>>98105814
I like them and the BSD. There's just something refreshing about a guy who acts, dresses, and tells you to your face that they're a supervillain and then you see them do something and it's some variant of
>Body horror
>Mind break and corruption
>Worse than rape-tier defilement

Admittedly this is also putting what is an interesting cultural group into a mold of villainy and edge that, though they loan themselves to well, isn't the full scope of what they can do or represent. A BSD CNA easily be a schizophrenic shaman, a perverted deceiver in a character's ear, a murdering psycho, a tortured soul, etc just like a Tzimisce can be some xenomorph looking aspie hellbent on enslaving California but they can also be weird transhumanist, stuck up aristocrats, le plastic surgeon, artists of the flesh more concerned with the process than actually getting any "Sabbat" things done. I like this part of the setting. I'm still going to make Hellraiser look PG when I'm done making skinless futanari cannibal guardians

What do you guys think of the following idea as a holy relic for a PC hunter, based on Kiritsugu Emiya:
>A gun that when its bullets hit the flesh of vampires make their vitae explode from the inside out
>Basically the spell Cauldron of Blood but in a gun

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>>98105948
Sounds fine and I am not just saying because I like Relics.

>>98105948
I wouldn't make it work like cauldron of blood exactly. Most 5 dot relics that drain magic either only drain 1 point or have an additional cost to use.
Given it's a literal Gun, most of the damage would be wasted in the latter case as normal guns already do fistfulls of dice in damage.

>>98105821
Anyone got any vampire game openings?

>>98105948
I'm cool with it, but I think it should be loaded with the blood/bone dust of someone with some True Faith as a tradeoff

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My Antediluvians aren’t Nosferatu or some ancient inhuman monster, they’re Dracula Flow, man
>I was flipping bricks for Mansa Musa before you were even a Type One civilization.
>I’ve moved camels through the eye of a needle.
>I was tossin’ diamonds at stripper poles below the great pyramids.
>I don’t fear St. Michael, that motherfucker owes me a fiver.
>Strapped my Ops to a rickshaw and dragged him around the city-state. This shit ain’t nothing to me, man.

>>98105821
>How was the last game you played?
We're 9 sessions into an OWoD WtA Changing Breeds campaign and everyone is having a blast so far. It's set in early 2001 in the wake of a year-long event called the 'Sundering' during which the Gauntlet was uncrossable and every Garou and Fera was stuck in their breed form and unable to use most of their gifts. Pentex capitalized on this to launch a worldwide campaign of genocide, the Garou Nation has fallen, and in it's place have risen a bunch of fanatics called the Wyld Hunt who believe that Gaia is dead and it's time for a Second Impergium. The PCs are individuals who are trying to avoid getting dragged into, while also endeavoring to make our city a little safer.

>>98106120
>Changing Breeds
(You) Are furries. And that's based. Jokes aside that sounds like a fun campaign hook, what's the cast like?

>>98105821

I'm playing in a V5 campaign set in Miami. I got a chubby Nagaraja doctor who's eating terminal end-of-life geriatric patients who are fully out of it.

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>The final death of Ravnos at the hands of the Technocracy circa 1999 (Colorized)

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>>98105897
>I'm still going to make Hellraiser look PG when I'm done making skinless futanari cannibal guardians
Gigabased, would make the Eldest proud if that cunt still had feelings beyond wanting to consume the earth.

>>98106089
Shorty chose to be with a demon, sounds like her problem to me
https://youtu.be/7xrzULIverA

>>98106120
>event called the 'Sundering' during which the Gauntlet was uncrossable
Weaver's wet dream

>>98106138
>what's the cast like?
Kitsune (Roko / Gukutsushi): spent most of her life in the woods; still acclimating to city life and human social rules.
Mokole: also animal-born, aspiring rock musician who missed out on her big break when she got stuck as an asian water monitor for a year and her band replaced her before going on tour. Best friend of the Kitsune despite being the opposite and knowing practically nothing of the spirit world or her heritage prior to the start of the chronical.
Bastet (the ones that can turn into ordinary house cats with the right gift): angry goth girl, but loyal; our best overall combatant.
Corax: the Bastet's best friend; mousy and quiet; spends a lot of her free time in the penumbra (more comfortable with spirits than with other living beings).
Ratkin (Engineer): a little 'off', but handy to have around.
Ananasi (Weaver leaning): good with computers; was the one who got the ball rolling on getting the group together; tries to run our little band of vigilante monster hunters like a corporation (which is endlessly annoying to the other PCs but endlessly hilarious to the players).

>>98106515
>Bastet (the ones that can turn into ordinary house cats with the right gift): angry goth girl, but loyal; our best overall combatant.
Is the player hot?
Did she get the merit that allows her to use hedge magic?

>>98106515
>Ratkin (Engineer)
>not Munchausen

>>98106515
>Mouse and Cat are best friends
Cute
>Literally a Skaven
>A N A S I
This is an interesting squad

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>TQ
I played the most wish fulfillment character I could possibly play because I knew it was going to be a trainwreck from the start. Everything was technically earned because of my prior bahari character in his sabbat chronicle.

The ST let me play a dhampir in v5. Basically all the perks of a true vampire without most of the penalties because my mother was a 9th generation vampire and I essentially got to pick and choose thinblood merits.

My character was born into a heretical bahari cult as a savior figure. She was destined to survive gehenna and bring about a new type of vampire that could survive in the sun and reproduce without the need to embrace. Only thing I really accomplished during the chronicle was using Obeah and Vicissitude to heal people and fix deformities and fucking a garou and giving birth to 2 abominations.
The ST seemed more focused on just jacking off one player he has issues with. Some sort of "i will give him everything he wants so it feels hollow and unearned" mentality. Really it just came off like gif rel. All and all it was pretty shitty since there were 3 other people at the table who pretty much got shafted because 90% of the time it was just watching two people go back and forth, 7% reacting to sudden plot developments, and 3% letting us have 1 or 2 scenes.

I got what I wanted because I knew that concept wouldnt fly in a more serious game.

Cutting out Hedgefag's still beating heart so that the sun may rise!

>>98106663
>Is the player hot?
I personally think so, but YMMV.
>Did she get the merit that allows her to use hedge magic?
I don't believe so, she seems mostly focused on scratching the hell out of people.

>>98106673
>>not Munchausen
I think he was considering that, but the player is kinda low-key and subdued; and I think he decided that he wouldn't be able to pull it off. Plus he loved the idea of being able to hobble together temporary machines from junk (now that I think about it, he almost played a Jawa in our Star Wars campaign).

>>98106675
>>Mouse and Cat are best friends
>Cute
Those two players often play 'odd couple' characters who end up getting along better than they should. The Bastet player was originally leaning were-bat; but upon finding out that ordinary house cat was an option, she switched to Bastey partly for that very reason.
>>Literally a Skaven
Well, that one clan anyway (Skyr? Skryre?)
>>A N A S I
??
>This is an interesting squad
It came together pretty nicely; and like I said, everyone's having a good time so far.

Why is hedgefag so homosexual

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hunter orgs for this feel?

>>98105814
But they aren't, though.

How do you think the various splats should ideally compare and mix with each other in crossover games?

In oWoD it can be a mess, but one would still want them to be splats and not Curseborne lineages, and I must admit to having no clue about how they mesh in nWoD.

How do you think they should be in this regard?

>>98106929
>orgs
More like neighbourhood incel gang.

>>98106897
Ananasi are kinda the jewish sort I can see screwing over the party in a nice 5 dimensional chess game, which I thought paired well with the pseudo-Skaven dude since they like to backstab not your friend or the Ratkin in particular, just the Skaven , so yeah it's a very interesting party. Very nice you could get a relatively larger group together and got to enjoy it. Should storytime it sometime anon, would be fun for us but no pressure.

>>98107003
Everything but the most extreme diehard kill everything now faction of each group is probably willing to play ball but because of the setting I imagine it'd take a lot of manipulation and deceit to really get anywhere, at which point you're playing more of a political thriller than anything else

>>98107027
>would be fun for us
Would it? I'm relatively new here; I've seen people react favorably to it but I've also seen people complain about 'blog posting'.

>>98105974
Pretty nice list

>>98106046
Well at first I thought it would go with the kindred rolling their current vitae pool, and each success is either blood points that explodes/do not explodes from their inside. Which would make it particularly potent the lower generation a vampire is.

But it’s kind of too much. So I went with the spell that’s the closest to what I had in mind. Draining a single point though is pretty sad for a five dots.

The gun could have restrictions though, like only being useful against vampires. Or the damage it does to kindred is lethal instead of aggravated.

>>98106066
That kinda works? When I was brainstorming the Hunter concept I was thinking that he would come from a family of true faith users that were the ones producing weapons for the Society of Leopold. After finding ways to mass produce holy arms, the PC’s father made their magnum opus. The Griseo Bestia! A gun that when loaded with holy bullets could make blank bodies pay for every drop of blood they forcefully took. I was thinking that the father died and his remains are used for the gun.

>>98107274
No one's going to be popular anywhere but I think the majority of us at least like storytimes of cool moments or session breakdowns. I know I do at least, but like I said no pressure.

>>98107329
That'd be cool, like loading the body parts of Saints into a gun used in monster hunting. Could evne make it so that the father was turned into a Saint by the Church or the Society for his efforts

>>98106460
Cool pic, I love speculating and headcanoning stuff about the Antediluvians. Troile being depicted as a redhead almost as tall as the presumably not a manlet Illyes has my schizo brain wondering on if it'd be a good idea to give her a bit of giant blood in her veins before the embrace.

Troile is in general an interesting and somewhat vexing Antediluvian. She was, as far as we know, the first Diablerist, and more importantly the only person to diablerize a member of the third generation without it backfiring. No doubt she benefitted greatly from the age gap between her and her sire being far narrower than the other attempted Antediluvian drinker, but it's still an impressive feat. Which makes the fact she largely floundered afterwards all the more fascinating, going from hair-brained utopian project to hair-brained utopian project, generally being thwarted by various Ventrue broods, with her story culminating in losing to Infernalist cock and having her final attempt at vampire "utopia" blowing up catastrophically in her face, resulting in either final death, jumping into hell itself, or being sealed away in eternal torpor.

I don't hate it, it's actually a nice counterpoint to Antewank, and I think it's very poetic if Troile was a prodigy at breaking things, but inept at building something to last. Very much the mother of her clan in that regard.

>>98105897
Based. I do believe Tziggers can be highly flexible, though I do have a personal distaste for the plastic surgeon shtick. Primarily because it's the common resort of people who want to play some sort of "ethical" Tzimisce, and such characters tend to be extremely self-indulgent even by VtM standards. The idea isn't completely unworkable though, I can get behind the concept if they're pumping out Bogdanoff style freaks, or have a tower of shaved off jaws like that one clinic in Korea.

>>98107003
>and I must admit to having no clue about how they mesh in nWoD.
In general it depends on where interests and conflicts align and clash.

Vampires are generally going to be in cities and focused on their night time activities of feeding, territoriality, and political intrigue.
Werewolves are mostly rural and focused on dealing with the spirit/material balance and planning and executing hunts to do that.
Mages are the most likely to be encountering other supernaturals just because they're highly curious and investigative, especially when it comes to Path-adjacent splats, like Acanthus/Changelings and Thyrsus/Werewolves. How those interactions go really depend on the intent and what kind of reason they're interacting. A Thyrsus could be doing experiments that are throwing off the Balance, or they could just hit it off meeting at a bar and getting blitzed together and realizing they can help each other out.
Changelings are generally pretty focused on helping each other out and defending against the Gentry, so anybody who can boost that can be worked with, and anybody who makes themselves a threat to the Freehold has made some vindictive and powerful enemies.
Sin-Eaters are similarly focused on the stuff going on in their Krewes.

The rest of the non-Hunter splats are pretty isolated on their own lanes.

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>>98106089
Most WoD thing imaginable would be if Dracula Flow was just some Malkavian being given a camera and secretly giving us the real history of the Antediluvians.

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Thoughts on the announcements coming to GenCon?
Is it our turn for franchise enshittification?

>>98106814
>>98106906
What's your problem/fixation with Hedgefag? All he did was to be vaguely nice and he esl'd the place up.surely anyone can just post storytimes, homebrew and cropped porn in spoilers, right? Why don't (You) do it?

>>98108032
>Is it our turn for franchise enshittification?
where have you been the last 8 years?

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>>98108409
Maybe out of the loop? I haven't had a lot of chances to interface with the community. I kept trying to find tabletop groups and the like. Never had much chance. So maybe I'm late to the party but I suppose I must start being around the online community.

>>98108032
Here: >>98102669

>>98108491
the current edition of wod is... let's say controversal to the point where it's fans are even a minority on the offical reddit and paradox on the offical discord server has forbidden comparision to older editions and plays of older editions and even looking for players for games of older editions till very recently

this has not worked out and as you can read in the last thread the new team is in full damage control mode but acording to anon last threat they are lacking the budget needed to start a new edition so they will need to try and fix a entire edition of 3 currently gamelines with errata and hope that it wins them back the fans

Bookish Virtual Adept gf or Giga Stacy Full Bushed Verbena gf?

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>>98108519
>i decide to finally start really going farther than usual to get into a new ip
>it finally gets touched by enshittification too
>i've been doing a homebrew with v5 as a starting point
I'm gonna McFuckingLose it, /tg/.

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>>98108525
What about V5 is controversial? I haven't seen anything that makes my eyebrows go up.

So there was World of Darkness, then there was New World of Darkness, then Chronicles of Darkness, then v20? So like, Masquerade, then Requiem, then Requiem again but Humanity and experience worked differently, and there was a separate part of the book just for Conditions, then finally back to Masquerade?

>>98108576
In no particular order:
>Street level focus, both narratively and mechanically. Players are not expected or allowed by RAW to ever play particularly powerful vampires.
>Removal of elders and methuselahs from the narrative. There aren't supposed to be any low generation or old vampires still hanging around, a couple of centuries at the oldest, which limits political intrigue and cool characters.
>Focus shifted to Anarchs as protagonists, Camarilla as antagonists and Sabbat as utterly unplayable. As the Camarilla are the most appealing faction in the entire World of Darkness, people are annoyed about them leaving the spotlight.
>Needless altering of clans. Clan Tremere got bombed to oblivion and its internal structure no longer exists, some clans got completely renamed, a bunch got fused together into the Hecata, others left and joined different sects.
>Weird mechanical decisions. Instead of blood points, there are now hunger dice. Using vampire powers is no longer a game of resource management, but a game of risk management, as a bit of bad luck might leave your vampire at risk of frenzying.
>Disciplines have been cut back and Thaumaturgy has been nerfed into the ground. All of the clan-specific Disciplines no longer exist, except as one or two weak amalgam powers to require multiple Disciplines.
>Real life politics. Textboxes about how players shouldn't be fascists or use the game to explore fascism, NPCs who are defined by non-traditional genders, races, sexual preferences and so on.
>The biggest threat is now humans. It went from being a game all about powerful vampires using the rest of the world as pawns, to a game all about vampires on the run and hiding in the shadows from hunters who can snuff them out at any moment.

>>98108734
>Focus shifted to Anarchs as protagonists, Camarilla as antagonists and Sabbat as utterly unplayable. As the Camarilla are the most appealing faction in the entire World of Darkness, people are annoyed about them leaving the spotlight.
At least it pissed off all those "the Camarilla are the good guys" idiots.

>>98108715
20th Anniversary actually came out before Requiem second edition. And the name change to Chronicles came later, so for a few years there were two world of darknesses running in parallel. New World of Darkness was never an official name, it's just how people differentiated it.

>>98107495
>and more importantly the only person to diablerize a member of the third generation without it backfiring
Why was Ilyes such a fucking loser?

>>98108769
Not every vampire can be gigachad.

>>98108715
>First edition of the World of Darkness came out, it was popular but bare bones.
>Second edition of the World of Darkness came out, it was given several years and loads of books and the chance to grow out of control.
>Revised edition of the World of Darkness came out, it cut back on some of the craziness and prepared for a big climactic finale.
>All previous World of Darkness editions are retired and called the old World of Darkness (oWoD) while a first edition for a new World of Darkness (nWoD) is made with a completely new setting inspired by the old one.
>A 20th Anniversary memorial edition for the oWoD is released to make money off of nostalgic grognards, but it unexpectedly causes a renaissance for oWoD.
>nWoD gets a second edition that has to compete with the 20th Anniversary edition of oWoD at the same time.
>The World of Darkness gets acquired by Paradox Interactive, who wants to focus entirely on oWoD, which becomes the true World of Darkness (WoD) while nWoD is relabelled as the Chronicles of Darkness (CofD).
>WoD gets a fifth edition that makes a lot of controversial changes. In order to prevent competition, new CofD books and 20th Anniversary WoD books are no longer allowed to be made.

>>98108715
no it's
>3 editions of wod
>nwod
>20th anni start
>second ed of nwod which is renamed cofd starts but dav20 wa20,wo 20 and m20 are getting content at the same time
>paradox get's the ip and starts wod5 with v5 to promote vtmb2
>cofd and 20th anni are both cut short because paradox won't greenlight anything
onyx path did pitch a dtf20 and htr20 in addition to several cofd books. we could have had it all

>>98109046
>onyx path did pitch a dtf20 and htr20
God, this is the one thing I hate more than what they did with 5th Edition. Literally stopping 20th Anniversary Editions from getting completed.

>>98108734
>a bunch got fused together into the Hecata
If anything anon is underselling it because the clans that formed the Hecata are mortal enemies, they just smooshed together into one amorphous grey blob because... they're the necromancy clans or something.

What if the whole WoD is just a caul that God threw Caine in?

>>98107401
Exactly!

>>98109237
>implying Caine needs help to make him a dick

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>>98108542
Sex would be amazing with the Verbena but there's a decent chance she will also fuck others with or without your knowledge. Might or might not be into sadistic shit with knives.
Virtual Adept will both be cocky and shy and might look mundane at first but you will love it when she brings her 11/10 digital avatar into the material world to have sex.

>>98108219
You just wouldn’t understand. You weren’t there.

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What would he be? World or Chronicles or both, I'm not picky.

>>98108769
It's often said he was horribly infatuated with Troile so may have let it happen. Trujah also struggle with apathy like a motherfucker so there could've been some fatalism weakening his resolve too. Also the age gap between Ilyes and Troile was probably no more than 1k years, whereas the other attempt to eat an ante are looking at a 10k age gap at least.

>>98109046
>we could have had it all

We really could've. CofD and 20th coexisted just fine, everyone has happy (more or less). There was zero reason to axe both of them for a new, far more limited game run, but here we are.

>in oWoD the concept of dragons in the Camarilla is not unheard of
How do you guys feel about a Tzimisce that goes completely against stereotype?

Such a character would possibly be not on the Path of Metamorphosis but on the Path of Humanity, being a very rare addition to the Camarilla.

One possible idea is that in their centuries of using Vicissitude they could have discovered how to flesh craft while keeping nerves and tendons in mind, somehow moving them away from the surgery spot temporarily so as not to cause pain. That would be done in order to observe the subjects reaction to being physically changed without feeling or even noticing it immediately.
A few repeated experiments later and the Vampire might have experienced an inexplicable feeling of joy or warmth that they would later notice to be grounded in the subject being spared of the pain. Perhaps, even if hidden deep down, a sliver of humanity from their mortal days had been alive the whole time?
After initial disregard and tries at contempt, that could have led to further experimentation and philosophical self reflections which eventually grew to change their core values fundamentally. Maybe they gained a point or two in Humanity sometime in that journey and that helped change their Path.


Do most Tzimisce fans shun such concepts for going against their edgier original themes or are they fair game?

>>98109588
Of course not all Vampires on the Path of Humanity are looking to acquire more points in Humanity i.e. become more morally on the good side.
This flesh crafter researching good-aligned Vicissitude is an example. Many of the grotesque flesh and bone items typical of Tzimisce dwellings could have been extracted painlessly from people and then grown outside of their bodies, with the original 'donors' healed before any major suffering happened.

>>98105821
Potential uses for Hedgefag in experimental medical trials?

>>98109454
Look at what he does and tell me the fucker isn't a True Fae.

>>98109588
>Do most Tzimisce fans shun such concepts for going against their edgier original themes or are they fair game?
not so much the fans the books often go on about how evil vicissitude is and how just being skilled in it mindfucks you, but they never support that rules wise because they want to eat their cake and have it with the closest they ever gotten to putting it in the rules being that you can't heal with the discipline

meanwhile it's the fans who usually want tzimisce to be less monstrous than they are in the books because they are given a creative free range power and then are told that it's evil! and only used for evil! despite it again not being supported by the rules and for fucks sake even baali get to have relative goodish guys who use their demonic discipline against demons! a lasombra turned the power of the abyss against the best anti demon and anti evil fucker combination power in the setting and tremere are allowed to just turn dark thaum paths into normal thaum paths with hard work, but the Vicissitude is pure evil!1!

fuckers can't even decide why it's pure evil with it changing between banes/souleater, the eldest and kupala in every second book

>>98109576
The thing is that the suits involved have no real reason to keep multiple game lines at once and having to deal with 3 times the work if promoting it to turn a big enough profit to pay whatever loan they got to buy the company in the first place. Even if they understood that there wouldn't be a unification of any kind they would rather avoid cannibalizing their own efforts.

Odds are I'm just giving them too much credit and no one gave a shit about the entire TTRPG side anyway.

>>98109588
>Do most Tzimisce fans shun such concepts for going against their edgier original themes or are they fair game?
They do because most of the canon lore and rules surrounding the clan is incredibly mediocre so the people who attach themselves to the concept use it more as prompt to flesh out their own take on the concept.

The tzimisce are the Danny Phantom of WoD.

>>98109695
>Odds are I'm just giving them too much credit and no one gave a shit about the entire TTRPG side anyway.

yeah the entire trpg side was handed to just 3 guys 2 of which got fired after the camarilla book scandal and then afterward the remaining guy got full control over the ip

and they weren't paying for or promoting anything because those all ran over kickstarter

the big problem was allegedly that the 3 guys in charge of wod5 been a apocalyptic case of "play it our way" and just didn't like the other gamelines for not having larp support. i would have to look it up but there is a interview in which the interviewed who was a author who was hired to write some of the early v5 books says he got pretty gangpressed into going to a vtm larp by his new bosses because otherwise "you are not real vtm fan and don't know the game" and he hated it and working there

>>98108525
Is this new team actually the old writers? I know they tied resurrecting the old White Wold name as a puppet to try to regain legitimacy a year or two back. It was a pretty hollow attempt which convinced no one. Have they finally taken it out of the hands of renegade studios?

I really don't see how they can fix things without a new edition, the overall changes of 5th edition are too pervasive. If paradox is not willing to fund things outside of errata anymore then WoD is in dire straights once again.

>>98109232
Ill play devil's advocate. Pretty sure most clans/bloodlines were kinda meh towards eachother aside from no one liking the giovanni. Nagaraja lost their home in Enoch with the great maelstorm caused by the Ravnos Ante. Augustus Giovanni is either dead or missing. The promise of 1528 is very close to concluding.

The Family Reunion was essentially a bulwark to protect the various bloodlines of death against those who would seek to destroy them since some of those clans are walking masquerade violations.

I dont know if its true but i heard some speculation that the Family Reunion was hinted at on one of the v20 books. Lore of The Bloodlines iirc.

>>98109739
no most of the team is new and outstar a youtuber who somehow managed to become art director
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/1J2faRdc-EAWmQdyz4E7DAS9yWXNR7-9TL48-LIdYAfI/edit?tab=t.0

not that the old writers would be necessarily a good thing because white wolf doesn't really have a Mike Pondsmith like character who still gives a shit about the setting: Mark*rhein hagen jumped ship while wod was still ongoing and his latest game is just pure vapor ware, burato... well let's not talk about goatfucker, achilli did v5 for a while and some of the worst v5 books have been made under his leadership and wick is too busy being a master in the freemansons to write rpgs these days which is why he sold his last trpg IP in 2019, Richard E. Dansky entire job these days is approving tom clancy military slop games and and and

>>98109801
>I dont know if its true but i heard some speculation that the Family Reunion was hinted at on one of the v20 books. Lore of The Bloodlines iirc.
yes the hecata storyline is something onyx path and dawkins especially wanted to do in v4 (their version before paradox came along) and he just kinda put it into v5 with cult of the blood gods and to be fair i think the problem most people have is not even that it happened but that it included the nagaraja because they are not cappadocians and that we are told that it already happened. previous vtm editions had us around for the founding of the camarilla, the death of house goratrix and pretty much all major events (that happened after the 1215 start date of dark age vampire) but v5 has a lot of it just offscreen

same with the second inqusition but they actually had vampires behind it. the stone man (the legendary og 4th gen caitiff) and a bunch of bloodlines who resent the clans are said to be preparing something along the lines of what would become the second inqusition in bjd

>>98107395
>I know I do at least
All right; it'll have to be in small pieces over time, but here goes...

More on the chronical, it kicked off at the beginning of March of 2001 in a fictional city called Sunsprings; located on the California coast where Morro Bay is in the real world.
For reasons unknown; paranormal detection powers like Scent of the True form just straight-up don't work within the city; and The Curse is not as pronounced when dealing with normal people.

When the Gauntlet became passable after the Sundering ended; it was found that the Penumbra, the Shadowlands, and the Near Dreaming had essentially merged into a single space.
ST warned us that, outside of the bounds of WtA, other splats might be a little different or a lot different. Specifically, he told us that vampires look somewhat Masquerade-like on the surface, but are VERY different beings (we've already discovered that sunlight weakens them instead of burning them).
Oh, and one other bit of ST headcanon that'll be important later: when a fomor or other possessed gets killed, the combined spirit can be clearly seen exiting the body

>>98109829
So myself (Kitsune) and Mokole had been friends prior to the start of the chronical; and like I said before, Bastet and Corax were long-time friends as well. Ananasi and Ratkin weren't really 'friends', but knew each other; and had both committed themselves to cleaning up Sunsprings as best as they could. The Ananasi had written a program which scoured local websites looking for indications of possible paranormal activity, but the two of them had already realized that they were in over their heads and were keeping an eye out for more people (which was stymied by the fact that supernatural detection doesn't work in the city).

So at the start of the first session, the Anansi got a hit from his webcrawler about a murder downtown. Six thugs has been seen chasing a guy into an alley, but only five of them had been seen fleeing; and the only body found was the victim. Could have just been that the sixth thug fled in a different direction, but Ananasi was suspecting that it might be a gang of vampires; so they went to check the murder scene.

The same morning, Corax was told by a local pigeon spirit that a man had been killed who had been carrying "a gigantic secret in a tiny blue box". That got her attention, she called up Bastet, and they went to check out the murder scene.

>>98109931
One my Contact NPCs is a little Garou girl named Puddle (Lupus / Bone Gnawer / Ragabash) who's not even half a year out of her first change. She fled from San Francisco to Sunsprings after her pack was slaughtered by Red Talons for refusing to join the Wyld Hunt, and now she just wanders the city like a stray. But she's made some friends around the city who offer her food, water, clothes, and shelter when she needs it; and I'm one of them. In gratitude, sometimes if she finds something she thinks is valuable, she'll bring it to me.

So that morning, she showed up at our door with a gun (a small pocket pistol). Mokole knew just enough about guns to unload it, but she quickly discovered that it was some kind of high-tech 'coil gun' disguised to look like a regular automatic.

Curious, we took the weapon to my other NPC Contact: Violet, an Unseelie Sluagh who doesn't get out much but knows a lot about the paranormal world. She didn't know what the gun was, but suggested that it was either classified military tech (meaning the owner was probably a high-ranking government agent) or some kind of 'weaver tech' (meaning the owner was probably affiliated with the Technocracy).

Puddle showed us on a map where she'd found the gun, they stayed to hang out with Violet while Mokole and I headed to the alley.

>>98109695
I'm going to have to disagree with your reasoning, considering how hard it backfired. It wasn't broke, both CofD and 20th were able to fund themselves and keep putting out new books, including entire gamelines. WoD5 on the other hand barely managed to put out 3 splats and antagonized the hell out of the existing fanbase.

Whether it was born out of corporate arrogance or apathy towards the actual tabletop products, I do not see a world in which it was a good business call.

>>98109684
Kek and interesting.
>Vicissitude can't heal
In that case the less monstrous flesh crafter could theoretically do the crafting without causing damage, presumably with enough expertise and caution.
Thank you for the thorough explanation. Makes sense.

>>98109709
I see. With not that much canon lore and rules, players could conceivably explore different nuances on the concept with considerable freedom (if the GM is ok with it, of course).
>o flesh out their own take on the concept
I see what you did there, nice.

>>98109825
Gonna be honest, everything I've ever heard about D*wkin's V4 sounded like it would be shit too. Probably not as shit as launch V5, but still shit. I hated BJD too.

>>98107003
They can mesh well enough, but you generally have to concede that one game's lore is going to be more important than the others to keep the game cohesive. You can have your vampire player scheming and being a bastard, but the Uratha pack that they're part of are more concerned with what's going on in the Hisil and how some rival Kindred's schemes are affecting it. It generally flows upwards in this regard, with Werewolf, Mage, Demon and maybe Sin-Eater being more influential over Vampire, Hunter etc.

A Uratha pack are less likely to be worried about things going bump in the night, but they'll help the Hunter player out because it's part of a larger issue. A Demon engages in the danse macabre with their Kindred peers because the Prince is a lynchpin in some sort of design the God Machine has. That sort of thing. Again, generally speaking.

>>98109588
If you want to use Vicissitude while in the Camarilla you could always play a Volgirre instead. Most new embraces are on the Path of Humanity, even the True Sabbath.

>>98108032
most likely an errata of some kind don't get your hopes up for something massive

>>98110031
100% fair. i think between cult of the bloodgods and bjd you can pretty much see what they would went for and a lot of it are things people did not really like in v5. Like even oblivion is something that is hinted at in bjd
>Following a successful summit between Giovanni, Putanesca, and Lasombra vampires in Sicily, the Keepers offer several fledglings to the Venetians, for guardianship and tutelage in the dark arts. In exchange, the Lasombra will educate new Giovanni Embraces in the ritae, and study of the Abyss. The parties agree to not make overt attempts at converting the wards in their “care.”
and hate people HATE that oblivion is a thing. so i think onyx path kinda dodged a bullet by losing vtm to paradox

>>98109588
I like any form and method that will make Tzimisce anything else than "an evil shapeshifting freak with meat castles"
But Tzimisce fit more with the Anarchs, imho. They're too solitary and arrogant to fit in the Camarilla system.

>>98109695
I get the feeling that it would have been better for business if they let WoD and CofD both exist as they were, rather than putting all their eggs in one basket and trying to make WoD into some multimedia franchise, which was never going to happen.
Like I think if they didn't feel the need to deny CofD's existence, they probably could have cashed in on the Hololive HtV game, instead of wasting a bunch of money creating and promoting H5, only for it to sell less than Vigil 2e.

>>98110017
>Vicissitude can't heal
yeah this is the text for it from dav20 core
>Vicissitude cannot be used to heal. Indeed, its very use is often damaging, and always invasive. After, a subject usually needs time to heal from the trauma of their shaping. Unfortunately for them, the physical pain is the least of their worries

>In that case the less monstrous flesh crafter could theoretically do the crafting without causing damage, presumably with enough expertise and caution.
there is a skill involved called bodygrafts usually in older editions it's medicine specialization but it's never anything but just a slight buff for fleshcrafting and dav20 makes it a seperate skill instead

> Body Crafts. Body Crafts is a unique Skill (not to be confused with the more generalized Crafts Skill) that combines knowledge of vivisection, anatomy, taxidermy, scarification, tanning, and sculpting into a new kind of artisan Ability. Its primary purpose is to augment the application of Vicissitude. Without Body Crafts, Vicissitude rolls may be made at +2 difficulty using the Medicine Ability. Almost no one outside of clan Tzimisce knows this highly specialized Skill.
so perhaps you could argue that for the special level of skill like you want your char to have he needs to have dots in both Body crafts and medicine or something?

>Thank you for the thorough explanation. Makes sense.
it's a bit of a pet peeve of mine because vtm has rules for making stuff evil like there are abyss mystic rituals that always cost humanity/morality unless you are on one of the two a special evil shadow path, infernalism and daimonion have some powers that cost humanity everytimes you use it, but Vicissitude doesn't has that it only has fluff telling us that it mindfucks you and even manipulates tzimisce to go into the common bodyhorror aesthetic of the clan which is boring and again not supported by the rules

i wouldn't even mind if it WAS corrupting like it's implied to be inuniverse but it's just not

>>98110150
Diversifying would probably be a decent idea but who knows what why they did what they did.

>>98109588
it's not that it isn't edgy enough, but that it completely disregard what makes the clan interesting. ignoring the vapid shock factor of a "coathanger made from baby ribs" tzimisce is a clan all about body horror, the connection between the body and the self is an important aspect of that. you don't just turn a human's body into a table, you turn a man's body and self-image into a table.

the issue with a good tzimisce is that the only way to alter a person's body and identity in a way that doesn't violate the victim's wants and doesn't skullfuck the masquerade is a plastic surgeon, which is both done to death as a concept and a narrative dead end.

>>98110221
>dots in both Body crafts and medicine or something?
Tzimisce and other Vicissitude users outside the clan usually do to be fair

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>Vicissitude can't heal
Well, since when do Tzimisce love to obey the rules (or anything)?

>>98110150
Seems like good ending is Paradox goes bankrupt or is in bad enough state to sell all rights to a holding company funded by fans.

>>98110255
Well, not really.
That is the image of the Metamorphosist Tzimisce, that became influential thanks to the machinations of the Eldest.
Which ironically means that the Sabbatard Tzimisce (those that are genuine in their beliefs and dont use Sabbat as their welfare piggybank/reality show experiment) are their Antediluvian's strongest soldiers

>>98110280
>Well, since when do Tzimisce love to obey the rules (or anything)?
always? this is a clan that kept to together for millenia because of it's rules like rules of guest right, rules that weren't even enforced by anyone and in modern nights they are the stereotypical rules lawyers and priests of the sabbat and even the barely above shovel heads are meant to be weirdly loyal to the sabbat

tzimisce are good lads who love to play by the rules

>>98110314
>it's rules like rules of guest right
Those arent rules. Those are traditions and basic mores.
They follow them because of their convictions, not because others tell them to.

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>>98110280
To be fair, it is not 100% the case for everything. Combining it with Fortitude bypasses it for example.

>>98110310
no, that's just basic body horror

>>98109576
They decided after the mess of Hunter 5 being "Vigil 2E, but worse in every way, so why not just play Vigil 2E" that they wanted to cut the internal competition, even though it was basically free royalty money from a publisher that funded itself.

>>98110288
Why do you think they created a new "White Wolf" subsidiary right after Bloodlines 2 launched and fizzled?

>>98110455
Not your anon but my answer is despair.

Ginning up a H:tV game for the first time in a while, and I'm stumped on what manner of foe to put against the party that isn't a bruiser of some sort.
I have an idea of a spector of some sort, but my imagination is failing.
Any advice on putting this together soundly, or what to read to crib ideas from? I reckon the campaign is going to last for 6 months or so.

>>98110221
Yes I was aiming for that Body Crafts dots to allow for the precision fleshcrafting I had in mind.
>so perhaps you could argue that for the special level of skill like you want your char to have he needs to have dots in both Body crafts and medicine or something?
That would certainly make sense.

The whole Vicissitude mindfucking practitioners fluff is a cool aspect of it all. I guess in my specific case the dragon would still be considerably damaged by that but also able to aim towards more Humanity in spite of that. A niche case that goes against the usual clan priorities.
If like you pointed out the rules don't force the fleshcrafters to be necessarily evil other than fluff descriptions, it is very plausible for a rare Tzimisce to go against all of that. Thanks.

In fact, the Camarilla Tzimisce might be considered a Tzimisce Antitribu.

>>98110256
Nice.

>>98110386
Interesting.

>>98110044
Good to know. Unironically my first ever Vampire was a Toreador as I felt they had a nice blend of social and combat Disciplines.

>>98110143
Fair enough. The Anarchs indeed do fit their usual values better. I guess in my specific theoretical case the Tzimisce would be an outlier among his peers and more aligned with the Camarilla, but that would definitely be an exception.

>>98110255
Ok. The body horror factor is an important theme with this clan, yes.
I agree that the plastic surgeon approach is a bit overdone in many similar fictions.
The Masquerade would have to be kept with caution and hiding of the too obvious flesh crafts.
I imagined the Humanity Path Tzimisce doing all of those things like organic human derived furniture and eventually even buildings. That would be done with careful painless flesh crafting, first extracting parts of subjects -in this case probably Ghouls so they can be fed vampiric blood in order to slowly heal up to to full health (as we have established healing is at the very least extremely problematic if not impossible for Vicissitude)- and then flesh crafting and growing these parts outside their donors' bodies while being kept alive even if without brains, not at all related to the original donors anymore.
With sufficient time, practice and dedication, the dragon could eventually have at his disposal many mindless functional organisms serving as cattle (necessitating proper sustenance and care etc.), blood storage and also the typical coathangers and pipes.
My fun with the concept is largely based on my impression that those 'ethical' flesh crafts would also amount to cool body horror scenes.

>>98110576
Who's everyone playing? What are some major problems facing the city? Got any designs on what the local supernatural community is like?

>>98110761
>I imagined the Humanity Path Tzimisce doing all of those things like organic human derived furniture
and by doing that you've removed the horror from body horror and reduced it to an aesthetic with no substance behind it

>>98110761
>I guess in my specific theoretical case the Tzimisce would be an outlier among his peers and more aligned with the Camarilla, but that would definitely be an exception.
Well, if you are willing to go heretical and consider V5, there is a Tzimisce Prince of Tokyo, for example.

>>98110787
Tzimisce are horrifying tyrannical rulers of the night with arcane and unique powers.
Stop devolving them into Necroscope rejects.

>>98110787
That is a way of seeing it. True horror would be removed and what would be left would be the aesthetic horror (any visitor's first impression would still be that those sights are all the work of the more typical Metamorphosis Tzimisce).
Substance would come from elsewhere.

>>98110851
Not knowing that much about V5, I had no idea. Will definitely look it up, thanks.

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>>98109588
>>98109684
I personally do not mind Viscissitude as "inherently evil because eldest/kupala aids" and it twisting you over time being flavour without mechanics. I see that as exactly the kind of thing where you get to play with the toy without being obligated to go full Ed Gein, but get to explore that angle if you or the ST want to, to touch more on the philosophy of Metamorphosis. "What is change? What is identity?" And you get to decide if making lamps out of babies helps you answer that or not.
>>98110752
I think Viscissitude being previously rolled with Medicine with it as a possible specialization is why the "muh ethical Camarilla surgeon Tzimisce" stereotype exists and is dogged on.

I like the way STV's Viscissitude Expanded describes several possible modifications to tell you exactly what every level of Viscissitude allows access to, with some modifications being harder than others, the possibility of improving the, and some having higher XP costs as a nice Xp sink Encourage that supplement to anyone looking to play a Tzim. For anon's case I like Medicine AND Body Crafts for a surgeon character, like I would like Crafts(Sewing) for a dressmaker Tzimisce. Or my own Insectoid Tzimisce has Science-Zoology/Entomology for a bonus in Insect-related Alterations
>>98110255
>it's not that it isn't edgy enough, but that it completely disregard what makes the clan interesting. ignoring the vapid shock factor of a "coathanger made from baby ribs" tzimisce is a clan all about body horror, the connection between the body and the self is an important aspect of that.
Amen to that. Body horror isn't horrifying because of the gore, it's horrifying because it questions and changes who you are, what you are, what you could become, and all that implies. Watch more movies: The Fly. The Substance, Videodrome, Possession. I feel a good Tzimisce character needs to embody that or the horror of rulership to work.

>>98110886
if you really want to explore a clan in an unorthodox way you'd drop the aesthetic and find new ways to explore the substance, not the other way around.

>>98110851
>Tzimisce Prince of Tokyo
Which book? Also a tzimisce turning people into yokai themed szlachta could be fun. Actually utilizing the folkloric monsters and demons of any culture and turning people into beings like that in both a mental and physical sense could be a lot of fun.

>>98110940
Those change and identity angles innate to Vicissitude are indeed cool aspects for character development. Even in the case of that rare Humanity Tzimisce those would be things he has to constantly deal with and philosophize about.
>STV's Viscissitude Expanded
Will check on that, appreciate it. Expertise in fleshcrafting would need every bit of minutia and precision possible.

>>98110951
>if you really want to explore a clan in an unorthodox way you'd drop the aesthetic and find new ways to explore the substance, not the other way around
Fair. As an example, there could presumably be a couple Tzimisces from the Old Clan that do their Koldunic Sorcery but not the stereotypical Vicissitude for any reason. Or a dragon that simply invested in other Disciplines outside of their clan while keeping with their philosophies.
That Camarilla Tzimisce concept, however, explores precisely the aesthetic aspect of the clan while keeping only a fraction of its substance.

>>98111048
I agree, Szlachta and similar monstrosities are filled with potential. The Masquerade breaking aspect of it all makes it all the more challenging.

>>98111086
Is it wrong for me to bully people whose tzimisce concept boils down to just using Vicissitude to do mild cosmetic surgery or gender affirming care? I dont even really care about the whole trans thing. I just hate the absolute creative bankruptcy of some people. Play a Caitiff or a Volgirre or some shit if you just want Vicissitude for cosmetic reasons.

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Guys I think my coterie mate is an infernalist or Baali in disguise, but he’s too sexy to kill. What do I do?

>>98111501
>What do I do?
Get a tan

>>98111501
>What do I do?
Castrating yourself.
I dont mean in game.

>>98111501
Wipe his memory and keep him as a sex slave, what else?

>>98111498
I wasn't aware that people used it to change gender or just mild cosmetic changes -probably because I assumed people already made up their characters the way the like them to be, but it is not surprising that some would like to roleplay the whole change as well.

Personally for the Tzimisce Antitribu concept in question I would want Vicissitude for all the body crafting detailed in >>98110761. A Caitiff or Volgirre with Vicissitude could do the trick as well, but they don't give the impression of using flesh crafting to the same extent, that of buildings, furniture or even private cattle.

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>>98111086
>Old Clan that do their Koldunic Sorcery but not the stereotypical Vicissitude for any reason
IIRC there's a part of them that believes it to be inherently tainted and don't practice it at all to not get infected. I like to think they get Vore'd by the Eldest in Gehenna anyways because no way are you gonna fool your ante like that
>Even in the case of that rare Humanity Tzimisce those would be things he has to constantly deal with and philosophize about.
Agreed. A discipline does not a character make just like the lack of it.
>>STV's Viscissitude Expanded
You're welcome, it's in the STV mega. I find it has exactly the kind of "build-a-bear" modifications I want out of the discipline with nice XP and skill requirements to satisfy my autistic need for the feeling of progression that also encourages experimentation as one way to fulfill the "go experiment fleshcrafting on someone" fantasy. I'd want something similar for Protean but all I've found is "here's some animal forms/you get to turn into any animal whose blood you taste". Not sure how I'd design that without just doing the same thing again

>>98111686
>I like to think they get Vore'd by the Eldest in Gehenna anyways because no way are you gonna fool your ante like that
they expicilty do! everyone who has tasted ANY tzimisce or tremere blood is a suitable host for the eldest no matter if they have dots in Vicissitude or not it also doesn't matter if the blood source had any dots in it

guys spend atleast 800 years raising their noses at the main clan for being doomed all while being 100% just as doomed

I'm new to CofD and I'm going to play my first game of Changeling the Lost this weekend. What should I expect?

Which is the “Chud” Kith, and why is Nockers?

>>98111747
>>98111749
The Duality of editions

>>98111747
You will be expected to do a lot of method acting about how traumatised you are about that one time you were raped by a fairy, and how terrified you are of a fairy raping you again.

>>98111722
Dont forget anyone that has done the vaulderie

>>98109829
>>98109931
>>98109964
I like this, thank you. Very cool lore changes to make the setting more interesting than just diet WtA for Changing Breeds. Quite cool to change up the dynamics of the paranormal, with shit like the RTs blatantly slaughtering other werewolves over even pettier reasons. That's also a cool starter session, I might ape a few ideas

>>98110280
>Make a guy stop bleeding by vicissituding his veins closed
How is this not healing? Sure it's basically a budget but stabilizing is a valid part of healing

>>98111788
>>98111747
Let's see here, would you rather
>Be raped by Fae as a broad concept
>Be sent to the infinite chamber of manual labor under the Fae like endlessly cleaning a dining room or being a bellhop forever or doing taxes
>Get tortured beyond human comprehension
>Die

>>98111627

He does have pumpkin sized asscheeks. Very valuable to keep.

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So a while back two anons were talking about merits for mage. Spark of Life gave me an idea for a side quest for my VtM chronicle where the tremere wants the coterie to capture a mage with this merit for thaumateurgical research. Knowing my players, one of them might just drain the mage dry before they can deliver them to the tremere. What sort of minor permanent benefit should I give the player that bungles the quest by draining the life mage?

>>98112076
Permanently gaining the Blush of Health merit.

>>98112076
Why would you reward a player for obvious self-sabotage?

I say fuck'em. They get some of the best tasting vitae of their life, but come off the high realizing they fucked up and have nothing to show for all the work catching the mage. Just like any other addict with self control issues.

>>98110783
>Who's everyone playing?
Starting with a low level compact. The campaign intent is mostly an introductory lead in that can expand if the group is interested.
>What are some major problems facing the city?
Nothing enormously currently, but 8 months ago, there was an explosion of violence in the city, a mass casualty event that included children, and the local weirdoes are saying it was a 'werewolf' running amok in the city that was responsible, and whisper there was a govt coverup of the entire thing.
>this is referencing a previous campaign I ran, where one of the party's packmates went full Wolfman on the city streets at 3:30pm
>it was bad; an element of Task Force Valkyrie was dispactched, led by a authorized supe, to bring the pack to heel, as it were
As for local supes, garou were the strongest population, but after the flareup, have largely gone to ground. Due to the werewolf situation, spirits have began to take considerable ground.
Shades were always a persistent concern, and with them accompanying 'strangeness'.
There is an active cabal of mages numbering 40 strong that have been quietly doing their thing, but the garou out of the picture and the spirits taking ground, have begun flexing.
As well, there was a small number of vampires active in town, with peaceable agreements with the packs in their hunting grounds, but with them gone, more have began moving in, and the Danse is surging forward in a fashion not seen in decades.
Basically, the city has a noticeable power vacuum, and the other supes are making strident, albeit subtle moves. Everyone noticed when THE up and coming garou pack was seemingly obliterated within a week, and are concerned about getting the spotlight.
Those 'in the know' are terrified; TF:V made a housecall, and the rumor is a powerful Geist was at the helm (although whether their crewe was there is unknown).
This is a different group of people, some new to WoD, some new to gaming, so I want to make this an introduction.

>>98112127
That is actually perfect. Ill probably throw in the fact their aura is also more "lively" too.
>>98112312
Because then they get to deal with the tremere trying to hunt them down to salvage what they can from the player's fuck up. If I just tell the player they get a good buzz and nothing more then that doesnt really leave the tremere any motivation aside from simple revenge.

>>98109588
I would do this but take it up to the 11th degree so that the tzimisce bucks stereotypes in the most tzimisce way possible.

Tzimisce are first and foremost obsessive hoarders and control freaks. Doc Tzimisce values and accumulates one thing above all others: Friendship. So he/she/it/they go around helping people and building up networks of allies who help him "get along" with the rest of the Camarilla in spite of his clan. He learns to fleshcraft without causing pain after an episode where he fixes a non-bloodbonded kine without causing any pain and they THANK him for it. Ooh! A strange tingle runs up Doc Tzimisce's spine. So he starts experimenting, trying to figure out pain. He learns he can just turn off certain nerves by pinching them while he works. As a side effect, he can "enhance" the kine in his den without having to gag them beforehand.

So off he goes, collecting friends and what are ostensibly not szlachta despite their clearly super-human abilities. He even has a mortal sidegig working as a "alternative medicine" practitioner that licks rely on to treat grievously injured goons and to perform the occasional cosmetic touch up for the local Roses.

I would like to see how Doc Tzimisce reacts to a betrayal by one of his closest friends

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>>98112618
By the description the guy wouldn't see it as betrayal but a fuck up on his hand, "I'm so sorry my enhancements gave you brain damage, I will fix you up right now" before shifting into Zulo and opening up your head because the guy couldn't be bothered to learn Dominate like a reasonable kindred.
By the time they are finished odds are your brain will look more like a knitted noodle than an actual organ.

>>98112694
>before shifting into Zulo and opening up your head because the guy couldn't be bothered to learn Dominate like a reasonable kindred.
based tzimtard. Why would I need Dominate? People already listen to me when I talk

Also, a zulo that's like a living, armored operating room... I gotta see that

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>>98112727
Something like this might work.

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So after anon's post >>98111747 triggering yet another wave of shitposts about how CtL is about fairy rape trauma I decided to actually look into the book and... this actually looks fun? Like a way to build your own fairytale character operating on Grimm logic? Looks more digestible and interesting than the scrimblo bimblo builder killed by an excel sheet that CtD seems to be to me at least, like something that actually fits the World of Darkness.

I'd probably try to build something like a Slenderman/Bloody Mary/Freddy Krueger type of character that gets stronger based on how much the legend is known and must follow some rules.Though I'm not sure how much of that applies to defending a freehold/trading stuff on the goblin market/capturing femboys/whatever it is happens in a CtL game.

>>98112855
>Looks more digestible and interesting than the scrimblo bimblo builder killed by an excel sheet that CtD seems to be to me at least
Ah, a classic sign of dogshit taste. And it appears to be terminal in your case, I’m afraid.

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>>98112855
>I'd probably try to build something like a Slenderman/Bloody Mary/Freddy Krueger type of character that gets stronger based on how much the legend is known and must follow some rules
>Bro seriously just reinvented Beast: The Primordial
So, have you date raped anyone recently, anon?

>>98110576
>>98112498
How about a sneaky or social slasher? Provides a clear and immediate threat that needs addressing, but isn't a pile of stats. Slashers are often good tutorial villains for that reason. Or maybe give Immortals a look, Blood Bathers can also make for fun early enemies because of how easy they are to mistake for vampires at first. They're also difficult to put down for good, which can be good or bad (depending on if you think the tutorial villain coming back is a good thing or not). Last suggestion off the top of my head, but if you wanna stress the "there's nothing policing the spirits" problem, throw a weaker Claimed at them and lay the groundwork for that plot point.

>>98112855
The autumn court is right up your alley if you want to be feared and infamous, though they're not one-trick ponies and contain a lot of occultists and intellectuals too. There's even an entitlement (at least I think so, I'll admit I'm not very up to date on 2e) all about developing a monstrous persona and becoming an urban legend.

>>98111858
>RTs blatantly slaughtering other werewolves over even pettier reasons.
Yea, my ST thinks Glass Walkers and Bone Gnawers are cool, but he doesn't have a very kind view of Garou in general; so I'm not surprised he's made them antagonistic.
>That's also a cool starter session, I might ape a few ideas
Have at; he'll be psyked to hear that he inspired someone.
Anyway, moving on...

>>98109964
Though the magic of first sessions, all three groups hit the alley around the same time. Everyone was curious why the others were there, but nobody wanted to say anything; so we just kinda awkwardly started looking around for anything that the police might have missed.

In a pile of junk, Mokole found some kind of small electronic device; and picked it up wondering aloud "what's this?" Bastet was nearby and said "lemme see", and it started beeping when she touched it; but before they could throw it away, it 'detonated' and everyone involuntarily stepped sideways. We would later learn that Bastet and Mokole had been a afflicted with a 0-point merit/flaw which causes them to get pulled along if anyone near them steps sideways.

Stranded in the penumbra, people were still hesitant to be too open; but that changed when bunch of shades through the walls and started attacking (only Corax had spent enough time in the Penumbra after the Sundering to know what they were; the rest of us just assumed that they were banes). Most of us transformed; the ones who didn't finally fessed up what they were after the fight.

The gauntlet was too thick to shift back, so we started heading towards the Suburbs; hoping that it would be easier to cross there. Along the way, we encountered a pattern which was panicking because it has sensed the gauntlet thickening and thought another Sundering had started. Along the way we also all revealed what had brought us all to the alley; and I showed the gun to everyone.

>>98113062
Hmm, like Johan from Monster or Jigsaw could be very cool and a fun idea for a more social or intellectual sort of Slasher rather than fighting Jack the Ripper on steroids or Jason as pictured by the author of Baki

>>98113115
Once we got back to the material world, the four homids headed back to the alley; lugging an asian water monitor and with a fox trotting along with them (neither of us as the Rite of Talisman Dedication). Our clothes and other things were thankfully still in the alley, and we then continued our investigation.

We got descriptions of the thugs as well as the motorcycles that they fled on (Bastet's player recognized that they were characters from Lost Boys just from the descriptions). Asking around the city (particularly other bike gangs), we were eventually able to narrow down that they hung out in a run-down boardwalk area near the coast. There was also an attempt to walk into the coroner's office with a half-assed story in hopes of seeing the victim, but we found out that the FBI had seized the body and the initial autopsy reports. After dealing with some meth-heads and searching around, the Corax eventually spotted the thugs' motorcycles parked outside of a closed-down bar.

Wasn't here a Giovanni subfaction in Scotland? I need it for... Research Reasons.

>>98112891
Sorry even mummy seems more interesting than your preferred game.
>>98112906
Only your mother
>>98113082
Thanks for the tip, it seems to have enough content for a variety of characters and motivations, I might plug it in my games for anything related to fairies which I've always admittedly ignored since I didn't feel dreaming really fit in WoD

>>98113527
The Dunsirn?

>>98110576
A lot of vampires have something other than a superhuman body as their main danger. You could be dealing with a Daeva wrapping everyone around their finger in plain sight, an elusive Mekhet you keeps knowing more about you than you find out about them... Maybe give a look to the "why you should fear us" part of clan introductions to see if any of them sounds interesting as a foe

How much flexibility do you think a splat (official one, fansplat, the reboot thing...) should have? How much room for playing in very different ways should it have?

>>98113667
These are full fledged RPGs, I think they should have the flexibility to go anywhere within the core themes, so while Vampires being superheroes who suck blood isn't something I'm against it's pretty against the themes of secrecy and manipulation going on in Vampire. Good aligned vampires are perfectly fine, for instance. Maybe it's a bit different for a more demanding splat like Mummy where you're sort of forced into being a good guy by nature of the books but I think more amoral or selfish / evil mummies should be possible. I understand within the scope of the setting (and no books) it isn't possible though

Alright /tg/, I come to you with a request. My friend is running a cross-splat game because he's a madman; We have one Vampire, one still undecided, and I'm playing a Mokole because I doubt I'll ever get a chance to play one of the big dinos ever again. Pretty much everyone in my group is more focused on the roleplay aspect of the game and don't care all that much about combat. As such, I have been given the pass from my fellow players and the GM to go absolutely ham and "Be the team's designated Doomslayer to throw at enemies".

My question to you is, what are the must-grabs for being the ultimate beatstick as a Mokole? What auspice, gifts, fetishes, etc should I grab if I want to be the meanest and tankiest beatstick possible?

Does garlic upset any wodg vampires?

>>98113738
20th anniversary by the way, just remembered I should specify.

>>98113742
Nope. There might be specific vamps who develop a Bane (Repulsion in Requiem for any specific item they have to avoid) that applies only to them, but there's no general weakness/upset from it.

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>>98108734
Whew I totally fogot about this thread.
>Street level focus
I don't see how this changes things for me as a writer or player. What're they gonna do, just delete all the old info? Lol. I can play what I want.
>Removal off elders
See above
>Focus shifts in terms of anarchs and protagonists
I hate this kind of thing. These things are supposed to be matters of perspective. At least, thankfully, nobody I've talked to is affected by this brain-rot.
>Needless altering of clans
See above
>Weird mechanical decisions
See above
>Disciplines have been cut back
See above
>Real life politics
WoD always had this kinda Leftist slant but it didn't outright ban you from having other perspectives. Again, I can chose to just... not have that in my game and so far that's gone pretty well for me.
>The biggest threat is now humans.
Always kinda was that way? For the average table, at least. Even so it all depends on what's going on in your game, if you were to ask me.

>>98108759
Well, we were always pissed off at people who thought the Anarchs were the good guys. I have played characters who were in almost every sect.
Besides, you can play Anarchs who are definitely not, "good guys."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6q6wFfvXz4
I don't agree with everything he says here, but this is pretty much how I've interpreted Anarchs long before this guy existed.

>>98113742
While the weakness to garlic flaw exists, garlic is actually an anticoagulant. So it warding off vampires is probably Masquerade propaganda.

>>98113790
>Street Level focus
Fair, it's just the lack of support in the game's rules and the V5 setting that make it difficult. You can't exactly port over old information without additional work on your end but of course you're welcome to do it.
>Perspective
Also fair
Nta and it's fine if you enjoy V5 personally, but I just question why V5 is needed if you'll be relying on old info to begin with. The quality of the books personally and the overt focus on thinbloods and being a bit more pathetic than usual as kindred isn't really to my liking. Also not a fan of the ruleset, like hunger

>>98113821
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/2bH23MccKfs

>>98113823
I've been using V5 as the basis for a Homebrew centered around a 7th gen Elder. Personally I have yet to feel like he was, "underpowered." But I might toy around with porting it to older editions. What do I know?

>>98113536
>Cuck who needs to roofie women is also an unimaginative dolt
Checks out.

>>98113742
There’s a Flaw for that because the Masquerade works a little too well sometimes. It’s psychosomatic, lorewise.

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>>98114081

>>98114100
This makes me wonder. What would a Pentex-backed “woke” agenda be like? They must have some stake in social media.

Is there anything like esoterrorists in Mage? "We must abolish consensus reality so we may rule as sorcerer-kings?"

>>98114139
Nephandi, maybe? The Technocracy wants to have control over humanity, but they do that by enforcing the current status quo. On the other hand, among the Traditions, the Order of Hermes might be closest. They want to abolish the Consensus, but they want all of humanity to be sorcerer gods. On paper, at least, if you know anything Hermetics and hierarchy.

>>98114120
Focusing specifically on social media, they'd be able to do a fuckton with AI. Could do some horrific shit to communities and individuals with that, on top of the resource drain.

>>98114190
>on top of the resource drain
Oh yeah, Pentex would be all-in on AI “data centers” (new BSD Hives and Bane hot spots)

>>98114139
>Is there anything like esoterrorists in Mage?
I think the Syndicate was complaining about Dreamspeakers going after some of their operations (most likely industrial ones)

>>98112855
>Though I'm not sure how much of that applies to defending a freehold/trading stuff on the goblin market/capturing femboys/whatever it is happens in a CtL game
What happens depends on your ST of course, but the inevitable (horny) court deals and Hedge expeditions are something you should always keep in mind. Having a few dots in athletics/survival as well as empathy, subterfuge, etc goes a very long way.
In terms of combat get a gun and a machete. On higher tiers you can always just get a token to stop time and place landmines under peoples feet or something equaly dumb, so don't overinvest into killing power at the start.

Playing into your seeming/kith with how easy it is to get exceptionals in your specific niches is also recommended.

>>98114139
That's what all of the Traditions are, anon. For all of the shit people give the Union, if the Traditions ever won, it would immediately turn into a nightmare of wizard-kings using ordinary humans as soul-batteries, mind-controlled thralls, blood sacrifices, spare parts for undead constructs and food for their pet dragons. This is why the Technocracy are the true good guys, they actually fight for humanity, while the Traditions have always fought exclusively for themselves.

>>98114139
every mage can fit this but special mention i feel like should go to the Taftâni who are in the wrong mage gameline because they go on how the Ascension War is fake news and the real war is between the truth (that magic is real and the force behind creation) and the lie (consensus) and thus pretty often blow themselves up by casting vulgar magic till paradox get's them

>>98114139
>looks at Taftani
>looks at Order of Hermes
Plenty. Hedge Mages are second class citizens in Order of Hermes. In a world where they are in power, Sleepers aka normal people are barely people.

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>>98114369
Image related

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Shemsu-Heru bros where we at?

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>>98114375
God, I want to be a Mage just for the Bastet gf.

>>98114403
You got better chances as part of the Osirian League desu

The Bubasti are part of them

>>98113536
At least when I was getting into the hobby, taking a mix and match, your table has your own canon approach was the norm with WoD. I met people who ran a mix of oWoD and nWoD lore, and in my opinion it's always been the best option. I have no idea when it fell out of fashion, but it's a real shame.

Which is to say, by all means use Lost lore in your next game if you want. It's not like you can't make other supernatural creatures within a single splat's rules.

>>98113617
Thank you.

>>98114375
for me, it's amogus

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>>98114844
There's only one place in WoD affiliated spaces where someone still uses this

Princes of Darkness 'cord.

>>98114865
ye I'm just fuckin with you this singular time, I'm not that guy before I cause a misunderstanding

>>98114403
>Mage tries not to engage in sexing animals: Impossible

>>98114896
I'll be watching you anon.

>>98114942
I mean i'd fuck the shit of a Bubasti ngl

Or a Nagah, probably a Nagah.

>>98114975
I look forward to paradox/scourge flying up my ass trying to make catgirls one day

>>98114369
Sleepers rights in mage in mage societies are probably on the same level as animal rights on our own.

>>98115023
Meaning only Nazis punish cruelty against Sleepers?

>>98114942
>The Garou? Yeah I'd fuck them
>The Ananasi? 8 legs, need I say more?
>The Mokole? I like em big. It's fine
>The Ratkin? My last GF was Jewish
>The Kitsuné? Built for handholding and tail pulling

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>>98115023
To be frank, it will not be as bad as that but we have seen what they did with the Sleeper in the Horizon after centuries. They are still just living in a fantasy medieval land.

If the Traditions ever win, they will most likely split the world among themselves, there will be a peace for a few decades and then the old grudges and new ones that formed will lead to war.

>>98113823
Imo, it really is a case of 'are you writing the setting for people to read the book, or for people to use in crafting a game?'.
This is incredibly prevalent in older settings, which the meme about failed authors writing for their game actually applies.
I have yet to see a game setting made before 2003 that was stuffed with infodumps that did not apply to the players in any real way or was principally meant for the players to interact with.
I don't think it is a coincidence that the most favored games and settings on this board read like fantasy novels of some stripe, not informative reading to help play the game.

>>98115426
I'd love to be a low value conscripted peasant in a wizard war yes

>>98115426
>most residents - even Awakaned ones - let their lives end when they may, naturally
Lmao, look at these idiots. Imagine being a fleshcel and not a borgmaxxer.

>>98114942
Yeah, Scientists would never

>>98115398
Meaning they are treated like pets, cattle or beasts of burden.

Is there are any rules snags with using Thaumaturgy rules for mortal Sorcerers?

In Requiem vampires automatically notice any blood in their presence even if it's a single drop, but it doesn't clarify whether it applies to vitae or if just living blood. Anyone know if they ever specified?

>>98115921
I'm too tired right now to comb the books for an exact quote, but just logically there's no way their enhanced senses can smell human blood a block away but can't smell vitae.

>>98105821
that's a boy

>>98116285
Lurk more newfag