The Managerial Revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race
They have a blind spot, its the same blind spot that humanity has always had. Namely, the hubris and illusion of control. The spreadsheet can only measure what it can quantify, not everything can be quantified. Henceforth, the future lies in understanding the limits of the algorythm that is being used, and use it against itself. Hercules cleaned the Augean stables, by redirecting a river and washing away all the filth. It is regardless, if this is mythology, laws or tech algorythm, the principel is the same. >be Hercules
>>538732071Everything can be measured. But not understood. Some measurements are so high dimensional, even their low dimensional shadows do not make sense.Hercules did not get paid by King Augeas or King Eurystheus despite finishing the task efficiently like a modern day engineer. The keepers of power will not leave without a fight. And they will not recognize any your contributions.
>>538732312Can they fight? Can they actually stand on their own? Their resistance takes the form of spiteful tampering of systems and processes. But their usefulness ends insofar as they are unable to actually manage anything. And depending how bad the consequences of what the reek are they may well be imprisoned or killed. And none of them want that.
>>538732312>The keepers of power will not leave without a fight. And they will not recognize any your contributions.Why do you pine for their approval, if you think they are illegitimate? Build parralel structurs, the story of the green grocer is praticularly telling: >Havel's greengrocer>Havel uses the example of a greengrocer who displays in his shop the sign Workers of the world, unite! Since failure to display the sign could be seen as disloyalty, he displays it and the sign becomes not a symbol of his enthusiasm for the regime, but a symbol of both his submission to it and humiliation by it. Havel returns repeatedly to this motif to show the contradictions between the "intentions of life" and the "intentions of systems", i.e. between the individual and the state, in a totalitarian society.>An individual living within such a system must live a lie, to hide that which he truly believes and desires, and to do that which he must do, to be left in peace and to survive. This is comparable to the classical tale of "The Emperor's New Clothes.">[T]hey must live within a lie. They need not accept the lie. It is enough for them to have accepted their life with it and in it. For by this very fact, individuals confirm the system, fulfill the system, make the system, are the system.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Power_of_the_Powerless#Havel's_greengrocerJust start by pointing out the shortcoming of the spreadhseet, they will go mad
>>538731859i like robert conquest aswell. https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/conquests-laws-john-derbyshire/
>>538731859pareto's foxes and lions are cool also. https://www.eugenewei.com/blog/2017/3/6/paretos-two-types-of-elites-lions-and-foxes
>>538731859>The Managerial Revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the human racewait... we were racing?
>>538731859>Managers will not leave without a fightWhat is that even supposed to mean?What an absurdly stupid thing to say.There is no "manager" conspiracy to rule the world, you retard. Managerialism is the logical consequence of a society complexifying and attempting to eke out more efficiency and productivity.
>>538732806Yes
>>538732586Why did Hercules seek approval from King Augeas or King Eurystheus?Sometimes the right way to become legitimate power is through populism which can be legitimized through full communion and approval from existing sources of power and legitimacy.Spreadsheets aren't so easy to beat BTW. The logic of financial/logical sustainability of a human action measured through imperfect methods has its utility. This is how both engineering and management work, not to mention capital, and even raw power of the mafia we call the government.
>>538731859managerialism isn't necessarily bad when the goal isn't to enrich the jew
>>538732847It means those Indian CEOs will fire you to replace you with Subservient Saars if you try to automate their job with AI.
>>538733054Well there was a epistemic reason i invoked a mythological figure Anon. This stuff cannot be caclucated into a cost benefit analysis. If it could, you are doing the exact same fallacy that the mangerial elite is doing. Like i said before, I never said to abandon the spreadhseet, you shoudl just become aware of its limitations. The one who knows most about all the possible ways a system can fail, we call these people experts.
>>538732847>attempting to eke out more efficiency and productivity.I work on a team with 8 managers and 3 code monkeys.
>>538731859how do we dismantle the managerial class? I feel burnham would recognize its a lot of jews and write a sequel were he alive now
>>538731859they all need to be Luigi'd
>>538733265i think conquest would also.
this dovetails into the topic well also. https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/45401718.Auron_MacIntyre
MANAGERMAN AGERmaking men older, via stress for example
>>538733230Ironically, your aversion to the striking inefficiencies of our system, amplified by things like Diversity Inclusion Equity, is part of the managerial impetus in itself. It's baked into the cake.
>>538732312>We run everything. >t. Kike Woah...so profound...
>>538731859did you see the news about microsoft? they have 14 layers of management
>>538734164I'm not averse to inefficiency anon. I'm averse to having eight bosses breathing down my neck.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wqQXu13tLA
>>538732847>Managerialism is the logical consequence of a society complexifying and attempting to eke out more efficiency and productivity.This is funny since it's the exact opposite. Managerialism is what happens when simple hierarchical authority is fractured and responsibility and power get dissolved into a mushy pool of procedure and exception handlers. It's not efficient or productive it's organizational entropy, sclerotization.
Iron law of bureaucracy
>>538732586Side note but I've always thought this Havel's Greengrocer thing is stupid and fetishized by liberals/capitalists. A greengrocer is a worker, he has to get up early, buy veg at the market, bring it back to the store, put it on display, clean out the old veg that is going bad, keep the store clean, mind the books etc. etc. It's not better or worse than any other occupation like factory work or building houses, just different kinds of work serving different needs.I suspect capitalism believers glommed onto this because they like to believe that inside every greengrocer is a supermarket chain tycoon waiting to get out. Maybe that's how Havel felt himself, or he had some sort of will to power that made him seethe over the job he was in. But what about greengrocers who just like supplying vegetables?
>>538734888>Iron law of bureaucracyWhat did Kek mean by this?
>>538735029way to miss the metaphor Anon. The point of the metaphor, is that it is something ordinary. Just as you noticed, the vegtable related activites are operational to the actual craft of selling vegtables. The putting the sign "workers of the world unite is not". In capitalist terms, this is the "tax" of doing buisness under a totalitarian communist regime. However, here is the agency Havel points out, he simply has not to put the sign out. That litte action is enough. Everyone has to come to their own conclusion of how much "resitance" they want to put up. It is about the PRESUMMED compliance.
>>538733265Stop giving them your capital to manage.Stop patronizing companies listed on the stock exchange.Use cash locally.Bank locally.Invest your pension and savings in gold.
>>538731859>Managers will not leave without a fightHow many of them will need to be executed to get them back in line?
>>538736277I completely get this, it's the premise I don't agree with; the assumption that the grocer is somehow forced to put this up. Havel's whole argument is rooted on the assumption that nobody actually wants to do so. As a comparison, it's very common to see the American flag in stores here. Some stores definitely just put it up because it's good marketing or because they don't want to field questions from busybodies about why they don't have a flag on display, which would be parallel to Havel's argument. But lots of people put up American flags because they just like it. If I were going by Havel's assumption I would have to assume that nobody really wants to but they all feel they have to; however I don't think this is the case. btw I'm Yuropian so I don't feel socially programmed to approve any appearance of an American flag.
>>538736574I like Girad's notion of mimetic desire here, it is just soemthing everyone does. It is a presumed step to achiving conformity. The grocer assumes, that in order to be a succesful green grocer they have to put the sign up "because everyone does it". But everyone else does it, because it everyone else does it ... etc. So the point is, you do not actually know if it is an empty ritual, or if it is actually an enforced coercion of the state. Most of the things that people think are teh state spying on you, is in reality just the panopticium like internalised self-governance. So by being "rebelious" in the small scale, people can reclaim agency and dignity.
>>538732806A frantic drift towards nothing. Biology doomed to an infinite recursive loop. Teeth with teeth with teeth. Take a bite.
>>538736702This is reasonable, but it still excludes the possibility that the grocer might actually buy into the whole idea and put up a poster to express pride in the work he does. I feel like there's an intellectual conceit here along the lines of 'if you were as smart as me you would not do this because it is just socially conditioned' whether you get that from Girard or Foucault or whoever. I tend that way myself but at the same time age has forced me to recognize that a lot of the time people just unironically like things.
>>538737324Absolultey, the masses are far more approving of totalitarinism than the intelgentsia like to think. Prussian militarism for example, was built from the ground up, through public education, not for the benfit of the indvidual but for that of the state. People internalise these value hierachies and identify themselves with it.
>>538731859they can fight back all they want, but at the end new companies without the dead weight will rise and outcompete the ones they manage to hold in.
>>538734164Ok, so you are some Swiss guy maybe at BIS or WEF or maybe just a fanboy that is shitting up world mountain Jew style and proud of it.. gonna be kinda hlarious if / when Swiss rivers turn into the Ganges in the next 100 years thanks to you people and everything that you do.. maybe then some of you will start to develop some kind of a conscience about something
