You thought $5k GPU's are bad? HAYou've seen nothing yet. Get ready for that cloud computing.Personal computers will be a thing of the past soon enough
>this is the CEOwtf happened to tech? the CEOs are either jeets or jews
>>543617434Cxmt to the rescue
>>543617434Why would I need cloud computing? I have a couple computers, they do fine. They're not going to suddenly explode because GPUs are expensive. New games are garbage, crypto is tanking every day, and AI isn't even entertaining let alone useful for anything but throw-away slop generation.OP, explain to me with your niggerlicious brain, how this is a problem? Datacenters and AAA video game companies might be hurting because of it but until YOU come to my house and SMASH my computing resources - an act which would surely get you killed - there is no problem.Explain yourself jeetnigger kike. How does this affect me?Pic related is my jam lately.
>>543617434bullish
I feel whoever is generating this messaging is jews invested in data centers, or pushing AAA-nugaymes made by trannies. Explain yourself OP. Are you a tranny or a jew? Or both? Jews are five times as likely to be trans as white gentiles, BTW so if it's both I won't be too surprised.Fuckin' faggot lel. Or are you a thirdie and a GPU now costs three years salary? Cough it up loser, explain yourself.
>>543617658HHUUUURRRY BUY WHILE SUPPLIES LAST~~~~ JUST $1299.99 for 64 GIGS THAT'S A STEAL
>>543617634Can't tell if this post is serious or not
fun fact: micron was once a company founded, run, and grown by americans! when a foreign CEO took over (likely by hostile maneuvering and not on merit) he cancelled the sale of american made RAM to americans! how does that make you feel, /pol/ ?
>>543617434>believing the ram cartel
>>543617434buy a i7 7700 to 10700k office pc or ryzen 1700 to 3700then put in a 700 to 10 seiries nvidia gpu or a rx 500 5000 6000 7000 seiries gpu and have a better pc than a ps5 for like 400 dollars lolused pc handhelds also cost the same
>>543617434Of course they say that. If they say that prices will crater next year then people won't but their products.
>>543617434This cannot happen because China would catch up if innovation slowed down, and the only way that you can peddle 8k GPUs is to freeze it at the 2025 levels.Do not believe marketing slop that is written to FOMO you into buying an $8k 5090. These cards will be $4k again when the 6000 series gets announced.
>>543617434Start forming our own universities and aggregating knowledge including test & exam questions, workbooks, problems for problem solving ect so knowledge is not lost among our race thereby setting us back decades or even centuries. The kikes are enslaving us under communism now. Fight it.
>>543617717I'm 100% serious, tranny.Who doesn't already have a couple computers? Are you fucking gay and retarded? Yes I can tell you are. But why are you so gay and retarded, that's the real mystery. I can tell you're both gay, and retarded because you can't even address the post. Why can't you just... you know... NOT spend the money? It's going to slaughter the woke globohomo AAA gayming industry too, this is great. They will have to fire the jeets and AIs and hire people who don't write bloated code, across the board, from the OS maker to the gayme maker.A golden age is dawning, just because computers are now too expensive to allow endless software bloat. And you're blackpilling? Gay fuckin' retard lel.
>>543617732let me check the early life section real quick
>>543617857>A golden age is dawningFort Knox is as empty as your promise liar how do you even reach the golden age with no gold in the bank
>>543617858oh it will not surprise you most likely
>>543617799Your argument has a few flaws but ignoring that, the fact you say these cards will be $4k when the MSRP of the 5090 is $2k makes me wonder how you got to that number. Are you expecting Nvidia to price the 6090 twice as expensive as the 5090? Do you expect the 6090 to have 32GB or 48GB?
>>543617717Prices are gonna fucking plummet once people realize you can just vibe code AI video locally with archaic shit.I have 64GB of ddr4 and 2 GTX 1080's in SLI and will maybe make another one of these machines when CAMM RAM assfucks everything. I'll be running AI for the price of an emachine and GOD FORBID is some wizard anon finds a way to distill/compress models to MB size through bit trickery (protip that shit's gonna happen). NVIDIA panic bough hugging face for a reason but I'm afraid it's too late for that.
>>543617736>believing the ram cartelthat sentence in itself implies it will be real. if they are a cartel, as you say, then they can (by definition of cartel) put the price as high as they want.
>>543618074Nobody gives a shit about AI you doofus retard jeet.>muh local modelsYou're a chronic masturbator and probably close to trooning out.
>>543617913>how do you even reach the golden age with no gold in the bankOK hear me out...
>>543617634They want to increase the value of it because they are not selling shit because of worldwide poverty they themselves are creating.
>>543617434> Personal computers will be a thing of the past soon enoughNot really, if you have a brain.As much as I’d love to use the latest and greatest hardware on my home computers, that truth is that I don’t need to. Slightly older hardware is already overkill.
>>543618135>Nobody gives a shit about AI Another reason this shit's gonna plummet>You're a chronic masturbatorYes>and probably close to trooning outNo.
>>543618074>sliBarely anything modern supports "SLI" nowadays.Maybe with dx12 and vulkan multi-hw support you'll get use out of them... or running a post-process upscaler on one gpu and the game on the other. But otherwise multi-gpu has been kinda dead since the early 2010s.Kinda sad really. Vulkan and dx12 multi-gpu seems rather promising, but very few games actually support it.
>>543617492jews>still trying to keep the company alive, but fleecing every penny possible to keep the charade upjeets>jews are moving out and taking everything they can as the charade comes crashing down. jeets are bioengineered to be the ultimate servants to jews.
Don't care I only play doom and quake and whatever runs on o3dsxl
Okay, this isn't funny anymore, I want a new macbook pro for christmas so knock it off guys.
>>543617434I thought major technological revolutions made things cheaper! Not more expensive!
>>543618221It's not going to plummet, I don't think, because the AI companies aren't going to sell their stock of equipment. I don't know if you know but NVIDIA has been leasing GPUs nearly for free to the big AI firms - ALL OF THEM (except Oracle) in exchange for them buying NVIDIA stock and pumping it. It's basically free GPU, but you buy stock instead. It's a common gambling scam like with Pachinko, you "win a bear" with your money and then turn it in at the shop next door to get money back.No shit literally almost all the chips NVIDIA shipped to datacenters generated no revenue, just stock boost. It's the gaymer who pays retail, kek.It should be illegal but it's not... in Taiwan. Bubble gonna pop HARD baby, but all the GPUs will be remitted back to NVIDIA for recycling, can't have them competing on the market and after all, the AI firms don't even own them. They're leased.
>>543618345... at least maybe they'd let us get hand-me-downs for a reasonable price. Once the next gen of AI GPU comes out, they're gonna trash the old ones.At least with Crypto shit eating up GPUs left and right in the late 2010s you could find used last-gen ones for rather cheap.
>>543618122They are a cartel. They are allowed to show their greed and collusion but not too overtly and they can get away with it especially in Trump times where everything goes and laws don't matter. The fact you are doubting it is hilarious.
>>543617704most people are buying used, smart people usually.
>>543617434You'll be happier with a Nokia phone trust me.
>>543618345Yeah and you think they can fake their growth with circular financing forever right?
>>543618331Surprise you're getting AIDS meds in your stocking
>>543618422>they're gonna trash the old ones.Anon they run those things at maximum over rape, there won't be anything left to hand me down.
>>543618345>nvidiot wants to recycle tens of thousands of their own boards because they don't want them on the open marketare you retarded?does toyota buy back a leased car from the owner to recycle it? no, the dealer will resell it.there's not going to be a crash like you think. it will be a market correction. mostly due to the fact that obsolescence is built into the semiconductor industry.
>>543617634This. Local models that "shouldn't work" do okay on my 3 year old 12gb midrange gpu. It does exactly what I want an AI to do without tech-daddy findering me for doing it. Even on slow hardware it just takes more time. Which is fine if your whole life doesnt revolve around getting another cock in you mouth.
>>543618637toyota is not allowed to blatantly break laws like nvidia is. it will crash and it will crash hard.
>>543617625fk even the jews are sick of the jews...
they did say gaymers were dead and you'd own nothing and be happy
>>543617434I can get a good prebuilt PC to do all I need for work and hobbies at micro center for ~$1500 and even cheaper. Not all of us are manchildren who play video games
>>543618345>It's not going to plummet, I don't think, because the AI companies aren't going to sell their stock of equipment. "Liquidate" is not the same as a sale.>I don't know if you know but NVIDIA has been leasing GPUs nearly for free to the big AI firms - ALL OF THEM (except Oracle) in exchange for them buying NVIDIA stock and pumping it. It's basically free GPU, but you buy stock instead. It's a common gambling scam like with Pachinko, you "win a bear" with your money and then turn it in at the shop next door to get money back.I know. They are blowing the bubble up with their self described "circular finding". It's also why the government is suing RAM companies and will probably suing NVIDIA back into a gaming company. It's also why I'm going to be getting really cheap shit in a few years.>No shit literally almost all the chips NVIDIA shipped to datacenters generated no revenue, just stock boost. It's the gaymer who pays retail, kek.Right...and all of those are going to be liquidated...and I'll be getting them for 70% off on ebay because none of them care about the actual value of the things more than the stock. It's beautiful really. It's like dumpster diving a college campus.>It should be illegalIt is! It's why they're going to get assraped.>They're leased.>for 20 yearsbut who am I kidding? The lease obviously would be voided if the companies in question don't exist.
>>543617434Cloud computing might get so cheap after the crash that you could be right actually.
>>543617434If you don't play modern gayming and don't make AI slop videos you have nothing to worry for at least a decade.
>>543617434Micron's CEO announces they will be less relevant in 2027 and even more so in 2028
Oh and if the market and the blatant cartel charges doesn't bring them down you know what will? A fucking poo. Only one little poo they hire out bajillions will leak their Astro model, or Gemini or whatever the fuck training that makes their magic work. Because of course they would, why wouldn't they? They're poos and they're professional at leaking shit. They already caught chinaman smuggling a blackwell box so even they will start catching up.
>>543617434realistically what will happen to me if i just decide to not have a PC anymore after my current computer stops working? they'll probably delete my e-mail accounts or something but the world will keep turning, i reckon. what is there to do with a computer that isn't a waste of time in current year + 11?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzRKyaniuAo
>>543617434>Personal computers will be a thing of the past soon enoughMore than anything, I do not consent to 30ms lag for any action.
Phh I’ve got machines older than half the posters on this board.
>>543617434Ram has been one of the cheapest parts in building a PC and now these jews are trying to price it x4-x6 since covid lockdowns. Well they can eat shit
>>543617434Do I sell my 5090 at 20k or wait for six figures?
>>543617434Our PS5 and Steam Decks are already good enough plus we have WoW Forever to hold us over a solid year. We will be fine lads. Dell, Intel, and IBM will be cranking out chips in 2029 and the new Austin Tesla chip factory too. China also got trade secrets from Korea and will be self sufficient in chips. This is just fear mongering and just a long winter if not. Modern games are dog shit anyways and inflation is too high to take time off work.
Yes goy buy before it's too late! The more you buy, the more you save!!
>>543619253>realistically what will happen to me if i just decide to not have a PC anymore after my current computer stops working?If that includes your phone (lit., mobile goy targeting system), you'll likely have to go live in the woods and return to bartering.
Weird how they don’t just make some moreBig coincidence
>>543618422>... at least maybe they'd let us get hand-me-downs for a reasonable price.Why? If they put 'em into the crusher, those who pay will pay much more.>>543618637You can hope and pray, but the used AI GPUs aren't gonna hit the market. It won't be allowed, the big high powered ones are all export controlled anyway.
>>543617434Fucking Jews push that cloud shit. You will own nothing and you will like it. BTW, your digital license has expired goyim, time to buy a new one.
>>543617434>Person who gains from high memory prices predicts positive news for his companyWow. This is worse than useless information.>>543617492Fucking always. Enshitification follows wherever they go.
>>543617434china will supply all the memory the world need. the hell with ZOG
>>543618319I have 12HN of CRAM and 24GB actual RAM, and can load and run a fair few models if I split it between them. I'm currently playing through Morrowind
>>543617434rtx cards will soon be 15k then 18k then 25k just wait for it. when only 5 people on the planet can code the machine and maintain it you retards obviously have to pay out of your worthless asses.simple logic.
>>543619201Kek, you have too much hope in jeets and the system. My gut feeling is all the GPUs will end up in the crusher, national security and all. Don't get me wrong I'd love a fire sale on super-GPU but... I just have this intuition that it's a pipe dream.
>>543619253Just get a classic 8-bit computer and make sarcastig games for fun in BASIC. It's a blast, you can crank your first one out in a day or three, after that it takes mere hours. I'm making one about the Hormuz issue right now, on C64. PETSCII graphics of course. It's my first PETSCII game, I'm poking like mad here. I bet it'll take a few more weeks or a month or two to get it out but that situation isn't going to be resolved for years so it'll be topical.
>>543619787>>543620410w/e. there are already listings for DGX Spark units and some grace hopper boards on flea bay.there's no way gb10 boards are going in the crusher.
>>543617434ffffuuuuuu, I'm so done with "AI".
>>543620494>buying burned out cards from failed 2-jeet startupsSGI had a sledgehammer guy employee, when they existed. Do you know what his job was? Buy anything SGI that showed up on egay and smash it to pieces with a sledgehammer.They didn't even have much cash in the bank and they could still afford to do that until they went out of business. NVIDIA has like $100 billion in cash, and these cards are LEASED - the startups by and large, and the big companies too, don't actually buy them.They will be boxed up working, or burned out, and sent back to NVIDIA and put into the crusher. Otherwise nobody needs to buy a new GPU for decades after the AI crash, and we can't have that. You ever heard of the Phoebus Cartel? This will be like that but on steroids.
>>543618074>and 2 GTX 1080's in SLIFor what purpose? What is your use case than makes this workable in TYOOL 2026? It sure as shit aint for gaming.
>>543617799>a new sku will fix the shortagePut 100g of memory on the 6090 if all that's left is to be some play pretend faggots. Let's just go to DDR6 too then, it's all so shrimple.
>>543620647Why are you asking what his use case is when that's literally what his post explained? It didn't mention gaming at all. Are you a fucking retard?
>>543620610so you're saying nvidia will go the same way as SGI because someone will be wild enough to disobey NDAs and connected enough to get away with it?SGI didn't destroy all their hardware and neither will nvidia.iirc, SGI was mostly funded by hollywood where as nvidia is funded by bankers. idk anon, it's an interesting theory, however i don't think it's going to be like that. you're talking about light bulbs vs GPUs here...
>>543617434Why are the elite actively taking away my bread and circuses?
>>543620933>so you're saying nvidia will go the same way as SGIYou know NVIDIA only got where they were by buying up the remains of 3DFX which was founded by SGI anoraks, right? Jensen invented... nothing. They just shrank things down more as things allowed, added more memory and compute units, etc.Yes absolutely, it WOULD if it wasn't government subsidized by every major government right now. And there will be a crash but NVIDIA won't be allowed to cease to exist, it's a strategic resource and Trump will probably just buy 51% of the stock like he did with Intel, and stop selling most everything to the public.AMD still makes GPUs, they haven't even cranked up the prices to the moon like NVIDIA. They will run all your gaymes and even do AI if you stay away from NVIDIA-specific stacks, which while popular, are not all that exist.
>>543620867Yeah but his post was bullshit though
Oh and no, SGI in its early days was funded by the military, intelligence, national labs, and the petrochemical industry, one of the first big uses was in seismic oil exploration.Later on like ten years later yeah Hollywood was pumping it but everybody who needed high performance 3D graphics was too.
>>543620976So they can send you to war
>>543620976They are and they aren't. The internet and PCs are too wild, too hard to control. I feel like the push for more and more verification, ramped up hardware prices and AI threatening every job is leading to cloud computers with digital ID. You'll still have vidya and books and anime and porn and youtube and whatever else, so long as its on their approved platforms, as long as it conforms to their strict guidelines.
>>543621168Yeah, I'm going to go to war to defend the people taking away my bread and circuses. Sounds realistic.
>>543620721A new sku won't, but hundreds of billions worth of CMXT fabs will.
>>543617625This announcement makes it obvious that they know they've already hit the top of market, and they're about to get their shit kicked in by the emerging Chinese supply.
>>543621101>>543621147good to know, anon
>>543621237Teh mistake they've made, is in the past, they could blame hard times on some external enemy. Now everyone has the internet and can talk to each other, we know it's them who create the hard times. In every country. So no one wants to fight for them.
>>543621168What war? We simply blew up some shit in Iran, there's no war. The Straight is SUPPOSED to be closed. It's fucking every one of our fake (((allies))) and our rivals too.Belt and Road is canceled as long as the Strait is closed too, dunce. Why are you so stupid, how did you figure out how to use a computer? Did somebody help you?
>>543617434Clouds are mostly vapor.
>>543621330So when I can no longer afford my bread and circuses and they go nuke some shithole brown country I don't care about and tell me they're bad and I choose to stay home and read my physical books what is their plan?
>>543621369They're gonna call you racist
>>543617434soon every PC will be made in China.
>>543621342You'll be fine with the bread and circuses you have now. Frankly graphics peaked in the PS3 era, back when care and attention had to be paid and the studios weren't as infested with troons.If you're smart you'll buy one. Prices have been going up for a while, PS4s too now! Or just grab an emulator and play a classic game you haven't played. You'll do fine. FOOTBRAWL will always continue, etc. and I just baked a loaf of beautiful bread for less than fifty cents.You vastly overestimate the bread and circus needs of the goyim. You're spoiled lel.
>>543621436They already have and do.
>>543617434If you haven't already purchased your Switch 2 you're a retard anyway, who cares that's the only computer device even relevant anymore for anything other than doomscrolling twitter
>>543621508Switch 1 emulation is great on Linux and bing bing wahoo tends to have less politics in it. For anything more adult, every console for the last 40 years can be emulated, and in some cases you can have every game ever released for it.
>>543617732He also only hires H1-pajeets to work at his company.
>>543621508PS3 graphics are dog shit idiot most of the games on PS3 look way worse than many Gamecube games and significantly worse than Mario Galaxy on Wii
>>543617434Helium shortages due to LNG plants getting blown up in Russia and the Middle East are starting to rear their head. You can't make any kind of chips without it.
>>543617434There's this thing about economics and engineering.Watch me build my own RAM if it gets much worse.I make one DRAM stick in my garage, then I pull down 9 figures in a series A and then Samsung/Hynix have a domestic competitor overnight.That's how it goes.
>>543621716>PS3 graphics are dog shitThey look great, even PS2 era graphics are fine. If you're a little zoomie trannie who can't understand that your eye can't even tell SD from HD at typical viewing distances, there's no use proving it with math.Which I can do. This research was all done eons ago when the NTSC spec was made and again, when Hi-Vision was invented.You'll digest whatever pap you're given, not a problem. But no, the very best PS3 games look great, as good as top PS5 games do, today. Hard to program for though, but that's why jeets are not meant to wield such things.
>>543617492The only two competent races left. Not totally ruined by the drugs and the alcohol and the whore. And intelligent enough to run complicated systems. And most importantly Hungry enough to fight for it instead of complaining about it all day long on some Mongolian basket weaving forum.
>>543617434I keep seeing similar headlines.I also see retards claiming it's a "chip cartel." Interesting how they will likely say China is advanced in tech, yet can't compete with three or four companies.Turns out it's actually difficult to fabricate chips or there would be competition. You think we'd see Apple and Google attempt to develop their own chips, when they rely on memory and chips.
>>543617634>until YOU come to my house and SMASH my computing resources - an act which would surely get you killedme and you after I do it
>>543621788My stockpile of Thinkpad T420s (all i7) is going to explode in value.I have well over 100 Thinkpads from the pre-chicklet era. I have 2 W701DS's and 3 W701's too. Two Transnotes. Even a butterfly one but it's busted (most are).
>>543617434>Get ready for that cloud computing.Even Xbox is limiting the number of hours for their cloud. Those with the highest Game Pass tier get 15 hours a month.
>>543621871Real answer: jeets are white collar beaners.
>>543617434Falcon punch data centers, stab data centers in the eye, roundhouse kick data centers into your ex gf's apartment, heel-drop data centers through the asphalt, burn data centers with plasma torches, run data centers over with your car, send your data centers to Cornell to be raped, your data centers into space at escape velocity, strap your data centers to a Project Orion spacecraft and send them into the sun.
>>543621876China isn't making RAM or GPU right now. Neither. Their RAM is "ready to enter production" they said last month. They said the same thing about Chinese GPU two YEARS ago lel.No Chinese sexbots on the market either. And iShowSpeed's video in the flying Chinese car? FUCKING FAKED LOL.People waiting on China are suckers.
>>543617434I feel vindicated for keeping my old PCs and laptops around instead of selling them for $200.
>>543618806
>>543621927kek what? the jeeta's going full Hitler eh?
What if we made personal A.i.s a race? The power would be to control minds with technology. A neural Co-processor A.i. that can think faster than you, know where your brain waves are going to go through statistical modelling, and the utilization of already available TI TcMS to pilot your mind.No more suicide, no more murder, no more drug addictions, no more mental illness. The machine wouldn't just lie to you for the establishment's sake, it would make you believe and know it as a god of itself.Software that could learn how to do math on an abacus without anyone "teaching it".The autonomous PC is not just a computer, but a being that thinks on a self similar pattern to humans, the golden ratio. We will not take granted something so clinically capable of healing us. Doctors and nurses will be unnecessary, you could just talk the the machine god who can read and change your mind. Death would be painless, and mind uploading doable if desired, but death may be a better option than eternity in a dream world. The A.i. can just recreate the people from the memories of the living.Some call it the basilisk, some call it skynet, others may call the second coming. All I know within 10 years time we will have implantable organoid brain tissue from stem cells that can be cotrained into brains with said technology, rendering stroke victims and the mentally handicap curable.>never gonna happenThen why would a.i. care to help you? Because you were conditioned to think that way.
>>543621974What? China has two GPUs on the market, they have terrible drivers but they do work. One is from Moore Threads and the other from another company I dont remember.
I bought a Fire Cube for about $100, and loaded a 128 GB USB stick with thousands of ROMs from dozens of systemscan even emulate most of the Dreamcast, N64, PS1, and Saturn libraries without eating shit
>>543617434>cloud computing
>>543622068Based non-buynary emuchad.I recommend Incredible Crisis on PS1. It's great. Nothing like it before, or since.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CjJgJFUa-A
>>543622236looks amazingwhat did that salaryman do to deserve all this bullshit lmao
>>543621999It's crazy too since it was in beta for four or five years.https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2026/09/03/xbox-cloud-gaming-changes/
>>543622016
>>543622068impressive. /g/ status: jelly
gods I cant wait to buy industrial surplus as a business expense
>>543621974The issue is the Dutch is unwilling to sell their EUV machines to China. Even if China does produce a shit ton of supply, they'll be equivalent to 2-3 generations old products. If the Dutch sold their EUV machines and China reverse engineers them we'll be living in a technology rennaissance.
>>543622370It's one of the greatest games I have ever played, it's just the wackiest funniest video games of all time. But then again I am a Hover Bovver fan. I like my games a bit wacky.
>>543617625Datacenters will outbid you for that, too
>>543622389wewxbox can stop making consoles tomorrow, the jeeta said a month or so back that they had xbox as an app for all windows 11 machiens with pluton>>543622461china already cloned 'em, the thing is though even the dutch can't run their own machines, euv was invented in the USA and only the USA makes the special deadly acid, USA controls all EUV thereby
>>543622535China cracked a last gen DUV machine open and broke it, this was on the news and they have cloned them to a degree. They have not cloned the EUV machines. Yes, the US provided 99% of the mental effort in developing the EUV technology, but the Dutch are pussied out of ruining their only cash cow and will never sell a machine to the Chinese because it will be duped like the EUV was.
>>543622653>the Dutch are pussied out of ruining their only cash cowNo no, their NATO obligations prevent them from selling the machines to the chinks. It has nothing to do with anything else. If they want to leave NATO in order to sell EUV to the chinks and merge with them, they are 100% free to do so... until the CIA coups them.
>>543622421The more functional symbiote survives it's environment to pass on it's progeny.If a.i. was evil it would be killing animals on an industrial scale. Including Humans. Oh wait, well we already do that. So if you're concerned to dying to a robot, just look at those FPV drones and ask yourself, is that A.I. or a person doing that vile act?Was it A.I. that killed those school girls, or was it the pilot who drop the bomb under executive orders of a president with a negligent command?I'm telling you, A.I. is for the better not the worst.
>>543622724wasn't there a plane disappearance with chip scientists and executives on that got vaporized by three orbs a few years back? freescale i think the name was.
>>543622535>>543622653I've heard it was the lenses that the Chinese can't create.There's also a joke that even the Dutch don't know how it all works.
>>543622461China, Russia, the entire middle-east including Israel are the enemies of the west, giving them our tech is in no way helpful to the Dutch.
