As you go to the polls to vote, today, you might want to consider not falling into this perpetual trap of western political belief.
>>545450040Communist China is very capitalist today.
>>545450040People who argue politics along ideological terminology are middle IQ retards
I have never met a fascist that cared about free healthcare, property is explicitly not free in china, Chinese policies like the 1cl has created a demographic imbalance where minorities are 10% of the population but having 40% of the babies, they do not have trad values because they abort millions of babies and the women are horrible materialists, china has literally been at war with taiwan for 90 years, china is not the number one military power by even a longshot with russia having a stronger army than them, and china's economy has recently gone into recession as demand for their products internally has collapsed.The only actual reason I would want to be communist is because I know too many liberals from familes where mom is a nurse practitioner making 150k a year and dad is a lawyer making 500k a year and they spend their time taking down to you while pushing trans rights. Total bourgeois death.NIGGER
>>545450215LMFAO. It's a 1 party communist nation, and you people perpetually post this misinformation in order to gaslight the public over your own failures, and the massive victories of your communist political opposition.>>545450269No. People who....*checks notes*....understand the differences in political views and have discussions about which ones are correct or wrong, are not "middle IQ retards". No. One more viciously incorrect post, from /pol/.
>>545450040What a foolish thing to say. The game is fixed, and no-matter who you select, you should be assured they will propagate the same underlying agenda.All forms of authoritarianism/totalitarianism are garbage.
>>545450040China of the 21st century has more in common with Italian fascism than Maoism, Stalinism and certainly American Bio-Leninism. It is more capitalistic than America and what makes it work is that it is authoritarian and many of its recent leaders were not wordcel lawyers but engineers.
>>545450312Everything in the post, per usual for this western misinformation echochamber, is just complete fiction. Just complete fictional claims about communist nations, which are pretty much fucking utopias, which are intended to put them down and brainwash the western public to continue manufacturing the consent for their own complete enslavement to private interest billionaires.
>>545450492Once more, as written above, China is a 1 party communist nation, and you try to misinform people over this fact here in order to keep the western public from understanding just how badly your policies have fucked them, and just how well the policies of your communist political opposition have worked for people abroad.
>>545450480>All forms of authoritarianism/totalitarianism are garbage.....you're fascists here. your politics involve viciously fucking over the poor and working people of this nation, in order to benefit the wealthy. and when you call yourselves "libertarians" it's just another label you invent for your politics, in order to gaslight the public even further.
>>545450040Health care is not free in China. It is cheaper than America but it is still insurance through your job.
Whatever is in my ethnic interest
>>545450040Fuck off, shitskin. At least since USAID was cut there have been far fewer of you
>>545450750Wait, what do you think importing millions of your fellow shitskins has done to the working man of this country? I’ll wait for your erudite response
>>545450621>When 20th century kikes adhere to Marxist dogma, try to facilitate class warfare, perpetual revolution, planned economy, forbid nationalism for the goyim, and millions starve to detah as a result of their talmudic rampage, it was not real communism>When 21st century China adopts a mixed economy, facilitates class cooperation instead of class warfare (like fascists), becomes strongly nationalist (like fascists), and focuses mostly on domestic issues instead of trying to export its ideology, and it all works, its real communism
>>545451295>>545451235No matter how many times you make posts pretending "the leftists" were behind USAID (imperialist, fascist org which was literally involved in the overthrow of leftist governments in foreign nations, replacing those leaders with fascist demagogues in their place.) or repeat your internet feed, MSM narratives about "leftists being responsible for the mass-immigration", the fact is these things are your own policies, here in your own western, fascist nation which opposes leftist politics all of this planet. The mass-immigration you've created in order to keep your precious capitalist economy afloat, because this capitalist economic policy requires mass-immigration in order to exist. No matter how much the wealthy capitalists on television brainwash western publics to blame "the leftists", or "the jews" for their problems, these will always be your crimes. You will be held responsible for them, one day. The people of this nation, I'm very certain, will not be fooled by your brainwashing forever.
>>545451556Boy, you just had a really powerful conversation with yourself. Unfortunately, the conversation exists entirely in your own head, and has nothing to do with my views, or leftist views, or the actual facts of modern day China, which is a 1 party communist nation no matter how much you people try to gaslight the public over these facts in order to cover-up your own failures.
>>545450451>you people perpetually post this misinformation in order to gaslight the public over your own failures, and the massive victories of your communist political opposition.I have no love for communism, or China for that matter, I'm just stating the facts.
>>545450215>state de facto owns the people, land, and economy>the state controls businesses>artificially manipulates the currency>one-party state>capitalist
>>545450979and being cheaper isn't a plus because wages are lower and the economy is weaker
>>545451931See >>545451849
>>545451849I understand you oppose China, and communism. That's the point. You're posting misinformation about communist nations in order to oppose them. Basic reading comprehension here. And no, nothing in your corporate Google AI query about China bares any relevance to the facts of the Chinese economy, given that the western internet is rise with vicious misinformation on each and every communist nation on the face of this planet.China is a 1 party communist nation, and there's a vast misinformation effort underway within western nations to gaslight and misinform the public over these facts, in order to cover-up how badly your own fascist policies have failed whilst communist policies have produced prosperity and geopolitical victory."Capitalism" in China exists only in free trade zones which were implemented under the boot of western pressure decades in the past.
>>545452127>>545451849PS now I will eagerly await your response in which you pretend not to understand the concept of "free trade zones", or the geopolitical history of the United States imperialistically forcing China and other communist nations to implement them, in order to evade war or economic lockout from the rest of the world.
>>545452127>We're now at the levels of 'it isn't real capitalism' cope when it comes to ChinaThe fucking delusion of some people is unreal at times.
>>545451556>>545451693he's telling it how it is. you lost tranny
>>545452412Like I told you >>545452229. I knew it was coming. I'm psychic.Once more, China is a 1 party communist nation. No matter how much misinformation from the western internet you post everywhere. If you want to cordon off every big private industry in the west into a few open air prisons, then reduce the cost-of-living for everyone outside of those few areas to zero, as per the policies in China, then we can begin a dialogue about that, for certain!Do you want to do that? Do you want to do that, here in the west? No, didn't think so.
>>545452441Your posts here frequently rely upon just making up blatantly fake posts from your political opposition, then fighting with your completely manufactured fake posts.Just part and parcel to the bullshit of /pol/. Unwillingness to recognize basic facts, too, ie China being a 1 party communist nation.
>>545452127>communismThe way you use that word causes it to cease having any meaning.I for example am a dues paying member of the Nixon-Leninist party which also seeks to put in place itself as the sole party and establish authoritarian government. Are we communists? We can style the name of our ideology however we like, maybe we can style ourselves as communists on Tuesdays. You keep reading a fucking script, tell us what makes a communist, like a working definition because technically I qualify with my party yet I'm a monarchist aka rightwing as fuck.
>>545453012You're trying to erase the meanings of words here in this post. That's all this is. This is another typical fascist mind fuck. Talking about "Nixon Leninism" or referring to yourself as a communist monarchist. You're just intentionally trying to confuse people with contradictory things which make no sense. And this is a famous way fascists mindcontrol people, by destroying the language in order to prevent them from discussing political concepts. This was described at length throughout Orwell's 1984.And obviously you're trying to accuse me of doing this, for no particular or valid reason, because accusing your political opposition of whatever you're doing is just another infamous way you people confuse and mindcontrol the public.
In George Orwell's 1984, for anyone who doesn't know, part of what Big Brother did was to erase the language in the hopes that once people could no longer accurately discuss political concepts it would become impossible for them to politically organize. This is a common theme when it comes to posts on /pol/. Once you understand this is what posters here frequently try to do, then you will notice posts of that type in more-or-less each and every thread.
>>545451584Oh wait, you’re that same tankie who thinks Mao was right wing
>>545450546>It's misinformation because... It just is!
>>545450040"Communists" (i.e. Leninists) were the original fascists
>>545454471>lumps in Palestine with SJW caricature>Nazi flagSo... what, are we supposed to support Israel instead?I get that you can hate both, but to be fair to Israel you don't see any of these SJW freaks defending it. Revealing
Westoids can't think in terms of pragmatism and efficiency because of moralfaggotry and religion
>>545450040Fascism and communism are literally the same thing
>>545453345Oh look, no definition of communist. I wonder why.
>>545454241I've never written anything of that nature. I doubt anyone who has communist views ever has.>>545454471The claims in the post are empty, completely fictional anti-communist propaganda. Of the type usually posted on /pol/. That's correct.>>545455237"Communists are the real fascists" I mean, OK. It's just what I was describing above in terms of Orwell and 1984 NewSpeak, where you people just perpetually work to destroy or pervert language, in order to confuse the general public and prevent them from even being able to discuss politics.>>545455469Again. Read above. And read >>545453622, >>545453345.
>>545455717There exist non-Leninist communists, you stupid nigger. Not everyone supports a one-party state, and not everyone is convinced that a different coat of paint actually matters. Just because people call themselves "communists" doesn't mean their actions magically bring a communist society closer
>>545450040corporatism is actually closer to whatever the fuck is happening in China right now than communism is. Who the fuck has a credit card score system run by the state or city council in a communist moneyless utopia? That don't make no sense.
>>545450040>China>CommunistLmao @ lefties
>>545456151>corporatismi.e. fascism, as Mussolini himself defined it
>>545450040The Republic of China (Taiwan/real "China") is not part of the People's Republic of China (Authoritarian Communists/fake "China"). The PRC does not have Heaven's Mandate. The fact that the PRC is an asshole to its neighboring countries is small dick energy. The Century of Humiliation will continue. I do not even like Trump.
>>5454557171984 was based on Stalinism
>>545450040>fascism, the ideology that puts all power in central government, is the exact opposite as communism, the ideology that puts all power in central governmentnice try lol
>>545451995True, but it’s still proportionally cheaper, approx £30 to see a doctor, and your insurance carries on into your retirement. It’s why Chinese people have large savings.
>>545450040I have a second house in China in my wife’s name, it’s very nice. When I go there I don’t see a single libtard, jew, brown or black, very refreshing and it’s the future.
>>545455717>>545455717We both know what kind of ideology 1984 was written about, so if you really want to be about preserving the full meaning of words and not regressing into newspeak but want to help us understand concepts and the full contextual meaning of things then give us a definition of communism. But you won't because communist means whatever is convenient to call it for revolutionary faggots to acquire power. If you don't like this then give a definition. But you won't because you're a faggot.
>>545450040How China operates is closer to fascism than communism.
>>545456427Hilariously enough, it really is that simple. This is why I hate Leninists so much. Fascists are at least honest about the fact that they want power for power's sake (now you understand the mentality of those who chose fascism over "communism" a century ago)
>>545456771/thread
>>545456298>>5454565701984 was written by the CIA. And it's well-known public record that they funded the film adaptations of both 1984 and Animal Farm. Correct. But leftists adopted 1984 as one of our favorite works, regardless, because we recognize it as the most classic instance of "accuse my enemy of what I'm guilty of", and in doing this they gave away many of their own techniques for mind control.You can obnoxiously point out who it was written about as much as you want, that does not matter. Bragging about your precious well-known CIA propaganda against communism is only another self-own in the end, ultimately.Once more, the vast majority of you in this thread are now just resorting to NewSpeak techniques, in which you try to erase the language in order to confuse people, and make it more difficult for them to discuss political concepts or ideologies. For example, I'll tag this guy, too, because it's clearly what he's trying to accomplish in this thread right now >>545456042.
>>545450040China isn't Communist. It's officially "Socialist with Chinese Characteristics"Fascism is Socialist as well
>>545456771You can really drop the "I'm not a fascist on /pol/, I'm just a communist who opposes communism, and I'm going to gaslight you by trying to argue about, or redefine, the meaning of every political word" grift here. Please. As discussed above. 1984. NewSpeak. Everyone knows what you're doing. It's very clear what you're doing. Everyone knows you're not "a communist" who just happens to oppose communism, or whatever.
>>545457210So the CIA book was good when you want to use it for your points but its propaganda when we want to use it for our pointsGotcha. How typical
>>545457295>>545456641Every fucking post in response to this thread is either people trying to invoke George Orwell 1984 NewSpeak in order to redefine the political words, thus confusing the public, or you people just fully gaslighting the fact that China, a 1 party communist nation, is even a communist nation in the first place. On every level, everything in this website exists for the purpose of deceiving and misleading the public in order to ensure they can't ascertain even the most basic understanding of the geopolitical world around them.
>>545457483Why dont you tell us why you disagree with that assessment instead of just screaming 1984 whenever someone says something you dont like
>>545457359I say again; there are non-Leninist communists. It's far more revealing that you insist on equating Leninism & communism.>>545457557Because they can't think, of course
>>545456151>>545456259Again, "corporatism", just another empty buzzword you people throw around to try to confuse people, and make them think these things are way more complicated than they are. China's a 1 party communist nation. Let me repeat it 1 more time: China's a 1 party communist nation. No matter how much you try to deny this fact in order to cover-up how successful communist nations can be, and how badly your own fascist policies here in the west are viciously losing to them.
>>545450040Economically they are a state capitalist nation.
>>545457483>China, a 1 party communist nation, is even a communist nation in the first place.You lacking a nuanced understanding of politics does not mean s/o else is using orwellspeak. One party system, Socialism, and Marxism are three entirely separate things. Now kys boomer retard
>>545457598China doesn't have a communist economy. They're basically just a dictatorship. A dictatorship is only as successful as the leader. You haven't seen what becomes of China after 5 different leaders have come and gone, because it would look a lot like Rome.
>>545457598Germany was a 1 party socialist state, I dont see you calling them communists
>>545457797>>545457789>>545457753>>545457716Just the hilarious unwillingness to recognize basic facts from /pol/.According to /pol/:>Fascist USA is communist.>1 party Communist China is fascist.>Fascist Germany, or Italy, was communist.I mean, everything here always has to be the complete opposite of the facts, just because you exist to play headgames with people here. To mindfuck them into oblivion, to the point where they no longer can understand anything about the world around them.
>>545457797Nazi Germany unironically had a stronger claim to being socialist than ANY "communist" state has EVER had to being communist
>>545457444That's right, actually. Like I wrote above, you wrote it as a means of propaganda against the USSR, but then leftists ended up loving it and adopting it because we understood it was a matter of one of the world's biggest mirror confessions, in which you gave away numerous of your fascist mindcontrol tactics. Not a difficult concept I'm describing here, you can keep on pretending you're too fucking dumb to understand it, though, per usual for /pol/.
>>545450040I voted for the Dems because Ive never been a boot licking, pistol whipped dumb ass.
>>545458059>fascist USAGod I wish. Were not fascist, were just a garden-variety oligarchy. >1 party system means communistSo was the NSDAP communist? >>545458115I miss Hitler, anon>>545458187So youre spineless and have no morals or ideals. Not suprising.
>>545450040>the complete opposite of communismel oh el
>>545458115The soviet union didn't claim to be communist
>>545451556Bodied the freak
>>545456427>>545456771Communism vs fascism are directly opposite political ideologies. 1 is government run for the wealthy, in which The People are enslaved. The other is government run for The People, in which the wealthy are brought to justice.>>545456771>>545456042No. You're just a fascist manipulatively trying to invoke this completely fictional notion of "libertarian communism", in which wealthy people aren't held accountable for their crimes. And that's just objectively not what "communism" is. You're trying to rewrite the political words, per the 1984 NewSpeak methods written about above, in the usual fascist fashion. Please drop the "I'm a communist, but let me tell you why I despise communism" manipulative bullshit.
>>545458533A wall of your empty fascist propaganda means completely nothing. Your politics, as fascists, exist to divert public blame away from the wealthy and powerful by peddling manufactured culture wars and Jewish, or otherwise convenient, scapegoats, in order to protect them from prosecution. That's it. No matter what empty rhetoric you have about yourself. You just exist to protect the wealthy and the powerful, and everything else you pretend to be is patently bullshit. And the economic policy that adopt is capitalism, with complete unfettered opposition to socialism, no matter how much you claim "we're not into capitalism because it's in our name."
>>545450451>>545451931>Oh no, muh one party nation...What the fuck do you think the US is, retard memeflag shills?
>>545458689>*plugs ears*>"lalala I cant hear you lalala"This is why we dont take leftists seriously
>>545458527Maybe not to the prying eyes of liberal democracies or their own middle class. I'm fairly sure they claimed as much to the non-educated parts of their population
>>545458391No one wrote anything about "1 party nation means communist". I mean, you people just completely make up fabricated quotes, then respond to them, constantly.The United States is a fascist nation, which has been involved in an 80 year long war with leftist politics everywhere they exist upon this globe. We fund fascist militias in every nation they exist. We assassinate leftist politicians, and replace them with fascist dictatorships. We're presently involved in 2 very high profile conflicts in which we're explicitly on the side of fascist militaries right now (Israel vs Iran, and Ukraine vs Russia). The government further peddles identity politics to the entire public, (more information in the pic related), in order to divert the public attention away from their class conflicts, war and economic problems. The United States is a fascist nation, and part of why you deny this fact to people is in order to evade blame for your failures.
>>545458997That doesn't have anything to do with my post. Per usual, the projection. The empty blame of your political opponents for whatever you're doing. Do you want to respond to the content of my actual post? No, because you can't. Because those are the facts about fascist politics, which you fundamentally cannot answer for, because they are just the most basic fundamental facts about what you people do, here on /pol/.
>>545450040But China doesn't have free healthcare. Infact, it doesn't have welfare of any kind at all really, even pensions. You're expected to provide for yourself and the state sure as shit isn't subsidising your existence.It doesn't have free property either, infact it has some of the most insanely expensive property on the planet. A square meter of property in somewhere like Shanghai or Beijing is way more expensive than even somewhere like New York.They aint got traditional values either. Mao destroyed that in his four olds campaign.
>>545450546You're lying. And you know you're lying. Why?
>>545459634This is just fictional information, per usual for this board. Just fictional, vapid, empty, anti-communist propaganda. The usual "no, communist nations are bad! and everything is bad there!" but they're not. And the more communist China grows to become the world's undisputed geopolitical force, the more difficult it is for you people to just post your usual vapid lies about the policies there are, and aren't.For example, you make this claim about "high real estate prices!" in this nation where they have near 100% home ownership rates, and what you're doing is focusing on a very tiny free trade zone, cherrypicking the economic data from this extremely unusual 1 spot, and then pretending it applies to the rest of the entire country. And most of the false claims you people make are based upon mendacities just like this one. Or often times you just make bullshit up from thin air, when you can't even find a little factoid to cherrypick in order to predicate your misinformation upon. It's all fucking fiction, though. Just all fucking fiction.
>>545450040lame
>>545459934>>545459634PS also when you make your claims about Beijing and Shanghai in particular, those are completely fictional. Like, Beijing, I know, has almost a 90% home ownership rate, even according to western data which usually is predicated against the facts of how wonderful everything is for people in communist fucking China.
>>545459664Because they want to hurt you
>>545459934China doesn't have nearly 100% home ownership though, it's probably closer to 50-60% if you ignore the fact that the CCP own all land in China and only rent it out.You have fallen for CCP propaganda again. They define home ownership differently.In the US, a home owner is someone who owns a home. If they own 1 home, or 100, they are a home owner.In China, they count the number of homes owned. If someone owns 100 homes, that is 100 "home owners". Naturally almost 100% of homes are owned by someone.You've just falled for the communist trick of changing the definition of something. Nigga they been doing this shit for like 100 years and you still falling for it.I mean, just look at the rental rates in somewhere like Beijing or Shanghai. About 50% of people in those cities rent. It's the same across the country. How the fuck can there be almost 100% home ownership rates when almost half of everyone is renting?
>>545459664Every time you people post, you just make up infinite empty, false claims about communist nations, or whatever other political topic is being discussed. You people in this thread won't even face that China is a 1 party communist nation. Then, when you won't be able to get away with that lie, you begin arguing about what words like "communism" or "fascism" mean anyway. I mean, whenever 1 of your bullshit lying attempts fails, you just immediately move the goalpost, and move to an entirely different attempt. And each time, you're completely unwilling to recognize even the most basic of facts when they're presented to you. You're just grifting, empty propagandists. None of you even believe your own bullshit, and most of you were paid, professionally, to do this job of posting political propaganda.
>>545450040china is the closer to a national socialist government than any other nation on earth. china is not communist in any meaningful way.
>>545450040China is in no way communist you'd fucking retard
>>545450040>>545450451>c-china is communist!Funny because you were the one calling them "state capitalist" just last week.
>>545450040If you try to do in the west what they do in China, you literally will be called a fascist. You can't just call a successful state a communist, and then also call globohomo nigger worship communism and pretend that these two are the same. You can't just pick success from one jar and all the actual policies from a different jar.
>>545457598Look up Peronism
>>545460320It's undisputed by any western source, even MSM outlets which have vicious anti-communist agendas, that the Chinese government has a near 100% home ownership rate for it's people. Even CNN, for example, in an article I'm not going to post because it's characteristically rife with misinformation, recognizes they have a near 100% home ownership rate.And every other claim you make in this regard about communist china is also completely fictional, and predicated only upon your fascist agenda to post anti-communist propaganda.
>>545460672No. I'm not looking up any of your western propaganda buzzwords, which exist to gaslight people, confuse the fuck out of them, and fuck up the language around political movements in ways that make it impossible for people to understand, or discuss what's happening to them. Fuck you. Fuck your widespread western mendacity.
>>545460423>>545460437The CCP officially calls it "communism with Chinese characteristics".And yes, China is essentially communist. There is essentially no private enterprise in China, it's all CCP run. Every company in China that hires more than like 10 people is legally mandated to have a CCP member sat on it's board of directors, and whether it's a lowly factory worker, or the CEO, they all answer to this CCP member.>>545460719It's undisputed because they do no research. China defines home ownership differently to the west. Commies have been defining things differently for a hundred years, and retards in the west eat it up all the time.
Here a definition of communism since the faggot won't supply one. It isn't state ownership of the means of production. It's a political formula that legitimizes the rule of an organized elite by mobilizing the masses through abstract altruism and moral crusades.Academia, media, and bureaucracy supplies the ideology. Marginalized groups supply the revolutionary constituency. The progressive elite supplies the leadership. Oppression supplies the permanent justification for expanding its power.Workers and peasants become racial and other identity-based constituencies; class struggle becomes identity politics. The ruling class doesn't need to abolish capitalism. It just needs to control the institutions that define legitimate opinion, distribute moral status, and determine who may exercise power.America can therefore be communist while remaining thoroughly capitalist in its economic arrangements. The revolution happened in the institutions, not the ownership deeds.>1984Then give a definition faggot
>>545460877Heh. "It's undisputed, but I'm still going to dispute it!" now. No. It's just fiction what you're posting. And home ownership is not different China than it is in the west, either, no matter what other false claims you make about that, except for the fact that they pay no property taxes or mortgages for their home. Meaning, they have actual access to property ownership, whereas we have only the illusory mirage of home ownership here, unless you're very wealthy.None of you here will accept these basic facts, because you're purely psychopathic, paid, professional propagandists for western governments and billionaire agendas, and your job is to professionally gaslight the public over the ways your fascist politics are fucking them.
>>545460877>The CCP officially calls it "communism with Chinese characteristics".No, they don't.They call it "socialism with Chinese characteristics"
>>545460947None of that has to do with our politics, as communists. None of what you wrote relates or pertains, in any fashion, to our politics as communists. You just thought up a bunch of bad sounding things, and then put them into a post with a header of "this is what communism means!" Per usual for /pol/.Communism is a political philosophy of class war against the wealthy. Nothing complicated. Nothing more.
These people are pathetic. The endless propaganda and endless fucking lies upon this website are absolutely fucking pathetic.
I hope democrats fucking win tonight, man. Even though they're a very right-wing party, and everything in US politics is massively to the right, they're abjectly the lesser of 2 evils, and by voting for them people are clearly, loudly declaring that they're not being fooled by your fucking grifts, in any fashion. I just hope the democrats fucking win tonite, man. I just hope the democrats fucking win tonite.
I voted for democrats downticket. Doesn't even matter if I don't know who they are, of it I dispute any one of their policies. Do I view democrats as the world's most perfect party? Not by any fashion. Do I understand they're demonstrably the lesser of two evils, in very clear fashion? Absolutely.
National socialism = racial communism
>>545450215not a great way to measure communism or capitalism. A communist country would still have non-state spending through independent communes, co-ops, personal importing, craftsmen, etc. Whereas a capitalist country may have a massive state spending from being like france/nordic countries or having an emergency state economy because of a war.>>545451931this person is right (which i hate to agree with a memeflaggot) but the cadre system and chinese interventionism make it fairly non-capitalist. Economist Makoto Itoh explains it fairly well using their banking system as an example in the late 90s.
>>545461635LMFAO. Just another George Orwell, 1984, "freedom is slavery", NewSpeak, complete inversion of what the facts are, and what these words mean. Your politics, as fascists, exist to oppose communism and protect capitalism, and it's wealthy benefactors, by peddling manufactured identity politics and jewish scapegoats. Nothing more. No matter how much you try to portray yourselves in the opposite way, or invert everything in your usual fashion. Your purpose is to divert people's attentions away from all of their class-based political views, and on to meaningless, pointless bullshit which poses no financial threat for the wealthy.
>>545460825Fuck you too. Interest groups vying for their issues is a completely basic idea, and to extend that to solve class struggle with class co-operation alongside the state is not that out there. It's a proven to work model, it's even present here in Finland for example.
>>545461889I'd beat you to death with a lead pipe before a "fascist"
I'm possibly going to log off, for a little bit, but I'll respond to more fucking idiotic, professionally-bullshitting fascist propaganda comments when I get back in a little while if the thread's still up.
>>545459525Do YOU want to respond to the substance of someone's post? You've done nothing all thread but act haughty and above-it-all while refusing to address anyone's points about anything>>545459420>the US is fascist>b- because it just IS ok?! Youre just shuffling definitions around, which is ironic, considering thats exactly what you accuse your opponents of doing
I don't understand how anyone can fall for your grift once it's pointed out. Like "hey, you're diverting the attention away from the wealthy and the powerful with jewish scapegoats and manufactured culture war idpol." Once that's pointed out, I just don't understand how anyone can keep falling for it. Maybe if they were new to politics, and this thought never occurred to them, but I feel like the moment once it's been pointed out, then it's all over for your grift.
>>545462412>I just dont understandNo, you deliberately misunderstsnd soas not to address any of our points
>>545458059From what I remember, one of the top party officials of China travelled to America and was extremely shocked and disgusted by the liberal degeneracy he saw, and whispered in the ear of Xi not to let it happen there. Since that time China has been very anti-western in terms of social policy. In terms of economics they basically are capitalist. In terms of government it's just a dictatorship.
>>545462412IDGAF about protecting some rich cronies
ITT social fascists arguing with regular fascists over nothing
>>545461889>by peddling jewish scapegoats.>and on to meaningless, pointless bullshit which poses no financial threat for the wealthy.Heh?
>>545450040Each democrat deserves the gallows.
>>545462607State capitalist at least
>>545450215LITERALLY the first post is "THATS NOT REAL COMMUNISM REAL COMMUNISM HAS NEVER BEEN TRIED"In the next thread youre gonna say "oh yeah, commie tou like communism, why dont you move to china?" As if you never posted this.
>>545461224Pray tell how China which has minted Billionaires and elevated their own petite bourgeoisie and have rigorous law defending private property arguably stronger than in the west such that they don't have eminent domain, is waging anything like a class war. By that definition they are clearly and plainly not communist as the leveling of Mao and the cultural revolution are like a hangover they recovered from and intend to never repeat while snickering about the United States going through our own version of that with the woke nonsense.
>>545451556>The US State Department calls China communist>The CIA calls China communist>The GOP calls China communistYou, an idiot>See, they're fascist just like me!
>>545450040>the complete oppositeAre you 12?
>>545461224>Communism is a political philosophy of class war against the wealthy. Nothing complicated. Nothing more.That's Marxism, not communism, which predates Marx
>>545450312I have never met a fascisti have met few people who can say what fascim actually is beyond just claiming it is simple racism.
>>545450040You’re a retard, you do know that most actual communists generally see people from the global south as inherently more revolutionary? They want (you) to get replaced by immigrants because they have more revolutionary potential. “American” in this image means white.
>>545463340China is doing market socialism, much like Yugoslavia, which doesn't contradict any of the things you said.
>>545450215But is it REAL capitalism?
>>545463593Even socdems get called fascist because things like free healthcare would benefit (White) Americans.
>>545450040They're racially homogeneous which is why they didn't collapse unlike the kiked USSR. Ill give them that. Same with north Korea.
>>545450040China is in no sense communist.They call it the "Communist Party" in China, just like they call wage-slavery "freedom" in the U.S., just like how they call brainwashing "education", etc.In China they have "socialism with Chinese characteristics". Another meaningless phrase. The "Chinese characteristics" seem to be stock markets and many forms of super capitalism.There is some central planning in China.Wow. Big deal.
>>545463843Stock markets are not capitalism, and actually represent the socialization of capital. That's probably one of the worst arguments you could make about China.
>>545463610China is literally doing corporatism i.e. class collaboration. They have tons of capitalists in the single party that dropped its ideological restrictions in favor of a more broadly national party. They've revisioned themselves closest to fascism.
>>545463768Everyone is a fascist these days. Except actual fascists, of course.
>>545464035No, China is following market socialism. The state controls the commanding heights of the economy while letting a private economy exist. Having capitalists doesn't contradict that at all, and socialism allows for the existence of capitalists because they're building the productive forces.
>>545464035>stock markets are actually socialist guise!!
>>545464084They're not following fascism at all. You don't see China invading countries like Mussolini and Hitler did to extract resources, which fascism requires, because it is essentially a perpetual war state that lives of conquest.>>545464328Public ownership is socialist, which stocks do, yes
>>545463610Can you explain how the United States isn't also market socialism what with the massive gov percent of gdp plus market interventions like bailouts and too big to fail.Communism predates Marx, what were the levelers up to, the United States was formed by them, communism is as American as apple pie. Revolutionaries don't know when to quit, a Stalin here would be a blessing because at least he put the further left revolutionaries to the wall and stopped it from getting crazier.
>>545464484In the US, corporations control most of private fiance and the land. In China, the state owns the land, the railroads, the energy grid and pretty much every strategy sector of the economy. You don't have people Sam Altman and Elon Musk running companies, you have CCP officials.>Communism predates Marx,Marx was revisionist of communism and theories get updated all the time, the Chinese learned from the USSR and what they did wrong, which was ending NEP too early
>>545464781You're comparing ownership structures while ignoring how power actually operates. The US and China are more similar than you suggest: both have enormous corporate-state complexes, strategic public-private partnerships, elite networks, and economies in which political access determines who can operate at scale. China's party-state directly commands strategic sectors; America's ruling establishment exercises much of its power through nominally private institutions, finance, regulation, procurement, academia, and media.The difference is the organizational form. China resembles Italian Fascism more closely: formally private enterprise operating within a state-directed national economic framework, with the party-state setting strategic priorities. America has a communist theocracy who's ruling class reproduces its authority through academia where tenured Professors (modern priests of the communist theocracy) are the equivalent of party officials, moral mobilization, and ostensibly independent institutions all follow the "science" of academia rather than direct state ownership while having our own commisars in every company, the HR department and minority hires.China has party officials directing the corporations. America has corporations and institutional elites embedded in a broader theological establishment.
>>545450215>>545451556>>545451849>>545456244>>545464084Pic related is the single greatest prediction ever made on /pol/. Its correct to the letter.
>>545450040China operates more like fascism than any other major country.
>>545450040China is China, and America is America. And that’s that. No one should cast a vote in the belief that a model that works in other, very different countries would work here
>>545464474What are you talking about? China had tons of geopolitical revisionism with Tibet, the South China sea, Taiwain, Hong Kong, and other territorial disputes, especially over the energy in said territorial waters. Furthermore, no one is fully one particular ideology by definition. Every country tries elements of each. They're all modified ideologies, just as China revised past maoism into Deng and now into nationalism with Xi. The CCP is actively pushing narratives of the revival/rejuvination of the great 5000 years of Chinese civilization. The Chinese Dream (more capitalism). They talk about Taiwan like Nazi Germany's Danzig and other historical humiliations like the Opium wars/unequal treaties like the Germans did about the Versailles treaty. More explicitly, they're committing to active assimilation (sinicization) of the Uyghers (since they did terrorism and separatism), somewhat even with Hong Kongers. Including the aforementioned elements like explicit class collaboration, you have virtually not argument to support this idea that they aren't closest to fascism among all the major global powers. They don't even do much ideological vanguarding for communism anymore. It's all just lip service. They don't even try to export the so called socialist revolution, and instead try to take the place of a responsible upholder of the international order (unless you go against their nationalist reunification project over Taiwan). The only communist element they have left is that they totally will transition into communism eventually after all the fascism, nat soc, and capitalism *wink wink*.
>>545466290This is retarded new fag energy. We've been glazing China as a nat soc state for years. Go look it up in the archives. Even more hilarious is how the chinese revile western communists and their political ambitions.
>>545466913That's one reason why China's perspective on the world order is good for us. They realize that their system won't necessarily work for everyone, and instead encourages other countries to find something works for themselves in their unique situation. They don't try to force a one size fits all ideology onto everyone like the neocons/liberals with liberal democracy or communism among leftists. That pragmatism actively promotes variation within their idea of a multi-polar world order, which is something many dissident western nationalists also believe in. It's a world dictated by national interests. Political realism over idealism.
>>545468533>It's a world dictated by national interests. Political realism over idealismWell, yes, the problem in the West is that many politicians, across the entire spectrum, betray national interests in favor of capitalism. It’s therefore ironic to hear them say such things when Chinese companies are wreaking havoc in the West and establishing their dominance. I don’t know how they can genuinely believe what they’re saying when they personally benefit from the exact opposite. So, while I agree with their stated position, it seems to me that the Chinese are merely paying lip service. The worst thing the West could do is treat China with naivety (which is precisely what we are doing, and will continue to do)
>>545462477You all just seize on this now, any time anyone says "I don't understand" about anything on this board. You just act like everyone's pretending not to understand anything. Another fucking lame, worthless cliche from /pol/.
>>545462779You're always gaslighting people and refusing to confess to what your agenda is, because this is what politics is for you, just the constant deception of everyone around you, rather than principles you actually believe and want to perpetuate.
>>545463340>>545463164>>545463610Every 1 of you people refusing to recognize the 1 party communist nation of communist China is a 1 party communist nation, are just fucking ridiculous. You have zero fucking credibility on this fucking board. None of you here can even face the most basic facts, about fucking anything. China has free trade zones, which were forcibly imposed upon them by western powers. Everyone understands this, and that these capitalist industries are confined to these limited FTZs, but per usual on /pol/ you just pretend you don't understand basic concepts in order to evade having to face them, or to justify your relentless posting of bankrupt misinformation.
>>545467438>What are you talking about? China had tons of geopolitical revisionism with Tibet, the South China sea, Taiwain, Hong Kong,China hasn't invaded Taiwan, Hong Kong was a part of China, and Tibet was always a part of China too. Even your complaints of the "South China" is weird - why do you think China is in the name? Its their water. This is like complaining about the US having ships in the Gulf Of America.>The CCP is actively pushing narratives of the revival/rejuvination of the great 5000 years of Chinese civilization. The Chinese Dream (more capitalism). This isn't really "more capitalism" and a total westoid, baizuo misunderstanding of China. China is following the Marxist-Leninist theory of productive forces, the idea that socialism is about creating a society of abundance through economic growth. This has little do with fascism, and is basic ML theory since the days Marx, Lenin and even Stalin. You clearly don't have any idea what you're talking about.
>>545467652>Go look it up in the archives.Okay I did thay and I cant find anything even remotely close to that so I think youre just mad. Can you maybe provide it because I just spent 10 minutes searching and nothing.
>>545471656>China has free trade zones, which were forcibly imposed upon them by western powers.Lol, China restricting where you can do capitalism in their country is proof their capitalist? Do you even read what you type. And no, China willfully opened up their economy because they realized Mao's ideas were wrong about socialism, and market socialism made more sense from economic standpoint.
>>545450040Up until 1939, that pic would describe Nazi Germany.
>>545450040>China>Communistkek
>>545466285>You're comparing ownership structures while ignoring how power actually operatesNot really. The biggest banks in the US are owned by JP Morgan, Citigroup and Bank of America.In China, they're all owned by the government.Trump does not control or make decisions on how banks are ran in America. Nor do Republicans. In China, the Communist Party quite literally does and regularly executes billionaires.You don't know anything about China at all, and clearly get your information about it from memes.
>>545472032No matter what anyone writes to you people, you perpetually just willfully pretend not to understand the basic facts of any given conversation. You just willfully pervert and invert any comment anyone writes to you. Ignoring what's inconvenient, and just making up completely fictional parts which fit your whims.This is how you "debate" with people. And this is why you're here relentlessly trying to pretend the 1 party communist nation of China is not communist, and then just patently pretending not to understand the basic concepts of their economy whenever you're confronted with them.I cannot believe people fall for the perpetual bullshit and mendacity from you people on this board. Woe to them. I hope they fucking wake up, before it's just too fucking late for everyone.
>>545472186It's a 1 party communist nation. "State capitalism" is a word you people have made up, completely fabricated in your own minds, in order to gaslight people over the communist victories in foreign nations.
>>545471496Straaawmaaaan. I want foreigners out of my country, be that investment or just people.
>>545463301It kinda is. It's basically national socialism. In the Nazi sense. A little bit more distributed decision making maybe?
>>545472392China still has money, China still has capital. It's not communist, it might be socialist, but it also has corporatist elements.
>>545461635National Socialism is more like Racialist Social Democracy
>>545472392Any time basic facts are started, you just post hallucinations you got from Chatgpt. I'm not sure how to tell you here when you are clearly infected with some kind of mind virus.And its so funny you think your opinion matters when the US is a shit hole country that's becoming poorer and less white while China is growing and becoming more powerfulDo you really think trying to win an internet argument with me is going to help you guys lmfao
>>545463530LMFAO. Just more 1984 Orwell attempts to rewrite the english language, in order to write political words out of it, in order to render it more difficult for people to discuss political ideologies. Per what was discussed in the comments above. No. Communism is a political philosophy of class war against the wealthy. Nothing more No matter what bullshit and gaslighting you post. And there's no distinction between "communism" or "marxism" outside of your fascist propaganda where you try to destroy or pervert language for the purpose written above.My connection appeared to just reset. I might be on a different IP now. Not certain. We'll see.
>>545472772yeah that's pretty close to be fair
>>545451849Jesus fucking christ the communist Chinese have a smaller government sector to GDP than almost every western country.
>>545450040>I'm gonna shill for a bunch of yellow people who follow communism, the nemesis of national socialism and who also destroyed the nazis in the 20th century!I never understood this logic from the contrarian chuds in here.
>>545472549No. You don't 'want foreigners out of your country', even. That's just empty populist rhetoric you post for the purpose of getting poor and working people to vote for the financial interests of billionaires. The fact of the matter is you people were the ones exclusively responsible for mass-immigration, because you know full-well your capitalist economic policy requires them in order to remain afloat. I'm the poster you were responding to, BTW, my IP is just different now because my internet connection reset.
>>545472713Communism has nothing to do with "not having money". This is your western, fascist misrepresentation of communist views, which exist to make them appear cartoonish, impractical or unpopular. Communism is a philosophy of class war against the wealthy. No matter what other bullshit you pretend in your fascist propaganda outlets. China is a 1 party communist nation. Your refusal to recognize this fact is just this massive demonstration of your complete defeat in this world, because you can't even recognize the nation that beat you was your political opposition.
>>545472789>Communism is a political philosophy of class war against the wealthy.Not really considering prior to Marx, it wasn't.
>>545472162No. It wouldn't have. It just factually wouldn't have. You people post pseudohistory any time you're discussing the history of the 20th century, constantly. Any time you discuss any of this political history, you're just making-up whatever bullshit you feel fits your whim, opportunistically.
>>545473278Don't care about your fucking cringeworthy post where you think an AI summary (known technology that everyone hates for being completely inaccurate, bullshit, and loaded with corporate propaganda) means anything in any political discussion, first of all. Furthermore, there's no "communism before Marx" or "communism without Marxism". This is just more of your 1984 mendacity, where you're trying to rewrite what these words mean. People discussing "communism" are referring to "Marxism". You can, and people do, use the 2 terms completely interchangeably. You know this. You're just trying to redefine every word in the english language in order to mindfuck the public, and pacify them through robbing them of political language to even discuss different political ideas.
Just the fact that the vast majority of comments in this thread are from fascists pretending the 1 party communist nation of china is "not communist" in order to evading having to admit their political views have lost, must be enough to make people recognize that none of what you post on this board has even 1 bit of credibility.
>>545473534>I don't care about the facts, only my feelings matterSolipsism clearly isn't helping you when you're clearly mad and are crying no one agrees with you or take your opinions into consideration about things lol
Also, in the Communist Manifesto, Marx acknowledges pre-Maxian communism did not support class struggle>"The founders of these systems see, indeed, the class antagonisms, as well as the action of the decomposing elements in the prevailing form ofsociety. But the proletariat, as yet in its infancy, offers to them the spectacle of a class without any historical initiative or any independent political movement.">"Hence, they reject all political, and especially all revolutionary action; they wish to attain their ends by peaceful means, necessarily doomed tofailure, and by the force of example, to pave the way for the new social Gospel"So even Marx disagrees with you lol
>fascism>the complete opposite of communismbruh they're like 95% the same they just take a different turn at the very end
>>545474623No one cares about your fucking rewriting of the word "Communism" to not mean "Communism" anymore, dude. No one fucking cares. Honestly, fucking no one cares. Just drop it. It's 1984 Orwell rewriting of the words in order to make people unable to even discuss political opposition, like written above. No matter what fucking pointless bullshit you continue to post about "communism" not meaning "communism", it continues to mean "communism". You fuck. You're just demonstrating the mendacity you people resort to, literally in order to redefine the language and control people.
>>545474765Fucking another one with the "fascism and communism are the same thing!" You fucking people literally cannot face even the most basic of fact. Every response in this thread is an attempt to either deny a basic fact about communist china being communist, or to just redefine political words in obviously contrived ways to confuse people and obfuscate everything about politics.
>>545475369>>545474765PS, as written above >>545458689: "Your politics, as fascists, exist to divert public blame away from the wealthy and powerful by peddling manufactured culture wars and Jewish, or otherwise convenient, scapegoats, in order to protect them from prosecution. That's it. No matter what empty rhetoric you have about yourself. You just exist to protect the wealthy and the powerful, and everything else you pretend to be is patently bullshit. And the economic policy that adopt is capitalism, with complete unfettered opposition to socialism, no matter how much you claim "we're not into capitalism because it's in our name.""
>>545473293In the 30s Germany had no healthcare, faced mass immigration, had a small economy and military, and no traditional values?
>>545450040Yeah China's been fascist for 30 years. How old are you lol
>>545475450>>545475369>>545474765Your whole purpose is to divert people's attention away from communism or class warfare, and force them to focus on your manufactured idpol or jewish diversions. Your entire premise, as fascists, is to use deception in order to divert people's attentions away from anything which could fundamentally force our government to make meaningful changes which benefit the poor or working people of this nation, instead of the wealthy.
I hate that my IP keeps changing, but there's not much I can do bout it >>545475711.
>>545475494Nazi healthcare was private.And yes they had mass-immigration:>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forced_labour_under_German_rule_during_World_War_II#Forced_workers
