Communists using China as an example of the success of socialism is one of the biggest self-owns in politics.The idea that socialism made China better is refuted by the fact that China was not a developed country during the time of Mao Zedong. Its economic success came after it liberalized its economy and introduced market-oriented reforms.It baffles me that there are still people who believe in central economic planning despite the fact that it contributed to devastating failures and millions of deaths.
>>543684416the missing factor is this was only possible because of Hong Kong and to a lesser extent Taiwan. China buries this fact so it will never make sense.
>>543684823All centralizing regimes need an enemy to rally against. That said its communism with chinese characteristics and debating it otherwise is retarded. The MZD era was a long war against the aristocracy and the creation of a new state.
>>543684896the "Chinese characteristic" is allowing private investment through Hong Kong
>>543684416Western socialists and communists tend to be big advocates of labor unions. Just point out to them that labor unions are basically nonexistent in China, and those that exist are under CCP's tight control and are basically just clubs where they socialize and give new years gifts etc.
>>543684416Anon China industrialized thanks to American pouring billlions in countering the soviet union
>>543684936in layman's terms, imagine you lived in CHAZ, full communism. but now imagine one member was getting envelopes full of their parent's money once a week.
>>543684896You have no freedom. You have to watch what you say lmao. Otherwise it's the gulag for you.
>>543684896Look man, the term has lost its meaning. China has billionaires and classes and a free market. It has all the hallmarks of capitalism. It just has top down planning, which is a communist friendly idea. But it just shows authoritarianism works. At least until your dictator dies.Calling it communism is dishonest.
>>543684416"Communists" like to bring up the value of labor, but their labor has no value. Any idiot can work a cash register or flip burgers.
>>543685272it doesn't have a free market, foreign companies and individuals can't own anything in Mainland China (they own the means of production). the market only goes one way. they can in Hong Kong but that's irrelevant, or is it? that's what people usually mean by China.
>>543685465what they have started doing is establishing Free Trade Zones. communist countries usually do this. the first one was in Shanghai, trying to emulate Hong Kong, but this was as recently as 2013 and with mixed reception because how 'free' are they? the government can just shut you down at any point. they do these small things trying to get away from communism, but to say they are a free market and have been for 40 years is the usual nonesense about China. but if you include Hong Kong then for sure it's a free market. that's my point though, you don't mention it, it doesn't make sense. Taiwan is another factor but it's a separate country (China doesn't think so and they trade with them, actually they don't officially, never happened)
>>543685678why would a free market even need a free trade zone?
>>543685784
New capitalist cope dropped
>>543687604lol,lmao. every thing is capitalist cope according to commies
>>543684416>Its economic success came after it liberalized its economy and introduced market-oriented reforms.Wrong, "Dengist" reforms were already being instituted by Mao, and China's largest economic growth was under central planning. Shock horror, development has phases, every Marxist understand this. Even the West initially developed under heavy Government protectionism and plans.
>>543684416Can you blame though?The people who hate China keep yelling at everyone that they're communist.
>>543685465>it doesn't have a free market, foreign companies and individuals can't own anything in Mainland China (they own the means of production)Same as was in the third Reich?
>>543689318Deng was a devout communist, this idea that he was some free market capitalist is one of the wildest copes from the failing muttmerican empire
>>543689318>Wrong, "Dengist" reforms were already being instituted by Mao,Mao didn't disband kolkhozes.First it needed maosists scum removal.P.S. Btw Soviet stalinist commies like Gorbachev refused to disband kolkhozes too
>>543689962You're going to end up with an equivalent in the future anyway as farming becoming more and more automated.Lots of the stuff was just before it's time frankly.
>>543690016>1979 year Chinese farm>automation
>>543689906>devout communist,>disbands kolkhozes >brings back kulaks and proletariat exploitation by kulaks via grain prices gouging
Socialists here will decry capitalist exploitation like Chinese sweatshops in one sentence, then turn around and call China a shining example of Communism in the next.
Modern China does justice to Bukharin's ideas. But it is very far from what tankies would like, it's more like fascist economics than anything. Tankies like Mao who was total disaster. Feels like Mao, Lenin, Trotsky were a project of the western left but eventually the locals had enough and made their own version of communism that kinda works and purged the old retard-tier revolutionaries.
>>543690248>Feels like Mao, Lenin, TrotskyWhat Lenin does in this group? He started NEP after all quickly realizing Marxist mumbo jumbo doesn't work. He was realpolitik man, who didn't put ideology on to no matter what.
>>543684896The MZD era was pure chaos. It was a period of senseless slaughter and needless suffering. In the end, nothing really changed.
>>543690392You're right, he did start NEP. Pol Pot fits more into turbo retard group
>>543684416Capitalism is domination of top market whales, what China did is for sure not capitalism but state domination. You are right that it is not succes of communism, but succes of leninist state? For sure!
>>543684416China is a national socialist ethnostate.
>>543684416You say this but if the capitalist world implemented the exact same policies as China right now, the usual suspects would be out in force crying about how it's communism and muh freedums are being infringed and so on. All it would take is an earnest implementation of Xi's "houses are for living in not for speculation" philosophy and the same cuckservatives who hail China as a "capitalist" success story would be pissing and shitting themselves the moment their parasite bux stop rolling in. And can you imagine the fallout of Chinese style anti-corruption purges in the West? Most of ruling class would be imprisoned or executed for committing economic treason against their own countries. These are the same people who think AOC and Bernie Sanders are hardcore Stalinists. They have no idea what the fuck they're talking about.
>>543691923I have been officially diagnosed with schizophrenia by a hospital psychiatrist. I receive $1,702 in disability every month. AMA.
>>543691923China is doing well, but China would do even better if it implemented more capitalist policies. The CCP is, unironically, holding back Chinese economic growth.There isn't a single nation on Earth that became economically poorer because of freer markets.
>>543684416That pic would make a great "it's afraid" meme
>>543684416True>incoming tranny seethe
>China is evil communists! We have to stop them!>Umm actually China is capitalist with Chinese elementsPick one. So you admit there's no reason to hate China then
>>543684416Stfu jeet
>>543692637>>543692680TRANNIES INCOMING
>>543684416I cringe so hard when leftists praise china. The chinese system is pretty much outright fascist but because they call themselves communist, idiots believe that their communist.
>>543692022How did you fake your illness? Are you and all your people that do this ashamed of yourselves for stealing my hardworking tax dollars?I've been busting my ass for 30 years and my body and mind are totally broken. I can't keep this up long enough to survive and I will die in the street. Any way I can get in on your scam?
