My peaceful resolution to Ukraine/Russian war as a neutral person from a heir of a country that led NAM during the cold war:Fundamental philosophy is that we need to stop the war, now, too many have died for very little meaningful change and that is going to go on for years more1. Russia gets to keep it's current gains2. Ukraine remains independent but neutral 3. Ukro-Russian border is mined up to depth and quantity of Ukraine's choosing, several corridors and border crossings are created, to be manned by UN for the next decade on one side and Russian soldiers on the other4. International aid to Ukraine to get rid of all the war garbage and explosives it accumulated5. International western powers guarantee the independence of Ukraine 6. Western powers start funneling money into Ukraine (that's why the war happened in the first place, surely you guys are gonna do your part and Ukraine is not gonna be a debt enslaved colony)>but the invader will get the territories! That sets a bad precedent and it's unjustifiedPoint is, everyone is happy, Ukrainians and Russians get to play DOTA 2 and Stalker instead of dying, Putin gets territories, Ukraine gets to survive and live better on western money with super high GDP, after all, it is so selfish to expect Ukrainians to die for 2 decades straight just so "good side would win". We need to make sure something of Ukraine survives in the first place, surely it shouldn't be used as some proxy for western interests.This is fairly reasonable. The peace should be concluded with Belgrade. Mail this to your politicians. I have based my realist approach on 19th century gigants like Castlereagh and Metternich.
>>545641713>Point is, everyone is happy, Ukrainians and Russians get to play DOTA 2 and Stalker instead of dying, Putin gets territories, Ukraine gets to survive and live better on western money with super high GDP, after all, it is so selfish to expect Ukrainians to die for 2 decades straight just so "good side would win".Also sometimes we need to swallow a bit of poison. After all, we live in a world where we hung Jesus and ignored Buddha. Like here, Kosovo has no legal basis to exist, it's pretty bad, but you know, slept the same since it happened, we still marry, go to parties etc.Sure Russians got to keep some land but you know, life moves on, we need to approach Russia and give them a piece of cake so Ukrainians get to stop dying and have a future, save some lives and do some good.
>>545641713In practice, a significant portion of Western aid is provided in the form of loans rather than grants. The expectation that Ukraine will be able to service them is already being called 'financial fantasy.' Without debt forgiveness mechanisms (which the West is in no hurry to create) or reparations from Russia (which Moscow refuses to pay), this contradiction is unresolvable.
>>545641713too idealistic. For both sides. And is prone to loopholes like the international aid which just can be used for more supplies or whatever. Ukraine is also neutral, its not nato, not even eu, so unless you got concrete way to guarantee that neutrality that wont be thrown out of window the moment it gets comfy for leadership to start bombing refiniries i dont think it will hold up to anything
>>545641713>Russia:I consent>Ukraine: I consent>Jews: I don't!Isn't there someone you forgot to ask?
>>545641713you are a slav you know that slavs don't just 'let things go' after a bloody genocidal war. Serbs and bosnians and corats are still seething about the yugoslav wars. Why would russians and ukrainians and belarusians not seethe?
>>545641713>peaceful resolution to Ukraine/Russian warTZD.
>>545642244They're crazy. Having a country four times larger on their ass, with money, a military-industrial complex, and nuclear weapons, they sit there and act out, even though they were told a million times in no uncertain terms where the red lines are and that they'd better not go further. For some reason, the Georgians had enough brains to understand and not poke the bear.
If the war ends and Putin has nothing to show for it his political career is over. From the EU perspective it makes sense to depose him since he is unpredictable and might start shit later even after the Ukraine war ends, not to mention that good relations between his Russia and the EU would be impossible due to the bad blood.If Russia under Putin were acting logically they would have never sacrificed their trade power over Europe for revanchist fantasies over some farmland. So now we in the interest of realpolitik want to replace him with someone who isn't aggressive and who can be trusted to be reliable supplier of cheap gas and oil to Europe.
>>545642390you're not a 'bear', you're subhuman scum bandits and murderers, living in a feudal police state.None of the lands you occupy are russian and won't remain under your control, and you will pay reparations for the war you started and a lot of you subhuman scum will die untill that happens.
>>545642425>If Russia under Putin were acting logically they would have never sacrificed their trade power over EuropeEuropean arrogance is also fueled by their conviction that time works for them. That one can wait, outlast, wait for a change of 'regime' or generation. Hence phrases like 'let's try again in 20 years.' This is not a strategy. It is the hope that Russia will tire and give up. But Russia will not give up, because its interests are not reducible to one person or one period. And European arrogance, if not overcome, will continue to hinder agreement. Because from a position of superiority one cannot build equal dialogue. One can only issue instructions and wonder why they are not followed.
>>545642390What if poking the bear is the only option
>>545641713Hang on, let me get Putin and tehm all on the phone, Trump too! Finally, a solution!
>>545642492>you will pay reparationswant to bet on it?
>>545642244
>>545642492Poland – 80 fighter jets. Russia – 1,100 strike aircraft, including all types of strike aviation: fighters, attack aircraft, frontline bombers, long-range and strategic aviation. Russia’s air defense systems are almost 100 times more numerous than Poland’s. Poland, with all its air force and all its air defense, was never able to intercept a single Russian missile.
>>545642492
>>545641713Any agreement that let Russia rest and regroup while still holding Ukrainian land is detrimental and net negative loss to Ukraine. Russia will use the peace treaty to rearm and try again. Russia must fully leave to end the war, but they won't. Therefore, Ukraine's strategy is to hold Russia by the nose until Putin dies, one way or another.
>>545642492>>545642612"po-land" is about as much of a cuntry as oinkrain is. a bunch of fucking mutts brainwashed to believe they are some great nation and a chosen ethnicity, all but to be a thorn in Russia's side.
>>545642526>Suddenly out of nowhere, while no one expecting, for no reason at all, Russia just attacked an innocent country that wanted to join EU for 30 years :(they think like that because they didnt care about Ukranny until 2022, thats why no one knows and care to know why this conflict happened in the first place
>>545641713Hmmmm... Nyo!~TZD
>>545642425You call Putin "unpredictable," but his demands on Ukraine have remained consistent since 2022: the full withdrawal of Ukrainian forces from the four regions, rejection of NATO, "denazification" (replacement of the government), and "demilitarization." This is not unpredictability.
>>545641713>International western powers guarantee the independence of UkraineWell we tried that already, no?
>>545642823Consistently insane demands and unpredictable actions are not mutually exclusive.
>>545641713All of that breaks apart at point 2. All benefits to Ukraine and what they give in return is words.Deals like that were arranged all the time throughout the last decades. They don't work.
>>545642612>1,100 strike aircraftkekyou need an update about your "never" ending Sovjet stock of military hardware
>>545642615>hold Russia by the nose until Putin diesBullshit. Ukraine's defeat is more likely than a palace coup in the Kremlin or Putin's death from a dislodged blood clot.
>>545641713>ukraine gets to surviveukraine, defined as it's people is already dead. the population is gone. genocided.the only thing that is just is full execution of the government for crimes against humanity.
>>545643068>two more weeks and everything will go by planhow long do you wanna repeat this line? Because you can´t even secure the already "russian" parts of ukraine
>>545642615Net negative loss to Ukraine was letting CIA coup its last pro-Ukrainian president.
>>545642728We let the 2014 invasion slide because Ukraine losing a part of their territory wasn't worth losing access to your cheap energy. Your leader saw that a sign of weakness and thought that he could annex the rest Ukraine with no consequences.But we remember the history of appeasement and it's consequences and acted accordingly.
>>545641713Nobody is going to guarantee anything to Ukraine. In reality when they ran out soldiers the war stops and the money stop, and Hohols get thrown to the trash been like a used condom.
>>545643198>MUH CIA COUPNever happened. Russia is just unable to hold white people in its "sphere of influence" without threat or mass propaganda.Maidan started because Putin threatened cuck Yanukovich (who promised EU deal during election) to back down on EU
>>545642728I know what happened. Russia is responsible.
>>545643381The EU delegation offered an economic suicide for a deal, and refused to even provide loans to compensate for it, knowing full well that if Yanukovich won't sign it, then their activists are going to sweep him out of the seat regardless.
>>545641713>serbian subhuman>neutral personOur soldiers during Bosnia war should kill more of you.
>>545643166But what about honesty and objectivity?
+ Putin is a deranged schizo nerd obsessed with Ukraine for a long time.He explained his views on Ukraine in an article published under his name in 2021 :>en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/66181Among over things, he claim Austria-Hungary created Ukrainian identity in preparation for WW1.
>>545643345Good day gulag homo bro.
>>545643381The Maidan is the most obvious state coup in history. And don't give me that "pro-Kremlin Yanukovych" stuff — Yanukovych was not a pro-Russian president, but a parasitic one. Whenever he needed to get something from Russia for free, he'd immediately start blackmailing with his laughable "separatism." We gave him a loan right before the Maidan - so where is the money?
>>545643492Maybe, because of russoid economic threat as I said.And still no CIA. Western diplomats were pushing for a deal between protesters and Yanuk, but the latter fled afterwards.Have a cookie, retard.
>>545643740But can liberal relocants be honest? Their entire political position rests on the fact that they exist only within their own ideological myth—that Putin's war is one man's war for holding onto power, while the rest of society is intimidated, propagandized, and confused. Because if that is not the case, one must talk about Ukraine's position, which has its own bright but also dark sides. In particular, nationalism, hatred of Russian culture and the Russian language, which arose before the war as unfair competition. Or their interpretation of this war as a war of Russians against Ukrainians, rather than, for example, over disputed territories. But one must not look for spots on the sun. What other disputed territories? Then the picture would differ from propagandistic simplification; it would not have such simplicity, such childish innocence: where on one side are the unwashed and merciless orcs, and on the other a freedom-loving people, pure as a tear, embodying full-fledged good.
>>545643345>we remember the history of appeasementAs in the nazis? Isn't ukraine memorializing their historic nazi collaborators (UPA) as national heroes? holding parades for them? renaming streets for them? even risking polish support for their precious nazi collaborators. maybe you need to remember history a little better
>>545643691>But what about honesty and objectivity?basic math is honest and objectiv and it doesn´t add up in your favour
>>545642087Why do you mongoloids insist to tie Jews into your retarded war? You think Ukraine would surrender if zelenski rolled over and died tomorrow? Have you asked actual Ukrainians about this?The only person whose death ends this conflict is Putin, just like how the war in Korea ended 3 months after Stalin kicked the bucket.
>>545641713>Western powers start funneling money into Ukraine >We need to make sure something of Ukraine survives in the first place, surely it shouldn't be used as some proxy for western interests.Maidan was started with proxy money, and the war is supported with Western money.please dont use your brain again
>>545643813>Yanukovych was not a pro-Russian presidenWhere is he now?
>>545642973'Insane demands' are the strategic level; 'unpredictable actions' are the tactical level. Their compatibility does not mean that they form a single 'strategy.'
>>545643813>And don't give me that "pro-Kremlin Yanukovych" stuff — Yanukovych was not a pro-Russian president, but a parasitic one>rile up shit>kill protesters>the moment shit went south, immediately flees to Russiano clearly not a pro Russian president
>>545644113This has long been chewed over since 2014–2015, just like the Maidan movement and US and EU interference in Ukraine’s sovereignty. But what a squeal they raise if things don’t go as planned - nothing but Putin’s interference and bribery.
>>545643813>Yanukovych was not a pro-Russian president>flees to russia You jeets aren't even trying anymore
>>545642492Support Tusk's coup and prepare to be taught by the Germans how to wage war.What? You don't want to do that?
>>545644212Ukraine banned the Russian language in schools and the media, introduces quotas, rewrites history, glorifies Bandera and Shukhevych. On May 2, 2014, in Odesa, pro-Ukrainian radicals drove people into the House of Trade Unions and burned them. Dozens dead. The perpetrators were not punished. Ukraine is not just a neighbor, but a hostile project.
>>545644113he got a new roommate with Assad
>>545642728Many of them hadn’t even started going through puberty yet lolwhat do you expect
>>545644223People reduce everything to one thing: 'He was a Russian puppet,' which, obviously and objectively, does not correspond to reality, instead of understanding the economic reasons for such actions.
>>545644330>Ukraine banned the Russian language in schools and the mediakek, none of this shit happened and till this day nobody cares what language you speak
>>545644212>kill protestersBerkit was unarmed during all maidan coupunknown snipers were cia assets even children now know thatvote AfD
>>545644423What economic perspective does Russia offer in contrast to the EU?Is russia that desperate for ukie made dildos?
>>545644455Then why did Donetsk rise up during Euromaidan? Why did eastern Ukraine always vote for conservative, pro-Russian candidates? Are you really going to brazenly lie?Besides, if they had no popular support in the east, why were there no mass partisan wars there, as depicted in the West?
>>545644423>does not correspond to reality,I'm questioning the reality of the flag you're posting under. How about you post an outlet with your hand and timestamp?
>>545644576Give it a couple of years and Odesa will become subsidized and not fucking needed — maybe even Kyiv. How hard it is for this to get through to you, it’s just unbelievable.
>>545642390The more of you subhumans die, the better. It's as simple as that, Igor.
>>545644598Most insurgents weren’t natives >>545643454Early Azov was mostly composed by Donbass natives btw
>>545644598>why did Donetsk rise up during Euromaidan?Because Putin sent troops in
>>545644753After the blackout in Moscow and the promises to turn Crimea into an island, just like Moscow, life became incomparably 'better' for the Khokhols.
>>545644455The Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine Law No. 2145-VIII "On Education"I swear, the western info bubble is full of goyed up golems who don't even know the first thing about either Ukraine or Russia, but act like they're the experts on the matter.
>>5456417131. Russia gets to keep it's current gainsvictory condition wrapped in a suurender condition. if russia continues, it gets more; why would they agree to this proposal>5 International Western powers guarantee the independence of UkraineA guarantee is something that, in case Russia attacks or invades again, will stop it.This means a Western army in Ukraine. Your proposal is worse than the situation for which Russia invaded. The proposal failed6. Western powers start funneling money into Ukraineyou should make sure the people on your side don't reject the proposal too, not just the russia
>>545644849Fuck off.Zelensky was barking about joining NATO, EU and hosting NATO weapons on it's territory.
>>545644559>BerkitIt´s Berkut you retarded jeet. They where armed on every footage back then>Then why did Donetsk rise up during Euromaidan?Ask your niggers Motorola and Girkin. I´m old enough how they complained that nobody wants to fight for their glorious cause
>>545641713Fuck that, not a single coin to Ukraine.Let Russia have all of it for all i care.
>>545644849>Donetsk>video about CrimeaUS illiteracy as usual
for what? living next to russia is no different from living next to north korea. they are unable to keep themselves to agreements or promises. so let them humiliate themselves in their sunk cost fallacy for as long as it takes
>>545644724nigger, you don´t have a couple of years left to end this shitfest. Judging byyour river crossing track record. This will be another desaster masterclass from russia
>>545643454It's too late to make a move now.
>>545644912Did I anger you, jeet?
>>545644877Every video of you baboons getting blown up is a good video.Got your penguin suit ready yet, Igor?
>>545643871First thing Russia do in a newly occupied territory is destroying Ukrainian language signs, switch schools to Russian, cut ukie TV transmissions and remove elected mayors.Since 2022 the goal is clearly to end Ukrainian identity, or absorb it into Russia.Very 18/19 century style, just like when Jacobin retard destroyed Britanny language/culture into "French" one.And about the 2022 referendum and "territorial claims" : lol, lmao even. Member Kherson after liberation ?
>>545644919So youve known this all along, lmao. self exposed, nice job retard.
>>545644978Ukraine lived on debt, inflating its state debt and constantly begging for another IMF tranche. By 2022, the country’s national debt exceeded 100% of GDP. What growth can there be without kilometer-long credit channels?
>>545644598this >>545644919
russian piggy brings new meaning to the word butthurt.
>>545645083Ukraine doesn't have a space program anymore because all their rockets were Russian
>>545645120The more of you russian pigs that die, the better.It is worth continuing the war just to exterminate as many russians as possible.
>>545644965Oh, Putin surely didn't send troops to the Donbass, they simply got lost amirite ?I can't be bothered digging through my meme folder to find a nice proofster for you.
>>545645182>can only deflect to ukraineYour brain is broken, russian piggy.I am simply glad you goblins are dying.
>>545641713I remember when in 2023, progressives did not want to stop the war, because "it would reignite later".Let this thing keep burning until there is only one side which can fight.Stop all this hypocritical shills
>>545644881They exist just to shit up any thread that shows Russia in a positive light or Ukraine losing. Best bet is to not engage with them as their aim is to prevent discussion of the OP via engagement bait. None of this will stop Ukraine losing, however, so their efforts are wasted.
>>545644965Shut up niggerhttps://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2015/01/06/372872870/the-russian-who-claims-credit-for-fanning-the-flames-in-ukraine
>>545645186There is no evidence of Russian troops being in Donbas before February. Nobody even care to fabricate it.Meanwhile, there is evidence of an Israeli helicopter firing on people in "That October".kek
>>545645111Remember, its ukrainians bussing ukrainians 5 years into this war
>>545645120russians live like this. its also telling that your department cant afford a vpn anymore. because you are either working for russian authorities or you should be reported for illegally visiting 4chan. banned by the czar himself, this is a betrayal of your family and country
>>545645254Why, the engagement was okay, he provided more info that shows Russia in a more positive light.
>>545645144>>545645183>>545645220why did you abandon your gay nigger family to die, taras?
>>545645342The fact is that the Khokhols are being kept on life support. The Khokhols are near death in critical condition. But at the same time bots are vigorously pretending that this is not the case. At the same time, absolutely everyone understands what is happening. But that’s their job - to cover it up.
>>545644881>The Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine Law No. 2145-VIII "On Education"Just because you cannot read, it does not mean that others cannot.
>>545645266whiter than youbtw why he is still alive IN Russia, dont you know?Kremlin wizard told you Putin is ruthless to his enemies, didn't he?Why Igor still alive? Even Navalny died but not the one who exposed russian aggression.You morons never think twice.
>>545645306No evidence? None what so ever?
>>545641713Russia doesn'tn get shit.No. Actually. Russia gets a nuke up the arsehole and every mongoloid kaffer Russian cunt that survives is worked to death in Siberia, all proceeds go to Ukraine. End of.
>>545645342Even if we lived like this, your funding turned Ukraine into shit worse that the picture.see >>545643774
>>545645482real russian patriots dont post on capitalist websites like 4chan, which is explicitly forbidden in russia. real russian patriots ack themselves on tape in ukraine for my personal entertainment
>>545641713How about:1. Russia withdraws to 2001 borders2. Russia pays reparations to finance rebuilding Ukraine and clearing munitions3. Ukraine holds a vote on whether to join NATO4. Kaliningrad returned to Poland
>>545644978By the way, what is 1 village? It's about 2-3 square kilometers of the village itself, plus another 2 km strip around the village, that is, 15-20 square kilometers. In total, 17-23 square kilometers per village.
>>545645491The amount of stuff available must be equal to one from Gaza during IDF advance.There is nothing that is identifying anyone as regular russian military.Have you ever thought about it?
>>545641713Unfortunately you are too sensible to be a dictator in a 3rd world corrupt shithole like Russia or Ukraine.
>>545645530>even ifthis is exactly how you live. like niggers - because thats what you are
>>545645521your permission is not required but you can enforce it by enlisting to the Kiev's regime army
>>545645521Based moderate Boer
>>545645521you and your family will be killed by niggers and no one will care, no one will intervene, no one will remember you. KWAB
>>545645638Even if we lived exactly like this. Why turn Ukraine into shit then? Enlist to the Kiev's regime's army and defend them.
>>545645638are you retarded? legit questionUkraine was always a backwater, even during Soviet times despite Russians trying to boost it with industrial capacity thentoday we see how oinkers display their gratitude
>>545645659Get droned pidor scum
>>545645254>>545645419You shillbots aren't supposed to have this conversation where everyone can see.If you cannot make these distinctions you will be moved to the front line. Please get it right, piggies.
>>545645615Well I guess it was all local civilians who were armed and trained by mysterious benefactors. Not wearing a uniform is a very popular combattant strategy amongst scumbag people so that's something Russians and palis have in common.
russians believe in all sorts of wild fantasies. using the word 'believe' loosely of course - they just parrot what theyre told by whoever is in charge at that time
>>545645782get killed by a nigger, replacement victimKEKAROO
>>545645747>Even if we lived exactly like this. Why turn Ukraine into shit then?a question (YOU) should ask yourself
>>545645801why did you abandon your nigger family to die, taras? why are you hiding and not doing your patriotic duty?
>>545645488>whiter than you>ashamed of flag
>>545645780>despite Russians trying to boost it with industrial capacity thenLol. Your country is filled with failure. Your industrial sector has always been a complete failure.Should Ukrainians be thankful for you subhumans rendering a portion of the country uninhabitable because you're too stupid to construct a nuclear plant?This is why it's a good thing for as many of you subhumans to die as possible.
>>545645745You will stand in bread lines and suck niggers cock to make a few cents to buy your meth - the glorious revolution!
>>545645747>>545645780russia is a nigger hole, and russians have no future. which is why anyone with a brain left russia long ago. why every child of the russian elite lives in europe and not in ziggerland
>>545645780>Russians trying to boost it with industrial capacity thenLike they're doing in Donbas now, lol?
kek russians are so stupid.look at this dumb russian cow mother accidentally killing herself for a pagan ritual:https://files.catbox.moe/xnfl9d.webmand her kids crying in the background, scarred for life witnessing their mother die horribly :)
>>545645550sorry it should have been reported by the kyiv independent
>>545645893>Lol. Your country is filled with fai- AAAAAAAACK
imagine getting your face blown off for a bald midget dictator (who is losing)
>>545645795main point of prooinkukranian retards that russia were fully operational on Donbass since 2014 same way just like after 2022At the same time ukraine’s regular active army nearly lost twice to fucking militia, ending up in encirclement situations, and the Eu Union had to rescue them under the false pretext of a truce on the path to peace and other nonsense.
>>545646001How will this help Ukrainians?
oof, that's gotta hurt, igor.
>>545646068>illiterate goblin retard still missing the point
>>545645486>no, your language is not being removedfast-forward to>removing the language is good actually because you still retain at least some rights
>>545645872anon forum, gtfo to redditmemeflags were first, kys trannie
uh oh taras meltie
imagine getting your leg blown off for putin
>>545646055>ukraine’s regular active army nearly lost twice to fucking militiaLol
imagine getting kidnapped by kikes to die for nothing
But seriously, why are Russians so butthurt?
>>545645944Lol. What happened to the mighty victory over Russia that was definitely going to be all over soon?
why are russians so shit at war? almost 5 years of self acking for the czars personal ambitions. at least ukrainians are defending their blood and soil
>>545646115>memeflags were first
this is somebody's son getting kidnapped to be tortured in a basement somewhere for the crime of being a goy
Crazy how many of these goblins just get casually wasted by surplus munitions.As history shows, Russia is really bad at managing lives.
>>545646026Ooh I forgot:5. Russia surrenders Putin and relevant staff for trial at the Hague charged with prosecuting a naked war of aggression6. Russia voluntarily demilitarises and surrenders its nuclear arsenal to UN staff
Russia stronk
>>545646233If you niggers are so right how come none of you are headed to Kiev?
imagine getting beaten to death on the streets by one of your kike dictator's goons
>>545646230whatever happened to this?
>>545646166you really dont know what are you talking about dont ya?us illiteracy at its best, are you from Mississippi?
It's crazy to think Russians believe westerners envy their way of life.
>>545646285Why don't you enlist and go to Ukraine, then?
>>545646104>may be studied>is not the primary medium of instruction
>>545646304the fuck are you talking about? were helping ukraine kill you dumb niggers and thats clearly working. hence why youre still not in kiev
Slavs aren’t humans you are unworthy of life
where did the tranny's legs go? KEKAROOOOOO
>>545641713>surely you guys are gonna do your part and Ukraine is not gonna be a debt enslaved colony
>>545646322doesnt seem so bad. looks a lot like my hometown of hamilton ontario desu
heres a russian cope map from the first months of the war. still one of the most popular bloggers in russia. russians have even less than half of this 4 years later kek. what an embarrassing failure
>>545646288Your right anon zelensky is just a humble good guy the last REAL good guy like sami zayn. He's just lumped in the president chair rubbing his chin looking concerned with the occassional slava ukraine how can I help my peoples? When it comes to bottom life reaffirming surgey zelensky himself with trudea runs to the soldiers in need of it in the frontline with a evac team there is drone evidence footage of this Russian army caught many times.
>>545646235still whiter than your midterms
>>545646464here's a useless nugget cripple nigger who now begs for change on the street KEKAROOOOO
>>545646464I think the thunder run up north was the best part.
russias yearly pride parade isnt what it used to be kek
>>545646389The devolution of peremoga recently>Russia is losing ground!>Russia is out of oil!>Russians are dying from a plague!>Russia is out of bots!And now we've arrived at>A Russian got beat up by a black dude on the train! It's over!
>>545646535IMAGINE DYING FOR MAN ON MAN ANAL SEX
you will be replaced by browns and you will embrace talmudic values
>>545646371>phasing out a language that almost the entire country speaks out of schools is good, because you can still choose to study it as a foreign languageYeah man, let's just stop teaching kids in French in Canadanian and Belgian schools. It's not like it matters in the Anglophone age anymore.
>>545641713>Fundamental philosophy is that we need to stop the war, now, too many have died for very little meaningful change and that is going to go on for years moreSuch philosophy is currently accepted by most in Ukraine, even by Zelensky and most of his corrupt friends. However, it is not accepted by Putin, who thinks that continuing the war indefinitely is safer for him than ending it here and now without something he can present as a definitive victory.>Russia gets to keep it's current gainsRussia keeps demanding more than its current gains. Even ignoring political implications of surrendering land without a fight, the loss of additional territories Russia demands will put Ukraine in a permanent strategic disadvantage that will allow Russia to restart the war later from a very favorable position.>Ukraine remains independent but neutral That would've been fine in theory, but for Russia "neutral" in practice means "unable to defend itself".>International aid to Ukraine to get rid of all the war garbage and explosivesSure, whatever. It will take decades though.>International western powers guarantee the independence of Ukraine Guarantee how exactly? If no one wanted to deploy forces in Ukraine before, or fight on Ukraine's side until now, then why would that suddenly change after the active phase of current conflict is over?>Western powers start funneling money into UkraineAs a Ukrainian, I'm actually strongly oppose uncontrolled funneling of money into Ukraine. When our government can take infinite cash flow for granted, things immediately get worse. Any funding should have very strict prerequisites attached to it: full transparency on how the money is used, anti-corruption reforms etc. I'd go as far as to say that even military aid should be attached to reforms that are long overdue. That's the only reasoning that can work with those corrupt bastards that have been controlling everything here for 7+ years, with elections being postponed indefinitely
>>545646360Ooh one more:7: Russia apologises for prosecuting the war at the UN and voluntarily surrender its Security Council seat
>>545646469>ESL gibberish
now ukraine plays the victim for cunt retards stupid enough to believe this war started in feb 2022.in the end, the 1991 borders are gone forever and nothing ukraine does will ever under any circumstance restore them
le tank man momentnot even the chinks had the stomach to run their goyim over on camera
>>545646464loved hearing the cope of erm actually the objective was accomplished (?) so they made a tactical retreat also they've not sent in the real army yet! funny how cope also develops over the years
behold the might of the russian faggot army
>>545641713> Western powers start funneling money into UkraineWe ran out of money to give away for no return.Ukraine lost their most precious mineral deposits.They don't have much left that we are interested in.
>>545646762
>>545646795why are you hiding your flag, surely not because you are a jeet nigger?
>>545641713Hohols already met with Blackrock representatives in Paris several days ago. Any way out after the war for the Hruckraine is to sell everything to Blackrock.
>>545646656> even by Zelenskynope, his friends and administration, yes.Zelenskiy is a deadman and everyone understand that.>not accepted by Putina reminder that EU, zelya and Co deceived Putin before. Now you crying that Putin don't want to be deceived again. L - logic.
>>545646656Forgot to select the flag.Also, I'll add that Putin wants more than territories and "neutrality" (whatever it is. He also wants to have control over purely domestic Ukrainian policies such as the official status of Russian language in Ukraine, the presence of Russian Orthodox Church in Ukraine, and other things that will make it easier for Russia to continue spreading their propaganda in Ukraine. We don't need that shit here - and I'm saying this as someone whose first language is Russian.
russians and jeets are one and the same
>>545646836
>Ukraine should remain le neutral>but the west should fully fund Ukraine and secure its independenceThis is literally the same as joining nato which is why Russia would chimp out and never agree to these terms
>>545646888
>>545646887>We don't need that shit hereIf you don't, why are you not in the trench yet?
>>545642615> Any agreement that let Russia rest and regroupHave you been living under a rock until now?It's Ukraine literally begging for a ceasefire to rest, repair, rearm, regroup.Russia rejects any ceasefires for a good reason.
>>545646887Then who will control Ukraine’s domestic policy?
Just gonna walk into this thread about russia and Ukraine surely there will be civil discussion.>>545646389>were helping ukraine kill you dumb niggers and thats clearly working. hence why youre still not in kievPosting memes online is not contributing to any war effort this congratulations this probably the gayes thing I've seen posted in this thread congratulations youve beaten Kremlin vatnik nigger bots and tranny nato fags in being cringe and gay
>>545646922cool it with the jeetophobia, don't you know they're the ukranny's greatest ally? who else has the human capital necessary to replace the tens of millions who fled or died?
>>545642492bro...
OP seems to be suggesting that Ukraine would join NATO. Russia will never tolerate that.
>>545641713>International aid to UkraineWrong, its Ukraine who owes all european countries billions, everything they have should be given to us after the conflict
>>545646950russians are chimps. they chimp out no matter what the agreement isthats why helping ukraine defend itself for as long as it takes is the only path to peace>>545647056through taxes and political support dipshit
>>545642049this, sadly. Ukraine needs to go full Switzerland mode or it will continue to get fucked by both sides. Bit too late at this point, though.
>>545644330>Muh Russian language ban and evil BanderaMakes perfect sense. The best way to protect Russian-speakers from a language ban is to bomb their homes, destroy their infrastructure, and cause massive civilian casualties in the East, while the Bandera-worshipping West remains relatively safe.
>>545641713a pipe dream>1. Russia gets to keep it's current gainsno point to discuss the rest of your list, putin won't ever agree to this, he didn't achieve even the minimum of what he wanted/promised, he even make amendment to constitution about captured territories, even ones he lost since then. agreeing to this is losing face, which is worse than death for that feminine psychology of his
>>545642973> insane demandsThe alternative is the end of the Ukrainian nation and statehood.Everything is heading only in this direction. Time is not on Ukraine's side.
If a reasonable deal could have been made, it would have been.The Russians still think they can win and have a peace where Ukraine has no security relationship with the west and where he'll be able to insert a Lukashenko figure into it to soothe his security agency rotted mind.This war wasn't started for Dombas, it was started for Ukraine, on a subconcious level Russians and Putin understand this, if it stops without achieving it's goals it will be considered a failure and that would be dangerous for Putin in his own system.So it can't stop.
>>545643379
>>545642492Butthurt belter
>>545642390Trying to protect yourself is provocation!>>545641713How about the Russians go back to Russia? War over.
>>545641713Russia demanded less than that in march 2022. Hohols refused and chose war, when they still held the land and had manpower intact, why would they agree now with such sunk cost? Or why would Russia for the same reasons. Much resources were spent, they have to be compensated one way or another. Also Hruckraine's allies are not interested in peace, they have MIC gaining huge profits and orders for production coming, not to mention what they harm Russia by using expendables, not by dying themselves. Peace is detrimental to them. And they pay for the show, thus they orders things around.
>>545647121>through taxes and political support dipshitHoly shit thats even gayer lmaooo according to that logic even the most devout pacifist in the US supported dearh and destruction in the war on terror through paying forced sales tax in the 2000sMy tax dollars go fund Israel and I cant stand those kikes L M A O
>>545647002Been there already in 2023-24. I've seen enough. I had no intention to waste all my life there after it became clear that initial momentum of 2022 was lost, and that everything is horribly mismanaged.>>545647051Ukrainians and whoever they end up electing. Hopefully not yet another populist, of course.
>>545644330>Ukraine banned the Russian language in schools and the mediaabsolutely nothing wrong with that.its ukraine, you should speak ukrainian in there.
>>545647407they fund israel in india?
>>545641713>1. Russia gets to keep it's current gainsWouldn't be enough to justify 4 years of war and all the losses.>2. Ukraine remains independent but neutralPossible, although we know "independent" is just in name>3. Ukro-Russian border is mined up to depth and quantity of Ukraine's choosing, several corridors and border crossings are created, to be manned by UN for the next decade on one side and Russian soldiers on the otherThe Russians may not trust the UN but could be possible>4. International aid to Ukraine to get rid of all the war garbage and explosives it accumulatedPossible>5. International western powers guarantee the independence of UkrainePart of the reason Russia invaded was due to the threat NATO poses to them, why would they allow an existencial threat on their border? If there will still be a platform that launches cruise missiles at Moscu after peace that could reignite whenever NATO says, why the fuck wouldn't they finish the job instead? Peace won't stop that threat and it doesn't look like NATO is going to stop either, it is that simple and that's why this war won't end until one side is defeated.>6. Western powers start funneling money into Ukraine (that's why the war happened in the first place, surely you guys are gonna do your part and Ukraine is not gonna be a debt enslaved colony)And weapons and then we all go to square 1.
>>545647328>it was simply a genocide of eastern ukraine based on nationality. Why did russia attack us? the killing of russians in eastern ukraine is purely a ukrainian matter.kek
>>545642526No, it is not arrogance. It is a fact. Funding a war and killing millions of your own citizen is a receipe for faillure. Not strengh. Russia had many major brake down over history with this exact behaviour, extreme violence or war then break down. 1917 is a prime example of it, then gulags and repression that lead to 1989. Being violent does not make one strong in the long term. Western europe learned it the hard way, and more that Russia apparently. French revolution was not a goal it was a step toward republic. Russia never got further than revolution and is cycling back to feodalism.
>>545647501>muh natois just an excuse. Finland is in nato. Estonia has been in NATO for years. its on their border. They invaded Ukraine in 2014 when Ukraine going in NATO was not even on the table. The only reason for anyone to join NATO is because Russia chimps out constantly
>>545647424so this has already happened with Poroshenko and the current Zelensky. What will be the difference now?
I started believing in God since the Russian invasion of Ukraine just so I can imagine the eternal suffering warmongering Russians and their jeet troops on /pol/ are going to endure in the darkest depths of hell.
>>545641713I like your proposal anon. The biggest flaw I see is the neutrality bit though. There's no way to enforce such a thing, and if it was violated there'd be not much Russia could do about it after a certain point. Sadly, this is the window Russia has to solve the problem, and they have to do what it takes to finish it.
>>545647628show your flag you disgusting nigger jeet
>>545645782enjoy your plaasmoord you cucked niggerlover faggot
>>545647405Russia asked for veto on the forces supposed to enforce that peace via it's UN veto.It was a joke of a proposal.
>>545647696>show your flagAmusing thing to say when you use main vpn host flag in the world.
>>545641713How naive... the war could be stopped in literally one fucking day... Russia has nuclear weapons and military satellites; they can track the movements of every single official in Kyiv or NATO in real time... Now, think about it again: WHY AREN'T THEY TAKING OUT THE LEADERSHIP?It’s a fucking business... these past 5 years, and the 8 years before that...Everyone is fine with it because these countries are run by agents of Western influence... Putin is an agent of the West, Zelensky is an agent of the West... the war is literally being managed by *kikes*—parasites. The *goyim* are happy to die in it every single day... you’re living in a literal version of a planetary hell, and you don’t even suspect a thing...
>>545647751you have been banned from visiting 4chan and other western websites. why arent you doing your patriotic duty and kill yourself?
>>545641713The war will only end with the unconditional surrender of Ukraine in some not so distant future.This is clear as sunshine by now.
>>545647483You can hate the Russians,Ukrainians, kikes and Indians they all suck but your delusion is on another level Make sure to pay more sales tax next time you buy a coke that will definitely show them ruskie niggers who's bossAhahahahhahaha holy fuck bro hey bro good job paying your VAT and how ever taxes work in Europe lmao such a great job bro youre like the Dutch rambo Ahahahahahaha.Ill make sure to call anyone calling me a armchair warrior a pajeet that'll show em Lmaoooooo
Every single person who has aggressively supported Ukraine in the West need to immediately leave their countries and fight in the war. Simple as.
>>545647696anon forum retard gtfo to reddit>>545647751this
>>545646104>fast-forward to nigglets are illiterateqed
>>545647870
>>545647843then why isnt russia in poland yet? why are they still dying daily in the mud of the east donbas against the poorest country in europe and on their border kek
>>545647945I still remember how MI5 fucked up with polonium and novichok.
>>545646055>main point of prooinkukranian retards that russia were fully operational on Donbass since 2014 same way just like after 2022no, it's not you dishonest vile piece of shit. Zelensky always says that in 2014 invasion of Crimea happened, then Russia supplied until 2022 the regions of Donbas, Sevastopol with arms, training and troops, when in 2022 full scale invasion happened. Where do you think seperatists got arms? Ukraine is not US, guns are not laying around at homes, how do you think for 8 years, seperatists fought against regular military.
>>545647748>It was a joke of a proposal.I see, eating up delusions of winning the war against Russiai, accumulated over the years , and as result losing half of population and entire economy with no prospect of it's ending turned out to be better outcome.
>>545647628Things have been going relatively well with Poroshenko. I have plenty of problems with him too, but he was doing a decent job at maintaining balance, slowly moving away from Russia and towards EU, while maintaining the low intensity of conflict.Then the fuckig clown got elected in 2019, gained a majority in parliament with his fake party of frauds and nobodies, and proceeded to ruin everything thanks to his total incompetence. His ratings were at all-time low until the 2022 invasion.Actually, his actions in 19-21 have weakened Ukraine so much that this ended up motivating Putin to start the invasion in the first place. All while Zelensky continued to deny any warnings until the last moment, when it was too late.
>>545641713Nuke Tel Aviv and the war stops
I think another million ziggers should die.
Bro it doesn't matter what we think, because all this is about is mass sacrificing for the next step in their agenda, it's that simple. Both sides are on the same team. It's all scripted. It's all fake bullshit. That is why there is no "solution". It's all so fucking tiresome
>>545641713I don't like the framing of this conflict as between Russia and Ukraine. It's Russia vs the West. Ukraine is just a puppet. The best peaceful resolution here is simply for the West to cut Ukraine off, then the Russians and Ukrainians will settle things quickly after that themselves, with minimal bloodshed.
>>545647617So what's the reason they invaded in your opinion?
>>545648016>I still remember how MI5 fucked up with polonium and novichok.me neither
>>545647870Join the Russian army and make me. The cube hungers for meat.>>545647510>Do something evil>get called on it>scream genocideRussians are like a caricature of jews, but just kind of walking around.
>>545647954Dunno dont give a fuck about either of them I come here to watch cringe from both sides for entertainment You just had the gayest post, I dont think you paying .05 euro extra for a latte helped in any real meaningful way or you post TZD really rallied any person. Just like I dont think Russians post Ukraine pig memes does anything but make them look retarded But posting you personally helped fight the war just took the cake on delusional cringe posting
>>545648156simple territorial ambitions. they thought it would be a quick and easy victory - like in crimea 10 years before
>>545642728Time will humble you down the hard way. Killing and displacing millions never had a justification and never will. Russia did a dire mistake starting this war. Get you shit together : clean your behaviour and you country. There are no reward for creating misery for your neighbours.Are you Christians as you pretend to be or not ?
>>545648156Oh easy. He can't accept the fact the USSR is dead and he wants it back.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbckvO7VYxk
>>545648228it is highly likely that my taxes over the past years paid for at least 1 dead zigger. but youre right, it pales in comparison to how much ziggers contributed to their own demise
>>545646055>to fucking militiayou mean to russian military without insignia and russian tanks and SAM systems. we know this because locals kept posting photos and videos online of them and can be verified by geolocation.https://www.bellingcat.com/resources/case-studies/2015/05/28/russias-pantsir-s1s-geolocated-in-ukraine/https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-europe/2014/11/08/origin-of-the-separatists-buk-a-bellingcat-investigationno point in lying when we have photographic evidence
>>545648194So, a democratic decision by the Donbass region to secede from Ukraine doesn't count?This is wrong type of democracy? This was "evil"? A genocide called ATO isnt evil? What happened in Gaza? Was it Jewish invasion?
>>545647945Friend, wake up - in '14 we didn't have 20% of their territories; now the balance of forces is completely different.
>>545642425>his political career is over.Putin is old and probably wishes this shit would be over so he can retire. Doubt he really cares all that much about his political future, though he surely does care a lot about achieving his goals in Ukraine.
>>545648461>Invade>Hold illegal election>omg we voted to join the invaders!I did a democracy! Why does everyone hate poor Russia for no reason?!
>>545648445>no point in lying when we have photographic evidencmy point exactly in the fact is that you don’t have them and never have.otherwise we call the french international legion a direct france participation in ukraine conflict and thus russia can strike France at any time.
>>545648634but when America invades and holds elections in places, those are 100% legit? please
>>545648461Yes, good point. The propagandists like to use brotherwar card, but isn't it would be a true brotherly behavior to allow people decide in what country they want to be instead of suppressing them with gunfire? Like accepting what Crimea wants to be in Russia, instead of cursing them forever and begin to plan to dry out the peninsula by cutting off water. Brothers don't do that.
>>545642615>Putin derangement syndrome.Putin dying changes nothing. I'd argue the same with Zelensky.>>545643100Pretty sure the leadership in Ukraine will all flee before things fall apart. Sad, but hopefully that will make re-russification much easier afterwards.
>>545648194what happened to the great ukrainian counteroffensive? KEK
>>545648461>a democratic decision by the Donbass region to secedethe reality:>The Security Service of Ukraine (SBU) released an audio recording on 5 May that they said was a phone call between a Donetsk separatist leader named Dima Boitsov, and the leader of the far-right paramilitary Russian National Unity group Alexander Barkashov. In the recording, Boitsov said he wanted to postpone the referendum due to the DPR's inability to control all of Donetsk Oblast. Barkashov said that he had communicated with Putin, and insisted Boitsov hold the referendum regardless of the separatist leader's concerns. He suggested that Boitsov tabulate the results as 89% in favour of autonomy.[31][32][33] Separatists stated that the recording was fake.[34] However, the 89% mentioned in the phone call exactly match the result of the referendum, which took place on 11 May 2014, i.e. several days after the recording had been published.[35]>exactly match the result of the referendum, which took place several days after the recording had been publishedtop kek
>>545648461There was no "democratic decision" there, LMAO. And neither was in Crimea.Any separatist movement loses all credibility when it's actively supported by a foreign player who's using such movement as a way to make a land grab.
>>545648156>the reason they invaded in your opinionit's three fold: 1. pootin wants to stay in power in russia indefinitely, so what's the best way for him to divert the attention of the russians from his kleptocratic regime if not a foreign adversary? The strategy is as old as russia itself. 2. He's also under the delusion that he can unring the bell of the USSR empire falling and disintegrating (muh historical russian lands). 3. He was under the delusion that he could conquer Ukraine in two weeks, and now he can't just stop the war without jeopardizing his position and life itself.
>>545648395You probably paid for some uniforms and some fuel or something since most countries I think are doing non lethal aid
>>545648634>Illegal electionUN can’t argue with that, only object.so‑called 2022 invasion occurred after the regions agreed to become part of Russia.Un can't argue with that either, only object
>>545648271These lost regions are rich in oil and gas. Thus, like all true spiritual Jews, the Banderites would sooner kill every man, woman, and child than give up a few shekels.
>>545642049That's what the minefield is for. And other fortifications.
My plan is way simpler and much more fair and realistic.>Russia retreats to 1991 borders>Russian army denuclearizes and is limited to 100,000 troops>Russia pays war reparations to Ukraine>Putin sent to the Hague to be tried for crimes against humanityOnly a retard would argue against this plan.
>>545648750Yes because do something about it
>>545642244You guys are gonna achieve partial TZD and total THD. Doesn't make sense.
>>545649019We already know you're a subhuman, anon. No need to keep reminding everyone of your state of delusion.
>>545649082Because both sides are retarded this shit aint ending for a while
>>545648903>And neither was in Crimea.Yes, because of that you call them "кpыcчaнe" and wish them dead. Not because they made this choice.
>>545649023I was kind enough in the OP. Meanwhile Russia may resort to more drastic measures. What do you think Metro books are? They are manuals for Russians. They will literally be cannibals in Yamantau mountain and live in metros under Moscow just to own the west. You are braindead. We need to negotiate with thr Russians.
>>545648866> that they saidWhen, as the last time, you heard that Ukraine spread disinformation. Even if this is true, no one cares, as Ukraine has lied so many times that even when they are not lying, no one believes them.but this is a good one m8
>>545649023Nonsense. The capitulation of a nuclear power with an arsenal of 5,420 warheads (1,796 of them deployed) is a scenario that has no historical precedent. No nuclear power has ever voluntarily given up its arsenal under external pressure, except in cases of state collapse (the USSR, South Africa).
>>545649163I don't call anyone that. I will, however, call you a fucking moron. I think that's reasonable.
>>545648903Remind me, why did the separatism problem even arise in the first place?Oh, right, the cookies from Victoria Nuland and Jeffrey Paiet.
>>545649085Your Jewkraine has already piled up enough debt for several generations. It either tells the West to fuck off and goes with Russia, or it pays for generations.
>>545649184>They will literally be cannibals in Yamantau mountain and live in metros under Moscow just to own the west. thats not the civilized world's problem though.>>545649187let me repeat the key part again, because clearly you didnt get it:>However, the 89% mentioned in the phone call exactly match the result of the referendum, which took place several days after the recording had been publishedso either:>the recording is real>SBU has time traveling abilityand SBU does not have a time traveling ability.
>>545649275The more of you russian subhumans die, the better.
>>545649284You have two choices:1. Russia expands, you look good, Ukraine survives.2. Russia expands, you look retarded, Ukraine doesn't survive because you want to use it as a proxy to the last one (considering how many are mobilized rhey do not want this).
>>545649334Lol. A significant portion of the aid comes in the form of loans, Ukraine will have to service the debt, and reconstruction is estimated at hundreds of billions — meaning even loans will not cover everything.
>>545649383option 3 is what i stand for:>NATO/EU military deployment in dumbas
>>545648959https://www-nrc-nl.translate.goog/nieuws/2026/06/17/de-nederlandse-miljardensteun-voor-drones-blijkt-van-doorslaggevend-belang-aan-het-front-in-oekraine-a4930142?_x_tr_sl=nl&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>one-third of all Russian dead and wounded on the battlefield (a total of about 35,000 per month) are killed or neutralized by Ukrainian drone troops equipped by the Netherlandslooks like we contributed about 10% of europe (which does more than the USA.) as a whole when it comes to military aid
>>545649284yes yes 6/7Btw why the only "source" for this is wikipedia?I mean the same wikipedia that got his co-creator banned for "disinformation".kekaroo
>>545649011>muh regions agreed to become part of Russia.the filthy russians didn't even occupy Kherson and Zaporizhya when they changed their "constitution" to include those regions as russian territories.
>>545649184Russia has no say in this. They will accept whatever surrender terms they are given.>>545649221>except in cases of state collapseAnd where do you think russia is headed?
>>545649466Europeans are like children.
>>545649534Maduro status?
>>545649523>Btw why the only "source" for this is wikipedia?>he doesnt know what the square brackets in wiki articles meanyoure not gonna make it
Why?
>>545649552it would be dozens of stealth fighters lobbing guided bombs against 1990s tech. personnel losses would be in single digits.
>>545649163>muh Crimea made the choicenope, the deputies of the Crimean parliament were herded like sheep at gunpoint to proclaim their whatever, lest they be tortured and executed by the russian GRU and FSB.
>>545641713>1. Russia gets to keep it's current gainsNon-starter.Russia invaded, and any peace that allows them to keep their territorial gains means they WILL do it again.
>>545649596yes because I don't use wiki. Inability to link the sources of your claim, if you provide one, is your problem, not mine. Internet is big.
>>545649647Yes, losses of the Russians would be in the single digits like how Yugoslavia lost 12 tanks and 20 apcs during 78 days of bombings.
>>545649574>but whatabout Maduroretard, Maduro was arrested in 2026 and Venesuella wasn't annexed by the US ... even their ruling party stayed in power. And we're talking about the event's of 2014-2022.
>>545649765Are you retarded? Like first Chechen war stopped them.from starting a second. If Russians want to start a war they will regardless of your moral lessons.
>>545649411The more of you russian subhumans die, the better :)I will always be supporting initiatives and investment that kill you vermin.
>>545641713>Russia gets to keep it's current gainspootin will never go for that, because he wants Ukraine to give him 4 regions that he can't occupy by force, he wrote them into his fake "constitution" already.
>>545641713>5. International western powers guarantee the independence of UkraineCorrect.This is the only thing that wil guarantee peace. If someone stronger than Russia is willing to send their own people to fight Russia.And this is the reason we are where we are.Consider this:If 5. is given, if Europe is willing to fight for Ukraine, there is no need for the other points.If Europe agrees to guarantee and fight for Ukraine in the future, there is no reason to give any Ukrainian territory to Russia today.And if Europe thinks they will have to fight Russia in the future, it is the best to extend this was as long as possible, as many Russians should die as possible
>>545642526>sovereign country minding their own business>poking the bearMaybe the bear should eventually fuck off far away into siberia, so it doesnt feel poked every now and then?
>>545641713I want putin to win the war and take all of europe.That Von Der Liar and the likes will have egg on their face.
this is what I think of Jewlensky
>>545649952This is not where we are. If Ukraine fortifies and mines the whole border with Russians they will not start another war. This war taught them losses are gonna be serious. 2023 counteroffensive shows a side cannot really puncture a thick, fortified line.
>>545649786https://web.archive.org/web/20140531132552/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J18RziLIl30internet archiveupload date: May 7, 2014https://web.archive.org/web/20140512044832/http://rt.com/news/158276-referendum-results-east-ukraine/internet archiveRT, straight from kremlin>in Donetsk region 89.7% of votes were cast in favour of political independence from Kiev>today's referendum on the status of Lugansk region in Lugansk May 11, 2014what now faggot? kekaroo indeed
>>545650151Also the reason Ukrainians have not done this on the rear is because if you mine the whole area it restricts maneuvering space. But it will not be a restriction in the scenario where they do it on the border and not in the rear front.Surovikin line was constructed in the area where Russians did not plan to conduct offensives.
>>545649765It's easy to say that when it's only Ukrainians who are fighting and dying trying to reverse those territorial gains (with insufficient resources), while the rest of the world is watching like it's a football match.Also, Russia will always seek ways to take control of Ukraine, regardless of where this current war stops, geographically.
>>545649950We will take everything, we will build a wall and you will pay for it.
>>545649837>Venesuella wasn't annexed by the USyes sure, cool story bro...)
>>545650295Good evening gulag homo bro. Apparently, you're not fighting nor dying either, but you profit from the (insufficient) resources and want more.
>>545649830that was very low intensity, more like nudgingcompare to intervention in iraq-kuwait
>>545650190cool, now do a double flip and give me webmyou aren't a newfag you know how it works, did you?
>>545643677This is why I like the easterners. Russians are nice and respectful - no, too idealistic, didn't work historically (though people fail to read "super thick minefield and defensive structures part". This can be dealt with but I don't think Russians would try. It is too hard to attack an enemy who expects an attack).Ukraine fans (I find it hard to use this word as I do not hate Ukraine) are just psychos.You people hate Ukraine more than anybody else. You want them to die to the last man just so you could satisfy your psychosis and hatred of the invader.Ukrainians have paid enough in blood, it's time they get to live normal lives you promised them.
>>545650301when? In the next 5 years, or before Christmas, you retarded russian subhuman?You will be bombed every day like an African shithole that you are. And in the meantime, enjoy banana republic food prices, North Korean Internet and citizen freedoms and other benefits of PidoRuzkyi Mir.
>>545642612Your point is valid however you are trying to discuss with a cultist. And not a separate case, our whole nation is like that. Trying to fight the narrative that we might NOT be the strongest country gets you branded as a ruska onuca. Just like in 1919-1939 saying that Rzeczpospolita Ludowa is weak would get you beaten and that continiued untill WW2 happened. Even after a total rape of the 40's the cope how strong we were continiued. Entire education system here will tell you how powerful the defenders on westerplatte were, how brave people saved jews from death camps, 40:1 ratio, Bóg honor ojczyzna etc. And for some reason, entire collapse of every frontline, total logistical failure and poor command chain that led to all that gets pushed away for a narrative of a bad luck of having 2 bad neighbours. Not our fault btw.Just like you guys are programmed for war and conquer, you try to discuss with a person programmed to feel strong.>was never able to intercept a single Russian missileExcept some of these were cardboard drones, weather baloons or not even russian missiles to begin with. Not to mention that for some of these "attacks" we had preemptive warnings coming from Belarus that our air space is about to be crossed.You vastly underestimate how much we overestimate our strength.>>545643052Whatever imaginary number russian propaganda might come up with does not change the fact that that 60% of polish military also runs on soviet stock or is directly based on such. And Russia/Khazakhstan is producing more Geran drones weekly than we have Krabs & Abram tanks overall. And there are 4 years of UA conflict to validate that. And changing that might be hard given the fact that we have ONE factory to supply it all.
>>545650499You have to be someone on a VPN, playing to Serbian stereotypes of complete fucking idiots.
>>545649540>Russia has no say in this. They will accept whatever surrender terms they are given.You're dumb. Even with current Western arms supplies, Ukraine does not possess the potential to fully expel the Russian Federation from the occupied territories (about 20% of Ukraine's territory) by military means in the foreseeable future.
>>545650441I've been fighting before, just a few years ago. I haven't died though, which is pretty nice. Also, no gulag for me, I can leave whenever I want. And personally, I only profit from my legal job, and from nowhere else.So fuck off, please.
>>545650490>give me webm>you aren't a newfag you know how it worksonly a newfag wouldnt know about the 4 MiB limit.>i refuse to click on an internet archive link because... because reasons okay?i accept your concession
>>545650295Agreed. These retards just see you as bodies to fulfill their own desires.From my viewpoint, even if 2014 was the most CIA coup of all CIA coups, I cannot hate people who die for their country, whomever they may be. You personally did not choose the direction of your country. Some things are hard to swallow and some things in Ukraine could have been better, but whatever, no single individual especially the average guy has a choice.Somehow I am the worst person because I suggest we stop this shit and try to find a middle solution. Too many people have died for no meaningful change, and when someone asks, "X side will collapse just wait a few years".What happens after 20 years of this war? Serbs, Croats and Bosnians died in the Bosnian war for several years just for Dayton to be basically what was offered in 1992 when Alija pulled back the signature.Who says that after 15 years of this war you won't get some settlement like OP. Ok, nobody wishes for it, Russians expect total collapse of Ukraine, you the opposite, but if neither happens you will be like we had enough and you will sign some settlement that nobody is happy with but will stop the dying.
>>545650623I am baiting the butthurt belters with some statements but OP and thjs>>545650821 is serious.You retards need to negotiate otherwise too many will die and high chance neither get what you want. Only Poland and others get what they want. You watch Ukrainians/Russians to die for your own fun and interests. Ofc you are happy because you despise both.
>>545642087>Ukraine: I consentnot to any of that bullshit
>>545650774You don't need to put everything, just important stuff.Interesting, even providing evidence you manage to lie, Its impressive skill.And it was enough to ignore one thing - quote "we can’t hold a lawful referendum because of the Ukrainian threat" whuch means to gather people to a several big crowds near voting "centers".Well they did right.And post factum, it became a lawful one.
>>545644042>muh PutinAlmost as if he is face of KGB now FSB and they have replacements for him who will be the same shit.Putin as a person is irrelevant. He is an extended arm of FSB.
>>545650301You've been saying that for years now, goblin.You'll die like the worthless piece of trash you are :)
>>545650955>You watch Ukrainians/Russians to die for your own fun and interests. Ofc you are happy because you despise both.its true that the selfishly optimal strategy for NATO and EU is for the putins blunder to continue as long as possible, because it means maximum damage to russian military and economy overall. never before was it possible to destroy 10k russian tanks for the cost of ~1/8 the annual defense budget (cost of assistence to ukraine).but the stalemate cannot continue forever, eventually one side will break (imo ukraine due to manpower). at that point, the west may be forced to either accept russia expanding westward or to deploy own military to ensure endsieg for ukraine.>>545651553>Interesting, even providing evidence you manage to lie, Its impressive skill.you asked for sources, i gave you irrefutable sources.the evidence is here: >>545650190i can copypaste them here for your easy:https://web.archive.org/web/20140531132552/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J18RziLIl30https://web.archive.org/web/20140512044832/http://rt.com/news/158276-referendum-results-east-ukraine/^ here are the sources you asked for. do you need assistence with putting the URL into your browser?whats the problem exactly? why cannot you open the links?
>>545651553can you explain how did the SBU-released phonecall of the separatists talking about faking the results to 89% managed to match the result of the referendum, despite the phonecall being released before the referendum happened?
>>545646656Good post. Thanks.
>>545651912>>545651809And you still don't realize that this evidence works for Russia's side.
>>545652045how does SBU releasing a phonecall, where separatists talk about rigging the referendum to 89%, several days BEFORE the referendum even starts and ends up indeed in 89% - work for the russian side?
>>545647927As their first law, they passed the repeal of the special status of the Russian language (consider it a state-language status) in the eastern regions of Ukraine; the people of Donbass were fucking stunned by such antics, and it began.
In 1990, the West promised: NATO would not move 'one inch' eastward. The promise was not put in writing—and that is precisely why it was broken. Five waves of expansion: Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary, the Baltics, Romania, Bulgaria, Slovakia, Slovenia, then Ukraine and Georgia next in line. Military bases, missile defense, exercises—all closer to Russia's borders. Russia warned: this is a red line. It was ignored.
>>545647180Idk if I buy shit like this. Putin is an intelligence operative who cozied with the right people and booted out the rest.If it's all about saving face Patrushev can just kill him and they can make peace without losing face.Unless the FSB clique doesn't care.But I don't buy that, intelligence operatives are never nationalists, they see ideology as a tool of the state and the state is them. It was thought Ukraine is gonna be easy. It is not easy.If the only obstacle to peace was Putin's personality high chance he'd be killed.
>>545652161If you don't understand, I won't explain it to you.But THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.
A better plan:1. commit to supporting Ukraine with longer and longer range weapons2. start seizing all Russian ships in int'l waters3. offer Russia Crimea and Donbas in exchange for $1T or whatever4. if they take it, give half the money to Ukraine, half to Ukraine's backers5. if not, take Kaliningrad and Karelia and Transnistria and dare Russians to do something about it6. we didn't have a world war for 80 years anyway
>>545652495Psychotic shit like this is why there is a war in the first place.
>>545652486>If you don't understand, I won't explain it to youwell that was the only play you had left at this point. you had no cards.gg no re.
>>545645060Ask the propaganda source that told you about "3 days"
>>545641713This plan is retarded. It was written by someone who has no idea what this war is about.
>>545646662Shoigu is gonna see this comment and shit his pants out of fear
>>545652441>We were promised something by someone who didn't put it in writing (source: trust me, bro) so now we'll break promises we did put in writing. And international law.
>>545646682schrodinger Russia: is both an existential treath to every single european state and its also so weak its soldiers fight with shovels
>>545652649Plan is genious but we can talk about the details.
>>545652758No, you're a violent nation of baboons and subhumans that still believes in imperialism. A cancer on the world.
>>545652531There is a war because Putin got fooled into thinking it would be quick and easy and now he can't back down because of all the usual reasons.
>>545647230Why did Ukraine start the war and keep asking for a ceasefire if they're winning
