China's real-estate market is dead. total collapse imminent
>>539554298They want real estate to be cheap. It's intentional.
Based. Wish we would do that.Housing should be for housing, not for investment.
>>539554298*checks every single object around me*"made in PRC"hmm why type PRC, shouldn't it be USA? must be some kind of mis-spelling*checks china*cheap fully self-driving EVssci-fi megacities, cheap real estatetotal safetyluxury high-speed rail all over the placearguably the best food in the worldthe list goes on and ondef just propaganda, 100%yeah i agree OP, you're totally not a faggot, china is collapsing big time and the west is thriving like never before
>>539554704God bless our Asian brothers in China and all Asian nations, including Russia
>>539554298OH NO, THEY WILL BE ABLE TO AFFORD HOUSES?
>>539554401>cheapretard, it's 'cheap' because the people who bought that shit started to default
>>539554298I dont know why americans love extremely expensive real state... what was china supposed to do? follow the example of the japanese and let the real state bubble inflate until it destroys the entire economy?
Infographics thumbnail. Wtf are you 12 or have a learning disability to watch their videos?
Which is completely intended by the Chinese government to make living more affordable for families btw.
this time for sure
>>539554934>let the real state bubble inflate until it destroys the entire economyThat is already going on.It's just hitting the population first, that's why shills can pretend it's not happening.
>>539554845>defaultNo. China actually subsidizes its citizens. Invests in its own homeland. In Stark contrast to our Faggot-Kike-Nigger-Lite zog. Nice try.
>>539554845A bunch of real estate companies went bust and were nationalized. Not a single person lost their home or house, just paper value got re-estimated. Who cares?
>>539554298Everyone lives in a home they own including young single people because supply far outweighs demand. The only people loosing out on this are speculators.
good they eat dogs I hope god judges them
>>539555087The bubble in China has already been popped buddy. You are late to the party.
>>539554298It will start to collapse in 14 days. That is two (2) weeks.
>>539555116You retarded monkey nigger.The citizens are paying out their asses already to prop up the failing sector. The government shilled housing for years at this point and completely misjudged the demand.
>>539554845Wrong you retard
>>539555231china shills housing for people to live in, the west as a jewish ponzi scheme to make shekels
>>539555087China intentionally popped the bubble back in 2016 I think. Thats why housing there is so cheap that basically everyone can afford own their own home.
>>539555128>Not a single person lost their home or houseAnother retarded nigger shill. You probably don't believe there are homeless chinks either.
>>539555231Homeownership in China is 95%. In Germany it's about to drop below 30%.Houses are for living, not speculation.
>>539555326I have been to China 3 times. Never seen a single homeless person. In Germany you don't even have to leave the airport for them.
>>539555335>>539555318>>539555317>>539555244You retarded chink shills think your bullshit going to sway anybody.
Homes are consumer goods
>>539554298When did they go from sucking the chink nutsack to doing stuff like this?Did Mao's check bounce?
>>539554298Two more weeks. Trust the plan
Few have the courage, but it must be said: When prices finally collapse there should be a hunt for those that sold when prices where high, and they must pay compensation for fraud and mispricing.
>>539555423>I have been to China 3 times. Never seen a single homeless person. In Germany you don't even have to leave the airport for them.just kys
>>539555423>Never seen a single homeless person
>>539555454The current German government now wants to make the nationalization of large real estate firms illegal to prevent future governments from doing what China did in order to makes houses more affordable and protect corporate landlords and large real estate businesses. We might see the first draft of the law by the end of the year.
>>539555557Can read shit in that AI generated image.
>>539554704b-b-but i saw a chinese cctv webm.... that means china bad...
>>539554298This is just seething about them prioritising the people over a few kike billionares who own all the property.Real estate investors are a special type of subhuman.
>>539555524>and they must pay compensation for fraud and mispricingIt's all a government racket, chinks will be thrown into the meat grinder while party officials keep living in villas and locked off neighborhoods.
>>539554298It's dead because most people in China actually own a house.
>>539555423While I only saw a few bums, they were seriously fucked up when they were bums. Missing limbs, rolling around on a furniture mover, shit like that. I will say Shanghai was surprisingly clean.
>>539555609>it's AIthe war cry of the chink shill
>>539555656>tofu dregs condo that'll collapse any day is a "house"Lol, too bad they cant own land.
>>539555656>actually own a houseThey pay for years out of their asses before they own anything.And with the chink flu a ton of people went bankrupt and got forced out of their apartments and houses because the banks and the state don't give a shit about debtors protection.
>>539554298
Real estate sector in China:90% of Chinese people live in their own homes, ~5% rent from closes family members, another ~5% of people are renting from someone else, among this number are most university students.Real estate sector in Germany:70% of Germans rent, usually from large corporate landlord syndicates that are owned by banks and financial institutions, some of which are foreign-owned. 30% of Germans own property but among those only 20% are your classical middle class homeowner. They are not really considered middle class anymore, because being a homeowner is already putting you into the upper class category automatically in a country where most people are rentslaves.
>>539555454>>539555557This is Deepak. Our newest shill. How is he doing guys?>>539555569Sir, when will my salary come?
invest in india and mexico saars :^)>>539554845you just outed yourself as a mutt
>>539555947hey another wumao
>>539555890Paying rent all your life like the average German is not paying out of your ass? German rent payments are now reaching 40-50% share of income in German cities. The average Chinese mortgage payment is way. less than this.
>>539556020>>539555746Nobody in the US "owns" the land they live on either.
>>539556020You are free to point out any accuracy.
>>539555317>china shills housing for people to live inwhy lie? CCP literally shilled houses for investment and told people to take on multiple mortgagesnow chinese are left with multiple mortgages on rapidly depreciating houses, only the mortgages don't depreciateCCP builders get rich, Chinese people get poor, lots of houses won't even be finished
>>539556063Sure thing crazy person
>>539556020Hello glownigger that can't form an actual argument
>>539556005No he's Deepak in Germany. Kumar is the mutt in America.
>>539554401consumer inflation in china is about 4% a year and core inflation is about 1%.home prices to remain stable should therefore increase by at least 1% a year. Or after 25 years they'd about about 30% up. That's a "flat" market.But prices are where they were 25 years ago after rising.you can cope all you like, but that's a crash
>>539556037>The average Chinese mortgage payment is way. less than this.ahaha, faggotLook at the prices in all the major places down the third tier cities, there is a reason why sea monkey lands are swarming with rich chinks now.
>>539556037proof for your claims?
>>539554298What's wrong with this? Why shouldn't housing be cheap? People live in them. China has a billion people, housing should be cheap as dirt.
>>539556133>glowThere's that retard main character energy.
>>539556112>doesn't know what eminent domain islmao
>>539554637>>539554298OH FUCKING NOOOOOOYOU MEAN POOR PEOPLE WILL GET TO OWN A HOUSE TOO???SONOFABITCH note: don't 9/10 people own there houses anyways
>>539556233What percent of US land has been seized in imminent domain cases?
>>539556107>literal whoKekSure they did
>>539555454my little bro returned home from a trip to Hainan/Hong Kong. this month, the HSK got made harder. everyone with brains is turning to China, but sure, let all upper-middle class boomies listen to Zeihan and put mortgages on all their mcmansions and invest on even more rentierism bullshit
>>539556107The vast majority of people never went beyond their first property. A bunch of fat cats got fucked. And who cares? A small price to pay for housing to become affordable for everyone. When the party banned private tutoring cram schools to make education less competitive and more affordable do you think anyone was crying about these parasitic businesses? Lmao.
>>53955429895% home ownership> muh landlords
>>539554298when bug foids are desperate to pay five figures for a green card then I'll be listening. until then fuck off
>>539556133>glowniggerthe moment the thread was up it was swarming with chink shillsthat's how pathetic commy shills are, coming to fucking 4chan of all places to spout their faggotry like nobody is going to oppose it
>>539554401No they don't. It was like the one thing the average chink was allowed to invest in or something. A guy I know from China told me about it years ago and how fucked up it was then. This could all be bullshit propaganda of course, but it's also possible the problems have gotten worse over there.
>>539556165Take the L mate, you're not doing well
>4tUty+4N
>>539556170Depending on where you live the rents are high, just like in every developed nation, but people are not forced into spilling all their money into worthless housing as an only investment option.
Two more weeks until TOTAL collapse
>>539554401This is a midwit take. No one wants LESS capital value in their economy you nigger. Learn some basic economics.
>>539555163It's still popping, didn't hit rock bottom yet.It's a slow motion controlled demolition like Japan's, actually this one will likely be even slower because of capital controls.
>>539554298>total collapse imminentwtf the 3 gorges dam just flew over my house!
>>539556469Post nose
>>539556415Get out of Australia you fucking parasite.
>>539556300Enough that a cursory google search lists multiple examples over the decades.
holy shit these kind of doom and gloom videos about china have been going on for DECADES.
>>539554298How long until we get threads showing us cheap houses in China by a faggot OP asking why we don't buy them?
>>539556469But shouldn't housing be plentiful? I think everyone should be able to own a home.
>>539556443You think that makes up for the execution vans?
>>539556534>You must be a jew to comprehend that no government wants their economy to lose value.
>>539556326>literal whoDeng Bibo, County Party Committee Secretary of Shimen.>>539556337>the CCP shill property as an investment to bail out CCP builders and steal from chinese people, and that's a good thing!
>>539556443In China even people in big cities can afford property. Also investing in real shit instead of the property is a good thing for the Chinese macroeconomy. The real estate sector is fundamentally a parasitic force, even Adam Smith knew this.
>>539556429Don't bully Kumar.
>>5395542982 more weeks
>>539556639>propertybut not landyou can only lease land
>>539556636>memeflaglike clockwork
>>539556633>Two rich people paying each other 1M to eat a bowl of shit adds 2M to the economy Kek
>>539556636You can complain about homeless people and you can complain about housing ceasing to be an investment and speculation option but you can't do both. You can only choose one. Which one do. you choose?
>>539556469capital is what you use to make things. rentierism is a tax on an economy that makes it less competitive. your country produces only sexual perversions, so it's understandable you don't know the concepts.
>>539556710Which is true of literally every sovereign nation on Earth.
real estate isn't supposed to be an investmentif home prices rise faster than inflation, it necessarily means more and more future citizens won't be able to afford onethis means they'll eventually run out of fools able to take on those 50 year mortgages and the market will correct catastrophicallyspeculation is the enemy of good economics>>539556633there is no "value" hereit's an unsustainable ponzi scheme whereby the current generation parasitizes the future ones
>>539556563>13 seethe postsKek
The actual problem here is that aspirationally wealthy Chinese people were using real estate as their primary investment vehicle and overbuilt by a few hundred million homes. So with the price collapsing, a lot of people's life savings were wiped out and they still owe whatever debts they used to acquire the homes, including the ones that were sold on spec and never built.The positive side effect of this is that rent is unbelievably cheap, lowering the cost of living for the average Chinese person. So on net it's actually great for lower class people.But also now, China needs some new way to create a retirement vehicle, because they are unwilling to do it through equities and debt or allowing Chinese to own foreign property. The real estate slow down also means that source of tax revenue will decline, so they will have to figure out some significant fiscal reforms to keep everything operating smoothly. They are intelligent though, they will figure something out.
>>539555569Looks comfy and cleaner than india.
>>539556710De facto you can also only lease land in the US. All property rights in the end are just at the pleasure of your government. Thousands of people all over the US are currently losing their homes because of new data. centers property rights be damned, welcome to the real world kiddo.
>>539556636>Deng Bibo, Secretary of the Shimen County Party CommitteWow, you don't get much higher than that
>>539556725No bigger meme than 基本盘 hiding in canada like rat.
>>539556778wrong, third generation land owner here, impossible in china>>539556797chink shill, you better leave and hope some cunts not going to bash your face even flatter
>>539556833A bunch of fat cats got fucked over. Who cares? Their sacrifice is appreciated.
>>539554704>cheap fully self-driving EVsThese things atomize or go up in flames if you look at them funny, no one fucks over Chinese like other Chinese>sci-fi megacitiesFew rows of skysrcapers covered in neon, go a few miles away from them and you would be excused for thinking you were in a rural village>cheap real estatePeople are putting their life savings in houses that crumble to dust or are never finished, your allowed to be there for a few decades and fuck off>total safetyYoull either be crushed by falling bits of a brand new building collapsing, drown in a tunnel in your car because all drainage holes are fake or any other fun freak accident>luxury high-speed rail all over the placeLucury high-speed fatalities all over the place>arguably the best food in the worldEnjoy some gutter oil with your virgin piss eggs, perhaps wash it down with some some refreshing Baijiu
>>539556846kek, imminent domain cases are still really rare.You spent that card wumao, it doesnt work
>>539556938This is why Nokia lost.
>>539556913>if you disagree with me you are chineseretard confirmed
>>539556793did the DSA tell you that at one of their cope sessions?
>>539556469it's a subwit take or I'm a ceiling fan
>>539554298chinks already work for next to nothing.total collapse just means they work for state rations, instead of pretend monopoly money
>>539556913>third generation land owner hereIrrelevant, your family could have owned land since the first settlers arrived in the North America and the government would still have the ultimate right to claim it per eminent domain.
>>539556887You lied and got caught. Perhaps you shouldn't lie about things you clearly know nothing about.
>>539556778completely wrong, dumbass.
>>539556751Just as I thought, you have no comprehension of economics. Stick to talking about drop bears, you abbo bogan
>>539554298>2 more weeksGo back to IndiaGet out from CanadaJeet Fecaloid
>>539556967>>539556797Don't bully Deepak. We are understaffed.
>>539554298That channels funny. It made 100000000000 videos about putler and based ukraine but exactly 0 (zero) videos about Israel/Gaza. Isn't that weird?
>>539554298Just import millions of jeets no?
>>539557028Renting isn't the economy. Read some fundamental economics like Adam Smith, kid.
>>539557003kek, you think that happens all the time dont you?what percent of landowners in the US had property taken under imminent domain in the last 10 years?
>>539556288>memefag>"thinks" someone with a fucking mortgage owns their fucking houseFucking. Lying. Jews.
>>539557007Uh no ESL, that's called sarcasm, it's a literal who, show xi or a person with power stating it and you'd have a point
>>539556833>rent is unbelievably cheapit's not for as long as the demand stays up, only places that are being abandoned see reluctantly falling pricesall major cities still have an influx of inhabitants, got even worse once they rolled the permit system back
>>539557011A piece of paper will not protect "your" land if the government really wants it.
>>539554298>This time for reaaaalllllllllllllllllmao
>>539554298Houses in China are like 30x the median wages, they are not cheaper for the locals lmao.
>>539556920It's not just fat cats, it's whoever had enough savings to invest. Chinese bonds and equities provided fairly poor returns for the amount of economic growth they had and they have limited options to do any kind of foreign investment.So there is some issue here with rugging normal people, but in context, the problem is a fine one to have. Shelter is extremely cheap, which allows for increased savings and consumption of other goods.There's quite a lot of inflow of physical gold and numismatics into China right now because it's a kind of way to store and accumulate wealth that won't immediately get rugged by state policy.
>>539556913>>539557011if you pay property tax, you don't own your land
>>539557028>Nooo! you can't point out how flawed muh jewish economics are Wrong
>>539557003Can be fought in court, try that in china.>>539556967chink shill, don't even deny it>>539557041saar
>>539557100Nothing got 'worse' because all these policy decisions are undertaken with those things in mind you retard. Why? Because contrary to the German government the Chinese one is immune to corporate lobbying.
>builds ghost towns for 25 years to pump the census and drive up construction/material costs world wide. Wut happened...
>>539557162according to you, and no one else.
>>539557099>or a person with power stating itI did, it proved you a liar and you did not like that.It was big drama in China because they tricked people to steal from people. They did exactly what you claim they did not.Chinese know, but you are not Chinese so you know nothing.
>>539557159>normal people'Normal people' weren't able to afford multiple properties and shit. What is. this nonsense. 90% of people can only afford property, the one they are living in. Real estate investment is a luxury. What is this nonsense.
>>539557240He fell for the ghost town propaganda
>>539556469I want far less (((venture capital))) in every economy. Using (((money))) to "make" (((money))) is a great sin and should be illegal.
>>539557275When will deng boy take Xi's place?
>>539556469Holy fuck you have to be trolling, nobody is this economically illiterate.Zimbabwe is not succesful, learn economics, you're white trash.
>>539557209>policy decisions Such as, faggot? >Chinese one is immune to corporate lobbyingahaha, there is no separation between regime and chink cooperation, hands in both buckets. Only a retarded shill thinks they are going to leave money behind.
>>539557028You are poor because you have no skills or education, you're an economic illiterate with zero education
>>539557289In China, most people own property, typically their ancestral home in a rural area or a home in their home town. With the influx of people into larger "Tier 1/2/3" cities over the past half century, people have saved up enough of their earnings to buy a home in these cities as well. So owning multiple properties is a fairly common thing in China.
>>539557289>Real estate investment is a luxuryYou are the dumbest fucking shill, it's the only way for chinks to bunker their money in any way.
>>539557177>Nooo! you can't point out how flawed muh jewish economics arejewish economics is most popular Chinese economics, they are best with money, everybody studies and uses and Xi Jinping Thought is Marxist thought, also jewish
>>539556107An easy solution is to outlaw the collection of any loan used in housing from private citizens. Fuck jews and (((banks))), they can eat the costs and starve to death like the parasites they are.
I've heard this before I'm sure.
>>539557408We were effectively talking about multiple properties in form of investments, not some ancestral piece of land in some village backwater. More bad faith nonsense.
>>539557446And most people put their money into the one property they own and live in. You lack basic reading comprehension.
>>539557446>the only waySo what are they doing with their savings now? No one buys apartments, prices are still going down.
>>539557390Kill yourself, you molested child of a drug-addicted STD-ridden whore.
>>539557548That's wrong, especially during the bull days when middleclass chinks could still afford shit.
This thread is full of economically illiterate people living in their mom's rental basement who feel threatened by the Chinese government making living more affordable for hundreds of millions of people as if they were some Maoisim-era post-feudal landlord that is about to be hang. Sorry buddy, you are not a future landlord or temporily embarrassed real estate developer. You are just a loser and you won't even get a pension.
>>539556469I think theyve realised that the only way to stop demographic collapse is to make life affordable for the youth.People working 70 hour weeks saving to hopefully own a fucking apartment by age 40 aren't great parents, and are likely so miserably fucking depressed that they don't even want to continue the human experience.t. 36
>>539557689and you're a wumao faggot shilling for an objectively shitty place to live.
>>539557606Like I said earlier, a lot of it is going into things that are not registered with the government. Gold/silver bullion and numismatics.I personally know someone who owns a pokemon card shop and he has Chinese clients that come in and buy and sell tens of thousands of dollars worth of inventory at a time because one of the ways they launder money/wealth in and out of the country is through pokemon cards.
>>539557606There is nothing left to save, it's fucking grim.If you have money you try to get it out of china and hope the authorities don't clap you.
>>539557689They're fucking retarded.Saying that real estate prices going up is good because it generates "value" is like saying food prices skyrocketing is good because it raises the value of Grocery Chain Stock.Raising input costs raises output costs, diluting the real purchasing power and therefore the value of everyone else.The unfortunante thing is the takeaway here is that Command Economy > Capitalism, when in reality we could tank our real estate prices too if we deregulated enough to actually allow mass construction of housing units to flood the market with supply.
>>539557390This is pure projection.
>>5395542982 more weeks bro
>>539557794If you're not trolling then you have less understanding of economics than a child who has never heard the term. It's like someone who actually believes the sky is green.Someone who has never heard of economics knows more than you because of how wrong you are.
>>539557765>>539557767>capital flightHm, I think this explains a couple of odd things about that economy.
>>539557754And you arent even white mister 54% including hispanics
>>539557689>Sorry buddy, you are not a future landlord or temporily embarrassed real estate developer.Only Chinese government official become billionaire real estate developers whilst Chinese people struggle.Such is communism.
>>539557872Poor Chinese people actually have to invest their capital into actual companies and innovations because they are not allowed to gamble it away by putting it into speculative assets like crypto or other bullshit financial products. Boo fucking wooo. These poor people. They are yearning for freedom.
>>539557884yawn, more euro cope, the us still has more white people than any other country.
>>539557785It gave the individual leverage to acquire more expensive property over the years. Essentially what burgers did over the last 50 years.
>>539557846You randomly assumed my financial status which is something that absolutely no one in this thread can determine from anyone. If anyone is stupid its you. IE, you're projecting.
>>539557985Yeah, that's policy. But we're talking about real life.
>>539554401housing is cheap, that's how normal people people owned like three apartments
>>539557985>invest their capital into actual companies and innovations ahaha
>>539557987lmao
>>539557987Lmao
>>539557985>Poor Chinese people actually have to invest their capital into actual companies and innovations because they are not allowed to gamble it away by putting it into speculative assets like crypto or other bullshit financial products.There are 139 billionaire real estate developers in China.All their money come from property speculation on the back of working Chinese people.
>>539558036Yes I can, if somebody as financially and economically illiterate as you had any money, they would lose it. Nobody can be this stupid and uneducated and keep money, you'd lose it in a heartbeat.>>539557999That's just a wealth transfer from non property owners to property owners, with the added inefficiency of blocking proper equilibrium.Rising oil prices could benefit oil companies, which benefit the boomers who own stocks in those companies... overal it's still a net negative to the economy because everything else, including what boomers buy, uses oil as an input factor. Raising the cost of rent raises the cost of living, which raises the cost companies need to pay workers to live, which raises the cost of final output. When everything costs more to make, that's equivalent to lowering productivity. Productivity is inversely related to the cost of production.
>>539558156enjoy sharia hans
>>539557482>One bookvs>an entirely subverted govtI guess it's the same...
>>539558242Again, projection.I'm glad you can't actually point out as to why i'm stupid. Apparently i'm dumb because I said no government wants LESS capital value? Really? You think that's an untruthful, and stupid statement?You think governments are intentionally going out there to devalue their citizens money for zero reason other than to simply do it?
>>539558247anon you know arabs and jews are classified as white in america right?
>>539557985The problem with that is that Chinese equities have performed very poorly for the amount of economic growth they've had over the past 40 years.If you were a Chinese person consistently investing your income in Chinese equities since inception, your retirement account would be similar to if you invested in US bonds
>>539558325>america expert from vax islandso many of you guys
>>539556469This opinion is only excusable if you own a house, otherwise you are perfect goycattle.
>>539558321Yes you are dumb Capital is not inflated housing prices, read some Adam smith
>>539558378Just letting you know who is in that 49%Iranians roo btw
>>539558367Insane
would you like it if the home you bought 10 years ago is worth half what it once was?of course not, especially considering china has quite consistent inflation.that seems to me to be the bottom line
>>539558257>One bookMany books, jewish economics is what is taught in China. You know nothing of China but keeping lying and being a fool.This is you, stupid Australian communist.
>>539554298China has been two weeks from collapsing for what, 15 years now? Surely it's going to happen this time. Right?
>2 more weeks until China's economy collapsing according to liberal ZOGseems legit, you haven't been pushing this on my algorithm for the past 10 years or anything...
>>539558321>You think governments are intentionally going out there to devalue their citizens money for zero reason other than to simply do it?Inflating prices is literally the definition of devaluing money.When you artificially inflate the price of things like housing or food, you by definition DEFLATE the value of the currency used to purchase said asset.Again, you're stupid.
>539558652>539557482>they study khazar thought in unis like a virus>that means they are khazar!seriously, negro? are you that desperate?
>>539558632No anon its actually worse China is experiencing deflation. Which is something these retards who say i'm wrong can't comprehend, but you are right. No one wants to buy something for a hundred dollars today, only for it to drop down to ten dollars tomorrow. That makes people hold onto their money for a "better" deal, but that leads to less consumer consumption which means less economic growth, which means job loss, which means economic loss, which means an even more devalued currency.Yet apparently understanding this fact means i'm dumb, or a jew. Its no wonder niggers, mudslimes and jeets are taking over, they're in good company like that Aussie retard.
>>539558732Stop calling Ravish negro.
>>539558682China's economy is already on life support. They failed to develop countries via the Belt and Road initiative. They've got huge amounts of factories making excess consumer goods which they're struggling to find buyers for both internationally and domestically. If it wasn't for their huge energy reserves, the Hormuz situation would've giga fucked their economy.
>>539554298>>539554401Look at the Jews screaming "China is imploding!" so the goyim wouldn't realize is being exploited.
>>539558632>>539558750There is one break in the logic chain hereIt's still a good that's inelastic in the sense that you still need a place to live. That overrides its status as an investment. So for example, if houses depreciated like cars, do you think people would not buy houses?People do buy cars even though they heavily depreciate. That's because we view them as consumer goods. Similarly for electronics or televisions. They depreciate rapidly, but we still buy one because we want one or need one. Similarly, a person needs shelter.Houses are a consumed good first and an investment second. And it is a legitimate investment because there is an investable asset there (land/rents). It's not so cut and dry. But the idea that deflationary house prices are inherently bad. I wouldn't say that's true. It would just create a similar dynamic to cars where the intelligent thing to do is to buy a beater home because it's cheap and save your money.In a capitalist context, Japan actually has some properties like this. You can go to Japan and buy beater rural homes for almost nothing because Japanese consumers prefer new builds and homes in Tokyo/Osaka to being yeomen
>>539554845>retard, it's 'cheap' because the people who bought that shit started to defaultYes it's called deleveraging. Or unwinding of a credit bubble. Bad debt gets marked to zero. That's what is supposed to happen. It's healthy. The fact that every time the market in the West threatened to do this jewish central banks and governments stepped in to prevent it from happening is why our economies are all broken and the middle class is dead.
>>539559219This is also true, by allowing for creative destruction, the economy's resources get allocated to more efficient uses.
>>539558632I don't own a home, I own stock in Agro companies, I don't want housing to go up I want food prices to SKYROCKET so i make more money!
>>539559210Ludwig Von Mises and Carl Menger level IQ.
>>539559210You're viewing this from a western lens, China has never had a housing crisis like we do. They're not running out of homes to live in, they have dozens of ghost cities built entirely for the purpose of driving economic growth that no one lives in.Its the collapse of housing that damages this economic growth strategy, thats is why its disastrous for them.There are more than enough houses, and have been more than enough in China for decades, their housing market is their stock market equivalent. They aren't facing any form of shortage what so ever, its an over abundance that turned into a formerly respectable, and profitable economic vehicle.
>>539559219The bubble burst in America was much quicker and violent though.
>>539554298Shut up jeet.
>>539554298They can just knock down whats unfinished or in excess to restore the prices. Thats what we did in the west when our housing market collapsed.
>>539559210as I'm sure you're aware, the french call real estate immobilier. Asians use a similar term which I know through japanese and mandarin: 不動産. literally "unmovable asset"Since real estate cannot be moved its value is associated with its location. Location. Location. Location.Locations can depreciate, if you move in niggers. Is that happening in china?your argument for depreciation of homes is pure garbage.
>>539559513Except, instead of letting the economy recover organically and rebuild itself they bailed out the banks who originated the bad loans in the first place, sent interest rates to zero for over a decade, ran multiple QE programs, and jaw boned the stock market higher. They pumped the air right back into the bubble and spent the last decade funneling all capital away from the economy into the stock market. They just made the problem worse.
>>539556158Other than the fact the people who bought houses as a way to grow wealth got burned, that's a good thing. Housing shouldn't be an investment. It creates a malincentive for companies to buy out a resource people need to live. At some point noe generation needs to get burned so that all subsequent ones can live a better life. Better to rip the bandaid off now.
>>539559210My country is full of houses that no one wants to buy and they are cheap. Bad condition. Bad neighbors. Bad locations.Similarly my country is full of expensive houses. Good condition. Good neighbors. Good locations.You can have a cheap house. Just pick your poison.
>>539556469Housing shouldn't be considered capital.
>>539559636Population declined means rents can decline, that is happening in China
>>539559590Problem is that demand has dried up because China isn't in its boom phase anymore. 10 years ago if you were a 40 year old Chinese man you'd be looking to buy your second or even third apartment. The new generation can't do that so housing cost are falling. Yeah people can still affording to buy real estate but they're not looking to buy what's effectively a rural retreat or summer home near the coast.
>>539554298I notice a ton of communists here in the states coping by saying this is a good thing because houses shouldn't be expensive, but then I wonder: if Chinese people all own their own houses, which is what these same communist copers were telling me about glorious Chinese socialism just a couple weeks ago, then doesn't that mean Chinese people are all getting a lot poorer?
>>539554298HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
>>539559895It worked for us. Will work for them. There is way more of them.
>>539559946It works in the sense that housing prices go up but it doesn't actually fix the underlying problem with the economy and they know that so they're not going to do it.
>>539559873There can be internal movement even in a declining population. Japan for example.
>>539559997So we are in trouble and they have side stepped it?
>>539559873the rate of chinese population increase is dropping but the population is still increasing, brainlet
>>539554298Funny how people who hate China are terribly concerned about the possibility of Chinese real estate investors losing money.
>>539560045No anon, we're all fucked but they're at least trying to adress the core issue rather than prop up housing prices. Chances are that they'll fail at that for the same reason we've failed.
>>539554401Real estate is their form of stocks, people put live savings in buying properly with expectation of growth. If real estate fails peoples live saving are gone.This is bad for the economy.
>>539560133i don't hate china. I admire it in many ways and have studied MandarinI'm interested in the collapse of the chinese real estate market because it might foretell a similar collapse elsewherebut let's be serious. china experienced a crash which is now being propagandized into "I meant to do that"
>>539554298Whose economy ISN'T fucked?
>>539560153>This is bad for the economy.The scheme is what's bad for the economy. The bubble is bad for the economy. The bubble popping is good for the economy (after medium-term pain).
>>539559851Completely pointless thing to even mention. Your opinion isn't how the Chinese view it, nor how their economy works.
>>539554298Oh no! Affordable housing that doesn't just send all wealth to jews?
>>539556072One inaccuracy is you include 70yr leases as ownership - why do you do that when other countries dont? Why intentionally use incorrect definitions so as to compare different things entirely
>>539560153The whole thing is retarded. Boomers have their savings locked up in real estate that they expect to cash in sometime in the near future. Except that housing is unaffordable to younger generations so in the end there aren't enough buyers to help boomers cash out their savings. Maybe Blackstone will step in and save us (lmao) by buying up all the real estate. Isn't that an encouraging thought?
>>539554704Their CO2 emissions offset all of the west’s reductions by several hundred percent. They are successful because they are not held to arbitrary standards. And shipping production to factories that don’t give a fuck about emissions or safety or worker rights is not an improvement at all.
>>539560143Countries like rising house prices because it creates so much taxable activity. Banking, building, furnishing, maintenance, legal fees. The list is endless.
>>539559776China is no different, in fact they're more interventionist. It's why you don't see a big vertical line in the graphs like USA 2008. Just earlier this year they restructured a lot of bad debt from local governments who propped the bubble. It's not a bad thing. The fed money for the Wall Street bailout was fully recovered.
>>539560419We are trying to economise on fossil fuels. Its not really about carbon emissions. Which is a good thing. We might be able to avoid ww3 if we can domestically produce energy. Even if it is more expensive.
>>539554298>imminentJust 2 more weeks
>>539560456>It's not a bad thing.It is a bad thing. It encourages mal-investment. It encourages inefficient use of resources. It encourages uncontrolled debt growth which causes inflation and at this point is a drain on the real economy.
>>539554704>total safetyhahahajust because liveleak shut down doesn't mean china became safe.
>>539560419They added as much wind and solar as the rest of the planet combined last year and are aggressively electrifying everything they can, hard for me to criticize them on the basis of climate change.
>>539554401yeah and I want my 401k to go down 75% and stay there for decades
>>539560425The problem is that this isn't an isolated problem, its part of a general issue with the economy. yeah you can bulldoze a bunch of houses but that doesn't prevent the construction workers from losing their jobs or finds new buyers for various construction materials.
>>539554642>>539556954
>>539561123They are doing solar not because they want to lower emissions but because they want to secure their strategic independence on Gulf States Oil. This has been a multi decade long process of theirs, it has nothing to do with the environment, and everything to do with the survival of the CCP as an institution, Notice how I said the CCP, and not China.
>The pig who cried wolfYAAAAWN
>>539555070They're most likely on the infographic show team. >>539554298What's up Josh? I thought you were AI until you started showing your face.
China's population is artificially small because of the one child policy.
okay, since the thread is now moving into energy and environmental policy I think we're all in agreement that china has experienced a severe crash in its real estate sector, and shills are trying to spin it into something intentionalthanks everyone for all your help
>>539556206This. You are talking to people who unironically believe the line must keep going up. They are boomers, mentally and spiritually. They can't stop talking about how prices need to go up.>it needs to go UP or else it's flat!Can't stop treating houses as an investment. So caught up in this crazy end-stage capitalism that they can't even comprehend a different way.
At some point it has to, they are just coping with it already. Just ahead of us as always.
>>539562113Thank you Rajeev. Please continue talking about energy. Kumar was supposed to do that.
>>539562137If you want to maintain your quality of life the way it is, yes number must go up. If it stays the same then your quality of life doesn't improve, if it goes down, so does your quality of life. This is why number go up has been every single functional nations goal since industrialization became a thing.You want to have the money for the nice things we all enjoy, and maintain them? Number must go up.
>>539556158Yea, they were up about 28% since 2005 through the peak in 2021 and all of that has been wiped out since. They fucked up with their three red lines in stereotypical commie fashion. Heavy handed intervention without giving their real estate developers any time to update their business practices in order to meet the stringent new debt requirements. It should have been obvious they ran the risk of an asset fire sale from developers they wanted to deleverage, and that's exactly what they got. Oh well, not like Chinks too many new units built since their population is shrinking anyway. People will just have to deal with their bathroom kitchens for a while longer.
>>539562113It was unintentional at first but became intentional as a way to salvage the market. People who are looking to buy property now have it good, people who bought before the evergrande bankruptcy are royally fucked.
>>539554642Kek
>>539562306Chinks are winning because to them nothing matters in the short term they just shrug and go yeah that's life. They just have that vibe about them. Old Chinese guys are never freaking out about anything even their impending deaths theyre just like yeah, I'll be dead soon, whatever, who gives a shit.
>>539562416>if you want to maintain quality of life, yesLies. This is all jewish money magic. Our ancestors didn't have *worse* lives by a "flat line".Flat = stay the same, in non-jewish economics.Everything you think you know about economics is jewish money magic, which is satanic.
>>539555574grim
>>539562710Our ancestors didn't have cell phones, TV's, cars, functional roads and transportation systems, water on demand both hot and cold, and electricity.Building these things inherently come with a long term cost that must be maintained anon.If every human being on the planet suddenly didn't know what modern luxuries were would yeah, be fine.But obviously we know what we have, ergo its not as simple as you seem to think. Go live in a cave and tell the rest of us how well off you are. We'll continue to live in reality.
>>539562620I highly doubt that considering their childhoods are no fun allowed and their adulthoods slavery just like all east asians
>>539562825>we have more stuff nowYes And before jewish economics, a "flat line" was totally fine. You are so spiritually jewish that you cannot understand that for 99% of human history your quality of life DID NOT GO DOWN because of a flat line.Only in jewish economics does flat = down.Do you not understand that?Flat = flat in non-jewish economics.Flat = down in jewish economics You are a jew who supports jewish systems that support jewish supremacy
>>539563110You're just an idiotGo start asking your neighbors to forgo the maintenance on the utilities that modern life depends on because you dislike jews. See how well that works, and how viable that is.Blaming jews on entropic principles of decay and maintenance is peak nigger behavior. If you're gonna shit on the kikes at least be intelligent about it.
>>539562564Salvage the market from what? Their housing prices already weren't keeping up with inflation. And the resulting disruption was certainly not intentional. The government didn't realize how many of their real estate developers would not meet their very strict Three Red Lines requirements which caused a massive asset sell off in the attempt to de-leverage. Since then China has lost 40% of their real estate development capacity by sales volume, which is a massive structural hit. And the funny thing is these firms weren't even over-leverage to begin with by international standards. So this was all around completely unnecessary. There was no real estate bubble and no potential for a liquidity crisis other than the one the bureaucrats unintentionally created.
>>539554298https://youtube.com/shorts/x3q5CU4KcEI
>>539556833I think they're looking towards PMs, they just started heavily regulating speculation on gold futures this month
>>539554298>Total collapse I mean Xi did it on purpose so housing was affordable....
>>539561449>Eeerm AKSHUALLY this country isn't moving off of fossil fuels out of blind altruism, they're doing it because it's the rational long-term strategic decisionYeah no shit
>>539563236>you're just an idiotGifted program. Never been an idiot. You are a kike raised in a kike system and you lack the intelligence to comprehend anything but the kike system that maintains kike supremacy.
>>539554298Food prices and car prices are also collapsing
>>539554845german economywhat a jokego to hell kraut
>>539558632If it was only my home that lost half its value that would kinda suck I guess, though it wouldn't have any real impact on my life.On the other hand if all property loses half its value, that just means it's now cheaper for me to buy something that would've been more expensive 10 years ago, sounds like a good thing to me.
>>539561449They're over installing solar they can't use because Beijing gives out good boy points to the provinces for qualifying infrastructure projects. The idiots in the provinces trying to get more good boy points have just been dumping it into useless solar, they already overpoduce power. Beijing is changing how they hand out good boy points so this will happen less but they're slow.
>>539554298I never trust any foreigner talking about the state of a different country, mainly because they don't even speak their language. How would they know whether or not the government is already addressing their concerns? Short answer is they wouldn't, and they don't care to learn because they're just grifting retards.
>>539554401>They want real estate to be cheap. No, they ran real estate ponzi. In order for your real estate ponzi to not collapse sooner, you need to make sure you have enough people to buy old RE in the next generations. China, however, with their retarded 1 child per family policy, made it s o bad that there's 1 working person for 4 retired chinese boomers. Their real estate is collapsing because of this.
>>539554704Slave $10/ day labor, khm, khm. Cheap low quality steel (cars last about 2-3 years). Yeah and real estate turned our to be a ponzie.>>539568915
>>539556958Nokia lost because CIA/ Pentagon wanted a control over it, and they couldn't get it. So they send a Microsoft Directory to take over Nokia, and they did.
>>539554298I ain't afraid of no ghost
>>539568496>they are building too much!!!!lmao massive cope.
>ChinaHouses are for living in, not speculation>Jews and Boomers in the westTHIS IS A COLLAPSE AND A GENOCIDE!I don't like the CCP, but a broken clock is correct twice a day.
>>539554298Debtcattle REQUIRES the failure of systems not rootes in usury, because the alternative proves that their existence is a lie:> that they've wasted their entire lives obeying unnecessary, arbitary rules designed to humilate them, enabling their own exploitation and ruination. > that their "economic system" is long since operating beyond ANY "economic theory" and boils down to the sale of longterm problems and renting of shortterm solutions (= marginally smaller, metastizing problems), to maximize debt and interest> that they are legally no more than should-be-inaninate property, only considered human in appearance and description
>>539554637Based chink commies
>>539554401ButLine goes upAlways
>>539556938I see a fellow fan of the china show
>>539555231>The citizens are paying out their assesChinese citizens are not paying out their asses for housing. It's very affordable.
>>539555557>Reddit post for ants>6 years ago>Looks like an average American city
>>539571840It's not cope your IQ is just nigger level. Having 9000% of your energy needs met at high noon doesn't do you a lick of good over having 1000% or 500%. It's a waste of all human effort involved. It's purely bureaucratic and driven by subsidies in China and bureaucratic gladhanding between the central and provincial governments. And like I said the chinks are slowly stopping this idiocy but walking you through the subsidy deletes would be over your head.
>>539555890>with the chink flu a ton of people went bankrupt and got forced out of their apartmentsThat was before three red lines. Yes, China was a shithole 10 years ago. Now it's a decent place that is potentially poised to be a scifi utopia.
>>539556158>CrashIndustrialization and automation and MMT made goods more available and affordable and you're doing everything you can to spin this as a bad thing. What's wrong with things that people need becoming less expensive?
>>539554401And America wants real estate prices high
>>539554704you dont think we see through your bullshit Chang? You give us far too little credit.
>>539556112American homeowners pay taxes on property at the municipal, state, and federal level, and owe HOA dues. All four agencies can use force to extract these rents. Municipal/state/fed can seize your house "at market rate" for no reason without your permission. Additionally, police can use civil asset Forefiture. This is why Nail Houses are unheard of in America. The homeowner has little to no protection from government seizure. Compare with a Chinese Lease, which is exceptionally difficult for the government to violate.
>>539556833But regardless if price action people would have to pay the debt off or default so why is cheaper prices bad? Homeowners just don’t want others to succeed. Crab bucket mentality
>>539556300Show us a Nail House in America. You can't be wise the second someone with wealth or power is inconvenienced by your house, they can take it from you.
>>539556413The government passed a suite of regulations called Three Red Lines. It's purpose was to lower housing prices by inhibiting speculation buying. It worked and GDP grew.
>>539556469>No one wants LESS capital value in their economyReplace "Housing" with "Food." Do you understand the trick that's been played on you now? The thing that you feel entitled to is blood feeding on the next generation. It's a sin. Face the wall.
>>539556633Three Red Lines caused GDP to spike because investment moved from vampirism to manufacturing.
