic words that appealed to braindead leftoids. Which just goes to show you, you can be a politician your whole life and accomplish absolutely nothing. But you can still make the cattle support you so long as you throw them some meaningless verbal overtures. Democracy is so fucking gay.I really enjoyed that picture of Bernie driving a Ferrari he bought with all his cattle donos, though.
>>538511541oh yeah, i forgot about that. it was long before ai.
>>538511541No, he became more popular because wealth inequality is starting to get pretty ridiculous, and so is corruption. He is seen as more authentic than corporate democrats like Obama or that godawful woman Hillary
>>538511541Can you explain to my how wanting a living wage for work is bad? And can you explain (without resorting to whataboutisms and ad hominems) why a politician who is fighting for a living wage for millions of people is somehow bad?
>>538511159Elon musk is a government construct.
Anyone who has a strong opinion about elon either way is likely a redditor. They worshipped him in 2019, now he's the turbo-hitler devil. Literally nobody else cares about this reddit human
>>538511785>richest man alive>you can't have an opinion on him or you're reddit
>>538511691Communists are doing it fundamentally wrong. Communism is steeped in rhetoric and philisophical idealism which is detached from the real world and thus their solutions are often pie in the sky fantasy.You can make criticism of the current system from a logical, fact-based, scientific perspective and come to reasonable solutions. But the commies will never bring you to that promisee land
>>538511159I will never forgive him for calling cave guy a pedo!!
>>538511159
>>538511811The key to understand is that he's not *actually* the richest man. That's just a meme
>>538511811I said "strong opinion". My opinion is that he's a fag. But obsessing over him is reddit behavior.
>>538511159Elon didn’t build any of that he had other people do it fucktard
>>538511691>Can you explain to my how wanting a living wage for work is bad?It isn't bad. You should want that.And if you support politicians who advocate for mass-immigration, you will never have that. Don't import direct competition for your labor then whine that you have no job.
>>538511159Bernie is betterImagine seeing two billionaires and seeing the guy that says hey I want to make things easier for you and make people that have money like me contribute more to make the country better and being like nah fuck that guy I'll take the richer guy who fires white people and replaces them with Jeets from India.For me the problem is the people.Everyone that sucks elons dick now found him insufferable for over a decade and found electric cars to be for fags.Everyone that hates elon now are the reason he was successful in the first place. They put him an a pedestal and spammed him throughout all of media. Then he changed his opinions gets involved in the government and now his once biggest supporters hate him.You people are fickle and easily swayed on both sides.Bernie has been the correct choice for over a decade.
Musk did not build anything. All he has done his entire life is steal and beg for government gibs.
>>538511438>they are only paid on the order of ~$10 millionMy last companies CEO was on $50 million.
>>538511932I guess it's like how bernie didn't build any of the houses he owns, he just bought them with taxpayer money
>>538512030I don't want a crazy commie meddling in the system. Rather I want to use the crazy commie as a threat against the Republicans that if they don't make some populist economic reforms they're going to get the crazy commie
>>538511159Elon is a jeet lover. This means he has to be insane and not in a good way.
>>538511159I hate all autists, but an occasionally based retard is better than a screeching blue-haired liberal retard.
>>538511830Nice straw man. He is not a communist but a democratic socialist. And answer the question: why is it bad people wanting a living wage and politicians fighting for a living wage?>>538511967Again, you are answering a question that hasnt been asked. Tell me how a higher minimum wage has something to do with immigration.
>>538512091That has nothing to do with my point. Nice whataboutism you got maga brain rot
>>538511438Oh wow, an actual retarded person here. Hooow aaareee yooouuu? Dooo yoouu neeed uuusss tooo caaalll someooone fooor yooouu?
>>538511159I'd like Elon again if he returned grok uncensored.
>>538512087The base salary is only a couple mill btw. The rest is "stock options" which I consider to be an exploit, but whatever. The point I'm making is that to reach these levels of accumulation you aren't doing it through free market means. You're exploiting something.
>>538512202Elon paid workers to build things with his moneyBernie paid workers to build things (with taxpayer money)It's called a 'comparison'
>>538511967Bernie understands this and is lowkey anti mass migration, he just can’t say it outright because he knows the voters (sheeple) will have a reflexive hissy fit
>>538511159>ai slop rage baitElon should die
>>538511159How about you not be a faggot and try forming your opinion.If you want to know what the collective thinks you should doz they want you to give me all your possessions and then kill yourself.
Spooderbern a cute, I would let him pet the garloids
>>538512302He's a spineless jew that says whatever DNC tells him to say. We saw that in 2016
>>538512245Make an argument or go home
>>538511350I saw it in the Simpsons!
>>538512030How do you people still fall for this shit?Bernie doesnt give a fuck about you, none of them do.
>>538512274You could achieve it through the free market, but you're right if what you mean is that Elon hasn't. Elon uses the real exploit: make the state your customer. It's by far the best way of getting rich in the modern international socialist west where the state extracts a greater proportion of generated wealth than the USSR did at its peak.
>>538511159Welfare lives up to the African stereotype. He's the biggest welfare queen on the planet, he stole all the inventions from his peers, he hates to pay his fair contribution to society, he begs for acceptance yet gloats delusionally. He says he's from the hood when he's just a privileged nigga that lived in uptown. He fathers dozens of children but isn't a father figure to none of them. He hates his father, and his children hate him in return, one of them even turned into a tranny out of spite, and consequentially he had to buy the platform that made his children troon out, and turn it into an echo chamber. He always smacks his lips and has something to say when nobody asked. He is obsessed with status and money. You could say he's the stereotypical nigger.
>>538512592all of the libbies biggest problems wouldn't exist if they just embraced small government principles and anti-migration positions
>>538511159him and his jeets use twitter to gang stalk me
>>538511159Musk is our rival, like Vegeta to Son Goku
>>538511159I can't imagine on what planet normal people would like Elon to be honest. Even if he's a rich guy, he's easily the most autistic and retarded rich guy of them all except maybe next to Dr Karp. Negative charisma
>>538512562>You could achieve it through the free marketLol no. To generate billions of dollars you must exploit others and their labor. Musk went with speculation, government subsidies and stock options to do just that.
>>538511845dude it was kayfabe lmao
>>538512736>embraced small government principles and anti-migration positionsNo because the immigration problem is rooted to the economic system. A small government with anti-immigrant policies under capitalism is an oxymoron.
>>538512968>i oppose capitalism, but can't oppose immigration because capitalism supports it!You are a retard
>>538511331Redditors actually believe this
>>538512878>speculationYou mean gambling your money by providing capital to people with ideas so they can hopefully make them real? How is that exploitation?>government subsidiesThere's the exploitation (by proxy).>stock optionsYou mean not allowing yourself to be maximally exploited by taking your pay in the form of assets that aren't immediately taxed? How is that exploitation?
>>538513051Prove Elon himself designed anything.
>>538511331you make it sound so simple
>>538511159The only people who liked him are left wingers who fell for the occupy wall street shit.No one has ever liked elon.Except for that small period of time where everyone got smug cos they thought his cars would save the world.The guys a fucking idiot.All the intelligence is in his factories, doing the actual work.
>>538512562All billionaires are exploiting something. I'll go down a list for you.First of all, I posit:1) the free market requires competition, not a monopoly2) the free market requires rational actors, not people who are addicted to something or not thinking clearly3) the free market requires open information. Information-gaps are an exploit- The Mars familySelling highly addictive candy products. Employing a deliberate strategy of buying up competitors and monopolizing shelf-space. Lobbying to make sure health standards are kept lax. ***Not free market!!-- The Walton familyOffshoring in a big way. Getting a vertical monopoly so they control the whole supply chain from production, shipping, distribution, and sale. Other stores literally cannot compete with their prices because they don't get first bid on those supply chains. They also have "local monopolies" over large swaths of the country.**Not free market!!!-- Jeff BezosHis company is a "network monopoly". Just as it's inefficient to dig up the ground twoce and lay a duplicate set of pipes to everyone's house just to provide "competition" in water delivery. In the same way it's inefficient to construct a duplicate network of distribution centers, shipping routes, and warehouses just to provide 'competition'. This is a natural monopoly.**Not free market!!-- Elon MuskGets in on the ground floor of small startups and acts as a go-between between government and the billionaire class to ensure adoption of the technology. In this way he gets to pick and choose which technologies live or die.**Not free market!!-- Michael BloombergEnabled his customers to get stock information milliseconds faster and frontrun other traders. What value did he really create?**Huge exploit!!!*I think if you went down the list, every single billionaire would be exploiting something. 100% of them
>>538511159MAGA trash love Elon. The smirking DOGE turds did what it they were supposed to, gut the government under the guise of "efficiency", all while actually costing the government more money in the long run.>>538511331>he just paid other people to do it.>he just got a ton of taxpayer dollars to pay other people to do it.FTFYFuck Elon
>>538512196>Again, you are answering a question that hasnt been asked.Again, your question was answered. >Tell me how a higher minimum wage has something to do with immigration.You aren't getting higher wages when you advocate for politicians and policies which directly undercut the value of your labor. More bodies = less demand for your labor. It's quite simple. And this is a fundamental principle of any market. I suspect you're going to ignore basic economics however and pretend you don't understand. It's a tactic leftoids are infamous for.
>>538511159Musk buying twitter was the most important event that started the cultural shift we are having right now.
>>538513240You hate Elon because you were told to. And you're jealous. Now tell me how cutting off millions of foreign moochers was somehow a "genocide". I could use a laugh.
>>538511541>He only became popular in recent years because he said some magic words that appealed to braindead leftoids.Bern has not been popular since selling out to the DNC, taking his payoff, and buying a fancy new million dollar home in North Hero, VTthe DNC defrauded him of the 2016 nomination because the DNC is a private corporation and they testified to this fact in court, arguing that as a private corporation, they can pick and choose their corporate officers as they please and the primary is but a suggestion that they are not bound to follow at all.
>>538513219too based for /pol/
>>538513276Elon is a foreign merchant who said that he wanted to switch to the Democrats after he got in a fight with Trump. the fact that someone like that can obtain citizenship here is a disgrace.
>>538513240trvke
>>538511691can you explain why min wage entry level jobs should pay like double what the market values them at?these burger flipping tier jobs were the jobs that we got at 16 and quit by the time we were 18 back in the day because there were far better options to be had and basically nobody was trying to support a family on a single min wage income
>>538513274well poisoning kike faggots will say that's a bad thing for reasons only they understand
>>538512375>>538511438What you are missing, and its why you should keep your mouth shut when talking about economy is that you become a billionaire by owning assets and stock, and increasing or having it increase. You dont get to a billion by receiving a salary
>>538513276>Now tell me how cutting off millions of foreign moochers was somehow a "genocide"LOL found the MAGA trash. nice strawman, bootlicker.the fact that DOGE cost the taxpayers much, much more than what they supposedly "saved" is well documented. You disingenuous MAGA trash fucks are always banging on about "hurr durr do you own research", which I wholeheartedly encourage. Especially if you're smart enough to actually understand what the research says, instead of listening to Dr. Joe Rogan and Dr. Alex Jones to interpret data.
Holy shit there are still people who like Elon? Despite him burning his bridges with both the left and right?
>>538513514Yeah but that's bullshit though. Money should be for work, not owning a piece of paper.How many of our best minds are trading piece of paper around on wall street instead of researching cancer cures and new technologies and stuff? I think the way the stock market works is fundamentally bullshit. I think it was delinerately set up this way by bad actors, and it's maintained because all these elites are profiting from it.Money should be for work, not "owning a piece of paper".
>>538513574go back to plebbit where people believe that globohomo trash you're typing, faggot
>>538511159always hated. a south african nigger who hired smart people to run businesses for him then he takes all the credit.
>>538511159Bernie did pretty well for himself considering his only skill is spouting socialist tropes.
>>538511438Let me help you out. They earn most of their wealth from building equity (value of a percentage ownership of a company). Let's say Tom the entrepreneur owns 50% of Company C. As a startup, it's worth zero, so 50% of the company is worth zero. But let's say he scales it to $1 million. He earns 500k for that. Not bad, but still well below enterprise ceo salaries But then let's imagine he scales it to a two billion dollar company. He just earned 1 billion. He also keeps collecting half of the profit every year after that (because he owns 50%), so if he owns a 2 billion dollar company for a decade, he makes 10 billion dollars. Does this make sense?
>>538511159how wealthy and successful would Elon be if he didn't vacuum taxpayer money to fund his companies?
>>538513757You seem to have missed the memo stating your cult is no longer allowed to like Elon due to his shilling of H1-B visas and dueling with your supreme leader on social media.
>>538513574I didn't read any of that, it's just incoherent womanly screeching. Leftoids all talk like adult children, then demand to be taken seriously lol
>>538511159Cope
>>538513240>>538513368now try again without sounds mad you lost your USAID funding.
>>538514127this tard thinking the right is like the left where they have shareblue instructing you all what to think, lmao
>>538511159Elon is like a Shark Tank angel investor. He doesn’t build anything. He just LARPs as Tony Stark in the most embarrassing way possible.
>>538513115he's a self made man with rich parents and a little emerald mine
>>538513219I don't disagree with you, except on Bezos if only because he has a ton of competitors with their own distribution networks, and on the implied point that it's impossible to become obscenely wealthy through free market means.
You'd think these retards would've realised by now that USAID was a soft power generator that allowed us to influence foreign governments rather than something as benign as a charity. Then again, Trump is very adept at obliterating America's soft power, to the point where you'd think it was intentional.
>>538514104The way the free market is supposed to work is that through the magic of supply and demand, the money you earn is directly equivalent to the value you create. If your hard work created $10 million in value, you should be paid $10 million.But the stock market acts as a sort of "magic money machine" that simply generates millions and millions totally disconnected from any work you did.First of all, whenever you make a trade based on what you think someone else is thinking, then that opens the door to speculation. I think you're thinking 'x', and you think I'm thinking 'y', and I think you're thinking I'm thinking 'z'...etc. It becomes like a hall of mirrors, infinite regress, that just opens to door to speculation. Some types of stock, like corporate debt, is very strictly disciplined. I buy in accordance to what I expect in return. But common stock is bidding for a spot on the board of directors. Which is basically, bidding for the chance that a rich person will want control of this company and buy up shares. So in that way you're bidding based on what you think someone else is thinking, and it just becomes runaway speculation.Guys like Kevin O'Leary and Mark Cuban became billionaires riding the dotcom bubble, selling worthless stock based on hype and mood. They created 0 value and wound up billionaires. If you're still not convinced, look no further than the bitcoin market. A trillion dollar market based on nothing but pure speculation.
>>538511331That other rich fag who owns Amazon also paid for rockets and shit yet he's nowhere nears Space X, how comes?
>>538511159>space litter>rare earth carwow he built so much, he put trash in space and destroyed the planet to make a car bomb
>>538511691>Can you explain to my how wanting a living wage for work is bad?It's not. Capitalism has lifted billions out of poverty, and the purpose of a nation is to benefit its people as a whole (see how Henry Ford felt about this).The problem, however, is that the reason why worker minimum wage needs to increase to be a "living wage" is not because of some nefarious mustache-twirling capitalists, it is because of currency debasement. You will never solve the problem by just saying "wage number go up" because the currency itself is being made worthless by government deficit spending and the federal reserve. We are over 40 trillion in debt and spend more on interest on our debt than we do on the entire military-industrial complex. The plan (which is why currency debasement is happening), is to print more money to reduce the value of the dollar instead of directly paying off the debt. You are right about the problem; you are completely wrong about the solution.>And can you explain (without resorting to whataboutisms and ad hominems) why a politician who is fighting for a living wage for millions of people is somehow bad?Because politicians don't actually accomplish anything for the people that they are "fighting for." What are his actual results that justify being paid for decades (through both administrations where his party has been in control and not). When you support Bernie, you are supporting the illusion of "fighting for you" against the wrong problem.
>>538514127Is the American left wing instructed by memos and has cults?
>>538514383He won the game of monopoly and became the monoplist. Still a monopolist though. He himself described his business as "fixed cost, exponential returns" and said after a certain threshold he just made infinite money. Because of economies of scale once he has enough warehouses covering enough of the country he just becomes the default supplier of everything. Other stores can't get the efficiency of scale like he can.
>>538514222USAID was always a tool of globohomo capitalism used to fund pro-US NGOs and train journalists all over the world to spread hegemonic propaganda and destabilize countries not aligned with Washington. They have always worked hand in hand with US social media platforms like Twitter. Which is why Musk will gladly suppress dissidents at home at the demand of the state department but will play the free speech card when rebels use his platform to organize their color revolutions and gain visibility.
>>538514461You aren't making sense. Because you don't consider the stock market to be real (or gambling at best), you think that is should be considered a "magic money machine" and therefore not real capitalism? Stock is a percentage ownership in a company. The company exists and its fractional ownership interests exist too. How does speculation, gambling and irrational behavior challenge the ontological status of the companies themselves?
>>538514528Some parts of it feel cultish at times certainly, you need only visit BreadTube to witness that.
>>538511691>a living wageIt's called working two jobs and having no life, boomers did it but that doesn't mean anything to recent generations, who were born with a different mindset and ease of access. Nevermind that boomers invented new jobs to ensure there was a ladder for people to climb, instead of being stuck in one position forever like their fathers were. Almost nobody today feels like they need to continually sacrifice anything or have it twisted in their minds that if they've suffered any sort of trauma in life, that they're somehow "exempt" from struggle. The struggle will only get worse as the world ages and more people are shoved into increasingly smaller spaces, so no someone else isn't going to do the job you don't want to do because they also think like you.
>>538513051True, Elon did design 1 thing, the Cyber Cuck. It's also the biggest piece of shit on wheels to ever exist. The Teslas that actually sell and retain value were designed by the founders, not Eloy
>>538514647"Efficiency of scale" and "logistics" are not sinister occult exploits. They are processes, people and technology. Do you consider anyone doing anything well to be an "exploit" and therefore "not real capitalism?"
>>538514814Tesla's products have been low quality for as long as I can remember, that company's value is derived mostly from hype generated by the obese South African.
Elon didn't do shit and his net worth is fake, because it relies on extremely overvalued companies.Elon is actually a worthless subhuman who got lucky with Paypal and since then has been surfing the jew-money wave. with all of his success actually built by his staff, not by him. If the jews wouldn't have use for him he would've gone bankrupt ages ago.
>>538511159Elon Musk is the MechaHitler that was foretold
>>538513757>globohomo trashImage typing that to support a south African who cashes in on massive government subsidies for all of his companies. While moving and doing everything he can to dodge paying taxes. Then using those gains to tinker with the very political system that is screwing you over. Resulting it it screwing you even harderAs you cheer like the midwit you are in life. Parroting bs you read on a social media platform Elon owns. Ok... You really are peasant class to your very core. You might of found an angle where you can make a decent living but your inner core is still pure servile peasant to the lordship.
>>538511331Jobs is arguably one of the only guys like that to be truly instrumental to Apple's success in a Great Man style. He tardwrangled the company back to success after taking leaves of absence from it multiple times and was instrumental in managing the aesthetics of Apple's branding, which has been its true strength as a company.Elon Musk is a retard and his own companies would probably be ran better if he just left and went away forever. His only "contribution" seems to be appealing to advance the interests of tech fascists for investment and special favors
>>538514945I can't pin your allegiance, kraut, because it sounds like you'd be an AfD shill, but Elon shills the AfD, but you don't shill Elon.
>>538514725I said this earlier: >>538513219The free market does not just automatically "work", it only works when certain conditions are met.>1) the free market requires competition, not a monopoly>2) the free market requires rational actors, not people who are addicted to something or not thinking clearly>3) the free market requires open information. Information-gaps are an exploitHuman beings are not perfect rational calculators. They are prone to moods, emotions, irrationalities like lust and gluttony. They are often not very intelligent, or lacking information. They are tribalistic, they are religious.All of these things makes them imperfect cogs in the machine of the market. As a result, the stock market basically becomes a vehicle to operationalize this for exploit. The mood swings, the greed, the information gaps, the intelligence gap, the stock market can turn this into cashflow. Particularly the speculative parts of the market where you bet based on other bets rather than a fixed outcome.There's also the simple fact of the financial system blowing this all up into overdrive, blowing up asset values everywhere. But that's another story entirely.
>>538515072>Then using those gains to tinker with the very political system that is screwing you over.quit whining that lefttards lost control over Twatter and they can no longer censor all the content to their likingfuckin shareblue retards
>>538515174Yes, I read that, and I don't agree with it, especially not the last two>the free market requires rational actorsThen, by definition, a free market of humans can never exist. It has been proven over and over again that human behavior is not rational. If a nobel prize for economics means anything to you, read the work of Simon, Shiller, Kahneman and Thaler. >Information-gaps are an exploitTell that to data and communications companies. Information management is the direct product of business processes that can be optimized (or not) and technology.To go a level deeper, do either of your beliefs there square with your real life experience? Do you find that everyone you know makes perfectly rational decisions all the time? When you read something in a book, do your friends automatically know it too? It doesn't make sense to apply a fantasy standard to real world systems and behavior.
>>538515620>rational actorsIn other words when you're choosing cereal you say"Hmm I like the taste of this cereal over that cereal"Rather than"I like this colorful box and mascot character, and I worship this company as my god!"Humans are stupid, tribalistic, and religious, and this makes advertising tactics a huge exploit. There's an entire lower class out there ripe to be exploited like wheat in the mill. >Information management is the direct product of business processes that can be optimizedLike when an engineer sells you a product he designed to break in 2 years so you're forced to buy a other. Or a mechanic claiming there's something wrong with your car. Or getting inside information about a stock, or whether this thing I'm selling causes cancer....etc.>do either of your beliefs there square with your real life experience?I have met lower class people, yes, and let me be frank, they are getting absolutely fucking raped. They fall for every scam, every sloganz every promise. These people are designed to exist in an integrated nation-state where they are looked after paternalistically, not to be thrown out to the wolves like lambs
>>538515895Ok, cool, so you are still rooted in reality, If you agree with me about irrationality, why is rationality required for a free market to exist. Regarding information asymmetry, you aren't addressing my point at all; you just listed a set of incoherent bad practices. People are irrational and knowledge isn't universal, so how can you require a system for people to have two characteristics that are empirically impossible. You also still have a strangely expansive definition of the word exploit. Also, a quick question: if two men are in a boxing match against each other, and one man is more physically fit than the other and wins, is he "exploiting" his opponent's lack of physical fitness? Is there something morally wrong about it?
>>538511438Do they not teach civics and economics in school anymore?
>>538516276>why is rationality required for a free market to existThe purpose of the market is to serve the people of course. I say the market works pretty well, but there's some issues here. I think it's kind of like a poorly programmed game filled with exploits, and we got a bunch of hackers using those exploits we call "billionaires". I say unless these exploits are patched, we're gonna go communist soon. Money should be for work. The amount you earn should be in direct proportion to the value you created. >how can you require a system for people to have two characteristics that are empirically impossible.Using empiricism to find the exploits and fixing them to the best of our ability. Just like patching bugs in a game.>if two men are in a boxing match against each other, and one man is more physically fit than the other and wins, is he "exploiting" his opponent's lack of physical fitness?So this is social darwinism, this is what Trump believes in. The idea is, it doesn't matter whst the system is, or even if it's a broken system, the strong will always top. They deserve their place there, because they were smarter and more ruthless, they earned it.No I don't belive in that. Because honestly having a powerful unified nation stare where everyone advances the whole is much, much more powerful than just having some individuals ruling a broken system, even if they are admittedly the best.
>>538511661He got kicked out of a commune because he would just sit around and whine all day instead of actually helping the community. There is nothing authentic about that old kike.
>>538516276What I gleaned from you two's conversation is that the free market is a meme because consumers aren't free in a free market, they're just captured prey on a hamster wheel as a subject of manipulation.
>>538514814>Elon did design 1 thing, the Cyber Cuck>Designer: Franz von Holzhausen
>>538511438You sound poor and probably are a gay
>>538511691You can get a job with a liveable wage, most people who function as adults have one.
>>538516654You really need to work on your reading comprehension. Try to respond to what I actually said rather than what you imagine I must secretly believe because I asked a certain question. If you respond with something more relevant to the topic than "so this is social darwinism like Trump!!111~@!" then I'll continue. >Using empiricism to find the exploits and fixing them to the best of our ability. Just like patching bugs in a game.Ok, so what is your plan to make all humans rational via empiricism (btw philosophy nerds will get a great laugh out of that)? Genetic engineering? Mind-altering drugs? Forced indoctrination into Vulcan idelology? How about your plan to instantaneously make all information available to everyone at all times? Mass surveillance, perhaps? I think both are impossible, so please let us all know what you have in mind.
>>538516750Advertising is a big problem. You can easily convince someone to buy something using very simple advertising techniques. In fact America as a whole is dominate by a huckster class, people like Trump, or Mark Cuban, or even Elon, whose whole deal is to schmooze and lie and look photogenic.
>>538511350HE DOESN'T HAVE AN ENGINEERING DEGREEIt's like claiming to be a doctor without going to med school. He's just a hypeman that promises bullshit which won't happen (robotaxis, humanoid robots)
>>538517041>what is your plan to make all humans rational via empiricism??? There isn't one. We design the system to match human needs not the other way around. Humans are tribalistic, humans are a bit irrational. So deal with it, accomodate it. The answer isn't going to be a simple monotonic solution, it'll be complex. That's ok.
>>538516750Yes, "the free market" as currently thrown around in American politics is a meme. But there is a real policy distinction between "people are imperfect, they should be able to live their imperfect lives freely, even if it occasionally yields absurd results it is better for everyone on balance" versus "people are imperfect, and I have decided to change that because people should not be free to make their own decisions." Read about the Great Leap Forward in China for an example of what happens when bureaucrats decide that they know better than nature and individuals.
>>538517241No Elon is smart in the scientific sense. There's no denying that. I don't think he's a trillion dollars smart, but he is absolutely an extremely smart person. I recognize a lot of the things he says from my scientific communities, he carries the same torch.
>>538517246Ok great. So let's get back to first principles here. I argued that your definition of "free market" is inappropriate because it does not align with human behavior or reality. If you agree with me that your definition does not align with human behavior or reality, what have we learned here about your definition? Is it reality and humanity that needs to change, or just your definition?
>>538511159You can like if you want but he's a retarded mongoloid South African nigger who needs to go the fuck back to Africa and fuck himself with that useless botched penile implant.
>>538517241Where did Isaac Newton get his physics degree? Where did Pythagoras get his math degree? Where did the Wright Brothers get their aviation science degrees? Where did you get your drinking water and breathing air degree? You don't have institutional credentials for that, and yet you are still doing it. How dare you.
>>538517491The free market is a solution that works when certain conditions are satisfied. If humans were perfect rational calculators, it would be the perfect system. Ayn Rand utopia here we come.But sadly humans are not that way. So obviously our solution needs some elements of a free market economy, but it's gonna need other aspects too. See a communist wouldn't talk like this at all. They don't think human beings have a inborne nature. They don't think there should be any market solutions. They don't believe in empirical thinking. A communist would be way out on Mars.That's what I was saying earlier. The critiques of this system and the solutions have to from this type of rational thought process, the ideological religious fury of the communist only results in dead bodies
>>538511331He’s not dumb. But if his iq is 150 and yours is 130, he’s not that much smarter than you.Entrepreneur shit is actually pretty difficult. He deserves some credit, but it doesn’t outweigh his Epstien, drug, gay Reddit behaviour.
>>538517730Once again, reading comprehension. Did I say that you were a communist? Did I mention communism at all? I am saying that your personal definition is useless because it has no empirical basis.
>>538517787I don't think the tribulations of an entrepreneur are that much more difficult than a scientist or mathematician. But it requires a type of higher testosterone, alpha personality that's very hard to squeeze through the school system as we've set it up. That's why it's usually immigrants.
>>538517127You could argue it's a problem in politics as well, hence why people were angry about unlimited political donations likely tipping a playing field.>if two men are in a boxing match against each other, and one man is more physically fit than the other and wins, is he "exploiting" his opponent's lack of physical fitness?This analogy also caught my eye as too much of an over-simplification, since in your free market the man with less bets may win, similarly to how the electoral college may overrule popular vote in politics. Fitness is one metric, not the only one and the market isn't played by a single factor, maybe the other guy has a haymaker up his sleeve or wins on technicality, whatever. The "more fit" man may be a less risky bet in superficial context but his pay out is smaller, the "less fit" man pays out more although he may be riskier.>>538517299People should be free to make their own decisions ideally, in practice that will create instabilities that compound over time, there's a valid argument to be had that you can't plan consistently for random circumstance. I've read about China's Great Leap Forward, it's relatively wonderful if taken at face value but also vile in its full context with the effects it had and still has on the rest of the "freer" world. I would argue its "leap" was the product of weaponized capitalism and exploitation of the west's overall greed, it was bound to happen as communism had no other choice but to adopt the weapon that would have inevitably destroyed it from the outside-in. A "less greedy" west directly harms China and would likely result in mass famine there, so I'm obviously not against some controls in our markets. People are approaching this issue from the wrong angle, the intent isn't simply to have people make do with less, it's that we were too comfortable from the start against an enemy willing to do anything to take us down.
Bernie is too busy propping up rapists to build anything
>>538511159elon didnt build things he bought things other people built
He's the darling of the left with all the electric cars, being African and doing liberal Star Trek stuff.
>>538518647No he doesn't. It's mostly invested and working in the value of his companies. How silly of you. He couldn't cut a check for half a trillion to the treasury if he wanted to.
>>538516911Everyone always memes Elon is le heckin nazi but I can actually see Franz or Lars being actual secret nazis.
>>538518798you're a smert goyim tho
The real tech genius of our time didn’t get his first job at a bank like Elon Musk, a financial conman who befriended the right people at the right time. The real tech genius of our time is Palmer Lucky. Next to sam bankman fried, he is one of our greatest young minds.
>>538518984He gave me a high five long long ago so he's cool and down to Earth. He also loves children which I want to aquire one someday too.
>>538519075No. He likes Fate.
>>538511159But then he went crazy and into the deep end. Whatever credibility that shill had is gone. Dudes probably a puppet.
"Built" is doing a lot of work in that picture.He was a rich brat of an emerald mine owner who threw his money in things. That's not building. It's vulture capitalisms.
>>538519469Sounds like you're in the copezone, lil commie
>>538518882wtf is he doing i hate him so much
>>538519637Also his Epstein shit makes him an instant fail.
>>538519140>He also loves children which I want to aquire one someday too.
>>538511331He hypes it actually. Gets investment. That is important and shouldn't be discounted. I'm just sick of the deification of him.
>>538511159>implying a bald scam artist with fake and gay hair is better than a civil right activistdo better
>>538521022>bald scam artistbut enough about bernie
>>538521022His hair is real. It's growing and everything.
>>538521443>look mommy i made a funny post. youre proud of me mommy.
>>538521609butthurt reddit fag
>>538514490He bet on the wrong candidate in 2024
>>538511159Elon didn't build anything.
>>538511438>1) It is theoretically impossible for someone to earn a billion dollars in their lifetimewhen you say "earn", do you mean "get paid by others for work you've done"? eg: have a job or clients? or, does it include investing? if the latter, then, 100%, a person could earn a billion dollars in their lifetime. many have.
we hate AIniggers
>>538522288RoflAnd Paul Hogan did?
>>538515075>well jobs cant be bad because of how successful his companies became>but ELON MUSSSSKKKKKK!Faggot. Before you say brain dead things, re read your post as someone who doesnt care about the retarded bullshit you care about, and see how it comes across.
>>538511159>BurnieA jeet made that photo
>>538516922You are poor. Everyone using 4chan is poor.Retard.
>>538511159>Do we like or hate Elon Musk now? I can't remember.Ethical people hate him, piles of rat shit like you lick the ground he pisses onElon is only rich because his mommy's family, the Haldemans, are very old Swiss German central banker mafia who literally hold the global government charter to print currency itself, and they megapump it right into his bank accounts so he buy up other people's hard work inventions and claim he invented them himselfSo you and all the rest of your Wormtongue kind, you stay on your knees and keep tossing his salad like the good lickspittle lackeys you are
>>538511331And the money he uses to buy things is secretly minted into existence just for him by his mommy's Swiss-German global central banker family, the HaldemansAnd Bill Gates's mommy's family does the exact same thing for him because they are the Maxwell banking mafia family that is regional directors of the Federal ReserveYou can follow Alex loudsnout Jones for a zillion years and he'll never tell you about any of thing because he's actually a secretly sold-out agent of Switzerland and its global central banker mafia
Elon is an opportunistic and savvy takeover specialist and mainly his skill is hype
>>538523714>Ethical people hate him,Youre not ethical. You like sucking cock for one. Get over yourself You hate him because of a combination of jealously, and politics. Then you reverse rationalize it. Its pathetic.
>>538523983Rich people help their kids?Someone stop the presses! We got a first page news story right here!Here's a question you've never considered in your entire life, why SHOULD the rich care if you live, die or struggle?
>>538524043No, I hate him because he's a degenerate cheater and a false-facade-obsessed con manHe thinks because he's Swiss Aryan he's magically entitled to have the entire table steeply tilted in his favorSo you can take your Ayn Rand dogma-propaganda and ram it right up your ass
>>538524231>No, I hate him because he's a degenerate cheater and a false-facade-obsessed con man>cheaterLike... on the women in his life? Lol is that what you're referring to here?Show tits slut. Then come back when you can come to terms with the lies you surround yourself with. Namely, that you give a single fuck about ethics or morality
>>538524343As I already said in my very first post on this thread, YOU LOW-IQ INBRED ALCOHOLIC BIGMOUTH, he "cheats" by having his mommy's Swiss-German global central banker Nazi mafia family literally mint up mountains of money for him to gobble up whatever he likes, and part of his buying things up is the stipulation that he will then get to lie about HIMSELF inventing everythingThat's how he cheats -- he doesn't have to do the lion's share of actual work to "make" his money; he simply has it cheated into existence for him by Mummy and her side of the family
>>538513051Tesla inventors and founders.
>>538514725Dude isn't common practice in America for big companies to ask big banks for big dollars and then to invest in their own stocks and then pay the banks with the added value? And then do everything again?Isn't your economy like 80% based on this one jewish trick?
>>538524713Still waiting for those tits slut
>>538525626Right after you show your teeny little skin tag of a microweenis first, Timmy
>>538511159Millions of veterans have better Medicare because Bernie Sanders secured billions in funding for them. Companies run by men like Elon Musk were using child labor to increase profits until Bernie Sanders secured regulations cracking down on it. He's literally called 'the king of amendments' because he's managed to pass so much legislation promoting his agenda.Implying he's done nothing but "complain" is just straight up fucking lying.
>>538525852>TimmySo youre an Indian slut? Pass. Dont like brown nipples
>>538511159Epsteinite subhumanWere he to appear before me I'd become a murderer
>>538525884you completely forgot about all of Bern's votes that favored the banks pretty much any time there was banking shit he had to vote on
>>538526196Are you retarded or something? How does that have anything to do with what I just said? The fact that you don't like his agenda is irrelevant to a conversation about whether he's managed to achieve any of it.The point is op implied he's done nothing but complain. That's objectively false.
>>538526562Imagine trying to talk up Bernie in 2026 lol.
>>538526651>he's old news goy just forget about him goy
>>538526562that's true, aside from complain he's worked to undermine the USA with socialist memes that are unlawful for the fedgov to implement, aside from helping protect the banks every time he had a chance
